MLG x Australia

[Dekar289]

bet you're excited m2k, more money to wipe your arse with

 

[Bsrk_]

A standardized ruleset was brought up not to long ago and people seemed to disagree with this_ Unless you're suggesting rules only and not stages_ I assumed that everyone used the same rules but stages was the glaring issue here_

 

[MTGod]

Stages I believe aren't necessary to create a standardised list - SBR has done a great job IMO in categorising stages whilst leaving TOs enough room to experiment and create with their scene... For attracting people (as said a while ago by I think Trav or Mic?) a more liberal stage list would be more appealing, however if the tournament was a major or a national event we'd want to make sure our stage list will be in support of good playing, not only from a player's point of view but from the spectators who want to see amazing smash being played (and not people dying from bombs exploding )

A ruleset though should be standardised, and as you sorta said I think the majority of Australian tournaments are using a similar ruleset already, it's just the finer details that need to be worked on...

 

[luke_atyeo]

we already use a standard ruleset pretty much, the only things that change from tourney to tourney are levels and the ledge grab rule

 

[Dekar289]

but from the spectators who want to see amazing smash being played (and not people dying from bombs exploding

you don't add uncompetitive stages because competitive stages = boring campy matches

"amazing smash being played" in brawl is campy and often lots of people find it very boring (some like it though), that's just the way competitive brawl is, if you don't like it... play melee B)

 

[Pete278]

Big Blue would make all Brawl matches more exciting by having more awesome music.

EDIT: But seriously, a standardized stage list/full ruleset for majors used on the Australia Major Smash Circuit (better name pending) would make competitive Smash -much- easier to advertise, bring in better revenue for the tops, and basically make everything easier/better on a self-referential cycle. I approve and will do anything I can to support it.

 

[megapup]

Heaps of people own brawl and would play competitively but don't know about it.
I played melee for 6 years before I realised people played it competitively, and a further 2 years before I found out that people played it competitively in Australia, near me, with tournaments I could actually go to.

Just let people know about the competitive scene and it will grow!!!!!!!!

 

[Mic_128]

Just to keep this thread from getting sidetracked, lets try and keep the specifics (ie, stage debate) in another thread.

 

[CAOTIC]

I have significant exposure to both the Australian and American scenes, so I'm well positioned to answer Gords' question. Earlier in this thread, Syke and Dekar made a connection with Genesis' turnout (400+ attendance) to the size of America's Smash community, and compared this to Rocky's turnout against the size of the Australian community. This is not a clear indication of Australia doing well for itself (in comparison to America), as I will explain below.

The turnout for Genesis (or any other US major) is influenced by the sheer number of large scale tournaments in the United States that are often in competition with each other. Genesis had approximately 20 East Coast players that represented, when the collective power of the entire US east coast is well over that. With big tournaments like Apex, Genesis, the entire suite of MLGs, Cataclysms, Pounds and the former FC, OC and MOAST series, competitive players tend to stick to their own regions and only fly out occasionally - it is too much to attend every large event in the US. Additionally, by virtue of competition between TOs and their tournaments, no US tournament has a monopoly on all of the Smashers, nor are they ever able to successfully capture all 4 major regions of the US (EC/WC/MW/South). Furthermore, MLG tours the US; they go to the competitive regions to visit the gaming communities, and not the other way around.

This is completely different to Australia, where our existence largely requires all us to all band together; hence the importance and the extraordinary commitments made to attend only 1-2 majors, since that's all we can currently offer as a collective scene.

 

[CaLibUr_1337]

Well my local Gametraders were happy to hear what I had to say so they told me to email them the Tempest poster so they could print a better quality version. They said that they would hang it up in the Wii section where people would notice.

 

[Splice]

Well my local Gametraders were happy to hear what I had to say so they told me to email them the Tempest poster so they could print a better quality version. They said that they would hang it up in the Wii section where people would notice.

What a Pro.

@VIC: We should do this for EB Games near Flinders Station. Have we ever made a poster?

 

[Mic_128]

What a Pro.

@VIC: We should do this for EB Games near Flinders Station. Have we ever made a poster?

If you want anything in EB Games you have to contact their head office.

 

[Gords]

THanks Cao for the reply, i thought there was something i was missing since i found it very hard for me to believe that a scene could have so many well known names in the competitive scene over there if the scene itself was only drawing in 400 participants at one national.

you also mention that MLG move to the smash players instead of the other way around, will they do this here. also how big was the smash scene in america when MLG got involved with melee? and how has their smash scene changed cause of there involvement.

Cao i know you were involved in the scene over there early on, so how did the americans advertise there community before MLG/Evo to build it to a community that MLG/Evo were interested in supporting?

my point still stands though that we are going to need to target the casual audience that bought smash as a party game rather then a competitive or fighting game but enjoy it enough to attend a smash event.
these will need to be similar to those held by nintendo and advertised in a similar manner.

I dont think advertising the scene itself would do much but rather advertising a tournament, whether it be one like i mention above or a national such as rocky/robocop. this would target the casual gamer and the serious gamer respectively. By doing this you draw people in that are interested in Smash and promoting the community along side this event you encourage people to stay and become involved rather than just attending that tournament.

For advertising on this scale (since for a puiblic style event we would be aiming for 128+ numbers per event) have a Big name associated with us would help as people will recognise that it is a serious event. Even MLG where some of the people that dont know they exist will recognise that if an organisation called Major League Gaming is sponsering the event then it must be more professional than some guys hosting an event (which is the situation we have now by mentioning check this thread on this forum on smashbaords).

What else does MLG do in Australia by they way.

 

[S.D]

If we have a standard rule list used for major tournaments in the national circuit that is probably enough. I think that local tournaments should be able to tinker with rulesets in order to experiment and come up with alterations that are deemed appropriate for us. Having a standardised ruleset does not mean it has to be concrete and used infinitely in its original form, there is room for experimentation and change. Yes, little late to the party...

 

[Pete278]

I'm entirely against having a standard ruleset for locals, since it'll prevent any possible changes to the national stagelist. If its impossible to prove a stage should be banned/legal in a competitive environment, then nobody'll believe you on it.

Of course, the circuit should definitely have a unified ruleset, as it'll make competing in the circuit easier for people (i.e. don't have to get used to different counterpicks at some events), and give it a more official air.

 

[CAOTIC]

Do not de-rail the topic or post a short string of posts. Posts that are detailed and respond directly to the opening post will be the only posts accepted. I will delete everything else.

 

[swordsaint]

someone should start up a discussion thread pertaining to all the specifics to help get this running then

 

[pwnsweet]

Hi,

I've read through the whole thread and there are some very good ideas being brought to the table, some of which I've quoted below. The fact that MLG are expressing interest in Australia can only be a good thing. With MLG willing to back us, we have a rare opportunity to really get this community off the ground and into the limelight and I think we all need to discuss, unify and streamline the community as quickly and effective as possible so we don't pass up this tremendous opportunity.

I think there are two problems, shared with (almost) all of the community.

Size of events. Frequency of events.

And also, among others, the amount of prize money. The two problems you've illustrated are valid and increasing both the size and frequency of events will certainly help in bringing in people that play and attend these events for the community and fun aspect of Melee/Brawl.

However there are people that initially don't care so much about the community. They're indifferent to the game and find it neither fun nor boring to play. All they initially care about and what catches their eye is the $$$ signs that the winner gets. If there is a large enough prize pool, they'll be willing to fly in from interstate or even from overseas and they'll put in a real effort to practice and get better at the game. And, who knows, maybe they'll even begin to like the game and stick around and become involved in the community.

Whether we want these kinds of people in the scene or not is an issue that needs to be discussed at another time (although going by the fact that a person matching this profile was recently sponsored to participate at our next national major, it looks like there are some people that don't mind), but it's definitely something that I believe needs to be considered if growing the size of the community is desired.

For print magazines, Nintendo Australia would be a good start... Hyper and other X-console magazines would maybe work, but I have a feeling most people buy those magazines for the reviews, not so much for the latest news on competitive scenes...

But advertising in these magazines is not a lost cause and is still very much worthwhile. Whilst it's true that people may not be buying these magazines for the latest news on competitive scenes, advertising in these magazines will at least make people aware that the scene exists, which I believe is one of the big problems at the moment.

i have often thought about syke's point, that america has over 10x the population and so in comparison our scene is already huge, how many more people can we attract?

I think there's still a lot of room to grow. Take South Korea's gaming scene for example. Whilst this comparison will be crude and doesn't factor in all variables (specifically cultural values), we can directly compare both the size and demographics of the population. South Korea has almost 2.5x the population of Australia and according to the CIA World Factbook, a similar age demographic for 15-64 year olds. Whilst it's true that South Korea is likely to have a larger percentage of their 15-64 between the ages of 18 and 26 (the lower and upper quartile of the Melee/Brawl community) than Australia, the difference isn't enough to explain the fact that the South Korean gaming scene is much larger than 2.5x the Australian gaming scene.

I think one of the biggest issues we have here in Australia, and something we have limited control over is cultural values, but that discussion is for a different time.

The other thing is creating a community vibe_ Just going to throw this out there, but how about filming during large national events_ Kind of like a what's happening, chowing atmosphere, interviewing kind of thing_ I would love to do this for Robocop...etc

This is an excellent idea. I'll add by saying I think it would be a good idea to have a small stage set up at nationals like Robocop where the TO has a short interview with the winner and ask him/her some questions and give the winner a chance to thank people etc, kinda like shoutouts but not on the forums and to do it in a professional style. I also think it would be a great idea to have a few projectors set up during the tourny beaming Melee/Brawl combo vids and previous years finals matches on a long loop to show newcomers what's possible in terms of technical skill and mindgames.

A ruleset though should be standardised, and as you sorta said I think the majority of Australian tournaments are using a similar ruleset already, it's just the finer details that need to be worked on...

I agree. I think a standardized ruleset is of paramount importance. People like to know that the game they're playing and the rules they're using to play that game is the same as what everyone else is using. We're fortunate that, unlike Melee, the mechanics of Brawl is the same for each region and by implementing a standardized ruleset we reinforce the idea that the game and it's rules are the same wherever you go.

 

[Mic_128]

Something Sydney might want to look at doing next year is approaching the Sydney Gamers League about us running a tournament there.

http://www.kotaku.com.au/2010/07/sydney-gamers-league-revitalised/#more-401510