Majora's Mask Mafia | Game Over!

[Overswarm]

So.

You're saying that CLAIMING MAFIA.

Which of course is the VERY FIRST THING MAFIA DO WHEN THEY ARE FORCED TO CLAIM (P.S. LOL NO).

Is better than claiming town, pushing a case on me, and then NOT IMMEDIATELY DYING AFTER THE ABDUCTOR IS LYNCHED?

You're thinking in the short term.

And you know who thinks in the short term in abductor lylo situations?

The abductor.

If I lied and then the abductor survives, I lose.

I have a better chance of winning by simply telling the truth. Several townies have died already, and I'm willing to sacrifice my own player slot to win the game.

And now you're just pointing out things that work against you.

You WANTED to claim. You WANTED adum to go "wow, he has to be mafia if he's claiming mafia, bed must be abductor", and have the pressure off you.

In fact, the very fact that you claimed mafia unprovoked proves you can't be mafia. Mafia aren't jumping for joy when they claim. Telling the truth about your role as mafia, like most other circumstances in life, is a lot harder than lying. I saw a person who wanted to be seen as obviously being mafia, and again, if you're extremely happy and open about claiming mafia, then you probably AREN'T mafia.

I'd also argue that it wasn't unprovoked, since you only claimed after adum came in and said he still thought you were abductor, which is similar to an L-1 situation, in which it's an unspoken agreement that you need to claim when you're about to die.

This, again, is a falsity.

You claimed to get a guilty read on me. I know this is the correct read for my player slot, but I know adumbrodeus isn't the abductor. Your play has been pretty accurate for an abductor and, despite your claim being accurate for me, nothing you've done makes sense with the rest of the game. I trust my gut on this one; I know adumbrodeus isn't the independent party, and that leaves you.

I have two options at this point:

A) simply ignore your claim on me and say I'm town

or

B) Come clean so some BS doesn't change adumbrodeus' line of thinking


Because I know adumbrodeus isn't going to hammer quickly. He'll wait until he has all the info he can. When he looks back and says "wait, he claims to get a guilty on OS but OS didn't go nuts about that and say lynch him, that must mean it's true", and will assume because I didn't claim mafia that I'm an abductor.

The laughable thing about you saying "you claimed mafia and thus must be the abductor" is you have said in this very game how mafia would be forced to claim in a 3 man lylo so that the abductor wouldn't win. That's an interesting inconsistency. -_-;;


Read carefully adum. Look at what Sir Bed is posting, and look at how he is posting. You know he's lying.

 

[Sir Bedevere]

If I lied and then the abductor survives, I lose.

The same would happen if you telled the truth and the abductor survives.

Why does telling the truth prevent you from losing?

I have a better chance of winning by simply telling the truth.

HOW DOES CLAIMING MAFIA AND GETTING YOURSELF LYNCHED TOMORROW GIVE YOU A BETTER CHANCE TO WIN

You have done NOTHING to prove that you are mafia. You literally could have claimed you were a VT, and we would have looked past that because it's something you have to believe, not prove. There HAD to be a reason you claimed mafia, because no one would claim mafia without having any sort of plan that would prove me to be the abductor. You don't have a plan. If there was one, you would have told us it already.

You screwed up big time.

I know adumbrodeus isn't the independent party, and that leaves you.

I have no idea why you keep stressing this. Yes, he isn't. If he was, we'd have lost by now.

I have two options at this point:

A) simply ignore your claim on me and say I'm town

or

B) Come clean so some BS doesn't change adumbrodeus' line of thinking


Because I know adumbrodeus isn't going to hammer quickly. He'll wait until he has all the info he can. When he looks back and says "wait, he claims to get a guilty on OS but OS didn't go nuts about that and say lynch him, that must mean it's true", and will assume because I didn't claim mafia that I'm an abductor.

This is your reasoning for claiming mafia and not town? Because one, small part of your game did not ENTIRELY line up with the perceived identity of a mafiat?

Actually, screw this. Let me quote the posts made by you immediately after I claimed (which, btw, is the exact time that OS could start planning around claiming mafia).

I'd like to check something. I want to make sure we get this right.

So I find it interesting that you've investigated 3 of the 3 people that happened to be left on the final day, yet have said "Why am I left with you three" at the beginning of the day. That would have been an "Oh, I have confirmation Flame is the abductor". You also didn't claim until the very last possible instant. If adumb and I weren't cautious, you would have been lynched.

Your thought process:

If you're not the abductor, if Flame is not investigated, if adumbrodeus is town, if OS is scum

Abductor = FFlame by process of elimination.

So... why, exactly, are you pushing for a No Lynch?

Because if you're a bulletproof abductor, it is only possible for you to die from lynch.

FrozenFlame? Claim. I've been waiting for your post, but it didn't give much information.

With a few responses, I think we can figure this out today pretty easily.

Mostly lines up with how you said you acted, but the first part of your post is defintely you doubting my claim.

And if the abductor doesn't abduct?

Quoting this because its part of your posts, and because you were testing the waters to see what would happen if you didn't abduct. :3

Sir Bedevere, I've determined who the abductor is, but I need you to answer a few questions first for me to be sure.

1) Are you positive you are a sane cop?

2) Have you been affected by any abilities that you know of?

Yeah, um, "are you sane" is not what you ask as mafia if you're INTENDING to not deny a cop's guilty. If you were mafia, you wouldn't need to ask that question.

If you were mafia, you also wouldn't INTENTIONALLY not deny a mafia's guilty so you could claim mafia in lylo, but that's something else entirely. :3

What happened to that big plan of yours, anyway?

Frozen? Claim.

I don't think we can no lynch today.

I want to hear adumbrodeus too.

quotin' cus i have to

By the by, I think this game is ending whether we lynch today or not. No lynch can't go down today.

why so scared?

You need to claim first because we have the least information on you.

You now have 21 posts. We don't know anything about your role.

We don't know of Sir Bedevere is telling the truth or not. Your claim can help us determine this.

If you don't fill in the details early on, I can't go on because you'll change the details.

Either you or Sir Bedevere is the abductor.

If we don't lynch today, there WILL be Nkill and there WILL be an abduction and the game will be over. You know that.

Assuming Sir Bedevere is telling the truth, "no lynch" doesn't increase our odds in any way shape or form. We'd have all the information already. Think about that for a moment, and ask yourself why you haven't claimed yet.

I can see from this post that you totally trust me! :D

lolno

This "I claimed mafia yesterDay" stuff is BS, OS. You never fully accepted you had a guilty on you for an instant.

The laughable thing about you saying "you claimed mafia and thus must be the abductor" is you have said in this very game how mafia would be forced to claim in a 3 man lylo so that the abductor wouldn't win. That's an interesting inconsistency. -_-;;

You realize how far back that was, right?

I was meaning more along the lines of what I was doing yesterday with directing the NKill. Like, working together with mafia to make sure abductor doesn't steal the game from us. If I literally said "get mafia to claim" in that post, then I wasn't really thinking it through, since abductor could claim mafia just as easily, as you're doing here. :3

---

What's absolutely hilarious is that, past all of this "I'm mafia" business, you haven't actually claimed your role. I guess you were just so anxious to say "I'm mafia" and be cleared and get me lynched, you forgot that mafia had those, right? Because you wanted to tell the truth and not screw up adum's line of thinking, right?

How about a claim?

Got some more coming, OS interrupted me in the middle of a post. :3

 

[Sir Bedevere]

OK, I can't help myself.

Some of the **** OS has been spewing has completely ignored parts of my posts, and I think he's doing it on purpose. You (adum) read it, see strong points (points which I'd already disproved), and think his case is better than it should be. It's almost deadline, you don't have time to read back on everything that's been said and see if what he said was correct, and you make a decision based on false information, which is what OS wants.

I'm going to keep this short and with as few words as possible, so OS will have a hard time hiding his terrible, lazy answer to the question I keep quoting to him in a giant mass of text of things that aren't as important (as he did in his second last post ;D).

And I'll also respond to some other things that are just pure BS.

He's actively staying out of the conversation because he wants no attention.

Adum, ask Sir Bedevere some pointed questions. Watch him fall apart.

(Translation:

Don't look at me and my terrible mafia claim, look at him and his sexiness!)

The player who wanted Sir Bed dead yesterday = abducted

Would also like to point out that FF immediately unvoted and believed my claim and seemed to think I was town. Your entire premise of "FF wants me dead, abducting him is terrible" kinda falls flat.

and he parrots you.

Quote where adum said that he thought Swiss would have to be your partner, because I can't recall him saying that. I've said it at least twice.

Also explain why parroting something that is COMPLETELY LOGICAL is parroting. If you're going to use that logic, then you're parroting me because I said "the" and "and" before you.

I said I got a wagon started on me early in the game, as usual, to put pressure off me for late game.

You've trapped yourself.

Only 1 wagon was started on you this entire game, before now. That wagon was the one made at the beginning of D2 by Swiss. It was started not because you led intentional trails of scumminess to Swiss; it was not that you intentionally told Swiss something out-of-game that would make him think you weremafia; it was started because he got a gut scum read on you. If you were really mafia, and you really did INTENTIONALLY START a wagon on you (this wagon being the one by Swiss on D2), the ONLY way you could have done this is if Swiss was your scumpartner, because it would be COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE for you to have anyone except your scumbuddy start a wagon on you solely based on a gut read. And if that's what you're admitting, then you can't be mafia, because mafia wouldn't out their entire scumteam.

How did you start a wagon on yourself?

He's been playing anti-town and lurking as a cop

Because that's a terrible way for a cop to play.

He's using things you're saying to create his own fake history.

Nothing he's saying about his reads have come up until after you gave them to him adumb.

Wait, you saying that I'm only saying Swiss must be your scummate because of what adum said toDay, and that I only got that info toDay?

I think OS and Swiss are the scumteam.

BOOM

Geez, you remember something completely inconsequential I said at the start of D2, but you don't remember what stances I gave on you and your possible scummate yesterday?

Which sounds more like an abductor to you:

Claims mafia in 3 man lylo without being provoked, votes for the guy who is pushing for someone else in 3 man lylo, doesn't want a No Lynch in 3 man lylo

or

Claims there has to be a No Lynch in a 4 man lylo and that we should let mafia attempt to NKill scum*, attacks the guy who is V/LA in a 3 man lylo, claims cop at the end of his SECOND wagon...**

I just can't resist a mad lib. :D

Which sounds more like an abductor to you:

Quickvotes the claimed cop for completely unverifiable meta reasons, claims mafia without prompt which mafia would never do, doesn't claim a role, doesn't verify how he's mafia.

or

Extremely sexy person

I lol'd heartily at "doesn't want a No Lynch in 3 man lylo". :D

**Go ahead and look back. Sir Bedevere posted saying he thought he had been hammered.

I said I DIDN'T KNOW if I had been hammered.

And how many times do I have to say this?

^Also didn't claim end of Day 2 because if I was lynched, my flip would make it pretty obvious who I investigated (the person I was tunneling for almost the entire Day), and if I wasn't, then hey, I get to keep investigating!

That was posted YESTERDAY. Stop skimming over everything that's inconvenient to you.

if I was the abductor, I would have won this game already. -_-;;

WHEN

Point out the exact moment you could have won this game. "HURR DURR I COULD HAVE VOTED ADUM AND THEN BED WOULD QUICKLYNCH HIM" is not a moment, because I'm not stupid enough to quicklynch OR quickvote ANYONE in lylo.

At this point, you're just trying to plant false facts into adum's head because you can't explain away why you claimed mafia.

---

roughly 12 hours to deadline

 

[Sir Bedevere]

@mod, request votecount

just making sure the votes are where they should be

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Day Two Vote Count
[1]Overswarm: Sir Bedevere

Day two will end December 5th at 3:00 PM.
With three players remaining it takes two votes to lynch.

 

[Overswarm]

vote Sir Bedevere

My vote was on him earlier.

I've got to take my lady to her house today, so I might not be back til later to respond.

 

[Sir Bedevere]

oh god where are you adum

 

[adumbrodeus]

Still reading of course.

I'm here, deadline is at 3, gonna vote very soon.


I've come to this conclusion, Bedevere, you are probably lying, however if overswarm is lying, it's irrelevant as far as lynching the abductor, because if OS is lying, the only possible reason is because he's the abductor.

 

[Sir Bedevere]

i'm glad you've come to that conclusion, even though it's the wrong one, since it will still mean you'll do the right thing :>

 

[adumbrodeus]

Wait, what?

Your making a conclusion before looking for evidence.

You're saying "OS = abductor, but he isn't acting like mafia, except he is, so he must have planted those things so he could CLAIM he was mafia"

Except that makes no sense. Occam's razor, adumb. I'm actually mafia. Claiming makes the most sense.

Why would I claim unprovoked?

\

You'd claim unprovoked cause it gains you more credibility in a lylo situation.

Let me get this straight:

To pin me as the abductor, you've assumed FF's alignment was mafia and I removed FF so I could claim mafia? That is the most backwards reasoning you could come up with, adumbrodeus.

Actually, assuming he's mafia is unnecessary, all I need is that you THOUGHT he was likely mafia.

If I'm the abductor, why is everything I've done been in the opposite of the abductor's interest?

Except it hasn't the abductor's interest is ultimately just to survive, and one person who you're sure will not vote for you is much stronger in lylo, then two maybes.

Have you not been paying attention to Sir Bedevere?

Sir Bedevere is probably lying, but him lying doesn't make him the abductor, you lying does.

He's actively staying out of the conversation because he wants no attention.

I claimed mafia because it's the best play in this situation. I can't win if the abductor wins. There's no reason the abductor would claim mafia when 2/3rds of the remaining players could CC and no mafia have flipped.

If you've dealt

Adum, do you really believe I'm a "last man standing" abductor?

I claim without provocation.

The player who knows me best on smashboards is left until lylo.

The player who wanted Sir Bed dead yesterday = abducted

Sir Bed pushes a lynch on you and HARD... I push a lynch on him despite the fact you're V/LA.

Why would I do ANY of these things as abductor?

Try grilling Sir Bed, adum. Watch him crack. Look at his most recent post:

You thought I was in your court all game and to be fair, I was until now.

Claiming without provocation helps your credibility.

Player who also happened to be incredibly likely to be mafia also.

I don't think sir bed would hammer before I get back, he's inexperienced, but he knows not to quickvote in lylo.

Really? As the abductor, you think I'd be that obtuse, adum? I'd get rid of everyone that could get a read on me personally, because it'd inevitably have to come down to lylo. This would be poor planning on the abductor's part.

But you thought I was solidly in your corner, that would make me being in lylo a significant advantage.

So Bed's instinct as Cop when he gets a guilty isn't "make breadcrumbs"... it isn't "start a wagon on OS"... it isn't even "question OS". It's waited until someone else votes and then vote for me, say nothing, then let it die and never return to said wagon.

Really?

So sir bed is most likely lying. I agree with you on that, but you lying means you're the abductor, so I don't see a reason to concentrate on sir bed for now.

Sir Bed says "I'm a cop" and I criticize him for his anti-town wagoning, then he says "who does this remind you of" and points to me as if it makes us equally bad. It doesn't. He's been playing anti-town and lurking as a cop, I've been playing anti-town and been posting all over the place to control the game as mafia. Indies don't run games, they flow with them.

Interesting comment, because on of the reasons this doesn't match up with your mafia meta is because you AREN'T trying to run this game.

Adum, ask Sir Bedevere some pointed questions. Watch him fall apart.

You know my meta, and you know this game reeks of scum play. You might be off about the number of mafia and when I suddenly had to switch gears, but you know none of my actions make sense as an abductor and, if I was the abductor, I would have won this game already. -_-;;

This game reeks of you TRYING to look like your scum play, but none of your actual scum play

 

[Sir Bedevere]

Reading through posts cus I'm bored.

If you were mafia, you also wouldn't INTENTIONALLY not deny a mafia's guilty so you could claim mafia in lylo, but that's something else entirely. :3

omfg scum slip

i need to not post at 2 in the morning

people will start thinking i'm not cop :<

 

[adumbrodeus]

A little late for that sir bed...



Gah, I'm out of time on this, most likely they're both lying, but OS lying makes him abductor guaranteed, Bed's lying makes him likely scum at this point so...


Vote: Overswarm


Here's hoping I read this right.

 

[Sir Bedevere]

I was thinking of fakeclaiming abductor in twilight to freak you out and make you claim mafia, but you're probably too smart for that.

I even made a "diabolical genius" version of my avi just for the occasion.

I'll use it anyways. :>

Town has still got this.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Night of the Fifth Day

Overswarm, Them, the Independent Abductor has been lynched!

Day Five Vote Count
[2] Overswarm: Sir Bedevere, Adumbrodeus
[1] Sir Bedevere: Overswarm

The night phase will last until Wednesday, November 8th at 11:59 PM, so send me your night actions before then!

DanGR, Swiss, X1-12 and FrozenFlame have been freed and return to the game immediately!<object width="0" height="0"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/vWFwACXa_Zg?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1?rel=0&autoplay=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/vWFwACXa_Zg?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1?rel=0&autoplay=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="0" height="0"></embed></object>

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Dawn of the Sixth Day

Swiss, Link, the Vanilla Townie has been killed!

With five players remaining it will take three to lynch. The deadline has been set for Monday, December 20th at 3:00 PM.

 

[X1-12]

LYLO - Don't vote

Massclaim anyone?

 

[Sir Bedevere]

ack

NO ONE CLAIM

let me explain this

 

[Sir Bedevere]

ok, let's do this :>

Hi, I'm Romani, Vanilla Townie. I just pulled off a pretty sexy fakeclaim that allowed town to not die N4 and let me live to lynch the abductor and his pretty unsexy fakeclaim. :>

@BSL

Can't tell you if it's a common occurrence, because I've only seen it a few times in the games I've played. Obviously you shouldn't just believe the person when they say it lol, though I don't think that's what you were saying. Probably best to just ignore it when you see it, but when it comes to a case like Dastrn where he basically just claimed without pressure, we're probably going to have to deal with the issue eventually.

Here's my fake crumb. I crumbed cop because I remember reading in a recent game (I think FF7) about how Gheb crumbed cop as cop and got NKed (likely because mafia saw his crumb), and thought it might be a good idea to try and draw the NK away from the actual cop, if there was one, since I'm only a VT (that was also why I was questioning the mafia's choice in NK D2; I wanted to know why they hadn't killed me). It was also statistically more likely that scum would find me before a doc, since scum would have more people looking for crumbs. Wasn't planning on fakeclaiming cop at this point, though it was in the back of my mind.

Also

You see at the bottom of 567, I said that I was rereading? Did the unvote then immediate vote back not tip you off to something?

^This was a mistaken attempt at a fake cop tell. Yes, I hinted at something in a way that isn't recognized for a role that I didn't have. lulzy. This was around the time where I started to think about the possibility of me claiming cop, and I'm glad I did, because it made my fakeclaim a bit stronger.

os bandwagon seems fun

vote: os

soooooooooo

I have town reads on everyone except OS adum and Pierre.

sooooooooooooooooooo

get back on dat wagon ftw?

Vote: OS

Swiss, you gonna wagon OS with me? :<

Still think OS is mafia, but I can't do anything about that. We'll have to kill him after we get the abductor.

Anyways, thus far toDay I've been getting townie vibes from you and I don't think you're abductor, so I don't think you're a play.

These were all legitimate gut reads, and not the product of investigations, if that isn't obvious.

I didn't claim VT at the end of D2 because if I didn't die, I didn't want scum to know I wasn't a PR, or at least not one that needed to tell town something directly about his results.

I wanted a no lynch because I legitimately thought it was the best course of action for town (and mafia, even), and I didn't expect that someone would try and turn me doing that around on me and try and kill me.

---

The reason I claimed cop was because EVERYONE was gunning for my lynch D4, and if EVERYONE in the town had a scum read on me, which I knew was wrong, then I knew I had to turn their reads into my reads, because my reads had to have been either better or on equal level with theirs (though I'd say it was worse, since I thought OS was mafia ), and cop made the most sense to claim if I wanted to do that (and the fact that I was preparing for something like this helped too). I also don't think I could have argued through FF AND adum AND OS, especially when at least 2 of them had to be scum.

Claiming I got a result on an abducted person was probably a mistake, but I'm glad adum kept a cool head about it, and I had a reason for it, anyway: I wanted to get killed last Night. I was really hoping that the crumb I left D1 in hopes of dying would finally catch up with me this late in the game, but it didn't happen.

That's also why I didn't claim yesterDay, because obviously, claiming VT and being useless would not draw any NKs (though I was annoyed at adum for constantly saying I likely wasn't cop, since that likely played a part in scum not killing me >.>). I took the risk that you guys would be smart enough not to start massclaiming right away or immediately CC me (or just claim something that disproves me; we've already seen 3 roles that would have done so, including Vocal's, which would definitely NOT have been useless if he were in the final 4 lol), just like I took the risk that there would be no one to CC me D4 either. I knew I would have to claim for real toDay if I wasn't killed, since I didn't want PRs outing themselves, thinking they had scum cornered (though at that point, outing PRs probably wouldn't really matter, since you'd just lynch me and lose lol).

If you have any questions about what I did or see any inconsistencies or anything, point 'em out. I'll do a reread soon, but as for what I think now...

X1 and DanGR can't both be scum. OS was very confident when he said that I couldn't have had higher priority than him, which makes me think he knows his role, which makes me think the priorities of his role were laid out clear to him, which means that mafia and abductor likely have different priorities, and since abdcutor would HAVE to have the higher one, X1 couldn't have killed anyone N3, which means he and DanGR can't both be scum. Another point towards this is there was no NK on N2, and Swiss was abducted, and as soon as the mafia had the chance to NK again, they go for Swiss. It's possible abductor and mafia both went for the same target, and abductor outprioritized them.

I also still think DanGR's town. My reads this game definitely haven't been the best, but I'm more confident in reading newer players (because I pretty much am one), and the "case" I made on him D1 still holds strong. Like, if he starts doing stupid things and stuff then maybe we kill him, but he's been away from the game for so long and has so few connections with people, that even if he IS scum, we'll have very few connections between him and his scummate. Not that that isn't a reason to kill him if we find out he's scum for sure, but if he is, we probably aren't winning this game, so it would be best to ignore the possibility all together (lol that sounds weird).

So, scum lies between X1/FF/adum, IMO.

Massclaim sounds OK, especially because we've had so many Nights because of the abdcutor stalling things out, so our PRs should have a lot of info. And I've already taken a step in that direction, lol.

also still loling @ mafia fakeclaim :3

 

[DanGR]

I've got a couple questions I would really like to get answers for before I read through everything I missed. (I was only skimming while abducted. X.x)

1. What do you guys know right now about everyone's alignment as a result of this past day? Anyone I should know the alignment of before I reread everything? Like I don't remember in my skimming if it was proved that Sir Bed and/or Adumbrodeus are mafia/cop or w/e. I'd like to take all that stuff into account while I read through again.

2. If Sir Bed is telling the truth about him being cop, why didn't Mafia kill him just now? There's 2 options the way I see it: Either he's lying about being a cop, or Mafia is betting on us realizing that they didn't night kill Sir Bed to get him lynched by all of us quickly. But wouldn't a Sir Bed night kill help them more if he's cop? I guess I'll have to crunch the numbers.

 

[DanGR]

Oh wait, got ninja'd by Sir Bed.

Reading his post now.

 

[X1-12]

want claims in this order

DanGR
Adum
FF


other people should do this too.

 

[DanGR]

The reason I claimed cop was because EVERYONE was gunning for my lynch D4, and if EVERYONE in the town had a scum read on me, which I knew was wrong, then I knew I had to turn their reads into my reads, because my reads had to have been either better or on equal level with theirs (though I'd say it was worse, since I thought OS was mafia ), and cop made the most sense to claim if I wanted to do that (and the fact that I was preparing for something like this helped too). I also don't think I could have argued through FF AND adum AND OS, especially when at least 2 of them had to be scum.

@the bolded part-

In saying this, is it implied that you think FF and Adumbrodeus are our lynches right now?

Yes I've been skimming, as I explained in my last real post. :<

I'll reread all of this thread by either tonight or tomorrow night in real time. I'm done with finals. :D

Claiming I got a result on an abducted person was probably a mistake, but I'm glad adum kept a cool head about it, and I had a reason for it, anyway: I wanted to get killed last Night. I was really hoping that the crumb I left D1 in hopes of dying would finally catch up with me this late in the game, but it didn't happen.

That's also why I didn't claim yesterDay, because obviously, claiming VT and being useless would not draw any NKs (though I was annoyed at adum for constantly saying I likely wasn't cop, since that likely played a part in scum not killing me >.>). I took the risk that you guys would be smart enough not to start massclaiming right away or immediately CC me (or just claim something that disproves me; we've already seen 3 roles that would have done so, including Vocal's, which would definitely NOT have been useless if he were in the final 4 lol), just like I took the risk that there would be no one to CC me D4 either. I knew I would have to claim for real toDay if I wasn't killed, since I didn't want PRs outing themselves, thinking they had scum cornered (though at that point, outing PRs probably wouldn't really matter, since you'd just lynch me and lose lol).

What does "CC" mean as used in this section of your post? counterclaim?


(And fyi, your post answers #2 in that last post I made.)

 

[Sir Bedevere]

@the bolded part-

In saying this, is it implied that you think FF and Adumbrodeus are our lynches right now?

No; you're forgetting the abductor, which I'm counting as scum. I do think either FF or adum (maybe both) is scum (since I don't think you are), but I need a reread to see which.

What does "CC" mean as used in this section of your post? counterclaim?

Yeah, that's what CC means. I didn't want the actual cop coming in, saying "Bed's lying, I'm cop, easy lynch", and then me awkwardly say "lol I'm VT, fakeclaimed to save town's skin, sorry about making you out your PR tho, bro".

I think I want

FF
adum
DanGR

 

[X1-12]

worth mentioning there's still likely to be 2 scum, the abductor doesn't actually effect the balance of the game that much.

 

[X1-12]

~EBWOP: 2 mafia.

 

[Sir Bedevere]

^Oh no, I'm not arguing that. On D4 (the day we no lynched), at least 2 scum had to be alive; 1 abductor (OS), and 1 mafia (FF or adum). 1 abductor and 2 mafia (FF AND adum) would also be possible.

AND LOL DERP I FORGOT X1

think it's because he asked me (so I discounted him), and he only listed 3, so I thought I only had to list 3 :>

FF
adum
X1
DanGR

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Pretty much posting to avoid a prod, big debate tourny this weekend.

Mass claim is reasonable considering we're pretty much guaranteed in Lylo and we have people coming back who havent been in the game for 2 days or more.

You guys agree on a claim system and I'll put my votes for claiming in when I get a chance and we can move from there. See you all in a more serious fashion about Mondayish.

 

[adumbrodeus]

Don't like the fakeclaim at all, sounds like backtracking cause he got caught in a lie. Why didn't you reveal this yesterday when OS started making it pretty obvious that you were lying?




As far as why mafia didn't kill sir bed (now that we know he's not a cop), four easy options:

1. Mafia has a roleblocker (which is you check my analysis, seems pretty obvious).

2. He's mafia.

3. Mafia realized he wasn't a cop.

4. A ton of doubt was thrown on him in the last few days, mafia might think he's an easy kill.



As far as claiming order.

FF
X1
Dangr
Me



FF and sir bed are independently incredibly scummy, thing is I doubt they're both mafia because of their interaction in mylo and their lack of connections in their overall gameplay. I'm more inclined to believe FF is mafia then sir bevedere atm.

 

[X1-12]

[collapse=Claims wanted]Adum wants:
FF
X1
DanGR

Sir B wants:
FF
Adum
X1

X1 wants:
DanGR
Adum
FF[/collapse]

@DanGR and FF say what order you want people to claim

@Mod: Request DanGR Prod

 

[Sir Bedevere]

Don't like the fakeclaim at all, sounds like backtracking cause he got caught in a lie. Why didn't you reveal this yesterday when OS started making it pretty obvious that you were lying?

I didn't reveal this yesterday because getting OS lynched was all that mattered. If you'll notice, I didn't put up too many points against OS (and you) saying I was fakeclaiming, because I agreed with your logic; me lying makes me anything, OS lying makes him abductor. Thus, proving that, in the limited amount of time we had, was a much more efficient use of time than trying to convince you I was telling the truth, and I could see scum still killing me just in case I was telling the truth and stopping me from investigating other people (apparently, I was too obvious). There was not much risk in me putting off the fakeclaim till toDay, while the reward for scum killing me would be huge (though I guess it worked out in the end, since they still killed a VT ). And if what you're guessing about the RBer is true, then me not fakeclaiming also drew the RB away from a PR, which is cool too.

Better question: why WOULD I have revealed this yesterDay? I don't see any negatives aside from someone snap-CCing me, and that's highly unlikely.

X1, you forgot DanGR on my list (he's last).

I'll reread over the weekend, this was a long day and I need rest.

 

[DanGR]

Okay, finished reading up.

My ideal claiming order:

FF
X1
Adumbrodeus
DanGR

----

Sir Bed, why did you, supposedly as a Townie all along, plant cop bread-crumbs early in the game?

 

[DanGR]

X1, where do you place yourself on your claiming order list?

 

[adumbrodeus]

I didn't reveal this yesterday because getting OS lynched was all that mattered. If you'll notice, I didn't put up too many points against OS (and you) saying I was fakeclaiming, because I agreed with your logic; me lying makes me anything, OS lying makes him abductor. Thus, proving that, in the limited amount of time we had, was a much more efficient use of time than trying to convince you I was telling the truth, and I could see scum still killing me just in case I was telling the truth and stopping me from investigating other people (apparently, I was too obvious). There was not much risk in me putting off the fakeclaim till toDay, while the reward for scum killing me would be huge (though I guess it worked out in the end, since they still killed a VT ). And if what you're guessing about the RBer is true, then me not fakeclaiming also drew the RB away from a PR, which is cool too.

Better question: why WOULD I have revealed this yesterDay? I don't see any negatives aside from someone snap-CCing me, and that's highly unlikely.

X1, you forgot DanGR on my list (he's last).

I'll reread over the weekend, this was a long day and I need rest.

Because OS punched a hole in your claim a mile wide, make no mistake you were the preferred target of the day, if I didn't know OS well enough that I was pretty much positive I could pick his scum meta up, then you would've been lynched for maintaining the fakeclaim. Even then I made it obvious that I had had substantial doubts and was on a razor's edge as far as who to lynch.

Defending the lie at that point only made it more likely that I would lynch you, and that's why I'm wondering why you would chose to defend it so hard.

 

[Sir Bedevere]

Sir Bed, why did you, supposedly as a Townie all along, plant cop bread-crumbs early in the game?

Here's my fake crumb. I crumbed cop because I remember reading in a recent game (I think FF7) about how Gheb crumbed cop as cop and got NKed (likely because mafia saw his crumb), and thought it might be a good idea to try and draw the NK away from the actual cop, if there was one, since I'm only a VT (that was also why I was questioning the mafia's choice in NK D2; I wanted to know why they hadn't killed me). It was also statistically more likely that scum would find me before a doc, since scum would have more people looking for crumbs. Wasn't planning on fakeclaiming cop at this point, though it was in the back of my mind.

Bread-"crumb". The other crumb I planted later was when I could see myself possibly claiming cop in lylo, as well as just another thing that might get scum's attention (although it turned out the crumb didn't exist, lolol).

Worst-case scenario, doc finds my crumb and scum don't and he protects me instead of a PR, which still wouldn't be that bad, since I'm town (on the offchance they try to kill me anyway). Medium-case scenario, scum wastes their kill on a VT. Best-case, both scum and doc find it and there's a no kill. I didn't see any harm in it.

Because OS punched a hole in your claim a mile wide, make no mistake you were the preferred target of the day, if I didn't know OS well enough that I was pretty much positive I could pick his scum meta up, then you would've been lynched for maintaining the fakeclaim. Even then I made it obvious that I had had substantial doubts and was on a razor's edge as far as who to lynch.

Defending the lie at that point only made it more likely that I would lynch you, and that's why I'm wondering why you would chose to defend it so hard.

I'll say it again; your logic on me and OS lying was flawless. OS had to be the abductor if he was lying, I didn't, and it was VERY clear that he was lying, what with his constant avoidance of the big question ("why'd you claim mafia?") that he simply had no good answer for. I suppose I'm saying this from a biased perspective, but from your position, I couldn't see how you could have lynched me over OS when OS had failed to answer the most basic of questions (whereas I had at least reasonable, if perhaps a bit weak, responses), regardless of meta. Backtracking on the claim could have backfired too; you could have thought I was "backtracking on a lie" and pushed my lynch instead. To me, it seemed better to hold my ground and not try and pick positions to be in (like, if OS claimed VT after claiming mafia, I don't see how we wouldn't have lynched him on the spot), simply disprove OS, and if I didn't die, realclaim VT and prevent people CCing.

And as I said, drawing the NK would have been awesome.

What would you have done in my position? Claim VT, have scum not NK you for certain when dying over PRs is part of your wincon, and risk getting lynched in abductor lylo for admitting to lying? And why would it be better than what I did?

FF, when you come back you should claim, since we have a 3/5 majority on you claiming first.

k i need sleep

 

[X1-12]

[collapse=Claims wanted]Adum wants:
FF 3
X1 2
DanGR 1

Sir B wants:
FF - 4
Adum - 3
X1 - 2
DanGR - 1

X1 wants:
DanGR - 3
Adum - 2
FF - 1[/collapse]

current totals:
FF: 8
Adum: 5
DanGR: 5
X1: 4

FF? order for claims please

 

[DanGR]

X1, where do you place yourself on your claiming order list?

[collapse=Claims wanted]Adum wants:
FF 3
X1 2
DanGR 1

Sir B wants:
FF - 4
Adum - 3
X1 - 2
DanGR - 1

X1 wants:
DanGR - 3
Adum - 2
FF - 1[/collapse]

current totals:
FF: 8
Adum: 5
DanGR: 5
X1: 4

FF? order for claims please

*Ahem*

?

 

[X1-12]

last

10obviouslies

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Alright so I'm pretty solidly the first claimer.

I'm Tingle, VT.

Here's my preferred order after me obv:

Dan
Adumb
X1

 

[X1-12]

[collapse=Claims wanted]Adum wants:
FF 3
X1 2
DanGR 1

Sir B wants:
FF - 4
Adum - 3
X1 - 2
DanGR - 1

X1 wants:
DanGR - 3
Adum - 2
FF - 1

FF wants:
Dan - 3
Adumb - 2
X1 - 1

[/collapse]

current totals:
FF: 8
DanGR: 8
Adum: 7
X1: 5

This order:
DanGR
Adum
X1


Dead
Roxy - Kaepora Gaebora - Self Watcher
BSL - Sakon - VT
Vocal - Guru Guru - Musicbox
Nabe - Anju - Jailer
Overswarm - Them - Abductor
Swiss - Link - VT

Alive: (claimed)
FF - Tingle - VT

DanGR is up

 

[DanGR]

I'm Gorman, also a VT.