Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Speed Weed]

Also Power Stone 3 yeah I wish

as meh as ryza would be to me, i kinda want this leak to be real solely for the sake of power stone 3

screw a new smash character, botw2 proper reveal can go **** itself, mother****ing POWAH STONE THREE is BY FAR the hypest part of this leak

like if it actually happened, i would delete my smashboards account, drop smash altogether and become the best competitive power stone player in the entire goddamn universe for the rest of my life

it's also why i think this is total bogus

 

[3BitSaurus]

This is getting attention because of Ryza 2 being leaked in Australia, but we had several times a rumor get something no one would haved guessed right.

Like the League of Legends rumor that gut the Trials of Mana spirit event right, or that Adeleine fan who exactly predicted the Hero's alts. A broken clock can be right twice a day.

Don't forget the guy that got DMCV stuff right then said Dante was in base Ultimate.

 

[SharkLord]

Marie is the first protagonist of the series.
Elie is the protagonist of the 2nd game, and is one of the most popular installments in Japan.
Rorona's game helped revived the series
And there's Ryza from the 2nd Revitalization of the series.

Do you think the Atelier girls could get a Hero situation, or would it only work if there was only one?

This is getting attention because of Ryza 2 being leaked in Australia, but we had several times a rumor get something no one would haved guessed right.

Like the League of Legends rumor that got the Trials of Mana spirit event right, or that Adeleine fan who exactly predicted the Hero's alts. A broken clock can be right twice a day.

To be fair, the LoL leak hasn't had anything to confirm or deny just yet. CP7 having neither an LoL rep or a Hollow Knight Mii would damage it, and CP8 would be the killswitch date.

 

[Faso115]

Ah yes. This is going in my "there was an attempt" surprise character list. Alongside Gothielle, Katalina and Agnes from Bravely Default

 

[SKX31]

Don't forget the guy that got DMCV stuff right then said Dante was in base Ultimate.

That one was extremely strange.

Also:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

#CantWaitForFebruary30th

 

[CapitaineCrash]

Don't forget the guy that got DMCV stuff right then said Dante was in base Ultimate.

I think the DMC 5 leak had actual information on DMC 5, and he just wanted to troll Smash fans. There's no way he was that lucky on that one honestly.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

That being said, if we did get a Kingdom Hearts 1.5 + 2.5 switch port and P5S trailer, Id be super happy

 

[SneakyLink]

That one was extremely strange.

Also:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

#CantWaitForFebruary30th

“Cannot tweet from their verified account”
Would be humorous if a direct were announced and they couldn’t tweet it out because of this.

 

[3BitSaurus]

I think the DMC 5 leak had actual information on DMC 5, and he just wanted to troll Smash fans. There's no way he was that lucky on that one honestly.

Yeah, I think that was pretty much it. The stuff he got right on DMCV was absolutely not easy to guess either (he got even some details on Nero and V's playstyles that only got revealed post launch, if memory serves).

 

[Flyboy]

That leak has knocked me on my ass because I cannot believe that after two solid years of speculation someone has managed to do a fake leak with a character/series that is just crazy enough to be plausible and yet I have never not once not for a single solitary second even considered for Smash.

 

[BernkastelWitch]

Honestly, people taking Atelier semi-seriously to get remotely something in Smash was not what I was expecting today. I don't mind it but given how everyone was dead locked on Ryu Hayabusa being the Koei rep, it came across a shocker how people are discussing this leak and even taking it remotely seriously due to that.

I ain't gonna be opposed to Atelier content in Smash. I'd personally like it. Hayabusa is still the most likely Koei rep but Atelier does have a bit of a legacy, being in the 90's so to me it's one of those "Crazy but makes sense if you look deep enough" kind of situations.

Even though I bet a lot of people would complain if this was somehow true and Reisalin did get in. I can already hear the complaints from people who are realizing Atelier has even a very small chance of getting something in Smash.

 

[cashregister9]

**** this leak makes me want Ryza in smash and she could have alts that change her character to other Ateliers like Rorona or Sophie

 

[Droodle]

I... kinda fail to see how? You'd think they'd appeal to the current generation with a big recent title like P5 or something more mainstream.

I may be speaking out of line, but... Atelier is definitely not what I think about when someone says "appeals to new players", with how relatively niche it seems to be. Especially because a quick search told me the series originates from the 90s.

The series is definitely niche, especially outside of Japan. And even in Japan it wasn't exactly thriving either, but the Ryza game was highly successful in Japan for a "niche" series. It definitely brought in a lot of newer players into the series.

Just for comparison to other popular characters games/ previous Atelier games(JP sales only, only physical):
- The Atelier game before Ryza (not remakes) sold 30 000 copies in it's first week.
- DMC 5 sold 120k in japan in it's first week (PS4/Xbox/PC)
- Crash N'Sane Trilogy sold 30 000 in it's first week (PS4 only). When the Switch version launched it did another 6 000 sales.
- Astral Chain did around 32 000.
- Nier Automata did around 200 000.
- Xenoblade Chronicles 2 sold a little over 100k on the Switch on release.
- Fire Emblem 3 Houses sold 150k at launch.
- Atelier Ryza sold around 150k (PS4/Switch). Even though the series itself is old, a lot of people who played Ryza were definitely newer to the series. Now obviously on a worldwide scale she is much more niche than any of the other series, but it was a highly successful game in Japan; especially for a series that typically got 10-20k sales and maybe 30k-40k lifetime per entry.

Decently mainstream JRPG series over there like Persona or Tales usually end up selling around 250-350k on launch nowadays. Meanwhile the juggernauts like KH, Monster Hunter, FF, and DQ usually end up selling around 1mil or higher.

I don't even know why I'm trying to defend my point, because I really do believe that the leak is fake and just lucked out.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

What are the Atelier games like?

They're JRPGs right? What makes them special?

 

[Calane]

For me, that character was Hero. It's probably why I don't spend much time on Smashboards anymore, lol.

View attachment 255650This moment will always be legendary to me.

The only characters who could match my excitement for Hero would be Adol Christin, Arle Nadja, and Saki Amamiya.
(Though I've been getting pretty interested in the Atelier series lately, and actually wouldn't mind seeing Ryza despite me knowing she has no chance).

Looks like this old post I made suddenly became relevant, lol.

Needless to say, I would be quite thrilled to see Ryza actually make it in. She's my favorite choice for a Koei Tecmo rep, honestly.

 

[Will]

We got leaks?

Lay it on me because I don't know how many pages back I gotta go.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Gotta say, the one thing I love about Smash and the speculation surrounding it is getting introduced to a whole bunch of series you never even heard of before.

 

[Droodle]

What are the Atelier games like?

They're JRPGs right? What makes them special?

They're usually pretty comfy, no real stakes or anything just gather materials to craft different things.

We got leaks?

Lay it on me because I don't know how many pages back I gotta go.

99.9% sure that it's fake, but a "Direct leak" guessed Atelier Ryza 2 for the Switch and that Ryza is going to be character 7. Shortly after, Atelier Ryza 2 was rated in Australia I think.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

They're usually pretty comfy, no real stakes or anything just gather materials to craft different things.

Like Harvest Moon?

 

[3BitSaurus]

The series is definitely niche, especially outside of Japan. And even in Japan it wasn't exactly thriving either, but the Ryza game was highly successful in Japan for a "niche" series. It definitely brought in a lot of newer players into the series.

Just for comparison to other popular characters games/ previous Atelier games(JP sales only, only physical):
- The Atelier game before Ryza (not remakes) sold 20 000 copies in it's first week.
- DMC 5 sold 120k in japan in it's first week (PS4/Xbox/PC)
- Crash N'Sane Trilogy sold 30 000 in it's first week (PS4 only). When the Switch version launched it did another 6 000 sales.
- Astral Chain did around 32 000.
- Nier Automata did around 200 000.
- Xenoblade Chronicles 2 sold a little over 100k on the Switch on release.
- Fire Emblem 3 Houses sold 150k at launch.
- Atelier Ryza sold around 150k (PS4/Switch). Even though the series itself is old, a lot of people who played Ryza were definitely newer to the series. Now obviously on a worldwide scale she is much more niche than any of the other series, but it was a highly successful game in Japan; especially for a series that typically got 10-20k sales and maybe 30k-40k lifetime per entry.

Decently mainstream JRPG series over there like Persona or Tales usually end up selling around 250-350k on launch nowadays. Meanwhile the juggernauts like KH, Monster Hunter, FF, and DQ usually end up selling around 1mil or higher.

I don't even know why I'm trying to defend my point, because I really do believe that the leak is fake and just lucked out.

Oh, I think the Atelier series probably has its merits, sure, but if you told me a character was added to Smash because they appeal to a newer audience, I'd equate that with either a juggernaut like Minecraft, a series that very recently had a more mainstream break like Nier or a genre-defining game of the 2010s, like Dark Souls.

Basically, the way it looks to me as an outsider, if Atelier was added to Smash, it would be more on whatever legacy the series has with its core audience rather than "it's hype and big among the new generation".

...and yes, it's probably fake, we're just bored lol.

 

[DanganZilla5]

Atelier huh? Never heard of it before. Doesn't seem to be my type of game but I might check it out later. To the fans of the series, I'm curious. How would a character play like and what their abilities? I'm intrigued but this seems quite niche. People smack talked Terry for not knowing him and calling him "obscure". If people were like that towards a character from Fatal Fury, then I can't imagine the reactions people would have toward a rep from a series this niche. I know it's not super obscure (I read Droodle's post), but this would create some extreme salt.

But hey if a lower pantheon character can get in then that might make my man Crypto more feasible.

 

[Nekoo]

What are the Atelier games like?

They're JRPGs right? What makes them special?

See the usual first quests and fetch quests you do in JRPG about going in the forest and crafting medicine?
That's basically the Atelier game, but add comfy, cute girls and that's it.

 

[Droodle]

Like Harvest Moon?

Not really, both series are comfy; but harvest moon plays closer to a simulation type game while Atelier are usually just JRPGs where the purpose is to gather materials from the world in order to craft stuff, there is a story in those games; but they're usually just there as a backdrop for why you're gathering stuff. I haven't actually played the games, but I have heard of them before; so someone else could probably explain better.

 

[BernkastelWitch]

I wanna say Atelier helped popularize crafting in JRPGs since once it existed, more games began to bring in crafting. So if this is true then it helped shape JRPGs in a small way.

The Alchemy systems are quite robust, really. You don't start with much but you progressively get new recipes to make new items and you can make some crazy items late game too. It's just as fun as the combat, if not moreso IMO.

 

[Will]

99.9% sure that it's fake, but a "Direct leak" guessed Atelier Ryza 2 for the Switch and that Ryza is going to be character 7. Shortly after, Atelier Ryza 2 was rated in Australia I think.

Goddamn, that's a -tier ad pick. Would not make the pass look very good on that department.

 

[cashregister9]

The series first priority is being cute but that is not a bad thing as these games fill a similar niche as Harvest Moon or Stardew Valley; Games you play to relax. Like others said there is a robust crafting system.

 

[SNEKeater]

From my readthrough, Sakurai's statements regarding Min Min come off less as "Min Min is more unique relative to the rest of the ARMS roster" and more "Min Min is more unique relative to the rest of Smash's roster". Basically all mentions of uniqueness are framed around the ARMS system and Min Min not having any traditional special moves, not her ability to kick. Plus, logically, if Sakurai really wanted to choose the most unique ARMS character, it's strange he wouldn't go for someone with a more outlandish special ability like Helix or Lola Pop instead of the relatively subdued Min MIn.

Same. When I read the translation, what I understood was that "Min Min stand outs in comparison to other Smash characters", not in comparison to the characters from ARMS.

 

[Nightguything]

I’m not saying I’d sacrifice smash for Power Stone 3 but..

Spoiler

OH NOO..

 

[MooMew64]

I feel like I'm the only one here who'd be low-key hyped for an Atelier pick, and I haven't even played the games, lol. Franchise always looked super adorable, I wouldn't mind having it in Smash.

But nah lol it's fake.

 

[Droodle]

Oh, I think the Atelier series probably has its merits, sure, but if you told me a character was added to Smash because they appeal to a new audience, I'd equate that with either a juggernaut like Minecraft, a series that very recently had a more mainstream break like Nier or a genre-defining game of the 2010s, like Dark Souls.

Basically, the way it looks to me as an outsider, if Atelier was added to Smash, it would be more on whatever legacy the series has with its core audience rather than "it's hype and big among the new generation".

...and yes, it's probably fake, we're just bored lol.

I meant moreso that choosing Ryza specifically would appeal to the newer fans of the Atelier series more than choosing something like the original protagonist from 1997, or even characters that came right before her. Sure if Atelier does end up getting a character, it'll likely be due to the overall legacy of the series. But even with that legacy other Tecmo reps should theoretically still get in first, like Ryu Hayabusa. If hypothetically Ryza does get in over Ryu, it'll likely be due to her relatively niche but recent popularity. Sure, there are more modern games/characters that would appeal to more people, but Ryza has that advantage specifically within her niche (Koei Tecmo/Atelier rep).

So essentially what I'm trying to say is that if Atelier gets picked, it'll definitely be due to a legacy standpoint; but Ryza specifically would appeal to modern/newer fans of the series. As another example, someone like Byleth appeals mostly to modern Fire Emblem fan rather than people who started back in 1990 with Marth's games. Sure, they still appeal to a lot of Fire Emblem fans in general, but since 1990 to now the primary audience for Fire Emblem has changed a lot and also gotten bigger. If someone like Leif from FE4/5 got in instead of Byleth, the reaction would have been much worse; because most of the fanbase currently aren't familiar with Thracia 776, and it would appeal more towards older Fire Emblem fans from the 90's.

 

[Will]

I’m not saying I’d sacrifice smash for Power Stone 3 but..

Spoiler

View attachment 278585

OH NOO..

​

See the usual first quests and fetch quests you do in JRPG about going in the forest and crafting medicine?
That's basically the Atelier game, but add comfy, cute girls and that's it.

Ah, the weeb antithesis to Harvest Moon. How enlightening.

 

[3BitSaurus]

I meant moreso that choosing Ryza specifically would appeal to the newer fans of the Atelier series more than choosing something like the original protagonist from 1997, or even characters that came right before her. Sure if Atelier does end up getting a character, it'll likely be due to the overall legacy of the series. But even with that legacy other Tecmo reps should theoretically still get in first, like Ryu Hayabusa. If hypothetically Ryza does get in over Ryu, it'll likely be due to her relatively niche but recent popularity. Sure, there are more modern games/characters that would appeal to more people, but Ryza has that advantage specifically within her niche (Koei Tecmo/Atelier rep).

So essentially what I'm trying to say is that if Atelier gets picked, it'll definitely be due to a legacy standpoint; but Ryza specifically would appeal to modern/newer fans of the series. As another example, someone like Byleth appeals mostly to modern Fire Emblem fan rather than people who started back in 1990 with Marth's games. Sure, they still appeal to a lot of Fire Emblem fans in general, but since 1990 to now the primary audience for Fire Emblem has changed a lot and also gotten bigger. If someone like Leif from FE4/5 got in instead of Byleth, the reaction would have been much worse; because most of the fanbase currently aren't familiar with Thracia 776, and it would appeal more towards older Fire Emblem fans from the 90's.

True, but at the same time, looking at Hero, he seems to appeal to legacy DQ fans despite the fact that most of his content came from DQXI.

Again, I'm not sure where Atelier stands on this scale, but even if it appeals to a "newer" Atelier audience, it's still a specific niche rather than a more general "appeal to newer players", methinks.

...I gotta say, even though pretty much everyone here agrees that the leak is fake, I love that we're getting some new conversation subjects to spice things up.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

I mean, Sakurai is already a reverse aging god. Sleep probably isn't that important.

True. He hasn't given his body a chance to realize how old it is.

Although it did give him trouble with the Castlevania characters.

Happy 20th birthday, Smash Bros! You’ve always been and will always be my favorite game series. Here’s to the next 20!#smashbros #SmashBrosUltimate #nintendo #nintendoswitch #SmashUltimate pic.twitter.com/g0RUb2zADd

— Wooden Plank Studios (@WoodenPlank) January 23, 2019

The Curious Case of Masahiro Sakurai. Probably uses a custom controller with a benjamin button.

 

[NeonBurrito]

The Atelier "leak" is definitely fake. Not because Ryza couldn't be the Smash fighter or anything, but on the sole factor that Power Stone 3 is one of those "too good to be true" sort of things. I have been waiting for a new Power Stone sequel for decades.

 

[Will]

The Curious Case of Masahiro Sakurai. Probably uses a custom controller with a benjamin button.

I need to rewatch Benjamin Button, wonder if it's still as good as I thought it was like ten years ago lol

 

[3BitSaurus]

I need to rewatch Benjamin Button, wonder if it's still as good as I thought it was like ten years ago lol

I think that's the kind of movie that ages really well.

 

[Shroob]

....I mean I've 'heard' of Alterier, but to see it actually considered even remotely plausible is pretty dang funny, ngl.

I missed all the fun it seems.

 

[Will]

I think that's the kind of movie that ages really well.

They say it gets fresher with age.

....I mean I've 'heard' of Alterier, but to see it actually considered even remotely plausible is pretty dang funny, ngl.

I missed all the fun it seems.

Bro if that **** was real, that would literally incentivize the toxic trend of making speculation out of any tiny new addition to the Switch lineup and treating it like it means that series is gonna be in Smash.

 

[Shroob]

They say it gets fresher with age.


Bro if that **** was real, that would literally incentivize the toxic trend of making speculation out of any tiny new addition to the Switch lineup and treating it like it means that series is gonna be in Smash.

Eh, if the lake's already toxic, adding some cyanide to it isn't going to cause anymore harm.

 

[Will]

Eh, if the lake's already toxic, adding some cyanide to it isn't going to cause anymore harm.

Not worth going ape**** over literally every small thing, when previously it was just big-name **** that was considered "hype" by speculation scene. Now with Alterier and people going "literally who", it'll be just about anything.

At least with Hero they eased up to it, they revealed DQ11S like three months before his reveal. Some triumphant ass music and this dude in his 50s going "Dragon Quest is the most iconic RPG of all time." like damn dude I get it.