Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Al-kīmiyā']

I think thats par for the course when no character reveal isn't happening for a while.

Clearly we should start talking about cuts right around next week

I like talking about cuts. The slowdown here and getting pissed at people on gamefaqs are starting to motivate me more to post my smaller rosters with explanations.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

I like talking about cuts. The slowdown here and getting pissed at people on gamefaqs are starting to motivate me more to post my smaller rosters with explanations.

It's been a while since I've done these sort of things, but I often challenged myself by limiting myself to 2 characters per franchise. For this I might expand myself to three.
Super Mario Bros:

Donkey Kong:

Mario spinoffs:

Legend of Zelda:

Metroid:

Star Fox:

Kirby:

Pokemon:
Zacian/Zamazenta
Kid Icarus:

Fire Emblem:
Edelgard, Dimitri, Claude
Animal Crossing:
Tom Nook
MOTHER:

F-Zero:

Any other mega-popular franchises represented by one character like Splatoon or Sonic can stay, with others being able to either stay or go.

 

[GoodGrief741]

My dream is to have swords grafted into my hands so that both the anti-punchy-kicky guys and the anti-swordfighter crowd can rally against me when I'm finally revealed as FP11.

And then for my neutral special I pull out a gun.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

My dream is to have swords grafted into my hands so that both the anti-punchy-kicky guys and the anti-swordfighter crowd can rally against me when I'm finally revealed as FP11.

And then for my neutral special I pull out a gun.

Hyakkimaru confirmed.

 

[DarthEnderX]

I like talking about cuts. The slowdown here and getting pissed at people on gamefaqs are starting to motivate me more to post my smaller rosters with explanations.

There was a thread awhile back about if Smash 6 was limited to 30 characters, what would they be. This was my Trim 30:

 

[Cosmic77]

I like talking about cuts because it makes you really think about which characters you truly value and which ones you're willing to say goodbye to. I just rarely bring it up anymore because there's too many people who can't handle that sort of thing, so they shut the whole conversation down as soon as they can.

Ironically, the people trying to change the topic to avoid conflict end up being more disruptive than those discussing cuts.

 

[Animegamingnerd]

Capcom's fighting game division is in a weird state where they have some nice gameplay ideas at times but get very little funding because the people up above seemingly don't care much. The only reason SFV has a budget is due to the sony partnership. Shame that it definitely just seems to be on the fault of just a few people on top with no confidence in the genre.

Miraculously despite SFV having wack netcode it's still somehow better than smash which has somehow some of the worst online i've experienced in a fighting game, Along with one of the worst training modes but thats a different story.

Heck I'd be down with sacrificing future characters for functional rollback netcode in this game not gonna lie.

Capcom's fighting game division is so strange when you compare it to the rest of Capcom, their old early 2010's self that we all hated and yet the rest of Capcom manage to move past and basically go on one massive redemption arc these past few years.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

Hyakkimaru confirmed.
View attachment 264048

Edward Scissorhands-kun?

 

[Deleted member]

Capcom's fighting game division is so strange when you compare it to the rest of Capcom, their old early 2010's self that we all hated and yet the rest of Capcom manage to move past and basically go on one massive redemption arc these past few years.

Pretty much the understatement of the century I'd say, haha. Now if only they can make a better MvC game than Infinite or a new Darkstalkers game...

 

[Proceleon]

Honestly, Senran Kagura could be done if they pick a character with a more conservative outfit. Just give Asuka some full leggings and reduce the boob size a bit and she'd be good.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I like talking about cuts because it makes you really think about which characters you truly value and which ones you're willing to say goodbye to. I just rarely bring it up anymore because there's too many people who can't handle that sort of thing, so they shut the whole conversation down as soon as they can.

Ironically, the people trying to change the topic to avoid conflict end up being more disruptive than those discussing cuts.

Some people just don't want to think about it. It makes them sad and it's not even applicable right now. Personally, I find it to be an interesting thought experiment to think about which Super Smash Bros. characters are the cake, which ones are the icing, and which ones are the toppings people are ok with picking off.

I've come to the conclusion that at least 60% of the cast is indispensable (or at least, really important), but that could just be me. Cuts are inevitable, but let's hope we don't see a full on reboot with a capsized roster because that would be just sad. 81 -> just 30 is sad.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I, too, remember how sad it was when Byleth couldn't save Geralt of Witcher III fame from getting run over in a McDonalds parking lot.

First Hayabusa, now Geralt?! Why must people be so irresponsible in fast food parking lots??

 

[Proceleon]

I like talking about cuts because it makes you really think about which characters you truly value and which ones you're willing to say goodbye to. I just rarely bring it up anymore because there's too many people who can't handle that sort of thing, so they shut the whole conversation down as soon as they can.

Ironically, the people trying to change the topic to avoid conflict end up being more disruptive than those discussing cuts.

Most of the characters we don't really need, TBH.
It still baffles me why we still have Jigglypuff. She was only included because making a Kirby-like character was easier than adding Meowth, which was planned.

We still have way too many Gen 1 Pokemon, so I wouldn't mind Trainer and Puff being cut. I'd also cut most if not all of the clones if they can't have a unique moveset. Dark Samus can be give more Metroid Prime moves and Chrom can be cut... honestly I keep forgetting Chrom even exists.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

We still have way too many Gen 1 Pokemon, so I wouldn't mind Trainer and Puff being cut.

But Pokemon is one of Nintendo's most popular and recognizable franchises alongside Mario.

 

[osby]

Most of the characters we don't really need, TBH.
It still baffles me why we still have Jigglypuff. She was only included because making a Kirby-like character was easier than adding Meowth, which was planned.

She has a fun playstyle, is pretty popular among Smash players and as you said, likely easy to develop.

To be fair, I don't get it when people talk about who we "need" in Smash. It makes sense to include popular and important characters but in the end, it's a video game. There is no objective need to try and achieve some arbitrary ideal roster just for the sake of it.

Plus, Smash Ballot showed that people get attached to characters in Smash because they play as them. Characters like Jigglypuff, Roy and Sheik can stay beloved in the Smash community even when they fell out of relevance in their own fanbases. I think there's nothing wrong with it.

I'd also cut most if not all of the clones if they can't have a unique moveset.

The thing with clones isn't they can't have unique movesets. The development team can't keep turning clones into unique characters and adding completely new fighters at the same time. You have to make a compromise somewhere.

People showed a big demand for clones so obviously most people are okay with more characters even if they aren't 100% unique.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Most of the characters we don't really need, TBH.
It still baffles me why we still have Jigglypuff. She was only included because making a Kirby-like character was easier than adding Meowth, which was planned.

We still have way too many Gen 1 Pokemon, so I wouldn't mind Trainer and Puff being cut. I'd also cut most if not all of the clones if they can't have a unique moveset. Dark Samus can be give more Metroid Prime moves and Chrom can be cut... honestly I keep forgetting Chrom even exists.

To me, Jigglypuff is one of the indispensable characters. It may not be that important within its series anymore, but like Sheik and Captain Falcon, it's become a major character in the Super Smash Bros. series.

I wouldn't cut Pokémon Trainer, but if we needed to cut Squirtle and Ivysaur we could make them custom characters that could use a combination of any Pokémon still on the roster. Personally though, I would just keep them and add some more Pokémon from other generations.

I think any echo fighters should be kept if their base character returns, but they should have some sort of gameplay reason for picking one over the other.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

I doubt we'll be seeing Jigglypuff getting cut tbh. She is after all among the Original 12 who I think are all safe.

 

[Guynamednelson]

She was only included because making a Kirby-like character was easier than adding Meowth, which was planned.

And was more popular at the time. Meowth being planned was just a rumor.

Trainer

Yes, let's cut one of the most popular Pokemon, Charizard, for arbitrary balance reasons.

Chrom can be cut

Because more arbirtray balance bull****? Characters aren't supposed to be functions that "balance" out the roster.

 

[Proceleon]

But Pokemon is one of Nintendo's most popular and recognizable franchises alongside Mario.

We have 8 Pokemon now, 10 if you count Trainer separately. We can have a varied Pokemon selection without relying so much on Gen 1 is the point.

She has a fun playstyle, is pretty popular among Smash players and as you said, likely easy to develop.

To be fair, I don't get it when people talk about who we "need" in Smash. It makes sense to include popular and important characters but in the end, it's a video game. There is no objective need to try and achieve some arbitrary ideal roster just for the sake of it.

Here's my problem with clones, besides the obvious two slots for essentially one character.
In Tekken Tag Tournament 2, Bob and Slim Bob have different endings to their arcade mode, and the same for Roger Jr. and Alex, despite them being clones. This story difference adds another layer to playing them in that mode, but with Smash playing as either Marth or Lucina makes no difference. The only thing you get is a different picture and that's not nearly enough of a difference to justify a whole other route. Granted, this is more of a problem with Classic Mode, but if there's no story to them, just do an Olimar and make Daisy and Lucina skins for Peach and Marth.

 

[PSIGuy]

I've been so desperate for anything Xenoblade X that I ended up looking into the character designer's backlog and played Popful Mail by Falcom as a result. And that led me to a ResetEra thread (look, it surprised me too) discussing how so many influential creators got their start at Falcom. Now I'm thinking a Falcom rep would be pretty alright in Smash (even if the only two games of theirs I've actually beaten, Popful Mail and Gurumin, have a slim chance even as Mii Costumes).
The Yakuza talk a while back also has me convinced that Kiryu would be a fun addition. Maybe now I'll be more excited about whoever gets in the second Fighter's Pass! ...or I'll find more ways to get disappointed when none of them get in. The joys of broadening my horizons!

My dream is to have swords grafted into my hands so that both the anti-punchy-kicky guys and the anti-swordfighter crowd can rally against me when I'm finally revealed as FP11.

And then for my neutral special I pull out a gun.

Dear Strongbad GoodGrief, how do you type shoot guns with boxing gloves on swords for hands?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

We have 8 Pokemon now, 10 if you count Trainer separately. We can have a varied Pokemon selection without relying so much on Gen 1 is the point.

Doesn't matter. Fact is there's a reason those two has the most represenation.

 

[Guynamednelson]

We can have a varied Pokemon selection without relying so much on Gen 1 is the point.

There's more to a Pokemon than its gen. Also, why do clone haters forget echo stacking exists?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

The only Pokemon I could potentially see being cut are

()

would then probably become his own individual character like in Sm4sh.

 

[Schnee117]

Dear Strongbad GoodGrief, how do you type shoot guns with boxing gloves on swords for hands?

The swords are also a gun

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So anyone think given Japan is on lockdown due to coronavirus there was in fact going to be an direct this week but it got delayed? Wouldn't surprise me.

Probably looking at April now.

Is that an actual thing or are people blowing things out of proportion? As far as I know (which granted isn't much) coronavirus is just a different strain of the flu; dangerous only because it's so widespread. If it is true I don't think the coronavirus will delay a direct for an entire month.

 

[Proceleon]

There's more to a Pokemon than its gen. Also, why do clone haters forget echo stacking exists?

I know clone stacking exists, it's the fact that they're there in the first place I take issue with.
Also if they wanted to "stack" them, why not just, again, make them alts like Alph?

 

[osby]

but with Smash playing as either Marth or Lucina makes no difference. The only thing you get is a different picture and that's not nearly enough of a difference to justify a whole other route. Granted, this is more of a problem with Classic Mode, but if there's no story to them, just do an Olimar and make Daisy and Lucina skins for Peach and Marth.

You really need to play as Marth and Lucina if you think there's no difference between them.

Also, why people who complain about clones being too similar always want them to be even more similar to their base character?

 

[Deleted member]

i would cut everyone in the roster. start fresh. clean slate. no more mario

 

[osby]

The only Pokemon I could potentially see being cut are

()

would then probably become his own individual character like in Sm4sh.

With how popular Greninja turned out in the last Pokemon popularity pool, they better not cut it.

I know clone stacking exists, it's the fact that they're there in the first place I take issue with.
Also if they wanted to "stack" them, why not just, again, make them alts like Alph?

Just because you don't see any difference between them doesn't mean there isn't any.

 

[Deleted member]

but with Smash playing as either Marth or Lucina makes no difference

have you played these characters before

genuine question

 

[Guynamednelson]

i would cut everyone in the roster. start fresh. clean slate. no more mario

Not good enough. To prevent EVIL CLONES from seeping into the roster, we must reject any newcomer that has some similarity to Mario, including:

• A projectile
• A projectile reflector
• An up-B that boosts them upwards
• A final smash
• Grabs
• A dash attack
• Aerial attacks
• Victory animations
• Alternate costumes

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

The only Pokemon I could potentially see being cut are

()

would then probably become his own individual character like in Sm4sh.

Yes, the Pokemon that just recently won a popularity poll by a wide margin is totally getting cut

 

[Michael the Spikester]

BTW to play along this is who I'd keep.

(Costume:)Waluigi
Dixie Kong
/Impa, Skull Kid, Breath of the Wild sequel character
/

Bandana Dee





(Costume:)

(Costume:)Medusa







Rex, Elma


Octoling

Akira Howard
Spring Man, Ribbon Girl
New Nintendo IP

 

[osby]

Yes, the Pokemon that just recently won a popularity poll by a wide margin is totally getting cut

To be fair, Mewtwo got cut almost at the height of its popularity. As much as we like to treat them like that, cuts were never Sakurai giving the boot to whomever unpopular characters.

Though, I agree that still treating Greninja like it's the flavor of the month is being incredibly close-minded at best.

 

[Garteam]

There's essentially two ways the conversation goes whenever the cut conversation comes up:

-A realistic discussion of what the next Smash game may be like and where to go from Ultimate.
-People going on a mindless cutting spree for every character they don't like, providing no argumentation

The first one is pretty alright, the second one sucks.

 

[PSIGuy]

i would cut everyone in the roster. start fresh. clean slate. no more mario

A Nintendo crossover game without Mario or Pikachu. I can already see the suits foaming at the mouth at the idea. Still, a reboot with 100% newcomers is way more appealing than a reboot with just 80% less characters in general. I'm entertaining this jokepost way too much aren't I.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Also, not sure why we're talking about cuts when there's pretty much no need to in this current time and place

This is the "Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion" thread after all, not "Veteran Speculation Discussion" thread

 

[Guynamednelson]

Not sure why we're talking about cuts when there's pretty much no need to

This is the "Newcomer/DLC speculation thread" after all, not "Veteran Speculation thread"

People foolishly hoping that "Everyone is here" will eventually become "Everyone that doesn't make you butthurt is here".

 

[Michael the Spikester]

If there are cuts in the next game we can probably agree thatandare at least going. Though with Dr. Mario and Dark Pit I can at least see them being degraded to costumes forand.

 

[Deleted member]

The only Pokemon I could potentially see being cut are

()

would then probably become his own individual character like in Sm4sh.

Greninja was just voted best pokemon in that google poll, I can't imagine it going anywhere any time soon. I could see Pokemon trainer disappearing again and losing Squirtle & Ivysaur since its happened once already and I feel like they only came back because Sakurai was determined to bring back EVERY character.

Incineroar is the most unique of the Pokemon since he's slow AF but tanky and has that whole wrestler moveset motif going for him that no other fighter has right now.

At this point, I Jigglypuff hasn't followed the main cast around in the show for a LONG time, but it was one of the original 12, so its hard to say whether it'd be dumped or not.

Lucario is also within the top 5 of people's favorite pokemon apparently, so he's not going anywhere either.

Pichu I feel has the highest chance of getting cut. It's pretty much just a slightly smaller, slightly stronger, self-hurting Pikachu. Fun character, don't get me wrong, but if they were ever looking to cut some pokemon, Pichu would probably be the first to get the boot.

They've cut Mewtwo before, but also brought him back in Smash Wii U as DLC due to popular demand and then again for this game. I don't think we'll see Mewtwo leaving in that case either.

If not for Greninja and Lucario placing so high on that poll, I would have said the two of them + Pichu would have been the Pokemon we'd see cut, but at this point, I kinda feel like we'll never decrease in Pokemon at all.

Other than trying to reason which ones have a chance to stay or leave, there's the fact that if honestly consider what the next Smash game will be like, there's an incredibly high chance that a huge amount of 3rd party characters will be cut. I mean, they've already admitted this was tantamount to a miracle and don't see this being possible again. Characters like Sonic or Pac-Man I could see returning easy enough, but they're not going to keep like 40 3rd party companies involved in this. With that in mind, you'd have to think, they won't want the roster to be too much smaller, so they might not drop characters like Pichu at all. I could see them increasing Pokemon, Fire Emblem, and Mario characters even further becuase they'll be losing a pretty fair amount of character slots.