Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Perkilator]

I too agree with Cinderace being the possible Gen 8 rep Smash fighter. Specially, if the producer of Sword & Shield Masuda also asks for a special request since Scorbunny is one of his favorite starter.

Cinderace could be like the Min Min situation where the producer is picking the choice instead of Sakurai's own personal decision.

What if, however, it's just Scorbunny and NOT Cinderace, somehow? Just speaking hypothetically.

 

[Shroob]

What if, however, it's just Scorbunny and NOT Cinderace, somehow? Just speaking hypothetically.

Plushie sales go up by 1000%

Ebay is flooded with "Scorbunny RARE Plush SMASH!" for 150$.

 

[osby]

LEGS representation will never be complete without her.

View attachment 276205

Fans: Can we get Chun-Li in Smash?
Sakurai: We already have Chun-Li in Smash.
Chun-Li in Smash:

 

[SnowClaws]

What if, however, it's just Scorbunny and NOT Cinderace, somehow? Just speaking hypothetically.

If it is just Scorbunny, then the Smash playing field would be on fire from Scorbunny running around like Sonic.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I don’t feel like we’re getting a Pokémon this time. Not with Inceneroar in base game. Byleth yeah, I kinda get it since all they got was Chrom base game, an echo, but Inceneroar was a whole new character so I dunno. I got a gut feeling saying that a Gen 8er isn’t happening.

 

[osby]

I don’t feel like we’re getting a Pokémon this time. Not with Inceneroar in base game. Byleth yeah, I kinda get it since all they got was Chrom base game, an echo, but Inceneroar was a whole new character so I dunno. I got a gut feeling saying that a Gen 8er isn’t happening.

I'm not banking on it either but we got Corrin in the last game as DLC despite Robin and Lucina also joining the fray in the base game.

I don't think Nintendo would refrain from adding a new Pokemon just because Incineroar.

 

[Shroob]

I don’t feel like we’re getting a Pokémon this time. Not with Inceneroar in base game. Byleth yeah, I kinda get it since all they got was Chrom base game, an echo, but Inceneroar was a whole new character so I dunno. I got a gut feeling saying that a Gen 8er isn’t happening.

Considering Gen 8 is what, the 2nd best selling Switch game period, and the best selling Pokemon game of all time... yeah, if Nintendo's picking the DLC, no way they're ignoring that just because they already put one in the base.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Considering Gen 8 is what, the 2nd best selling Switch game period, and the best selling Pokemon game of all time... yeah, if Nintendo's picking the DLC, no way they're ignoring that just because they already put one in the base.

I mean, Animal Crossing: New Horizons is the 6th best selling and nobody is guessing that Tom Nook is going to get shilled in. Mario Kart is number 1 so like, Waluigi maybe?

I dunno. I think the fact that the last two characters being Nintendo made has gotten everybody into this mindset that Nintendo is only going to pick “shill” picks from now on but Nintendo picked Fighters Pass 1 too apparently and there was what 1, 2 of you count DQXI Hero? I think people are just jumping into the whole first party thing like everyone did the third party thing.

 

[Shroob]

I mean, Animal Crossing: New Horizons is the 6th best selling and nobody is guessing that Tom Nook is going to get shilled in. Mario Kart is number 1 so like, Waluigi maybe?

I dunno. I think the fact that the last two characters being Nintendo made has gotten everybody into this mindset that Nintendo is only going to pick “shill” picks from now on but Nintendo picked Fighters Pass 1 too apparently and there was what 1, 2 of you count DQXI Hero? I think people are just jumping into the whole party thing like everyone did the third party thing.

I think it's moreso to do that we know Pokemon gets special treatment in Smash compared to other franchises.

Sakurai literally sets aside a spot in every Smash game for a new Pokemon before the newest games are even fully out, sometimes going as far as picking Pokemon to include based on nothing but concept art.


It's not so much "This pass will be loaded with 1st parties" as much as it is "Oh, yeah, Sword and Shield were huge. Well, it's happening."

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I mean, Animal Crossing: New Horizons is the 6th best selling and nobody is guessing that Tom Nook is going to get shilled in. Mario Kart is number 1 so like, Waluigi maybe?

I dunno. I think the fact that the last two characters being Nintendo made has gotten everybody into this mindset that Nintendo is only going to pick “shill” picks from now on but Nintendo picked Fighters Pass 1 too apparently and there was what 1, 2 of you count DQXI Hero? I think people are just jumping into the whole first party thing like everyone did the third party thing.

I really don't understand the idea that Min Min is a shill pick.

She's no more a shill pick than Inkling or Isabelle.

 

[Shroob]

I really don't understand the idea that Min Min is a shill pick.

She's no more a shill pick than Inkling or Isabelle.

Yeah, like

ARMs is what, 2-3 years old at this point? Not really worth 'shill'ing a game that old, they've already made the bulk of their sales off ARMs, Min Min being in Smash may be a small blip on the sales radar, but that's it.

 

[SharkLord]

To go back to Smash influencing franchise popularity, Ness was always in Smash but it took until like, the mid 2010's for Earthbound to get released in Europe and FE almost died despite a decade of Smash, needing to stand up on it's on feet and escaped the jaws of death.


Also, the only character I consider a lock is Dante. Suddenly gained a massive surge of popularity for Itsuno to address it? Ok. Itsuno saying we should be asking for DMC on Switch before Dante in Smash only for DMC on Switch to be announced shortly afterwards? Probably using Smash popularity to get people to buy the game, that's surprisingly common.

DMC3 BEING A ****ING DEFINITIVE EDITION THAT'S ONLY AVAILABLE ON SWITCH? Yeah that HAS to mean something to me

But said popularity surge happened around Byleth's reveal in January, but the pass was finalized around the October/November range. Even if Dante did suddenly become extremely popular, the hype train arrived in too late to be considered.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

It's not so much "This pass will be loaded with 1st parties" as much as it is "Oh, yeah, Sword and Shield were huge. Well, it's happening."

Bro, that is SUPER jumping the gun. It could happen yeah but saying it is going to happen because Pokémon sold well, and it always sales well, doesn’t really make sense. Arms wasn’t the most SMASHING success ever and we got a character from it. Let’s Go Pikachu and Eevee did awesome and we got nothing from it. Same thing happened back when AlphaSapphire and OmegaRuby came out. Pokémon isn’t really a definite thing. It’s definitely a possibility yeah

 

[Shroob]

Bro, that is SUPER jumping the gun. It could happen yeah but saying it is going to happen because Pokémon sold well, and it always sales well, doesn’t really make sense. Arms wasn’t the most SMASHING success ever and we got a character from it. Let’s Go Pikachu and are we did awesome and we got nothing from it. Same thing happened back when AlphaSaphire and OmegaRuby came out. Pokémon isn’t really a definite thing. It’s definitely a possibility yeah

ARMs actually sold very well, actually. Over 2 million units sold. Even though it didn't catch on like Splatoon did, those are still really respectable numbers for a new IP.


"It's not a definite thing"


Except, it is. Sakurai flat out admits that he always sets aside a spot in the base game for Pokemon, that's just a fact.


Does it mean we'll get one for DLC? No, but I'm hedging my bets on "Better safe than sorry."

 

[osby]

Bro, that is SUPER jumping the gun. It could happen yeah but saying it is going to happen because Pokémon sold well, and it always sales well, doesn’t really make sense. Arms wasn’t the most SMASHING success ever and we got a character from it. Let’s Go Pikachu and are we did awesome and we got nothing from it. Same thing happened back when AlphaSaphire and OmegaRuby came out. Pokémon isn’t really a definite thing. It’s definitely a possibility yeah

I'd say there is a difference between remakes and brand new games when it comes to Pokemon in Smash.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

But said popularity surge happened around Byleth's reveal in January, but the pass was finalized around the October/November range. Even if Dante did suddenly become extremely popular, the hype train arrived in too late to be considered.

No, Dante was becoming a popular Smash character since 2018 when someone impersonating the DMCV leaker claimed Dante was coming to Smash, it grew immensely by Byleth's reveal, but Capcom acknowledged his Smash popularity in 2019, I don't entirely remember when, but it was before the first game got ported to Switch and I know that the second game's port was announced in September alongside Terry and XBDE

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

ARMs actually sold very well, actually. Over 2 million units sold. Even though it didn't catch on like Splatoon did, those are still really respectable numbers for a new IP.

I wasn’t saying it didn’t sell well. I know for a fact it sold very well for a new ip. I’m saying that hedging everything on sales or on Pokémon for the sake of its Pokémon is just jumping the gun


I mean believe what you want to believe dude I was just giving my input that I don’t think Pokémon is a shoo-in this time is all. Didn’t think that opinion was that controversial.

 

[SirBillyBob]

Bro, that is SUPER jumping the gun. It could happen yeah but saying it is going to happen because Pokémon sold well, and it always sales well, doesn’t really make sense. Arms wasn’t the most SMASHING success ever and we got a character from it. Let’s Go Pikachu and Eevee did awesome and we got nothing from it. Same thing happened back when AlphaSapphire and OmegaRuby came out. Pokémon isn’t really a definite thing. It’s definitely a possibility yeah

I mean, it's not like you could add anything from Let's Go into Smash, Pikachu is already a fighter and Eevee is a pokeball summon. Even then, we got those two bonus spirits if you bought the game.

 

[Shroob]

I wasn’t saying it didn’t sell well. I know for a fact it sold very well for a new ip. I’m saying that hedging everything on sales or on Pokémon for the sake of its Pokémon is just jumping the gun


I mean believe what you want to believe dude I was just giving my input that I don’t think Pokémon is a shoo-in this time is all. Didn’t think that opinion was that controversial.

To note, I don't even like Sword/Shield, and it'll be a cold day in hell before I plonk down 100 bucks for the game + dlc.

But when I see that Pokemon is the golden child when it comes to how it's handled, plus the fact that it seems that Sakurai is more than happy to either go back and grab things the base game missed(ARMs), or more recent games(3 Houses), the writing is on the wall for me.


Yeah, we got Incineroar... but we didn't get a stage. Truth be told, Pokemon's 'new' content, while good, is nowhere near as crazy as prior game's, not counting returning content.

 

[SirBillyBob]

Truth be told, Pokemon's 'new' content, while good, is nowhere near as crazy as prior game's, not counting returning content.

I'm still disappointed they didn't add the two boss themes from Sun and Moon nor Necrozma's theme. The stage, I get. You would have to completely build a new one from scratch, no reusing models like Zelda or Mario.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Honestly a new pokemon wouldn't be too exciting. There's multiple Swoshi mons I like that can work well in Smash but at the end of the day, that's still the 11th Pokemon character when Pokemon already takes up over 10% of the roster. At least the Swoshi gym battle theme slaps

 

[Shroob]

Honestly a new pokemon wouldn't be too exciting. There's multiple Swoshi mons I like that can work well in Smash but at the end of the day, that's still the 11th Pokemon character when Pokemon already takes up over 10% of the roster. At least the Swoshi gym battle theme slaps

The one thing I'll praise Gen 8 for is having legitimately good music.

Been on a Marnie's theme kick lately.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I mean, let me just be clear, just because I don’t think Pokémon is getting an 8 rep doesn’t mean I won’t stan the **** outta Urshifu.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

The one thing I'll praise Gen 8 for is having legitimately good music.

Been on a Marnie's theme kick lately.

As dull as the 11th Pokemon would be, I cannot deny it'd be cool to be at matchpoint and hear the crowd chant. That is, if the stage gets to be legal or if background isn't too obnoxious

 

[Shroob]

As dull as the 11th Pokemon would be, I cannot deny it'd be cool to be at matchpoint and hear the crowd chant. That is, if the stage gets to be legal or if background isn't too obnoxious

Dynamic music on that stage would be sick, ngl.

 

[SirBillyBob]

This

This is the ideal Pokemon.
You may not like it, but this is peak performance.

 

[TheCJBrine]

As a big Pokémon fan, a Gen 8 rep in Pass 2 would kinda disappoint me tbh, unless it was Inteleon or one of most of the non-starter ‘mons (such as Falinks, Impidimp, and Sirfetch’d), though I also like the Cinderace and Rillaboom lines even if they don’t interest me as much.

It’d all be perfectly good if we get Marnie’s Theme, though.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

This
View attachment 276212
This is the ideal Pokemon.
You may not like it, but this is peal performance.

Hitting Eiscue with any physical moves makes it twice as light as puff but as a tradeoff it's slightly stronger than Brawl Meta Knight

 

[7NATOR]

Man There people out there that want Both Geno and Waluigi (Which would make 11 Mario characters). While the Smash Community might not love it, the Pokemon Fans would love it, especially if they Pick Cool Pokemon (if they were to pick Pokemon, I hope they pick Zarude because He can play like Spider Man)

At the same time, I don't think We getting another Pokemon. I do think there are 2 Franchises that will get it's 2nd Character, with one of them being the last one because it would be Ultimate Reveal, but that's a theory for another Day

 

[ZephyrZ]

I'm very biased as a pokemon fan but I do think a Gen 8 pokemon, while unsurpising, could still make a fairly strong character pick. Whatever you may think of the current games they still have very strong character design and there's a lot of room for unique movesets with a lot of personality.

I don't think we need a new pokemon at all, but it'd still be hard to go wrong with one. I think pokemon can be fearmongered almost like FE is before their reveal but once we see their movesets people tend to warm up to them (unlike FE, where people hate them no matter how different their moveset is).

What if, however, it's just Scorbunny and NOT Cinderace, somehow? Just speaking hypothetically.

I'd actually be down for that. All of our unevolved pokemon are either the mascot , a clone, or just parts of a different character . Having another standalone base or mid form could be a fresh change of pace.

 

[DevaAshera]

Considering Gen 8 is what, the 2nd best selling Switch game period, and the best selling Pokemon game of all time... yeah, if Nintendo's picking the DLC, no way they're ignoring that just because they already put one in the base.

It mostly depends on The Pokémon Company. They can literally say 'no' if they feel like it, even for no reason..like how they said no to any sound effects or music for Pokémon costumes in the base game of Super Mario Maker or outright not letting Pokémon amiibo give Yoshi new skins in Yoshi's Woolly World.
I could legit see them saying 'no' to a new Gen 8 Pokémon simply due to some arbitrary reason like not charging enough for it, not wanting a new stage or spirits, or not wanting their character as 'mere DLC'.
When it comes to TPC, nothing is ever a sure thing except for them wanting money and lots of it.

 

[Shroob]

It mostly depends on The Pokémon Company. They can literally say 'no' if they feel like it, even for no reason..like how they said no to any sound effects or music for Pokémon costumes in the base game of Super Mario Maker or outright not letting Pokémon amiibo give Yoshi new skins in Yoshi's Woolly World.
I could legit see them saying 'no' to a new Gen 8 Pokémon simply due to some arbitrary reason like not charging enough for it, not wanting a new stage or spirits, or not wanting their character as 'mere DLC'.
When it comes to TPC, nothing is ever a sure thing except for them wanting money and lots of it.

They could, but they've also allowed, for the first time, Mii Costumes of Pokemon Characters to be sold as DLC(The Team Rocket Grunts).


As it stands right now, at least in regards to Mii Costumes, they seem pretty okay with DLC.

 

[DevaAshera]

They could, but they've also allowed, for the first time, Mii Costumes of Pokemon Characters to be sold as DLC(The Team Rocket Grunts).

As it stands right now, at least in regards to Mii Costumes, they seem pretty okay with DLC.

Yeah, which is why I think that TPC is just unpredictable.

Also, if I recall correctly, Nintendo gave Sakurai a list of characters to choose from, I could see him opting for someone he found more interesting over a new Pokémon. Considering that every newcomer thus far, except for Byleth, is from a new IP being added to the game, I could also see him deciding to go for more new IPs than one already well represented..though Byleth still got in so clearly it won't be the case every single time, its just a 5/6 case atm..2/7 if you count Piranha Plant, who almost seems like a case of just not being finished in time for Base or being held back due to not seeming 'big' enough for base and thus was given away for free..considering he has something none of the DLC got, Palutena's Guidance.
He also seems like he wants each DLC character to have some unique gimmick..
Joker - Persona mechanics
Hero - Random Crits, Swapping Spells
Banjo-Kazooie - Rival Console Dev character, Wonder Wing
Terry - 4 Specials, Secret Specials
Byleth - Many different weapons
Min Min - Directional ARMS, Tap vs Hold, ARMS Change, Aerial Smashes

 

[osby]

It mostly depends on The Pokémon Company. They can literally say 'no' if they feel like it, even for no reason..like how they said no to any sound effects or music for Pokémon costumes in the base game of Super Mario Maker or outright not letting Pokémon amiibo give Yoshi new skins in Yoshi's Woolly World.
I could legit see them saying 'no' to a new Gen 8 Pokémon simply due to some arbitrary reason like not charging enough for it, not wanting a new stage or spirits, or not wanting their character as 'mere DLC'.
When it comes to TPC, nothing is ever a sure thing except for them wanting money and lots of it.

So, like pretty much any other company?

I'm gonna be honest, I'm not a fan of personifying companies. TPC don't make business decisions because they feel like it. They allow Sakurai to add a Pokemon from the latest Gen in each game because it's free promotion. Yeah, they might be picky about the content but "they can do whatever" is not really an argument. They allowed DLC Spirits and Mii costumes. I don't see how unspecified arbitrary reasons is enough for them to reject a Pokemon if Nintendo wants one.

 

[Shroob]

Yeah, which is why I think that TPC is just unpredictable.

Also, if I recall correctly, Nintendo gave Sakurai a list of characters to choose from, I could see him opting for someone he found more interesting over a new Pokémon. Considering that every newcomer thus far, except for Byleth, is from a new IP being added to the game, I could also see him deciding to go for more new IPs than one already well represented..though Byleth still got in so clearly it won't be the case every single time, its just a 5/6 case atm..2/7 if you count Piranha Plant, who almost seems like a case of just not being finished in time for Base or being held back due to not seeming 'big' enough for base and thus was given away for free..considering he has something none of the DLC got, Palutena's Guidance.

Something tells me that Pokemon has a lot more say in these kind of things than we give them credit for.

Just a hunch.

 

[keleyeemoh]

I'd say Toxtricity is near the top of my most wanted list right now. As for a stage, I think Ballonlea would be gorgeous.

 

[Knight Dude]

Pokemon again huh? It's certainly possible. But unlike ARMS, I can't say I'd be interested for it.

 

[osby]

Also, if I recall correctly, Nintendo gave Sakurai a list of characters to choose from, I could see him opting for someone he found more interesting over a new Pokémon.

Isn't that something fans made up? Sakurai was clear that Nintendo chose the characters (or at least games they came from) and he only approved them.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Isn't that something fans made up? Sakurai was clear that Nintendo choose the characters (or at least games they came from) and he only approved them.

Yeah, it’s made up. Sakurai discusses stuff with Nintendo, but there’s never been any mention of them giving him a list. He can likely say no to a character they ask about, however none have been rejected because of moveset or whatever like that iirc.

 

[DevaAshera]

Pokemon again huh? It's certainly possible. But unlike ARMS, I can't say I'd be interested for it.

Same here honestly. When it comes to new Pokémon in Smash, ever since Brawl, its just felt like 'oh, here's a marketing tool for the newest game'. Aside from Pokémon Trainer, we never get new Pokémon from older Generations like Gardevoir or Sceptile, just whatever the newest Pokémon Generation is..usually a Starter Evolution.

Isn't that something fans made up? Sakurai was clear that Nintendo choose the characters (or at least games they came from) and he only approved them.

I've seen places reporting it as fact, like EventHubs.
https://www.eventhubs.com/news/2018...asahiro-sakurai-no-ballot-or-fan-vote-coming/
https://www.eventhubs.com/news/2019...ide-super-smash-bros-ultimates-fighters-pass/

The fact that Sakurai can reject their choices does seem to imply that there is some leeway at least, so if he thought a new Pokémon didn't have what he wanted from a DLC character, he could reject it in favor of a different character.