Left 4 Dead Series (New DLC planned!)

[Ladybug]

I forgot about the multi hit survivor buff. You can't still hit logs/cars and camp with them though. And who cares about what the tank does after dropping some one, the point is you got a random 5th attacker to clutch the other team down. 4 players vs 3 (cause one is downed by the tank) is pretty good odds.

No one does that corner thing against tanks these days anyway. It's a bad idea.

No no no. You can still give up control of the tank, it just wont stay where you left it. So the five on 4 is still possible, it's just it wont be a surprise 5 on 4. The tank automatically runs after the survivors if it's AI instead of just sitting there like it used to.

 

[Mic_128]

April 21st is a long time to wait...but is this a Patch or the DLC? What will this patch fix?

The patch is the DLC stuff, I'm used to PC terms.

 

[Spife]

No no no. You can still give up control of the tank, it just wont stay where you left it. So the five on 4 is still possible, it's just it wont be a surprise 5 on 4. The tank automatically runs after the survivors if it's AI instead of just sitting there like it used to.

which is what I'm saying.
Either way the tank (as a piece in this game) still has to rush now.

I sound whiney haha. I just liked the way the game was, and I am not use to games getting patched (even though I've owned a 360 for al ittle over a year now, nothing this dramatic ever got changed).

GOnna go play tonight with a team mate (who's going to go join the navy on sunday )

 

[Red Exodus]

The Tank parking thing doesn't bug me at all, I'm just glad that they made it so if one team gets a Tank, the other does as well.

 

[Spife]

The Tank parking thing doesn't bug me at all, I'm just glad that they made it so if one team gets a Tank, the other does as well.

and same with the witch, I completely agree. It also makes it fun in pubby matches on infect first, knowing where that tank will spawn so you can start planning early

I post in this topic to much >.>

Anyone wanna play via 360?

 

[Black Waltz]

Interesting update.

Updates to Left 4 Dead have been released. The updates will be applied automatically when your Steam client is restarted. The specific changes include:

Game and client changes


Introduced fatigue to the melee attack in versus mode. You will see a HUD display when your melee swing is cooling down

Boomer vomit will now pass through common infected

Addressed some surround sound detection issues

Fixed a rare crash when exiting Left4Dead on Windows Vista

Fixed a case where the complete all expert campaigns achievement was not being rewarded


Dedicated server changes

Corrected an issue where Windows based dedicated were sending spurious shutdown notifications to the master causing them to delist temporarily

Fixed dedicated servers not resetting the versus team swap correctly--you could join a dedicated server that had a previous game that was swapped and arrive on the other team than what was selected in the lobby

Renamed the tags for sv_search_key to use "key:" in the server tags instead of "sv_search_key." This should help with issues of the 63 character limit of server tags

Fixed an occasional server crash related to voting

 

[4% APR]

did this update just come out? They are updating it really often

 

[Spife]

The melee thing looks nice, do you guys have that in now?

 

[Vyse]

Hopefully this will help with corner camping =_=

Really, they need to make it so that Melee'ing will do like, 1 damage to anybody who is touching you (survivors I mean). Something like that would discourage people corner camping. Also something like boomer bile lasting longer if you stay close to each other (Again, to discourage the corner camp method).

 

[Black Waltz]

I hate this patch...it's like 4 melees and then you have to have for 2 seconds before you can melee again.

 

[Red Exodus]

I can't test out the update now but it sounds good, melee spam was being to kill versus mode for me.

 

[Ladybug]

I hate the new melee patch too. That means you can no longer defend your teammates against a hunter with melee... That means you can no longer break through a hoard with melee... Which is stupid because that's the only way to break through a hoard and I'm not even talking about in reference to a corner. If you get boomed out in the open, you're now stuck having to melee, take the hits, melee, take the hits... And yeah, you can shoot, but when your trying to make a break for it, shooting isn't your fastest option. Plus you then run the risk of hitting teammates. This was a bad idea. There are certain bits that I have been fond of because it promotes better teamwork, but this one is just rediculous.

 

[Mic_128]

But just mashing right mouse button = win for every situation bar a tank isn't ridiculous?

 

[Ladybug]

A tank adds an element. It would get so boring if it was just the regular special infected because you know they will be there every round. A tank isn't always there.

And actually if you just hold the right click it does the same thing as constantly clicking. But at the same time, it didn't help with everything. There was no way in hell I was gonna melee my way out of a tank. But what happens if you used up all your bar in order to get out of something and then a boomer comes a long. You can no longer melee the boomer to get him away before his spews on you. It's just annoying.

Then again I also didn't like the whole "If your team is winning at the end of this round you start as survivors automatically whether you started as them or not."

 

[Red Exodus]

I think it was ridiculous how melee was the remedy for every situation, regardless of whether someone got hung, pounced or boomed, the Survivors could just melee their way out of everything. Maybe this nerf was too hard [still haven't tried it] but it's a step in the right direction.

EDIT:

Left 4 Dead is worthless without friends now, I thought it was bad before but I just tried around 7 servers and each one of them was filled with team killers, I can't get a decent game at all now, it's ridiculous. I can't believe people are so hung up on sitting in a corner melee spamming or Tank parking that as soon as they lose those things they throw a tantrum. The melee nerf isn't even that bad, it's only bad if you just hold down the button the whole time. This is what happens when people take games too seriously.

/rant

 

[Mic_128]

There was no way in hell I was gonna melee my way out of a tank. But what happens if you used up all your bar in order to get out of something and then a boomer comes a long. You can no longer melee the boomer to get him away before his spews on you. It's just annoying.

No, what's annoying is waiting 30 seconds to spawn, wait til someone's knocking back lesser infected, run out to boom them and just get meleed away while they continue to batter away the swarms, only pausing to shoot you when you stumble to a safe distance.

Melee was overpowered. Now you can't just hold the button and walk through a horde.

Then again I also didn't like the whole "If your team is winning at the end of this round you start as survivors automatically whether you started as them or not."

It works on two fronts, people hang around longer, and it gives the people behind a chance to catch up with unexpected witch and tank appearances.

 

[Superstar]

I actually corner camp. I can say that the Melee update [4 swings then wait] doesn't fix corner camping at all. Why?

1) Said 4-5 swings is enough to reload pretty much any weapon. If your ammo is out, you press reload, then mash Melee. Once you get fatique you're reloaded.

2) You can still shoot when you're fatiqued. Meleex4 Shootx2 Meleex4 Shootx2 Meleex4 Shootx2

It DOES have it's plus sides though:

1) You have to use Ammo. Game gets a little more about conserving ammo.
2) It's not as annoying. Not like mashing Melee, there is some more "variety" to corner camps.
3) This update establishes Shotties as better than the machine guns. Machine guns have a delay to shoot, shotties don't, and shotties are better for an inyourface horde due to spread, so Machine Guns are hurt by the update. However, those are the best weapons to take on tanks and help a boomed teammate, so Tanks have just got buffed. You still need to carry an M16 to sweep over someone and to take on a tank if it appears in the absolute worst of place.
4) While 4 person corner camps are still there due to the shotties in front M16 in back order, 1 person corner camps have been HORRIBLY nerfed. Needs a shotty to survive, and the special infected can take care of him.

Ah, and you can't just Melee through zombies and rush through. Should have a better indicator of fatique though, let you know how tired you're getting.

 

[Red Exodus]

Ah, and you can't just Melee through zombies and rush through. Should have a better indicator of fatique though, let you know how tired you're getting.

That's the only thing I felt was missing from the update, something to monitor how close you are to 100% fatigue or something to let you know that your melee is cooling down without going to 100% fatigue.

 

[Superstar]

Also, the shotties in front crouching machine guns in back is a MUCH better corner camp than Melee everything. Why don't more people do that?

What I don't get are closet camp complaints. In Versus, the majority of closets have been removed, many of them around crescendo events. Only time you'll get to closet camp is if a horde comes from nowhere and you just arrived to a closet, or if a boomer hits you while you're near a closet. If it's the later, you deserve it.

I WOULD closet camp if I got the chance, but there is VERY RARELY EVER a closet there when you need it. It's closer to room camping than closet camping, and oftentimes you can spawn in those rooms.

 

[Spife]

Lol, I do everything people are talking down on. I corner camp (which apparently we have different definitions on), tank parking, I melee (lol broken). I tank camped like such a **** when we could. Not really in pubbies though, who cares about pubbies? Only in friendlies and matches.

I'm not sure how I feel about this melee thing. I think it's going to make the game harder for survivors, but to me it just changes the metagame. The biggest problem (for me any way) I can see is having to monitor your melee use so you can save some one from a hunter (head shots don't always do it). I think the flaming hunter damage tweak makes a lot more sense now though.

I think the shot gun is going to be the gun to use for a while now though, cause it seems like a ranged melee now (in terms of saving your self and team mates)

Anyway, how is the melee tweak? can you still use it as a hit run, but that i'ts now bad vs hoards?


Edit:
http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/316/0312090010.jpg
lol

 

[Mic_128]

I actually corner camp. I can say that the Melee update [4 swings then wait] doesn't fix corner camping at all. Why?

1) Said 4-5 swings is enough to reload pretty much any weapon. If your ammo is out, you press reload, then mash Melee. Once you get fatique you're reloaded.

2) You can still shoot when you're fatiqued. Meleex4 Shootx2 Meleex4 Shootx2 Meleex4 Shootx2

Reloading while Meleeing isn't a problem, the problem was that people weren't even shooting in the first place.

And the fact that people are now shooting as opposed to meleeing has fixed problems for the infected.

Smokers can grab without them being immediately freed from everyone spamming melee (not saying that they don't get meleed, but rather they do it conciously, not "oh hey, i freed bill during that from a smoker and i didn't notice!"

hunters can jump in and not be immediately blocked by a wall of flailing fists

Boomers can now run into the gunfire and explode on everyone

The fact that this change is in vs only is brilliant.

 

[Spife]

wait...why would anyone in their right mind try to smoke when there's other survivors around them like that? And just pounce from above, no one melees up, and boomer pingpong is a hard game to play but don't think this melee change is gonna stop people from meleeing you and then shooting you still.
Seriously, just adapt. And I'm sure you're just playing pub games, pubbies can't be that good. 360's pubbies are stupid, very stupid.

Question: do you really have games where people melee only? That sounds ridiculous and easily broken (up, not unbeatable).

 

[Mic_128]

wait...why would anyone in their right mind try to smoke when there's other survivors around them like that? And just pounce from above, no one melees up, and boomer pingpong is a hard game to play but don't think this melee change is gonna stop people from meleeing you and then shooting you still.

The main example I think of for stuff like this is the elevator part of no mercy. when all four get behind the bed there's pretty much nothing anyone can do until the lift arrives, or they leave the corner. hunters Melee actually can do damage but Smokers are basically usless during that time, though with the patch they're a bit better.

 

[4% APR]

I like the update, I pretty much agree with mic. It's not that melee spam was completely broken, but it was annoying when you would jump in as a hunter and get smacked by someone just swinging for the hell of it.

 

[Superstar]

I remember that when a hunter pouunces, the unhit survivors are broken up and stunned. Quite a bit of knockback. And Melee spamming never helped in vs as much as it did campaign. You could PREVENT pounces in Campaign, but I never could in versus. Probably because in campaign we always restarted till we got a good server, in vs people took what they could get. [200+ ping]

Boomer jumping into gunfire is a major upside I didn't take into account. However, if Hunters melee Boomers a certain number of time, survivors meleeing the boomer will make it explode. I don't remember the number, but you can't expect pubbers in vs to know about it.

I only shot rarely even with patch, but now more playing let's me know more about it. It does VERY little change if you have an autoshotty. With a pump shotty, you NEED your teammates to Melee them off/cover you. AutoShotties are range Melees, but pump? Forget it.

My corner camps pre-update weren't the normal ones. They were shotties in front Meleeing/shooting, and those in back covering them. Like Campaign style closet camps. And I love how they did that to only versus. You can still Medpack run, and Expert is still beatable.

Smokers can grab without them being immediately freed from everyone spamming melee (not saying that they don't get meleed, but rather they do it conciously, not "oh hey, i freed bill during that from a smoker and i didn't notice!"

That only helps if the survivors are nubs. At least one survivor should notice the Smoker tongue coming then Melee. I know from my experience I notice it 40% of the time or something coming initially, and Meleeing before the survivor gets dragged 2 feet happens like maybe 70% of the time for me. With 3 non smoker survivors, so long as they are compentent they can stop the pull.

That and in the NM2 Crescendo, I meleed randomly when the tower of flames were in front. I didn't want someone to be smoker pulled INTO the fire. Those are always hella scary.

 

[Spife]

The main example I think of for stuff like this is the elevator part of no mercy. when all four get behind the bed there's pretty much nothing anyone can do until the lift arrives, or they leave the corner. hunters Melee actually can do damage but Smokers are basically usless during that time, though with the patch they're a bit better.

Oh, yeah. But I wouldn't say the issue is melee, I'd argue the issue is that 4 survivors can occupy one space.

Think about it, all infected are pretty much useless there. Hunters can pounce above (easilly remedied by jump melee or angled up melee), smokers can do nothing (as you said) and if a boomer manages to vomit on them, more normal infected come (during an already crescendo event) and get melee'd.

I'm sure the melee patch helps that event a lot more though.

I still think this update will make it harder for survivors, which wont matter with the million med kits they get each level

 

[Superstar]

I'm serious some of them should be pain pills.

Pain Pills sometimes have use over medkits. That and medkits are too easy.

 

[Charizard92]

Wait, is the melee thing only in VS? because I've never seen it and I've been only playing campaign/

 

[Ladybug]

Vs is a lot more fastpaced and there's a lot more going on. Vs is a whole lot more stratigic that campaign. Campaign has certain places for weapons and generally if a tank is coming you'll get L2ls beforehand (GENERALLY). Vs doesn't always offer L2s. I've gone through 3 sections before I got an L2 and had tanks in all of them. It's a completely different style of play.

And I agree about the pills. Pills are a lifesaver more often than not even with health kits. You should never have to heal if someone has pills.

 

[Ladybug]

Sorry about the double post, even through its been here a while.

 

[Red Exodus]

Melee is the same in campaign, the nerf is only in versus which is fine by me because campaign is definitely a lot tougher on the survivors in versus if you have the difficulty turned up.

 

[Mic_128]

Darn straight, especially on Expert where regular infected hit for about 10 damage a hit. If the change was for all melee I'd be hating it, but the change being vs only? Sheer genius!

 

[Superstar]

10-20 damage on vs. Dunno if it's more if they hit behind, I hear it's 20 damage from in front and 10 from behind.

 

[Ladybug]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGI6ltnGzrM

Has anyone else seen this? Wrecked.

 

[Spife]

That was ridic.


Anyone know what patches is going to the 360 on the 21st? I understand survival and two new campaigns, will be nice but I don't care about that right now. What game mechanics are changing? Is there a place (L4D forums?) that I can see all the patches since the 360's last patch?

 

[Charizard92]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGI6ltnGzrM

Has anyone else seen this? Wrecked.

Holy... that definitely wasn't supposed to be there (valve please fix wall climbing hunters)

 

[Ladybug]

There is a l4d forum on the Steam website. If you can't find it there, I don't know where you would find it since that's the actual l4d info.

 

[Spife]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGI6ltnGzrM

Has anyone else seen this? Wrecked.

This:
Doesn't Kill (I hit it last night, it's just a 25 point pounce)
Is incredibly hard to hit on people who are just standing there
I don't have a third thing to say

 

[Ladybug]

From the top of the hospital on level 3? I can't even get up there, let alone pounce anything.

Yeah, the best I've done is 30 one pounce.

 

[Black Waltz]

From the top of the hospital on level 3? I can't even get up there, let alone pounce anything.

Yeah, the best I've done is 30 one pounce.

Pounce damage caps at 25.