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Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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NonSpecificGuy

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I rarely see Geno brought up anywhere but here but I guess it depends on where you’re looking. My Twitter, for instance, is flooded with Doom Slayer, Lara Croft, Rayman, and Crash with a little bit of Dante sprinkled in. I’ve never once seen a Geno post on Twitter besides a single wishlist I saw a while back. No fan art or anything.

Granted here and Twitter are the only places I visit and I rarely visit Twitter as is so I’m definitely not the best metric but even still if Geno really is as popular as everyone says then I would’ve seen more of him elsewhere. I think it’s drastically overblown in my opinion. Even as a fan of Geno.
 

Droodle

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I rarely see Geno brought up anywhere but here but I guess it depends on where you’re looking. My Twitter, for instance, is flooded with Doom Slayer, Lara Croft, Rayman, and Crash with a little bit of Dante sprinkled in. I’ve never once seen a Geno post on Twitter besides a single wishlist I saw a while back. No fan art or anything.

Granted here and Twitter are the only places I visit and I rarely visit Twitter as is so I’m definitely not the best metric but even still if Geno really is as popular as everyone says then I would’ve seen more of him elsewhere. I think it’s drastically overblown in my opinion. Even as a fan of Geno.
There's plenty of Geno posts on twitter, the problem is that usually they're linked to Sakurai's POTD tweets, so you have to look for them. At the same time, he's still a highly controversial character on there too, so someone might post "Geno on his way to get added to Smash" and get 60 likes, and then someone else posts "Geno on his way to NOT get into Smash" which'll also get 60 likes. There's some fan art here and there too, but you have to look pretty hard for it; and the Geno doesn't really have a popular fan account like the likes of Rayman4Smash or Reimu4Smash.

EDIT: And it's not just twitter either. As someone who ends up going to plenty of forums/imageboards, Geno gets posted about a ton in general. The problem is that most of the time outside of here or the Geno thread, he's still highly controversial. For example, gamefaqs absolutely hates Geno with a passion; there are multiple threads every week stating that Geno shouldn't get into Smash or worse (putting it lightly). If you're a hardcore Geno fan, it's annoying going on there. Its hard to tell with 4chan, because its all anonymous; but most people seem to think Geno isn't really worth it at all, the Geno dedicated threads get tons of posts (some supporting, mostly hate). Reddit seems to be pretty chill about him, but there isn't really a huge speculation scene on reddit aside from when some major leaks pop up (most people on there say that he's more of a upgraded costume style of character).

So really, if you want Geno discussion the best place is the Genoboard, the problem with the Genoboard is that it's obviously highly biased in favor of Geno's definitely getting in; which makes certain types of discussion pretty difficult unless you're a hardcore fan and think he's DEFINITELY IN this time. The last place is here, but even then Geno is still a pretty controversial character.

TL;DR: It's pretty much impossible to discuss Geno honestly outside of here or the Genoboard. Which is likely another reason why Geno gets posted about a ton on this site, especially post E3/Hero when all the Geno hate started in every other site.
 
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LiveStudioAudience

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2B feels like a Master Chief in that her inclusion would be significant given the lack of any sort of Nintendo history by either Nier or Drakengard. A genuine outsider in that respect barring some announcement of Automata showing up for Switch.
 

Cosmic77

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Geno is mostly contained within places made specifically for Smash speculation. He's not the kind of character who you can casually drop on Twitter or Facebook and expect people to be extremely enthusiastic about him. If you just got into Smash or never really paid attention to speculation until recently, Geno's popularity would likely feel confusing to you.
 

NonSpecificGuy

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Geno is mostly contained within places made specifically for Smash speculation. He's not the kind of character who you can casually drop on Twitter or Facebook and expect people to be extremely enthusiastic about him. If you just got into Smash or never really paid attention to speculation until recently, Geno's popularity would likely feel confusing to you.
Yeah that’s basically what I’ve been trying to say. Basically if you were to drop Geno in Smash on Twitter as a Mario character basically everyone on there would just go “where’s Waluigi?”.
 

Megadoomer

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PapaGenos talking about Neku.
Thanks to Lord Woomy Lord Woomy for pointing this out; this seems like it might be worth noting here:

 
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Droodle

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Thanks to Lord Woomy Lord Woomy for pointing this out, but this seems like it might be worth noting here:

Yeah, people really need to fact check the context of certain posts before thinking a leaker hinted at a particular character getting into Smash. And I say that as someone who has Neku as their most wanted.

That said, I can safely say if a sequel is planned then Neku's chances for Smash are officially not 0%, that's a win in my book.
 

Voe

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I hope I'm not too late for this game.

I think I got a decent game. I hope it's good.

Make a fighters pass using the top six "gun wielding" characters you'd like to see in Super Smash Bros Ultimate so anyone who fights using guns or any kind of weapon that shoots bullets or lasers beams (Like Samus, Joker, Bayonetta or Inklings) is fair game. I'll give you all an example.
1. Doomguy (DOOM Eternal Slayer would probably be his default and his classic outfit would be his alt costume, but as far as his moves go he would pull from DOOM 1, 2, 2016, and Eternal.)
2. Slippy Toad (Someday people will respect youl. Slippy would likely would have his SF Zero design which I'm cool with. It would be neat if his reveal trailer was a continuation of Snake's Brawl codec with Falco.)
3. Marco (From Metal Slug. He would be based on his short/chibi looking in-game design, along with Tarma, Eri, and Fio as alt costumes similar to how Hero was handled.)
4. Jill Valentine (RE1 Jill as default and RE3 Jill as the alt costume. If RE3 Jill can't make the cut then I'd happily take her BSAA uniform.)
5. Dante (I'll take any design as long as none of them are the reboot Dante.)
6. Jak & Daxter ( They would be based on their Jak 2 designs because I'm bias, but one costume slot can be saved for Dark Jak. Jak would have a transformation gimmick for his guns and a meter that's pretty much LIMIT. When the meter is full he can use his gun upgrades from Jak 3.


Honorary mention goes to Captain N. Too bad Nintendo forgot the IP existed.
 
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ZeldaPlayer87

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Geno’s really been put through the ringer, hasn’t he? His popularity cropped up around Brawl. But he was nowhere to be seen, and I can’t recall off the top of my head if he got a sticker, which I doubt since SE wasn’t involved with Brawl.

Smash 4 rolls around the people speculate what newcomers we are getting, and yet still no Geno at launch. Then the process of speculating who DLC might include Geno, but they use 3 out of 7 DLC spots for veterans, so that sort of ruins things, and then as time goes on, the glimmer of hope for Geno is shattered when his Mii Costume is revealed. We were almost there boys, we almost got him.

A few years later, Ultimate is revealed and a wave of speculation begins, which of course, the #1 talking point is Geno. With shock reveals like Ridley and King K. Rool, many were hopefully Geno would be front and center at launch, but that wasn’t the case. Now we are in the thick of DLC speculation again, and after being disappointed once again with Geno not appearing in Pass 1, everyone is setting their sights on Pass 2, hoping and praying our Pinocchio-inspired wooden wonder will make it in finally.

Ironically, the ARMS reveal will help or hinder Geno’s chances since ARMS has spirits in the game already, so if Nintendo gives us a character that already has a spirit, then Geno has a hopeful shot. If they do something wonky by giving us a character that doesn’t have a spirit, then Geno’s chances will not look good.

There is also an issue of what he sounds like. I would contend that maybe there was internal debate within Nintendo/SE about how his voice should be, because Geno’s never been heard outside of SMRPG. We know he speaks since he’s got lines in the game, but we have no clue what he sounds like.

I don’t know if it’s like that in anime, where the original writers/producers etc. have a say in what the English dubs should sound like in terms of characters. Look at Yu-Gi-Oh. Bakura was British for some reason, Joey had a Long Island voice going for him, and Kaiba was essentially a more gruff-sounding Brock. It was kind of bad, actually lol. That 4Kids dubbing was something else.

Given the amount of effort put into Ultimate, my guess is that, if they plan on releasing Geno, they want him to sound just right. I bet you $20 and a bag of doughnuts that’s one of the main reasons why he’s been kept out for so long; a major argument about his voice. It may seem arbitrary, but if someone wanted to use my character in their game, I would fight tooth and nail to make sure they sounded as authentic to the actual product as possible. Since Geno’s never had a voice outside of RPG, it’s really a struggle to figure out what would be “authentic” to Geno.
 

Ramen Tengoku

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Given the amount of effort put into Ultimate, my guess is that, if they plan on releasing Geno, they want him to sound just right. I bet you $20 and a bag of doughnuts that’s one of the main reasons why he’s been kept out for so long; a major argument about his voice. It may seem arbitrary, but if someone wanted to use my character in their game, I would fight tooth and nail to make sure they sounded as authentic to the actual product as possible. Since Geno’s never had a voice outside of RPG, it’s really a struggle to figure out what would be “authentic” to Geno.
GEEEENOOO BOOOST

GEENOOO WHIIIRL
 
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metalhydra273

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There is also an issue of what he sounds like. I would contend that maybe there was internal debate within Nintendo/SE about how his voice should be, because Geno’s never been heard outside of SMRPG. We know he speaks since he’s got lines in the game, but we have no clue what he sounds like.
He may end up being similar to the other voiceless characters like mega man, pac-man, villager, etc... Just because he can speak doesn't mean they have to make him. Unless you think it's that important that he does. If so, then maybe, but I'm sure they could find him something if they set their minds to it.
 

TheCJBrine

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I rarely see Geno brought up anywhere but here but I guess it depends on where you’re looking. My Twitter, for instance, is flooded with Doom Slayer, Lara Croft, Rayman, and Crash with a little bit of Dante sprinkled in. I’ve never once seen a Geno post on Twitter besides a single wishlist I saw a while back. No fan art or anything.

Granted here and Twitter are the only places I visit and I rarely visit Twitter as is so I’m definitely not the best metric but even still if Geno really is as popular as everyone says then I would’ve seen more of him elsewhere. I think it’s drastically overblown in my opinion. Even as a fan of Geno.
I see some Geno and SMRPG fan art in my twitter feed, though I follow Operation Starfall and they retweet it so idk. It’s usually about Geno or other SMRPG characters (or all of them) themselves and not Smash.

Also I don’t know why I talked about this site being an indicator of popularity earlier. I guess I meant around this site specifically since I saw others seem to use this site as a metric for him in the greater outlook of things, so I thought this was actually a good place for him and it wasn’t just the smaller group of people who posted in the Geno thread often, but idk. Even outside this site, though, there are definitely some examples where you could say Geno is very known among internet boisengirls up to the same or nearly the same level as other popular characters (including ones that have been included in Smash’s roster). Some YouTube videos, for example.

Of course he’s clearly not up to gigantic levels, but he’s not really near as obscure as some people imply either.


Geno’s really been put through the ringer, hasn’t he? His popularity cropped up around Brawl. But he was nowhere to be seen, and I can’t recall off the top of my head if he got a sticker, which I doubt since SE wasn’t involved with Brawl.

Smash 4 rolls around the people speculate what newcomers we are getting, and yet still no Geno at launch. Then the process of speculating who DLC might include Geno, but they use 3 out of 7 DLC spots for veterans, so that sort of ruins things, and then as time goes on, the glimmer of hope for Geno is shattered when his Mii Costume is revealed. We were almost there boys, we almost got him.

A few years later, Ultimate is revealed and a wave of speculation begins, which of course, the #1 talking point is Geno. With shock reveals like Ridley and King K. Rool, many were hopefully Geno would be front and center at launch, but that wasn’t the case. Now we are in the thick of DLC speculation again, and after being disappointed once again with Geno not appearing in Pass 1, everyone is setting their sights on Pass 2, hoping and praying our Pinocchio-inspired wooden wonder will make it in finally.

Ironically, the ARMS reveal will help or hinder Geno’s chances since ARMS has spirits in the game already, so if Nintendo gives us a character that already has a spirit, then Geno has a hopeful shot. If they do something wonky by giving us a character that doesn’t have a spirit, then Geno’s chances will not look good.

There is also an issue of what he sounds like. I would contend that maybe there was internal debate within Nintendo/SE about how his voice should be, because Geno’s never been heard outside of SMRPG. We know he speaks since he’s got lines in the game, but we have no clue what he sounds like.

I don’t know if it’s like that in anime, where the original writers/producers etc. have a say in what the English dubs should sound like in terms of characters. Look at Yu-Gi-Oh. Bakura was British for some reason, Joey had a Long Island voice going for him, and Kaiba was essentially a more gruff-sounding Brock. It was kind of bad, actually lol. That 4Kids dubbing was something else.

Given the amount of effort put into Ultimate, my guess is that, if they plan on releasing Geno, they want him to sound just right. I bet you $20 and a bag of doughnuts that’s one of the main reasons why he’s been kept out for so long; a major argument about his voice. It may seem arbitrary, but if someone wanted to use my character in their game, I would fight tooth and nail to make sure they sounded as authentic to the actual product as possible. Since Geno’s never had a voice outside of RPG, it’s really a struggle to figure out what would be “authentic” to Geno.
I’m not sure a voice is really needed, but it would be really cool. Remember that Olimar and Alph don’t use their voices, though, and Isabelle doesn’t make any noise at all either even though she could :S Other characters are like this, too. They could just give Geno some SMRPG sound effects or something.

The Pikmin Captains’ lack of voices still bugs me however, and Isabelle really could’ve exclaimed a short gibberish “oof” when getting hit or something.
 
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TheHeartbreakKid

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How we feeling on Rayman's chances? I feel like Rayman has almost as much momentum going into E3 as Banjo did last year (minus the insider buzz), but not nearly the same amount of hype
 

Cosmic77

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I know Sakurai values making characters feel authentic, but I don't feel like the voice is holding Geno back.

Actually, Geno doesn't even need to speak. Isabelle doesn't make any sounds despite having a voice in the Animal Crossing games.
 

Dinoman96

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How we feeling on Rayman's chances? I feel like Rayman has almost as much momentum going into E3 as Banjo did last year (minus the insider buzz), but not nearly the same amount of hype
I just don't find him likely at all. I think any new western characters are going to be far and inbetween, and good working relationship with Ubisoft be damned, I just don't see why Nintendo would be willing to include a guest character that barely even exists in their home country. And I'm not convinced he really has the massive fan demand that Banjo had that his fans claim to have.

I still feel like Crash and dare I say, Steve are probably the most likely western newcomers.
 

TheHeartbreakKid

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I just don't find him likely at all. I think any new western characters are going to be far and inbetween, and good working relationship with Ubisoft be damned, I just don't see why Nintendo would be willing to include a guest character that barely even exists in their home country. And I'm not convinced he really has the massive fan demand that Banjo had that his fans claim to have.

I still feel like Crash and dare I say, Steve are probably the most likely western newcomers.

I think Crash is extremely likely as well, but all the weird coincidences with Rayman and Ubisoft lately make it extremely unlikely in my book that he won't be getting in. Multiple Ubisoft Mii Costumes, none of which are Rayman? The trademark renewal? The weird Ubisoft bot mention of him potentially being DLC?

Steve has been dead in my mind since the Mojang community leader was publicly mocking the idea of Steve getting revealed at E3, and stated she had been following Banjo speculation
 
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KingofPhantoms

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What I don't really get is why Geno has such a huge following for Smash Bros., of all things, in the first place.

Ensemble Darkhorses happen all the time. Nintendo has plenty of them. One-shot characters who are entertaining, quirky, charming, maybe they're well-written, maybe they're mysterious, maybe they have a story or character that people really feel or connect with. People want to see more of them, people clamor to have them appear again, they get a cult following.

I'm not surprised that Geno has a fanbase. What I don't get is why so many people are asking him to be in Smash, when hardly any other Nintendo one-shot is getting the same treatment on the same level. Skull Kid seems to come the closest to him in that regard, and even then you can at least say he's had multiple appearances.

Is it only because Sakurai mentioned an interest in the character? Or was there a fair amount of support even before that? I know he had support as far back as Brawl, but I can't remember when it was that Sakurai first showed interest in him.
 
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Wunderwaft

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What are your opinions on spirits becoming fighters? I wanna see what other people think on this topic.
Really I think the moment that the ARMS spirits were shown as legitimate candidates during the initial reveal was the moment that Nintendo told us that they view AT and spirits upgrades as viable options.

 

Digital Hazard

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Is it only because Sakurai mentioned an interest in the character? Or was there a fair amount of support even before that? I know he had support as far back as Brawl, but I can't remember when it was that Sakurai first showed interest in him.
Well, there was a poll back in Smash 64 days about what characters people would like to see and Geno was in there.

Keep in mind Mallow was there too, and they both only received 4 votes, and a Goomba was in higher place by 1 more vote.
 

KingofPhantoms

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Well, there was a poll back in Smash 64 days about what characters people would like to see and Geno was in there.

Keep in mind Mallow was there too, and they both only received 4 votes, and a Goomba was in higher place by 1 more vote.
Why the hell is Goomba not in Smash yet, then?

Jokes aside, I somehow doubt that's exactly where it all started lol.
 
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SMAASH! Puppy

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...I just don't see why Nintendo would be willing to include a guest character that barely even exists in their home country.
Why would that be a reason why they wouldn't add a character? They've added regionally popular characters before, there's not really any difference between only being popular in Japan and only being popular anywhere else unless the country is much smaller.

Steve has been dead in my mind since the Mojang community leader was publicly mocking the idea of Steve getting revealed at E3, and stated she had been following Banjo speculation
I don't think she has any say in the matter though.

Well, there was a poll back in Smash 64 days about what characters people would like to see and Geno was in there.

Keep in mind Mallow was there too, and they both only received 4 votes, and a Goomba was in higher place by 1 more vote.
Keep in mind Peach and Bowser weren't in the game at this point. Lesser characters wouldn't likely have had that much support back then.
 

Digital Hazard

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Why the hell is Goomba not in Smash yet, then?
I unironically always had in mind Mario mooks as potential newcomers before Piranha Plant happened due to them being frequently playable in spinoffs, so yeah, where are a Goomba and a Koopa?
 

TheHeartbreakKid

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I don't think she has any say in the matter though.
This is a point I've argued completely to death before, so I'll try and be succinct for once:

It's not that this woman would have any SAY in the matter, but that if Steve WERE coming, she WOULD be in the know. She's the head of Community Outreach for Mojang, meaning her job literally is to handle the Minecraft fanbase. If Steve was going to be a DLC character, someone would have contacted her after her first bout of tweets to say "don't delete your tweets, but lay off the Steve/Smash stuff", since they wouldn't want a vocal team member poo-pooing an upcoming major announcement. Deleting the tweets would make it obvious he was coming, so the best option for Microsoft would be to have her just not tweet about Steve in Smash anymore... but she mocked the idea MULTIPLE different times leading up to Banjo's announcement.

So basically, unless Steve as a character has been negotiated for SINCE AFTER Banjo's announcement, I don't see him being very likely at all.
 
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Dinoman96

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Why would that be a reason why they wouldn't add a character? They've added regionally popular characters before, there's not really any difference between only being popular in Japan and only being popular anywhere else unless the country is much smaller.
Most of those were either A. Nintendo characters included in the base game so whatever (Little Mac, Ridley, etc) or characters popular in Japan (Hero), which unfortunately have more priority than characters more popular in the west. That's just how it is with a game made in Japan by Japanese people. I imagine they don't want to have a character that would totally alienate their home audience and thus be far less likely to sell as DLC.

At least Dragon Quest has had million sellers here. Whereas no Rayman game in Japan has sold more than like, 14,000. Even the first Banjo-Kazooie sold about 400,000 when it was first released there.
 
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Megadoomer

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What are your opinions on spirits becoming fighters? I wanna see what other people think on this topic.
I feel like there's a good chance of it happening, and I have no problem with it. The alternative is the development team deciding to rule out 1000+ characters, including practically every single potential Nintendo character, because a PNG of them found through a Google image search was included in the game. That just seems silly to me.

There are Nintendo characters who don't have spirits, like Sylux from Metroid, Adeleine and Ribbon from Kirby, Porky from Earthbound, Mike Jones from Star Tropics, and some others, but there aren't many.
 
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SMAASH! Puppy

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So basically, unless Steve as a character has been negotiated for SINCE AFTER Banjo's announcement, I don't see him being very likely at all.
I can't say for certain, but I think the characters were chosen late last year, in which case this scenario is definitely possible.

I imagine they don't want to have a character that would totally alienate their home audience and thus be far less likely to sell as DLC.
In Japan. It'll sell like hotcakes where the character's target audience is. Unless Japan as a whole boycotts the rest of the characters in protest (I doubt even America would do this) I don't think there's going to be a huge loss, especially if the character is super huge like Lara or Master Chief.

I unironically always had in mind Mario mooks as potential newcomers before Piranha Plant happened due to them being frequently playable in spinoffs, so yeah, where are a Goomba and a Koopa?
Actually, Super Smash Bros. seems to be its first playable appearance, with Mario Tennis Aces being its second.
 

LiveStudioAudience

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What I don't really get is why Geno has such a huge following for Smash Bros., of all things, in the first place.

Ensemble Darkhorses happen all the time. Nintendo has plenty of them. One-shot characters who are entertaining, quirky, charming, maybe they're well-written, maybe they're mysterious, maybe they have a story or character that people really feel or connect with. People want to see more of them, people clamor to have them appear again, they get a cult following.

I'm not surprised that Geno has a fanbase. What I don't get is why so many people are asking him to be in Smash, when hardly any other Nintendo one-shot is getting the same treatment on the same level. Skull Kid seems to come the closest to him in that regard, and even then you can at least say he's had multiple appearances.

Is it only because Sakurai mentioned an interest in the character? Or was there a fair amount of support even before that? I know he had support as far back as Brawl, but I can't remember when it was that Sakurai first showed interest in him.
Part of it is rooted in Mario RPG getting more fans as time has gone on with fans discovering the character and thus seeing the potential of him as a fighter. Same as fans of Puyo or Panel de Pon who see the same potential in Arle or Lip.

Something else is that I think for some that it would enshrine a beloved game that's never really been followed up on. Mario RPG has gotten spiritual sequels in stuff like Paper Mario or M&L, yet a true sequel has never appeared and even elements of it appearing in other games have been few and far between. To have Geno in Smash as a main fighter would not only be a significant acknowledgement of it, but give it it showcase that would in a sense have it be immortalized even further.

Him appearing in Smash leading to a Mario RPG sequel would be nice, but even if it didn't, even if Nintendo and Square never did anything with the character or sub-franchise again, just being in a mega popular pillar of modern gaming? It would be something any fan could go back to and always have; that in this biggest crossover of all time, fans got to experience the character again in a way that felt meaningful.
 
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TheCJBrine

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What I don't really get is why Geno has such a huge following for Smash Bros., of all things, in the first place.

Ensemble Darkhorses happen all the time. Nintendo has plenty of them. One-shot characters who are entertaining, quirky, charming, maybe they're well-written, maybe they're mysterious, maybe they have a story or character that people really feel or connect with. People want to see more of them, people clamor to have them appear again, they get a cult following.

I'm not surprised that Geno has a fanbase. What I don't get is why so many people are asking him to be in Smash, when hardly any other Nintendo one-shot is getting the same treatment on the same level. Skull Kid seems to come the closest to him in that regard, and even then you can at least say he's had multiple appearances.

Is it only because Sakurai mentioned an interest in the character? Or was there a fair amount of support even before that? I know he had support as far back as Brawl, but I can't remember when it was that Sakurai first showed interest in him.
I think Sakurai first showed he had interest in Geno in one of his columns after the Smash 4 mii costume released, saying he wanted to put him in as far back as Brawl.

I’m a newer fan so I don’t really know how big his support was back then, I just feel like people have made it sound like it was much better than the huge lack of faith in his inclusion during the Smash 4 days.

I guess people want him in Smash for the same reasons as mostly everyone who wants a character + wanting to see him come back after so long. I feel other characters would be similar if there was something that made people think they had a good chance, too, not necessarily because “this character is likely I must support them!” but because they either already liked/loved the character but didn’t put 2-and-2 together for Smash for some reason or they just didn’t feel it worthwhile to speak up before.

I think Crash is extremely likely as well, but all the weird coincidences with Rayman and Ubisoft lately make it extremely unlikely in my book that he won't be getting in. Multiple Ubisoft Mii Costumes, none of which are Rayman? The trademark renewal? The weird Ubisoft bot mention of him potentially being DLC?

Steve has been dead in my mind since the Mojang community leader was publicly mocking the idea of Steve getting revealed at E3, and stated she had been following Banjo speculation
Mojang has other Community Managers too, though. Are we sure they would really know? I would think telling someone who’s job is to communicate with the community early on about it would be risking leaks but idk. Plus her comments on Steve were from November 2018, while the rest of her Smash-related tweets were very early 2019 saying nothing bad about him nor if he’s in or not + just one weird tweet near E3 where all she said was “Minecraft Steve” (said nothing about Smash) and now she’s deleted her old Smash-related tweets about Steve.

If she would know, I doubt she would have back then at least. Pass 2 was likely greenlit at E3 last year, too, given what Imran Khan said in a video (unless he meant its entirety was decided I guess...? Idk he just said Pass 2 was decided or something around E3).

edit: actually yeah. The “Minecraft Steve” tweet is, of course, fine. There’s no way they negotiated Steve and other characters during when her original tweets were posted given what we know. How they announced “more DLC” in September last year probably shows they weren’t fully finished negotiating, either.
 
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Droodle

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What I don't really get is why Geno has such a huge following for Smash Bros., of all things, in the first place.

Ensemble Darkhorses happen all the time. Nintendo has plenty of them. One-shot characters who are entertaining, quirky, charming, maybe they're well-written, maybe they're mysterious, maybe they have a story or character that people really feel or connect with. People want to see more of them, people clamor to have them appear again, they get a cult following.

I'm not surprised that Geno has a fanbase. What I don't get is why so many people are asking him to be in Smash, when hardly any other Nintendo one-shot is getting the same treatment on the same level. Skull Kid seems to come the closest to him in that regard, and even then you can at least say he's had multiple appearances.

Is it only because Sakurai mentioned an interest in the character? Or was there a fair amount of support even before that? I know he had support as far back as Brawl, but I can't remember when it was that Sakurai first showed interest in him.
It's a mixture of things, Geno was a linked to a big meme back when Brawl was being developed; and he became one of the first big fan requests. By the time 4 came out, Geno's fanbase had returned to being extremely small; and there were a ton of characters that were more requested then him, Then Sakurai gave Geno a mii costume and acknowledged his fandom in Smash 4 and recalls that he tried making him playable in Brawl, which led to a huge resurgence in his fanbase.

You have to remember any time when Sakurai states that he tried making a character work, but it didn't work out. It automatically increases the fan demand of that character a ton. Think Takamaru back in Smash 4, not in due to being too unknown, gets a huge popularity boost. But Takamaru's support ended up decreasing a ton from 4 to Ultimate, likely because of the sword.

Anyways now you get to Ultimate, Ridley and K. Rool get confirmed playable early on. This is important because Ridley and K. Rool were seen as "NEVER EVERS" because of how long their fan-demand has been floating. Some of the other big NEVER EVERS like Isaac and Waluigi get AT'd, which for a large amount of the community is a death sentence; meanwhile, Geno is a spirit, which to a lot of people isn't as big a death sentence as being AT'd. So the Geno fanbase gets even larger while the other 2 stagnate. Meanwhile, Banjo gets in and Geno isn't a part of Hero's mii costume pack which feeds into their theory that since Geno is a NEVER EVER that he'll be playable too. A huge portion of the Geno fanbase becomes really vocal, which makes them really divisive in other communities, so now you have haters increasing the amount of Geno discussion dramatically.

Now you get into the second half of last year, one guy leaks all the costumes in BK's line (except Sans) and lists Mallow and Smithy (but not Geno) as upcoming costumes. Then, at the end of October we get the Cacomallow leak; which most modders aren't able to definitively disprove and as time went on, interest on the leak died out (you can't prove it, you can't disprove it) and most people thought that it's not real. But then, a ton of Geno fans think the leak is still real due to the quality and the fact that it lined up with the Mii costume leak. It's been 2 fighters since then, with a 3rd one coming up really shortly. On top of this, thanks to Cacomallow most fans think that Geno is going to be revealed "soon" due to the costumes. So thanks to all of this, the Geno fandom has been on high alert looking for Geno in any way they can because he's DEFINITELY happening. The more likely a fanbase thinks a character is, the more hate they'll end up getting especially if they're incredibly vocal about it.

Now the problem is that at least in DLC, fanbases don't become super vocal and practically act like they're in unless there is some huge proof that a character is coming relatively soon, which minimizes the amount of controversy/hate a characters fanbase generates. For most characters this is like a week or 2 at most. However, the Geno fanbase has been super vocal about how likely Geno is for almost an entire year, which a lot of people don't take kindly to, which generates more discussion around the character. A good chunk of the DQ fandom got hate on other sites because they acted like they're practically in for 6 months and Hero was a highly controversial character upon reveal on sites like reddit. This is amplified for Geno, because unlike DQ which is a massive franchise that most people think warrants some sort of representation, Geno as a character is incredibly small in the grand scheme of things and is only seen as a huge character to his fanbase.

TL;DR: The reason why Geno is so massively discussed is because he has: some genuine fan support going as far back as Brawl + some new fan support from after Sakurai gave him a mii costume + a natural NEVER EVER multiplier + how vocal his fanbase is compared to their size + how many leaks surround the character since the start of Ultimate + the bandwagon effect (a good chunk of people want this character, so should I) + the pity effect (this character has been asked for since Brawl, I feel bad for his fans) + how much hate Geno/his fanbase gets. There are definitely bigger requests then Geno, but they aren't as divisive which is why you see them discussed far less. Unironically speaking, the divisive reputation Geno has garnered within the last year have boosted his discussion to the point where it's out of proportion to his popularity.
 
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GoodGrief741

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Geno is definitely a hardcore Smash demand, but I'd say he manages to be such a unique and bizarre case that he's known as one, even by more casual fans. Every time I see an article by IGN, or GameSpot, or other gaming news outlets that's about Smash characters, if they mention characters that are popular, they usually go with the likes of Crash, or Sora, or Doomguy - "mainstream" popular characters - and Geno, as the "token hardcore" popular character. Every Facebook, Twitter or YouTube comment section on something Smash related has comments about Geno. When the Grinch leak happened, my more casual friends and I talked about it and I was surprised that they knew about Geno, even if it was just that "a lot of people want that one". I think that's worth pointing out. Geno's popularity might not extend past the dedicated Smash fandom, but if other people know him as "that character Smash fans want", that counts for something.
 
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Dinoman96

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In hindsight, the Takamaru hype was really just the result of the Smash fandom going by "patterns" and trying to find the next Pit (i.e a forgotten NES era character to be ressurected by Smash).

Piranha Plant pretty much buried the notion of "retro characters" (i.e a character specifically put in for the sake of having a forgotten/old character), which really were never much of a thing outside of Ice Climbers in Melee.
 
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GoodGrief741

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In hindsight, the Takamaru hype was really just the result of the Smash fandom going by "patterns" and trying to find the next Pit (i.e a forgotten NES era character to be ressurected by Smash).

Piranha Plant pretty much buried the notion of "retro characters"(i.e a character specifically put in for the sake of having a forgotten/old character), which really were never much of a thing outside of Ice Climbers in Melee.
Or maybe it's the fact that Takamaru is objectively cool.
 
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