New Smash Bros for WiiU

[TBone06]

Am I the only one who finds it ironic that Pieman0920 brought up Balloon Fighter, even thought he's clearly never getting in?

where is the source for that?

 

[shinhed-echi]

Sakurai attempted to declone characters in Brawl (we can hardly call them clones by now. Falco plays very different from Fox, and Luigi is his own character) so I can only predict we'll be seeing even less of them now.


And as far as I know, Balloon Fighter was indeed planned for Melee, but replaced for Ice Climbers. So at least the guy has been in Sakurai's sight.

 

[Starphoenix]

Melee

One of the plans for Melee was to use a character who would represent NES games in general. Sakurai revealed a list of characters who had been considered (we don’t really know if it was all of them or not, though) along with reasons they had been dumped (some of the reasons were joking, some really weren’t). The rejected choices were:

-Balloon Fighter (“if his balloons were popped, he couldn’t do anything”)
-Urban Champion (“there’s not much you could do with him”)
-Bubbles (from Clu Clu Land) (“she (?) doesn’t really know how to fight”)
-Excitebike (“you’d have to install ramps on all the levels for him to be playable”)

The character that was actually chosen for this position was, of course, the Ice Climbers. Interesting that Pit apparently wasn’t in that list.

Just thought I would post this.

 

[Pieman0920]

I don't think its ironic. Its just a hypothetical question. I mean its not like Funky is getting in or anything.

But @shinheed, Balloon Fighter was never planned for Melee. He was considered or at least allegedly considered. Sakurai dismissed the idea when he thought that the BF couldn't do anything if his balloons were popped, and thus moved on to the Ice Climbers.

 

[Deleted member]

I don't think its ironic. Its just a hypothetical question. I mean its not like Funky is getting in or anything.

But @shinheed, Balloon Fighter was never planned for Melee. He was considered or at least allegedly considered. Sakurai dismissed the idea when he thought that the BF couldn't do anything if his balloons were popped, and thus moved on to the Ice Climbers.

And that's why we are probably never going to see Balloon Fighter.

 

[DiamondFox]

His multiple personalities each have no personality

K.Rool is generic, to me mind you, in that he's just a filler villain. DKC needed an ending, and in the end, it was the big crocodile who was also a king. He jumps around charging around, and outside of his crown being thrown, which was kind of silly, he just screamed generic to me. Then he became a pirate and then an evil scientist, and to some that didn't grow up on Saturday morning cartoons where villains love to change outfits and disguise themselves, this may not be all that generic, but to me it was. Then when he finally started talking in DK64, he was just a Bond Villain or something. To me, each time he changed, he was just lampooning something else in order to make up for the lack of any real character. Thus I can't help but find him generic and without a personality. And that all could be forgiven if he actually had anything interesting to use in Smash, but really, just his blunderbuss seems interesting, and if that's the case, it should just be an item.

Well then, guess we're cutting Mario, Peach, DK, Yoshi, Link, Zelda, Ganondorf, Toon Link, and a lot more for being even more generic than K. Rool.

For a more relevant comparison because villians are more interesting by default in Nintendo's games due to generic player avatar protagonists, let's compare him to his fellow villians. Sure, he's not nearly as good as Bowser, but that's a pretty tough act to follow. Ganondorf, on the other hand, is one of the most generic villians Nintendo has, and he's far from held back by said genericness as a Smash Bros candidate. There's a reason they're trying to shoo him out of every title now because he makes the storyline overly predictable, and when they put him in for a "twist ending", like in Twilight Princess, it blatantly falls flat on its face. The fact that his series is more serious is the main reason why his being so generic can't be excused like that of other cookie cutter villians.

K. Rool is easier to take seriously than Ganondorf within his own series, simply because his boss battles aren't piss easy (An incredibly rare quality in Nintendo villians) and he manages to differentiate himself each time he recurs so you aren't groaning when he comes back. Sure, he always gets beaten, but the mass kidnapping he does also helps to add some legitimacy to his status as a villian.

And the blunderbuss is far, far more than enough potential to vary up K. Rool's potential for Specials, much less an entire moveset if Sakurai wanted, considering all the various uses it has. However; Sakurai sucks horribly at making movesets and only cares about the Specials, and pretty much everybody has enough potential to make those at least somewhat unique, so moveset potential is a terrible argument. If you are bringing it in, though, it's a pretty idiotic place to bring it up as an argument against K. Rool.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Well at least he was under Sakurai's radar at some point. Maybe he played Balloon Kid by now, where the character actually survives for a while without them. :D

Didn't they plan Pit for SSB 64 and they couldn't make him work? It's much easier to think up a moveset rather than change programming for a game, and we know which one was done already. :O Just saying.

 

[Starphoenix]

Well at least he was under Sakurai's radar at some point. Maybe he played Balloon Kid by now, where the character actually survives for a while without them. :D

Didn't they plan Pit for SSB 64 and they couldn't make him work? It's much easier to think up a moveset rather than change programming for a game, and we know which one was done already. :O Just saying.

No, that was never the case with Pit.

I would really recommend everyone read this post: http://forum.starmen.net/forum/Stor...ing-a-comprehensive-list-of-unused-characters

 

[Deleted member]

Didn't they plan Pit for SSB 64 and they couldn't make him work? It's much easier to think up a moveset rather than change programming for a game, and we know which one was done already. :O Just saying.

Meowth, Pit, and Peach were all rumors.

K. Rool is easier to take seriously than Ganondorf within his own series, simply because his boss battles aren't piss easy (An incredibly rare quality in Nintendo villians) and he manages to differentiate himself each time he recurs so you aren't groaning when he comes back. Sure, he always gets beaten, but the mass kidnapping he does also helps to add some legitimacy to his status as a villian.

I had a much harder time beating Bowser in Super Mario World then King K. Rool in Donkey Kong Country.

 

[TBone06]

Well at least he was under Sakurai's radar at some point. Maybe he played Balloon Kid by now, where the character actually survives for a while without them. :D

Didn't they plan Pit for SSB 64 and they couldn't make him work? It's much easier to think up a moveset rather than change programming for a game, and we know which one was done already. :O Just saying.

Exactly, like if I recall, Pit's wings were a problem in prior games, but they were able to fix that. Not saying Balloon Fighter is a shoe-in by far, but to say he'll never be in is a bit of a stretch (although yeah of course there's the chance he won't be in)

 

[Deleted member]

Am I the only one feeling that Ganondorf isn't guarantee to come back to SSB4? We have no information on whenever or not he'll be in The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Swords and if he isn't in, I'm getting the feeling that they may be trying to give Ganondorf the boot next time because he is pretty much a full clone of Captain Falcon and a poor one at it which then they'll replace it with another Zelda villain.

I would hate for that to happen, but just keep in mind that I have a feeling that we could be seeing at least one "painful" cut. Granted, I doubt we'll have to see that in SSB4, but I still think it's possible.

 

[TBone06]

Am I the only one feeling that Ganondorf isn't guarantee to come back to SSB4? We have no information on whenever or not he'll be in The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Swords and if he isn't in, I'm getting the feeling that they may be trying to give Ganondorf the boot next time because he is pretty much a full clone of Captain Falcon and a poor one at it which then they'll replace it with another Zelda villain.

I would hate for that to happen, but just keep in mind that I have a feeling that we could be seeing at least one "painful" cut. Granted, I doubt we'll have to see that in SSB4, but I still think it's possible.

I think he's too important to Zelda's history to cut him, especially after being in Melee and Brawl. I don't see him being cut - even if he's not in Skyward Sword. You're right though it'd be a painful cut.

 

[DiamondFox]

Am I the only one feeling that Ganondorf isn't guarantee to come back to SSB4? We have no information on whenever or not he'll be in The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Swords and if he isn't in, I'm getting the feeling that they may be trying to give Ganondorf the boot next time because he is pretty much a full clone of Captain Falcon and a poor one at it which then they'll replace it with another Zelda villain.

I would hate for that to happen, but just keep in mind that I have a feeling that we could be seeing at least one "painful" cut. Granted, I doubt we'll have to see that in SSB4, but I still think it's possible.

Ganondorf only doesn't have a moveset because Sakurai is an idiot, and he could easily be given one any time Sakurai chooses to do so. All other Zelda villians have been episodic (I don't care if Vaati comes back), and that won't change with Ghirahim. Sakurai also has an obligatory quota of Zelda characters to meet considering the importance of the series, and it's pretty much impossible to meet without Ganondorf considering how few good characters the series has.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I think he's too important to Zelda's history to cut him, especially after being in Melee and Brawl. I don't see him being cut - even if he's not in Skyward Sword. You're right though it'd be a painful cut.

Also... Sheik happens.

:D

(In case some of you don't get it... Don't you remember "Sheik isn't in TP, she's not getting in"?)
Plus, we have Ocarina of Time 3DS now. The least we could have about it is OoT Ganondorf back with an original moveset.

 

[BirthNote]

Whoah, K.Rool was not hard in DKC. It was a memorable fight because of the amazing music and kredits. He was a difficult master in DKC2; its easy to see if you compare the fights. DKC3's fight is harder than the 1st game but not the 2nd's, and DK64's was very silly.

Yeah I don't agree that Melee's problems were solved by Smash. But I agree with a lot on your list.

What Brawl Fixed

Spoiler

-I agreen that there was a problem with clones and Brawl did a good job in fixing that.

-Also the level representation was a lot better than Melee

What Brawl Didn't fix or made worst

Spoiler

- The overall physics made the game slower more "floaty". This is kind of a trade off because it made brawl easier to learn the Melee but less exciting. Also slower characters (e.g. Ganondorf) were hurt real bad in it.

- The character tier was more broad then Melee and it was virtually impossible to win with some characters (e.g. Ganondorf, Link, Bowser) even casually.

- CPU in Brawl was much harder than Melee cpu. They would gang up on you even though they were not on teams. You can test this by having a four person match and just try to stay away from them. They won't fight each other and just go after you.

I also see some bias to your statement too. You seem to not like moving or active stages. That is more of a preference then a problem.

I'm unsure about your opinion on Melee's character recovery. Are the characters metion ones that have poor UpB recovery? Because most of them have very good recovery. In fact Peach was design to be a recovery expert and her UpB is one of the best recovers in the game.

LOL, for the most part I do like moving stages, but I understand why people would find Big Blue and Poke Floats (some of my favorites) frustrating. I'm 50/50 with Rainbow Cruise, but its nowhere near my first choice. I also fight on many active stages as well; its just that Summit has no grabbable ledges and the water is deadly, Skyworld can lose its ledges and you can get spiked through the clouds, and Pokemon Stadium 2 can be annoying when it actiivates the treadmills or the light gravity. And I agree about the CPUs. Its like they're competing with each other to kill you.

EDIT: About recoveries, I meant the characters that are guaranteed to return after being thrown very far. Roughly 8/25 characters who have a good UpB is a bit of a problem

 

[OmegaXXII]

Whoah, K.Rool was not hard in DKC. It was a memorable fight because of the amazing music and kredits. He was a difficult master in DKC2; its easy to see if you compare the fights. DKC3's fight is harder than the 1st game but not the 2nd's, and DK64's was very silly.....

KRool was definetly a force to be reckoned with in he DKC games, plus he's always been an antagonist, if he was was excluded fron DK Returns, his chances are still quite good, even I'd Dixie's are a bit better.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Anyway, regarding retro characters, I don't see how it's such a taboo. Nintendo likes its retro franchises, they're even bringing some classics back in pseudo-3D 8-bit/16-bit style for the 3DS. And it's still advertising.

While overcrowding a single franchise with characters isn't exactly advertising anything other than the same franchises as always. There's room for everyone, and I'm sure by now the "big" franchises suggestions are almost scrapping the bottom of the barrel by now. (Be honest... Waluigi? Just because he can fill a 4P plumber battle?)

I have nothing against most suggestions. But we shouldn't dispose of retro characters just because.. well, they haven't had a game done in some time. Samus got another game, Pit got another game, who knows who'll be next?

Some popular franchises being underrepresented is also a valid argument. ONE Metroid character for example, is pretty insulting. 2 DK characters... hmm.. Ok, maybe you're right here too.

And "Retro" is anything but a generalized franchise. Each retro character is an individual, standalone, MAIN protagonist. It isn't fair to bag them all together under the category "retro characters".

 

[DiamondFox]

Whoah, K.Rool was not hard in DKC. It was a memorable fight because of the amazing music and kredits. He was a difficult master in DKC2; its easy to see if you compare the fights. DKC3's fight is harder than the 1st game but not the 2nd's, and DK64's was very silly.

You forget, we are comparing him to the likes of other Nintendo villians.

Bowser:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrnmVjllV_M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlzPoXCFWAQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fYGYljLmV4

Ganondorf:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O33Xybjegtc&feature=player_embedded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFHT4Y6-UMk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx0Yfg6EasQ

Dedede:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHUKqza-DCs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzDeWvWQ-FU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXTCIzwjmnY

Those three make K. Rool look like something out of I Wanna Be the Guy in comparison.

 

[OmegaXXII]

...regards of those other villains, I believe K.Rool should be given a shot and can be taken seriously just as much as Bowser and Ganon.

 

[DiamondFox]

...regards of those other villains, I believe K.Rool should be given a shot and can be taken seriously just as much as Bowser and Ganon.

I was downplaying the other villians by linking pathetically easy boss battles - giving him points for not sinking down to their incredibly low levels.

 

[TBone06]

I was downplaying the other villians by linking pathetically easy boss battles - giving him points for not sinking down to their incredibly low levels.

Yeah I remember when I was young and K Rool would take forever to beat. I still remember in DKC1 when you beat him and the credits start rolling, and then he comes back. He's definitely right up there with Bowser/Ganondorf/Dedede/Wolf. Metroid and Donkey Kong deserve a villain. Ridley and K. Rool fit the bills.

 

[Pieman0920]

Wait, what does boss difficulty have to do with anything here? >_>

@Diamond Fox:
No, the blunderbuss isn't enough. Its could be used for a special or two, or maybe a special and a smash, but seeing as it isn't a signature weapon or anything (and its not versatile enough to do all too many moves) its would be out of place to make for it alone to justify an inclusion.

And I never argued that K.Rool doesn't have moves, or whatever you're going by with moveset pottential there, but rather K. Rool doesn't do anything interesting. Now you can argue against that, since what is and what isn't interesting is all relative, but that'd just be pointless, like a rebuttle for my requested explanation. You bad mouthing me or Sakurai or Ganondorf or whoever, isnt going to change my opinion there. What could change my opinion is if K.Rool showed off something new and interesting, but seeing the curent state of the DK series, that may take a while. :/

 

[DiamondFox]

Wait, what does boss difficulty have to do with anything here? >_>

@Diamond Fox:
No, the blunderbuss isn't enough. Its could be used for a special or two, or maybe a special and a smash, but seeing as it isn't a signature weapon or anything (and its not versatile enough to do all too many moves) its would be out of place to make for it alone to justify an inclusion.

And I never argued that K.Rool doesn't have moves, or whatever you're going by with moveset pottential there, but rather K. Rool doesn't do anything interesting. Now you can argue against that, since what is and what isn't interesting is all relative, but that'd just be pointless, like a rebuttle for my requested explanation. You bad mouthing me or Sakurai or Ganondorf or whoever, isnt going to change my opinion there. What could change my opinion is if K.Rool showed off something new and interesting, but seeing the curent state of the DK series, that may take a while. :/

I was debating K. Rool not being generic for a Nintendo character, because your post was mostly just going on about how generic he was. That isn't exactly a matter of SSB4 likelihood.

If you do indeed want to talk about his Smash 4 chances, DKCR has made the DK series much more relevant than it was during Brawl's developtime cycle, and considering how terrible a lot of the other newcomer choices are DK is due for a 3rd rep. It doesn't particularly matter that Rool wasn't in DKCR when no new viable SSB4 candidates were introduced inside it, and his only competition, Dixie, wasn't in it either.

As for K. Rool vs Dixie, Dixie was only going to be in Brawl as a Nana for Diddy Kong.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=144627 (Copypasta the Japanese text at the start into google for more results)

She wasn't ever seriously considered as her own character, and seeing Sakurai isn't uncloning freaking -Ganondorf- just because he doesn't want to alienate former Ganon mains, he's not going to bog Diddy's moveset down by tacking on Dixie. Her chance to get in with Diddy was Brawl, and it's past.

Now that we've destroyed that stupid forbidden 7 rumor, K. Rool is much more important to the series than Dixie. Dixie was demoted down to Waluigi's level after the death of the SNES, never appearing in a remotely meaningful role ever again.

 

[OmegaXXII]

You are wanting to see something new out of K.Rool correct? Well I believe that if he is to make his grand appearance in Smash he would definetly show off any 'new' things that he would offer along with his series of classic moves, he doesn't have to be in something recent in order for you to expect something new and different from a said character.

 

[Pieman0920]

You are wanting to see something new out of K.Rool correct? Well I believe that if he is to make his grand appearance in Smash he would definitely show off any 'new' things that he would offer along with his series of classic moves, he doesn't have to be in something recent in order for you to expect something new and different from a said character.

I don't see why he'd have anything new. I don't like them, but K.Rool has other moves, and there's really no need to make up anything with him.

@DiamondFox: I was saying why I thought K.Rool was generic because I was requested to explain my opinion. Your reply to that isn't going to change said opinion, and most people don't think the way I do about the character, so it doesn't seem necessary to make a response. Heck, its not like I said my perception of him being generic limited his chances for Smash 4 there. :V

And in my opinion, DK isn't due for a third character because I think its struck its balance like Kirby has. I'd love for Funky to be in, and if I had my way I'd add him, but I know that's not in the cards. I'm indifferent about Dixie, and slightly prefer her to K.Rool, but I don't think she's making it in either. Also, I'd say your logic behind Dixie's exclusion is flawed, considering how you don't know how she was to be implemented, but I don't want to discuss it. Personally though, I believe she was partnered with Diddy, yet had her own moveset at the same time, and worked like the pair did in DKC2. But like I said, I don't really want to get into it, because I don't/can't know the specifics, but then again neither can you.

 

[SteliKingOfSpeed]

*raises hand

To the above, and the above! *Agrees!*

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Ehhh... Waluigi is just one of those characters that are annoy me. Simlarly to Bowser Jr., that is why my Mario character of choice is Paper Mario.

Waluigi is deliberately a spin-off character, while Bowser Jr. actually had mainstream appearances. Mario is already in the roster, so Paper Mario is heavily redundant.

Mine too. The concept sucks but his personality is awesome.

I also think he should be in WarioWare. That much, I made him a new design.

Spoiler

​

Wario's WarioWare appearance seems to be based on a biker. I felt Waluigi needed an appearance that had that edginess as well, without being a biker too. I once read this article about Foreman Spike from Nintendo's Wrecking Crew '98, and that he appeared to be the prototype of Wario and Waluigi. This rumor is also fueled by Waluigi's DS kart, the Gold Mantis. So I decided that he had to have some similarities to him. Ta-dah! Hope you like.

That's a rather funny depiction of Waluigi's WarioWare outfit. Though I don't see him being sleeveless.

Am I the only one feeling that Ganondorf isn't guarantee to come back to SSB4? We have no information on whenever or not he'll be in The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Swords and if he isn't in, I'm getting the feeling that they may be trying to give Ganondorf the boot next time because he is pretty much a full clone of Captain Falcon and a poor one at it which then they'll replace it with another Zelda villain.

I would hate for that to happen, but just keep in mind that I have a feeling that we could be seeing at least one "painful" cut. Granted, I doubt we'll have to see that in SSB4, but I still think it's possible.

Being a major villain, I highly doubt that Ganondorf will get the boot. Booting him would be like booting Bowser after all.

 

[Pieman0920]

Ganondorf isn't going anywhere. If anything there is the excuse that he just showed up in that OoT remake, and if the Pokemon remakes were a good enough excuse to bring in PT, then the OoT remake is a good enough excuse to keep Ganondorf there. Plus, its not like he's a complete clone anyways.

 

[SteliKingOfSpeed]

Being a major villain, I highly doubt that Ganondorf will get the boot. Booting him would be like booting Bowser after all.

But, what could be the Painful cut, I'd say ROB?! Or I did in my roster below anyways, but he is so influencial On gaming! :D

 

[shinhed-echi]

Being a major villain, I highly doubt that Ganondorf will get the boot. Booting him would be like booting Bowser after all.[/SIZE][/FONT]

This is what I'm saying. Sheik was far less important to the overall series, and while she didn't even appear in Twilight Princess, she was designed as if she were going to appear in it, and got into Brawl.

I think importance to the Smash Bros. franchise counts by a lot too... It's the only reason to explain why Jigglypuff has stayed till this very day.

 

[Kantrip]

The stupidity in here....

Moveset potential? Captain Falcon.

Needs to be unique? Doctor Mario.

Size an issue? Olimar.

Needs to be relevant? All retro characters.

Must be popular? More retro characters.

Needs to be important to Nintendo? Snake.

Seriously, everyone seems to think they know Sakurai's inclusion criteria when they don't. Instead of trying to make arguments for why your character deserves to be in the next Smash game, let's just keep the conversation to the purpose of this thread. Until more details are revealed, we know very little. It's all good and fine to talk about K. Rool, Ridley, Bowser Junior, Toad, Professor Layton, Tingle, who have you! But please stop the idiocy and conceit. You don't know what's happening.

 

[shinhed-echi]

The stupidity in here....

Moveset potential? Captain Falcon.

Needs to be unique? Doctor Mario.

Size an issue? Olimar.

Needs to be relevant? All retro characters.

Must be popular? More retro characters.

Needs to be important to Nintendo? Snake.

Seriously, everyone seems to think they know Sakurai's inclusion criteria when they don't. Instead of trying to make arguments for why your character deserves to be in the next Smash game, let's just keep the conversation to the purpose of this thread. Until more details are revealed, we know very little. It's all good and fine to talk about K. Rool, Ridley, Bowser Junior, Toad, Professor Layton, Tingle, who have you! But please stop the idiocy and conceit. You don't know what's happening.

Wise words, fellow smasher, wise words. We will never know what's going on through Sakurai's head, nor where his decisions come from. All we can do is wish and comment on what is revealed.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

But, what could be the Painful cut, I'd say ROB?! Or I did in my roster below anyways, but he is so influencial On gaming! :D

Lucario is probably one of the candidates most likely to get the boot. Bye-bye Lucario, hello Zoroark.

 

[DiamondFox]

@DiamondFox: I was saying why I thought K.Rool was generic because I was requested to explain my opinion. Your reply to that isn't going to change said opinion, and most people don't think the way I do about the character, so it doesn't seem necessary to make a response. Heck, its not like I said my perception of him being generic limited his chances for Smash 4 there. :V

Well, considering some of the posters in this thread, I wouldn't of been surprised if you were going to argue against him specifically because of being generic.

Also, I'd say your logic behind Dixie's exclusion is flawed, considering how you don't know how she was to be implemented, but I don't want to discuss it. Personally though, I believe she was partnered with Diddy, yet had her own moveset at the same time, and worked like the pair did in DKC2. But like I said, I don't really want to get into it, because I don't/can't know the specifics, but then again neither can you.

I just find it difficult to believe that they would bother giving her a unique moveset if she wasn't going to have her own slot. It seems like a waste, much less when the idea is that it'd play more like an actual tag team than a generic transformation.

Needs to be relevant? All retro characters.

Must be popular? More retro characters.

Direct me to examples that are -not- retro characters. Retro characters are specifically included because they are retro as an obligatory tradition of Sakurai's.

 

[SteliKingOfSpeed]

Lucario is probably one of the candidates most likely to get the boot. Bye-bye Lucario, hello Zoroark.

Yeah I predicted that, but Could there e a unlikely cut?! That's what I meant?!

 

[DiamondFox]

Lucario is probably one of the candidates most likely to get the boot. Bye-bye Lucario, hello Zoroark.

Because clearly Pokemon is going to have 4 slots straight for 3 games. Mario and Zelda are getting 5, Pokemon has no reason not to keep Lucario. It's not like the Pokemon company specifically forced Sakurai to exclude Mewtwo in Brawl what with the forbidden 7, they just forced him to include Lucario.

He's the likliest character to go, but that's not saying much.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Do we know for certain that they'll be cutting characters? For all we know, they still have everything from Brawl intact, and they'll be doing a lot of character porting from Brawl to SSB4. Heck, by now maybe they even got to port characters from Melee too.

I'll wait until official announcements to start saying "x" or "y" characters should be removed/will most likely be removed.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Because clearly Pokemon is going to have 4 slots straight for 3 games. Mario and Zelda are getting 5, Pokemon has no reason not to keep Lucario. It's not like the Pokemon company specifically forced Sakurai to exclude Mewtwo in Brawl what with the forbidden 7, they just forced him to include Lucario.

He's the likliest character to go, but that's not saying much.

Probably, but most of the Brawl fighters likely to get cut are Pokemon related. I did mention Solid Snake as well, but that's just me; by my visuals, seeing someone from an M-rated series in Smash Bros. is just pretty strange.

 

[Kantrip]

Alright, if retro characters are Sakurai's tradition, who was the retro added in Brawl? Was it ROB or Pit? I'd be inclined to say ROB. Pit was thrown in because his series was planned to be revived. Before Brawl, however, we didn't know this. Pit's inclusion was out of the blue; he was not relevant, and he was practically forgotten over the years.

 

[Pieman0920]

I just find it difficult to believe that they would bother giving her a unique moveset if she wasn't going to have her own slot. It seems like a waste, much less when the idea is that it'd play more like an actual tag team than a generic transformation.

...What?

Zelda and Shiek share a slot. Samus and ZSS share a slot. PT's Pokemon share a slot. They all have different movesets.

Alright, if retro characters are Sakurai's tradition, who was the retro added in Brawl? Was it ROB or Pit? I'd be inclined to say ROB. Pit was thrown in because his series was planned to be revived. Before Brawl, however, we didn't know this. Pit's inclusion was out of the blue; he was not relevant, and he was practically forgotten over the years.

I don't think there's any evidence that when Brawl started development that a new Kid Icarus was planned. Unless I'm mistaken, Sakurai said he had the choice between several franchises to work with on the 3DS and chose Pit due to the updated design that he had to give him.