Lucario Brainstorm Thread (Updating Soon.)

[Alus]

Ciao

'Warning of possible noobiness'

I've seen from multiple Lucario based threads and posts that the general concensus about DT is pretty negative. I understand the counter-window/total-frames ratio isn't that big but do we really have to limit it to countering blatantly slow start-up moves and predictable recoveries? The way I see it, there's a psychology to fighting that DT can fit itself into, like the same instinct anyone uses for spotdodging. This may just be hot air but it seems like discounting a move from our moveset forfeits a possibility of limiting opponent options--giving them another factor to worry about.

I admit, this isn't really a thing for testing against any kind of computer, but personally, I like this move, and I'd rather not leave it to rot. Can it REALLY not be developed?

If it works for you, use it, maybe you can actually find something (somehow)... But really, its difficult to develop on a move that has a somewhat small window for activation, and then once you do activate it...gets shielded.

The way I see it, there's a psychology to fighting that DT can fit itself into, like the same instinct anyone uses for spotdodging.

I'm sorry?

 

[Zucco]

I always run up to people, turn around and fake them out with fsmash, so I find this to be kind of useful to me. even though its not much, I have a better chance at landing a tipper fsmash, added to the fact that I'm at a safer distance in case its blocked and since you have to charge it a little I would assume its alittle stronger.

 

[Aurasmash14]

Ciao

'Warning of possible noobiness'

I've seen from multiple Lucario based threads and posts that the general concensus about DT is pretty negative. I understand the counter-window/total-frames ratio isn't that big but do we really have to limit it to countering blatantly slow start-up moves and predictable recoveries? The way I see it, there's a psychology to fighting that DT can fit itself into, like the same instinct anyone uses for spotdodging. This may just be hot air but it seems like discounting a move from our moveset forfeits a possibility of limiting opponent options--giving them another factor to worry about.

I admit, this isn't really a thing for testing against any kind of computer, but personally, I like this move, and I'd rather not leave it to rot. Can it REALLY not be developed?

Yes it really cant be developed. there is no psychology, no mindgames, almost 0-things you can do with a counter move with very little active frames, and an avoidable attack. If you truly want to use this, you can sometimes DT a predictable recovery like firebird, but thats about it. Any obscenely slow moves can be Fsmashed/aurasphered if you were going for knockback.

im sorry, i used to love DT too, (when my opponents still got hit by it >_> )

 

[phi1ny3]

If you time it right, it's a lulzy attack on an Ike Aether, but you have to really be strict on it <_<;
Oh and I'll sometimes use Reverse Double Team against falco lasers because I get annoyed with having to PS all the time and one RDT covers like half of SV/BF, and they don't expect it often.
But yeah DT sucks, if you really want to work it into your game, you can, but the problem is, the amount it does the most damage at is also the time you'll get killed by anything, and you don't want to risk that if you're even/behind in the game.

 

[tedward2000]

So, I have a tournament tomorrow, and I was just running around with lucario today.

I did notice that if you where able to somehow turn lucario around in a shield or cancel this turning around animation while running, you'd be able to easily aura charge on people.

why I bring this up? To hopefully get some people to figure out how to turn lucario around. And then possibly find a better way to charge on people.

Oh and aura charging someone in the air in-order to "Diddy or Wario" gimp them, doesnt work. The charge sends them up. Aura charge would be buckets better if it charged them downward. D:
-t2

 

[phi1ny3]

Anti-ledgehog thingy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YqyRnFHlSQ

 

[Aurasmash14]

im surprised no one has reacted to this... ^

 

[culexus・wau]

shhhhh its supposed to be a secret.


philllllllll stop DX

 

[Aurasmash14]

well, while its disappointing to see it doesnt work from below, its still a pretty good tech :D

 

[Ledge_g2]

Yes it really cant be developed. there is no psychology, no mindgames, almost 0-things you can do with a counter move with very little active frames, and an avoidable attack. If you truly want to use this, you can sometimes DT a predictable recovery like firebird, but thats about it. Any obscenely slow moves can be Fsmashed/aurasphered if you were going for knockback.

im sorry, i used to love DT too, (when my opponents still got hit by it >_> )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFdAE1IBlu4
@3:28
I am much better now but im sure you get the point.
if DT works for you then use it, should always use as many options as you can get imo.

So, I have a tournament tomorrow, and I was just running around with lucario today.

I did notice that if you where able to somehow turn lucario around in a shield or cancel this turning around animation while running, you'd be able to easily aura charge on people.

why I bring this up? To hopefully get some people to figure out how to turn lucario around. And then possibly find a better way to charge on people.
-t2

You can B-Reverse a grounded AS while running, the timing takes some getting used to though

 

[Browny]

DT is horrible, please dont attempt to defend it

 

[Aurasmash14]

To be honest.... a DT should never hit an MK lol.

it is a move which should only be used if you want to..

a) get *****
b) get *****
c) lose
d) taunt the opponent if they get hit by it in a friendy. e.g "omg you fell for it lololol.

 

[Ledge_g2]

When i used it in the vid, it was to punish a Nair, it was prob one of the only moves that would have killed at those %s.
not saying its a good move at all, but im sure it could be used situationally where you read your opponent and figure out his patterns/habbits too catch your opponent off guard.

I read that he had a habbit of dashattacking -> Nairing, so i took advantage of it. when the DT hit, he was still in the animation of Nair so it couldnt have been blocked(from what i could see).

ohh i also see Azen and Lee Martin use DT sometimes, probs for some sort of mind game.

thats as much as im going to defend it anywayz... ill stop now XD

 

[iRJi]

Reviving. I might postpone the Doubles thread for a short while because of inactivity and lack of enthusiasm for it as of right now. I do have another project prepped, however I want to see what other people might want to do. Posts your idea's here, and if it is popular enough, we can start on it ASAP.

Let our Revolution begin!

 

[phi1ny3]

uthrow projects are going to happen here soon, and we're also going to break down "Anubis" once and for all to the nitty gritty.

 

[Aurasmash14]

remind me again why Lucario's throws are considered good?

i get upthrow. its low knockback and angle allow stuff.

but what about the others?

 

[phi1ny3]

fthrow on lighties has weak followup potential, fast, and does a ton of damage (14% + 1-2 easy pummels = D3's bthrow in damage)
dthrow can help setup juggle stuff
uthrow can too, but we're testing some theories about it that might be better than previously thought
bthrow is good to get someone offstage quick and both bthrow/dthrow are useful for solid low % damage, and resetting space.

 

[Aurasmash14]

but upthrow , if hunches are correct, just might be the most useful one?

 

[Browny]

fthrow is good because its fast, people wont always react to a dashgrab-fthrow properly and DI accordingly. even better that it has legitimate KO potential lol

 

[The_Bear735]

Bthrow is amazing for getting knockback when you have no aura.

 

[hough123]

Hey guys, because I have no where to post these, I'll bump it with some "finds."

1. Lucario can grab MK out of his tornado. I played with it for half an hour, and it seems like you can only grab after either half or towards the end of the tornado. You also can't be too far away, nor can MK be too high. Basically, it seems hard and very situational.
2. While grabbing, rapidly hitting "A" while twirling the c-stick, (set to smash), adds about one damage total before they break out. I got 15 pummels with them at 60%. Could be useful to get in more pummels faster to prevent decay.

Just to point out, if you pummel too fast it doesn't count to decrease of move decay. Just a nice note to know.

That's it. Discuss what you will.

 

[iRJi]

Just to point out, if you pummel too fast it doesn't count to decrease of move decay. Just a nice note to know.

 

[hough123]

Just to point out, if you pummel too fast it doesn't count to decrease of move decay. Just a nice note to know.

Thanks, I'll edit that in.