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This Mewtwo would be ridiculously top tier. I support it. Except for the landing hitbox on n-air, don't think that's necessary and it would mess with combos. What would his weaknesses be? I think he'd honestly be pretty polarizing.
"Here's how to make Mewtwo a better glass cannon!"
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So what you're saying is you want Mewtwo to be one of the best, if not the best in the game?
Straight port? Just his shadowball hitbox, melee weight, grab game and throws(Up throw kill power to a certain degree and down throw combo), combined with what he has now. That's just my vision of *my ideal Mewtwo, though its unlikely, and unnecessary. I will get what I want in a more realistic sense though."Here's how to make Mewtwo a better glass cannon!"
-Give him more health, defeating the whole purpose
Just admit you want a straight port of Melee Mewtwo with fixed issues and nothing else. Glass cannon is NOT another way of saying "top tier" or "great character".
I don't care if he's the best and I don't think he would be the best automatically for having those either. He doesn't need all of those of course. But that's how I see him to stand a chance against the top 10.
There is a difference between "glass cannon" & "ridiculous top tier".
Have thou not seem the might of Abadango?
I've seen some of their videos. They're good though they have to work 2x as hard as someone who's maining a top tier character , and then skill can only take you so far in a tourney until a characters most crucial flaws bring you down. I also feel like part of the reason why they have done so good, is that top tier characters usually fight other top tier characters and don't play mid and bottom tier nearly as often, so Mewtwo players have that advantage for a few games at least(just like people started winning with Cloud right after he won, because people haven't played him enough).
As much fun as it would be, my mod sense is telling me that it's a necessary evil at this point. There's still an upcoming patch, and Mewtwo isn't perfect like Sheik or ZSS.--- Do we still need this thread?
Also, Mewtwo got ridiculously buffed this patch. Not only did they give him better combos, they made them easier. Nair is less technical, as well as Uair. Mewtwo is really fine now. I have no complaints whatsoever. (Except in the Fox MU)
He is? And here I thought we could tempt him to join us Mega Mains.
Please, go on about how Mewtwo doesnt have the cannon part.
Browny
managed to put it better than I did in the earlier post but Mewtwo USmash is bonkers and it is NOTICEABLY WAY BETTER NOW because his run speed got cranked up to eleven. Mewtwo WILL catch any landing in this game with USmash for free now if they airdodge or throw out anything that isn't fast and disjointed.
Mewtwo's ground game doesn't suck. Are you kidding me? He has great dash speed. Not only that, but 3 of his ground attacks are quite good. Down tilt, I don't need to mention, everyone knows how beautiful that is. Jab has a lot of kill setups, and that's made even better by the fact that it's his fastest move along with down tilt and it can combo into other things.
More that he can't accept that uthrow is no longer uncontested.
is more of a glass cannon than can ever hope to be.
You're definitely right. I think people try to say he's not a glass cannon, because when we think of those, we think of characters likeHow is this character not a glass cannon? Let me go over all of the things you can do in this patch now.
- Hit Nair combos kill people and also takes their souls. Did I say Nair yet? Nair Nair Nair Nair
- Forward Air is 1 frame laggier than Melee on landing except it has all of its positive Smash 4 attributes and is + on shield drop. Abuse this.
- Why do his tilts need to be 2 frames faster WHAT?! Dtilt is already FRAME SIX that's AMAZING and it is unquestionably like top 3 Dtilts in the game if not #1.
- Uair is now free off the top cheese. It got 40 BKB added with literally THREE units removed from KBG. I think that is the most knockback I've seen a move get, and I play Dr. Mario whose USmash went from bad to STUPID in one patch. Mewtwo can FISH FOR AIRDODGES now and actually kill you vertically with this move.
- Dair is just better Falcon Dair now. The sweetspot and sourspot are stronger, the active frames are better....need I go on?
I think
I think he could use maybe one or two fine tuning things (note: I think a lot of characters could, just a layer of polish, I think strength wise Mewtwo is fine) but otherwise I think he's solid and has improved significantly, with the key thing being stuff like Nair allowing for more consistent combos via the whole dragging into the ground part, among the amazing landing lag cutoffs he got. This patch was super favorable for Mewtwo and I'm glad it was.
. Characters like him love to just rush in and deal a ton of damage but isn't like that. He's very methodical and smooth with his combos, and doesn't really like to approach.
Being a glass cannon is more than strength, it's how versatile your tools let you be in how you can approach situations. Seth from SFIV is pretty much an ultimate example of this: he has an extremely large array of tools, but is tall and cannot take much punishment at all. He also isn't what you'd call "speedy", with less-than-impressive walk speed/dashes and frame data. Even so, he is still a major threat because his tools, even if they may be weaker than the originals they're derived from (particularly his piledriver), they still allow him to be as aggressive or passive as he wants to be.You're definitely right. I think people try to say he's not a glass cannon, because when we think of those, we think of characters like
He's an unorthodox glass cannon. He's easy to kill and has tons of KO power himself, but he uses it in a very defensive and passive playstyle. He's much more reactive with his punish game, will Fox is super proactive with his rushdown.
I dont think he should have a kill confirm out of it, i mean he already can kill with his Uthrow and Bthrow, but i do agree he should have a true combo at low %, also to kinda wok around this you can just use Fthrow, Fthrow with 3 pummels does like 19 damage if all the orbs hit it a really damaging throw.
Apparently, Gibus also is doing well with Mewtwo (same region as Mew²). I heard he won a local tourney with him? I haven't seen the video yet. That region, wherever it is, is mostly streamed by a channel that mostly puts out Melee content (which I no longer watch outside of highlight or funny videos), so I didn't subscribe. So yeah!
Adding onto this, people need to compare his fthrow to other combo throws.
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I would enjoy a buffed down throw as long as it's not brain dead. Not that he needs it horribly or anything for reasons you mentioned, but right now down throw doesn't have much of a use compared to his other throws, leaving it ignored most of the time. I think it would be cool to mix up forward throw and down throw when he gets grabs for damage racking. They wouldn't be as good as his down tilt combos by design, but it would be a cool option to have. If combos aren't an option, then the damage should be raised of the throw itself. I don't think this would break Mewtwo, but it would probably put him in high tier.Adding onto this, people need to compare his fthrow to other combo throws.
Diddy for example, dthrow - uair - uair does a whopping 17% and he only gets it once on most characters, then at best he will get uthrow-bair for 14%.
Mewtwo will get up to 16% off an fthrow at 0% and continues to get 12-13% from it.
When you look at how much damage characters get from throws, it only makes Mewtwo look bad if you compare him to the likes of Mario, but across the whole cast his fthrow is more damaging than most throw combos in the game and it refreshes more in the stale move queue.
Seriously you have characters like
Who have really good throw combos while the likes of
All have pretty mid-range combo throws or in Mewtwo and Ganondorfs case, huge damage to make up for it. A lot of these stop working immediately after 0% and none of them truly confirm into a kill. In many ways Mewtwo is at the top of this group since 13% working up to 100% is far more than all of these characters will get. If you got 4 grabs per stock on 0, 25, 50 and 75% Mewtwo is going to do MORE damage from his throws overall.
Mewtwo has a massivley better throw game than
So next time people complain about a lack of a combo throw, just remember when mixed with his fthrow, a dthrow combo would immediately put Mewtwo into the top of top tier of throw games. Only DK, ZSS and Ness would be higher imo.
I think you underestimate greninja's throw game but whatever.Adding onto this, people need to compare his fthrow to other combo throws.
Diddy for example, dthrow - uair - uair does a whopping 17% and he only gets it once on most characters, then at best he will get uthrow-bair for 14%.
Mewtwo will get up to 16% off an fthrow at 0% and continues to get 12-13% from it.
When you look at how much damage characters get from throws, it only makes Mewtwo look bad if you compare him to the likes of Mario, but across the whole cast his fthrow is more damaging than most throw combos in the game and it refreshes more in the stale move queue.
Seriously you have characters like
Who have really good throw combos while the likes of
All have pretty mid-range combo throws or in Mewtwo and Ganondorfs case, huge damage to make up for it. A lot of these stop working immediately after 0% and none of them truly confirm into a kill. In many ways Mewtwo is at the top of this group since 13% working up to 100% is far more than all of these characters will get. If you got 4 grabs per stock on 0, 25, 50 and 75% Mewtwo is going to do MORE damage from his throws overall.
Mewtwo has a massivley better throw game than
So next time people complain about a lack of a combo throw, just remember when mixed with his fthrow, a dthrow combo would immediately put Mewtwo into the top of top tier of throw games. Only DK, ZSS and Ness would be higher imo.
Lest we forget Bowser... Bowser is definitely in the top tiers of "best throws in the game" as well.Adding onto this, people need to compare his fthrow to other combo throws.
Diddy for example, dthrow - uair - uair does a whopping 17% and he only gets it once on most characters, then at best he will get uthrow-bair for 14%.
Mewtwo will get up to 16% off an fthrow at 0% and continues to get 12-13% from it.
When you look at how much damage characters get from throws, it only makes Mewtwo look bad if you compare him to the likes of Mario, but across the whole cast his fthrow is more damaging than most throw combos in the game and it refreshes more in the stale move queue.
Seriously you have characters like
Who have really good throw combos while the likes of
All have pretty mid-range combo throws or in Mewtwo and Ganondorfs case, huge damage to make up for it. A lot of these stop working immediately after 0% and none of them truly confirm into a kill. In many ways Mewtwo is at the top of this group since 13% working up to 100% is far more than all of these characters will get. If you got 4 grabs per stock on 0, 25, 50 and 75% Mewtwo is going to do MORE damage from his throws overall.
Mewtwo has a massivley better throw game than
So next time people complain about a lack of a combo throw, just remember when mixed with his fthrow, a dthrow combo would immediately put Mewtwo into the top of top tier of throw games. Only DK, ZSS and Ness would be higher imo.
...who was conspicuously left out of his final list of top-tier grapplers. Thus my post. Yes, I see Bowser was mentioned earlier, but leaving him out of the final list is to underestimate the power of the Koo-Pah.
He is the first character he mentioned. It might be the wording but bowser was already included with characters that have top tier grabs.Adding onto this, people need to compare his fthrow to other combo throws.
Diddy for example, dthrow - uair - uair does a whopping 17% and he only gets it once on most characters, then at best he will get uthrow-bair for 14%.
Mewtwo will get up to 16% off an fthrow at 0% and continues to get 12-13% from it.
When you look at how much damage characters get from throws, it only makes Mewtwo look bad if you compare him to the likes of Mario, but across the whole cast his fthrow is more damaging than most throw combos in the game and it refreshes more in the stale move queue.
Seriously you have characters like
Who have really good throw combos while the likes of
I interpreted what he wrote differently. There is no reason to be upset.
I would appreciate the lower landing lag. It would help with mindgames.
Thanks! Im happy to be here!I would appreciate the lower landing lag. It would help with mindgames.
Also, welcome to Smashboards.
I don't mind if characters with low crouches are able to avoid grabs. That's pretty standard fare in Smash.
Are you STILL wanting these buffs after telling you that we don't need it?