Last duke biweekly! Online prereg! $20 venue $0 entry|m2k, armada, pp, ally attending

[DJRome]

yeah, my main problem is getting kills. . . my edgeguarding and stage killing ability is atrocious. also, i need mad warmups to play well

lol ic sheik is likely even, but maybe in ic's favor at higher levels of play

 

[AlcyoNite]

It's just harder for Falcon to do his 'death' stuff than it is for Sheik because of the way the matchup works.

Considering I haven't looked at the Marth boards since very early 08, I'm not surprised. I'm gonna have a hard time swallowing Falco's favor in that matchup regardless.

i would discuss this with u, only it will take some time to collect my thoughts, and ive been putting off this 10 page paper for almost an hour now

 

[Dr Peepee]

Alright then, maybe another time.

 

[DJRome]

so pp, how do you feel about the fox falcon matchup?

 

[Dr Peepee]

@Crystal: Just checked the current Marth matchup thread POF did. 55/45 Marth. =)

Fox-Falcon? I don't know what number I'd give it(because I don't want to), but Falcon loses. Some people would say Falcon doesn't lose as hard as he does due to how well Falcons do lately(SS being #1 in Norcal makes no sense sometimes lol), but it's more or less the experience these Falcons have that allow them to sort of avoid the big problems with the matchup.

Fox can force Falcon to approach with lasers and rack up enough % to get enough damage to make a difference in his combos in that time. If Fox chooses not to laser camp, then there are a few other ways Fox can play. He can Bair camp, Nair aggro, or do whatever tuar does and just sit there and react to Falcon's sub-par approach options(with uptilt/upsmash/Bair/Nair/CC punish).

Fox has waveshine combos that can put Falcon in a bad position that aren't as nice as where Falcon's knee puts Fox but they do more damage. Anytime Fox pus Falcon into the air he usually gets Bair'd until the Bair edgeguard stops happening. Falcon's game relies on grab into tech chase, so s long as Fox CCs Falcon's Nair and keeps a dumb hitbox out when Falcon approaches Fox won't be getting death comboed often.

Falcon can kind of edgeguard Fox with things like angled down Ftilts or run off double jump Uair but ultimately Fox can be tricky enough(with his good recovery) to survive much more often than Falcon will. The fact that Falcon is easier to gimp than Fox in this matchup(though it happens sometimes because Fox is a furry) despite Falcon's weight only makes the matchup harder for him.

Fox also is more successful on CP stages(except maybe Brinstar and mayyyyybe KJ64) than Falcon so the matchup can become a counter(if it's not already) or worse on stages like FoD.

 

[null55]

lol @ DJ trying to use Fox against Falcon instead of Sheik.

 

[DJRome]

hmm. . . i may pick up fox or puff to supplement my game. . .

 

[Moophobia]

hmm. . . i may pick up fox or puff to supplement my game. . .

If you pick up puff I will never drive you around anywhere ever again. TWO gay characters?!?!?

Just giving out my daily super hate.

 

[DJRome]

i think u mean 3 lol

 

[Moophobia]

i think u mean 3 lol

Would that character be fox? That ***** ain't gay. He's Win Mcnair.

 

[onlymaskde]

Pick up Falcon so you can

a) balance out the gay
b) Falcon ditto

 

[DJRome]

no one ever wants to teach me. i've been asking for months

 

[Dr Peepee]

I've never heard you ask anyone to teach you Falcon. You just say "no one ever wants to teach me!"

 

[DJRome]

so teach me already

 

[Dr Peepee]

K come see me.

 

[DJRome]

i'll never get over there

 

[Dr Peepee]

Guess you have to wait then.

I'll teach you though.

 

[DAftFlip]

like i've said before, once you get to a certain level, the tech skill is irrelevant. how much harder is it to waveshine vs tilt for pros? about the same success rate when they want it to come out. relatively, it may be harder, but the cool result is that the skill at high levels of play is the mind gaming and spacing, not the tech skill.

so technically harder, yes. actually harder? maybe not.

and while sheik's approach to the matchup is simpler, it doesn't make it necessarily easier. I agree it's easier, but not categorically based on its simplicity

This is what I think. It's only an educated opinion. So please don't read this and think " This guy doesn't know what he's talking about. He's not a Shiek main etc etc etc :

Drephen. We all know who he is. We all know how he plays. He uses the "Gay Style" as Neo so lovingly coined the phrase.

If shieks took tips from him. Played campy. Abused his good moves. The things that work for her and not the fancy stuff, then you have a good CF counter. Don't do alot of jumping and you wont get punished. Try crouching. Her crouching game is really good as well as it allows you to avoid getting grabbed which Falcons game relies heavily on; something that we also all know.

Simplicity is the key when it comes to this match up in my opinion. When you try to go for the fancy over the top tricksies that's when you get yourself into trouble. During this matchup you must be a minimalist and be patient. Abuse Dsmash and tilts when you can. Try to work on your tech chasing game so that you don't let CF off the ground. Remember when Azen played Samus ? He only really used alot of backwards WD to Ftilt and kept alot of really high tier players at bay and beat them. Shiek has that tilt except it's better AND you can combo into it. The name of the game is Simple, Patient and Clean. Practice in the matchup against a really experienced and good Falcon main is essential.

EDIT : You can also become really good experience wise to the matchup. Like someone who plays Ganon but is really good at the Shiek matchup because maybe they had a friend that played that character. You can begin to mend or patch up the little faults within the matchup.

That's all I got for you Gentelman. Later's

 

[Dr Peepee]

Not like I've seen any flashy Sheiks, but yeeeee regardless.

 

[DJRome]

i get the matchup most of the time, but it's when i get comboed to death i get frustrated.i really don't have any trouble with cf except vs people better than me :\

 

[Vilt]

I dun understand this bonus thing for non PR people. Explain please.

 

[DJRome]

if you get in the money and you're not a pr, i buy you dinner on campus

 

[Dr Peepee]

Just found this:

rofl,everyone on here exaggerates bad matchups.

Kirbykaze, sheik vs falco is even, same with sheik vs fox. Sheik vs falcon is 55/45, it's not nearly as bad as it's made out to be, neither is sheik vs ganon.

Mario does go even with ganon tho. I used to play Green Mario substantially back when he lived near me and I know the matchup really well. Doc vs ganon is probably 55/45 in ganons favor but hardly.

Raaaaaaape

 

[-ACE-]

just saw that too.

did you ever hear of my MBR vs non-MBR crew battle proposal at pound?

 

[Dr Peepee]

Yeah I read that rofl.

They get Mango/SS/Darkrain/etc which makes me sad. We get me/Zhu/Tec0/etc which *****.


If we do some of the MMs being discussed in the PR thread here, when should we do them? Between singles and doubles seems good to me.

 

[DJRome]

i agree. tho we should get some doubles mm too

edit: duke smashfest this sat

 

[Bl@ckChris]

i get the matchup most of the time, but it's when i get comboed to death i get frustrated.i really don't have any trouble with cf except vs people better than me :\

i don't have a problem vs any character being played by someone worse than me.

and figure out where/if theres a way to DI? i haven't played $mike yet, but i have a feeling now that i know which way i'm supposed to DI, i will get combo'd significantly less (after playing smith, i'm pretty sure it works, at least for ganon).

 

[DJRome]

i don't think it's comparable

 

[Bl@ckChris]

define "it"

shiek getting out vs. ganon getting out?

 

[null55]

weird question. if "it" is referring to either it makes the same difference.

what i want to know is if he's trying to start something with you.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

well he could mean that smith trying to combo me isn't comparable to $mike trying to combo me, or he could mean that sheik getting out of falcon combo's isn't comparable to ganon trying to get out of falcon combo's.

or he could mean that his little asian **** isn't comparable to my massive black ****. all i know is that he doesn't think its comparable.

 

[Dr Peepee]

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

****

 

[null55]

u mad.

 

[-ACE-]

Too good Chris.

Lmfao

 

[Bl@ckChris]

on a side note, i'm doing isai drops out of auto canceled bairs on battlefield...**** is so fast. its not even comparable.

 

[-ACE-]

Awesome man, yeah it really does help a lot. Someone should post about it in HLS

 

[DJRome]

sigh. . . i hate black people lol

 

[Dr Peepee]

Lol DJ, THAT's a fair response.

Get ***** physically and metaphorically, btw.

 

[null55]

sigh. . . i hate black people lol

LOLOLOL. same yo. blackies are annoying.

 

[DJRome]

i was gonna say mm. . . but mm?