Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

Chinderblock

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Watch as the microsoft E3 conference ends with them lowering another car onto the stage, except Sakurai gets out of the car and puts a smash invitation on the hood.
"That's right. Forza Car will be joining the battle in Super Smash Bros Ultimate."
That's why Brave's files show them drifting. It's because they're an actual car. How could we have been so blind?
Well, I did say it's not impossible for a Nintendo employee to announce something at Minecon. But seriously, I doubt it'll happen.

There might be some exceptions, though - we did get Joker being announced at the Game Awards, which was unprecedented. Seeing as we got a Smash Direct announced at last year's EVO, I could see an announcement of a Smash Direct (or a character announcement) happening this year.
There is a difference though; first, Joker wasn't a full announcement with a proper trailer. That came way later. It was just a "this guy exists". In previous character reveals, they were always full reveals, behind closed doors or not. He was more of an exception, but not the usual way it's done. TGA is a highly public event, not a specific company one as well. So it's a different situation from Minecon. It's far more EVO.

True. Besides, a Direct announced at EVO could mean a lot of things - it's a "neutral" event, not really one belonging to a game from another company, and Smash is a fighting game in the first place. Just like Joker's announcement, as TGA doesn't serve one company specifically, so announcing a character for a fighting game (even if it wasn't Smash) isn't really out of place, but at the same time it keeps the element of surprise. A Direct announced at Minecon, however, would blatantly point to content relating to a specific series. That's my opinion, at least.
Exactly. TGA and EVO are neutral. Minecon and Microsoft events are not. I won't say it's impossible, because who knows what they'll do, but there's a good reason to believe it's unlikely.
 
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Given the Japanese Smash Bros. YouTube page's apparent private video and the fact that we're getting a Mario Maker 2 Direct in 16 hours, I have a feeling that we might get a surprize reveal.
I'm 50/50 on this, as it is unprecedented, but the timing fits.
 

AEMehr

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the biggest smash related reveal would be if joker was shown a costume mario option because it would imply a joker amiibo was actually a possibility
 

Zeke The Zekenator

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the biggest smash related reveal would be if joker was shown a costume mario option because it would imply a joker amiibo was actually a possibility
We got Amiibo for every other DLC character in 4.
Not before Incineroar please.

Why Plant got it first I'll never know.
Plant seems to have skipped the main roster for a reason (deadlines most likely) so probably its amiibo finished first.
 
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We got Amiibo for every other DLC character in 4.

Plant seems to have skipped the main roster for a reason (deadlines most likely) so probably its amiibo finished first.
I honestly don't buy the "Plant was meant to be in base roster but was held back and finished as DLC" thing.
That's not something Sakurai does. If Plant was planned yet scrapped, Plant wouldn't be playable period.

It's far more likely Plant was decided to be in the game early on specifically as a pre-order bonus.
 

Guynamednelson

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Given the Japanese Smash Bros. YouTube page's apparent private video and the fact that we're getting a Mario Maker 2 Direct in 16 hours, I have a feeling that we might get a surprize reveal.
I'm 50/50 on this, as it is unprecedented, but the timing fits.
I doubt Mario Maker representation will go beyond the stage and Mario's costume.
 
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I honestly don't buy the "Plant was meant to be in base roster but was held back and finished as DLC" thing.
That's not something Sakurai does. If Plant was planned yet scrapped, Plant wouldn't be playable period.

It's far more likely Plant was decided to be in the game early on specifically as a pre-order bonus.
Is that why cut content from Smash4 (RH character, Dr Mario stage) wasn't just DLC? I heard from PushDustin keeping the DLC and game development separate is why we still didn't get those things.

speaking of which, what if a surprisingly unexpected character was merely a non-speculated Nintendo character you wouldn't expect to be sold as DLC like a RH character, I can dream...
 

Ornl

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Crafted theory : pillars distributed on different Nintendo consoles
The elements below aren't indicative of authority, notes are just shared for inviting comparison and fun.

This is a sub-theory of pillar theory. The pillar theory interprets that all new DLC Fighter would come exclusively from new series that have no representation in Assist Trophy, Spirit, old Costume or Music.
• First this sub-theory reinforces the idea of pillar, based on the fact that all the DCL Fighters, whose licenses didn't appear on NES, represent different consoles.
• Then it takes into account only the licenses appeared for the first time on Nintendo console, and thus reclassifies the licenses born on arcade.
• Finally it makes the assumption that Castlevania and Dragon Quest would definitely complete the NES licenses, so that the Nintendo NES licenses strictly are twice as many (12 first-party / 6 third-party).

minitheory consoles.jpg


• First here are the licenses that still would compete with Dragon Quest.
- NES : Bubble Bobble, Gradius, Ninja Gaiden, Space Invaders. Sega : Puyo Puyo.
- GB : Tomb Raider.
- GBA : Kingdom Hearts.
- NDS : The World Ends with You.

• Then any third-party license that appears on a console already having a representative would be disqualified.
- SNES : Fatal Fury, Harvest Moon, Samurai Shodown, Tales of. Non-Japanese : DOOM.
- NGC : Soulcalibur.
- WiiU : Non-Japanese : Minecraft.
- 3DS : Yo-kai Watch.

• Finally the other licenses would then be in competition.
- GB : Tamagoshi. Sega : Sakura Wars.
- Wii : Okami.
- N64 : Resident Evil. Non-Japanese : Banjo.
- GBA : Ace Attorney or Digimon. Non-Japanese : Crash or Spyro.
- NDS : Cooking Mama, Inazuma Eleven, Ni no Kuni, Professor Layton, Rune Factory or Xenosaga. Non-Japanese : Assassin's Creed.
- Switch : any portage or indie game.

Observations
• This theory is in confrontation with the two 5Chan rumors : Steve + Doom Slayer + Ryu Hayabusa / Velvet + Nakoruru.
• It values Bandai pets, Capcom series and Level-5 as the best company to represent the third-party licenses on NDS.
• It rivals Capcom characters and platform icons Banjo & Crash. Resident Evil rep would make Banjo impossible but would make Crash possible. Phoenix Wright would make Crash impossible but would make Banjo possible. Banjo and Crash would be in SmashU DLC only if there is no new Capcom fighter except Amaterasu.

Additional informations
The poll from Famitsu's readers about favorite games on each console holds :
- Ace Attorney as the second preference on GBA after Pokémon Ruby and Sapphire,
- Professor Layton as second preference on NDS after Dragon Quest IX.
• The best consoles sales holds :
- NES : Excitebike 10th - Dragon Quest 12th, 14th, 20th, 31th - Mega Man 44th - Final Fantasy 50th - Castlevania 1,23M units - Pac-Man 1,22M units - Bomberman 1,03M units. Tales of Phantasia 0,4M units.
- SNES : Street Fighter 5th, 9th, 21th - Killer Instinct 12th - Star Fox 13th - F-Zero 15th - Chrono Trigger 19th - SimCity 22th.
- NGC : Sonic 15th, 18th, 26th - Pikmin 17th - Super Monkey Ball 21th, 23th - Soul Calibur 22th.
- WiiU : Splatoon 6th - Minecraft 15th - Bayonetta 24th.
- 3DS : Yokai Watch is 10th, 21th, 23th, 32th, 33th - Persona Q: Shadow of the Labyrinth 0,25M units.
- GB : Pokémon is 1st, 3rd, 5th, 13th - Tetris is 2nd - Wario is 8th, 20th, 32th - Kirby is 9th, 17th, 21th - Tamagotchi is 33th, 34th.
- Wii : Wii Fit is 6th - Monster Hunter 1,9M units - Xenoblade 0,92M units - Okami 0,6M units - Shovel Knight 0,3M units.
- N64 : Banjo is 10th, 36th (Diddie Kong Racing 8th) - Rayman 2: The Great Escape 0,64M units - Resident Evil 2 0,56M units
- GBA : Spyro is 17th. Crash Bandicoot is 30th - Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney 0,93M units - Rhythm Tengoku 0,3M unit.
- NDS : Cooking Mama is 15th, 27th. Professor Layton is 22th, 24th, 37th.
 
Last edited:

Megadoomer

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Crafted theory : pillars distributed on different Nintendo consoles
The elements below aren't indicative of authority, notes are just shared for inviting comparison and fun.

This is a sub-theory of pillar theory. The pillar theory interprets that all new DLC Fighter would come exclusively from new series that have no representation in Assist Trophy, Spirit, old Costume or Music.
• First this sub-theory reinforces the idea of pillar, based on the fact that all the DCL Fighters, whose licenses didn't appear on NES, represent different consoles.
• Then it takes into account only the licenses appeared for the first time on Nintendo console, and thus reclassifies the licenses born on arcade.
• Finally it makes the assumption that Castlevania and Dragon Quest would definitely complete the NES licenses, so that the Nintendo NES licenses strictly are twice as many (12 first-party / 6 third-party).

View attachment 220237

• First here are the licenses that still would compete with Dragon Quest.
- NES : Bubble Bobble, Gradius, Ninja Gaiden, Space Invaders. Sega : Puyo Puyo.
- GB : Tomb Raider.
- GBA : Kingdom Hearts.
- NDS : The World Ends with You.

• Then any third-party license that appears on a console already having a representative would be disqualified.
- SNES : Fatal Fury, Harvest Moon, Samurai Shodown, Tales of. Non-Japanese : DOOM.
- NGC : Soulcalibur.
- WiiU : Non-Japanese : Minecraft.
- 3DS : Yo-kai Watch.

• Finally the other licenses would then be in competition.
- GB : Tamagoshi. Sega : Sakura Wars.
- Wii : Okami.
- N64 : Resident Evil. Non-Japanese : Banjo.
- GBA : Ace Attorney or Digimon. Non-Japanese : Crash or Spyro.
- NDS : Cooking Mama, Inazuma Eleven, Ni no Kuni, Professor Layton, Rune Factory or Xenosaga. Non-Japanese : Assassin's Creed.
- Switch : any portage or indie game.

Observations
• This theory is in confrontation with the two 5Chan rumors : Steve + Doom Slayer + Ryu Hayabusa / Velvet + Nakoruru.
• It values Bandai pets, Capcom series and Level-5 as the best company to represent the third-party licenses on NDS.
• It rivals Capcom characters and platform icons Banjo & Crash. Resident Evil rep would make Banjo impossible but would make Crash possible. Phoenix Wright would make Crash impossible but would make Banjo possible. Banjo and Crash would be in SmashU DLC only if there is no new Capcom fighter except Amaterasu.

Additional informations
The poll from Famitsu's readers about favorite games on each console holds :
- Ace Attorney as the second preference on GBA after Pokémon Ruby and Sapphire,
- Professor Layton as second preference on NDS after Dragon Quest IX.
• The best consoles sales holds :
- SNES : Street Fighter II is 5h. Street Fighter II Turbo is 9h. Fatal Fury Special is 73th. Tales of Phantasia is 98th.
- NGC : Sonic Adventure 2 Battle is 8th. Sonic Mega Collection is 13th. Sonic Heroes is 21th. Soul Calibur II is 26th.
- WiiU : Minecraft is 14th. Bayonetta 2 is 24th.
- 3DS : Yokai Watch 2 Ganso/Honke is 15th. Yokai Watch 2 Shinuchi is 21th. Youkai Watch is 23th. Yokai Watch Busters is 25th. Yokai Watch 3 is 40th. Yo-Kai Watch 3: Sukiyaki is 72th. Persona Q: Shadow of the Labyrinth is 77th.
- N64 : Banjo-Kazooie is 10th. Banjo-Tooie is 35th. Resident Evil 2 is 88th.
- GBA : Spyro: Season of Ice is 16th. Crash Bandicoot XS is 25th. Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney is 74th (unlisted).
- NDS : Cooking Mama is 16th. Professor Layton and the Curious Village is 17th. Professor Layton and Pandora's Box is 22th. Inazuma Eleven 2: Blizzard / Firestorm is 96th.
All of this seems completely irrelevant; it doesn't seem to matter what console or console generation a character first appeared in. If Sakurai, the developers, or the fans want a particular character in, the people who make these decisions aren't going to go "well, we already have six third party franchises that originated on the NES, so I guess we can't add another one."
 
Last edited:

Sari

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Crafted theory : pillars distributed on different Nintendo consoles
The elements below aren't indicative of authority, notes are just shared for inviting comparison and fun.

This is a sub-theory of pillar theory. The pillar theory interprets that all new DLC Fighter would come exclusively from new series that have no representation in Assist Trophy, Spirit, old Costume or Music.
• First this sub-theory reinforces the idea of pillar, based on the fact that all the DCL Fighters, whose licenses didn't appear on NES, represent different consoles.
• Then it takes into account only the licenses appeared for the first time on Nintendo console, and thus reclassifies the licenses born on arcade.
• Finally it makes the assumption that Castlevania and Dragon Quest would definitely complete the NES licenses, so that the Nintendo NES licenses strictly are twice as many (12 first-party / 6 third-party).

View attachment 220237

• First here are the licenses that still would compete with Dragon Quest.
- NES : Bubble Bobble, Gradius, Ninja Gaiden, Space Invaders. Sega : Puyo Puyo.
- GB : Tomb Raider.
- GBA : Kingdom Hearts.
- NDS : The World Ends with You.

• Then any third-party license that appears on a console already having a representative would be disqualified.
- SNES : Fatal Fury, Harvest Moon, Samurai Shodown, Tales of. Non-Japanese : DOOM.
- NGC : Soulcalibur.
- WiiU : Non-Japanese : Minecraft.
- 3DS : Yo-kai Watch.

• Finally the other licenses would then be in competition.
- GB : Tamagoshi. Sega : Sakura Wars.
- Wii : Okami.
- N64 : Resident Evil. Non-Japanese : Banjo.
- GBA : Ace Attorney or Digimon. Non-Japanese : Crash or Spyro.
- NDS : Cooking Mama, Inazuma Eleven, Ni no Kuni, Professor Layton, Rune Factory or Xenosaga. Non-Japanese : Assassin's Creed.
- Switch : any portage or indie game.

Observations
• This theory is in confrontation with the two 5Chan rumors : Steve + Doom Slayer + Ryu Hayabusa / Velvet + Nakoruru.
• It values Bandai pets, Capcom series and Level-5 as the best company to represent the third-party licenses on NDS.
• It rivals Capcom characters and platform icons Banjo & Crash. Resident Evil rep would make Banjo impossible but would make Crash possible. Phoenix Wright would make Crash impossible but would make Banjo possible. Banjo and Crash would be in SmashU DLC only if there is no new Capcom fighter except Amaterasu.

Additional informations
The poll from Famitsu's readers about favorite games on each console holds :
- Ace Attorney as the second preference on GBA after Pokémon Ruby and Sapphire,
- Professor Layton as second preference on NDS after Dragon Quest IX.
• The best consoles sales holds :
- SNES : Street Fighter II is 5h. Street Fighter II Turbo is 9h. Fatal Fury Special is 73th. Tales of Phantasia is 98th.
- NGC : Sonic Adventure 2 Battle is 8th. Sonic Mega Collection is 13th. Sonic Heroes is 21th. Soul Calibur II is 26th.
- WiiU : Minecraft is 14th. Bayonetta 2 is 24th.
- 3DS : Yokai Watch 2 Ganso/Honke is 15th. Yokai Watch 2 Shinuchi is 21th. Youkai Watch is 23th. Yokai Watch Busters is 25th. Yokai Watch 3 is 40th. Yo-Kai Watch 3: Sukiyaki is 72th. Persona Q: Shadow of the Labyrinth is 77th.
- N64 : Banjo-Kazooie is 10th. Banjo-Tooie is 35th. Resident Evil 2 is 88th.
- GBA : Spyro: Season of Ice is 16th. Crash Bandicoot XS is 25th. Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney is 74th (unlisted).
- NDS : Cooking Mama is 16th. Professor Layton and the Curious Village is 17th. Professor Layton and Pandora's Box is 22th. Inazuma Eleven 2: Blizzard / Firestorm is 96th.
You're looking into it too much. I doubt Nintendo cares that at all about the debut system of each newcomer. It's not like they're gonna add Sora then just say "NOPE!" to Phoenix Wright, Crash, or Spyro just because they all made their Nintendo debut on the GBA (Crash/Spyro's GBA entries aren't even the most memorable entries from their series). The fact that the NES already has a ton of third party reps means that they could just do the same for the other systems.
 

RileyXY1

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You're looking into it too much. I doubt Nintendo cares that at all about the debut system of each newcomer. It's not like they're gonna add Sora then just say "NOPE!" to Phoenix Wright, Crash, or Spyro just because they all made their Nintendo debut on the GBA (Crash/Spyro's GBA entries aren't even the most memorable entries from their series). The fact that the NES already has a ton of third party reps means that they could just do the same for the other systems.
Yeah. I also don't think that Nintendo cares about what console the third party characters first appeared on. The pillar theory is one with a lot of holes in it.
 

Chinderblock

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There'd be a lot of disappointed Banjo fans I guess, having just gone to Microsoft for a Mii costume.
Highly doubt that's the only reason they'd be going for. If Banjo's a Mii costume, that means we're very likely getting a playable Microsoft rep(though there's not a lot of other ones that seem too feasible besides Steve right now. A Battletoad and Jago/Fulgore are all relevant enough for them to be possible, but there's no pretending that Steve is wayyyyyyy bigger as an icon respectively. They all had their own gaming impact, or moreso their games, but still). I won't discount the idea of someone besides the big 3(Chief, Steve, Banjo) being playable, but imo, they don't feel very likely. Especially with Cuphead and Master Chief disconfirmed by the various developers(not Frank in this context for Chief, as his was a soft disconfirmation) who directly said they were not approached for the Fighter's Pass for their respective characters.
 
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Google Leak the more I think about it makes sense to me, especially if we are getting a second wave of DLC.

First, let me just say the more and more I think about it, Dark Souls makes sense in the grand scheme of representation. It is one of the games I would point to to defining the seventh and eighth generations. Dark Souls is easily one of the most influential games that came out in this era. A new franchise that sparked a whole subgenre of RPGs. It makes sense, though Artorias would not have been my first choice. My theory for why he would have been chosen is for more visual uniqueness potentially. He is the odd man out.

Next up is Hayabusa. Ninja Gaiden is one of those last big NES iconic franchises that is not in smash. Outside of Dragon Quest and a couple of retros like Excitebikes, we have the core iconic NES library laid out. Hayabusa completes that.

Doom is the the granddaddy of an entire genre. It is the forerunner of the modern FPS. It is easily one of the most influential games of all time. It had a revival that was a huge success. We even heard Nintendo went to talk to Bethesda which makes this look good.

Then we come to Banjo, who in my eyes has never been more likely. Microsoft is playing friendly, Cuphead and Minecraft on switch, the massive demand for the character, I would say if the leak falls through, he would be my most likely character.

With that being said, I honestly believe that we are not one with DLC after these four + Joker. I feel we are gonna get a second wave, an echo pass, and maybe one misc character released if we are good ala Plant but that is unrealistic.

Should that come to pass, here would be my expectation of a Wave two.

-Crash (Stage: Warp Room)
-Sora/Erdrick/Sephiroth/SE Rep (Stage: Dive into the Heart/Aliahan/Nibelheim/etc)
-Leon S. Kennedy (Stage: Raccoon City)
-Lloyd Irving (Stage: World Tree)
-Sans (Stage: Underground)

As for if they did an echo pass, here would be my rough guess of what they would do (i don't have any third parties since licensing)
-Ninten
-Dixie
-Octolings
-Hilda
-Medusa

General framework of thought would be throw bones to popular choices, franchises that did not get much more stuff in Ultimate, or choices that you could market pretty easily.
 

Robdelia

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Google Leak the more I think about it makes sense to me, especially if we are getting a second wave of DLC.

First, let me just say the more and more I think about it, Dark Souls makes sense in the grand scheme of representation. It is one of the games I would point to to defining the seventh and eighth generations. Dark Souls is easily one of the most influential games that came out in this era. A new franchise that sparked a whole subgenre of RPGs. It makes sense, though Artorias would not have been my first choice. My theory for why he would have been chosen is for more visual uniqueness potentially. He is the odd man out.

Next up is Hayabusa. Ninja Gaiden is one of those last big NES iconic franchises that is not in smash. Outside of Dragon Quest and a couple of retros like Excitebikes, we have the core iconic NES library laid out. Hayabusa completes that.

Doom is the the granddaddy of an entire genre. It is the forerunner of the modern FPS. It is easily one of the most influential games of all time. It had a revival that was a huge success. We even heard Nintendo went to talk to Bethesda which makes this look good.

Then we come to Banjo, who in my eyes has never been more likely. Microsoft is playing friendly, Cuphead and Minecraft on switch, the massive demand for the character, I would say if the leak falls through, he would be my most likely character.

With that being said, I honestly believe that we are not one with DLC after these four + Joker. I feel we are gonna get a second wave, an echo pass, and maybe one misc character released if we are good ala Plant but that is unrealistic.

Should that come to pass, here would be my expectation of a Wave two.

-Crash (Stage: Warp Room)
-Sora/Erdrick/Sephiroth/SE Rep (Stage: Dive into the Heart/Aliahan/Nibelheim/etc)
-Leon S. Kennedy (Stage: Raccoon City)
-Lloyd Irving (Stage: World Tree)
-Sans (Stage: Underground)

As for if they did an echo pass, here would be my rough guess of what they would do (i don't have any third parties since licensing)
-Ninten
-Dixie
-Octolings
-Hilda
-Medusa

General framework of thought would be throw bones to popular choices, franchises that did not get much more stuff in Ultimate, or choices that you could market pretty easily.
I think wave 2 of DLC will be a thing, and I believe the gimmick will be "assists/spirits get promoted into actual fighters." Reveal the season with Waluigi being promoted to playable to show that they aren't messing around, and then whatever happens happens.
 

Ovaltine

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I think wave 2 of DLC will be a thing, and I believe the gimmick will be "assists/spirits get promoted into actual fighters." Reveal the season with Waluigi being promoted to playable to show that they aren't messing around, and then whatever happens happens.
Nintendo is known for being pretty tone-deaf. They've been better about it recently, but... I still wouldn't get my hopes up. That being said, I don't know if they'd promote assists, but I could see them promoting spirits.

give me my star son sakurai-san pls thank u for appreciating him w/ the spirit and costume, he is very cute
 
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Given the Japanese Smash Bros. YouTube page's apparent private video and the fact that we're getting a Mario Maker 2 Direct in 16 hours, I have a feeling that we might get a surprize reveal.
I'm 50/50 on this, as it is unprecedented, but the timing fits.
Well, I didn't expect my gut feeling to come true, but damn if I didn't get excited for a sec when the Mario Maker 2 Direct went over 15 minutes and just happened to mention buying Smash Ultimate with the new vouchers.

I think wave 2 of DLC will be a thing, and I believe the gimmick will be "assists/spirits get promoted into actual fighters." Reveal the season with Waluigi being promoted to playable to show that they aren't messing around, and then whatever happens happens.
Springaling!
 
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SourceGaming did a poll on DLC characters and made a video on the Top 50.
718 is a lot of characters, but allowing 4th party characters doesn't seem necessary. Goku may be the only on the list not originating from a game, but it's silly to see this list having Obama and PewDiePie as honorable mentions.

The top 10 was fairly predictable. The real interesting parts were the other 40, but I don't really have that much to say about them other than at least they used a picture of the Erdrick figure and not Luceus' costume like Delzethin did for his prediction vid.
 

Vrbtm

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SourceGaming did a poll on DLC characters and made a video on the Top 50.
Banjo, Sora, and Dante are the only ones I can truly get behind 100%, and I'm not even a fan of Banjo-Kazooie, Kingdom Hearts, OR Devil May Cry.

Like everyone else, I think Erdrick is all but confirmed. I also think he's really boring and lame.

Klonoa would have to be my #1 personal choice if Sakurai personally asked me to pick a third party character with no regard for what anyone else wants, and it makes me happy that he seems to be a popular choice with other people as well, but I think his cult status and utter lack of relevance in gaming right now mortally wounds his chances.

Monster Hunter would be boring, but I could accept it by virtue of it being so odd that we have a Monster Hunter boss, but no playable rep. Travis Touchdown and Lloyd Irving wouldn't be very exciting for me, but I can still see them happening. Ryu Hayabusa would be cool-ish, but I share the uploader's concerns with his moveset being too derivative, since we already have two ninjas in the game (as well as one character named Ryu). 2B would be cool, I guess, and even though I don't care about Nier, I still think she has a chance, given that we have three M-rated characters at this point.

Crash and Spyro can't happen unless they're BOTH in the game, imo. They're basically counterparts, and you can't have one in a crossover fighting game without the other, as far as I'm concerned. And, frankly, wasting two DLC slots on these two characters would be kinda lame. I just don't see it happening for either of them. Marvel vs. Capcom 3 proved that both Amaterasu and Phoenix Wright can work in a fighting game, but I don't personally expect or want them. Chrono Trigger is a cool game, but we don't need Crono in Smash. Neku is eh.

I don't see any first party characters happening, which rules out Porky Minch. He would be interesting, though.

The following characters have absolutely no place in Smash, as far as I'm concerned: Steve, Arle, Quote, Goku, Master Chief, Reimu, Sans, Hollow Knight, Cuphead, Monokuma, Professor Layton, Scorpion, Lara Croft, Heavy, Leon Kennedy, and ESPECIALLY Doom Slayer.

The following characters are deconfirmed, as far as I'm concerned: Geno, Shantae, Rayman, Rex & Pyra, Elma, Dixie Kong, Tails, Chibi Robo, Paper Mario, Bandana Dee, Karate Joe, Chorus Kids, Waluigi, Skull Kid, Isaac, Shadow, and Ashley. Some of these characters deserve to be playable, some don't. I've bolded the ones that I would've liked to see.

Some characters simply work better as bosses or Assist Trophies, and I think people need to learn to accept that.
 
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Okay, so yesterday night I was in the middle of a mild insomnia episode and for whatever reason I wanted to compare Costume Theory with the way we got third party costumes in Smash 4 to see what we could learn from there. To recap:

Pack #1: X Armor and Proto Man Armor - Came with Mewtwo
Pack #2: Heihachi Outfit, Akira Outfit, Jacky Outfit, Zero Armor and MegaMan.EXE Armor - Came with Lucas, Roy and Ryu
Pack #3: Lloyd Outfit - Standalone
Pack #4: Hunter Mail and Rathalos Mail - Standalone
Pack #5: Geno Outfit and Chocobo Hat - Came with Cloud
Pack #6: Gil Outfit, Tails Outfit and Knuckles Outfit - Came with Corrin and Bayonetta
  • All Namco outfits came with characters from other companies except Lloyd, who was standalone.
  • All Square costumes came with :ultcloud:. Also, no other costumes came in that same pack (First Party or otherwise).
  • Two costume waves were standalone, not having any associated fighter.
  • The least we got in the waves (total) was two costumes and the most was nine.
  • The least we got in the waves (third party) was one and the most was five.
  • :ultryu: and :ultbayonetta: never got costumes from their series.
  • :ultmewtwo: has obviously no relation to the costumes that came with him, but that seems to be an exception since he's first party. Interestingly, these costumes DO relate to the third-party character that came in the next wave, :ultryu:.
  • All third party characters make sense with at least some of the costumes that come with them:
    - :ultryu:: Heihachi, Akira and Jacky are fighting game characters, while Zero and MegaMan.EXE both belong to Capcom.
    - :ultcloud:: Chocobos are Final Fantasy characters and Geno also belongs to Square Enix.
    - :ultbayonetta:: Tails and Knuckles are Sega characters, and Sega is involved with the Bayonetta series. Additionally, this has happened again with :ultjoker:, regarding these same two costumes.
Combining this with Costume Theory, we could potentially get any combination of:
- A fighting game character (to go with Heihachi, Akira and Jacky outfits). Incidentally, unless we get another Sega rep, this is the best bet for returning Akira and Jacky costumes.
- A Capcom character (to go with the six Capcom costumes)
- A Namco character (to go with the three Namco costumes)
- Another RPG character (to go with Lloyd, Chocobo, Geno and possibly MH costumes)
- A Square Enix character (to go with Chocobo and Geno Costume)

To clarify: the things on this post don't mean anything on their own, as the costumes were probably chosen and divided in these packs according to the characters, not the other way around. Not to mention there is no guarantee these patterns will repeat at all, but it's still interesting to think about the possibilities.
 

Vrbtm

Banned (6 Points)
Joined
Apr 12, 2016
Messages
248
Okay, so yesterday night I was in the middle of a mild insomnia episode and for whatever reason I wanted to compare Costume Theory with the way we got third party costumes in Smash 4 to see what we could learn from there. To recap:

Pack #1: X Armor and Proto Man Armor - Came with Mewtwo
Pack #2: Heihachi Outfit, Akira Outfit, Jacky Outfit, Zero Armor and MegaMan.EXE Armor - Came with Lucas, Roy and Ryu
Pack #3: Lloyd Outfit - Standalone
Pack #4: Hunter Mail and Rathalos Mail - Standalone
Pack #5: Geno Outfit and Chocobo Hat - Came with Cloud
Pack #6: Gil Outfit, Tails Outfit and Knuckles Outfit - Came with Corrin and Bayonetta
  • All Namco outfits came with characters from other companies except Lloyd, who was standalone.
  • All Square costumes came with :ultcloud:. Also, no other costumes came in that same pack (First Party or otherwise).
  • Two costume waves were standalone, not having any associated fighter.
  • The least we got in the waves (total) was two costumes and the most was nine.
  • The least we got in the waves (third party) was one and the most was five.
  • :ultryu: and :ultbayonetta: never got costumes from their series.
  • :ultmewtwo: has obviously no relation to the costumes that came with him, but that seems to be an exception since he's first party. Interestingly, these costumes DO relate to the third-party character that came in the next wave, :ultryu:.
  • All third party characters make sense with at least some of the costumes that come with them:
    - :ultryu:: Heihachi, Akira and Jacky are fighting game characters, while Zero and MegaMan.EXE both belong to Capcom.
    - :ultcloud:: Chocobos are Final Fantasy characters and Geno also belongs to Square Enix.
    - :ultbayonetta:: Tails and Knuckles are Sega characters, and Sega is involved with the Bayonetta series. Additionally, this has happened again with :ultjoker:, regarding these same two costumes.
Combining this with Costume Theory, we could potentially get any combination of:
- A fighting game character (to go with Heihachi, Akira and Jacky outfits). Incidentally, unless we get another Sega rep, this is the best bet for returning Akira and Jacky costumes.
- A Capcom character (to go with the six Capcom costumes)
- A Namco character (to go with the three Namco costumes)
- Another RPG character (to go with Lloyd, Chocobo, Geno and possibly MH costumes)
- A Square Enix character (to go with Chocobo and Geno Costume)

To clarify: the things on this post don't mean anything on their own, as the costumes were probably chosen and divided in these packs according to the characters, not the other way around. Not to mention there is no guarantee these patterns will repeat at all, but it's still interesting to think about the possibilities.
Thank you for picking up on PapaGenos's slack.

But yeah, this definitely means nothing, IMO. I fully expect some Mii Costumes to never even return.
 
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Thank you for picking up on PapaGenos's slack.

But yeah, this definitely means nothing, IMO. I fully expect some Mii Costumes to never even return.
Well, ultimately the costumes returning or not would depend on their sales and maybe character support. Regarding the former, we have no concrete data about it and in the latter's case, even that may not be enough if the rights are too expensive or the companies say no, or whatever other reason.
 

Ovaltine

Smash Champion
Joined
Dec 7, 2018
Messages
2,069
The characters I'd love to see who aren't deconfirmed on this list are Steve at #6, Master Chief at #10, Sans at #14, Cuphead at #23, Hollow Knight at #46 and Quote at #47. I really hope at least one of them happens.
Cuphead was already deconfirmed, I'm afraid. His creators were going on about how they're wishing to see him in Smash just after the Switch port was announced. I doubt they'd say that if he was already planned for the pass.
 
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The characters I'd love to see who aren't deconfirmed on this list are Steve at #6, Master Chief at #10, Sans at #14, Cuphead at #23, Hollow Knight at #46 and Quote at #47. I really hope at least one of them happens.
Cuphead was already deconfirmed, I'm afraid. His creators were going on about how they're wishing to see him in Smash just after the Switch port was announced. I doubt they'd say that if he was already planned for the pass.
So was Chief, for a similar reason. I don't have the quote, but the Halo twitter account was pitching him for Smash in a similar way to Cuphead. Considering DLC was decided before even the Game Awards, this means he's not happening unless we get a second Pass. Shame, really, despite not being a Halo fan, I'd like to see him just for the collective internet meltdown.

Picture this -



- but instead of an explosion sound, it's the audio from the Halo Discord server reacting to the PC reveal.
 
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Regarding Mortal Kombat's presence in Japan, you can still purcahse Mortal Kombat there, but only for PC since CERO doesn't rate PC games (that, or you can order the console version from over seas). There's actually a decent sized Japanese MK fan-base, and the older games in the series have all been released in Japan, so the series at least has a legacy in Japan.

Also, seeing Scorpion at 22 on that list put a smile on my face.
 

Ovaltine

Smash Champion
Joined
Dec 7, 2018
Messages
2,069
Regarding Mortal Kombat's presence in Japan, you can still purcahse Mortal Kombat there, but only for PC since CERO doesn't rate PC games (that, or you can order the console version from over seas). There's actually a decent sized Japanese MK fan-base, and the older games in the series have all been released in Japan, so the series at least has a legacy in Japan.

Also, seeing Scorpion at 22 on that list put a smile on my face.
MK in Smash would be the most hilarious and amazing thing in the world. I know it's pretty unlikely, but it at least has a decent shot. It'd destroy me.

Personally, though, while I love them both, I'm less a Scorpion and more a Sub-Zero kinda gal, haha.
 

Vrbtm

Banned (6 Points)
Joined
Apr 12, 2016
Messages
248
Mortal Kombat being banned in Japan is exactly why you'll never see Scorpion in Smash.
And even if it wasn't, that level of gore and violence just wouldn't translate to a Smash game at all. He'd have to be toned down even more than he was in that MK vs. DC game, which nobody liked. Same reason why Doomguy is a terrible idea.
 
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