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Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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Rie Sonomura

Rie Sonomura

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SKX31 said:
Alarm bells go off.

Rie, SNK is not under Tencent. They're under another Chinese video game company (37 Games, mobile / broswer dev) primarily.

I used to believe that Hong Kong based Leyou (those who own Digital Extremes, aka. Warframe) also owned SNK together with 37. That's why I initially thought that when Tencent were about to buy Leyou (as they recently did), they'd also get SNK. But Zhuge confirmed nope. Further down the twitter thread:

"There was a press notification that Leyou's intention of buying Ledo Millennium & at the same time Ledo will buy SNK. I think people misunderstood this."

Leyou did not go through with buying Ledo, nor did they SNK.

Ledo's underneath 37 Games, BTW.
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I get my Chinese companies mixed up whoops

I know Tencent and SNK collab’d on SOMETHING tho
 
D

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Rie Sonomura said:
Oh that’s who it was? Idk much about KI so it flew over my head :079:
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Figured nobody's really suggested Killer Instinct as a possibility. I remember playing the game on SNES a loooong time ago (it was the only one with a black SNES cartridge) and thought a leak suggesting Black Orchid would be cool. The game series had two protagonists, Jago & Black Orchid. Orchid's been a favorite by many and was the only female fighter in the original. I thought it'd make a nice pick so I wrote up a quick fake leak to support them. The catering to Halloween might have been a bit much, but most leaks are a sprinkle of vague (to protect the leaker's identity!), acceptable truth (an 'out there' pick that's somewhat believable), and something crazy (Halloween tourney & spirit event).
 
SNEKeater

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Cutie Gwen said:
I don't want to get into a whole discussion about all of this but I do want to highlight the Metacritic thing. Gamers are ****ing babies and can and have countered reviewbombing by doing the exact same thing but for positive reviews. See it as a sign that people who actually like the game are more mature in that regard. Hell, SMT Nocturne has a 60% user rating because one person was outraged at Joker getting in Smash that the dumbass reviewbombed every ****ing Megaten game in 'retaliation'
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I mean, you're completely right. And I agree. Gamers can act like stupid babies.

Reviewbombing isn't exclusive to TLOU2, that's obvious, but I mean... the numbers I posted are very clear. It's not "another game suffering a bit of reviewbombing". It's essentially a campaign of hate. A lot of people was ready to dislike and hate the game before even playing it (assuming, of course, they ever played it lmao). Similar case happened with Death Stranding.
I mean, it's still happening. You can't go read a Naughty Dog Twitter post, no matter if it's unrelated to TLOU, without finding crybabies in the comments complaining about the game.

Places such as 4chan and others sites were absurd when the leaks happened. Judging the game solely for the story leaks and forgetting the other aspects of the game, where the game undoubtely shines, then discovering not everything was true or that some aspects in the end weren't what they were thinking, like
assuming Abby was a trans character, which shows the level of some of the haters, and they were thinking that basically because she's buffed.

Those weeks were a completely ****show. People who were supposed to be "fans" of the first game deciding to read leaks of the sequel (what the actual ****), people spoiling the game to others, people judging the game without playing it and experiencing it for yourself, a LOT of clickbait ****ty videos before and after the game was released, people predicting "this game is gonna sell very poorly just wait and see haha got em", etc.
And naturally, very few people was going to argue with all of that, because actual fans didn't wanted to be spoiled so they barely participated in discussions until the game came out. So the initial impressions, which are always the strongest, is that "everyone hated TLOU2" which obviously, isn't true.

In any case, I want to clarify: I don't have anything against people disliking or not enjoying the game. That's fine. No game in the world will be loved by everyone, that's impossible. And I like to see other points of view. But then, there's people who didn't even tried to like the game, or worse, people who hasn't played the game but already decided it's bad because "Random Youtuber That I Follow said so".

As I said I don't really care about awards and all of that, but in this case I'd be happy if the game ends winning GOTY only to see incels raging and crying on the internet lol.
 
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Rie Sonomura

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Blackmage Kuja said:
Figured nobody's really suggested Killer Instinct as a possibility. I remember playing the game on SNES a loooong time ago (it was the only one with a black SNES cartridge) and thought a leak suggesting Black Orchid would be cool. The game series had two protagonists, Jago & Black Orchid. Orchid's been a favorite by many and was the only female fighter in the original. I thought it'd make a nice pick so I wrote up a quick fake leak to support them. The catering to Halloween might have been a bit much, but most leaks are a sprinkle of vague (to protect the leaker's identity!), acceptable truth (an 'out there' pick that's somewhat believable), and something crazy (Halloween tourney & spirit event).
Click to expand...
I only saw a KI machine in an arcade once as a kid but I never actually played it
 
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SNEKeater said:
I mean, you're completely right. And I agree. Gamers can act like stupid babies.

Reviewbombing isn't exclusive to TLOU2, that's obvious, but I mean... the numbers I posted are very clear. It's not "another game suffering a bit of reviewbombing". It's essentially a campaign of hate. A lot of people was ready to dislike and hate the game before even playing it (assuming, of course, they ever played it lmao). Similar case happened with Death Stranding.

Places such as 4chan and others sites were absurd when the leaks happened. Judging the game solely for the story leaks and forgetting the other aspects of the game, where the game undoubtely shines, then discovering not everything was true or that some aspects in the end weren't what they were thinking, like
assuming Abby was a trans character, which shows the level of some of the haters, and they were thinking that basically because she's buffed.

Those weeks were a completely *show. People who were supposed to be "fans" of the first game deciding to read leaks of the sequel (what the actual *), people spoiling the game to others, people judging the game without playing it and experiencing it for yourself, a LOT of clickbait ****ty videos before and after the game was released, people predicting "this game is gonna sell very poorly just wait and see haha got em", etc.

In any case, I want to clarify: I don't have anything against people disliking or not enjoying the game. That's fine. No game in the world will loved by everyone, that's impossible. And I like to see other points of view. But then, there's people who didn't even tried to like the game, or worse, people who hasn't played the game but already decided it's bad because "Random Youtuber That I Follow said so".

As I said I don't really care about awards and all of that, but in this case I'd be happy if the game ends winning GOTY only to see incels raging and crying on the internet lol.
Click to expand...
I heard Abby was LGBTQ+. So she's trans? Interesting, but all of the discourse surrounding TLOU2 honestly ruined the entire game for me.
 
Rie Sonomura

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ShinyLegendary said:
I heard Abby was LGBTQ+. So she's trans? Interesting, but all of the discourse surrounding TLOU2 honestly ruined the entire game for me.
Click to expand...
No, she’s just a buff cis woman, there is a trans boy tho and I don’t like how he’s treated in game

can we please stop discussing TLOU2 here now?
 
Cutie Gwen

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SNEKeater said:
I mean, you're completely right. And I agree. Gamers can act like stupid babies.

Reviewbombing isn't exclusive to TLOU2, that's obvious, but I mean... the numbers I posted are very clear. It's not "another game suffering a bit of reviewbombing". It's essentially a campaign of hate. A lot of people was ready to dislike and hate the game before even playing it (assuming, of course, they ever played it lmao). Similar case happened with Death Stranding.

Places such as 4chan and others sites were absurd when the leaks happened. Judging the game solely for the story leaks and forgetting the other aspects of the game, where the game undoubtely shines, then discovering not everything was true or that some aspects in the end weren't what they were thinking, like
assuming Abby was a trans character, which shows the level of some of the haters, and they were thinking that basically because she's buffed.

Those weeks were a completely *show. People who were supposed to be "fans" of the first game deciding to read leaks of the sequel (what the actual *), people spoiling the game to others, people judging the game without playing it and experiencing it for yourself, a LOT of clickbait ****ty videos before and after the game was released, people predicting "this game is gonna sell very poorly just wait and see haha got em", etc.

In any case, I want to clarify: I don't have anything against people disliking or not enjoying the game. That's fine. No game in the world will loved by everyone, that's impossible. And I like to see other points of view. But then, there's people who didn't even tried to like the game, or worse, people who hasn't played the game but already decided it's bad because "Random Youtuber That I Follow said so".

As I said I don't really care about awards and all of that, but in this case I'd be happy if the game ends winning GOTY only to see incels raging and crying on the internet lol.
Click to expand...
Bruh why'd you feel the need to clarify, the only people who'd take your posts as aggressive backlash to criticism are the kind of people who wouldn't listen to anything at all either way. You're cool man
 
Jerry98

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SNEKeater said:
Like I'm not gonna quote every comment after the last one I made, but seriously, I wouldn't be surprised if like half of you didn't even played the game. At least that is what my experience has showed me these last months, half or more of the people I have discussed TLOU2 with on the Internet clearly didn't even played the game. And for the rest, most of these people had very simplistic criticisms that you can apply to any game.

The other day someone here talked about how the negative opinions always seem more powerful (I don't remember the context, only that comment), even if those usually came from the minority. TLOU2 is not really different.
Play the game for yourselves, and don't let clickbait videos/articles or spoiler dramas decide for you.

If we're gonna act like this, we should also say that the game suffered of a hate campaign even before people played the game. Like, is someone gonna actually defend that at the 00:01 on the day the game was released, the game already had A LOT of negative user scores in Metacritic?
Like, seriously. TLOU2 has around 143.000 user "reviews" on Metacritic. That is NOT normal even for a big anticipated AAA game. Examples of why I say this:

  • Red Dead 2: 13.800 user scores
  • God of War: 16.000 user scores
  • Breath of the Wild: 15.600 user scores
  • FFVII Remake: 6.300 user scores

The difference is incredibly obvious. Not to say the death threats the VA of a particular character received.



I've played the three games you mention and TLOU2 still seems superior to me.

About your spoiler, sorry, but you seem to completely miss the point of the game. I'm not gonna say "you must like it!", of course, and anyone is free to dislike a videogame, that's evident. But I read your spoiler, and in my eyes, it couldn't be more wrong.

The problem is you think they were trying to force the players to hate Ellie, but that's not the case. That's a very simplistic and emotional way to see it.
It might sound like a cliche, but it's more like "the guys you thought were the good ones maybe aren't that good, and the guys you thought were bad, maybe aren't that bad". I can't see why someone can't understand that, regardless of liking or disliking the game.-

I mean, C'MON. The first game had that as well. Or you're gonna say Joel is your usual good guy? Obviously not. The first game literally ends with him killing an entire hospital to rescue Ellie (and destroying any potential cure for the virus), then we saw him lying to her at the end. The game is screaming at you that "people can do horrendous things for love" or that "humans sometimes act like monsters for their own interest".

Joel was gonna die 100% since the day Part II was announced. Or did you expect them to not address what he did in the first one? Of course what he did was going to bite him back eventually. He died, which is evidently a big moment for Ellie and the player, and therefore, we automatically hate Abby and we think she's the villain. In Ellie's eyes? Yes. Videogames usually makes us believe, without even think about it, that everything our character does is morally good, and every questionable act that our protag does can be justified for some reason.
They clearly tried something risky with this. Killing one of the main characters of the game + make the "villain" playable halfway through the game. Which won't like everyone, that's okay.

But it's not trash, sorry. I myself was confused when the game changed to Abby, but ended liking it and seeing why they did this. She's a great character. And if you're gonna say she killed Joel, yeah, but it's not like she killed him because she was bored. Like I said, Joel killed the entire hospital and his father, destroying the Fireflies. He didn't only killed his father, he also destroyed her life, because as we saw in the flashbacks, she was essentially a part of the Fireflies, even if it was because her father was an important man in the organization.

Considering all this, naturally they must have to humanize Abby when you control her. Because the regular player is already familiar with Ellie and loves her from the first game, and the first impression the players gets from Abby isn't very positive. Therefore, it's logical for them to humanize Abby a bit more and depict Ellie a bit crazier (who's btw is basically going through the same Abby was going before she killed Joel) to show us that in the world of TLOU we could hardly say there's "good people" and "bad people".

The game clearly tries some things that aren't very usual in a videogame. Well, at least for AAA games. But seriously, sometimes I believe some folks seemed to expect a Disney happy game, when the first TLOU was already really violent and raw.

PD: I know this is pretty much off topic so I won't continue after this. If someone wants to continue the discussion, we can do it in private, I guess.
Click to expand...
Thank you.
There are a lot of other things that should be said and discussed, but clearly this is not the place to do that.


Cutie Gwen said:
I mean, that's kinda not the case as one of the first things reported on the game when it released was that Naughty Dog saying players won't be forced to kill dogs was a lie as you wouldn't be able to get past certain story points, like if you got to the end of stage in a Sonic game but simply stared at the goal ring for 20 minutes instead of actually touching it
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Okay, there is one single dog you must kill to advance the story.
All the other dogs when you're in full "combat gameplay mode" are completely optional and I'm pretty sure these are the dogs they were referring to and it makes sense because the videos that started the discussion about killing the dogs were the gameplay session at the hospital and Hillcrest.
 
SharkLord

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SKX31

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Rie Sonomura said:
I get my Chinese companies mixed up whoops

I know Tencent and SNK collab’d on SOMETHING tho
Click to expand...
SharkLord said:
I believe this was the one?
Click to expand...
That they've done, yes. Honor of Kings (aka Arena of Valor) X KOF / SamSho:


Tencent's also developing a Metal Slug mobile game as well as one KoF game in the past (Tencent - more specifically their TiMi mobile studio - are developing games for Capcom, Konami, SNK, TPC etc.). Tencent's very friendly to SNK. I understand the confusion - trust me, I was fooled myself too.
 
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Cutie Gwen

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Jerry98 said:
Thank you.
There are a lot of other things that should be said and discussed, but clearly this is not the place to do that.



Okay, there is one single dog you must kill to advance the story.
All the other dogs when you're in full "combat gameplay mode" are completely optional and I'm pretty sure these are the dogs they were referring to and it makes sense because the videos that started the discussion about killing the dogs were the gameplay session at the hospital and Hillcrest.
Click to expand...
That's still a lie as it was framed as not needing to kill any dogs period.


Anyway I demand Bury the Light as DLC. I'd gladly fork over money for the song I'm currently hyperfixated on without a character. You could say I find this opportunity to fuel me with motivation
 
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Rie Sonomura

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SKX31 said:
That they've done, yes. Honor of Kings (aka Arena of Valor) X KOF / SamSho:


Tencent's also developing a Metal Slug mobile game as well as one KoF game in the past (Tencent - more specifically their TiMi mobile studio - are developing games for Capcom, Konami, SNK, TPC etc.). Tencent's very friendly to SNK. I understand the confusion - trust me, I was fooled myself too.
Click to expand...
That Mai design looks great, if only it had come sooner, we’d probably have that Mai stage cameo that’s 100% CERO approved :c
 
SNEKeater

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D

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When someone else makes a mistake: "Let's not."

When I make a mistake: "SHINY YOU ****ING ATTENTION SEEKING FASCIST, WHY DO YOU HAVE TO RUIN OUR PEACE IN THE THREAD?"
 
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Rie Sonomura said:
Posted a while back, and honestly, I sleep. All of them are pretty much “safe picks” like Geno or “flavor of the week” characters like Monster Hunter. It’s even gotten to a point where Rex is considered a “safe pick”

I wish people would be more daring and risky with their predictions. Neku? Elma? A League of Legends character? NOW you’re thinking outside the box!

that’s why I found the LoL leak so interesting, it’s something nobody expects, but given Sakurai let another one of Tencent’s subsidies in (Terry from SNK) I can KIND OF see this happening, and League helped establish the esports scene so yeah
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They're predictions. They're not intended to entertain you.

They're "safe" cause he feels they're the most likely.
 
zeldasmash

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SNEKeater said:
It deserves to be nominated. It's not like it's a bad game or anything like that.
And the game's narrative is fine so the game being nominated to best narrative would be understandable.

I mean, I know some people would scream because they're angry even if TLOU2 was nominated to, idk, something stupid like best game that came out in June 19th. But these people not liking the game doesn't actually mean the game was bad, like, AT ALL. I can't think of many games this generation that are really good in practically every aspect like this one.
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I respectfully disagree, at least in terms of narrative. The Last of Us 2, from a gameplay perspective, is good but nothing groundbreaking. But as a narrative and sequel to the first game, it falls flat in every regard at least to me. The game does deserve technical awards, though. The voice acting, music and graphical fidelity are extremely well done.
 
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I.D. said:
Nintendo essentially saved them from Namco lmao
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Yeah. Monolith Soft's Xenosaga games especially the last 2 didn't do so well and Namco wasn't so happy about it and shortly after, Nintendo came and bought them. So Xenoblade wouldn't exist if Xenosaga didn't fail in sales so that warrants KOS-MOS a slot in Smash in my opinion.
 
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Cutie Gwen

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SNEKeater said:

King of Fighters 98 UM OL (mobile game) x Guilty Gear Xrd REV 2.

This clearly means Sol Badguy is FP7.

Click to expand...
Goddamn I know Ky looks feminine ingame but goddamn he went full twink
 
Dinoman96

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Sol is kinda one of those mid tier Japanese characters people started rallying for when Terry got announced, like Arle.

This may sound really stupid, but my hang up with Sol is the fact that his company, ArcSys, has already gotten representation in the form of the Kunio spirits. I think my mindset is that I'm not sure if Nintendo would be willing to give away a company's involvement in Smash like that if they were going to get a character. It'd be like if Cloud and Hero weren't playable but they did the Mana event. It's just weird to telegraph a newcomer like that.

A similar reason I don't expect the likes of Rayman or Doom Guy, because to me I think the Assassin's Creed/Rabbids/Fallout Mii outfits would of been released alongside or after their inclusions as characters.
 
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Iko MattOrr

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Teeb147 said:
Lol not gonna lie but that would be awesome if it was real :D
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It seems to be real, it apparently got leaked by Nintendo themselves, there was the game's icon too.
I don't know how this would affect character speculation though, I somehow think it decreases the chance of getting any Kirby character in the real Smash since now they're playable in their clone spin-off. (if the game is good I'm fine with this anyway).
 
Cutie Gwen

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zeldasmash said:
I respectfully disagree, at least in terms of narrative. The Last of Us 2, from a gameplay perspective, is good but nothing groundbreaking. But as a narrative and sequel to the first game, it falls flat in every regard at least to me. The game does deserve technical awards, though. The voice acting, music and graphical fidelity are extremely well done.
Click to expand...
Lmao you said it deserves technical awards and didn't bring up the realistic garden hose physics or whatever it was. That ****'s genuinely mindboggling like Yakuza 7's bread physics
 
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osby said:
Okay? I don't see what's the point of bringing this up suddenly if you're talking about something that happened in the past.
Click to expand...
Nevermind, I'll drop it.

I'm just saying, watch. People are going to eat me alive in here, and you're just going to sit there and watch as I get torn apart again.
 
SharkLord

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SNEKeater said:

King of Fighters 98 UM OL (mobile game) x Guilty Gear Xrd REV 2.

This clearly means Sol Badguy is FP7.

Click to expand...
You know what else Hatsune Miku makes Sol Badguy canon to?
 
Rie Sonomura

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ShinyLegendary said:
Nevermind, I'll drop it.

I'm just saying, watch. People are going to eat me alive in here, and you're just going to sit there and watch as I get torn apart again.
Click to expand...
Shiny, please, we have nothing against you as a person. It’s just that the moderators require we not deviate too much from Smash as a topic
 
Megadoomer

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ShinyLegendary said:
My apologies.

We need CP7 to purify this thread.
Click to expand...
Okay.



He's like Min Min, but a heavyweight.

(It's a One Piece reference; he's part of a group called CP7)

As for the Last of Us 2 talk, I haven't played either game in the series (though I'm aware of the LoU2 controversy to some extent), but it seems like it would be better suited for a social thread or a PlayStation thread.
 
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Rie Sonomura said:
Posted a while back, and honestly, I sleep. All of them are pretty much “safe picks” like Geno or “flavor of the week” characters like Monster Hunter. It’s even gotten to a point where Rex is considered a “safe pick”

I wish people would be more daring and risky with their predictions. Neku? Elma? A League of Legends character? NOW you’re thinking outside the box!

that’s why I found the LoL leak so interesting, it’s something nobody expects, but given Sakurai let another one of Tencent’s subsidies in (Terry from SNK) I can KIND OF see this happening, and League helped establish the esports scene so yeah
Click to expand...
not sure putting character you wants specifically count as "risky" or thinking outside the box
 
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