New Smash Bros for WiiU

[SmashChu]

I'm about to make like metal and disappear after I correct this. I was going to let this go but I couldn't, is that supposed to say sentiment? That is definetly the most unique spelling I've seen of that word.

lol. Was gonna fix this, but forgot. The browser spell check doesn't give me what I'm looking for most of the time.

 

[Shorts]

I tend to keep the Mario, DK, and Wario series very close. They're usually row one as well.
The next rows are usually Kirby or LoZ, and they usually are paired with some random smaller sized franchises. Like, KI, or someone like Little Mac or Takamaru.

Mother and FE are usually the next series I do, OR they're second to last.

Next usually comes "Space groupings" F-Zero, Starfox, and Metroid.

The final row is always Retro/WTFs smaller franchises I couldnt fit anywhere else, and the occasional 3rd parties

 

[Kantrip]

I tend to keep the Mario, DK, and Wario series very close. They're usually row one as well.
The next rows are usually Kirby or LoZ, and they usually are paired with some random smaller sized franchises. Like, KI, or someone like Little Mac or Takamaru.

Mother and FE are usually the next series I do, OR they're second to last.

Next usually comes "Space groupings" F-Zero, Starfox, and Metroid.

The final row is always Retro/WTFs smaller franchises I couldnt fit anywhere else, and the occasional 3rd parties

Yeah I'd say I did something kind of similar.

I liked having Mario, Link, Pikachu, and Kirby as the first one in the first four rows as they are like the poster children of smash who are on trailers and stuff. Donkey Kong is a big enough franchise that it got to start its own row rather than being near Mario, but Yoshi and Wario were lumped in there.

[COLLAPSE=My Roster]

[/COLLAPSE]

 

[Sage of Ice]

golden: dropping pokemon trainer is somewhere where personal opinion bled in. Charizard's one of my all-time favorite pokemon, but trainer struck me as redundant. i always assumed some trainer was offscreen giving pikachu or jiggs orders. (EDIT) then again, i did include Ike on the grounds of not cutting anyone, so it would only be fair to put him back.

oasis: i actually do have a roster image put together, organized much the way everyone's been suggesting, but i forgot how to put images onto forums.

john: remember that dattebayo guy? anyway, i've seen several arguments for and against krystal and ghirahim. i would love to see them, but honestly i wouldn't be hugely surprised if they didn't make the roster. with cuts, the only brawl character i dropped on purpose was trainer, and i already gave my reasoning for that. were you also including the ones from melee that weren't in brawl? as far as third-party and retro, i tend to fill that in with balloon fighter and megaman.

also, Krom/Chrome was meant to be the same character. i've seen both translations, is one more accurate than the other?

 

[ChronoBound]

I am not going to express my roster ideas in the future.

 

[Oasis_S]

Swap Takamaru and Saki's places. You should know better. Then swap Mac and Saki I guess.

 

[ChronoBound]

Swap Takamaru and Saki's places. You should know better. Then swap Mac and Saki I guess.

Takamaru is definitely more retro than Saki is, so he stays in the retro column.

 

[Starphoenix]

Don't worry Chrono. I am going to scrutinize everyone of your selections so I can establish precedent.

 

[Sage of Ice]

Chrono, don't forget that Ridley's general badassery is reason enough why he should be in. also, takamaru's a good pick. why didn't i think of that?

 

[Oasis_S]

Takamaru is definitely more retro than Saki is, so he stays in the retro column.

C'mooon. 3rd and 4th columns are just MEANT to be the Famicom Disk System columns. Look into your heart. You know it to be true.

 

[Johnknight1]

I would want Lyn playable this time. (Fire Emblem)

Her playstyle would be unique in my opinion, I couldn't even think of how it'd work out.

I agree, but I think her "window" to be playable in smash has passed. She could, however, be the ultimate speedster sword-wielding character.

Besides, her (potential!) son Roy should return. I mean c'mon! R0y h@5 t3h ph1r3!

My roster had a general theme of lumping franchises together on horizontal rows, and down the columns it would be the order of character roles in their respective franchise.

For example:

Mario | Luigi | Bowser | Peach | Toad
Link | Toon Link | Ganon | Zelda | Sheik

Protagonist | Secondary Hero | Villain | Female | Supporting Character

Not a terrible idea, although we'll probably run out of everything that isn't the main character!
I mean, Zelda, Pokémon, and Mario are the only series with that many characters... unless you combine characters and rows.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Impa makes a better supporting character. Especially when relating to Toad. Just sayin'.

 

[Deleted member]

Takamaru needs to be with the Zelda gang due to his game being the "sister" game to Zelda, like how Kid Icarus was to Metroid.
Also, if Takamaru is there, you've got the Famicon Four.

Also, I don't see why people always say G&W is a Retro. Just because he existed before Mario and Donkey Kong?
I mean, he was relevant before Melee with the Game & Watch Gallery series.
ALSO, Mac is as Retro as Pit is at this point. He's been revived already. To call Pit a non-Retro soley for Uprising, while calling Mac a Retro despite POWii and Doc Louis' PO is nothing short of hypocritical.

I also disagree with 2 KI Newcomers on the basis that Sakurai is actually modest with his characters. It took 3 games just to give his own series another character, let alone two. The only game he's done for KI was Uprising. While one new character isn't out of the question, two is overkill.
EDIT: Otherwise, we would need to expect Yellow Alloy (based on Meteos, another game Sakurai made) and Mushiking (Sakurai worked on one of the games).

 

[SmashChu]

Pretty cool roster. Kind of close to mine. My thoughts.

Black Shadow over Goroh? I understand what your getting at, but I doubt Sakurai's going to add a character just to change another.
Was hoping you sold me on Starfy. Sadley, not sure why he's there.
Not sure if we are having third parties back, so I'm skeptical on anything about them. Maybe you can explain why they should return. Megaman explanation was OK.
Cool with Palutena and Medusa. What I would have said so yeah.
12 is kind of low. Melee added 13 characters. Brawl added 15 and this is with the late addition of Sonic. Count Pokemon Trainer as 3 and we have 17.
EDIT:I'm always skeptical when Shulk is missing.

Not sure if anything else, but there you go.

 

[Big-Cat]

...Umm... who gives an eff what a bunch of Dungeons and Dragons nerds think=??? Maybe this is my jock side coming out (I was one until I developed a medical condition that physically limited me), but man, I never will let a bunch of nerds who live with their mothers at the age of 26 working at Burger King and devout their entire personal lives to electronic toys telling me what something is or isn't.

Where do you get this D&D stereotype?

john: remember that dattebayo guy?

Wasn't that the idiot on the Serebii forums that wanted Spongebob for Brawl?

 

[Oasis_S]

Isaac > Stary. Just the facts.

Shulk is a very hard Sell, SmashChu. Shouldn't you be more Skeptical when he's there? Even when Star Suggests him, it's just because he's got a FEELING.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Isaac > Stary. Just the facts.

Shulk is a very hard Sell, SmashChu. Shouldn't you be more Skeptical when he's there? Even when Star Suggests him, it's just because he's got a FEELING.

But Starfy is VERY Strong. He finishes off the most recent final boss by throwing the moon at the guy. If that's not Strong, I don't know what is.

 

[Deleted member]

But Starfy is VERY Strong. He finishes off the most recent final boss by throwing the moon at the guy. If that's not Strong, I don't know what is.

Hardly a feat. Both Donkey and Diddy have done THAT.

Spoiler

Actually, DK steps it up a notch; he PUNCHES the moon into his final boss. While Diddy just falls on it, which makes it fall.

 

[Propeller Toad]

oasis: i actually do have a roster image put together, organized much the way everyone's been suggesting, but i forgot how to put images onto forums.

Did you upload your roster image to an image hosting site such as Photobucket? Is that the problem or is is just the coding? Just curious.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Hardly a feat. Both Donkey and Diddy have done THAT.

Spoiler

Actually, DK steps it up a notch; he PUNCHES the moon into his final boss. While Diddy just falls on it, which makes it fall.

Starfy does it twice.
Pushes it twice, second one kills the boss.

Besides, DK and Diddy didn't save the universe with it. They saved bananas.

EDIT: And they didn't hit the final boss. The EXPLOSION from the final boss(AKA his defeat) threw them to the moon in the first place. They hit the Tiki in the volcano, and freed the bananas.

 

[Deleted member]

You see, DK and Diddy didn't HAVE to do it twice. Therefore, Starfy is weak.

And you also see, there is no kill like overkill. Imagine if the universe was on the line. DK would proabably punch the SUN to save it.

 

[Johnknight1]

Where do you get this D&D stereotype?

I went to a Smash tournament with the trilogy of smash games (64, Melee, and Brawl) at San Francisco State University (it had at least 150 people), and there was some small scale Street Fighter IV tournament.

I was talking with this great Link player (from Melee) and the dude who I had a match with on the Summit. We could overhear two of the Street Fighter people talking about how "gay" (their words, not mine) smash was and we all were. We walked by them to see who they were, and they were a bunch of stereotypical D&D nerds, and had no social skills. No lie. All they could talk about was their game and how lame "we smash girls players" are (yes, they called us "smash girls). It was sad.

The Link dude was all tattooed and buff, and the other guy was pretty big, too. They were both very kind and funny. The former was probably more into Melee than the Street Fighter D&D nerds were into their game (but not as much as they were into their conceit personalities), and the other guy was kinda casual but still competitive. We also weren't just talking about smash or Street Fighter, but a plethora of other things.

This is what I think a lot of the Street Fighter community that talks us down are like. They're like the socially awkward jealous nerds talking behind the social and oddly polite jocks' backs about how lame they are.

Takamaru needs to be with the Zelda gang due to his game being the "sister" game to Zelda, like how Kid Icarus was to Metroid.
Also, if Takamaru is there, you've got the Famicon Four.

This makes sense.

Also, I don't see why people always say G&W is a Retro. Just because he existed before Mario and Donkey Kong?
I mean, he was relevant before Melee with the Game & Watch Gallery series.
ALSO, Mac is as Retro as Pit is at this point. He's been revived already. To call Pit a non-Retro soley for Uprising, while calling Mac a Retro despite POWii and Doc Louis' PO is nothing short of hypocritical.

Actually G&W, Mario, Donkey Kong, Pit, and Little Mac are all retro.. and to an extent they are all also "modern." However, none of them are "purely retro" except for the 2D graphics of G&W in smash.

And are you sure the G&W Gallery games came out before Melee=??? I thought they came out from like 2003-2006.

I also disagree with 2 KI Newcomers on the basis that Sakurai is actually modest with his characters. It took 3 games just to give his own series another character, let alone two. The only game he's done for KI was Uprising. While one new character isn't out of the question, two is overkill.

Yeah, I think 2 is most likely.

@ Chrono
I think you should replace either Medusa or Saki with Issac. Saki's two games have sold maybe 100,00- units at best. The first two Golden Sun games sold around a million units each, they are universally acclaimed, and the third game sold about 500k or something like that.

If I were you, I would adjust your roster with the following:
Medusa: Change with Paper Mario/Bowser Jr./Toad/a random character.
Saki: Replace with Issac... or another "modern"/random character. I think your roster lacks "WTF?'s" good sire.
Black Shadow: I understand your reasoning, but I would replace with either Samurai Goroh, another largely forgotten retro character/newer character, or Pac-Man.
I your roster lacks surprises...

Also, my roster organization theory is simple: the 10 Smash 64 franchises, then the 3 Melee franchises, the 6 Brawl franchises, and then the new franchises.

 

[Arcadenik]

I grow tiresome of rosters without surprises.

BTW, Game & Watch Gallery 1-3 was around before Melee came out.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

You see, DK and Diddy didn't HAVE to do it twice. Therefore, Starfy is weak.

And you also see, there is no kill like overkill. Imagine if the universe was on the line. DK would proabably punch the SUN to save it.

Yeah, but it knocked Diddy unconscious, and hurt DK's fist.
Starfy did it TWICE WITH HIS FACE/HEAD, and wasn't even hurt.
Starfy is Stronger.

 

[Oasis_S]

Because all of your Surprises Suck, Arcadenik.

No one wants a birthday present from you.

 

[Johnknight1]

Yeah rosters need at least one "surprise" to most gamers. It doesn't have to be Takamaru. Maybe we've just uncovered all potential surprises because all but maybe 3 to 5 of the obvious characters are playable in smash. There are very few stones (aka characters) that we here have left unturned. That is, unless we get another "surprise" Pokémon. Perhaps Pichu returning would be a huge surprise...

Also, G&W Gallery 1-3 came out well before Brawl. I was thinking of 4, which came out in 2002. Collection came out in 2008, and Collection 2 came out in 2010. So we are all right (Golde, Arcadenik, and myself). YEAH TO BEING RIGHT!

 

[Deleted member]

@John: And Samus. And Ridley. And Peach. And Bowser. And Toad. And Link. And Zelda. And etc. All Retro.

Horray for all being right!

@Poppy: Oh trust me, he was hurt. You just didn't see it.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

@John: And Samus. And Ridley. And Peach. And Bowser. And Toad. And Link. And Zelda. And etc. All Retro.

Horray for all being right!

@Poppy: Oh trust me, he was hurt. You just didn't see it.

Actually, looking at it... The MOON was hurt. It has a bandage after the final boss explodes. Starf wins.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I grow tiresome of rosters without surprises.

Surprise characters can either be good or bad, depending on what you're looking for. Because of that, it would probably be wiser to implement downloadable content, instead of being disappointed with the surprise.

 

[Deleted member]

Actually, looking at it... The MOON was hurt. It has a bandage after the final boss explodes. Starf wins.

 

[Pachinkosam]

Did i miss anything.

 

[Johnknight1]

@John: And Samus. And Ridley. And Peach. And Bowser. And Toad. And Link. And Zelda. And etc. All Retro.

Retro is generally seen as something that is 25-35 years old. Therefore, all of the characters you listed are (arguably) retro.

Horray for all being right!

Hope we are all right on Impa. And by all of us, I mean everyone that isn't Diddy Kong... :grimer:

 

[Arcadenik]

Because all of your Surprises Suck, Arcadenik.

No one wants a birthday present from you.

That's because you are all afraid of change. That's why all of your rosters are too conservative and boring. The only newcomers I constantly see are:

Mario series: Toad, Bowser Jr., Paper Mario, Waluigi
Donkey Kong series: King K. Rool, Dixie Kong
Zelda series: Tingle, Ghirahim, Toon Zelda
Metroid series: Ridley
Star Fox series: Krystal
Pokemon series: Mewtwo, Zoroark, Victini
F-Zero series: Samurai Goroh, Black Shadow
Fire Emblem series: Roy, Krom
Kid Icarus series: Palutena, Medusa
Retro series: Little Mac, Takamaru
New series: Isaac, Saki, Starfy, Mii
Third Party series: Mega Man

I guarantee you that there will be surprises in SSB4. Honestly, did anyone correctly predict Zero Suit Samus, Pokemon Trainer with Squirtle/Ivysaur/Charizard, R.O.B., or Snake in SSB3/Brawl? Did anyone incorrectly predict there would be no cuts in SSB3/Brawl?

 

[Pachinkosam]

ignore me then 0_0

 

[Johnknight1]

Surprise characters can either be good or bad, depending on what you're looking for. Because of that, it would probably be wiser to implement downloadable content, instead of being disappointed with the surprise.

Exactly. It depends on the surprise character, how they play in smash, and what they bring to the smash bros series.

Also, Sakurai will be looking for overlooked characters who are important characters in major franchise (ie: Toad and Bowser Jr.; these are fairly "WTF?" to most people) or stars of under-appreciated or largely forgotten games and/or series, whether new, old, or both (instead of random characters from said games).

@ Arcadenik
Ain't nobody posting Waluigi in their rosters. And the few people who have posted Tingle on their rosters... have been dealt with.

Also, you forgot several retro characters (Balloon Fighter, Mach Rider, etc), Pac-Man, Tails, Dark Samus, and Adam.

I think characters like Tails, Pac-Man, and even Issac are being extremely overlooked and passed off as characters with "no chance" despite each of them being solid choices, each of them are at least fairly popular, each of them are well known by Sakurai (the first two are amongst the ten or so most recognized characters in all of gaming), and each of them could add something to the table.

 

[Arcadenik]

Surprise characters can either be good or bad, depending on what you're looking for. Because of that, it would probably be wiser to implement downloadable content, instead of being disappointed with the surprise.

Haha... no safety nets. Honestly, the only reason people are being so damn conservative with their rosters is because they are afraid of being disappointed with whatever SSB4 might throw at them.

 

[Starphoenix]

Not really going to concern myself with the aesthetics of your roster. It is fine enough. Because of how long my responses are becoming I am going to break down my responses into individual posts (or at least attempt to fit as many into one post as I can). You are free to respond to them individually as they come or wait until they are complete in their entirety and respond. That is your decision to make.

If my grammar is a little off, forgive me. When it comes to fan forums I don't really use my collegiate level writing abilities.

All Characters From Brawl Return + Mewtwo & Roy brought back:
All of the characters that were introduced in Brawl were received very well and have a large amount of fans. There is generally a lot of hostility to the idea of cuts this time around, and most Smash Bros. fans would rather see the entire Brawl cast brought back. Of the cut Melee characters, Mewtwo and Roy are the ones brought up the most in regards to being brought back for Smash 4, and for many people, seeing these characters return would be a very big deal. They were also both planned for Brawl. There are also many who think Dr. Mario should be brought back as a costume as well (with some even suggesting Pichu as a model swap for Pikachu). This just goes to show how popular Smash Bros.'s cast is and how much personality and charm Sakurai puts into every character he places in.

I generally agree with this given how unpopular the cuts have been among people even today. Sakurai is a little harder up for characters this time around, therefore, it is not illogical to think he will bring back as many if not all of the characters from Brawl into the next game. As for Mewtwo and Roy I will discuss them separately.

Mewtwo: Out of all of the cut characters he makes the most sense. Even within the Pokémon fanbase Mewtwo remains one of Pokémon's most widely known and popular characters. Outside of that fanbase the same remains true. The requests for his reinstatement, so to speak, has been wide enough to place him within the top five on many online character polls almost consistently. The only problem I feel he faces is the possibility of Game Freak/The Pokémon Company shoehorning their latest flavor of the month mascot; although this hinges upon the supposition that either of the two companies are heavy handed with their licenses to begin with. The Pokémon playable in the games to date probably have more to do with Sakurai and less with The Pokémon Company advertisment.

There is the remote possibility that Mewtwo was one of the characters Sakurai had in mind where in the Nintendo Power interview following Brawl's release he mentioned having more characters he wanted to add into the game but fell short on time. With the already existing speculation out there regarding Mewtwo's bad luck in Brawl Sakurai may rectify this in the next game. It is also known that Mewtow has been planned for every Super Smash Bros game to date, the caveat to this however is that Mewtwo has only been in one of those three games he was planned for. In a funny case of coincidence it is possible, according to some theories, that in both Super Smash Bros 64 and Super Smash Bros. Brawl Mewtwo was edged out by Jigglypuff. Make of that what you will.

Roy: While Roy was probably among the two Melee characters outside of Mewtwo who came closest to being in Brawl his work may be cut out for him in the next game. If Sakurai looks towards adding Roy, or any other Fire Emblem character, are going to have to contend with Krom. In the next year Fire Emblem: Awakening is going to be released and there will be a swell of fans who are going to want Krom in the next game. Whether this group is going to primarily be fueled by the mistaken notion that "new=likely" or by genuine support will need to be seen, but there will be a mixture of the two. If Fire Emblem: Awakening does well and Krom is a character people gravitate towards, than Roy is in deep trouble. Not necessarily because the whims of the fans have too much weight on the will of the developers, or that Intelligent Systems is going to shove him down the throats of Sakurai and his team, but instead perception. What I mean by this is Roy will begin losing support, votes, mentions, what have you while Krom will increase. By the time Sakurai holds a poll, which he will, Roy may begin to fade while Krom begins to rise above him. Perception is key because Sakurai was the one lamenting how unpopular Wario was during the Brawl E3 reveal trailer and wondered if it was a mistake adding him. Whether a joke or not I do not know, but the fact is Sakurai will be looking towards his own set of polls determine what is the best decision.

Before I go any further I should also clarify why I believe all of this affects Roy the most. From what I have seen of Krom he does not appear likely to have a playstyle similar to Marth or Ike. Marth has been presented as the nimble, light character while Ike is more of the heavy hitter. Roy was more of the balanced fighter, and if he'd been in Brawl would have likely been the in-between for Marth and Ike. Based upon the brief amount I have seen of Krom he comes across as a similar type of character as Roy, and in the context of Super Smash Bros a possible balanced fighter. Is this certain? No, to try and claim something so intangible as fact would be foolish, but it is at least easy to see where I am drawing this from.

Ultimately though the decision lies with Sakurai. If he feels like bringing back Roy due to his efforts in Melee to put him in, and in trying to do this in Brawl, than he will be included. If he chooses, instead, to look at all of the other options, Roy may fall into a precarious position. Ultimately being overlooked and left to the memories of Melee fans long ago.

 

[ChronoBound]

I guarantee you that there will be surprises in SSB4. Honestly, did anyone correctly predict Zero Suit Samus, Pokemon Trainer with Squirtle/Ivysaur/Charizard, R.O.B., or Snake in SSB3/Brawl? Did anyone incorrectly predict there would be no cuts in SSB3/Brawl?

I agree with Arcadenik on this one. We will probably get 1 to 3 characters in Smash 4 that barely anyone saw coming.

 

[---]

I'm jealous of Chrono right now, a roster review from Star, so lucky.

I gotta agree with Arcadenik a little bit, chances are there will be some surprises (I doubt DHD will be one of them though). However, you can't speculate surprises so it should be obvious that rosters will for the most part be conservative.

 

[Johnknight1]

I agree with Arcadenik on this one. We will probably get 1 to 3 characters in Smash 4 that barely anyone saw coming.

As do I. Again, I keep bringing up Pac-Man, and aside from people saying "oh, he would be cool," we dismiss him. This is after Shigeru Miyamoto said he could "add any character he wanted" to smash bros. You know who his favorite character is that isn't made by Nintendo right=??? Pac-Man!

Also consider that Pac-Man (along with some Pac-Man ghosts and Mrs. Pac-Man) was in two arcade Mario Kart games. Nintendo could easily get the rights to him. Pac-Man is amongst the most recognizable faces in gaming. He would simply be an excellent choice based on that alone. Plus Pac-Man would be a great surprise character that we all already know, much like Snake in Brawl.

Again, I am for him (not wildly for him), but I don't understand why people keep dismissing him. We should at least consider that "hey, he may have a shot." If we get 4 third party characters, and 3 are Snake, Sonic, and Mega Man, the third will probably be Pac-Man from what I can gather. I just got that "gut" feeling... again.

@ Star
I think we should hold before comparing Roy and Krom. Roy in his game (Fire Emblem 6) is mostly a finesse fighter with a lot of speed and a lot of stabbing attacks. Literally all of his sword moves involves stabs. Every other character in smash has mostly lunges and slashes. I think Roy's style could be either a semi-clone of Marth or a finesse based moveset with a ton of stab attacks (with little pre lag but a noticeable amount of after lag).

Either way, I think he could be different from Krom. I haven't seen much of Krom, so I can't judge him (based on his moves) quite yet. Chances are that he does not fight like this. Like Ike and Marth, he probably operates with mostly slashes and lunges. He probably won't be as finesse-based as Marth or as deadly powerful as Krom, but that doesn't mean we can automatically eliminate the possibility of getting all four of them.