- Joined
- Mar 14, 2011
- Messages
- 5,493
.......no.....
I had so many hopes for showing that Peach/Puff was close to even...
HUNGRYBOX, WHYYYYY
I had so many hopes for showing that Peach/Puff was close to even...
HUNGRYBOX, WHYYYYY
-
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Data Mah0ne's Stuff about Puff
- Thread starter Mahone
- Start date
Tekk
Smash Lord
I guess people have enough trouble mastering dair as it is.
Puff mains really need to practice fox more lol.
Puff mains really need to practice fox more lol.
Tekk
Smash Lord
"Practice fox" as in "becoming very technical, accurate and consistent".
hungrybox
Smash Legend
Yeah playing secondaries really expands horizons
My only secondary is Ganon and I am horrible with him. I just can't play other characters as I get combo'd to death and it feels awkward to move around in the ground more. I should just mess around with my crappy Falco and Fox an hour a day and become da bess in da wooooorld.
Krynxe
I can't pronounce it either
yeah, more so for certain character mains than others
it helps you, particularly, understand how another player of that character thinks
it helps you, particularly, understand how another player of that character thinks
Kaizer
Smash Journeyman
pretend you are fighting marth, except for the crouching. ie spaced bairs, patience. drill-grabs to edgeguard is pretty solid.
edit: and never rest.
edit: and never rest.
Massive
Smash Champion
When you get him airborne, go for uair.
He can't really do anything about it.
He can't really do anything about it.
Mahone
Smash Champion
just really think about how to get around the pills
don't always try to beat them, sometimes try to just dodge them
grab more often that you think, docs really like to shield
just play a lot vs them to get a feel for how to edgeguard
di the throw full behind to make the fair harder to hit
don't try to go for standard uptilt/upair rests too much until you KNOW they will hit (which isn't very often at all)
doc's dair can be really good for him when coming down, learn when you can beat it with upair (this spacing is tricky, practice it) and other ways to avoid his dair
Bieber
Smash Apprentice
sometimes doc can be hard to edgeguard because of pills, cape, and high priority on the up-b but nair actually works against all three of those (cuts through pills, hitbox on nair is all around you so cape doesn't do much, and it trades with the up-b)
like when he's offstage, just jump at him and nair and he's pretty much ****ed, especially because nair will send him at an angle that usually makes a second chance at recovery impossible
as for the neutral game, study hungrybox vs shroomed from apex, pretty much a clinic on how to play the matchup
also docs really like to roll for some reason so try to punish those
like when he's offstage, just jump at him and nair and he's pretty much ****ed, especially because nair will send him at an angle that usually makes a second chance at recovery impossible
as for the neutral game, study hungrybox vs shroomed from apex, pretty much a clinic on how to play the matchup
also docs really like to roll for some reason so try to punish those
Landry
Smash Ace
- Joined
- May 29, 2008
- Messages
- 839
Thanks for the advice everyone. You guys are the best.
So this is kinda embarrassing but would you guys mind giving me some critique on a match? I uploaded a game I played (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqK3ab9iHMA) at a local weekly tournament. I had never really faced a decent Doc before this so I didn't know the matchup at all at the time. I think I have a better handle on it now after some friendlies and a bit of research, but if you guys wanna just let me know what I could do better that'd be awesome.
Any general critique is also greatly appreciated. I've gotten to a point where I'm realizing my Puff isn't really very good so I need all the help I can get. Thanks guys!
So this is kinda embarrassing but would you guys mind giving me some critique on a match? I uploaded a game I played (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqK3ab9iHMA) at a local weekly tournament. I had never really faced a decent Doc before this so I didn't know the matchup at all at the time. I think I have a better handle on it now after some friendlies and a bit of research, but if you guys wanna just let me know what I could do better that'd be awesome.
Any general critique is also greatly appreciated. I've gotten to a point where I'm realizing my Puff isn't really very good so I need all the help I can get. Thanks guys!
Bones0
Smash Legend
- You shield too much after landing. You shielded 3 times in a row from landing at the beginning of the game, and he grabbed you on the third. I remember Mahone telling me that moving asap after landing from aerials is a huge thing new Puffs struggle with. Try WDing away or jumping and doing an aerial immediately after you land.
- You tend to overextend yourself trying to hit him with aerials when he's out of range. Maybe just be a bit more patient so you can get quality hits instead of just spamming moves to wall him out from the side or above.
- WD OoS more. Learning to use WD OoS has helped me transition from spamming shield to moving after attacks, so that sort of goes back to the first point. If you catch yourself shielding even though they can't hit you, you can just WD out, and eventually you will just be WDing or doing something else without shielding habitually at all. WD more in general to adjust your spacing before leaving the ground to aerial.
- You tend to overextend yourself trying to hit him with aerials when he's out of range. Maybe just be a bit more patient so you can get quality hits instead of just spamming moves to wall him out from the side or above.
- WD OoS more. Learning to use WD OoS has helped me transition from spamming shield to moving after attacks, so that sort of goes back to the first point. If you catch yourself shielding even though they can't hit you, you can just WD out, and eventually you will just be WDing or doing something else without shielding habitually at all. WD more in general to adjust your spacing before leaving the ground to aerial.
Massive
Smash Champion
The most glaring thing I can see is that you are grounding your aerials in bad positions.
Doing a fair or bair or even a pound that ends at ground level, right next to them, is begging to be punished. You need to practice staying airborne and continually delivering aerials that will always land out of reprisal range.
On the same vein as that, be very careful about landing right in front of someone. Actually don't be careful, never, ever do it. It's a free grab. Landing behind someone is a viable option (utilt > rest, mmmm), but it's a diminished position against characters with strong OoS options.
I also noted that you're occasionally falling into single-jumpitis at ground level. Do not be afraid to burn your jumps on approach, jigglypuff doesn't actually need them to recover (especially against doc, who has no real downward momentum moves) thanks to pound. Jigglypuff can basically dashdance in the air with her jump, and she definitely needs to because she's at a more sizable disadvantage while grounded, especially against mobile zoning characters like doc.
Doing a fair or bair or even a pound that ends at ground level, right next to them, is begging to be punished. You need to practice staying airborne and continually delivering aerials that will always land out of reprisal range.
On the same vein as that, be very careful about landing right in front of someone. Actually don't be careful, never, ever do it. It's a free grab. Landing behind someone is a viable option (utilt > rest, mmmm), but it's a diminished position against characters with strong OoS options.
I also noted that you're occasionally falling into single-jumpitis at ground level. Do not be afraid to burn your jumps on approach, jigglypuff doesn't actually need them to recover (especially against doc, who has no real downward momentum moves) thanks to pound. Jigglypuff can basically dashdance in the air with her jump, and she definitely needs to because she's at a more sizable disadvantage while grounded, especially against mobile zoning characters like doc.
Landry
Smash Ace
- Joined
- May 29, 2008
- Messages
- 839
Thanks for all the help guys. It's really time for me to start taking Puff more seriously and really try to incorporate some more strategy into my gameplay. All this criticism is very helpful.
I uploaded another recent match (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldxoTYiYGl4). If anyone is willing to give me any more general criticism I'm very open to hearing what you have to say. Thanks!
I uploaded another recent match (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldxoTYiYGl4). If anyone is willing to give me any more general criticism I'm very open to hearing what you have to say. Thanks!
hungrybox
Smash Legend
Bair into his face and just wavedash under the pills. or bair the pills.
drill into grab is nice. the more you grab him the better. when he's sheilding just do a leapfrog jump while facing forward and grab as soon as you land and then back throw.
when he's above you keep uairing. he can't do much
♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡
Anti-Illuminati
- Joined
- Jan 10, 2007
- Messages
- 1,863
Kaizer
Smash Journeyman
Hi guys, I went to this tournament and did pretty horribly. Want to know what I'm doing wrong, so please if anyone want to critique too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bY_1NKpU0A&feature=g-user-u
I'm having problems with the marth matchup, especially getting KOs and edgeguards, and some DI issues. And SDs…
I'm having problems with the marth matchup, especially getting KOs and edgeguards, and some DI issues. And SDs…
I will try to critique as well as I can... I play the Marth MU quite a lot actually.
You need to be more patient. Most of the time Marth will easily just outspace you with whatever he decides to throw at you. You absolutely have to bait and punish his moves or there is pretty much no way to get in. This might take a while, so don't rush in. A lot of the time you seemed to just jump at Marth because you wanted to get in, this is a recipe for disaster.
When Marth hits you, always try to DI out and when you get out wait a bit. You got punished pretty hard as when you escaped his combo you just floated straight back and got hit again like 3 times in a row. I know I make the same mistake often, but you are Puff, you can wait out a bit for the momentum to die with your 5 jumps and infinite pounds.
Against Marth, grab more. Marths like to shield everything you do so a quick waveland grab or something like that helps. If there are platforms, Dthrow them into them and techchase into a rest. If there aren't any available, simple throw them offstage.
Edgeguard him with reverse fair. It's very effective against him and will trade against his upB which will most of the time gimp him.
And damn it! What were you thinking, fsmashing Marth from a crouched grab? REST HIM. You might have even won if you had done so. 90% of the time in the set a rest would have been worth it as you couldn't have been killed afterwards. Getting a big lead against Marth matters a lot because he has a hard time killing you. Oh and you need to get better at resting, I dunno if you use it more usually, but a lot of the time it seems you totally forgot about it.
Oh and, mute city is legal in Norway? O_o
Was Thomas that guy who won at 2HOT? I think I might even kinda remember him.
(oh and I only watched the first 2 matches. Sorry)
You need to be more patient. Most of the time Marth will easily just outspace you with whatever he decides to throw at you. You absolutely have to bait and punish his moves or there is pretty much no way to get in. This might take a while, so don't rush in. A lot of the time you seemed to just jump at Marth because you wanted to get in, this is a recipe for disaster.
When Marth hits you, always try to DI out and when you get out wait a bit. You got punished pretty hard as when you escaped his combo you just floated straight back and got hit again like 3 times in a row. I know I make the same mistake often, but you are Puff, you can wait out a bit for the momentum to die with your 5 jumps and infinite pounds.
Against Marth, grab more. Marths like to shield everything you do so a quick waveland grab or something like that helps. If there are platforms, Dthrow them into them and techchase into a rest. If there aren't any available, simple throw them offstage.
Edgeguard him with reverse fair. It's very effective against him and will trade against his upB which will most of the time gimp him.
And damn it! What were you thinking, fsmashing Marth from a crouched grab? REST HIM. You might have even won if you had done so. 90% of the time in the set a rest would have been worth it as you couldn't have been killed afterwards. Getting a big lead against Marth matters a lot because he has a hard time killing you. Oh and you need to get better at resting, I dunno if you use it more usually, but a lot of the time it seems you totally forgot about it.
Oh and, mute city is legal in Norway? O_o
Was Thomas that guy who won at 2HOT? I think I might even kinda remember him.
(oh and I only watched the first 2 matches. Sorry)
Landry
Smash Ace
- Joined
- May 29, 2008
- Messages
- 839
This is ****ing awesome, btw
Naughty Pixel
Smash Apprentice
LOL what an emberassing set for me :/ Seems like whenever a set has any value to it in its result my ability to think dwindles. If you could PM the rest of the uploads that'd be nice so I can see what I can do to not fsmash your shield and empty dair off the stage.
Mahone
Smash Champion
i like marth puff so ill probably just write up a 10 page critique of this later today
Massive
Smash Champion
This is more of a bad habit, but it's good to be aware of:
You always go back to the ledge when you're recovering, it makes you very easy to ledgeguard. Try mixing in some high recoveries that completely ignore the ledge to increase your survivability.
Like -LzR- noted, you need to DI away from marth when he does pretty much anything. Otherwise he gets fair > fair > blah blah combos on you and you get messed up. Default DI on an fthrow is a guaranteed tipper and should be avoided. The only exception is if the marth is good at fthrow > wavedash > fsmash, then you need to DI towards him and eat the fsmash in non-tipper range, otherwise DI away and get off scott-free.
Also, a piece of advice AustinRC gave me about playing against Marth. When you land behind him, he can't do much of ANYTHING safely besides reverse dolphin slash. Everything else is completely beaten by shielding or ducking. Try to land behind him as much as possible and toss out utilts, usmash, or grabs.
Additionally, Marth falls steeply into the floaty category. He is very vulnerable to nair > usmash/fsmash or dair > usmash (maybe dair > rest if you're hbox cool).
Finally, do not be afraid to trade with him in midair. The only airborne move marth has that will kill you at reasonable %s is dair (and maybe bair), and that will lose his stock too if he's recovering. Chase him off the stage with reckless abandon. If you stop his horizontal momentum after his 2nd jump, that's the stock.
Yeah as Massive said the ledge thing is not cool. I would always recovery high and skip the ledge if at all possible. There is almost no reason to go to the ledge against Marth if you don't have to. I mostly quickly use it to refresh my jumps and try to reach a platform and something.
But I guess I should let the big boys handle this. Waiting for Mahones huge wall of text.
But I guess I should let the big boys handle this. Waiting for Mahones huge wall of text.
Kaizer
Smash Journeyman
Thank you so much guys!
Sometimes I don't feel comfortable resting, and keep smashing instead. This is a bad habbit, and I'll try to sort it out. I'm quite confident in my rests if I get the first one, but if I miss some there's some psychological block that turns in. I need to grow a pair, I guess.
Mute City isn't normally legal, but this tournament had some wacky stages on. And I'm Thomas ;P I got 2nd at 2Hot.
Mahone: Looking forward to it <3
Massive: Yeah, I'm aware of the ledge habbit, and I have to be more focused on it. I think I'm afraid i'll get hit by tilts and stuff when I'm coming down, so I'll just get the ledge. My patience is pretty limited, and I have to work on that.
I also have the same DI issues with Falcon, where I'm DIing inn in case of knee/tipper. Good call. I'm usually pretty solid at the nair > whatver aspect, but this isn't a great example. Also sometimes the Marth reads it, and can just wavedash back and fsmash. But it's just a matter of spacing. Landing behind Marth is a huge thing, and I didn't focus enough on it. I'll take notes on that. Sometimes I get hit by a dair oos, but I'm sure puff have better options than marth in that scenario.
Sometimes I don't feel comfortable resting, and keep smashing instead. This is a bad habbit, and I'll try to sort it out. I'm quite confident in my rests if I get the first one, but if I miss some there's some psychological block that turns in. I need to grow a pair, I guess.
Mute City isn't normally legal, but this tournament had some wacky stages on. And I'm Thomas ;P I got 2nd at 2Hot.
Mahone: Looking forward to it <3
Massive: Yeah, I'm aware of the ledge habbit, and I have to be more focused on it. I think I'm afraid i'll get hit by tilts and stuff when I'm coming down, so I'll just get the ledge. My patience is pretty limited, and I have to work on that.
I also have the same DI issues with Falcon, where I'm DIing inn in case of knee/tipper. Good call. I'm usually pretty solid at the nair > whatver aspect, but this isn't a great example. Also sometimes the Marth reads it, and can just wavedash back and fsmash. But it's just a matter of spacing. Landing behind Marth is a huge thing, and I didn't focus enough on it. I'll take notes on that. Sometimes I get hit by a dair oos, but I'm sure puff have better options than marth in that scenario.
Aah yeah that's true. No wonder why I didn't recognize you at first as your name here is different. I have exactly the opposite habit of yours. I usually go for the rest whenever I can, sometimes causing bad stuff to happen, but it improves my resting ability a lot. Get rid of that habit, I know it's hard.
Does Norway usually use the MBR ruleset? Maybe I should sometimes give a visit if you are hosting something interesting.
Kaizer
Smash Journeyman
We usually have standard MBR ruleset, except that pokemon is a neutral instead of FoD. There will probably be a tournament spring-ish if I'm not mistaken. You should try to get the other finns to come too!
Massive
Smash Champion
Don't feel too bad, I choke on rests constantly. I've become quite adept at setting them up and then hitting rest either too late or not at all.
My opponent always sees that the rest is coming, I hear them make a gasping sound, and then nothing happens, I miss, or phantom rest (which happens to me all the time for some reason). I think it's probably accurate to say that about 1/4 of my stock every match is lost from a missed rest.
To be fair, stuff like this is probably why there's only been 2 jigglypuffs ever that actually win nationals.
My opponent always sees that the rest is coming, I hear them make a gasping sound, and then nothing happens, I miss, or phantom rest (which happens to me all the time for some reason). I think it's probably accurate to say that about 1/4 of my stock every match is lost from a missed rest.
To be fair, stuff like this is probably why there's only been 2 jigglypuffs ever that actually win nationals.
I think I land my rests pretty well. I don't really have trouble and I don't really choke with it much. Whenever I doubt it though I will choose another option, but I actually feel like I use rest way too much when I could just kill with a bair...
It's just funny when people say Puff is cheap and too good and stuff and so easy yet I only see Hbox actually do anything with her. I would expect there to be a lot more Puffs if she actually was easy.
It's just funny when people say Puff is cheap and too good and stuff and so easy yet I only see Hbox actually do anything with her. I would expect there to be a lot more Puffs if she actually was easy.
KrIsP!
Smash Champion
I often second guess my rest setups and immediately go for pound, which hits but I usually sigh because therest wouldve hit too. I also have a problem of pondering if I should go for the rest and hear that gasp from my opponent making me face palm at a missed opportunity.
I just have an issue with remembering to do things while under pressure that I know I can do. Hopefully more playing will iron that out.
I just have an issue with remembering to do things while under pressure that I know I can do. Hopefully more playing will iron that out.
Mahone
Smash Champion
Game 1
start- might wanna check what controller port u are so u dont start above him
1:13- dont go for bair there, im fairly confident he could have wiggled out and not had to tech, but if u think hes going to have to tech, go for a techchase rest, since its higher ev than a bair by A LOT, if u thought he was gonnna jump/wiggle out (most people will jump out), than trying to catch the jump with an upair will lead to ridiculous combos
1:22- that was good di out of the throw, but then you rolled in (probably trying to di in, in case the fsmash hit u?), i remember the first time i watched this u did that A LOT, so try to react faster to being out and not roll/techroll in
1:25- ive already seen like 3 times u like to opt for the fair when falling on marth's shield, i think its good for poking (and u seem especially good at doing that from what i recall), but it wont really lead to anything, i would much rather go for falling upair since it can also poke well and it'll lead to rest at those low-mid percents
1:26- i would have opted for grab rather than an empty fullhop nair there, into dthrow
1:50- i dont know why u chose to do a low bair and land, i would have just used more jumps and kept throwing the bairs high since he was still at risk of running into it
2:04- try to avoid hitting weak fairs like that, he could have counter attacked if he was better
2:09- again u di the throw correct, but remember to tech (i always just tech in place since hes in fsmash lag and that give u the fastest recovery and "stage control")
2:10- u know u should rest instead so whtevs
2:19- i would have pounded that upair, don't know if thats right, but i think its worth the risk reward EASILY, since hes at 38 close to the edge and at most ull eat like a fair oos (although i do think the pound would have just punished the lag, but its close)
2:41- that was weird, the bair would have comboed but u didn't drift towards him enough because u didn't react to hitting him fast enough, not sure how to fix this except for experience to quicken ur trained reaction time
2:51- i dunno why u went low, this guy has a habit of immediately jumping out of throws offstage and u havent punished him for it yet, that time you could have... just practice in friendlies IMMEDIATELY jumping after the throw because puff can barely get high enough to hit that option as u can tell from ur previous attempt like 10 seconds before this on the other side of the stage
2:59- u reflexively turn around to use bair since thats usually what u need to edgeguard marth, but he was too close for that, and u were above him, nair would have been perfect in that situation (just a fastfall nair willing to trade with the upb would of been my choice)
3:19- theres an example of him punish that weak fair
3:30- again u roll in after good di
general stuff:
need more pound, i find it a vital tool in the marth mu to keep his spacing honest, low risk high reward most of the time
doesn't seem like ur comfortable staying in the air for more than one full hop double bair, this is common among jiggs, practice alone mixing up 3 bairs high one low, 4 bairs high then waveland, fastfall one low bair, high bair jump waveland, etc... dont get pigeonholed into fullhop double bair and shorthop weaved out bair like every jiggs but hbox is
not willing to use jumps and predict marths jump when hes at the edge of the stage, ur gonna have to gamble and jump with him, otherwise ur letting him back to the center for free too much
Game 2
4:47- again opt for fsmash at low percent, could have done uptilt or just grab upthrow, i know its cuz u have slowish reflexes in tourney, i do too :*(
4:52- nice, u started going for the falling upair
5:18- punish with weak fair, thats actually a perfect spot for the dair-stuff comboes
5:33- u knew he was gonna jump (i think?) but u got hit with the fair, just try to space farther out there, practice that more in friendlies
6:17- could have rested/fsmashed, slow reaction again
6:42- again opted for fair shieldpoke instead of upair or something better (like empty land to crouch or uptilt, etc.)
YOOOOO, i just realized, why is this mute city rofl
6:52- again good di followed by roll in
7:06- lol, that was worth getting hit... for the mindgames
Game 3
10:33- yoshis
11:05- why do u keep edgeguarding low?? he always jumps
Hmm, not much to say here, i think u know all ur mistakes for this game
general stuff:
i don't think you grab enough, he gets away with shielding way too much, you need to mix in empty hop grabs and then empty hop uptilts to catch his immediate rolls
Game 4
12:08- upsmash sucks, maybe u know something i dont, i would just go for uptilt always
12:20- i would have just rested, he was at the center of the stage and u were at low percent, i think its greedy to try to carry him offstage with bairs from there
13:27- again weak fair instead of falling upair or empty land
13:31- on fd i think upthrow is actually pretty reasonable at lowish percents, definitely better than fthrow
15:05- i dunno what all these upsmashes are
16:30- that was a cool combo, if u started the bair lower and than did an upair->bair chain that shoulda been a zero to death
general stuff:
u don't seem comfortable singgrabbing the ledge in all situations, practice that A LOT, with a diff num of jumps, from different angles, anything u can think of
u don't use dash attack at all, it can be really good vs marth in the right spots (catching him as he starts jumping for a nair for example), just play around with it and see if it suits ur style
start- might wanna check what controller port u are so u dont start above him
1:13- dont go for bair there, im fairly confident he could have wiggled out and not had to tech, but if u think hes going to have to tech, go for a techchase rest, since its higher ev than a bair by A LOT, if u thought he was gonnna jump/wiggle out (most people will jump out), than trying to catch the jump with an upair will lead to ridiculous combos
1:22- that was good di out of the throw, but then you rolled in (probably trying to di in, in case the fsmash hit u?), i remember the first time i watched this u did that A LOT, so try to react faster to being out and not roll/techroll in
1:25- ive already seen like 3 times u like to opt for the fair when falling on marth's shield, i think its good for poking (and u seem especially good at doing that from what i recall), but it wont really lead to anything, i would much rather go for falling upair since it can also poke well and it'll lead to rest at those low-mid percents
1:26- i would have opted for grab rather than an empty fullhop nair there, into dthrow
1:50- i dont know why u chose to do a low bair and land, i would have just used more jumps and kept throwing the bairs high since he was still at risk of running into it
2:04- try to avoid hitting weak fairs like that, he could have counter attacked if he was better
2:09- again u di the throw correct, but remember to tech (i always just tech in place since hes in fsmash lag and that give u the fastest recovery and "stage control")
2:10- u know u should rest instead so whtevs
2:19- i would have pounded that upair, don't know if thats right, but i think its worth the risk reward EASILY, since hes at 38 close to the edge and at most ull eat like a fair oos (although i do think the pound would have just punished the lag, but its close)
2:41- that was weird, the bair would have comboed but u didn't drift towards him enough because u didn't react to hitting him fast enough, not sure how to fix this except for experience to quicken ur trained reaction time
2:51- i dunno why u went low, this guy has a habit of immediately jumping out of throws offstage and u havent punished him for it yet, that time you could have... just practice in friendlies IMMEDIATELY jumping after the throw because puff can barely get high enough to hit that option as u can tell from ur previous attempt like 10 seconds before this on the other side of the stage
2:59- u reflexively turn around to use bair since thats usually what u need to edgeguard marth, but he was too close for that, and u were above him, nair would have been perfect in that situation (just a fastfall nair willing to trade with the upb would of been my choice)
3:19- theres an example of him punish that weak fair
3:30- again u roll in after good di
general stuff:
need more pound, i find it a vital tool in the marth mu to keep his spacing honest, low risk high reward most of the time
doesn't seem like ur comfortable staying in the air for more than one full hop double bair, this is common among jiggs, practice alone mixing up 3 bairs high one low, 4 bairs high then waveland, fastfall one low bair, high bair jump waveland, etc... dont get pigeonholed into fullhop double bair and shorthop weaved out bair like every jiggs but hbox is
not willing to use jumps and predict marths jump when hes at the edge of the stage, ur gonna have to gamble and jump with him, otherwise ur letting him back to the center for free too much
Game 2
4:47- again opt for fsmash at low percent, could have done uptilt or just grab upthrow, i know its cuz u have slowish reflexes in tourney, i do too :*(
4:52- nice, u started going for the falling upair
5:18- punish with weak fair, thats actually a perfect spot for the dair-stuff comboes
5:33- u knew he was gonna jump (i think?) but u got hit with the fair, just try to space farther out there, practice that more in friendlies
6:17- could have rested/fsmashed, slow reaction again
6:42- again opted for fair shieldpoke instead of upair or something better (like empty land to crouch or uptilt, etc.)
YOOOOO, i just realized, why is this mute city rofl
6:52- again good di followed by roll in
7:06- lol, that was worth getting hit... for the mindgames
Game 3
10:33- yoshis
11:05- why do u keep edgeguarding low?? he always jumps
Hmm, not much to say here, i think u know all ur mistakes for this game
general stuff:
i don't think you grab enough, he gets away with shielding way too much, you need to mix in empty hop grabs and then empty hop uptilts to catch his immediate rolls
Game 4
12:08- upsmash sucks, maybe u know something i dont, i would just go for uptilt always
12:20- i would have just rested, he was at the center of the stage and u were at low percent, i think its greedy to try to carry him offstage with bairs from there
13:27- again weak fair instead of falling upair or empty land
13:31- on fd i think upthrow is actually pretty reasonable at lowish percents, definitely better than fthrow
15:05- i dunno what all these upsmashes are
16:30- that was a cool combo, if u started the bair lower and than did an upair->bair chain that shoulda been a zero to death
general stuff:
u don't seem comfortable singgrabbing the ledge in all situations, practice that A LOT, with a diff num of jumps, from different angles, anything u can think of
u don't use dash attack at all, it can be really good vs marth in the right spots (catching him as he starts jumping for a nair for example), just play around with it and see if it suits ur style
Kaizer
Smash Journeyman
Yooo, thanks man! Ton of good stuff here.
I don't know whats up w/ the upsmashes either lol.
I don't know whats up w/ the upsmashes either lol.
knightpraetor
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2005
- Messages
- 2,321
nice critique..reminds me of the good old days
Massive
Smash Champion
The Jigglypuff Renaissance is still underway.
The Puff boards are like 1/3 that actually discuss detailed matchups and strategies with any success.
The Puff boards are like 1/3 that actually discuss detailed matchups and strategies with any success.
Kaizer
Smash Journeyman
Do you guys ever use buffered jump? I find it harder to get full control on directions and stuff...