Make Your Move 27: Voting Open!

FrozenRoy · Aug 6, 2024

And with that...

Make Your Move 27's submission period has ended! Reading shall now commence!

We're going to be doing something a bit different this contest, so please pay attention. Given how much we've ended up extending anyway and how people sometimes found it...discouraging, this time we're starting with a long reading period with the plan to have it last a long time without extensions if possible. In this case, we are having it last all the way to November 21st, a week before Thanksgiving. Hey, you can go bring the Top 50 to the dinner table that holiday season. Make it a conversation point.

I realize as I make this post we didn't have an exact divide for reading / voting period so I'll have to edit that in. As usual I, FrozenRoy, will be the vote guru this contest, and this time around I'll be joined by thread OP n88 as the other vote guru!

UserShadow7989 · Aug 6, 2024

Important Update: Jamcon Voting extended indefinitely; get to reading!

Katapultar · Aug 6, 2024

Angwitch is a summon-based set, which is fitting for a Yu-Gi-Oh! character but not something you see prominently on monsters. Rather than go the Ferrijit or Saori route where you have to protect your summons, Angwitch puts a villainous twist on the archetype in which she can damage her summons and benefit from destroying them! It reminds me of older MYM minion sets like Romero, so it’s really nice to see revisited here. Taking the souls of your minions for your nefarious deeds also reminds me of Don Thousand’s Final Smash where he summons the Barian Emperors and takes their souls to power himself when they’re defeated. In fact, the whole concept of killing your summons for a big pay-off, whereby you can’t use them before then, and having to prevent your opponent from killing them is really cool.

Neutral Special is essentially a Phantom Slash style move that summons a Ganondorf-like minion to perform a budget version of Ganondorf’s Forward Smash. The minion mechanics are good, and Dark Blade being a meat shield against projectiles seems fair when the other summons don’t really do this. The various mix-ups of the charge-based attacks Dark Blade has access to are simple but satisfying in a way that’s perfect for this set given it’s not the main hook.
Goblin has a pretty wild/high potential attack animation for a minion thanks to that teleporting. A minion with the ability to teleport their victim to another minion is very cool! Also has a good dynamic of being a weak minion that’s easy for both you and your opponent to kill, but the latter technically has something of an advantage given that Goblin is sent away from you on summon. Likewise, Key Mace being able to teleport victims to Angwitch for combos is fun.
Up Special makes it increasingly obvious that sending your monsters to the graveyard (or just having them killed by opponents) results on Angwitch losing out on neutral tools and her recovery if she’s holding out for her big reward. There’s a very fun dynamic of Up Special being super good, but effectively having an artificial “cooldown” due to the minion mechanics behind it.
Going off on a tangent here, I like the villainous characterization behind Angwitch, as depicted in her summoning and idle animations.
Mystical Sheep utilizing hypnosis reminds me of Rocket Executive Hugo, even if the mechanics behind their hypnotism are entirely different. No mind control here, as fun as that would be for synergizing with the minion-based aspect of this set. Putting your opponent to sleep still leaves them open for minion fun and big-brained combos, though. Glad to see that one of the minions in this set technically does not produce a hitbox, limiting Angwitch from overwhelming her opponents even if she has Dark Blade, Tatsunootoshigo and Mystic Sheep all out at once. It’s also opposite to the other minions where the sheep is easy to kill, and having it out of play isn’t a huge deal for Angwitch.

And now to the main part of the moveset! It turns out that Angwitch is a mega-minion set, which is particularly exciting here because she has to jump through a lot of hoops to actually get her minion rather than access it from the start like Syndrome. This reminds me a lot of the aforementioned Don Thousand, a set that I was a huge fan of back in the day. It’s just very cool to see a new take on a summonable boss in a modern set, alongside Baron Mordo from MYM25. Ghost Mace’s targeting effect vaguely reminds me of some old 3v1 boss sets, which is fitting when we have Hypah invoking old MYM to make 3v1 modes again. Making Tecuhtlica function like a Smash boss is all fine, and the set naturally doesn’t hyper-focus on positioning or controlling the boss with non-Specials like older MYM sets did. Key Mace does all that for you in one attack.

“If the blasts hit a foe or the ground, they will create an explosion that expands out 1.5x Bowser’s size and lasts for 8 seconds for the same damage and knockback as the blast itself.” I assume the blast lasting for 8 seconds is a typo? That’s a very long time if it does, and potentially exploitable where Angwitch could hide inside the blast since she and the boss can’t hurt each other.
Bold of you to give Tecuhtlica an attack that can generate a blast zone on the ground to instantly kill opponents.
Heh, 7 seconds is a hilariously long time to be in stun for if Tecuhtlica dies.

Moving past Tecuhtlica, the Smashes get into some fun minion interactions where Angwitch benefits from harming one of her minions to boost her attack. F-Smash is a rush that can burst in and stack by killing lots of minions, while U-Smash can be used to protect them and trap both opponents and a minion so you can hit them both at the same time. D-Smash is a funny little input that can set one of your GY monsters as a trap, and gets fun mindgame potential when you have multiple monsters in the graveyard and can threaten different directions with the coverage they possess.
Sudden thought, but perhaps the generic ghosts used in Tecuhtlica’s attacks and Angwitch’s Jab could in fact be the classic monster card Souls of the Forgotten. The ability to customize the knockback of a Jab finisher using monsters in your graveyard is quite a unique idea.
I like F-tilt’s attack name. The sweetspot’s pseudo-tether application of flying with your opponent is sweet, and reminds me how I’ve used the idea in my own sets. This set puts an extra twist on the idea by letting you hit your minions to go flying with them, so it makes sense why it’s not on a throw.
U-tilt is another move that uses your graveyard in a cool way, a Volcano Kick style move that gets faster the more monsters you have dead. It reminds me of a ForwardArrow move. Also nice that U-tilt isn’t a reliable anti-air so Angwitch has some holes in her defense for how strong she can be.
D-throw is enticing for how it plays into Angwitch’s main mechanics and lets her get Tecuhtlica out without having all her monsters in the graveyard. Might also be worth noting that Angwitch is not invincible when using her throws on her summons, as iirc fighters are invincible while they’re performing their throws.

Angwitch’s minions and boss concepts are great fun, and make for what might be the most over-the-top set you’ve posted. I do have some uncertainties with Tecuhtlica, however. Using 50/50 RNG to determine one of 2 or 3 attacks Tecuhtlica will use for each attack phase is faithful to how bosses work in Smash, but it does make the boss gameplay less consistent than I would like and feel is necessary. This is especially the case when a number of attacks hit a random part of the stage and can make foes panic big-time when they already have to deal with Angwitch.

I think it would be better if Tecuhtlica had a more fixed attack pattern and more consistent hitbox placements - it would make it easier for both players to plan around what Tecuhtlica will do next, noting that Angwitch still has a massive advantage in this situation when she owns the boss. It does feel a bit too much right now, especially when Angwitch gets a sizable number of buffs to her moveset when Tecuhtlica is in play. This is tricky, as I know Angwitch does have to put a massive amount of legwork into summoning Tecuhtlica and suffers an enormous penalty if the boss is killed, so you could easily argue that it balances itself out. Not to mention Angwitch could just choose to not summon Tecuhtlica at all and still have a solid moveset to play around with.

I think it largely comes down to the fact that a fighter who gets such an enormously powerful minion as their big reward might be too inherently oppressive and unfun to fight in practice, compared to if the big reward was just a one-time insta-kill move or a superpowered state, an issue that is probably baked into the boss concept. It reminds me of qualms I had with Syndrome where the boss initially felt too powerful and dominating. I can’t quite call Angwitch one of your best, but she still had a lot of great things, and I can safely say that she is in SV tier for me this contest.

Surprise last day WCF set! Wasn’t expecting this, but the character does make sense for you.
Footstool jumping on Toads is a little confusing. The set implies that footstool jumping on a Toad uses one up but gives you one back, but it would make more sense if footstool jumping on one used it up given the benefits that footstool jumping offers. I’m also unsure how footstool jumping on a Toad is initiated - if they are always following Toadette, doesn’t that mean that just jumping in general would result in automatically footstool jumping on a Toad? I might be missing something here, though.
Wasn’t expecting a duplicate-producing attack in this set! This set puts a unique twist on the genre by making the clone’s attacks all deal 1% apiece, but still the same amount of knockback and hitstun. The double focuses more on doubling and expending from Toadette’s resource of Toad fans, but the idea of having to play around with a clone that’s positioned behind you feels more interesting conceptually. Being able to throw the cherry to duplicate an onstage Toad and double down on his hitboxes is interesting, too.
Bit of a contradiction on Up Special where it says that both trampolines stay out, but the previous paragraph states that making a second trampoline makes the first one disappear. I assume it’s the former case with this moveset. A nice Pac-Man Up Special style move, though, especially when combined with Toad bouncing.

The grab game is fairly simple in general, even with the Toad resource mechanic, but D-throw stands out for the fact that you can use the bouncing Toads as footstools to follow your airborne opponent!
Using Toads to move your F-Smash papercraft construct forward does seem like a small reward for gathering Toads, but it does seem useful for turning the papercraft into a pseudo-projectile to attack enemies from a distance.
U-Smash makes surprisingly decent use of your Toads and even your clone to cover the airspace behind you. I could see a scenario where Toadette uses a Toad to reduce her U-Smash’s starting lag while the fake’s start-up is not decreased, resulting in their hitbox having a slight delay.
D-Smash is a simple enough move that’s your most direct way of getting a big power move from gathering lots of Toads.
Toadette’s B-air does a hilariously high amount of damage for a move that uses pigtails.
The Aerials are all pretty decent and fit into Toadette’s gameplan, but I like D-air for its aerial reversal situation, and its synergy with Up Special’s trampolines where you can cancel your plummet and bounce up to continue assaulting your opponent!
I like Samus style Jabs that aren’t guaranteed, but are powerful in exchange.

While Toadette has some fun to her, being made quickly means she naturally lacks spice in certain areas, and parts that could do with more clarification and synergy with the set’s overall gameplan. For instance, I’m not sure how using Toads to give your F-Smash papercraft more range fits into Toadette’s Golden Mushroom/platformer-based offensive gameplan, and Neutral Special doesn’t go into potential gameplay applications of Toadette’s Neutral Special options despite Neutral Special generally being the “main” input of a moveset.

Rychu · Aug 6, 2024

Friedrich der Große by

Arctic Tern

And thus it came to be, and so we begin with the Gacha Shipgirl Moveset Thoughtcrimes: a big, slow heavyweight battleship mommy based on a proposed Nazi warship and classical music. Insane. I'm going to make a set specifically that creates water to drown opponents just for her.

The alternating attack mode mechanic is an interesting one, and incredibly unique. I'm not sure I've seen anything quite like it outside of, like, my own Two-Face moveset from 2 contests ago that did something far less committal. I understand its a translation of an ability in her home game, but it does end up giving her a "master strategist" feel right off the bat which is very fun to read, though I confess that I could literally never wrap my head around this sort of thing as a player. She's an absolute monster of a stage controller, but I think you make some smart choices that keep her from feeling too in control, like the way SSPec must all go boom at once, or how her INSANE superarmor buff cumulatively takes damage, making it actually feasible that an opponent could potentially pepper their way through it even though she's going to be realistically living for a long, long time due to her sheer thiccness and the fairly versatile recovery she has, even if her recovery is quite laggy. Point is, as far as heavies go, she's got survivability.

The moves tend to get less insane as the moveset goes on, which is appreciated as I don't think my poor little heart could handle 2 movesets worth of insanity for that long. What that ends up accomplishing is that Friedrich has a very strong and somewhat complex base and relatively simple to understand tools with which to interact with said base which I think is a very good way for a set to go. That's not to say it doesn't have insane stuff in the standards, I'm particularly fond of being able to ride on her projectile Dash Attack to be able to both move faster than she normally could and turn her massive frame into a moving hitbox for instance, but there is an intentionality in the design that keeps it from being too insane or keeps her from being a jack of all trades and master of all trades also. The stances switching between a hard hitting heavyweight with insane stage control potential and an even harder hitting but usually slower heavyweight with even better stage control almost feels like a balancing act in itself, and actually emphasizes her inherent flaws which, to me, makes for more interesting moveset design than a character who can just "gacha" every move an opponent makes.

Yeah, i'm a fan. Dumb boat girls. S. You get an S.

Mauga and Torbjorn by

tunz

So, right off the bat, before getting into the movesets themselves, I do have a bit of a writing criticism here for Mauga and Torbjorn. Mainly, that while your writing has a very appealing casual and sort of "stream of consciousness" vibe to it, I do think we could do a bit in the way of organizing the information, as well as easily rectifying some minor general writing mistakes. To wit, as an example, on its surface, Mauga's neutral special is a fairly straightforward move to grasp: tap the button, and after 30 frames Mauga will fire his incendiary chaingun. Hold the button for the duration of the starting lag, and he'll instead fire the volatile chaingun. If you double-tap and hold, he'll fire both at the same time. The chainguns have a range of about a battlefield platform, fire for 3 seconds or until the special button is pressed again, and he can walk and jump once while they're firing.

Of course, there's more information afterwards, but the information is conveyed just out of order enough, along with several instances of repeated information (and the occasional very understandable grammatical mistake) made this fairly simple attack (and a few others) a bit hard to parse and required me to reread them several times to make sure I was getting it - this is something I noticed in Torb as well, and I don't want to bog down 2 comments talking about it. I'd recommend in the future doing the little trick of rereading what you've written out loud to yourself - you would be surprised how much you catch in terms of readability by doing this. Heck, I'm doing it right now, as I write this comment. I don't want to harp on this, but I felt it necessary to mention in at least a bit in this comment, as I genuinely did find myself not fully understanding some of the move descriptions without having to go over paragraphs several times throughout both sets.

Onto the movesets themselves, starting with Mauga, much like the aforementioned Neutral Special, Mauga is extremely straightforward, and seems to be a pretty direct translation of his Overwatch ability list into Smash. Not that there's anything wrong with that - after reading a more complex set, simplicity is nice to come to. I will say there are a few concepts that feel a bit underexplained here and there - mostly in the Down Special, which I assume is a direct translation of his Overwatch ability. I'm assuming what "20% damage resistance and 20% lifesteal" means is that for 5 seconds, he only takes 80% of whatever damage is incoming and heals the equivalent of a fifth of whatever damage he deals? If so, I do think that's a cool way to implement a very survivable heavy into smash, though in all honesty it might not even be too altogether useful - I think you could make this more powerful, is what I'm saying. The aura only lasts for 5 seconds, and as a laggy bruiser he's going to be able to deal, maybe, 3 hits in that time if you're lucky. Assuming he uses his most powerful attack, which is the double-fired minigun, and connects with everything, he's going to heal for a whopping 8% and be able to possibly take, like 8% instead of 10% on incoming attacks. That 20% is a lifesaver in a team game where you're dealing with hundreds of points of damage and potentially blocking that damage for several teammates, sure, but it's a bit underwhelming. Torb is a lot of the same - there's a very strict adherence to Overwatch with very little variation in this - in fact, you specifically call out in both movesets where you need to come up with something original and seem to loathe to do it.

There's obviously a lot of passion here for Overwatch as a series, but I do think that strict adherence can be a negative sometimes. What we end up with here are 2 sets that are flawed in almost the exact same way, because they're not really tuned in to be "Smash movesets" they're really Overwatch ability lists that are superimposed over a smash bros moveset. On top of the occasional hard time reading the sets with the problems mentioned before, there also tends to just be some information missing or very briefly thrown in as an afterthought - exact frame data isn't necessary, but if you're gonna do it for some moves you might as well do it for all of them, none of your Smash attacks indicate tapped or charged damage and knockback and some of the numbers are big enough that I genuinely cannot tell which its supposed to be, and so on.

Am I a fan of these? No. Do I think they're the worst things ever? Also no, though I can't imagine I'll be referring back to them in almost any case. There's a tinge of creativity here, and I actually think some of the original stuff you come up with tends to be more fun that the obligatory Overwatch Ability Insertion into the sets. I'd encourage you to be a bit more explorative in your sets - we've all gotten caught up in trying to translate things 1-1 in movesets, and I think you'll find that when you instead try to distill the idea and essence of a character into a moveset rather than checking off a list of abilities, you'll come up with things that they maybe don't do in canon but feel right. It's all about interpretation! Unfortunately I'm giving both Mauga and Torb "D" grades, but not without the caveat that I think there's a ton of room for growth!

Pumpkinmon by

SaltySuicune

Pumpkinmon is a short, breezy, simple set that doesn't have much in the way of ambitious design goals, but because of that, manages to stay quite charming throughout. The fact that Pumpkinmon has an Axe special that doesn't act like the actual Axe special in smash because that kind of projectiles is already a Pumpkin is kind of funny to me, don't know why. I think the characterization throughout is great, this little creature being simultaneously adorable as heck and creepy as hell with his moves alternating between falling clumsily on his face and stabbing the opponent while twisting the knife and cackling. It's charming, and that charm is what carries the set.

Unfortunately, that's about the biggest positive I've got for Pumpkinmon, though its a big one. Pumpkinmon, in my opinion, doesn't really do anything wrong per se, but also doesn't necessarily do a ton exceptionally well, either. This is, in fact, a collection of moves that alternately show the various facets of Pumpkinmon's personality, but that's about all it is. There isn't really a hook, a central mechanic or a playstyle-defining move or set of moves that really define him. When I saw that big pumpkin, I thought for sure we were gonna have a big staying projectile or something that Pumpkinmon uses his other moves to knock around, or something, but really it's just a pretty normal projectile. Unfortunately, this leaves me leaving Pumpkinmon charmed by the cute creature, and little else. Pumpkinmon gets a "D", but not for lack of trying with his adorable little face.

Therion by

SaltySuicune

Firstly, I just want to get it out, I think this set is an immediate huge improvement over Pumpkinmon. Both steal and Boost are interesting special mechanics, though Boost gets a lot more play in the set than steal does, which was a mite bit disappointing to me. I think the addition of a universal mechanic like Boost really does help focus the set a lot more, especially since you seem to be basing Therion off of 2 very specific smash moveset archetypes (Joker and Sheik + a dash of Swordie) which makes for a more put-together idea.

I still don't have a ton to say about Therion, the majority of the set still being quite simple or even straight up borrowed/heavily inspired from existing smash moveset, but like I said, I do think there's a major improvement here. The standout move to me is probably the Down B - the idea of this quick hitter who can buff himself up choosing to use those resources to instead debuff his foe is an interesting one. If the next set I read from you continues this trend, you're going places! Therion is going to get a "C" from me.

Arctic Tern · Aug 6, 2024

TOADETTE (WCF)

Toadette makes a solid attempt at fusing all of the character’s many appearances across Mario lore into a cohesive role, mainly centered around her army of Toad simps. By performing flashy moves such as landing combos, footstools, or other specific move-based requirements, she can gain Toads that serve as an ammo bank to buff several of her moves. To aid her in this, Toadette can summon Toads to attack and serve as objects for her to footstool on, create trampolines to serve as indirect methods of setting up footstools, or summon a clone to double down on her Toad collecting at the cost of using up more of them. Her last Special makes a nice call back to her origins, being a burst move based on her special item in Double Dash that serves as a strong combo tool and wall-of-pain extender with the repercussions of making self-destructs very easy. It’s overall a very neat take on gaining resources for an ammo bank, and gets creativity points for being one of the few sets I can recall where footstooling is a semi-central mechanic (and a fitting one for a Mario character).

Beyond the mechanics, the set has a few standout moves, though nothing too standout, such as FAir’s tricky air-to-ground conversions and FSmash giving Toadette the ability to move the hitbox during the active frames with enough Toads. The grab in particular is notable, having her take on her Peachette form and thus making all of her throws the same as Peach’s, but with added/different utility due to being able to have more Toads attack on the throws that use Toad and her vastly different moveset otherwise. DSmash was a bit underwhelming in that the kill percents with max Toads are higher than I think they should be with how much is needed to acquire them and using them all up on use, and I’m not a fan of it only dealing damage with Toads. Additionally, while the idea of using clones to double team the opponent is mentioned, and fairly fair for the foe on account of the clone only dealing 1% on all their attacks and dying in one hit, only the idea is for the most part - it really needs more elaboration for something with such huge repercussions to Toadette’s kit, though I understand this was probably a result of it being rushed out. This is still a surprisingly good set for how quickly it was made, though, and aside from a few moves and lack of details there’s no real major flaws to it either.

ROYAL FORTUNE (Khold)

Finally… a normal sized Azur Lane set…

Royal Fortune, being a pirate themed shipgirl, leans into the theme heavily with a mechanic based around empowering her weapons by acquiring booty from the foe. These buffs are fairly standard, with the main thing of note being the buffs to her rigging, which turn her into a standard heavyweight, buff her speed and coverage, and make her ship a ghost ship that becomes immune to harm. On the subject of the ship, Fortune can ride it with SSpec, enabling her to use the attacks that rely on it while moving and “desync” herself from it to alter the properties of said attacks. Her last notable Special is NSpec, which fires a barrage of cannonballs that encourages the foe to approach if they don’t want to be laddered offstage and also doubles as a command grab.

Fortune’s other moves vary heavily in terms of detail, but the more detailed of them are generally the standouts. Dash Attack is a fast burst move with armor that she can use at midrange for quick damage, while FSmash has large hitboxes with notable blindspots in between them. BAir has a fun animation where Fortune grabs onto a rope then attacks with her cutlass in classic pirate fashion, with unmounting her ship making the move just the cutlass strike. Lastly, the grab game has a neat gimmick where every throw involves the ship in some way, including making the foe walk the plank as a kill move, though I do have to note that only BThrow and DThrow seem to have any described uses other than being throws. There’s also a neat gimmick where grabbing the opponent while unmounted turns it into an automatic combo throw.

The main issue with the set is under elaboration. In addition to most attacks not having their specific frame data, damage, and kill percent listed, it also doesn’t describe the effect the DSpec upgrades have on Fortune’s set which is promised in DSpec itself, doesn’t list how much damage her ship needs to destroy it, and doesn’t describe the specific range of her attacks. Additionally, several moves are stated to inflict the “burn” status effect, but nowhere in the set does it say exactly what it is (I assume it’s a DOT effect since that’s what it is in Azur Lane, but you have to assume that not everyone reading the set has heard of it since you’re posting this to a public access forum and even then there’s nothing to indicate its duration and the exact amount of damage it deals). Going on a bit of a tangent, I think that some of this is a result of you prioritizing making the set look good instead of making the set itself good, which has been a problem with you before (it’s the whole reason the big “remake every old set” project got canceled). It is important for the set to be readable, but ultimately it is the contents of the text that decide how well a set is received - looking good is just a side note, which is a major part of why I don’t really bother with it in my sets (the other is that I’m lazy). Additionally, I assume that the reason there’s so much under detail is that it was rushed to have an end-of-contest set; it’s nice to have one, but it is by no means an obligation, and it’s generally better to hold onto a complex set like this until everything is fine tuned instead of trying to chase the hype,

Overall, while Royal Fortune does have a great chunk of neat ideas, they’re ultimately bogged down by inconsistent levels of detail and a development cycle too quick for its concepts. With a bit of time to update the set my ratings may get higher, but for now it sits on the seafloor waiting for the day someone comes in to spruce it up to true greatness.

Link to full comment repository here!

Katapultar · Aug 7, 2024

Continuing the Tern NMH Train is an old Rychu set in Bad Girl, the fitting and sole submission for Rychu Day. Aside from being a modern take on a character with two old sets, this rendition of Bad Girl is interesting for the fact that we’ve had two NMH games since the second Bad Girl set in MYM14, and thereby extra things for Charlotte to work with in the form of a Bloodlust mechanic that’s reserved for playable characters in the series. I appreciate this set’s approach to characterization and the symbolism behind the red text throughout the set.

It’s funny that we got two Tern sets for female villains who summon minions and benefit from hitting them, though Bad Girl’s take is a lot more simple and less minion-focused. The animation feature of gimps having their necks snapped from Bad Girl’s bat swing if you already have one out is particularly savage.
Down Special has a very interesting dynamic of being a buff that takes a long time to set up, but gives you a chunky damage boost that stacks with your other damage boosts at the cost of taking self-damage over time. It can be used to get out of combo percents, which is more relevant to Bad Girl given she can lose Bloodlust stacks at higher percents, whereas using it at higher percents means you risk dying earlier in exchange for accumulating more Rage. I don’t think the once-per-stock limit is entirely necessary for this move, as the move already has enough drawbacks (could just limit it so Bad Girl can’t reapply the buff until it expires), but keeping it as-is won’t dock points from me.
Side Special is a surprisingly Jab/F-tilt-like move for a special attack, maybe a tad underwhelming, though Bad Girl admittedly doesn’t have a massive amount of potential to work with beyond her mechanics and first two Specials compared to NMH assassins with more supernatural-based powers.
Down Smash is easily my favourite of the Smash attacks. It’s unique enough thanks to that charging hitbox, which synergizes well with Bloodlust’s armour, and its potential shield pressure combined with being able to shield poke shields from above to get around the potentially bad shield safety.
U-tilt is a good example of a simple but effective move that plays into Bloodlust’s gameplan. Likewise, D-tilt has undertuned frame data but becomes very powerful when you can combo into a big Bloodlust kill move. Even the sweetspot’s low angle benefits from higher Bloodlust!

All and all, Bad Girl fits in the vast “solid” tier of your movesets, with a more middle-ground and modest concept that’s executed in the best way I could ask for from this character. Quite similar to Margaret in that regard, though she was surprisingly popular last contest so who knows?

I doubt anyone expected an Azur Lane set from you, but here the trend continues, and I can see why you read Freidrich and Chapayev first among MYM27’s movesets. Was looking forward to a more ambitious moveset from you when Golbat and Relicanth displayed some very enticing presentation. While the animations section is incomplete, I’m a big fan of them being popped after the stats section like a MYM5-6 moveset, as well as going into some detail on the sound effects that Royal Fortune’s rigging makes. Not every set goes into detail on sound effects. Making Royal Fortune able to drown against enemies who can invoke it is a fair touch, even if I hope that never has to be applied against a modern moveset, and I like the glossary section of the moveset. Telling readers what rigging is is good in case they’re not familiar with Azur Lane or ship parts in general, and channeling a handy term for holding down a button to keep a move going.

Neutral Special is admittedly confusing to start with, as it starts with what appears to be a puddle-generating animation and then jumps into firing cannonballs in the next paragraph, almost giving the impression that the latter is on a different input altogether. Paragraph 2 jumps to talking about the cannonball projectile, then paragraph 3 brings up a command grab and paragraph 4 brings up cannons again. It is admittedly tricky to make sense of, but from what I understand holding (or channeling) Neutral Special locks Royal Fortune into a stance where she can continuously fire cannonballs while having a passive command grab that triggers if opponents gets close enough to her. Perhaps it would be better to just talk about the cannonball projectiles and then bring up the tentacles. Anway, the move reminds me of K. Rool’s Neutral Special in being both a projectile and a grab, which certainly makes it unique. It would be neat if there were some kind of noted synergy between the cannonfire and the tentacle grab, similar to how K. Rool can potentially suck up his cannonballs if they hit and bounce off of a target close enough to him.

It can also be a bit tricky to read the small text that depicts damage and frame data, due to its size and the fact that it blends in with the white text and the doc’s background. Perhaps it would be better to give these a color that matches Royal Fortune’s color scheme so it sticks out better to readers? Spreading out different hitbox details between paragraphs rather than putting them together where relevant can also make later moves like Jab and Dash Attack confusing - the placement of hitbox details can be out-of-sync with the actual description of these hitboxes.

Don’t think Side Special specifies how fast RF is propelled by the tailwind. I could also see the tailwind’s hitbox having noteworthy applications depending on whether foes are launched towards or away from the direction RF is moving. The move states that RF turns slowly during her Side Special stance, which would be absolutely necessary if she has a long passive hitbox behind her so she can’t just casually turn around and hit with it for free. The idea being able to move forward and use your other attacks is cool though, being balanced out by the fact that the rigging can be attacked and destroyed to put it on a yet-to-be-determined amount of cooldown.
Short move aside, I’m curious whether Up Special is intended to have as much start-up as it does? Not that I object to a frame 20 tether recovery, lets you get away with stronger things if it hits.

“Her other main attack type is tentacles, but she can’t upgrade those through plundering booty because manga hadn’t been invented yet during the Golden Age of Piracy.” Heh.
I like the Bartholomew Roberts trivia throughout this set, as I recognize the name from Fate/Grand Order.
Down Special gets rather creative with the types of upgrades Royal Fortune can get, at least from a flavour-based perspective. It adds more to her character in a way that is presumably non-existent in her source material.
Using stale-move negation to determine what type of upgrade you get rather than RNG or manual choice is actually cool. Also the trivia on Royal Fortune being non-obtainable from gacha because she hates gambling.

F-tilt mentions a burning effect on the flame cutlass, which is the first time it’s been mentioned in the set and something that I assume you’re in the middle of working out. The move has a cool premise of mix-and-matching two types of upgradable weaponry in the cutlass and the cannonballs.
Might be a good idea to specify how far the reticules appear ahead of RF on F-Smash - I initially assumed that they appeared directly in front of her, so saying that there was a blindspot between the sourspot and the sweetspot was initially confusing.
N-air does help to sell potentially cool things RF can do when she separates herself from her rigging, which I admittedly forgot about until I saw the interaction. It helps that N-air is a two-part attack and you don’t have to go for the more committal attack that uses your rigging.
D-air sounds like it would be a very fun move when it’s completed - “projectile D-airs are fun in general, along with the fire patch and the risks associated with using the move when you have rigging beneath you.
Ah, the promised single-throw grab that you brought up in the moveset-previewing thread.

It goes without saying that Tempesta is incomplete, but I just wanted to read her for acknowledgement’s sake and to read everything this contest. This is a pretty similar scenario to Team Fortress 2 from last contest where a lategame set was fully-updated to be a big one closer to the end of voting, but Royal Fortune arguably has more of her filled in. She certainly has some base concepts to work with with her booty and rigging, and I’m curious to see whether she’ll end up around the 30k alongside the other Azur Lane sets we’ve gotten.

Arctic Tern · Aug 7, 2024

KAELA KOVALSKIA (Bubby/Kat/Froy)

Kaela, befitting her occupation as a blacksmith, is based around weapons and the many ways that equipping them alters her set. Befitting her status as a grind-heavy famer, she can improve them by gaining resources that enable her to use her DSpec to improve their damage output and add buffs to her weapon attacks if she uses the rarer materials. The threat of buffing her weapons enables the slow Kaela to force approaches, and she can also store her weapons to make her attacks faster and/or safer. On the other hand, her weapons also have limited durability that force her to spend some time upgrading her weapons to keep them around, or use her NSpec to get around this by making a forge that prevents them from losing durability if she uses an attack in it. All of this is a fairly complex set that really indicates that this is a joint set, since most of Bubby’s sets are way simpler than even that basic outline.

The meat of the set comes in the weapons, which have a lot of interactions with SSpec (a projectile using her equipped weapon) and USpec (Aether, but Kaela can choose to go in certain directions for an immensely powerful hitbox). UTilt turns the projectile into a grabbox that can extend kills, DTilt can potentially drag the foe with it if sufficiently upgraded, and DSmash turns the projectile into a potentially very strong combo starter in exchange for how long the hitbox lasts. FSmash also has a cool interaction with dropped weapons where they become projectiles once the hitbox comes online, enabling Kaela to create a mini-bullet hell should her weapons have enough durability. The most notable moves are the Dash Attack, which changes completely depending on the equipped weapon, and FThrow, which becomes a potentially absurd kill throw if she has enough weapons stockpiled. There’s a lot of creativity with how the weapons interact with Kaela’s kit, and it’s definitely one of the high points of the set.

That’s not to say the actual moves are boring - far from it! The aforementioned UTilt is an uppercut that can potentially pitfall if a second hit is used, and FSmash is a classic slow read move that comes out frighteningly fast if Kaela has it stocked and makes the opponent afraid of properly challenging her. UAir has a neat orichalcum effect where landing it will drag her with the foe, enabling her to turn the high knockback move into a proper laddering tool. The throws are probably my favorite part of the set for me, with a throw that slows the opponent down so that she can better punish them and a DThrow that forces them into a tech chase that gets worse for them the more materials Kaela has. Despite how potentially powerful she can get, the resource management aspects coupled with being easy to combo and slow ultimately balance things out and make it fair for the foe. My only real issue is that (likely from what I understand was a fairly hasty development cycle) some moves don’t have their material buffs listed (BAir has no orichalcum effect listed, while how FAIr interacts with Side and Up Spec isn’t described with no indication this is an intentional design choice - also on a semi-related note Kaela’s fall speed doesn’t have a specific value).

Overall, Kaela was a very strong set, and certainly a worthy one for the very first three-way joint set.

RAVEN BEAK (Froy/FA)

Raven Beak is essentially a Metroid-flavored “boss set” in the vein of Sephiroth, with ridiculous range and power at the cost of horrid disadvantage. Here, the main gimmick is two sets of armor he can give to himself: one that provides limited armor on melee attacks and an incredibly long ranged attack that becomes stronger the more damage it took, and another that provides infinite armor at the cost of adding windows to his attacks that leave him immensely vulnerable if he’s hit during them. Not only is this a dope way of incorporating Dread’s main gameplay gimmick, but it’s also a smart way of encouraging Raven Beak to not spam the same move over and over lest the foe catch him in a combo he struggles to escape from. Once the armor breaks, he sprouts wings (another Sephiroth comparison) that grants him multiple jumps and unique aerial smashes, but eventually disappear after he takes enough damage. A smart way of incorporating his phase transitions into his fight while also giving Raven Beak some solid comeback factor that a boss set needs to some extent.

A boss set also needs some big ****-off attacks, and Raven Beak has plenty. His SSpec fires either a black hole that homes in on the opponent that he can buff by attacking or a sun that has slow startlag, but is an immensely strong stage control tool that he can potentially knock the opponent into for absurdly early kills. NSpec is a move that, when fully charged, deals 60% damage but comes at the cost of denying Raven Beak a casual projectile and locking him in an immensely long animation that he is ripe for punishment during. His smashes are suitably over the top, with a massive FSmash laser with a 3 second charge time but absurd kill percents, a USmash that covers absurd area but has a massive blind spot, and a simpler DSmash that hard punishes the foe in tech chases and can combo if the back hit lands. Raven Beak’s aerial smashes are just as nuts, with a downwards aimed version of his ground FSmash, a dragging multihit that leaves the opponent vulnerable to his devastating ledge game, and a large explosion that serves as a strong end to his juggles. Lastly, his throws are incredibly powerful, including one that lets him slam the foe into a sun for ridiculously low kill percents and a UThrow that lets him harass them with homing missiles.

All of that would be nothing without some more simple attacks to balance out the craziness, and in that regard Raven Beak still shines. His FAir and FTilt allow him to play a more traditional neutral game while still being strong combo and kill moves, respectively, and his UAir is a standard flip kick that gets a lot of interplay off of his assorted tools. There’s still plenty of gimmicks there, too; DTilt pitfalls the opponent if they were stunned or in prone, Dash Attack crumples them if Raven Beak hits them during the start of an attack (funnily enough a set I’m working on right now has this gimmick too), and NAir gets varying buffs depending on what DSpec shield he has up, including a Rest-style sweetspot that takes stocks insanely early. All of this can and often will be overpowering for the foe, but they do have plenty of counterplay; aside from the counter windows, armor goes away when he uses projectiles, his OoS game is very poor, he struggles to recover normally, and his size and fall speed makes him easy to combo. Raven Beak can not throw out moves and hope to win off of the strength of his buttons - he must think about what move is safest to throw out and whether using his infinite armor shield is worth the drawbacks. Additionally, I was quite fond of the subtle characterization of giving him some similar moves to Samus, whether it be in animation (UTilt and BAir) or mechanics (SSpec for both fires different projectiles depending on whether the stick was tapped or held, and FAir can be a wall-of-pain for both).

To summarize, Raven Beak is very worthy of being the last set for this contest, both in terms of character hype and actual set quality. All those that precede him (well, most) must accept their helplessness.

Link to full comment repository here!

Katapultar · Aug 8, 2024

Well, this is certainly something! This wasn’t what I was expecting when Froy told me he had a burst of inspiration and was working on something he started 2 days ago, but it’s great to see him get out something meaningful in the end (I know it came down to real life difficulties, which I’ll just mention here for posterity’s sake). I also know that FA was big on making this character, so it was surprising to hear that Froy was the main driving force behind this set. Funny sexy body writing was probably done in the heat of the moment, but I imagine it would be replaced with a more serious and imposing writing in the future. The stats section is brisk in a manner you’d expect from old Froy sets, but it’s fitting for Raven Beak to be fast from how Metroid Dread controls and feels gameplay-wise.

Down Special applying passive amour is a pretty trademark Froy thing, and it has the unique twist of varying in strength based on whether Raven Beak is attacking or not or using a projectile. More unique is the twist of suspending Raven Beak’s armour and giving him the option to perform a powerful projectile after his blue armour takes 3 hits. This plays well into Raven Beak’s heavyweight status of being easy to combo, and the fact that the projectile deals damage equal to the combined hits you took is very cool! It’s pretty fitting given Raven Beak’s whole emphasis on power being everything. The potentially deadly projectile is kept in check by its high lag, and the fact that you cannot hold it forever. Raven Beak can also apply golden armour to be almost invincible, bar some weak points in his moves or if certain attacks get parried or he’s grabbed. Oh, and losing either armour gives Raven Beak wings like a final boss entering their next phase, which is really the case here - giving him access to Aerial Smashes until the wings are clipped and loses them for the rest of the stock in exchange for getting his armour more frequently. This is truly a great and involved attack, but it’s designed in a way that it never feels like too much, nor is it difficult to follow.

Side Special’s black hole definitely has some Flagg tennis vibes going on, where both fighters want to land the third hit on the black hole (this seems to be how it works in-game where Samus can destroy it, based on the U-Smash GIF). Or hit the sun. Tap vs Smash options for a black hole or a sun actually reminds me of Froy’s old MYM15 Touhou sets. The black hole and the sun might be a tiny bit oppressive when they last for so long and incentivize opponents to hit them and potentially be distracted from the fast Raven Beak bearing down on them, being fairly similar to minions in that regard, but they are at least kept in check by their high starting lag (especially the sun) and not being able to have both a sun and a black hole at the same time. The latter is not only good for gameplay purposes, but fitting for what I assume is how it plays out in Raven Beak’s boss fight.

Neutral Special is a welcome comparison to Samus’s Charge Shot. It reminds me of the Smady sets for villains or rivals of existing Smash characters, where they could draw upon existing Smash moves to make for fun and mocking comparisons. It makes sense that Raven Beak would trade a potentially powerful charged attack for a more reliable neutral projectile when he’s so powerful, but charging the attack comes with the risk of leaving Raven Beak open more and more due to a longer duration (and naturally works against his Down Special amour’s no-armour-when-using-projectiles properties). Simple but enticing. I’m glad that aiming Neutral Special is a slow affair that makes a stream of shots easy to get around, as I have a pet peeve with attacks that can be aimed omnidirectionally too casually to just block off all the space around you.

Up Special’s tricks with using one burst > wing > burst reminds me of Bayonetta and even Nox’s teleporting tricks. I also enjoy the comparisons to fellow Metroid villain Ridley, even if it’s a very minor thing in the grand scheme of things I enjoy about this set. The recovery itself gets boosted greatly with wings, albeit having the wings is situational, and having gold armour turns it into a high-risk pseudo-counter where foes can mess you up if you’re exposed during your end lag.
This set has an interesting naming convention with its Specials, where instead of going X move/X move for two variants, it combines the names of the two variants.
“First off, Raven Beak’s angles are no longer limited with his wings out as he uses them to brace and contort his body, flapping them once to properly angle himself wherever he damn well pleases for the Shinespark.” I like the use of the phrase ‘damn well please’ in this sentence - it gives off a strong sense of defiance that you might expect from Raven Beak in the face of recovering.

F-Smash is a “straightforward” and relatively modest projectile attack that can get incredibly strong when charged. It has the simple enough application of giving Raven Beak a big deadly projectile to use against opponents who are occupied with his sun and black hole, which is a pretty MYM’ian interaction and well worth the free kill if he is allowed to pull it off.
I could see U-Smash being a vertical projectile that’s easy to use against your sun or black hole. The sheet is modest in application, but you’d be hard-pressed to implement it in a better or more balanced way given how the sheer number of tools and attacks Raven Beak has to juggle from his boss fight.
It goes without saying that Raven Beak needs a slow but strong melee option to take advantage of his passive armour. The damage bonus against stunned/prone enemies is welcome, even if there doesn’t seem to be any specific logic behind it animation-wise.

Jab is actually unique with the slide that precedes the backhand. I like proximity-based attacks, which aren’t common in MYM, even if its implications are pretty light on this move. The attack’s movement makes a pretty overwhelming offensive option, which is only fair when it has high end lag and thereby is unsafe even if you have your armour set up.
F-tilt is a very straightforward attack, but the counter windows are very well thought-out for the move in regards to its lag and how Raven Beak can use his attack’s range to space.
Dash Attack’s special crumple against attacking opponents does have some good synergy if they’re attacking your black hole - as well as your Down Special armour! I also like that the sweetspot crumple gives Raven Beak a guaranteed way to pop off his otherwise situational bury out of a D-tilt stomp, which was brought up before Dash Attack!
Aerial F-Smash is welcome for how it gives Raven Beak a casual way to drag opponents into his sun with a powerful hitbox. And Aerial D-Smash introduces the dynamic of Raven Beak being vulnerable from below and worse off without his wings, similar to Hades from last contest.

Wasn’t expecting the N-air to not get armoured, and instead be buffed by your Down Special. This actually makes sense from a flavour perspective when N-air involves using lightning, just like Raven Beak’s lightning armour. This makes it one of the cooler moves in Raven Beak’s moveset, as it gives him another way to utilize tanked damage aside from Peal of Thunder, and an enticing Rest-esque sweetspot on golden armour that you could potentially get if foes don’t DI correctly. The fact that Raven Beak doesn’t get armour during N-air is also interesting, as opponents might be scared out of attacking him from the fact that -most- of his attacks are armoued in the first place!
It’s interesting that both Raven Beak’s N-air and F-air can convert into grounded situations, and I’m perfectly fine with it. Especially when the two moves have very different applications outside of said situation.
“Parrying is less of a concern on this move as an aerial but the fact that this is one of Raven Beak’s best shorthop approaches also means that if he gets predictable approaching it can be a disaster: just ask Ike about how over-reliance on one aerial in this regard can backfire, now add a bigger parrying penalty!” Interesting, I should keep this in mind.
“This is also one area where his height betrays him: He can’t really do fastfall Up Aerial to begin combos on grounded opponents reliably like, say, Mario because the hitbox on the flip kick starts too high. While this can work against particularly large opponents (for example, imposter Raven Beaks) it is not something to trust.” Another interesting note to take in. Reminds me of Gundam Barbatos having an U-air that’s held back by his huge height.
U-air is a simple but effective melee attack that plays rather well into Down Special wings and the general mechanics behind getting them or Peals of Thunder.
I like the fact that D-air’s descent can be cancelled by using one of your wing jumps!

It feels like FA wrote the grab. I wasn’t expecting him to have a “ranged” grab, but it makes sense given the GIF and has humorous comparisons to Samus’s grab.
Blue-Eyes White Dragon intensifies on the Forward Throw’s name. Kaiba would be proud.
I like F-throw’s niche use case of reducing your NSpec’s ammo count so you’re not as committed to a fully-charged shot and potentially leave yourself open. I am personally trying to move away from throws that have some sort of secondary effect that requires pressing A, mostly to make things easier on players discovery-wise (and to be less “gimmicky”), but I have no objection to its use in people’s sets. It helps a lot that the control scheme is pretty consistent among Raven Beak’s throws.
U-throw gets some clear good usage out of a sun. The homing missiles seem like they belong on a Special, but being locked onto a throw so they’re not too centralizing to Raven Beak’s super armour-based gameplan is very justified. Part of me wondered whether a cargo carry would be good for black hole or sun fun, but I think it’s good that he doesn’t have these when those two constructs are pretty powerful. Raven Beak should have to earn that toss into the sun, and I can see situations where foes might want to stand under the sun to avoid its projectiles.
The rage boost for B-throw upon losing wings definitely has FA touches to it. Raven Beak’s grab game is pretty good overall, which is to be expected from you two.

So, overall! Raven Beak has a really strong start to him in Down Special, which may very well be my favourite move in the contest (though I don’t know if I said the same thing about an earlier set, or whether that was last contest or the one before). Down Special was such a strong start that I thought Raven Beak was going to be an easy Super Vote Plus, but I feel like the set was largely carried by Down Special: knock your opponent into X damaging projectile/trap has been done a lot in old MYM, and the Smashes weren’t as exciting or wow-inducing as I’d want from a truly top-tier moveset (Hakumen and Barbatos setting high expectations probably doesn’t help?). This is just me explaining why Raven Beak isn’t a Super Vote Plus or a 10/10 set, mind you - he is handily one of my favourite sets this contest, an excellent way to close the contest like Tern said. I would be surprised if he didn’t make the Top 5 this contest.

And that's every MYM27 set commented! You can see all of the comments here, while this doc links to where I've ranked all of them for voting purposes. Said rankings are largely final, but they are prone to change with future edits.

FrozenRoy · Aug 8, 2024

For the aforementioned clarification that I said we were discussing, so reading period will extend out to October 13th, with voting starting after that and continuing until the end of November 13th as mentioned before.

Like with every contest if you want a reading list, hit me up!

Rychu · Aug 10, 2024

Ignore this please

Rychu · Aug 11, 2024

IT'S JAMCOMENT TIME

Oogie Boogie by

Arctic Tern

Oogie Boogie feels like one of those classic MYM characters to me, even though he's apparently only had one moveset. Maybe I'm conflating him and Pennywise for some reason, but I had thought both Kat AND Kupa made Oogie sets in the past. Oh my, I'm going senile in my old age.

As someone with a hobby for rolling dice as well as a general love of statistics, it does bother me that the Neutral Special's dice rolls don't actually line up to what real dice percentages are (in which 7 is the most likely number at about 17% and 2 and 12 are the least likely at just under 3% - the likelihood that you roll a 6, 7, or 8 is about 42%!) but I understand the importance of fun game mechanics, and the loaded dice mechanic is very fun in and of itself. I think, even with all of the set's fun traps and set ups, the simple fact that it encourages a volleyball game between Oogie and his opponent attempting to smack his dice around to get it to land on the preferred number is the most fun the set offers in terms of things I'd like to see in a smash game. Im already imagining some sick Oogie dice combos in my head, expecially paired with his shadows and suction moves.

Oogie is a very fun set that keeps its momentum up throughout the entire read, bolstering its very fun central dice and trap mechanic with a very solid melee game that pairs well with the traps. I don't think it's a particularly deeply mechanically interesting set, but it is still mechanically interesting and, as mentioned, that central hook is absolutely killer. It's really good, though not quite on the level that Fredreich was for me. Oogie gets an "A" for Aaaaaaah!

Symmetra by

BrazilianGuy

I played Symmetra in the initial release of Overwatch 1. Man, I hate Overwatch. Miss my turrets that went brrrrrrr. Bad times.

Symm pulling from every iteration of her many, many, many, many changes is a good choice, I think - I personally found her much more interesting as a support hero than as an attack hero, but Blizzard is a bad company and makes bad decisions - as it gives her a more varied pool of abilities to draw from. Side Special I think is the neatest move in the set, though that might be my own bias towards liking platform creation. The moveset in general takes from Symmetra's Overwatch kit while also dipping into some emotes and expounding upon some victory animations, keeping everything nice and in-character. Given OW isn't (generally) a movement-based game, letting Symmetra's athletic and dancer-like emotes become a part of her gameplay is a fun choice.

I do think the moveset sort of runs out of steam around the time we gat past the Standards, but I think even then there's some fun stuff even if it's either fairly basic, inspired by another Smash attack or sort of undercooked mechanically. I understand this was a Jamcon and therefore written with a time limit in mind, but (and not to push my own ideas for Symmetra onto another set maker) I think expanding on the varying levels of charge she gets for her Photon beam (here basically just made into a pretty unique and fun Jab) and making that a bigger part of the set as a whole would be really fun - maybe tie it in with her turrets being able to build the charge as well, giving her a reason to strategically place and defend them. I dunno, that's just my take.

Symmetra's on the whole a pretty fun set that unfortunately sorta loses my towards the end. For the fun ideas at the start and sprinkled throughout, though, I'm gonna rank it a "C".

Akuma by

GolisoPower

This man never showers, very stinky. All that grime is the reason he's not the lightest mf in the game.

I think Akuma accomplishes being exactly what it needs to be: a scarier, more damage-forward version of the already established SF characters in smash, with a few different options to differentiate him and turn him into a rushdown beast as opposed to the more patient playstyles of Ryu and Ken. The interperetation of Akuma's glass cannon-ness as being weak to recover offstage is a good one I think. Also giving Akuma a highly customizable burst movement option on top of the already mobile tatsu just further reinforces the rushdown feel of the character, and allows him to play both more aggressively and more trickily than Ryu or Ken, is great. All good choices without cluttering the set with meter mechanics or EX meters like other Street Fighter sets we've had (that's not to take away from those, I just think something like this is refreshing).

The ACTUAL mechanic we have cluttering the set is a fairly cool one that differentiates him even further, though I think it's a bit more elegant than a meter mechanic. I'm a little confused on how its activated - so, basically any move that deals above 15% makes it activate? So Akuma's best bet is to go for the grab variation of his down special, which will automatically put him into this state if it lands, or so I'm being led to believe. Putting him in a turbo-state is hilarious, tbh. Even with the cooldowns on the insane specials, them combined with Turbo mode increasing his damage and giving him even more power makes Akuma feel hilariously overpowered, especially when he has to land just 1 (one) attack to activate it.

Akuma's a lot of fun, even if after the specials and mechanic (which is just about over half the set's full word count) he sorta just becomes faster Ryu/Ken. Obviously those moves get recontextualized when paired with the new mechanics, but the set does become less exciting when it becomes less insane. That's sorta what Jamcons are for, though - making insane thoughts happen and then supergluing the rest together into something workable without the time to agonize over it. Akuma gets a "B" because of how "B"at**** it is.

Rambi & Squawks by

BridgesWithTurtles

Squawks getting KOd nerfing your weight from definitive second heaviest to tied for second heaviest is my favorite little detail in this entire set.

I love this duo being a way more extreme version of Duck Hunt mixed in with Rosalina & Luma, it's a very fun design choice. I really enjoy the way this set plays with extremes, too, in terms of statistics and the fact that you can just straight up lose access to certain attacks if Squawks gets squawshed. I think the little extra mechanic that's added in in the Jab where you can Shoot Egg during one of Squawks' other attacks is a very neat little idea that makes the rather humdrum projectile just a little more useful, especially since doing to is inevitably going to have the Egg Shoot at different angles than the foe would expect. It's neat, and it's charming.

Which is, I think a good way to describe how I feel about the set in general. It's got neat ideas, and the fact that you were able to squeeze a full moveset out of Donkey Kong Country mounts is kind of astounding, and the whole idea behind it is incredibly charming, and I think the charm really carries the whole set more than its actual mechanics. Which, to be fair, is something to be entirely expected out of this - a Rhino and a Bird can only do so many things without some secret third or fourth thing like the Duck Hunt's secret third partner in the Zapper. I think, mechanically, the most interesting thing about the moveset is actually the Squawks ranged grab, though to be honest I think it ultimately ends up being more interesting conceptually than in practice in the moveset itself.

Can't say I wasn't absolutely delighted though, which is something I tend to just get out of your movesets in general. Vibes alone take Rambi to a "B" for me, though I would probably say that its on the lower end of that. Vibes are immaculate, though.

Bloodless by U UserShadow7989

I could fix her but I don't want to. I want her to make me worse.

Bloodstained is one of those games I keep telling myself I'm going to play and then never getting around to it, though I do know it's closer on the spectrum to Symphony of the Night than the classic Vanias that I myself am a bigger fan of. Anyway, hot goth vampire girl, hell yeah. This set feels like a wee throwback to classic Goop mechanics from MYM9, but significantly scaled back and reasonable. The idea of an "ammo" mechanic that's also tied to an amount of armor for the character is a very strong design choice, and one that I certainly think can be iterated on beyond its use in this set - not to say that this moveset doesn't use the idea admirably, you have a penchant for striking and effective if simple to grasp hooks. Of course, you pay off the blood splatter in a variety of ways throughout the set, most notably the very cool blood rain down special, and there are some really fun ways of getting it spread all over the place, with forward smash being the most striking example. That F-Smash is one of the standout moves of the set, something I think that Kat touched on in his comment. I love big "just GO for it" moves like it, and similar moves in smash proper.

Bloodless, overall, feels like the baseline of what I expect of a US set: that baseline being that the set is going to have strong foundations, a strong central mechanic, and at the very very least some interesting melee to go with it. In other words: Bloodless is quite good, though I think the general deadline of a Jamcon probably limited the set in scope somewhat. I'd really like to see a set with these sorts of mechanics that's really had a chance to simmer and stew rather than get done quick and dirty. But, like, I think that that feeling ultimately means the moveset intrigues me enough that I wish there was another layer to its "wow" factor. I think Bloodless goes in "A", but if I cared at all about rankings within rankings she'd probably be a low A. Wait hold on I need to make a blood type A joke. Uh. "A" like the blood type. ah ah ah! Because she's a vampire? I dunno man, it's late.

Camilla by T TortoiseNotTurtle

Jesus Christ, these Fire Emblem guys are programming with one hand, huh.

I won't lie, I find the formatting you use to be a little hard to get used to, but I'm overall not opposed to these sort of information boxes. I don't personally know how I'd organize information in these things, but I will say having the information separated out like this takes some getting used to when you're used to movesets being long and prose-driven like I am.

I think the notable positives of Camilla are the core hook and the dedication to actually getting 2 movesets out of a Wyvern rider. I think mount sets are very cool, and are something I'd like to try my hand at one day, so kudos for attempting something this sort of mechanically complex in such a short amount of time. I also think some of the other ideas, like the Side Special being a tool that can be used to position Marzia and potentially aim her fireballs even more precisely is exactly the kind of cool interplay I want out of a mounted combatant. Some of the special interactions she has while mounted are pretty nifty as well - I like the ability to catch a thrown axe in concept at least, though I don't know what gameplay functions that would have other than a flex or one-time fake-out.

I would say the set suffers quite a bit from a lack of concrete detail. You don't have to go crazy with numbers and think quick in-game comparisons are useful at times, but I don't think the moveset lists actual damage or knockback percents like... at all, sorta letting the whole thing be a sorta oopy goopy miasma of vagaries and mystery, which, brought together with the fact that outside of the central mechanic and a few of the specials there isn't much interplay at all spoken about within the melee portion of her set... just sorta makes it hard to really picture or follow, and definitely makes it a difficult to get excited about past the actually rather strong opening machanic. I'm gonna give Camilla a ranking of "D", which, while we're probably looking at gs at least, D seems to be thematic with her design.

as was probably obvious by the image, I'm gonna cast my Jamcon vote for Oogie Boogie.

BrazilianGuy · Aug 12, 2024

Ngl Fellas, work and college has made reading and stuff more complex, but I think I got it under control now, I'll try and read everything just kinda going over Sets in any order really.

I decided to get back into reading with Giorno for 2 reasons, 1: He is from a series I love. 2: He was made by Jolyne, which I believe is her first posted moveset, so that's fun! However, I do believe this moveset can improve, I'll be doing a criticism sandwich with some things I liked as well as some I believe could be better.

For Starters, as a Jojo fan I enjoyed a lot of the fun references to the source material and the fans, stuff like an Araki Forgot, how you can taunt while foes are on the ground like in All-Star Battle, Coco Jumbo being here, and Giorno acting as a more supportive fighter. But, I do believe things could be more explained, sure I know about Jojo, but there can be people who never read it and have no idea what Golden Experience even is. A paragraph or two with more explanations on details like Stands, Passione, and Giorno's ultimate goal could be a good addition. Funnily, this is a tip I received when I posted Jonathan Joestar, and it helps a ton.

Secondly, Mista is here! This helps with the mentioned support vibes going on, and it is a very unique choice that fits with how much fighting in a team happens in Part 5. It is a bit weird how Mista is also the grab, like it works but nothing really about him screams THE GRAB. I also find that at some sections such as about the Tree, knowing how big they are is very needed as it defines how they can be used and how to deal with them. This lack of description is present in a ton of the moves, as well as some info that just isn't the clearest, like Jab lasts for 20 frames but you can also hold it for 3 seconds? Also on the note of jab, it feels really weird to have it be mostly the same as F-Tilt, and while you do mention Giorno can walk slowly it would be nice to get an actual distance or speed he travels.

The last thing I'd like to really touch upon is word repetition, the example I have is for the Mista Paragraph that uses his name 11 times. It becomes a little bit much and I just think that it could be a good idea to try and avoid doing that in future sets. As for final compliments, I liked how Life Bringer was used and I enjoyed the visualization for the alts AND Requiem having new Specials is based.

I do find that the core of the set is very good and Im looking forward to your next sets, but I think Giorno needed a bit more to really show everyone his dream.

I recall reading a bit of Camilla around when she was getting posted or a bit before, IDK I forger, but she was made by Chonk, the homie, so I must read it.

I just know that I do not have the right image of this character in my head, but I'm glad you acknowledge it and just kind of embrace it, it's who Camilla is and that is ok. I kind of feel more "Ok" with her now as I got to know a bit more about the character like how she can care for her Wyvern by using her taunts, that's cute.

For starters, I always enjoy how you present your movesets! The box formatting is always very clear and something unique from any other set, I always appreciate new things. I also love how you do the Competitive Section at the end, helps you to really imagine her interactions with the rest of the cast, like I never imagined she'd get beat by Inkling but after reading your explanations, yeah it makes sense.

Her being able to basically set up a wall and do combos from it feels so fun, I also love how there's weight on a ton of her attacks, rightfully so I mean, she using a big weapon. Her Up Tilt in particular is a move I really enjoyed for it's unconventional use. Also, you're awesome for making her Back Air what it is DKAJSDSAJKDSAKJ.

Marzia (I liked the name choice) is implemented well in a way that she feels meaningful but also not the only thing Camilla has going on, something that could have been tricky.

My only real complaint is that some moves are a little too simple, but like, that's not a huge problem really when you consider it's a Jamcon Character. I really wanna check your Non Jamcon sets to see what happens when time is not an enemy and you get full acess to the kitchen, will be reading Byleth when I can!

Lastly, she just not being able to fight Corrin AT ALL is very funny.

Lastly, Tigershark, I picked their set to read at random, but one look at the character had me hooked. Sharks are my favorite animal, I am an easy person to please. Also super fun to hear how passionate you are about this really obscure series that is only really known in your region, thats also something I'm a fan of,

Tigershark does a great job at mixing his two animals together into a fun moveset, obviously, he has more tiger stuff going on, but hey I like him having a swim mechanic that's almost completely unusable in any competitive scenario but it's fun for casual, more characters need something like that. Also enjoyed how much of real animals is used for the moveset such as the tiger cub animation, the facts on why sharks rip their victims and the kitty pounces, I liked that.

I also liked how the alts were done a lot, tho I think most are missing the images on the graphs. Idk could be my notebook.

I do think however that Down Special is a bit odd in the kit, it's not terrible and I like the idea of it dealing more damage the closer you are, but it feels weird Idk even how to explain it, but compared to everything else I kind of just nodded when I saw it.

The last set from you I read was Pumpkinmon, and I have to say I thing this one is a big improvement over it, I liked reading the fish feline.

Hyper_Ridley · Aug 12, 2024

Raven Beak by FrozenRoy and ForwardArrow
I'm back for one MYM thread and one of my Smash 6 MW gets a set? Nice

This reminds me of my own Leviathan Guardian sets, with trying to translate ALL the boss's attacks/mechanics into a PvP setting. Of course there's stuff like the homing dark sphere and Flash Shift, but I wouldn't have thought to actually make a distinction between Blue and Gold lightning armor, complete with the Pearl of Thunder and counter points. Heck, he's even got the phase changes going on!

I like the held grab and BThrow's use of Flash Shift. The actual Up-B Flash Shift is a bit disappointing how he needs his wings to make use of it beyond recovering, but the grab/BThrow mechanics give him some more mileage out of one of Dread's unique upgrades. On a related note, I like how UThrow lets him use Missile Storm, and how it's specifically designed to be great for FFA matches. Sometimes MYM can get a bit carried away with trying to cheat extra throw inputs onto characters, but this feels like a legit bonus mechanic to play around with. It's too bad Cross Bombs couldn't be included, but I guess we need to save something for Samus' Smash 6 rework.

The allusions to the other Metroid characters are cool. There's the obvious UTilt as Samus' USmash, but then there's his axe kick DTilt like Samus' UTilt, and his BAir reminds me of Ridley's. And there's his DAir, which is like Ridley's but good. I'd make a Zero Suit Raven Beak joke, but writing this made me realise that we technically do see that right before his, uh, "final form" in Dread.

It's also a nice touch to include his dark and light beams in normal attacks, even having a cheeky Annihlator reference in air USmash. I never made that connection in Dread, but geez, I'm starting to think those nav room monologues may be justified.

I appreciate the final smash being a Mawkin battalion and not him magically turning into Kraven Beak X for a single attack. Although when you think about, he's got several attacks throughout the moveset that would be a final smash on other characters; Hyper Beam, the sun, Pearl of Thunder, Annihlation...

It's really funny how much this guy shares with Machinedramon, considering they were posted a day apart.
Superheavy? Check
Over-the-top storable charge projectile? Check
Possibly armored grab? Check
Big scary armored attacks with weakpoints that crumple him? Check
Extra-strong stall-then-fall DAir? Check
Crazy screen-covering smashes? Check
HR-coded villain? Check

9/12
Toadette by WeirdChillFever

The intro post got a good laugh out of me

Amassing a group of cheerleaders is a fun take on the character, and I like how she gains them by doing Mario-style movement stunts. I'm trying to imagine what it would look like having 8 Toadettes all having 30 Toads trailing them, and all I see is a mass of fungi consuming the screen. This is starting to sound creepy.

I think she relies a bit too much on referencing the Princess' throws. Her jab being a combo of them is cool, her literal throws doing it to include Peachette is cute, but then her Neutral Special, the full-on SPECIAL input introducing the mechanic, just seems to have them as a token hitbox to justify talking about the Toads. On a related note, Neutral Special has 2 paragraphs at the end that both say that she can and can't interact with her Toads. Schrodinger's MYMushroom.

Her other specials do feel much cooler. I love Golden Mushroom's implementation as the dash badge from Wonder, there are plenty of stages where she could flat-out run between platforms, and I can't wait to Dash Attack someone offstage. Up-Special as a triple jump reference is cute while also utilizing those bouncy mushrooms that seem be sprouting up throughout the Mario worlds. Double Cherry might be a bit UP because of the clone dying to anything, but I appreciate how it's theoretically easier to desync them than the Ice Climbers and actually do silly things without an advanced degree in frame data. And I love the term Fauxdette.

I like the dynamic between her air and ground normals. Her air attacks are all quick simple affair to bop people while platforming, while her ground attacks are for more quirky, niche interactions to help clear the way for her next aerial act. And they have a lot of personality, even something like FTilt is a cute semi-reference to her TTYD appearance while still being distinctly Toadette's take on that kind of attack. I can't believe you referenced one of the most evil Mario Party minigames in DSmash.

Using the pigtails for some extra hitboxes is a nice touch that I wish was utilized a bit more. Like somehow they clap during UAir for a slightly easier hitbox that won't grant bonus Toads. Or perhaps the animation for FAir could be reworked a bit to include them? Granted, she's not known for weaponising her hair (mycelium?), but it's also the main thing that differentiates her from other members of her species, so...

The writing throughout does a great job of providing a clear picture of her attacks without getting bogged down in meta theory. I will say that USmash's trajectory is a bit unclear; Is it being tossed straight up like Snake's mortar, or thrown forwards like a Simon axe?

Overall, a dang good set that's given me some more appreciation for her!

9/17
Bad Girl by Arctic Tern
Despite never having played the No More Heroes games, the moment I saw the series mentioned here, I thought "Yep, checks out".

I've been sitting on this comment for a week, but I can't think of much to say. She sounds like a fun heavy hitter; Get in, grab that bat, and crack some skulls, like God intended. Those gimps are the exact kind of thing I would expect from a Suda51 character, and the idea of playing minion tennis baseball with them is a good way to include them without overshadowing her focus on melee dominance. Her normals' quirks all feel organic and relevant, like using NAir bunting to "gently" abort a gimp rally, or giving her DSmash a charging hitbox as an homage to her boss fight.

I will say that UThrow feels wierdly weak for the sound effect. Maybe rather than a combo, bloodlust should empower the single hit, with the crrrack sound playing at enough stacks. Oh, and there's a typo with BThrow: " with the victim’s head being what hits the ground first instead of their head."

...What happens when Kirby copies Bad Girl?!

9/29
Byleth by TortoiseNotTurtle
I'm pretty sure this is the first time I've read a moveset with a bibliography.

"Regional variant Byleth" is not something I knew I wanted, and it's interesting to see how the setting affects their weapon triangle. A bit sad to lose the whip-sword and long spear, but a spikey club and dagger-like spear have their own appeal. I do wish there was a bit more fiery stuff involved, seeing as A!Sothis is literally a fire spirit and Smash Byleth gets some red-hot tilts. The wind effects on the club and "mirage" stuff with the spear are cool in any case.

Glad to see the Mwende Sword is still devoted to BIG POWER HITS, with Down Special having the additional quirk of creating a trap of sorts and giving them some hand-to-hand inputs. Kinda funny that in the same year or so we have Mortal Kombat 1's General Shao doing the same gimmick, but I think yours sounds way more interesting in implementation; Shao mostly just immediately combos his axe slam into the very attack that gives him back the weapon, but Byleth actually has some level of commitment and genuine playmaking with placing that big sword on the field. The one thing missing is actually describing the Mwende-less inputs. That would even be a perfect time to include some more fire effects, like they're channeling Sothis' power through their body to keep up the attack.

Since this Byleth has the bow as their signature weapon, it's great to see it utilized more. That rapid jab is cool, and dash attack just clubbing someone with the bow got a chuckle out of me. Ricocheting arrows off Mwende to double-up on pressure is a fun way to incorporate these tools into A!Byleth's more rushdown-oriented gameplan. Likewise with the arrow impalement granting a buff to grab range, that's a great way to encourage going in with the arrows, without just slapping a combo pop-up on hit.

Speaking of impales, I'm impressed how well you've conveyed the attacks' animations in a couple sentences each. In the intro you mentioned wanting this Byleth to be "brutally efficient", and I'll say you nailed it. They go from intimidating spear strikes through dust clouds, into catching someone on their club and hurling their foe to the ground, then stabbing them with an arrow, pulling them in by that arrow, only to start bashing them against Mwende. It's like they're casually a badass without realizing it.

I really like the dynamic with F/BThrow, having FThrow be generally weaker since the enemy's already sandwiched between Byleth and Mwende before the grab occurred. On the other hand, DThrow shouldn't have a bury. It's already really powerful with Mwende nearby, giving it a bury on top quickly invalidates the other throws. Replacing it with a simple knockdown and tech-chase would keep it in line. That would even allow for another mix-up if Mwende is a bit too far for the regrab, since it would constrain the enemy's wakeup options.

Final Smash is amazing aesthetically, but it might be hard to implement in Ultimate, where there's an effort to keep them faster-paced. Funny enough, Smash Byleth has a similar problem, where it feels like the cinematic abruptly cuts out without letting the giant sword flail attack sink in.

Despite my quibbles, this is a great moveset overall. Hopefully someday, someone creates an African folklore strategy game with a protagonist like this.

10/25
Maple by Katapultar
+Respect for the main character of a made-up MMO being a DoT Tank and not a generic all-rounder with a broadsword. And she likes to summon hydras and xenomorph worms? Hell yes.

It took me about a week to figure out how I actually feel about the set. There's a lot of individual inputs/mechanics I appreciate, but the sheer mechanical density made things a tough read for me.

Gotta love how she takes "tank" to such a degree that she can't even jump without lag penalties. I wonder if her jumpsquat armor is a bit too subtle for its own good. I see how it fits into her gameplay, and it's certainly a unique OOS option, but I feel like it might be hard to communicate. Yoshi has a similar thing with his midair jump, yet I always forget he has it until an outside source reminds me, despite playing him since the very first Smash.

The tentacle tether is an oddly endearing way to give her some situational movement and pressure. Oh don't mind me, I'm just going to stick a bunch of tentacles to you and fling myself alongside you uWu. It has a great unsaid dynamic with devour, in that the aerials she'll be doing her tether combos with are all shield-based, so actually performing a big combo is also using up her devour points. This encourages her to a)Go for setups/mixups off tether hits instead of the same rote air combos, and b)Actually use her other throws since they provide value without worrying about tether stuff. It's also eerily similar to an idea I had for my potential L moveset, did not expect these 2 characters to have something like this in common.

Love the "hitstun immunity" mechanic, it's like an inverted armor that's a great fit for the genre. Here's to hoping this becomes a thing in platform fighters writ large. Likewise with the way she effectively has air shielding, you'd think there would be a game with that mechanic by now. (jots down notes for pipe-dream OC platform fighter)

I think she's got too much fine control over her attacks. So many have cancel windows or recoil adjustments or fake-outs. Hydra even lets her fine-tune frame data. It makes her feel more like a tryhard metagamer rather than a clumsy goof who improvs her way to victory. This also compounds the complexity/reading issue I had, there's already so much to unpack with the poison and her shield and tether, then with all the other failsafes on top...

Thankfully she does have a lot of more implicit playmaking potential. My favorite is tethering to Syrup's underside, then going into Venom Capsule to turn herself into a poisonous wrecking ball, then flinging herself off Syrup to gain speed for FAir. Or perhaps place DSmash, summon Hydra's spit, then use the self KB to cover more ground in poison? How about playing a fully charged DSmash, tethering to someone, then deliberately not doing anything that will break the tether; just walk forwards to keep the shield maintained until the 45% explosion kicks in! Stuff like is where the set is at its best, where she can't rely on having multiple low-committal safeguards and needs to leverage her core wacky stuff.

It's funny how one of her final smashes is just "gain invincibility", then the other is a full-blown boss form. And then she has an actual 1v3 boss mode that isn't based on either.

The taunts and such are a lot of fun, though I can't help but think her poison wool powers might actually be hard to deal with in certain matchups. Does seem on-brand for her to make a taunt into a secretly OP technique!

Overall, I rate the moveset "good, but broke my brain"

Rychu · Aug 15, 2024

It's comment time again!

I no-lifed Metal Gear Solid 3 and it's gonna be a solid few days before I can both get my hands on a copy of 4 and a PS3, so it's time to do this instead.

This time, the goal is to com some 'ments for set makers who's work I haven't gotten to yet this contest before I probably spend the next week reading Arctic Tern movesets to knock out a significant portion of the contest entries. Just to get more reading done, I am gonna knock out shorter sets first

The President by

Slavic

I've still never played a single moment of any Pikmin game despite them definitely being right up my alley. Also, even in this funny Pikmin moveset I can't escape Azur Lane mentions.

The President is a very cool take on the resource management that is only very lightly brushed up against in Olimar's smash moveset proper, and I like how his more greedy use of the cute little creatures makes him feel all the more heartless. I like that upgrades and money transfer across stocks and that the President has no Pluck mechanic - I can imagine scenarios where a President player makes a strategically-informed self-sacrifice to gain Pikmin back in a desperate ploy for power!

As for some common elements I've seen commented on for this set, I do sort of agree that the Smashes seem a bit odd in that old MYM way of basically feeling like an extra set of specials, but I can at least understand the design choice in wanting to minimize or eliminate menus in favor of efficient move-space economy. It doesn't end up bothering me too much to be honest, since at the very least this is restrained to a single input section that might be the single most committal one of the bunch beyond specials. Something that does raise an eyebrow is the nearly complete lack of aerials and complete lack of grab game without Pikmin, which feels just a tiny bit cruel. At least let the guy grab and slap for pete's sake! I appreciate the dedication sticking to the creative choice, but I feel like President's stocks are on a massive reverse snowball where he'll be SOL far quicker than one might anticipate.

Balance concerns aside, President is generally what I'd consider a set with heavy inspiration from an existing Smash set done right - there's enough new ideas and identity to prop up the moves or concepts already present and it comes with a conceptually intriguing and fun moveset, even if I think he'd be massively frustrating to play IRL. I'm gonna give The President a "B" for "Bapitalism.

Charon by

n88

I'm a simple man. I see Hades, I click like, simple as.

Charon is a simple set that was clearly made very quickly, though its not without its very fun concepts and enough MYM-veteran elbow grease to add a but of char to an otherwise somewhat undercooked moveset. I think the ideas present here are quite cool for a bullet-hell type set that comes very naturally for a lot of Hades bosses, and Charon being able to fill the screen with flying skulls, bounce them off jars and generally keep himself at arms length to protect his skeletal frame all feels very intuitive. I do really like the idea of offscreen-spawning projectiles in general so good implementation is sort of an automatic point in its favor.

As with a lot of sets of this nature I do think it sort of falls flat once you've exhausted Charon's boss fight abilities in the smashes, but as these things go, as I said, you've got the general know-how to make the set at least work together believably, even if its not too terribly exciting or memorable past a certain point. To be honest, I am having a bit of a struggle with things to say about Charon, since I don't have anything particularly stand-offish to harp on, I just also don't have much in the way of specific gushing outside of some cool implementation of his specials in a fun, if not very novel, way. Charon's getting a "C".

Golbat by

Kholdstare

I'm sure this has been mentioned before this, but the image work on Golbat is top-tier. Love the way this set looks.

Golbat is, I think, a moveset that I enjoy in theory, but in-practice it feels quite disjointed - which makes sense, given how the set was made based on in-set comments throughout. Golbat's various mechanics are neat: bloodsucking turning him from a lightweight to a heavyweight, using a mist that he can knock around in conjunction with, I think, an actually very cool interpretation of a "confusion" status effect in the form of Supersonic's interaction with said mist. Genuinely, I think that even individually these different mechanics are very strong and could be built upon to be the basis of 3 different sets. I suppose my problem is that the set isn't really built around those mechanics outside of the Blood Sucking (which definitely feels like it was the first thing created for the moveset) and moving the Haze around. Personally, I suppose I was looking for more interactivity with the confusion status effect since that's what I associate most with the Pokemon line, and I thought I was gonna get it based on the up special sort of controlling the illusions, but that was dropped afterwards. I feel bad because I felt primed to really enjoy this, and I think you could probably retrofit it to be something pretty strong if it was given more time to cook, but as it stands I unfortunately can't say I'm a huge fan outside of liking the mechanics in a sort of theoretical sense. Goldbat's gonna get a "D" from me.

Knuckles by

FazDude

No pressure but Knuckles is my second favorite Sonic character so if this is OOC in any way I will hold a grudge for the rest of my life.

Once again I find myself without much to say about a rather short moveset - there's nothing wrong with Knuckles, inherently, but it's genuinely such a bread-and-butter straightforward adaptation of his powerset that leaves little up to set maker's interpretation. There's not much interactivity between moves other than the occasional mention of whether its a good combo starter or follow-up, he doesn't really have any interesting mechanics that play off of his moves in any meaningful way, et cetera. I'm left feeling fairly underwhelmed, though its hard to say that if you're looking for a meat and potatoes moveset that resembles what Knuckles would most likely play like in a Smash Game with very little dressing, which I get the impression this set is, you honestly can't really complain too much. I dunno, not to my taste, but not not to my taste for this specific character either. Knuckles gets a D.

FazDude · Aug 15, 2024

Rychu said:
Knuckles by FazDude FazDude

<img src="https://smashboards.com/attachments/1723721605787-png.393470/" data-url="" class="bbImage" data-zoom-target="1" alt="1723721605787.png" style="" />

No pressure but Knuckles is my second favorite Sonic character so if this is OOC in any way I will hold a grudge for the rest of my life.

Once again I find myself without much to say about a rather short moveset - there's nothing wrong with Knuckles, inherently, but it's genuinely such a bread-and-butter straightforward adaptation of his powerset that leaves little up to set maker's interpretation. There's not much interactivity between moves other than the occasional mention of whether its a good combo starter or follow-up, he doesn't really have any interesting mechanics that play off of his moves in any meaningful way, et cetera. I'm left feeling fairly underwhelmed, though its hard to say that if you're looking for a meat and potatoes moveset that resembles what Knuckles would most likely play like in a Smash Game with very little dressing, which I get the impression this set is, you honestly can't really complain too much. I dunno, not to my taste, but not not to my taste for this specific character either. Knuckles gets a D.

Thanks for your critique - Admittedly, I wanted to stay away from any crazy mechanics since I didn’t feel like that was super fitting. Knuckles is a pretty to-the-point combatant who mainly focuses on fundamentals, and I wanted to incorporate that idea into his moveset. If you wanna give Knuckles mechanics, that’s cool - Bridges’ gliding mechanics are fun and overall I think their Knuckles is objectively better - but it’s something I personally strayed away from intentionally. I will agree I could have done more in the move synergy department, though.

Overall, I’d like to think I outdid my performance last year, at least in the “formatting everything to MYM standards” department. I will admit that MYM’s guidelines provide such a stark contrast to how I usually do movesets that even doing one moveset can feel super daunting, and while I’m very happy I was able to put out something this year, I still feel I’m struggling to really get in the groove of frame data and whatnot. Maybe I’ll really lock in next year, but we’ll see.

Enough of me rambling, though - Might try to squeeze in some extra comments later on.

BrazilianGuy · Aug 19, 2024

Hololive and Hades both start with an H and are not series I'm super familiar with, that's my logic for joining these two together. Gilius is here now too

Yeah I know nothing about anything that has to do with Hololive, so this was a lot to take in, I'm sorry if I'm grossly misinterpreting it, but it feels like wrestling, how there are these characters with their story arcs and the generations they come out. I don't know, the more I look into this the more confused I feel. Anywho, the moveset itself does do a great job at making her and her goons easy to understand even for an outsider, although I really don't see their animal themes (especially the Orca Girl).

The concept of a fighter with summons isn't anything new, but I like how much control she can keep of them, and how despite there being a lot of things against you (Like shackles even) she can still be a devastating snowballer. I also do think you did a great job at representing the side of her that knows every atom of the universe and it's location because it feels like you'd need a separate manual to play as her and execute all the crazy shenanigans she can get to. Not just for having to know how to take advantage of each goon, but also to know what moves change cause of them, which ones they attack after you, which ones they don't and you can use to set stuff up, the rotation in Koyori's side smash? All really big brain things I would not be able to really do I think.

If I had to pick a go-to goon, it would most likely be Lui, I enjoy the rather simplicity that her moves have as they work very well to set up into other moves. I also REALLY love that Lui's Smash has her put foes to Sleep and Chloe's Smash prefers to be used against debilitated foes. That's the mastermind stuff that's really clever and fun to see in the set, how even between the goonies they got synergy.

Also bonus points for having taunts that do customization, really wish there were more of those in Smash.

All in all, while trying to understand Hololive is a bit too complex to me, Laplus is complex in a way I'd really enjoy watching in tournaments as people who are cracked with the character set up the whole squad and just wreak havoc. She gets a ShortQueen/10

Funny we had a Hades moveset this MYM and a Zagreus one, kinda poethic.

I know very little about Hades as a game, I just know its a rogue-like, so out of the bat, the boons mechanic fits in really well, giving players a way to customize Zagreus to their liking, without making him too insanely different. I also liked the focus on less weapons, going with what I assume are his main ones. I do wish the boons changed more than just his specials, maybe his forward air or other normals.

Adding to that, getting more details on the boons (how long do they last? how frequently they appear? can foes do anything about them?) but that could be applied to the whole set, with it having very few descriptions on move usage. Also, more pictures would help to show his weapons, like Idk if his forward air is done with a gun or a cannon, so an image or description would help. I also would like to know a bit about Zagreus and what he is like.

I also appreciate that there is frame data, but like? No ending lag on an Up Aerial? Can he just loop it infinitely? That can use a lot of work to be honest.

The part I liked the most was the grab, I don't know why but the description of Zagreus grabbing people by strangling them made me think of him as Homer Simpson from the popular animated sitcom The Simpsons. That made me laugh for way more than it should, I will now always have Zagreus and Homer connected in my mind.

Overall a boon/10

Gilius, not gonna lie, as I was reading I started calling him Julius because it rolled off the tongue with more ease, but he is a fun arcade pick! Also fun as a pair for Torb in this MYM, it’s interesting because they may both be dwarfs but one is full aggressive and the other is more zoning based.

I liked his Specials, even though I was expecting his Side Special to be what his Dash Attack is, but the alternative you went with gives him a good way to answer against projectiles. I also liked how you did the balance of his Down and Neutral Special. I like that he rides the chicken and can use it to recover by sacrificing them Yoshi style.

His throws are a nice element, love how you gave him a big emphasis on this, and an extra input for a Throw is something so simple but that you don’t see that often, really awesome. That paired with his unique movement makes him feel straight out of his series, really awesome.

Your interest for Golden Axe also really shines with the set, containing tons of references and nods to smaller parts of the franchise, like getting attacks from his descendant, Belmont style.

Other moves I really enjoyed were the Down Air kick with it’s triumphant lead up. Also, he has a BOULDER move, though its a Down Smash, that gives him nice utility, and it had Bowser Jr. neutral special mentioned, based.

All in all, loved the berserking dwarf, great set, He gets a ChickenPiece/10 from me

GolisoPower · Sep 2, 2024

ÅÅÅÅÅAAAAAAÆUUUUÜÜÜÜÜÜÜRG this took forever...

GOLISOPOWER'S COMMENT LIBRARY

needed a bit of dusting off.

Anyways!

Today's set comments...

Friedrich der Große by

Arctic Tern

And more to come, ~~hopefully~~...

n88 · Sep 2, 2024

Miraidon by

Hyper_Ridley
This was a fun read and a pretty solid moveset - admittedly I can't say it's a huge favorite, but it had some attacks that got my brain turning over and cracked the ol' tentative votelist. Plus it's cool to see you back in action. I have to admit I don't have an incredible thesis on this one, I'm unfortunately not writing my overall thoughts while super fresh on the moveset. I read this one a while ago but then had kind of a stupid... checks notes 3 months, wow. With life calming down for me a little bit I'm getting the old reading train moving again and getting some comments in. Miraidon is top of the pile because I've just been sitting on all these notes since June. Might have to revisit him come time to make choices about Ye Olde Votelist, but no sense on sitting on the notes I had any longer (or as long as I did even).

"if only there were 3 universal inputs in Smash Bros I could use for this" - yeah it's a shame that Super Tilt Bros Ultimate doesn't have anything like that.
"This creates a shockwave that immediately covers the terrain across half a BFP, extends 3 units into the air" - surprised that it's taller than it is wide but that does feel very dramatic.
"Miraidon's attacks inflict an extra second of hitsun" - a flat full extra second would keep opponents in hitstun after their knockback ended a lot of the time, I think, based on how fast Ult knockback is. I feel like even with the positioning and timing restrictions there's proooobably something gross that can be done with that.
opening with a TCG attack is very neat, not something I'd expect from a Pokeset. Fun attack, too - wouldn't mind shading in some details about speed and whether it can ricochet off shields.
Dragon Breath damage is a bit tame but you don't have to sell me on the electric terrain effect being spooky, as noted above. I like the idea of this move generally but I'd be tempted to take his electric terrain hitstun stuff down a notch and increase the coverage of this move a bit. (Admittedly not an opinion informed by, say, the rest of the moveset)
"anyone with a brain cell is going to easily evade the bolt." - no brain cells, FSmash only, Final Destination.
Koraidon does what Miraidon't. (There's a "Miraidon't" typo in DSpec, which I wouldn't normally point out but I'm honor bound if they're funny)
I read every "ha!" interjection in the voice of Alf.
Delayed hits from USpec/DSpec definitely layer with his other stage control tricks. Not surprised based on the Multiversus characters you were picking.
Shield Spec "non-combat mode" is a funny wrinkle. It's a bit of a heavyweight implementation for an optional silly thing but it's fun!
Jab having an eye on the elec terrain exploits is good.
All of Miraidon's boosted moves seem to have pretty hefty price tags - kinda wish the smashes were more front-loaded so I had a better idea of how easy it was to charge Hadron Engine. Or maybe that could just be laid out a bit more in the mechanic?
- It seems like he's losing it pretty fast but that's not a big deal if he gains it fast. Though the idea that he has to charge a Smash means it's presumably somewhat committal. Kinda surprised he has no charge Special to use as an alt option, though I guess USpec is kinda in that niche. It feels like SSpec cries out to be a manual charge over a passive ROB charge though.
Something like the lingering UTilt hitbox with the lingering weak upward hit is the kind of thing that's probably doing something janky in elec terrain with the huge hitstun buff.
DTilt is goofy but neat.
Big dash attack with some mechanical flash is a good call for this kind of character - was kind of expecting the "I am a motorcycle" stuff to be here before starting the set but of course it wound up on Shield Special instead.
Interesting to see some charge normals creeping into the set. Does seem like his Hadron gains are pretty modest across most of these, so unless the Smashes pick up the pace, activating Hadron seems pretty occasional.
"I recommend the tipper hitbox." - ah, thank you sir, I imagine that will pair nicely with the white.
"Miraidon pulls back its tail before stabbing forwards underneath itself, aimed downwards on a 35 degree angle." - what if he just locked his legs completely straight and dropped downward instead?
Grab game feels pretty functional - nothing too flashy but hey throws are throws.
Small thing but I do like seeing characters that find a good reason to tamper with the default smash charge times/charge strengths.
"After changing your pants yet again" - this move is ruining me.
FSmash is really cool, "projectile that fires other projectiles" is a really fun space.
"You can usually expect to enter Hadron mode once or twice a stock" - his Smashes do give him pretty easy access once he gets himself some space.
I think right now an unsung quality of FSmash is that it's just a good general-purpose input to charge if the opponent is off-stage or combing their hair or whatever. Even if the opponent evades or blocks, he's getting Hadron charge.
Really like the design around tagging the floor with electricity - his Specials do make it fairly easy.
"Bad Miraidon players" - funny plays are good in their own way.

Camilla by T TortoiseNotTurtle
This one doesn't quite get into the details enough to really bring Camilla to life for me. I'm often not sure how her attacks are meant to feel "weighted" against each other and at times moves can feel very perfunctory. There's a good enough sense of character in the moveset though and I'd call it a success on that front - playing up her identity as a goofy fanservice vehicle was the right call I think. I don't know Camilla very well, never played Fates, but sometimes you just have to acknowledge what you're working with instead of fighting against it. There's something here and I cracked a smile a few times so I'm glad you went for it - probably not getting the jamcon nod from me though.

I do wish this character was like slightly more sensibly designed visually, I dig the color scheme and generally big axe dragon rider cool, just, y'know. I guess the outfit goes with the character though.
Treating the wyvern as a sort of superstate is an interesting take - I've thought about wyvern FE characters a few times and my instinct was always to try to make it a bit more "normal" but I think going big probably makes sense for Camilla personality wise.
- It does seem like she gets a pretty generous amount of time in the "superstate"? Like basically a third of her time (10 out of every 30 seconds) unless she gets tagged with something and knocked off the wyvern.
  - Possibly mitigated by needing to spend her resource on other tricks though.
I wonder if just mounting Marzia would shake up her ground game a lot by shifting her main hurtbox upward and forcing opponents to jump at her or use high-hitting attacks.
SSpec is fun but missing a few key details I think - like how easy it is to jump over or whether it can be moved past at all. It talks about Camilla being able to exploit the wall but I'm not sure how feasible that is.
The numbers on SSpec seem pretty generous - it'd take 2-3 beefy attacks to fully deplete the wall even when starting from half, and projectiles don't work on it since it's a reflector. The 3 second wait on regnerating Bond is sort of a slap on the wrist. I do like that she has meaningful meter-driven options to compete with her superstate, but this could be a little pushed.
Ike reference makes a lot of sense for USpec - the application for pressuring armor-heavy opponents is very fun but the move doesn't really get too deep into how else it can be used and from there the set kiiiinda starts coasting a little bit and doesn't get too deep on how moves are used.
"Slice to meet you" - good move name, I approve of it.
The Slap on FSmash definitely reads a little out of place - I actually don't think it's a problem in theory for her FSmash to be kind of a down-step in terms of how dramatic the animation is. There's a subversiveness to it that feels funny and I don't hate it, but it feels weird for it to hit harder than her other attacks.
- I do like the bonus against taunts, that's fun flavor.
- I wish this attack was a Jab 2 or she had a chargeable Jab since she's getting slap-happy there and Bigger Slap would be a logical extension of that.
I think FSmash is an outlier and the moveset has a good animation sense otherwise.

Bloodless by U UserShadow7989
This definitely feels like a classical MYM archetype; the big-mechanical-setpiece projectile zoner. There's some faint lineage to goop sets and other "spread your influence around the stage" sorts of guys too maybe - I feel like Bloodless would be meeting up with Knull and Miraidon at the family reunion. That's not a knock on the set at all, mind you. If there's anything holding it back it's more just the Jamcon Factor of it all - the slightly unsupported idea here or the input that's doesn't really pop there (I'm mainly thinking about BAir). It still has the flair to set itself apart and some fun little touches that lend her character though, a lot of "oh that's neat" moments throughout. It's probably more of a solid comfort-read sort of thing versus a real standout for me but there's no shame in that for a jamcon.

Dig the pseudo-float, small touch that feels fun as something to build around. Doesn't come back that much but I get it, jamcon.
"Naturally, we will not be giving her a free full heal every stock." - cowardly, should have called this moveset Spineless.
The twist on Bowser's Tough Guy is fun - I do think the set is overestimating how much Bowser gets out of that; even at 0% Tough Guy only has a shot of working against rapid jabs, multi-hits and real cruddy projectiles. It's not something Bowser can bank on in ordinary situations and it's unlikely to protect him from most gimp attempts - maybe the odd Mario Fireball (I think even that has to be stale to avoid cracking Tough Guy though). I get what you're going for though!
NSpec/SSpec/DSpec are a strong trio of inputs to kick off the set.
Smashes are fun - big, flashy animations.
DSmash has pretty crazy coverage, I missed at first how much you could extend it. She is on a timer and meter constraint for blood spatter though, I don't think it's unreasonable just didn't jump out at first pass what she could do off that input. The bury here is also maybe a little underexplored? Intuitive applications but it's a nice trick that doesn't really come back around.
"If this sounds strong" - not really, honestly. Link can do it by just walking! Especially for a move that presumably doesn't have crazy activity and is described as having reactable start-up, I don't think it's a big deal at all.
Lots of fun little melee tidbits throughout, I dig the Dash Attack/DTilt mix-ups and NAir being an everything button that becomes straight-up unsafe if you do manage to really bottom out your meter.
Ah, the rare fall-then-stall.
"As an important reminder, taking damage while being grabbed (aside from a pummel) can cause a grab release" - can hits without knockback actually hit you out of a grab? Probably not a big deal if generally true, could specifically work for this moveset either way.
FThrow is simple but fun, always dig the "push them through the set-up" type effect and it's really elegantly handled here.
DThrow with the light armor mechanic is fun - I always feel a little silly about going for Snake DThrow because it's such an easy button to hit when looking for variation in throws but it is fun and the armor gives her a unique reason to like it.
I appreciate the little winks at the Belmonts here and there - there aren't a ton of direct ones but I feel like she also has kind of a similar "oddball projectile trajectories" thing going on in her core inputs that gives her a sense of kinship with those guys.
"If her set is a little too gory for you, you can opt to instead cover the stage in pepto bismol." - crazy that Bloodless is a Danganronpa fan.

Akuma by

GolisoPower
Killing Surge is interesting mechanically and I respect the willingness to take a swing like that - translating guys from other fighters is always really interesting: what do you keep, what do you carve away, what do you invent for the new context? This is a slightly oddball choice in that it's making a mechanical meal out of a character note that his home series doesn't. I think that's always gonna mark this set out as very specific to you and not like a Purist Quintessential Akuma Adaptation but I don't know that that's such a bad thing; it's cool to get something with a certain sense of perspective to it.

Ashura Senku is a neat idea too, I like the fighting game input tied to the shield button as a sort of unique command dodge. Really fun adaptation choice. Generally his Specials are stylistically cool - always a sucker for a big multi-option thing and I like squeezing in the super inputs, I think it makes a lot of sense on this type of character.

The set doesn't always really succeed at explaining itself or its ideas, though. A certain level of familiarity with Ryu and Ken's kits is taken for granted and a lot of things just aren't explained. Moves also just really do not explore some of the big ways they'd affect gameplay. As cool as Ashura Shenku is, the input never at all touches on the idea that he can cancel a bunch of his normals into it and it therefore makes him crazy safe on shield (like sure it's got some lag but given how much space he gets off it that does not matter). The idea that he can cancel into it at all only gets brought up as a bit of an afterthought, a single sentence in Held Jab, several inputs later.

The moveset struggles a bit to keep his gameplan and his myriad options well-defined. That's not crazy given you're trying to write something as big and technical as a Ryu riff on a Jamcon timeframe, of course. I'd mark this as another failure for the "Goliso pick a normal Jamcon" challenge but I really respect the hell out of you taking swings on these. Shin Akuma feels a bit busted, I'm not really sold on some of the combos described as making sense, and I wish certain ideas came back around a little more. But I did walk away from the moveset thinking Akuma was a pretty cool scary guy so you got something going on.

As a man who was born in February of '94 I also have to regretfully inform you that it's been 30 years rather than 20. I know, it doesn't feel right to me either.
I read this on the train and don't have bullet points.

Rychu · Sep 7, 2024

BrazilianGuy · Sep 10, 2024

Trying to do some commenting

I'll start this by saying that I find this moveset very impressive for what it does. Designing a character with two movesets is always very nice and challenging, and the concept of her changing so fluently through the usage of odd or even numbered attacks is super unique, don't think I've ever seen something like that in fighting games as a whole. The orchestra theme also goes a really nice way with Fried's cohesion, having the name of the attacks be a reference to it, and calling the modes Fortissimo and Pianissimo, as someone who used to spend a lot of time in the piano, that's nice.

I also may not understand anything about Azur Lane or ships and war stuff, but it's clear that you do, I got to learn quite a bit about this franchise that's very far away from my interest radius and also about some real-life stuff, Movesets can also allow you to learn and I find that fascinating.

However, I will say that I couldn't get too invested in the character herself. Being the personification of a Nazi Ship is a little bit much for me honestly, I know it's not meant in any horrible way and is simply what she is in the game and that doesn't mean anything but idk man. As I write comments I try to find and define what I really care about and value in movesets, I believe that I really care about the character that is being brought to life through the Moveset, and I couldn't really get with around to her. I'm not sure if this makes any sense, I do really enjoy the design of the moveset, I just don't really like the character itself, which is a big deal, to me at least.

Again, impressive work, everything I've read from you is really awesome, I just didn't like the character choice, that's it. As a final note, her getting to ignore drowning is really nice. A Ship/10

Therion is a very standard character, kind of the definition of a Rogue in terms of how he is presented with moves that alternate between using a knife, a sword, and some magic. I've never played Octopath Traveler since it requires reading, a thing I never learned, but I could get a grasp at what Therion was all about from the set which is nice.

Steal mechanic is very funny and fits well with a thief, I can think of a couple of funny interactions like just stealing Wario's bike and preventing him from getting it back or stealing a Belmont axe. His second mechanic, Boost, is quite simple for what it is, but at the same time I wished it had some cohesion as to what gets a buff, it makes sense that all his specials get some, but then only Up Tilt and Dash Attack get them in the normals section. This is more of a personal thing, it doesn't ruin the character, just my thoughts.

I found the Skins part very pretty, and overall really appreciated the visuals the set had. Also gotta appreciate someone who puts a Classic Mode, that's always cool.

Also, "Edgy Sex Kick" for his neutral air made me laugh more than I think it should, I know it's hella basic but I think it's the attack I'll remember the most out of this set, and the "Lock you in a chest" Down Throw and the alternating Down Smashes.

All in all, Therion is simple, has some fun attacks, and some nice mechanics, I personally found him cooler than Pumpkinmon, but I still think Tigershark was the best of your sets this MYM. I give the thief boy a Boosted/10

Risk of Rain seems like a game I'd enjoy from what I've gathered of Bandit, and Drifter served to reinforce this sentiment, nice. I liked how she uses her resources, the way it combines smash combat with resource management is pretty fun and could lead to quite a lot of cerebral plays with her but she also doesn't depend only on that to fight. Neutral Air was a nice subversion by making it so she doesn't only wanna use Scrap for Smash Attacks and a chance to get her items.

My favorite move in the entire set has to be the Side Special. I main Kragg in Rivals of Aether and what can I say, heavies with objects that they can hit around and screw over other people with are something I enjoy. Speaking of, I didn't expect her to be that heavy and big, from the image I kind of imagined her to be like an Amongus in size but then got jumpscared with the DK weight and Dedede height.

One nitpicky thing is that at the start you use They to refer to Drifter, nothing big just wanted to mention it.

Also, I enjoyed seeing she has a varying Final Smash, that was pretty neat and fun, wished she had other extras such as alts and other details but that doesn't break the set or anything. All in all, Drifter is a nice cool heavy with a cool mechanic, she gets a Scrap/10

Ayy Chonk moveset, this one presents itself as a Bowser moveset before making it clear it's actually for "Bowser", an honestly really nice bait and switch as I view this as basically a horror moveset. I guess you could also call it a Creepy Pasta which is more fitting as it's a messed up Subject Bowser, very unique take.

Speaking of Unique, I still really like the Unique way moves are described in your sets, but I do think I prefer the 'western' way, nothing wrong with it being done like a manga but just personal preferences. The manga style does really add to it once the images come into play, your art is always fantastic man, really captures just how messed up this Bowsaw is.

The almost "listing an SCP" vibes through the moveset are very nice, love how this thing gets called the Subject, and I also love how it mixes elements from Bowser. There's obvious stuff, like the Tanooki tail being in there which is neat, the various animations where things from the Mario Universe come from his mouth (I love how messed up it is to imply this thing ate Jr.) and how it's Forward Smash kind of feels like a combination of his OG and his New one, starting as a Dropkick before it becomes a headbut attack.

I'd also take the fire ball neutral special over his Flame Breath any day of the week lol.

"Bowser" has a great feel of a horrific take on the beloved villain, it's a really bold direction to take him but that which I really liked, probly your favorite set from you rn (although I've only read Camilla and Dagded so that could change). A La Criatura/10

I like how it's just Poképark 2 Whimsicott, she's not even a major character but its just her here. I don't really get why the choice, but I love Poképark so I dig the choice, it does also give it some nice flavour with the Poster animations and the Down Special.

The moveset makes sense, it has her use the air to her advantage, just being taken by it and having amazing control of what she does while airborne. I do think a character who can jump 6 times, in the middle of all these jumps use her mobility side special, use down special, use Neutral special, use Up special could be a bit annoying if they just decide to camp you, but low weight does help with that issue, also it ain't no ground fighter, plus it fits with her hard to catch nature from PP2.

I enjoyed the way you did the usual Grass Draining move, I would love to see that be used off-stage since she can obviously recover and it has her and her foe go down slowly, sounds like it could be nasty. I also wish that her Down Special Cotton's had their size explained since they are the 1 thing she does in Poképark. And I do like how you make the most out of the few elements she has such as the horns, the fairy wind and the vines with thorns.

All in all Whimsi is an enjoyable read that has a unique way to navigate the air that isn't too close to the other Aerial Fairy type already in Smash, with nice elements. A PosterThief/10

Sure, I may not know this character, nor its franchise, nor anything really, but the paragraphs at the start really helped me get invested on her as a character. However, what really had me sold on her was THE GUN. I FW fighting game characters that use guns, be it Elphelt, Agent Smith, Chris Redfield or Joker Persona 5, slap a gun to the fighter and I'm hooked.

Safe to say, Cordelia and her multitude of bullets did as any Gun Character do to my brain and had me interested. Also, the rich character having so many bullets to pick and choose is really nice and privileged of her.

Speaking of privileges, I think Down Special is my favorite of her inputs, starting as a seemingly normal counter move but with more flavor as she brings backup, but the reveals a very well-developed minion mechanic, being able to call him in and have him also take advantage of the bullets! It's also a very nice detail that she can ignore her problematic jump height by footstooling him, literally cheating the system. She also gets more unique mobility with her Side Special and Jab, other great moves! I also liked grab cause it shows her character really well+more interactions with the Down Special buddy, neat!

The Moveset had great pacing and loved reading your stuff, at this point I had only read Voyager, who was really impressive with distinct specials for Ground and Air, but I think I liked the short gunner more, really excited to read your other movesets

She gets a 139.8CM/10

n88 · Sep 15, 2024

Symmetra by

BrazilianGuy
Still owe ya an Ed read, but with this one I've completed the Brazil MYM27 Jamcon Trio. This one doesn't feel quite as mechanically adventurous as Buzz Buzzard or Arum to me - though tbf some of that may be a MYM bias of seeing a lot of zany setup stuff over the years, I think this one would probably scan as wackier in Smash. The amount of indirection and non-flinching damage (with Jab/NAir and I think the turrets?) in her kit would definitely give her a pretty distinct vibe. All of her central inputs are pretty neat - the Jab/NAir in particular stood out to me as a really fun take on the Mega Man style Jab/NAir input.

Definitely some of the later attacks don't feel as strong and they seem to pull from some pretty oddball places. I think the choices in what to do with the attacks are all solid though? Don't know Symmetra myself, never been an Overwatch head, so grain of salt on this, but I felt like everything made sense visually and the set did a good job of pulling these stray animations into something cohesive. You could probably do much wackier stuff with this character's ability set but I think there's a logic to keeping the normals lighter weight like this - they'd still benefit from a slightly harder sell on how they fit into her gameplan though.

She's a very fun, breezy read overall though - always have a good time with your sets.

Rambi & Squawks by

BridgesWithTurtles
Another pretty charming little jamcon set - I felt like this one stayed unusually strong throughout for a quick set? Like a lot of jamcons tend to fall somewhere on the "strong opening, peter out a bit at the end" spectrum. I guess the grab game is maybe a bit basic, but it feels like the throws provide an intentional and well-considered "normal" grab game versus the set actually losing momentum.

Rambi if anything built momentum throughout for me. I was a little iffy during the standards (where he feels like he's reaching a little harder for material) but warmed up to the set by the time I was getting through the aerials (where there are some clever subtle choices that make good use of Rambi's weird physics).

The control scheme on USpec is maybe a little awkward? I get that it's trying to keep the Egg Shoot control consistent but mashing jump here feels odd. Does feel right to how Squawks controlled in DKC2 if I remember right though.
I think Rambi is maybe a little too hard up with Squawks gone? He's basically got a 20 second period where if he gets hit off-stage at all he's kinda just cooked; locking out SSpec in the air without Squawks feels needlessly harsh.
I do kinda think NSpec could have brought up the way it can be used during Squawks' endlag? Nothing wrong with the way it's laid out but I did feel like I was missing something as I read it and it clicked more later when the Jab dropped the information.
Torchlight is maybe the one part of the set that didn't completely sing for me - I like the concept of the mechanic booster but I'm not sure how well it really coheres?

I'm straying into nitpicks here though, which is a bit of a misfocus. The set doesn't have a lot of flashy inputs given it's so even-keeled, but it's making a lot of little choices I like throughout. Tipper mechanics are always neat to me and I'm also a huge sucker for busy attacks with multiple hitboxes, so a lot of little touches throughout that are right up my alley. As touched on briefly earlier, the care put into making their movement feel accurate is really cool, definitely feels right to someone who played a lot of DKC2. This is a set for a character you might clock as slightly awkward and limited character, but really sells them as making sense in an organic way. Nice work.

Oogie Boogie by

Arctic Tern
None of the gifs loaded on mobile and I was really reading this like "dang these are some of the crustiest images in a set ever" but I see revisiting the set now that I was mistaken. (Though tbh this has only sold me on continuing to read sets on tablet, I hate looking at gifs)

This was my final jamcon read and a pretty strong one - the core NSpec here is really strong and inventive and the ways you interact with the dice feel really satisfying. Funny that RNG came up on the Discord today, I think this kind of "press your luck" mechanic can be really fun and the chance of the "crit fail" here that you can try to cheat away from is very cool. Also Ooogie Boogie yelling "snake eyes" is maybe the only thing I remember him doing in the movie (besides like... generally dancing around a lot?) so that checks out.

Generally I think Oogie Boogie has this very fun energy as a guy who can toss a lot of stuff out there and hey all of it is pretty ephemeral, but he can get up to something else if the opponent puts too much focus on breaking his toys. The dice are the most fun implementation of that but the set gets some good mileage out of the shadow stuff in a natural way, his shadow play stuff really neatly also slots in with the way he wants to play even without the shadow around.

The moveset is pretty buttoned up past the Smashes (except maybe DTilt and a couple of the throws - btw does he free up before the second hit of DTilt? I was a bit fuzzy on that), but I think it's in the set's favor that he gets a lot of pretty normal tools outside the funky core - I think the set really gives the right weight to the zanier stuff and the simpler stuff. Definitely my favorite of your jamcons and I might favor it over Angwitch even? It doesn't take as big of mechanical swings but I think it's a tighter package. You were really killing it this contest.

Jamcon nod to Oogie Boogie. Nice work, all.

n88 · Sep 29, 2024

Suisen by

Katapultar
Not sure I have a clever thesis statement on this one, but it is a big crazy set. The bombast certainly suits Disgaea's vibe. I think it skews a little excessive for me; some moves are maybe coming up with one or two more wrinkles than they need and I think he's probably a bit overtuned in a few places. That said, the zaniness is of course offset by a lot of clever stuff and fun ideas. Not sure I've read any modern Kat set without geeking out over at least one move; USmash was a favorite here, so the streak is alive. I think overall though, Suisen lands in that slightly awkward space for me where I'm a thumbs up on it but it's coming from a stylistic place that's pushing one too many boundaries for me; I think he'll have other bigger fans than I. You know what you're doing though, and it's your way to play around in that space and push the limits a little bit. I imagine this will not be my favorite Kat set of the contest but I still had a good time reading.

(Apologies for the delay - I wanted to take notes and that always slows me down quite a bit even when I'm having a good time)

crazy shield mechanic, really dig it. Felt at first it might be too harsh that he learns + gets the damage cut against attacks after the first? Like the damage cut makes sense to me because his shield is just super fragile otherwise but I wonder if he should only learn the first attack he blocks while he keeps his shield up, so that he can still get pressured a little bit. On the other hand, the amount of time he can even hold shield at standard depletion is so short that maybe it makes sense. Might depend on if Learned does anything beefy later in the set.
- Nothing toooooo crazy, coming back around later. I'm still wishy washy on this point, it's the kind of thing I'd probably want to test if I was actually implementing this.
second floating Kat boy I've read this contest.
the self-repair is a bit spooky, being able to fully heal off any hit by making space is a lot. Even if it's a bit slow it's a lot of pressure on the opponent.
I think it's a little ambiguous in Tapped DSpec how he exits the stance without canceling?
"Actually, it is possible to make enemies Forget their grab if some facet of their grab game can be countered, like if one of their throws applies a delayed hitbox on use. Oops." - doesn't the last paragraph in White in the pink box describing Forget contradict this?
"Actually, they can be made to Forget 1 extra move for every 4 moves Suisen has learned from them, so they can have up to 5 moves Forgotten if you have learned 16 of their moves." - I'm not sure about this. It does require landing several counters but the counter sets up into itself and with some of the other tricks he has being kinda nasty, it feels a bit much. I'm never a big fan of shutdown/negation mechanics though, so grain of salt.
- Returning to this after reading through the whole set, I didn't feel like Forget-stacking was really super necessary and he'd be fine without it.
Suisen can't cancel Held DSpec until he's past the early counter frames, right? Maybe that's in there and I just missed it. Without a visual cue, the set-up doesn't really work, and if he could cancel before the counter frames it'd just give him a discount on start-up.
I'm not sure about the Held DSpec frame data design - like I think in practice since he's not committed to the counter and some of his normals are pretty quick out of the counter, it feels like it's usually gonna be best to cancel once you're in the start-up? And like, at a certain point he's just kinda creating the usual "is this guy gonna go for a real attack or his counter" dynamic you get with a regular counter, but this one doesn't have endlag.
Jade Bird Attack is really cool, love the big flashy payoff. I do think the beam feels pretty free to chuck around with its combo of range and speed, but maybe it's fine when it doesn't actually deal damage? Not sure, getting the reticule anyway means it still has a payoff. This is tough to compare to stuff in Smash.
The torpedoes get a little complex for my taste? There's a lot going on here, control wise.
"though your opponent should realistically have more damage at that point." - USpec seems like it'd have some pretty high snowball potential since Learned attacks only reset on Suisen getting KOed.
- Ahhh this is acknowledged just a bit later in the move after I made this note.
*Shield Special is pretty simple but fun.
I do think so far some of the Lock-On effects are adding complexity but not necessarily a ton of value? He's already a pretty technical character without them and I don't feel like the Lock-On effects really dig into broader playstyle concerns as much as his core stuff.
"Dash Attack deals a varying hits, and foes must hold out their shield for all of them or else they will get hit." - the attack is only listed as having 3 active frames right now. I don't think they could conceivably drop shield once they start getting hit, if they're getting rehit faster than once per frame. The idea of it being a multi-hit conflicts somewhat with the idea of him moving at Fox Illusion speeds and having such short activity; might need to slow it down a hair.
Not really a fan of the DTilt status effect; feels excessive. The delayed hit part is cool.
The FSmash drones might be a bit overtuned. Hitbox size and KO percent on the follow-up are both pretty generous. Conceptually it's fun though. Tower of Light lists its active frames as 20-40 - I thought that was maybe meant to denote the timing being a little variable as a follow-up, but the FAF is set so maybe it has 21 frames of activity? That seems a bit high, especially with very little endlag.
- This does feel like the kind of move that's balanced around the idea that people will play perfectly against it when I imagine it would be quite easy for opponents to mess up and the follow-up would probably go through a lot despite theoretically always being possible to evade (even before you start compounding the complexity of the situation with delayed hitboxes and such). I think that's a wider MYM issue though, I'm very guilty of this also.
Definitely feeling like the self-healing is a bit much in conjunction with Suisen's zoning tools. Personally I'd recommend capping how much of it he can heal at a portion of damage (I dunno, 0.4x or something?); I think it's fine for the incentives that self-repair creates to still be there, but he has a really robust zoning game and a strong recovery.
FSmash is a really wacky input, the cube stuff kinda goes nuts at the end. Generally I like the delayed cube being created with lock-on but a couple of the things it does feel a bit unintuitive? Following Suisen around on contact and the self-repair inheritance both feel a little left-field; nothing else in the kit works like that and I don't think it'd be clear why the self-repair damage buff happened. They're both fun ideas for stuff a construct in this kit could do, but it feels a little mechanically stuffed.
Generally having this feeling going through the kit that it's probably a biiiit busy for me? I feel bad saying that because I know I had similar thoughts on Vania/Fatla and Voyager (the last one of yours I remember reading off the top of my head). There's stuff in here that's really brilliant, but I'm not sure I'm sold enough on every piece to 100% get behind it.
- Though I was very wishy washy on how much it was an issue for me in Vania/Fatla and it may have still been my SV+ if I'd been able to finish reading - they were really only competing with Iz.
Speaking of stuff that's brilliant, I adore USmash. Great marriage of funky animation and weird gremlin mechanics, this is exactly what I come to MYM for.
- I do think the sideways throw is probably a bit juiced? I think even with the high start-up and having to go through USmash first you could probably chuck it out pretty reliably if the opponent gets hit off-stage, and it feels like it's probably worth doing in that situation since if it connects the opponent just evaporates.
I do think the superarmor on Suisen's NAir keeps it viable as an OoS option. It's not fast enough that it's ideal, but I think it keeps the move very workable on defense, especially since he can heal damage he tanks. Tanking through an attack and then hitting the opponent out of it also still works for learning attacks.
- Analysis on something this complex is really tough because it's hard to compare Suisen to existing things - I think broadly he feels a little overtuned to me because at like... a high level he's like "okay I'm good at zoning but I'm slow and light!" but then the mechanics compensate for him being light hard enough that I don't think durability is a real weakness of the set anymore and it feels like a lot of moves are either not that slow or they have some defensive trick that largely compensates for the speed.
"it can give the foe a little something to get around if they’re approaching Suisen." - I mean, the move was packing plenty of that already I think. It's an aerial with a slow-but-not-crazy FAF (comparable to Mario FAir) that fires a Thoron-sized beam across the whole screen. You're getting a lot of hitbox for your investment. It's a cool move, don't get me wrong, fun to have a big payoff on the DSmash reflectors. Feels tough to contest already if he's got the space for it at all, though.
BAir is really fun, dig how the vacuum effect pairs with his trapping stuff - kinda like USmash, just feels like a wacky but intuitive idea that plugs into the kit in a really sharp way.
Command grab UAir that grabs and throws downward, now this is MYM.
DAir is fun, dig the drill.
- The aerials don't address landing lag too much but they talk about usages enough that I can kinda infer it and that seems fine.
I do like Suisen's funky long range grab that doesn't work well out of shield, I think that's a good choice for the set. Grabbing in mid-air is maybe a bit spicy.
Enfeeble isn't the craziest debuff but I don't really love it in the context of already having some reservations about his healing.
Airgrab raised an eyebrow but the throws feel pretty conservative about air setups for the most part - BThrow does allow for the cheeky stage-spike but it's not too too crazy.
FThrow and Far DThrow stray a bit into wacky MYM territory but his other throws keep it pretty basic and get good mileage out of the funky premise of his grabgame.
Hitlag extension on every melee attack does feel like a maybe excessively annoying thing about Far DThrow, I think that would mess with me a lot - especially if an opponent uses a multi-hit or something, just having the hand on them is really gonna punish that. Like I'd say this is a passable throw even with no learned moves just for the hitlag extension effect.
I do appreciate that the set doesn't get too over-explain-y about certain things - a few of his Special options are pretty under-stated but still make sense in the whole.

bubbyboytoo · Oct 1, 2024

It's that time of year again! Our very own little now-properly-established annual tradition, Movetober is like Inktober for moves (and occasionally other Smash-adjacent things), tasking anyone willing to participate with writing a little something for one of the following prompts every day in October. As always, participation is not mandatory, just a fun little side thing to keep those creative juices flowing. Remember to keep reading and commenting on movesets, too, reading period is still happening.

This time around, we polled the MYM community for prompts, so all these came from you guys! Some of them are a lot more esoteric than the last two years' prompts, so don't feel bad if you can't come up with anything for them. The system we've established is to post them in a thread in the Discord once you're finished with each day, but if you wanted to post them here in the thread I suppose there's nothing stopping you. Either way, here's to a fun month full of writing!

1st: Write something that fulfills any of the Movetober prompts from 2022 or 2023. (Use a random number generator to pick a day if the choice paralysis gets you.)
2nd: Write an unconventional teleport.
3rd: Write a move for a character from a "new favorite" media that you got into recently.
4th: Write a move that involves spinning.
5th: Write a move with additional applications in a team battle.
6th: Write a move that uses a UI element.
7th: Write a move that leaves a lingering item or prop.
8th: Write a move with an unconventional input for Smash, like FGC command inputs.
9th: Write a move with a windbox.
10th: Write an Assist Trophy.
11th: Write a move that uses any object that isn’t traditionally a weapon as a disjointed weapon.
12th: Write a move with a bug theme, or for a bug-themed character.
13th: Write a move for a video game character that has no games available on the Nintendo Switch.
14th: Write a move that can cause Special Zoom.
15th: Write a move for a Mii Fighter that doesn't exist.
16th: Write a move for a character from something that doesn't exist. (Fake game, fan concept, cancelled project...)
17th: Write a move for a mascot or advertising character.
18th: Write a move that does damage but no knockback, or the inverse.
19th: Write a move for an inanimate object.
20th: Write a stage.
21st: Write a move for a character from a series you've never written a set for before.
22nd: Write a move for a character that canonically never fights.
23rd: Write a move for an existing Smash character.
24th: Write a move where the character dances to attack.
25th: Write a move for an Echo Fighter, and detail how it differs from the original fighter. (The original doesn't have to be an existing set, why not throw another layer of hypothetical on there?)
26th: Write a move for a "fusion" character.
27th: Write a move that could fit two different characters at once.
28th: Write a move that takes advantage of a character's unique air physics or multiple jumps.
29th: Write an enemy for a Subspace Emissary / Smash Run-esque mode, original or adapted.
30th: Write a move that would fit any of MYM27's JamCon themes, whether by character or the move itself.
31st: Write a story scene featuring some of your Movetober characters.

And of course, the submitters who came up with them:

bubbyboytoo : Days 01, 04, 12

tunz : Days 02, 11, 14, 28

n88 : Day 03

Arctic Tern : Days 05, 21, 22, 30

Rychu : Days 06, 07, 08, 09, 15, 16, 17, 19, 24, 26

Slavic : Days 10, 18, 20, 23, 25, 31

FrozenRoy : Days 13, 27

Kholdstare : Day 29

Arctic Tern · Oct 1, 2024

Link to my 2024 Movetober entries

And another link to my 2023 entries, pretty sure I didn't actually link to them on the thread proper. Sorry.

GolisoPower · Oct 1, 2024

Movetober is back and SO AM I!!!

n88 · Oct 13, 2024

Voting for MYM27 is now open (through November 21st)! If you've got a votelist, PM it to myself and FrozenRoy. See the OP for details on voting!

Perkilator · Oct 14, 2024

PSA to anyone using Google Docs for MYM: Google Docs just added a document tab feature not too long ago. So next time MYM opens up for submissions, feel free to use the document tab feature as you see fit.

n88 · Oct 14, 2024

yeah we're very excited about it! Opens up a lot of flex in how to structure docs.

Rychu · Oct 19, 2024

Hey everyone! I haven't been keeping up with comments but I have been reading, so I figured I'd share my as-of-current ranking image. Sorry to those sets on here which don't have a comment - I'm simply prioritizing reading at the moment and am making a hopefully followed-through vow to be more on top of things next context

Also because I'm awful at things the movesets aren't ordered inside the tiers themselves, just placed haphazardly in the order I read them in

Arctic Tern · Oct 20, 2024

GIORNO GIOVANNA (Jolyne)

Giorno is a zoning-focused character, fitting for his “support” role in JoJo canon, and has an assortment of projectiles in the form of his NSpec, which gives him various options to attack from a range. He also has Mista helping him out, who serves as an assist with a small moveset and grab game of his own. Mista’s main contribution is his bullets, which can be redirected by his Stand for a potential immense boost in damage and can be punched by Giorno to turn them into traps. The last gimmick of the set is Giorno’s Live Giver, which applies a brief slowdown to the foe if he hits them with the sweetspot of moves involving Gold Experience and gives him potential to combo on hit. In addition to sounding cool, it also potentially lets him lean into the “zoner” archetype by having laggier normals than usual but strong combo potential nonetheless on account of his slowdown.

The main issue I have with the set, outside of the lack of elaboration - which is a rule more than an exception for newcomers - is that the numbers are quite off. Most moves in the set have endlag in the single digits, something that is a rarity in Smash; Mario’s UTilt, for reference, is one of his fastest moves to start and end and has 19 frames of endlag. This makes Giorno into a combo fiend in practice since his moves also have fast startup, which goes against the intended playstyle and JoJo protagonists as a whole, who generally win fights by being smart. There are also some weird damage percents, like his NSpec narwhal being a combo starter that deals 30% and comes out at frame 9 at its fastest. Additionally, there’s not a lot of elaboration on Mista; not only do the potential tag-team combos go unmentioned, but it’s also never stated how the player can change his behavior from “turret” to “follower” despite the ability to do so being mentioned.

Don’t mistake this for me saying the set is outright bad: most of what I say can be applied to most other first sets by newcomers. It still shows a good amount of potential in terms of its concepts, so I can see another set from you ranking higher should you take the set’s comments to heart.

Link to full comment repository here!

SaltySuicune · Monday at 9:36 PM

Bit late but here's my first round of comments. Also, my movetober entries for 2024.

Ah sweet! Man made horrors beyond my comprehension!

I like how the teleport is not just a regular recovery Up B, and instead depends on a construct that can be moved around. The way a portion of non-special moves make use of and help you move between lockers as well is also fun.
Those many buffs and debuffs on a character that fast are very scary, which I guess fits for a horror monster.
All those creepy animations where it uses the animations were cool, shapeshifting into animals in all kinds of ****ed up ways. Really helps bring home the idea of what kind of threat the dredge is supposed to be.

Very cool, but now I’m scared of public restrooms.

He’s got a knack for confusing backgrounds.

Tail go boing boing means I can footstool enemies for free just because, fun.
I love Side B, sounds like such a fun move to be a little menace when playing with friends, which is always good in my book. All the different interactions it’s got with other moves are also fun. I especially like what it does with sliding attacks.
I like that Fang can get caught by grounded Up B fitting for someone who ruins their own plans.
Down B is pure chaos and I’m here for it, the idea alone sounds like so much fun and the fact it can interact with side B is a nice addition.
Down Throw has such a silly animation, I love it, that’s cute.

Glad he sorted his identity crisis out.

While most normal moves are kinda simple I think what’s in the specials is already pretty fun on its own. It’s so clear how passionate you are about the little guy, he’s so fun to read, plus I gotta respect someone who puts in this amount of extras. The extras are always my favorite part of the movesetting process, and it’s always nice to see someone who also does them.

Unrelated to the moveset, but why is it called Beedrill? It’s closer in body shape to a wasp and it doesn’t have drills anywhere, nor does it learn any drill related moves. So both words making up its name are misnomers.

Always glad to see a bug type getting some love.
Poison mechanics are fun to mess around with and implementing venoshock is something I hadn’t thought of but actually makes so much sense. Being able to remove poison with one hit feels a bit too easy given how fragile Beedrill is, but that’s made up for with an attack as powerful as the Special Pummel.
As far as I know, modifying your rage is such a novel concept, I think SSpec is one of my fave moves out of this set.
Pursuit is cool and the fact it can hit dodges is cool given the source material.
Up Smash is also nice. Assurance’s functionality being tied to how much shield you’ve got left is an original concept I haven’t seen before.

I don’t really have anything silly to say here. I think definitely the best part of this moveset is all the ways you can mix up Beedrill's many ways to make up for how fragile and underpowered they are.

When I clicked on Sayu I did not expect her to be this Sayu, so this was a nice surprise as a claymore enjoyer myself.

Implementing the stamina bar is a fun idea. And being Sayu of all people I feel it fits like a glove. It reminds me of my Amber set from two years ago where I considered doing something with stamina but eventually scrapped that idea.
Crouching Down B is really cute, I love that. This is the most Sayu thing ever.
Held Side B not only sounds fun but also feels like a better spindash… If smash’s take on spindash was actually enjoyable when it comes to controls. So I’m all for it.
The element of surprise added by regular Down B is a nice touch, and fitting given who and what Sayu is.
The extras and all the little flair in some attack animations are so cute and totally in character, I love them.

Banger. Definitely deserves some headpats, but don’t tell her I said that.

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