Luigi's Mansion Mafia - Game Over!

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

What did you meant by this?

Why he made himself more invested than he needed to.

There's believing a read and then there's pushing a read you believe in. He took much more a forefront to the wagon than I expected even from marshy and when last I left he was still interested in that angle.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

tall order. lemme meditate on this ****. but in the meantime how bout you tell me why youre giving me the hard question. youre toeing the line and i sense us reaching similar conclusions through different directions (this is more with the ryker half) but the possibility of you mirroring my play to work me sits in the back of my mind enough that i want a lil more insight here. ive got ideas but i wanna see what you produce without bein led

You definitely got the hard question. You also ran down my exact train of thought as far as wanting to see what you're thinking before I give you my own train of thought to spit back at me.

Okay, so first off let me run through what I think about you right now. This is Ryker and, although we've reached much the same conclusions, my process of getting here is somewhat different from Laundry's, so I'm not speaking for him right now.

I don't play Pregame. I used to, but after looking into deadlines and what I think is fair in this game, I don't. Gives town more time and makes scum have a harder time winning. If a game is balanced around X number of days per phase, that throws it out of whack. You don't deserve extra time to play. I was aiming to sit down with Alex and catch up the day the lynch occurred. This means my first REAL exposure to the game was in Twilight. My first reaction was to be furious. There was a lynch that quickly and you were championing the wagon, this could be nothing short of your fault because you're you. I stand by the fact that if you weren't around, that would've never happened, but my knee jerk reaction was much more accusatory than it called for. My first exposure involved the most active Jerkus we've seen all game and he was spouting a lot of the same reactions I was. My comment that I wanted you copped in my (Ryker) first post out of pre-game was legit. I still wanted you copped because it's a ***** to read you and more of a ***** to lynch you. Your PR direction post had me foaming at the mouth. Didn't like it one bit. It was night phase, doing catch-up work with Alex that I noticed something odd about your interactions with different players that made me think you might have a certain role. Since then, I have become less and less sure of that, but that combined with Ruy's outburst I mentioned earlier, made me go back and actually put the effort in to re-examine my read. The way I say to read you is to look at your reads, both town and scum, and examine them closely. If they make sense, you're probably good to go. If they don't, then you can burn at the stake. So I've been reading. I've been doing that. You line up with what I want from you in a lot of ways. However, I am about to dig into this game with four other people and I wanted a straight list from you. I want to see how your reads pan out and I want to see if they change from your previous reads.

That's why I'm asking you the hard question. As for your worries. My read list, as it is, has already been published. If I change something to tailor to you, you can at least look back and decide if it's not genuine.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Lost my post due to Crashboards, so I'll try to re-construct:

AM, what do you make of Gorf? I cannot for the life of me understand what he's trying to accomplish with his pushes. They seem weak, unsubstantiated, and his direction changes as often as the wind.

As for Frito, I'm just not seeing what he has to gain through this play AS scum. What does scumFrito gain by pushing Marshy so early? This doesn't sit well with scum meta for either of them. Town Ruy AND Town Rajam are BOTH known to tunnel like they're digging to China. What makes this different? Where's the scum intent?

I'm totally with you Raziek. I haven't liked Gorf ever since Pre-game play dissipated and ever since it seems like he really doesn't have any direction at all, and when he does have some sort of direction, he changes his mind so haphazardly that it's hard to understand where he was coming from in the first place. See: how he's handled today. What bothers me more is that he seems be gloating in his own play and those posts where he points out his own inconsistencies (Gorf so scummy for changing him vote again!! haha right on man!!! smoke weed!!!) really are boggling my goddamn mind. I don't know what he gains by openly pointing them out and like I said before, it looks like an appeal. I see no town intent to make those posts and I really can't see his town intent at all.

 

[Friday Townie]

Aye man lets just hope nobody gets to L-1, we never know what crazy ol' Gorfs gonna do man!

why did you need to post this

Cuz Gorf is scum obv

Meanwhile my read on the waggoners up to L-2 in Sokr's wagon is that they were attempting to get reaction-reads, Nabe came and left a content-less L-1 vote on Sokr and disappeared, and Gorf just came and hammered and is like nobody remembers that toDay

Also Gorf, you were very keen at the end of yesterDay on calling the wifoms; how is it possible you missed the different layers of wifom that happened in the thuggin-Circus exchange post-hammer yesterDay too?

Scum: thuggin, Nabe

Scum-Lean: Gorf

Null: Scary, Raziek, Circus

Town-Lean: Rake, AM, Kary

Town: soup, dabuz, Joey

(^ Rajam reads)

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

EBWOP: That post is a garbled mess and I'm really sorry about that, I'm thinking on the fly and trying to properly phrase everything.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

I forgot to elaborate on this. You're clearly stepping outside your town meta here. When, as town have you ever been #HBC just lynch someone D1? Never.

But it's not just that you're outside your meta. It's that when I called you on it (#517), you tried to downplay it:



Come on. Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. What sort of reactions were you really expecting?

Because what you've got is me going for your throat.


Don't get me started on that textbook Rake scum vote from the top of toDay.

Not true did it in deadpool maf and a couple other's like HBC, I don't normally do it because it's outside my information gathering zone but in certain instances it has a place. I want you to explain why it being outside my town meta is telling though. If you really think as scum I'd break my own meta, you need to elaborate on that given that my scum meta is hwo I played in FE&A, You may call it wifom but I wouldn't change what worked especially given it worked so well last time.

That wasn't a downplay, that's why I did it, you askedd for a reason and I gave you one. I was expecting like I said before, resistance, defense, something outside of sokr to be offered, hell even a little bit fo a strong arm from you or soup to say: Hey ql don't!! But it never happened which as I mentioned before was mad odd.

Also, there is no "textbook" rake scum, your smart enough to realize that me voting is a null, try again.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Cuz Gorf is scum obv

Meanwhile my read on the waggoners up to L-2 in Sokr's wagon is that they were attempting to get reaction-reads, Nabe came and left a content-less L-1 vote on Sokr and disappeared, and Gorf just came and hammered and is like nobody remembers that toDay

Also Gorf, you were very keen at the end of yesterDay on calling the wifoms; how is it possible you missed the different layers of wifom that happened in the thuggin-Circus exchange post-hammer yesterDay too?

Scum: thuggin, Nabe

Scum-Lean: Gorf

Null: Scary, Raziek, Circus

Town-Lean: Rake, AM, Kary

Town: soup, dabuz, Joey

(^ Rajam reads)

>Town
>Dabuz

WHY

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

AM, what do you make of Gorf? I cannot for the life of me understand what he's trying to accomplish with his pushes. They seem weak, unsubstantiated, and his direction changes as often as the wind.

As for Frito, I'm just not seeing what he has to gain through this play AS scum. What does scumFrito gain by pushing Marshy so early? This doesn't sit well with scum meta for either of them. Town Ruy AND Town Rajam are BOTH known to tunnel like they're digging to China. What makes this different? Where's the scum intent?

Again, Ryker without Alex's signature.

Null lean-town. He's putting himself out there substantially. He may be scum, but if he is, I think it'll come out in the wash later. He's got too much on the table. As far as the number of times they've changed direction, I dunno about that. I'd need to see. I don't think his change in direction has changed so much to be unacceptable.

It comes down to looking up whether he intended to push Marshy this hard or whether Marshy backed him into a corner. And look at that Twilight: It could easily have been an attempt to push the Marshy hate momentum with me and Circus on board. That second bit is the easy devil's advocate answer. I really don't get the scum intent question. They would obviously be intending to lynch Marshy who is after them, questionable in town's eyes, and both unpredictable and dangerous.

Regardless, I don't want to lynch Frito at the moment. I don't have enough on him to warrant that.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

Okay. I'm caught up for the most part.

Currently Town-reading Kary, Soup and somewhat Frito.

Most importantly, I really want to look into Kary's Rake angle. Rake's play around the quicklynch was whack as ****, and he's not playing his Town meta. Rake usually keeps his thought process specifically on the table so that people can WATCH as he runs around like a headless chicken trying to find Town-reads.

That was distinctly absent in his play yesterday, and I want to see this angle explored.

Rake, talk to me about your play yesterday. Why in the world were you in "SOMEBODY HAMMAH" mode?

See: My response to Kary.

It's like you guys think approaching something differently due to circumstance is bad or something. My thought process was in fact on the table , I even spelt it out a couple times as I was doing it. Cmon man. Be smart.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Not true did it in deadpool maf and a couple other's like HBC, I don't normally do it because it's outside my information gathering zone but in certain instances it has a place. I want you to explain why it being outside my town meta is telling though. If you really think as scum I'd break my own meta, you need to elaborate on that given that my scum meta is hwo I played in FE&A, You may call it wifom but I wouldn't change what worked especially given it worked so well last time.

That wasn't a downplay, that's why I did it, you askedd for a reason and I gave you one. I was expecting like I said before, resistance, defense, something outside of sokr to be offered, hell even a little bit fo a strong arm from you or soup to say: Hey ql don't!! But it never happened which as I mentioned before was mad odd.

Also, there is no "textbook" rake scum, your smart enough to realize that me voting is a null, try again.

Rake, I need to know why you're so content with trying to throw meta at us as a reason why your actions aren't suspecting. It's a flimsy argument and not acceptable. Where's your head currently? Do you still want Thuggin'? I haven't seen you do much this whole phase besides respond to Kary iirc.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

I would love to hear Rake's input on this.

On what did you want here ? Gorf ?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

@AM

Don't you find Gorf's reasoning to vote you earlier on Pre-game to be a bit concerning? Do you recall when he was trying to say 'he saw the merit of the wagon' but wanted to deny ever being on it?

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

Rake, I need to know why you're so content with trying to throw meta at us as a reason why your actions aren't suspecting. It's a flimsy argument and not acceptable. Where's your head currently? Do you still want Thuggin'? I haven't seen you do much this whole phase besides respond to Kary iirc.

Good post.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

Rake, I need to know why you're so content with trying to throw meta at us as a reason why your actions aren't suspecting. It's a flimsy argument and not acceptable. Where's your head currently? Do you still want Thuggin'? I haven't seen you do much this whole phase besides respond to Kary iirc.

I never wanted marshy ?

I'm not trying to throw meta, I'm trying to respond to everyone throwing meta at me. I know meta is flimsy but when people throw it at me i can't really respond in any other fashion. People need to learn to look beyond meta. And into intent, I giving and have gave the intent and people's response has been : well it's different so it's bad. But different =/= scummy, different == different

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

@AM

Don't you find Gorf's reasoning to vote you earlier on Pre-game to be a bit concerning? Do you recall when he was trying to say 'he saw the merit of the wagon' but wanted to deny ever being on it?

I don't hate anyone for being on that wagon in pre-game. It was pre-game. I was the RVS wagon of choice and Alex bit wrong. I can look again, but no, I don't recall anything particularly off-putting about it.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

I never wanted marshy ?

I'm not trying to throw meta, I'm trying to respond to everyone throwing meta at me. I know meta is flimsy but when people throw it at me i can't really respond in any other fashion. People need to learn to look beyond meta. And into intent, I giving and have gave the intent and people's response has been : well it's different so it's bad. But different =/= scummy, different == different

What Soup, and me too now, is trying to say is remove meta from your vocabulary, stop talking about yourself, and do something.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

You need to explain this.

Didn't like your slot before as mentioned D1 so i followed my intuition.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

vote: friday townie

I got confused on who you're voting, but it still doesn't change anything. You've sat on this vote all goddamn day. Are you ready to do something with it?

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

What Soup, and me too now, is trying to say is remove meta from your vocabulary, stop talking about yourself, and do something.

Trying to mang. I'll have opinions once i'm done sifting this see of posts

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

I got confused on who you're voting, but it still doesn't change anything. You've sat on this vote all goddamn day. Are you ready to do something with it?

i haven't been here of course I sat on it -_-. and yeah, despite not having read recently I'm probably not gonna move off him and even try to get more into him as I have concerns left over from previous feels

 

[#HBC | Kary]

I've been getting crashboards for 2 days. Will try and catch up now.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

Cooking now, will come back and get crashboarded.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I never wanted marshy ?

I'm not trying to throw meta, I'm trying to respond to everyone throwing meta at me. I know meta is flimsy but when people throw it at me i can't really respond in any other fashion. People need to learn to look beyond meta. And into intent, I giving and have gave the intent and people's response has been : well it's different so it's bad. But different =/= scummy, different == different

Well, my main problem is that you're hiding behind it and not doing anything. I mean, Kary's argument might be some-what meta based but there are also legitimate concerns made that you seem less concerned about and more focused on defending yourself. You're not getting anything done with your current mindset because you're basically telling me in this post that you can never do anything wrong and if anyone suspects they're just reading your meta wrong. Bull****.

 

[Friday Townie]

>Town
>Dabuz

WHY

Strong meta vibes. In the very recent FE-Adv I pinned scum-dabuz instantly, specially due to borderline-inactivity + absolute lack of town intention in his posts (and lack of postures). I don't see that here at all. Here, his pregame posts (which is actually an extension of D1 in this particular game, so it shouldn't be dismissed) were instantly aimed at analyzing stuff and getting reads, not at posing a townie appareance and rest on it. Both his town and scum playstyle are incredibly similar to mine (probably he is the closest player in DGames to me in terms of playstyle), so I feel confident in meta-reading him; trust me when I say dabuz is town in this game.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

(Rake) Would like a little explanation on his vote in 657

If this is my FT vote is was I felt like he wasn't playing to read people and was instead scummily putting his blinders on, especially to marshy and even to me. I know it's half rajam but the Ryu side didn't show any intent to get a real reads, his feels largely felt fake to me and even skimming now I don't understand how he has me at null town at all seeing as I haven't been doing anything toDay yet. Slot is scummy and should prolly go short of what I missed being damn amazing

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

if i hear meta again im going to ****ing puke; frito, what do you make of my pressure against him and my reasoning to scum-read him? have you looked into it all?

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

vote: Nabe

What even is this though. Why nabe at that point ?

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

I think even if FT is scum, Joey would not hard-defend his partner like this. I think Joey is just doing what he believes is right and what I really like about him is that he seems very genuine in his posts instead of trying to mold an image of a townie with long wall-posts that don't really go anywhere. It's easy to discern what Joey's mindset is this game without needing to dig.

Dabuns, why are you sudden to just toss aside what thuggin' is talking about and just vote him over FT? Hell, why are you openly making posts #752 that don't go anywhere and look like you rushed to post content? I really don't get how out of that mess, you concluded that thuggin' was the right lynch. I don't recall you ever discussing dislike of thuggin' earlier (and if you did it was really vague) so for you to just side with frito really concerns me.

Everyone tell me their read on Dabuns right now please.

At this point i was leaning null scum. Shades of dabuz from FE&A. I think i talked about this on D1 where i mentioned not feeling comfortable with his approach due to my experience of his scum play. His thuggin vote didn't make too much sense as I felt like his post was gearing towards joining the train on me. I don't think he ever explained why he felt marshy was scum over just agressive town marshy at least that i saw, the vote seemed haphazard and placed really. Like what you might expect of directionless scum

 

[Friday Townie]

if i hear meta again im going to ****ing puke; frito, what do you make of my pressure against him and my reasoning to scum-read him? have you looked into it all?

lol why are you now dismissing meta when you're one of the players that use it the most in DGames (at least that's my perception from past games); anyways, I haven't checked what you've said of dabuz; once I get there I'll try to throw an oppinion.

soup is dabuz the player you want dead the most? Which are your other options?

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

Looking at Rake due to his interaction with Kary, I'm really bothered by how he tried to play off the lynch.

Dunno after that a whole lot, I would like more from Raz and Circus since they gave less I can read from.

I didn't do this. Why am I still a null town from your POV. Is marshy still your priority ?

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

Gonna chat with Rajam on recent Dabuz stuff, kinda curious since Soup's post has merit.

Whatever happened to this.

 

[Raziek]

Again, Ryker without Alex's signature.

Null lean-town. He's putting himself out there substantially. He may be scum, but if he is, I think it'll come out in the wash later. He's got too much on the table. As far as the number of times they've changed direction, I dunno about that. I'd need to see. I don't think his change in direction has changed so much to be unacceptable.

This is rather vague. How exactly has he "put himself out there" outside of hammering on D1? I haven't gotten that impression at all.

This also doesn't address my inquiry regarding his pushes being weak/unsubstantiated. Do you have a counterexample on that, or are you conceding that point?

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

Yeah but he played the same in the very recent FE-Adv and he was scum. Something has been bugging me about that slot lately, idk yet what it is but on first glance I'd say is his extremely off reads (they're like the complete opposite of mines) so I'm retracting my initial town read on him and I'm moving him to null until I figure out what's Rake up to

Why was this / is this telling though. Ok my reads are different, and ?

This is also super wishy washy and I dislike it intensely

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

lol why are you now dismissing meta when you're one of the players that use it the most in DGames (at least that's my perception from past games); anyways, I haven't checked what you've said of dabuz; once I get there I'll try to throw an oppinion.

soup is dabuz the player you want dead the most? Which are your other options?

I use meta as a scent, not a tell. It's true that some of my argument in past (and current) games have meta involved in my reads but it's never the absolute base of the argument. I have much more reasoning to town-read Raziek based on his individual play than just meta, but I also have meta reasoning that contributes to it. Right now, your argument against mine is solely compromised of Meta and holds no barring other than 'Dabuz did this in X therefore Y' tell me: did anything ever come out of Dabuns' analysis and reads? Can you tell me without a doubt that Dabuns has been productive at all? Read more into my argument instead of dismissing because we don't happen to agree. That's why I see here. You've built an image of what Dabuns plays like in your head and it's completely clouding your judgment. That's what makes my read different from yours. Tell me what town intention you can discern from Dabuns' recent posts and responses.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

need to eat, way too many errors in that post, apologies again

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Request Deadline Extension

 

[Raziek]

-Alive-
1. Circus*
2. Nabe*
3. Rake*
4. Aggressive Mediation (WashedLaundry/Ryker)*
6. ScaryLB59*
7. Raziek*
8. dabuz*
9. Friday Townie (Red Ruy/Rajam)*
10. Mari777 Kary
11. we thuggin (marshy/Sold2)*
12. Gorf*
13. soup*
14. -Masquerain-*

PoE Thought Dump at the Moment:

For toDay, I'm narrowing down my lynch pool. I'm setting aside Soup and Joey in my "clearly Town" pile.

Kary's kinda faded into the background. His earlier posts and his Rake push have lined up really well with my thoughts. Can probably attribute the "fading" feeling to Crashboards at least partially. Still strong town-lean.

Mentioned my thoughts on AM & Frito earlier. Frito still under review, but for now, is slight Town-lean.

Mostly ok with what Circus has posted, but that admittedly isn't a ****load. Slight Town lean here.

Scary, Nabe, Dabuz and Marshy are still undecided on.

Clearly Town:

Joey
Soup

Town-leans:

Kary
Aggressive Mediation
Circus
Frito

That leaves my lynch pool for today:

Rake
Gorf
Dabuz
Nabe
Thuggin'

Rake and Gorf I have actual scum-leans on currently. Nabe and Thuggin are nulls that I wouldn't split hairs over lynching. I'm going to re-read Dabunz right now to try to wrap my head around his actual content.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Gorf why do you keep doing this it's literally an appeal and I don't get what you gain calling this out at all I mean are you trying to defend yourself because this isn't a really good way to do it you did this before trying to justify your hammer on Sokr like how many times can you do this before it gets ****ing old

no i will not use periods

Man you gotta relax bro. You're killing my vibe

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

you're killing my vibe gorf

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

ebwop: for the record, i'm trying not to bog down the thread by responding to a bunch of ancient **** but you made the comment that we should reevaluate how we play the game when, if we get mvp in this game, we will have gotten mvp in three games in a row, one in each alignment, whereas your signature speaks for itself. do not start with me.

*throws hands in air*
la de freakin da.

FT concerning y/n ?
Dabuns too ?
FT == Dabunz ?

Where do you stand on Soup ? (I like him still, I'm feeling less conflicted than D1)
Thuggin direction hold any salt( i think thuggin is worth keeping around off my d1 feels but i could be talked about it as long as it wasn't ryu doing the talking )