New Smash Bros for WiiU

[OmegaXXII]

Hmm...I've always wanted a gym based stage to be honest, maybe like a mini stadium of some sort with somekind of hazards, but I think it would be too similar to stadium though so I dunno.

 

[Berserker.]

Mario series: 5
Mario
Luigi
Bowser
Peach
Toad

Zelda series: 5
Link
Zelda/Shiek
Ganondorf (With sword)
Toon Link (Wind Waker/Phantom Hourglass based moveset)

Donkey Kong series: 4
Donkey Kong
Diddy Kong
King K Rool
Dixie Kong (I think she's worthy now)

Yoshi series: 1
Yoshi

Metroid series: 3
Samus/Zero suit
Ridley

Kirby series: 3
Kirby
Meta Knight
King Dedede

Star Fox series: 3
Fox
Falco
Wolf

Pokemon series: 7
Pikachu
Jigglypuff
Victini
Mewtwo
Pokemon Trainer

F-Zero series: 2
Captain Falcon
Samurai Goroh

Fire Emblem series: 3
Marth
Ike
Roy

Wario series: 1
Wario

Pikmin series: 1
Olimar

Kid Icarus series: 2
Pit
Medusa

Retro franchises: 4
Game and Watch
ROB
Ice Climbers
Takumaru

Punch out series: 1
Little Mac

Sin and Punishment series: 1
Saki

Golden Sun series: 1
Isaac

Xenoblade series: 1
Shulk

3rd parties: 3
Snake
Sonic
Mega Man

Newcomers:
Toad
King K Rool
Dixie Kong
Ridley
Victini
Mewtwo (Returns)
Samurai Goroh
Roy (Returns)
Medusa
Little Mac
Takamaru
Saki
Isaac
Shulk
Snake
Sonic
Mega Man

Total no. of newcomers : 17

Total no. of characters : 50 (45 without Sheik, Charizard, Squirtle, Ivysaur and Zero suit Samus)
[collapse=a dream...]Mario series: 6
Mario
Luigi
Bowser
Peach
Toad
Bowser Jr.

Zelda series: 6
Link
Zelda/Shiek
Ganondorf (With sword)
Toon Link (Wind Waker/Phantom Hourglass based moveset)
Tingle

Donkey Kong series: 4
Donkey Kong
Diddy Kong
King K Rool
Dixie Kong

Yoshi series: 2
Yoshi
Kamek

Metroid series: 4
Samus/Zero suit
Ridley
Dark Samus

Kirby series: 4
Kirby
Meta Knight
King Dedede
Bandana Dee

Star Fox series: 4
Fox
Falco
Wolf
Krystal

Pokemon series: 9
Pikachu
Jigglypuff
Victini
Zoroark
Deoxys
Mewtwo
Pokemon Trainer

F-Zero series: 3
Captain Falcon
Samurai Goroh
Black Shadow

Fire Emblem series: 4
Marth
Ike
Roy
Chrome

Wario series: 2
Wario
Captain Syrup

Pikmin series: 1
Olimar

Kid Icarus series: 3
Pit
Medusa
Paletuna

Retro franchises: 6
Game and Watch
ROB
Ice Climbers
Takumaru
Lip
Sheriff

Punch out series: 1
Little Mac

Sin and Punishment series: 1
Saki

Golden Sun series: 1
Isaac

Xenoblade series: 1
Shulk

Star Tropics series: 1
Mike jones

3rd parties: 4
Snake
Sonic
Mega Man
Phoenix Wright

Newcomers:
Toad
Bowser Jr.
King K Rool
Dixie Kong
Ridley
Dark Samus
Victini
Zoroark
Deoxys
Mewtwo (Returns)
Samurai Goroh
Dark Shadow
Roy (Returns)
Chrome
Medusa
Paletuna
Lip
Little Mac
Takamaru
Saki
Isaac
Shulk
Snake
Sonic
Mega Man
Phoenix Wright

Total no. of newcomers : 26

Total no. of characters : 59 (54 without Sheik, Charizard, Squirtle, Ivysaur and Zero suit Samus)[/collapse]

 

[OmegaXXII]

Saki? That guy from Sin& Punishment? Hmm..I think Star made a moveset based on him if I remeber correctly, I forgot what it was though.

 

[MechaWave]

No...
Sakurai intended on having voice chat but eventually decided against it because people would trash talk others over Wi-Fi.

 

[Deleted member]

megaman cannot copy the ability of an organic. robots only. however, nintendo and Sora ltd. don't know much about the blue bomber aside from the arm cannon and the fact that he steals the abilities of his foes.
those programmers over at sora better have some pretty good researchers or avid megaman fans, i wouldnt want the blue bomber treated like the blue blur was in brawl... halfheartedly.

The "half-hearted" treatment probably came from the fact Sonic was one of the last in development. If Mega Man is introduced at E3 2012, I'm sure they won't give Mega Man the same treatment.

On subject of third-party characters, no one is really likely, but if I had to choose, Mega Man. Other choices I could see are Slime, Layton, both Ryu's, and Tails.

 

[MechaWave]

Third-party characters are last on Sakurai's roster, unfortunately. Sonic was put in at the last minute which explains his moveset among other things. I'm certain he'll receive changes in SSB4.

At the same time, we'll probably get only 2 extra third-party characters max.

 

[Oasis_S]

Y'know, I bet another thing that makes adding third-party characters so difficult would be all the advisers or whatever companies would send over making sure their characters are represented as they feel it should. Things like that tend to be really strict.

Apparently, that's what Sakurai was referring to when he mentioned how difficult it was when working with the Pokemon series. He probably doesn't get as much trouble with smaller franchises, but he also mentioned something about himself not having much to do with Zelda related things in Smash. He also mentioned Nintendo being very strict about Mario's design or something.


All pretty much a GIVEN but it's WORTH A MENTION I suppose. :V

 

[Deleted member]

Third-party characters are last on Sakurai's roster, unfortunately. Sonic was put in at the last minute which explains his moveset among other things. I'm certain he'll receive changes in SSB4.

At the same time, we'll probably get only 2 extra third-party characters max.

I actually like it that way. Because of this, Sakurai will be able to focus on Nintendo characters first then worry about keeping third-party. In all honesty, I'd rather lose them then a Brawl vet.

 

[y.toonlink]

I say Sonic should have Light Dash as his Side B and just leave Down B to Spin Dash. The Homing Attack I don't remember it being too bad but I think it should have a little more control and a faster start up.

 

[---]

Finally we're back on topic, and it seems that the tread wasn't closed down. Great, but stay on topic and please limit flaming.

Moar like PULSEMAN!

Yeah, someone besides me finally mentioned Pluseman! He's the Geno of the Pokemon series, but unlike him Gamefreak actually owns him so he does have a better chance.

@SSBF

Yep, I'm a Deoxys supporter, so thanks for adding me.

Gotta go to class, be back later.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Would this count.

Manhole made a cameo in the Flat Zone stages. It would be interesting to convert its background into a stage though.

 

[vicgur]

So essentially something like THIS but for individual games?

Yeah, kinda. It's a nice example. But I wouldn't make it so "Poké Floatsy"....
It could be like the Lylat System, but everytime you teleport, you go to another series' location.
The stage goes with you everytime you are transported to the next location[a very neutral stage, like a Battlefield[or Battlefield itself]]

The Background keeps changing, the fight stays the same.
[COLLAPSE="Like this"]- You start on a Mario location, you can see Peach's Castle in the background, pipes, mountains with eyes, etc.
- Then, you are teleported: You land on Hyrule Field. You can see the Lon Lon Ranch, the Castle, the Death Mountain in the far background...
- Again, you are teleported: You're in Dream Land lot's of colors, lots of little stars. Whispy Woods watching the fight in the background, you can see the Halberd and Dyna Blade flying through the sky, and Dedede's castle, maybe.
- Now, you're in the Metroid part of the stage. What's that!? Is that a Space Pirate!? Of course it is, and it's extracting phazon while you fight, you can see Samus' ship, the good ol' shootable doors, etc.
- A race track!? Is this madness!? // Madness? THIS IS F-ZERO.
- You're in space. Oh, look: The Great Fox!
[/COLLAPSE]
A stage like that would be interesting to watch...

The music for this stage would change at every new location. Like the Obstacle Course music changes when it turns into Winter in Yoshi's Island

 

[Berserker.]

How about some boost attack for his forward B?

 

[y.toonlink]

Who Sonic? I saw a moveset where he would throw a ring and then Light Dash where its thrown. The ring itself could be a projectile. I don't know where it would fit, but Sonic Wind would be a cool attack to use.

 

[Berserker.]

Yeah Sonic.

All he does is boost towards the enemy. He can boost of stage lol.














Hi Jigglypuff

 

[nLiM8d]

You mean 'Bye' Jigglypuff?

Yeah, kinda. It's a nice example. But I wouldn't make it so "Poké Floatsy"....

I understand, you'd be discussing something more on the lines of Castle Siege and Delfino Plaza.

The stages themselves wouldn't be a riot to play on (as per my example), instead they would lead you on a tour through the game's history.

No...
Sakurai intended on having voice chat but eventually decided against it because people would trash talk others over Wi-Fi.

That's funny:" where's the off switch on this thing? I doesn't turn off?! Quick unplug the wall jack!!!"

 

[Shorts]

Bomberman has a marginal choice, his chances aren't that good, still I would prefer Megaman over him since he has way more popularity anyway.

Why anyone would pick someone is insiginificant as Layton over Bomberman is beyond me. Bombs has got him beat on Nintendo history, impact on gaming, and iconism. Unfortunetly, after the collapse of Hudson soft, he hasn't been doing too well.

Wellllll, I understand exactly why they would pick him. They like him. Duh. But I think when you stack everything up, popularity may be the only thing Layton has on Bombs. (Which he may not even have collectively)

Soul Calibur? Please shortie, you're too obsessed with it lol...

That was just a list, I wasn't suggesting. So relax. Notice how it has less than like 8% of the votes? There is a reason for that.

Yep, I'm a Deoxys supporter, so thanks for adding me.

I supported Deoxys before it was cool

Well, actually that's true. I supported him and defended myself from all the flames.

The "half-hearted" treatment probably came from the fact Sonic was one of the last in development. If Mega Man is introduced at E3 2012, I'm sure they won't give Mega Man the same treatment.

Snake ended up having a nice moveset right? I think time definitely played a part in how Sonic played out. Although I do "get" why he has some of the attacks he has, I just think if they're going for mixup attacks, they could have done better.

 

[Oasis_S]

I remember the Sonic thread having to put up with people saying "all Sonic does is spin."

Clearly those fellows were right.

 

[---]

I remember the Sonic thread having to put up with people saying "all Sonic does is spin."

Clearly those fellows were right.

Yeah, I would have to agree. What does Sonic do besides spin?

I know he has had a few powerups like Mario over the years, but how would they work or translate into Smash? As we don't want a complete overhall of how he plays.

Either way the only real changes I see him getting is a few buffs that give him more kill moves and less laggy Smash Attacks.

 

[Starphoenix]

Sakurai did not intend for Sonic to be in Brawl. Sega came to Nintendo and Sakurai at the last minute with the suggestion. Which in turn caused the original delay and the uncompletion of Roy and Mewtwo. Forget last on the list third party characters are not even on Sakurai's list. The ONLY way third party characters are included is if the company themselves make an initiative. Otherwise Sakurai has enough to do just trying to fit all the Nintendo universes together.

Granted, now that Solid Snake and Sonic are in the series they will probably be on his list; since they are beginning with Brawl. But if Sonic and/or Solid Snake do not appear in the E3 2012 trailer they are more than likely toast.

 

[nLiM8d]

Ok, so they made accommodations for Sonic in last minute but his chances are less in the next installment? I'm not sure I follow.
_ _ _

I'd say if they made Sonic's homing attack more accurate to its original conception (CD)
and toss in his rush/boost technique

Yes along with Tri-Hy's suggestions, we'd have a pretty well rounded Sonic.

 

[Oasis_S]

Yerp.

Sakurai looked at the polls and said "PFFF WHATEVER" and didn't want to add Sonic until Sega told him to?

 

[---]

Sakurai did not intend for Sonic to be in Brawl. Sega came to Nintendo and Sakurai at the last minute with the suggestion. Which in turn caused the original delay and the uncompletion of Roy and Mewtwo. Forget last on the list third party characters are not even on Sakurai's list. The ONLY way third party characters are included is if the company themselves make an initiative. Otherwise Sakurai has enough to do just trying to fit all the Nintendo universes together.

Granted, now that Solid Snake and Sonic are in the series they will probably be on his list; since they are beginning with Brawl. But if Sonic and/or Solid Snake do not appear in the E3 2012 trailer they are more than likely toast.

While I don't think that if they don't appear in the E3 trailer all hope would be lost, as they would probably be handled differently. They won't be as big of an advertizement to buy the game as they were in Brawl in comparison to MM.

Throw in the fact they'll be unlockable characters, for all we know we may not find out about them until we get the game.

As for another topic, was everyone O.K. with Brawl's delay at the cost of Roy and Mewtwo in order to get Sonic?

 

[Steam]

I would have rather had roy and mewtwo and no sonic... and an even longer delay

I would be okay with a delay just to take out sonic.

 

[nLiM8d]

Roy? Meh, Ike

Mewtwo? I mean if they really had to, but hey Lucario right?

I would have preferred a more fine tuned Sonic and Stage, but beggars can't be choosers
_ _ _

IF they had gone this route: Pulse & Minum for Jigzy, Made the Diddy Dixie team work

[COLLAPSE="and Added THIS fella"]

[/COLLAPSE]

I wouldn't even trip over Sonic or Mewtwo, add Paper in there and those picks would just be my hype for smash 4.

 

[Starphoenix]

Sakurai looked at the polls and said "PFFF WHATEVER" and didn't want to add Sonic until Sega told him to?

I'm not exactly sure how it played out. More than likely he was so busy with Nintendo series that he didn't make much of an effort to go through the legal limbo just to get Sonic. So when Sega contacted them and made the suggestion it was a good opportunity.

While I don't think that if they don't appear in the E3 trailer all hope would be lost, as they would probably be handled differently. They won't be as big of an advertizement to buy the game as they were in Brawl in comparison to MM.

Throw in the fact they'll be unlockable characters, for all we know we may not find out about them until we get the game.

As for another topic, was everyone O.K. with Brawl's delay at the cost of Roy and Mewtwo in order to get Sonic?

That is true. It doesn't explicitly mean they are gone. But I'd think with an E3 trailer designed to build hype they would want to make it aa exciting as possible. Knowing that a popular guest character was returning would help that. C'mon, seeing Sonic in an epic cinematic trailer alongside other Nintendo characters would make people go batty.

No, because of legal reasons alone they have to promote the character prior to the release of the game. It is one of those weird contractual agreements.

 

[nLiM8d]

So essentially what your saying is that having Sonic and Snake in a major trailer would be acceptable, in the likeness that Metaknight and Pit were?

Yeah I can see that, almost as if they had been in Smash the whole time.

Not to side track your discussion, but I'm liking the feel of Sonic here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZsRDH3rn1Y&feature=related

Even though he was fourstocked... Its the design that COUNTS!

 

[Oasis_S]

@Starfy-nix:
Eh, maybe the sarcasm didn't come through but I was trying to CONVEY that you're (probabloly) wrong. With Snake, Sakurai asked Kojima if he could use Snake in Brawl after first not being capable of doing so during Melee after Kojima had asked Sakurai if he would use Snake. With Sonic, Sakurai (or Nintendo) PROBABLY asked Sega if they could use him after it being clear from Sakurai's poll results that Sonic was the most requested character. Unless you think Sega was paying close attention to Sakurai's personal blog or something.

The only time we have SUCCESSFULLY gotten third-party characters is when Sakurai/Nintendo took the initiative. Obviously that doesn't always have to be the case. It sounds like you're trying to come up with an end-all explanation?

 

[y.toonlink]

Yeah Sonic.

All he does is boost towards the enemy. He can boost of stage lol.
Hi Jigglypuff

That's basically what Light Dash is, but you have a nice way of controlling the direction you boost with the ring. Plus it gives Sonic a projectile if dashing into it is toggled
Homing attack could be like Jiggs Pound with the right control

I don't think the first trailer from E3 has to show Sonic and Snake. They could be in a later trailer with some new 3rd party like Megaman or Slime(&Chocobo).

 

[Oasis_S]

Even if we don't a guest in the trailer, the inclusion of third-party characters is going to be some of the first information we learn about.

Y'know, because people are going to be asking what the deal is.

 

[y.toonlink]

True, but it doesn't have to be in the very first trailer. It'd be nice though

 

[OmegaXXII]

Star-Enix? Haha, good one!!

 

[Starphoenix]

Sonic was never planned to be in Brawl, and Sakurai himself said that. Sega, more than likely, saw the demand for Sonic and saw it as an opportunity to both promote Sonic and please their fans. Which is not so difficult to believe considering his announcement came on the heels of Mario and Sonic at the Olympic games.

With Snake you admitted it yourself Kojima came to Sakurai initially. I'm not trying to be unreasonable I'm simply stating things according to what Sakurai himself has said in interviews. If I wasn't limited to a cell phone I could go into better depth over this, but for now I'm unable to.

 

[OmegaXXII]

Haha, good logic there, how do you come up with all this?

 

[Starphoenix]

BTW, CoroCoro was just released and a new Pokemon game was announced. Pokepark 2. You can read more on it at Serebii.

Also, look at this.

This Mewtwo event for Black/White includes a Mewtwo with a "Pressure" ability. Plus he has a new signature move. Called "Psycho Break" or something like that.

 

[Oasis_S]

Sonic was never planned to be in Brawl, and Sakurai himself said that. Sega, more than likely, saw the demand for Sonic and saw it as an opportunity to both promote Sonic and please their fans. Which is not so difficult to believe considering his announcement came on the heels of Mario and Sonic at the Olympic games.

I KNOW THIS ISN'T ANYTHING TO GET HUNG UP ON, buuut:

Sakurai: At the time we announced Snake, we actually put together a survey for our users, asking which characters they would like to see in the game. And a huge amount of people said Sonic, especially in the United States. So in order to satisfy our fans, I thought it was a good idea to try to include Sonic. But that was the thing that put the whole process in motion."

I mean, doesn't that sound like he took the initiative here? Because of the fan demand? You see the same story everywhere. I doubt if this is what you're wanting to get at or not, but you seem to write-off that fan demand is a factor when it CLEARLY SEEMS to be a big one?

ANYWAY, it's all kind of trivial because no matter who took the first step, the end result was the same. But your ABSOLUTES were a bit silly.

From the sounds of it, Capcom may take the initiative for Mega Man, but perhaps Nintendo would take the initiative for Slime considering Iwata's agenda for expanding Dragon Quest in the West?

 

[Starphoenix]

Congratulations, you win Oasis. Satisfied with your victory? Taste like Toad?

 

[augustoflores]

Psycho Break? A possible final smash? it kinda sounds like a counter move... it also sounds like a special attack version of brick break (which is more likely)

hey... can anyone write up a moveset for mewtwo without him being all crappy? ie hypnosis, disable...

 

[OmegaXXII]

This is pretty legit stuff here, Im liking Mewtwo's chances.

Also, got a link to the new Pokemon game? I can't since I'm on my phone. -_-

 

[Le vieux lapin]

If I've learned anything from this thread, its not to get
hyped on Mew2's chances. Ya think Roy or Dr.Mario are gonna show
up? Sakurai got rid of them for a reason... one that I don't know.


BTW Megaman ftw.