Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Hadokeyblade]

Still couldn't save Geralt though.

Why must you remind me.

 

[TheShiningAbsol]

Still couldn't save Geralt though.

that whole thing was just so eh.

"hold on papa i'll save you"
"no wait you can't"
"oh okay"

 

[ARandomFruit]

Even ignoring gameplay mechanics it seems divine pulse has some cooldown or limit so its not like they're unbeatable because of it

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

that whole thing was just so eh.

"hold on papa i'll save you"
"no wait you can't"
"oh okay"

At least he tried using Devine Pulse. A lesser story would have forgotten it existed.

Then again pretty much all of your interactions were just there to give him a death flag and part of his death scene is in the attract mode cutscene so iunno.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

I don't mind having a bunch of punchy characters or a bunch of sword characters, but I'd rather not have the fighter pass be completely dominated by either.

 

[Aerospherology]

I don't mind having a bunch of punchy characters or a bunch of sword characters, but I'd rather not have the fighter pass be completely dominated by either.

Pass 1 had 3 fighters who use a sword (or in Joker's case, a big knife) You could count Banjo as a 4th FP1 swordfighter, due to the way he uses Kazooie in some moves...

 

[PeridotGX]

Your ideal Fighter's Pass 2 gets pitted against Fighters Pass 1 + Plant in a battle of canonical strength. How do they fare?

My pass definitely stomps; Dante and Sol Badguy are both Bayonetta tier, Doom Slayer is pretty strong as well, Crash and Artorias are both from Dark Souls, and Waluigi would probably find some way to cheat himself into victory.

Maxwell kinda makes this a joke. He could probably solo the entire roster.

If we get rid of him, making this an even 5v5, things get more intresting. Frisk might as well be dead weight, they're a pacifist. I also can't see Bandana Dee contributing all too much either, but he's mostly on Banjo/Terry level. That leaves us with Grovyle/Megaman X/Kamek VS Hero/Byleth/Joker. Kamek would mostly be support, healing and buffing Grovyle and X. If Grovyle gets the Time Gears he can neutralize Divine Pulse, getting rid of FP1's best tool. X can out-range Joker and Byleth with ease, so they might have a shot

 

[P.Kat]

Your ideal Fighter's Pass 2 gets pitted against Fighters Pass 1 + Plant in a battle of canonical strength. How do they fare?

My pass definitely stomps; Dante and Sol Badguy are both Bayonetta tier, Doom Slayer is pretty strong as well, Crash and Artorias are both from Dark Souls, and Waluigi would probably find some way to cheat himself into victory.

Elma, Shantae, and Sakura could possibly beat everyone short of Hero, and Byleth.
Kat, Sora, and Amaterasu dominates everyone else.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Maxwell kinda makes this a joke. He could probably solo the entire roster.

This doesn't work if the opponent is faster than he can write the word "dead".

Frisk might as well be dead weight, they're a pacifist.

He's not always a pacifist. And when he's not he can bend the rules of reality in order to murder people so...

 

[Deleted member]

I mean, under this hypothetical, there's almost no way any group of frontrunners would win out for one simple reason.

Byleth has control over time. That alone kinda makes this almost unwinnable.

Opo, you know what's more busted? In Dragon Quest, there's an infinite use item called the "sands of time" that allows you to restart whatever battle you're in. So even if Byleth's divine pulses run out, Hero can always reset the battle if he doesn't like how it goes.

 

[Iko MattOrr]

Your ideal Fighter's Pass 2 gets pitted against Fighters Pass 1 + Plant in a battle of canonical strength. How do they fare?

My pass definitely stomps; Dante and Sol Badguy are both Bayonetta tier, Doom Slayer is pretty strong as well, Crash and Artorias are both from Dark Souls, and Waluigi would probably find some way to cheat himself into victory.

Adeleine & Ribbon, Ganon, Karate Joe, Captain Syrup, Hornet and uhm well... maybe Prof. E. Gadd.

Most of them are pretty weak by the way, except maybe Captain Syrup but she's still a regular human with no superpowers or anything. The only one who is powerful enough to blast the whole pass 1 is Ganon.
Hornet is a little spider, she's pretty strong in her universe but placed near other characters and considering the canon size and stuff, she probably has no chance against anyone; same for Adeleine, she's canonically weak and, like, about 16 inches tall (twice as Kirby more or less).
Karate Joe is not really a fighter, regardless of what it seems.
If you give some time though, Prof. E. Gadd may be able to build some gimmick that can stop the enemies before the fight even starts (maybe capture them into a canvas) Who knows, once they are stuck in a canvas, maybe Adeleine can bash them by summoning wathever nightmare-ish creature into it.

 

[Proceleon]

What if we got a character from Raid: Shadow Legends? XD

 

[SpectreJordan]

4/5 would be great. crash means nothing to me but old school only people would eat it up. Perinsally i think he'd be a dull character to play kinda like banjo vs the rest of season 1. getting the dream of dante vs bayonetta vs 2b in an action showdown would be epic.

i see people often post "i have no connection with this character" and i just cannot understand it. is that the DRIVING force for people to determine whether or not people what a character? You develop a connection to characters AFTER thier inclusion often not prior to them being added. FE fanbase came from smash for example as kids no one ignored marth ad roy because they hadnt seen them before (or couldnt understand them) what changed? why are people so agianst being introduced to new characters when thats what smash does for most people and players? Do people not consider movesets or interesting mechanics that thier inclusion could bring? i dont see what crash would bring other than being crash which is just not exciting. i want to see characters that wil lsee play in competitive and casual play. give me characters like hero, joker, and terry and not banjo or PP.

This is an odd way to look at it. I do agree that being attached to a character prior to their inclusion in Smash doesn’t guarantee you’ll like them. I’ve always been a big DK fan, but I really don’t like him in Smash; meanwhile, I main Lucina & Cloud, who's game I hadn’t played before I started using them in Smash. But at the same time, you can love a character that you’ve already loved like I do with Banjo. It goes both ways.

Also, what’s the point of speculating Smash characters & getting hyped for reveals if you don’t want characters that you’re personally attached to? Might as well just wait until the character is out to see if you like their gameplay style at that point.

I also don’t see what’s wrong with simpler characters. Not every character needs a flashy gimmick or anything. Sometimes it’s just fun to use a character with some good normals/aerials & simple special moves. Mario is as basic as they come, but he’s a ton of fun to use IMO & he’s good to boot.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

I don't, but the simple fact is, Marvel didn't want to promote the X-Men while FOX had all the movie rights. But now it's all under Disney.

Why would Marvel have had more incentive than Disney to not promote X-Men?

 

[DanganZilla5]

Your ideal Fighter's Pass 2 gets pitted against Fighters Pass 1 + Plant in a battle of canonical strength. How do they fare?

My ideal pass would be Crash, Phoenix Wright, Doom Slayer, Agumon, Kratos and Master Chief. The last 4 are definitely the heavy hitters. Doom Slayer is freakin Doom Slayer. He's very powerful. Agumon can digivolve into Wargreymon who defeats Mega Charizard and is overall very powerful. Kratos kills literal gods and Master Chief has taken down armies and all kinds of threats. As for Crash, he could do some damage and Phoenix Wright is practically useless since there are no characters around to buff him. Overall, I say my team would win.

 

[Deleted member]

Your ideal Fighter's Pass 2 gets pitted against Fighters Pass 1 + Plant in a battle of canonical strength. How do they fare?

First we gotta analyze the biggest strengths of each character and their games for Pass 1

Joker has an incredible slew of Personas he can bust out, including the physical manifestation of sin that is as large as a two story house. Now here is the catch, they're only accessible in the Phantom realm. Theoretically, Joker is useless beyond knife skills. And for the record, his gun isn't even real.

You can get some busted ass skills in Dragon Quest. The zap spells are literal screen nukes in DQ, they can heal other party members, they can revive other party members, they can buff other party members, they can just kamikazee and wipe out someone. It gets better too. In Dragon Quest, some heroes can learn the spell Kerplunk. Kerplunk sacrifices the caster, but revives every single dead party member. If you wanna win, you go for Hero first. That might be hard however. In Dragon Quest, there is an item called the Sands of Times that can literally restart the battle. It's infinite use too.

These two are nowhere near as versatile as Hero. However, they have two tools that can make them useful. 1) Grenade eggs. In Banjo Tooie, these are just literal grenades and they do the most damage out of every attack Banjo has. 2) Golden Feathers. In Banjo-Kazooie, golden feathers kill every enemy that's the same size as Banjo. It's also a great shield for if an enemy does a really powerful attack.

Straight and simple brawler. He's good for 1v1 and could probably zone with power wave, but he'll have a hard time if he's ganged up on.

Similar to Terry in which he's only really proficient at 1v1. He can zone with his whip sword and he can heal people if in a pinch. Plus like Hero, he can reset the battle if things go south through divine pulse.

These are the greatest assets of each character in Pass 1. Really, your biggest obstacle will be the fact that can literally rewind time. If your party can kill these two before they get a chance to cheat, you might have a chance.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

Maxwell kinda makes this a joke. He could probably solo the entire roster.

If we get rid of him, making this an even 5v5, things get more intresting. Frisk might as well be dead weight, they're a pacifist. I also can't see Bandana Dee contributing all too much either, but he's mostly on Banjo/Terry level. That leaves us with Grovyle/Megaman X/Kamek VS Hero/Byleth/Joker. Kamek would mostly be support, healing and buffing Grovyle and X. If Grovyle gets the Time Gears he can neutralize Divine Pulse, getting rid of FP1's best tool. X can out-range Joker and Byleth with ease, so they might have a shot

In the DC Universe Anti-Monitor is the strongest, if not the strongest beings in existence, able to erase entire universes.

In the crossover comic with the DC Universe, Maxwell is able to summon an Anti-Anti-Monitor on whim. The kid is canonically pretty dang powerful.

 

[snowgolem]

Your ideal Fighter's Pass 2 gets pitted against Fighters Pass 1 + Plant in a battle of canonical strength. How do they fare?

This is an old post, but it’s a really fun question so I’m still gonna answer it.
Ideal Fighter’s Pass 2: Phoenix Wright, Waluigi, Master Chief, Steve, Neku Sakuraba, Chell
This ones definitely tough. Phoenix Wright may be able to be put into a fighting game, but he’s still just some dude. He might not even be able to hold his own against PP. So he’s out of the question. Waluigi, I think, is too skinny to affect any of his opponents. But I do think he is strong enough to defeat PP when Phoenix couldn’t. Joker is definitely too skilled to lose to some tall skinny guy though. However, Master Chief has a really cool looking gun (among other things). And if it’s canonical, then Joker is weak against guns. Easy win for him. If you ask me, Hero is not that strong. He’s just some guy with a sword who can do spells. If you’re just some random person with a bunch of high tech weapons, it’s an easy win. I’d also say Master Chief could easily beat Banjo (he could) but nah. It’s no fun if one character is annihilating everyone else. So now let’s imagine Steve against Banjo. Easy win for Steve. I’m pretty sure Banjo would slice pretty easily with a standard iron sword. But Terry would be more of a problem. Steve would look like Toon Link in the eyes of Terry. Steve would definitely lose. And does Master Chief run in to save his friend? Nah. Neku also gets torn apart after a long battle, leaving Chell and a bored Master Chief. Chell could probably beat Terry by placing a portal outside the invisible walls on King of Fighter’s Stadium and then sending Terry through that portal and closing it. Byleth probably would slice Chell into little pieces, but then get pulverized by Master Chief.
sorry for writing a book I just want to make sure everyone knows my wants for pass 2 are stronger than pass 1. It was really important that I told you

 

[Deleted member]

This is an old post, but it’s a really fun question so I’m still gonna answer it.
Ideal Fighter’s Pass 2: Phoenix Wright, Waluigi, Master Chief, Steve, Neku Sakuraba, Chell
This ones definitely tough. Phoenix Wright may be able to be put into a fighting game, but he’s still just some dude. He might not even be able to hold his own against PP. So he’s out of the question. Waluigi, I think, is too skinny to affect any of his opponents. But I do think he is strong enough to defeat PP when Phoenix couldn’t. Joker is definitely too skilled to lose to some tall skinny guy though. However, Master Chief has a really cool looking gun (among other things). And if it’s canonical, then Joker is weak against guns. Easy win for him. If you ask me, Hero is not that strong. He’s just some guy with a sword who can do spells. If you’re just some random person with a bunch of high tech weapons, it’s an easy win. I’d also say Master Chief could easily beat Banjo (he could) but nah. It’s no fun if one character is annihilating everyone else. So now let’s imagine Steve against Banjo. Easy win for Steve. I’m pretty sure Banjo would slice pretty easily with a standard iron sword. But Terry would be more of a problem. Steve would look like Toon Link in the eyes of Terry. Steve would definitely lose. And does Master Chief run in to save his friend? Nah. Neku also gets torn apart after a long battle, leaving Chell and a bored Master Chief. Chell could probably beat Terry by placing a portal outside the invisible walls on King of Fighter’s Stadium and then sending Terry through that portal and closing it. Byleth probably would slice Chell into little pieces, but then get pulverized by Master Chief.
sorry for writing a book I just want to make sure everyone knows my wants for pass 2 are stronger than pass 1. It was really important that I told you

Here's the problem with the Master Chief versus Hero match-up:
Bounce.

I do agree that Master Chief could probably mow down nearly everybody by the pure fact he gets fully automated modern weapons like assault rifles and bazookas.

 

[Schnee117]

Opo, you know what's more busted? In Dragon Quest, there's an infinite use item called the "sands of time" that allows you to restart whatever battle you're in. So even if Byleth's divine pulses run out, Hero can always reset the battle if he doesn't like how it goes.

So it's just an infinite loop of Dante messing with everyone.

 

[Deleted member]

So it's just an infinite loop of Dante messing with everyone.

Theoretically. You ever play Super Meat Boy or Cuphead where every death gives you knowledge of the patterns of every ball-bustingly difficult level and boss? I imagine Hero and Byleth are having to deal with that as they keep rewinding time against Dante or Chief.

 

[snowgolem]

Here's the problem with the Master Chief versus Hero match-up:
Bounce.

I do agree that Master Chief could probably mow down nearly everybody by the pure fact he gets fully automated modern weapons like assault rifles and bazookas.

Everybody knows Hero can’t use a spell unless it’s one of the random four he gets when he randomly draws for them. According to the ssbwiki, Hero has a ‘16’ chance of getting Bounce when drawing four spells. So if that happens, Master Chief could just energy sword them. I think

 

[Deleted member]

Everybody knows Hero can’t use a spell unless it’s one of the random four he gets when he randomly draws for them. According to the ssbwiki, Hero has a ‘16’ chance of getting Bounce when drawing four spells. So if that happens, Master Chief could just energy sword them. I think

Wait are we going by Smash rules or their respective universes rules? If so, Chief wins by default

 

[DarthEnderX]

Why would Marvel have had more incentive than Disney to not promote X-Men?

I meant Disney-owned Marvel. If you aren't aware, mutants(as well as the Fantastic Four) were practically all killed off in Marvel comics during the same period. It's because anything that promoted those properties was basically seen as promotion for FOX's Marvel movies.

Now that Disney owns the X-Men movie rights as well, all of a sudden, EVERY mutant(and the FF) is back alive again in the comics. And if there's another MvC game(which, I kinda hope there isn't, I want Capcom to just make it's own crossover game without another company for once), X-Men will pretty much certainly be back in that as well.

Having a crazy unique moveset, while nice, isn't always the main reason people want characters. It's usually an attachment to that character, their design or their game in general. Sometimes forced gimmicks can be a detriment.

Hero, Hero, Hero and Hero.

Also Little Mac...

 

[The Rhythm Theif]

I want Capcom to just make it's own crossover game without another company for once.

(Street Fighter x Mega Man slowly intensifies in 8-bit Balrog theme)

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

And if there's another MvC game(which, I kinda hope there isn't, I want Capcom to just make it's own crossover game without another company for once)

Why can't we have both?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Capcom can make its own crossover game once Nintendo vs. Capcom becomes an reality.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

I meant Disney-owned Marvel. If you aren't aware, mutants(as well as the Fantastic Four) were practically all killed off in Marvel comics during the same period. It's because anything that promoted those properties was basically seen as promotion for FOX's Marvel movies.

Now that Disney owns the X-Men movie rights as well, all of a sudden, EVERY mutant(and the FF) is back alive again in the comics. And if there's another MvC game(which, I kinda hope there isn't, I want Capcom to just make it's own crossover game without another company for once), X-Men will pretty much certainly be back in that as well.

Hero, Hero, Hero and Hero.

I think you misunderstood our discussion. Platinum7 implied that the decision was more Marvel's than Disney's. That doesn't make sense to me, because Disney was competing with Fox more directly than Marvel was. Why would Marvel deny Capcom the X-Men, except to make money for their parent company?

 

[DarthEnderX]

Your ideal Fighter's Pass 2 gets pitted against Fighters Pass 1 + Plant in a battle of canonical strength. How do they fare?

A plant, a magic teenager, 4 fantasy knights, a bear and a bird, a martial artist and another fantasy knight...vs. a ninja, two commandos, a fantasy knight, two Japanese delinquents, a cyber soldier, and 4 soldiers riding tiny tanks...

Hmm, it's actually pretty even I think. It mostly comes down to "how do the spell casters in the first pass fare against those tanks".

I don't mind having a bunch of punchy characters or a bunch of sword characters, but I'd rather not have the fighter pass be completely dominated by either.

*checks his most wanted characters*

*sword, guns, javelins, punchy, metal punchy+guns, big guns*

I agree.

Frisk might as well be dead weight, they're a pacifist.

Uh, that's like saying Snake is a pacifist. Just because you CAN play Frisk without killing anyone doesn't mean you have to. And even when you don't kill anyone with Frisk, you still fight people.

Why can't we have both?

I mean, if they can pull it off, sure. But right now, Capcom is having trouble making even one Vs. game work.

I say, make a Capcom Versus game first. Going back to having 3v3 gameplay, maybe rip off ArcSys's graphical style so it looks amazing and runs well, and have a huge roster. And then, once they've done that successfully, you can just take that game, and add Marvel characters to it to make Marvel 4.

I think you misunderstood our discussion. Platinum7 implied that the decision was more Marvel's than Disney's. That doesn't make sense to me, because Disney was competing with Fox more directly than Marvel was. Why would Marvel deny Capcom the X-Men, except to make money for their parent company?

Ah, okay then.

 

[Garteam]

Maybe we should all just take the higher road and evaluate characters on an individual basis, instead of writing off characters because of superficial qualities.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Maybe we should all just take the higher road and evaluate characters on an individual basis, instead of writing off characters because of superficial qualities.

B-but how am I supposed to gatekeep a character for not having enough Hype Points™ arbitrarily assigned to them?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I mean, if they can pull it off, sure. But right now, Capcom is having trouble making even one Vs. game work.

It's kinda sad that the biggest roadblock for this goal is the fact that it would require making more than one good game. Hopefully Capcom's fighting game division can get it together.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Capcom can make its own crossover game once Nintendo vs. Capcom becomes an reality.

This guy gets it.

 

[Proceleon]

I think this chat has gone wildly off the topic of speculation.

 

[ManlyPlant]

Capcom's fighting game division is in a weird state where they have some nice gameplay ideas at times but get very little funding because the people up above seemingly don't care much. The only reason SFV has a budget is due to the sony partnership. Shame that it definitely just seems to be on the fault of just a few people on top with no confidence in the genre.

Miraculously despite SFV having wack netcode it's still somehow better than smash which has somehow some of the worst online i've experienced in a fighting game, Along with one of the worst training modes but thats a different story.

Heck I'd be down with sacrificing future characters for functional rollback netcode in this game not gonna lie.

 

[ZelDan]

View attachment 264010
Why must you remind me.

I, too, remember how sad it was when Byleth couldn't save Geralt of Witcher III fame from getting run over in a McDonalds parking lot.

 

[Faso115]

I think this chat has gone wildly off the topic of speculation.

I think thats par for the course when no character reveal isn't happening for a while.

Clearly we should start talking about cuts right around next week

 

[Deleted member]

I think this chat has gone wildly off the topic of speculation.

Maybe that's why I haven't participated much lately haha

But in all seriousness this does give me time to burn off with other activities. So long as there's no...

"YO LESLEY THERE'S A LEAK THAT HAS A LEAKED MUSIC TRACK AND IT'S FROM SENRAN KAGURA"

GIRL SHUT THE HELL UP WHAT

"On 4chan. And Smash is for good boys and girls anyway."

When the hell will I learn?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Maybe that's why I haven't participated much lately haha

But in all seriousness this does give me time to burn off with other activities. So long as there's no...

"YO LESLEY THERE'S A LEAK THAT HAS A LEAKED MUSIC TRACK AND IT'S FROM SENRAN KAGURA"

GIRL SHUT THE HELL UP WHAT

"On 4chan. And Smash is for good boys and girls anyway."

When the hell will I learn?

Wanting a Senran Kagura character because they'd be a woman is like how white women on twitter go "yaaaas queeeen iconic" at Margaret Thatcher

 

[N3ON]

Wanting a Senran Kagura character because they'd be a woman is like how white women on twitter go "yaaaas queeeen iconic" at Margaret Thatcher

gwen let me introduce you to leslie