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Louie's Notes-Olimar Q&A Thread!!
- Thread starter Zori
- Start date
You're kidding right? Did I word that wrong? Don't pikmin suffer hitlag separately from olimar on smashes?
I did an Fsmash on Green Greens and Olimar was done with the move before it finished hitting the 3rd block in the row. So I'm just wondering because your frame data thread doesn't list block advantages for each attack/pikmin.
I did an Fsmash on Green Greens and Olimar was done with the move before it finished hitting the 3rd block in the row. So I'm just wondering because your frame data thread doesn't list block advantages for each attack/pikmin.
Perhaps I'll rephrase it in a way you can understand what you're saying better...
In terms of block advantages, Hilt has been working on them for a bit. It's posted in bits and pieces in another thread. It takes a little over 5 times longer than every other character since each Pikmin has it's own variable data.
Why would Olimar's smashes be different than any other projectile in the game?
In terms of block advantages, Hilt has been working on them for a bit. It's posted in bits and pieces in another thread. It takes a little over 5 times longer than every other character since each Pikmin has it's own variable data.
DtJ Hilt
Little Lizard
Well in my first post, the first 2 questions were just to clarify that my 3rd question mattered.
I was just asking for block advantage data, since it isn't listed in your frame data thread. I also couldn't find it in the guides.
Hilt, you were very helpful, will that data be edited into the frame data thread when it is finished? I only see data for 1 move in that thread's OP.
I was just asking for block advantage data, since it isn't listed in your frame data thread. I also couldn't find it in the guides.
Hilt, you were very helpful, will that data be edited into the frame data thread when it is finished? I only see data for 1 move in that thread's OP.
-Vocal-
Smash Hero
...and Vocal proceeded to chuckle to himself for a solid five seconds
DtJ Hilt
Little Lizard
Yeah, as soon as I start testing things again. It's just a lot of work.
Slain Avenger
Smash Ace
The ROB match up... I have no idea how to go about it, couldn't get a stock off him. Are there any good guides lying around? It's the hardest MU i've had so far with Oli :/
PSI.kick
Smash Lord
*cough lol metaknight mu is now in our favor cough*
*cough richbrown is awesome cough*
I have trouble with this mu too, used to have problems with the gyro, but then i started powershielding it all the time, helped me not get ***** every time i played. Getting gimped is a problem against rob because he can chase you all day off the edge. My solution for this is to stay away from the edges. Not sure of much more than that sorry.
*cough richbrown is awesome cough*
I have trouble with this mu too, used to have problems with the gyro, but then i started powershielding it all the time, helped me not get ***** every time i played. Getting gimped is a problem against rob because he can chase you all day off the edge. My solution for this is to stay away from the edges. Not sure of much more than that sorry.
Sabeta
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Oct 2, 2010
- Messages
- 31
The Guide mentioned in OP is gone...
I really want to get good with Olimar, and I'm just barely getting a grasp on some of his basic AT (Well, to be honest, I've only mastered the Whistle Armor) I have no clue how to rocket my Pikmin, or how to tell/get them De-Synched, or how to spot/avoid/abuse Ghost Pikmin, let alone what they do, how they get there, or anything related to that. I don't really know any combos. (I managed to pull off one combo, where I grab a guy, Uthrow, jump, Usmash, then Smash behind me, somehow go turned around in the process (Is that what a pivot is?) FSmash, then Nair to the ground. Best combo I've done, and it only happened once. Probably wont happen again until I get decent.
So yeah, can you answer all those questions, I'm pretty nooby, so please don't use a bunch of complicated terms, or if you do, define 'em for me. Please, thanks, and have a nice day.
I really want to get good with Olimar, and I'm just barely getting a grasp on some of his basic AT (Well, to be honest, I've only mastered the Whistle Armor) I have no clue how to rocket my Pikmin, or how to tell/get them De-Synched, or how to spot/avoid/abuse Ghost Pikmin, let alone what they do, how they get there, or anything related to that. I don't really know any combos. (I managed to pull off one combo, where I grab a guy, Uthrow, jump, Usmash, then Smash behind me, somehow go turned around in the process (Is that what a pivot is?) FSmash, then Nair to the ground. Best combo I've done, and it only happened once. Probably wont happen again until I get decent.
So yeah, can you answer all those questions, I'm pretty nooby, so please don't use a bunch of complicated terms, or if you do, define 'em for me. Please, thanks, and have a nice day.
DtJ Hilt
Little Lizard
I took care of ya bro
PSI.kick
Smash Lord
EDIT: ... HILT GOSH DANGIT.
Welcome to the Oli boards, where racism, communism, and slavery are in abundance!
alright im not gonna go over everything, just the basics and some useful tips.
Ghost pikmin is very irrelevant, it almost never happens so don't worry about it.
Pikmin rocketing and desyncing is too complicated and really is unnecessary, sometimes fun but way situational and hard to pull off, don't worry about that either.
K terms,
sh=short hop
fh=full hop
d=down
u=up
f=forward or front
b=back
COMBOS
easy ones, as in the ones you will almost always use
dthrow->sh fair (guaranteed at early percents)
dthrow->usmash
dthrow->usmash-uair (i love this one)
Land canceled Nair(when you do a neutral air into the ground and it doesn't finish)->usmash
those are the main combos you're gonna want to use for now, more complicated and less guaranteed ones come later.
PIKMIN TOSSING
This is a must for olimar, it's easily a third of his game (more for a lot of matchups... lol ddd xD.) one of the best ways of using this is sh double toss: You will get extra distance on your throws and also not leave yourself too open.
How to do this: Short Hop then pikmin toss twice, but don't hold forward on the control stick between tosses, let go as soon as you've tossed the first slave pikmin. try to slam the stick backwards in between your two throws to keep get a small retreat on it as well.
UP SMASH
hyphen smash:
simple, just dash then usmash, you'll usmash out of a dash. good to use for kills or damage.
Reverse hyphen smash:
not really necessary for olimar, if you want you can get into that some other time.
usmash out of shield (OoS)
Yummy, this is not the same thing as dropping your shield and usmashing, you won't experience the lag of that with this. TO DO: you shield, you jump, then nearly at the same time or immediately after you usmash. DO THIS A LOT.
Overall usmash is amazing, its speed is godly and its range is godly, you will be surprised by how far sideways it reaches, with yellow pikmin it hits more than an olimar's distance in front and behind.
FORWARD SMASH
i'm not gonna go all the way for this move, though it is epic. overall a powerful and quick move that is good to use in a lot of situations.
hills and ledges: pikmin will continue to fall down with their hitboxes a bit after they lost horizontal momentum. This can be useful for ledgeguarding and setting up a wall of pikmin for yourself.
Everywhere else: pretty much the best fsmash ever, quick andpainless painful, insane range and epic. C-STICK FTW!
GRABBING
"WHAT THE **** IS THE DEAL WITH OLIMAR'S **** GRAB?!"
you will hear this a lot, they are jealous of our communist benefits... mwuahahah. Anyway, olimar's grab is insane. It's one of the longest in the game and it is unaffected by hills and tilting stages. bottom line, it *****.
PIVOT GRABBING
i can't stress this enough, replace every roll you would normally do to avoid your opponent with a pivot grab, it's helped my game so much...
TO DO: dash one way then slam the control stick the other way and grab at nearly the same time. (when i say slam i mean go the other way, but slam is just way more epic) I'm not sure why but this increases the grab range A LOT. Do this more than you think you should do this, it is one of the best parts about playing olimar, GRABS FTW.
THROWS
dthrow- amazing for combos, use this throw the most, don't stale your other throws, you want to save them for kills
uthrow- purple uthrow is a very good kill move
bthrow- blue bthrow is also a very good kill move. Sometimes you will use this as a gtfo move but usually you want to stick with dthrow
fthrow- same as bthrow really but kills at way higher percents, use this as a gtfo move or just something to get them in front of you out of the way or off the ledge or whatever.
DON'T GO OFF STAGE. I know how tempting it is to go for a dair spike! don't do it, olimar has a terrible recovery and you will get gimped if you screw up!
DI (directional influencing)
I won't talk much about this, but this is definitely a must. When you get hit by a kill move, as you are in the hitstun push the control stick at a 90 degree angle away from the direction you will be sent in. Easiest moves to do this with imo are zelda's smash attacks. You will bend a little the way your control stick was faced, and this helps you because of this
picture the stage as a big rectangle. The blast zones (the part you die in) are the sides of this, the top, the right, the left, and the bottom. You want to try to go as close to the corners as you can, this is where you will survive the longest.
My description of di is definitely a fail, there are a lot of descriptions of it though, you'll learn. There's a thread to a very good description, ill try to find the link in a bit.
RECOVERY
SAVE YOUR JUMP, DON'T USE IT AS SOON AS YOU CAN. The best option is to try to get close to the ledge, then jump. If they are guarding the ledge then you need to whistle as you are jumping so they can't hit you out of it. Then if they are edgehogging you need a purple pikmin to throw at them and that will get them off of it so you can tether (up b, also known as utility belt). Tether also gives you a small hop, so if they are edgehogging you and you are close enough then use it and you will land safely on the stage.
I don't have much on this, but it is a very important thing to get better at.
PIKMIN COLORS
almost forgot about this lol
anyway, not gonna go over much here, just the basic uses for each color.
Reds: element fire, Good for aerials (more damage, kills earlier etc), a smidgeon stronger for smashes, and isn't affected by fire attacks (ex. bowser's flame thrower)
Blue: Good throw and pummel damage, kills at a decent percent from bthrow. A good overall color that isn't particularly good at aerials/smashes, but not bad. This is the only pikmin that won't die in water.
Yellow: Bigger hitboxes than most pikmin colors, element is electric so it isn't affected by electric type attacks. Highest priority of any pikmin color for all attacks (it beats other moves better) has more hitstun than other colors
White: Extremely far pikmin toss, they travel with very small arc and deal high latch damage. They have the highest pummel damage when you grab with them. Most attacks from whites have very little knockback, meaning DON'T EVER USE ONE OF THESE FOR A SMASH ATTACK, THEY WILL SCREW YOU OVER. Pluck 'em and chuck 'em.
Purples: Grape n' ****, they have the highest damage output on pretty much every attack. Purple usmash is insane, you wouldn't even know killing someone that early was possible. Purple uthrow kills at a reasonable percent as well. Grape n' **** man, grape n' ****...
Keep track of your pikmin line, know which one you have next.
My last piece of advice, use common sense and don't be stupid.
some useful threads
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=284729
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=285739
there's another one regarding pikmin colors, i can't remember what it was called.
Welcome to the Oli boards, where racism, communism, and slavery are in abundance!
alright im not gonna go over everything, just the basics and some useful tips.
Ghost pikmin is very irrelevant, it almost never happens so don't worry about it.
Pikmin rocketing and desyncing is too complicated and really is unnecessary, sometimes fun but way situational and hard to pull off, don't worry about that either.
K terms,
sh=short hop
fh=full hop
d=down
u=up
f=forward or front
b=back
COMBOS
easy ones, as in the ones you will almost always use
dthrow->sh fair (guaranteed at early percents)
dthrow->usmash
dthrow->usmash-uair (i love this one)
Land canceled Nair(when you do a neutral air into the ground and it doesn't finish)->usmash
those are the main combos you're gonna want to use for now, more complicated and less guaranteed ones come later.
PIKMIN TOSSING
This is a must for olimar, it's easily a third of his game (more for a lot of matchups... lol ddd xD.) one of the best ways of using this is sh double toss: You will get extra distance on your throws and also not leave yourself too open.
How to do this: Short Hop then pikmin toss twice, but don't hold forward on the control stick between tosses, let go as soon as you've tossed the first
UP SMASH
hyphen smash:
simple, just dash then usmash, you'll usmash out of a dash. good to use for kills or damage.
Reverse hyphen smash:
not really necessary for olimar, if you want you can get into that some other time.
usmash out of shield (OoS)
Yummy, this is not the same thing as dropping your shield and usmashing, you won't experience the lag of that with this. TO DO: you shield, you jump, then nearly at the same time or immediately after you usmash. DO THIS A LOT.
Overall usmash is amazing, its speed is godly and its range is godly, you will be surprised by how far sideways it reaches, with yellow pikmin it hits more than an olimar's distance in front and behind.
FORWARD SMASH
i'm not gonna go all the way for this move, though it is epic. overall a powerful and quick move that is good to use in a lot of situations.
hills and ledges: pikmin will continue to fall down with their hitboxes a bit after they lost horizontal momentum. This can be useful for ledgeguarding and setting up a wall of pikmin for yourself.
Everywhere else: pretty much the best fsmash ever, quick and
GRABBING
"WHAT THE **** IS THE DEAL WITH OLIMAR'S **** GRAB?!"
you will hear this a lot, they are jealous of our communist benefits... mwuahahah. Anyway, olimar's grab is insane. It's one of the longest in the game and it is unaffected by hills and tilting stages. bottom line, it *****.
PIVOT GRABBING
i can't stress this enough, replace every roll you would normally do to avoid your opponent with a pivot grab, it's helped my game so much...
TO DO: dash one way then slam the control stick the other way and grab at nearly the same time. (when i say slam i mean go the other way, but slam is just way more epic) I'm not sure why but this increases the grab range A LOT. Do this more than you think you should do this, it is one of the best parts about playing olimar, GRABS FTW.
THROWS
dthrow- amazing for combos, use this throw the most, don't stale your other throws, you want to save them for kills
uthrow- purple uthrow is a very good kill move
bthrow- blue bthrow is also a very good kill move. Sometimes you will use this as a gtfo move but usually you want to stick with dthrow
fthrow- same as bthrow really but kills at way higher percents, use this as a gtfo move or just something to get them in front of you out of the way or off the ledge or whatever.
DON'T GO OFF STAGE. I know how tempting it is to go for a dair spike! don't do it, olimar has a terrible recovery and you will get gimped if you screw up!
DI (directional influencing)
I won't talk much about this, but this is definitely a must. When you get hit by a kill move, as you are in the hitstun push the control stick at a 90 degree angle away from the direction you will be sent in. Easiest moves to do this with imo are zelda's smash attacks. You will bend a little the way your control stick was faced, and this helps you because of this
picture the stage as a big rectangle. The blast zones (the part you die in) are the sides of this, the top, the right, the left, and the bottom. You want to try to go as close to the corners as you can, this is where you will survive the longest.
My description of di is definitely a fail, there are a lot of descriptions of it though, you'll learn. There's a thread to a very good description, ill try to find the link in a bit.
RECOVERY
SAVE YOUR JUMP, DON'T USE IT AS SOON AS YOU CAN. The best option is to try to get close to the ledge, then jump. If they are guarding the ledge then you need to whistle as you are jumping so they can't hit you out of it. Then if they are edgehogging you need a purple pikmin to throw at them and that will get them off of it so you can tether (up b, also known as utility belt). Tether also gives you a small hop, so if they are edgehogging you and you are close enough then use it and you will land safely on the stage.
I don't have much on this, but it is a very important thing to get better at.
PIKMIN COLORS
almost forgot about this lol
anyway, not gonna go over much here, just the basic uses for each color.
Reds: element fire, Good for aerials (more damage, kills earlier etc), a smidgeon stronger for smashes, and isn't affected by fire attacks (ex. bowser's flame thrower)
Blue: Good throw and pummel damage, kills at a decent percent from bthrow. A good overall color that isn't particularly good at aerials/smashes, but not bad. This is the only pikmin that won't die in water.
Yellow: Bigger hitboxes than most pikmin colors, element is electric so it isn't affected by electric type attacks. Highest priority of any pikmin color for all attacks (it beats other moves better) has more hitstun than other colors
White: Extremely far pikmin toss, they travel with very small arc and deal high latch damage. They have the highest pummel damage when you grab with them. Most attacks from whites have very little knockback, meaning DON'T EVER USE ONE OF THESE FOR A SMASH ATTACK, THEY WILL SCREW YOU OVER. Pluck 'em and chuck 'em.
Purples: Grape n' ****, they have the highest damage output on pretty much every attack. Purple usmash is insane, you wouldn't even know killing someone that early was possible. Purple uthrow kills at a reasonable percent as well. Grape n' **** man, grape n' ****...
Keep track of your pikmin line, know which one you have next.
My last piece of advice, use common sense and don't be stupid.
some useful threads
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=284729
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=285739
there's another one regarding pikmin colors, i can't remember what it was called.
PSI.kick
Smash Lord
Kaffei you don't approach olimar, you have to out camp him, dont approach don't punish don't do crap. just sit there and let him pikmin toss you, then when you're about 70% or so, approach, make sure to get hit by his usmash while your at it!
Havn't they taught you this stuff at mk school?
but yeah nado is pretty good, but don't be predictable lol. idk, how do mk's usually approach people xD
and sebeta, its not a joke, the pikmin disadvantages/advantages are real, have you never played olimar before? but seriously, that's what makes him a good character, you have to really think to play him.
cool sig btw.
Havn't they taught you this stuff at mk school?
but yeah nado is pretty good, but don't be predictable lol. idk, how do mk's usually approach people xD
and sebeta, its not a joke, the pikmin disadvantages/advantages are real, have you never played olimar before? but seriously, that's what makes him a good character, you have to really think to play him.
cool sig btw.
Sabeta
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Oct 2, 2010
- Messages
- 31
Thanks, I made the Sig and Avatar myself. I'm fairly good at Photoshop. I didn't mean the Pikmin colors. I've been playing Olimar for quite a while, (though not competitively) and the original Pikmin games since before then.
I meant the different colors of Olimar, Ie: Rojolimar, Pink Boots, Olivar.
=edit=
I can't seem to get that double toss thing working. Where I sh and throw two pikmin. I only throw one. (You said, throw one, stop tilting, throw second, yes? ) I think it happened all of once.
Also, how do I get better at controlling my character. I suck at short hopping >.>
I meant the different colors of Olimar, Ie: Rojolimar, Pink Boots, Olivar.
=edit=
I can't seem to get that double toss thing working. Where I sh and throw two pikmin. I only throw one. (You said, throw one, stop tilting, throw second, yes? ) I think it happened all of once.
Also, how do I get better at controlling my character. I suck at short hopping >.>
Kaffei
Smash Hero
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2008
- Messages
- 7,048
ugggggggggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh no one knows how to fight olimar except like Anti and Nairo and they never post in MK boards to help
Sabeta
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Oct 2, 2010
- Messages
- 31
Well we already suggested using 'Nado. Olimar's best answer to it is UP-B, and that's about it. Using your Down-B to close the gap between you can help duck between tosses, I'm sure. I believe when fighting Olimar, you want to be off the ground, but not above him. (On the ground, you're susceptible to grabs, which Olimar has apparently gained notoriety for.) Above him, you risk his U-Smash. So come in at him from a 45 degree angle or so.
(I'm still a noob, so don't take my word unless someone backs it up)
(I'm still a noob, so don't take my word unless someone backs it up)
Like almost every other match-up.
Varying levels of forward-smash, grab and pikmin toss.
DtJ Hilt
Little Lizard
Run away a lot and don't get jabbed. We have a matchup discussion on the character, if you'd like to read it.
DtJ Hilt
Little Lizard
No it's a lot more serious in this matchup. Like you don't even know.
Slain Avenger
Smash Ace
Whats the correct controller patter for the out of shield upsmash? I can't seem to pull it off unless I position my hands in a really awkward way, so I have to be doing it wrong >.>
-Vocal-
Smash Hero
Tap Jump ON:
-Tap Jump
-C-stick up immediately afterwards
Voila.
Tap Jump OFF:
-Tilt shield up
-Jump
-Slide finger from jump to attack quickly
Voila.
At least that's how I remember it. I may be wrong about the tilt shield part; I can't quite remember if you have to smash in the direction at the moment of or if it registers anyways.
DtJ Hilt
Little Lizard
Yup, Vocal's got it. Main thing to remember is that you hit Jump and A at about the same time, like almost at the same time, just jump a tad bit earlier.
Jane
Smash Hero
yeah i do it with tap jump on, and A. you have the slightly delay pressing A after tapping up, otherwise youll shieldgrab
PSI.kick
Smash Lord
Tap jumps screws me over. i'll almost always have something stupid happen to me where i lose my second jump... ugh...
btw usmash oos you don't have to tilt shield, you just push jump then push up and A almost the same time as jump, barely after. Tilting the shield takes less good timing though, i personally don't do it (you don't really have time for it...)
btw usmash oos you don't have to tilt shield, you just push jump then push up and A almost the same time as jump, barely after. Tilting the shield takes less good timing though, i personally don't do it (you don't really have time for it...)
Slain Avenger
Smash Ace
I turn off tap jump since I'm use to playing Falco but I end up either jumping or shield grabbing. I'm probably not thinking about it enough but I want to try to get the hang out it, less than a week left for the tourney I'm going to debut my Olimar in, I refuse to loose -.-;.
Player-4
See you in 25 years
Is there a frame data thread? If so, can I plz has?
If not, could you guys at least tell me what his grab frame data is?
If not, could you guys at least tell me what his grab frame data is?
Slain Avenger
Smash Ace
Frame data for olimar can be found here
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=225377
Olimar's grab comes out on frame 7
The one about costume mattering? lmao...
Player-4
See you in 25 years
It's just a vid on how the black man needs to exterminate the white man
