Newbie Mafia 12 FMP Fumoffu!: Game over!

[asianaussie]

From what I see, it goes like this:

- kuz sees namedrop (of me, to boot ._.), claims scum, puts you in spotlight
- you respond with reasoning: naming some players scum and adding in belief other players is logical (which the logical part of me agrees with)
- it just so happens that you only dropped one non-scum belief
- you asked opinions on a couple other people
- Fynal pokes at you for doing so
- JTB mentions wagon on you because of two consecutive votes
- TBS pokes at you
- Seikend throws a wardrobe at you

I might have misinterpreted, but I read your behaviour as fairly normal and barely defensive at all.

 

[asianaussie]

Reasonable behaviour, but I think that Seikend in particular has something in his accusation, so you aren't all-green in my book.

 

[th3kuzinator]

Your thoughts have simply conveyed to me that you're null/scummish on Ranmaru. You're going about things fine, much more intelligently that most newbies.

Also, take everything Ran says with a grain of salt.

 

[ranmaru]

Well, I try not to be defensive, because defending myself isn't my priority. Scum need to look town, not me. I have to catch scum. (Yet this will net me attention, it doesn't matter)

Basically, I care not of my image, but of catching scum. I may be wreckless.

 

[asianaussie]

I take everything ever with a grain of salt. I'm the most cynical person ever. Peak period is over and I have 5 hours of lectures to attend, bbl

Sorry, I also missed the most vital question posed in this thread, I must be scum ._.

What do you feel about my avi? :o

I never liked sailor moon and idc if it's not sailor moon, it looks like sailor moon.

More innocent than kuz anyway, scummy filthy dictator that he is portrayed as (and probably is)

Real men watch Clannad.

 

[ranmaru]

Yes that's why I picked her. :3 People would feel awkward when I give pressure because of my sweet sweet avi. ;o And yes, she is Sailor Mars.

 

[JTB]

So I was rereading the past few pages and I picked up on something.

During the wagon on me

ughh.
Unvote
Vote:JTB

Nothing out of the ordinary, Kuz had presented a legitimate case on me, no reason for people not to jump on.

But wait...Fynal makes his newbie mistake.

In retrospect you thought that? But it seems that you had already considered it from your voting post. Care to explain?

Unvote
Vote: Fynal

Seems a bit opportunistic, it's pretty clear that Fynal messed up, but I'll give Seikend the benefit of the doubt in thinking it wasn't a newbie mistake.

But wait...a wagon on Ranmaru starts.

Unvote

Vote:Ranmaru

I'm not liking how quickly Seikend hops around. He has made it clear in his last post that he wasn't getting on the wagons for reads, he believes that the three of us are all scum. However, I see it as a noobscum trying to get on the easiest person at the time.


Prior to Fynal's mistake, he had a town read on him in #244, but was quick to change that to scum. Kuz explains to Seikend how it was a noob mistake, who seemingly agrees. Ran says that it was evident of noobscum, which he questions.

Now let's look at this.

I wasn't sure whether my scumtell was legit or not.

Kuz is town for me currently, Swords is null.

I asked their opinions on the matter to judge whether it is or not. Still waiting on Sword's reply before I make the call.

I just asked you to see if you were being opportunistic. Based on your response it seems like you were.

I see Ran as scum.

Kuz is town, Ran is scum. If Seikend believed Kuz to be town, he should agree that Fynal's vote was just a newbie mistake, correct?

And on the other hand, if he believed Ran was scum, he should disagree with Ran that it was a scum slip, right?

I'm off for the night. Gonna post my scum picks then that's me.

Ran scum, Fynal scum. JTB remains null-scum.

Nope.

unvote
Vote Seikend

 

[JTB]

If anyone disagrees with what I have posted, I would ask for you to wait until Seikend addresses my case.

 

[ranmaru]

Oh wow, good point. I just wondered why you didn't join my wagon the whole time. And Seikend voted him after I did.

 

[JTB]

Whoops, my last post wasn't what I intended. I don't mind if people say they disagree with me, I just want Seikend to be the first person to address my points.

 

[ranmaru]

If you guys do address JTB's points before Seikend does, you then give Seikend the chance to ignore it.

So if you want to address it, wait until Seikend responds to it first. Same with questions directed to a specific person. If you answer a person's question, then the question doesn't have to be answered anymore. Therefore giving the person a reason to not answer it. Wait until questions are answered to add on your own thoughts.

 

[Seikend]

Response to JTB.

I was on you for pressure. My read on you remains the same as it was before the wagon.


To clarify, my case on Fynal had nothing to do with his vote. That is null for me. It was his unorganised defence.

Yes, I believe Kuz is town. However, town is not always correct, and I'm more inclined to go with my own read over someone elses. On the other hand, if two of the ICs are telling me I'm wrong, then yeah, I might start to doubt it.

I disagree with Ran that Fynal's vote was a scumslip. My case on Fynal has nothing to do with his vote at all.

There is no contradiction in my thoughts on Fynal.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

So you didn't post that in chronological order? (The vote came first)

i posted it in a blind rage but i'm sure you can re-order it and see the exact order.

The Bandwagon on JTB didn't bother me at first, we all pretty sure he thought he was scum, and kuz said to keep him at L-2.

BUT THEN...

for the sake of pressure only,
unvote
vote JTB

inb4lolninja causes hammer

Now, people are gonna excuse Fynal's play on this but...cmon...this is really oppurtunistic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynal
simple. misunderstood concept of pressure it seems

L-1 is worse than i realized

So you thought pressure was almost getting someone killed? That's a very bad misunderstanding.

Unvote: JTB

Vote: Fynal[/quote]

this is calling the kettle black, he coulda just FoS'ed Fynal, but instead, votes him like a slap to the face.

i figured "almost getting someone killed" was the definition of pressure. force the roleclaim and all?

though i guess in retrospect a lurking scum coulda jumped just then and he would have died

people posting so fast i can't think things thru

so you were looking for JTB to roleclaim? sometimes, people like name-claiming too, but..it's a bit too early to start role/nameclaiming.

In retrospect you thought that? But it seems that you had already considered it from your voting post. Care to explain?

Unvote
Vote: Fynal

look at sudden switch of votes, it somewhat bothers me, sometimes i feel scum can now capitalize on it.

Still think that Ran is being opportunistic with his Fynal vote.

I'm pretty surprised at how quickly my wagon started and how quickly it disappeared, am I really at L-5 right now? I'll definitely go through this later on.

so you're basically saying "cool i have two scapegoats now."

Why?

Also why does me being scum make Aussie scum?

textbook reversal.

I said joining one without reason.

HAHAHAHAH but you did.

*is about to vote Ranmaru.*

TINY GODS!
I thought it was a nice and slow game then I leave to write a paper and SHERBLAM at least 4 pages of intense back and forth.
To fynally repost a reply for Fynal,
@Fynal -> I do not see the need to defend my self, it was an honest mistake now that I know I would have laid down my vote, my question is why would you dissect a newbies post for such subtle mistakes when they are obviously not going to know the ins and outs of the game, such as not leaving a tab open when writing your english essay. That seems a little intense to me, then again I am a delicate Rhino just trying to live up to my role modle, Unicorn-ious.
--------
Vote: Ranmaru

so you make a case on fynal, but vote ranmaru?

jesus.

but you said why so it's coo.

Alright, I'm back now

We doin' a Ran wagon?

if this isn't a scum post, i don't know what is, why would a townie even care who we are wagoning on.

Quote:
Gova pointed out Fynal knew that people would roleclaim at L-1, yet says he doesn't know how important it is.

http://z0r.de/124

http://z0r.de/147

Well, I try not to be defensive, because defending myself isn't my priority. Scum need to look town, not me. I have to catch scum. (Yet this will net me attention, it doesn't matter)

Basically, I care not of my image, but of catching scum. I may be wreckless.

all i see is an excuse.

Oh wow, good point. I just wondered why you didn't join my wagon the whole time. And Seikend voted him after I did.

okay, i'm getting tired of this blatant sheeping.

 

[X1-12]

Soren comes off as a bit scummy in my eyes, I thought it was pretty clear that when X1 asked for his thoughts, X1 wanted to know what his thoughts towards the game, not just whatever was actually on his mind. And as goes with X1's definition of town, he isn't helping town towards their wincon.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=12466105#post12466105

Was it really that clear?

@Bluespot: If I'm your number 1 pick, then why haven't you voted me?

Why do you care that Bluespot is not voting you? Why would you even ask this when Bluespot explains in that post why he's not voting you?

@AsainAussie: In #246
You say you disagree with my read on Fynal, you then later factor it in to your decision making process about who is scum. If you disagree with my case, then why is it playing a part in you deciding who is scum?

@Fynal: If Bluespot was searching for a an easy lynch by pushing Sworddancer who is on V/LA, why would he not push a new player? Do you not think that would be easier than a V/LA IC?

@X1, Sword: Analysis of this post.

"And such it is with great displeasure that I have to say that you are my top pick for the scum of the day" - Sword/TBS scumteam? Possible but unlikely, too obvious imo. The post as a whole null-leaning-town imo. Lots of people jump on it which I don't like

@X1, is this reasoning warranted at this point? Anything catch your eye between JTB and Ranmaru? Responding to the link in my 264 would be helpful, and a subsequent read of TBS.

JTB Opportunistic, really really very much so. Also in early game JTB massively advice-dogs

@X1, do you think scum regardless of how experienced they are, tend to fall into the same pattern when an easy out with regards to fake contributing such as game mechanics or teaching?

Yup, gonna attack me for it now?

@Gova: Substantiate this post

I wanted to explain wagoning is bad because townies shouldn't let scum get on wagons easily. Why didn't you explain wagoning to them? I thought I should have posted that being an SE.

All people who are scum say "Fantasia" sometime during Day1 instinctively

-> You tell everyone not to say "Fantasia"

-> How does this help town?

Spoiler

It doesn't

-> How does this help scum?

Spoiler

It makes them less likely to get caught as scum

Soup, no need for cursing.
Ran, no need for derping.

lol

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12471943&postcount=356
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12472028&postcount=382
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12472057&postcount=389

Above is serious opportunism from JTB, Swords and Ran respectively. Do not like.

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12472077&postcount=395
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12472249&postcount=429

non-content and advice dogging from swords.


Think JTB and Swords are both scum, am OK with going JTB first since Swords is V/LA still right?. Cool with kuztown, govatown. Rest null

 

[Gova]

@X1, you were ninja'ing each other with posts about how to play mafia, terms, explanations etc. If you were on the same team I doubt you guys would purposely ninja each other while answering the same questions.

 

[JTB]

X1, yes, it was really that clear. Why would we care about what someone is doing outside of mafia?

Also, explain my opportunism on voting Ran, I fail to see how pointing out something scummy can be considered opportunism.

 

[JTB]

so you're basically saying "cool i have two scapegoats now."

Explain this a little more for me, I don't understand it.

if this isn't a scum post, i don't know what is, why would a townie even care who we are wagoning on.

Ranmaru was my biggest scumpick, so why shouldn't I care?

 

[X1-12]

Hey Soren, I see you viewing, can you post what you're thinking atm? Just say whatever's on your mind atm

Soren comes off as a bit scummy in my eyes, I thought it was pretty clear that when X1 asked for his thoughts, X1 wanted to know what his thoughts towards the game, not just whatever was actually on his mind. And as goes with X1's definition of town, he isn't helping town towards their wincon.

?


10characters

 

[JTB]

Response to JTB.

I was on you for pressure. My read on you remains the same as it was before the wagon.

Fair enough.

To clarify, my case on Fynal had nothing to do with his vote. That is null for me. It was his unorganised defence.

Ughghgh, seriously? You make this huge deal out of Fynal putting me at L-1 accidentally, say that he is one of your scumpicks, then say that he is scum because of his unorganized defense? Without referring to any specific posts? Doesn't sit right with me.

Yes, I believe Kuz is town. However, town is not always correct, and I'm more inclined to go with my own read over someone elses. On the other hand, if two of the ICs are telling me I'm wrong, then yeah, I might start to doubt it.

Ugh, I don't personally see the significance of needing two ICs over one to tell you that you are wrong, so w/e.

I disagree with Ran that Fynal's vote was a scumslip. My case on Fynal has nothing to do with his vote at all.

You voting Fynal after Ran did makes you look opportunistic and trying to hop on the easiest person to vote.

There is no contradiction in my thoughts on Fynal.

Do you believe that Ran and Fynal are scum together?

 

[JTB]

?


10characters

We can endlessly argue this point X1, but it's pretty clear that it's going nowhere and does nothing for the game. You can believe that he answered the question appropriately, but if I was in his shoes, I would've seen that you wanted my thoughts on the game.

 

[X1-12]

I just take issue with you accusing someone of being scum for answering a question, especially when you are making it sound like it was perfectly clear when it really wasn't. Looks very much like you taking any opportunity to push someone. The fact you're doing it to a newbie doesn't help your case either

 

[X1-12]

not to mention that you not wanting to discuss it doesn't make me feel any better about you either

 

[JTB]

You asked town to take a stance on someone I thought was the most scummy, so I did. How can you call that opportunistic?

 

[Seikend]

I don't make a big deal over his vote at all. Didn't see the need to quote because I thought it was obvious, but apparently it wasn't.

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12472149&postcount=410

I highlight the part of the post that bothers me.

It wasn't the vote, it was the lolninja comment, then saying in retrospect.

He answers in one post, then makes a second post shortly after explaining it again.

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12472252&postcount=430

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12472634&postcount=487

Please show where I don't like his vote. I see him as scum not for his vote, but for his response.

 

[#HBC | J]

Votecount 6:

Swordsdancer [1] - Gatlin
TheBlueSpot [0] -
Fynal [1] - Ranmaru
Gatlin [0] -
Blacknight99923 (Soren) [0] -
X1-12 [0] -
th3kuzinator [0] -
Ranmaru [3] - th3kuzinator, The Blue Spot, Seikend
Gova [0] -
JTB [2] - Soupamario, X1-12
Seikend [1] - JTB
Soupamario [0] -
asianaussie [0] -

Not Voting: Swordsdancer, Gova, Blacknight99923 (Soren), Fynal, asianaussie


With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

A deadline is set for Thursday April 14th at 0400 hours.

 

[Seikend]

@Mod JTB is voting me.

 

[#HBC | J]

@Mod JTB is voting me.

Fix'd lol =p

 

[Fynal]

@soup: i had not seen kuz's post "ok he's at L-2, don't vote" when i posted my vote.

please someone tell me that level of hyperactivity was unusual

 

[Fynal]

To fynally repost a reply for Fynal,
Vote: Ranmaru

just found this <3

 

[Fynal]

EBWOP refering to the pun, not the vote -.- /want edits

 

[#HBC | Dancer]

I'm not v/la anymore.

X1, I'm pretty sure that you can't just point out one quote and say I'm posting no content.

Also pretty sure that I'm an IC, so it's my job to give advice to the newbies.

Honestly didn't see the part where TBS gave a reason for us not to vote.

@Seikend: I'll say it's slight newbie town tell, for pretty much the same reason Kuz said.

Also lol I'll respect your wishes. You're now null to me. Well, actually maybe slight town still, just for your honesty.

 

[#HBC | Dancer]

Also what part of that post came off as opportunistic to you X1?

 

[asianaussie]

@AsainAussie: In #246
You say you disagree with my read on Fynal, you then later factor it in to your decision making process about who is scum. If you disagree with my case, then why is it playing a part in you deciding who is scum?

I didn't actually disagree, I merely said I wasn't convinced by your reasoning, even if that reasoning was sound. Sorry if that was unclear. I can see how badly I worded it.

At that point there were in my opinion only a few candidates who could be considered as scum: Fynal, Gatlin, Sworddancer and yourself, and of those the first two stood out to me, as reasoning for Sworddancer being scum was weak and it was too difficult to read intent from your advice-filled posts. Soren was, as you yourself pointed out, not really a serious pick.

Me pointing at those two was more to stimulate discussion than anything, as there was next to nothing to convince me of either's scumminess. You had already asked for discussion on Fynal, so I decided to press Gatlin a bit more.

I think the intent to discuss went somewhere, it let Gatlin clear his name reasonably (for me, at least, I don't know what anyone else thinks of him right now), even if nothing else really happened.

 

[#HBC | Dancer]

I don't see how I am anti-town. I always help town, and scumhunt. Can you explain how I am always anti-town?

Cause you kinda have a tendency to distract the town. For example, in RG mafia you were attacking Ryker early on, correct? In that game I saw you attack Ryker simply because he attacked you. In the end, it was a distracting case that shed eyes of suspicion your w
ay when it really shouldn't of.

This is just an example, but it should help make things clearer.

Btw, my actually read on you as of now is null, as what you're saying about pressuring others as much as possible does line up with what you said early. Still though, how much "pressure" can you really give someone if you're hardly even going to grill them?

---

Now, despite the fact that I consider Fynal's reaction to be a tell of a newbie-townie, I'm still cautious of him for two things right now:

1. Him putting someone at L_1 and then LOLing about how someone might hammer him. That . . . tells me that he might of already known about the dangers of putting someone at L_1, and thus lying about how he didn't realize that it was really bad for him to put someone at L_1.

2. Him deliberately using the noobcard as of late.

@Ran, Gova: Thoughts on this?

---

TBS, for future reference, you shouldn't be afraid to vote. Voting is an easy way to let town know where you stand.

Btw, what has happened to your read on me?

---

Since I feel that discussion is good, I feel like I should pressure an inactive, which would be Gatlin at this point. Especially knowing that he's not one to be inactive on smashboards. So . . .

Vote: Gatlin

 

[th3kuzinator]

That wasn't a scummy post at all.

 

[th3kuzinator]

@Sword, read on Ranmaru then JTB in that order.

OR

X1 then Seik in that order.

Only answer one. I'll let you choose.

 

[ranmaru]

Kuzi he gave a read on me in that post.

 

[th3kuzinator]

Inconsequential. I am asking him again, and I expect him to answer again.

Please don't interrupt his thought process.

 

[ranmaru]

@Kuzi: I see. I just thought you didn't read his post. I understand now.

@Sword:

No i actually voted him for singing and it boiled down from there. But I guess you are right, if you didn't get anything but suspicion on me for it, I'll try to double check what I do.

Thank you, it does.

I have been grilling, but Kuzi keeps downplaying me and telling me to stop. ;-; I don't think we should let newbies go, though. That's a big mistake. In my newb, Vandie pressured me, saw my noob card, and assumed I was town the whole game. So we do have to somehow read the noobs.

Now, despite the fact that I consider Fynal's reaction to be a tell of a newbie-townie, I'm still cautious of him for two things right now:

1. Him putting someone at L_1 and then LOLing about how someone might hammer him. That . . . tells me that he might of already known about the dangers of putting someone at L_1, and thus lying about how he didn't realize that it was really bad for him to put someone at L_1.

2. Him deliberately using the noobcard as of late.

@Ran, Gova: Thoughts on this?

Ok, here are my thoughts. Even if people think he is noobscum or newbtown, you should still ask him to explain that further. Like "Well if you used the noobcard, how did you know someone might have lolninjahammered?"

This is why I have been questioning him, to see if he could slip up. The only problem is that newb townies could have been eager to put someone at L-1 as well, so we do have to look carefully.

He says that he read too fast. For example, he voted JTB because someone said it was good to start wagons. Yet, he forgot JTB was the one who said that, so did he really think JTB was scum, when he agreed with him? Stuff like that.

So just ask Fynal about what he did, and his reads on everyone. (To see if they match up with his thoughts on putting that person at L-1, etc)

 

[Seikend]

Alright, willing to drop Fynal scum.

JTB remains null-scum for me. Attempting to scumhunt looks good, but his accusation was baseless, as his premise was incorrect. Could have simply misread, or could be faking scumhunting. Not sure yet.

That wasn't a scummy post at all.

Not seeing this Kuz. I assume your explanation will come once Swords give those reads?