Social King K. Rool's Kremling Kutthroats: This...Is Our Finest Hour!

[AngrySun88]

I must be in the minority that liked DK64 and who thinks that DKC3 is terribly underrated.

I've wanted K Rool in Smash since Brawl. The DK series is terribly underrepresented, and adding K Rool would give Smash another villain spot. The developers can easily pull from the DKC trilogy for his moves and costumes. Ultimate is the perfect chance to add a long desired fan favorite.

 

[volbound1700]

@ AngrySun88 - I thought DK3 was a decent game. It has some unique mechanisms compared to the first two.

Regarding K Rool, I want him to come back in the DKC Returns series. The third one would be perfect to have him as a villain. They should even find a way to tie the Tikis and Viking Animals from DKC R2 to KRool.

 

[CannonStreak]

I must be in the minority that liked DK64 and who thinks that DKC3 is terribly underrated.

I've wanted K Rool in Smash since Brawl. The DK series is terribly underrepresented, and adding K Rool would give Smash another villain spot. The developers can easily pull from the DKC trilogy for his moves and costumes. Ultimate is the perfect chance to add a long desired fan favorite.

In that case...

Judging by your latest activity, this is your first post on this topic. Welcome aboard!

 

[AngrySun88]

In that case...

Judging by your latest activity, this is your first post on this topic. Welcome aboard!

I'll likely be commenting on the threads of characters I want in Ultimate. K Rool is one of them.

That brings back memories of watching the DKC show before going to school. I'm not sure if it's aged well.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I may be a bit blasphemous in saying this, but I've never actually played DK64. I've just never owned it, and I've continued to think about buying it, and I just don't. Even from the Wii U eShop where it's $10 and I have no reason not to, I just haven't. I think I've been scared off by all the criticisms over the years... I mean as much as I love collectathons I've also never actually finished either Banjo-Kazooie or Tooie, and that's arguably worse...

Even worse, I've never finished DKC 2 because I played a ton of it as a kid and ended up losing the cartridge when I was younger... I really need to get on those.

I'm very bad about finishing games if you couldn't tell...

 

[StormC]

DK64 having tons of things to collect wouldn’t be such a problem if it didn’t force you to constantly swap characters. SM64DS did a similar concept much better.

Level design doesn’t hold a candle to Super Mario 64 or Banjo either.

 

[Banjodorf]

I must be in the minority that liked DK64 and who thinks that DKC3 is terribly underrated.

I've wanted K Rool in Smash since Brawl. The DK series is terribly underrepresented, and adding K Rool would give Smash another villain spot. The developers can easily pull from the DKC trilogy for his moves and costumes. Ultimate is the perfect chance to add a long desired fan favorite.

Not at all! Or at least, I agree with you wholeheartedly. I love DK64; if any one 3D game ate up a lot of my formative years besides Banjo, it was that.

And DKC3 is incredible, just not given a fair shot because it was quite different, and had a very unfortunate release timing.

 

[Luigi player]

Sad to see so much DK64 "hate".

While it's hard for me to say if I like DK64 or Banjo games more, both were absolutely amazing and I love all of them. Kinda hard to say about Tooie as well since I played that kinda late, but it's amazing as well. Even the GBA Banjo game is decent (I enjoyed it)!

DK64 was absolutely epic. And while some specific collectible things were a real pain I was almost never really annoyed by it (I was never able to KO the mechanical fish until many, many years later when I looked up videos and wanted to finish it... that was kinda stupid).
I love(d) the music (sooo many epic, atmospheric and unbelievably good tracks), the complexity, the variety, the humor, K. Rool, and the overall epicness.
The thing that bugged me the most in the game was that they chose to create a "Dixie 2.0" for no reason that kinda replaced her.

I definitely like them all more than Mario 64, even though that is a great game as well.

It's also too hard to compare it to the DKC games for me. They are obviously pretty different overall, being 2D and all. They also came first, so nostalgia might play a role there. DKC1 was my first SNES game so that had a huge impact as far as nostalgia goes, even though I like DKC2 and 3 more than it. When I got DK64 I was about 13. I definitely loved all these DK games. After that they died for me and I only got back into them with DKCR.
King of Swing and Jungle Climber can be fun, but they should be spinoffs imo.. (I think I only found out about them later, maybe after Returns).

 

[Megadoomer]

Do you guys think a character will be shown off at evo? maybe a certain reptilian of royalty?

I don't think we'll get a Smash character announced at EVO (Nintendo seems to like having full control over that sort of thing - so far, new characters have only been revealed in Directs, other E3 presentations, and updates to the official website), though if we do, I feel like it would be one with direct ties to fighting games (so someone like Heihachi or a King of Fighters character).

 

[Organization XIII]

Banzo-Kazooie - Lighting is bad. Hard to see in some levels (notably the Dungeon). Controls can be difficult too.
Mario 64 - the controls are decent.

Ummmm what. The absolute worst part of 64 is how it controls but you somehow think they are better than Kazooie's controls? I mean everyone has their opinions but seriously mate I super curious as to what makes Kazooie's controls difficult whereas 64 is decent in your eyes. Also, I never noticed any problem with the lighting or having any trouble seeing but experiences differ I guess.

 

[Jimmy42893]

Rare made much better sandboxes than Nintendo in the platform department

Just ask Banjo

As someone who LOVED Banjo-Kazooie and liked Tooie and DK64, I have to say that the best Banjo-Kazooie game ever is Super Mario Odyssey.

In the chance that King K. Rool gets confirmed for Ultimate, what would you celebrate the moment with? I've been having daydreams of the moment that he gets confirmed, usually with ones of me freaking out with tears of joy in my eyes. I also thought about parading in my house with a crown and cape and blaring "King K. Rool's Finest Hour" (sounds childish but I don't care).

I would call my grandma. As I mentioned on here a few weeks back, my grandma and I have been bonding over K. Rool since Tropical Freeze first came out on Wii U. I promised her that she'd be the first to know if we ever got any news, so I've called or texted her pretty much every time there's been a Nintendo Direct over the last three or four years. She always answers the phone by asking if I have good news, and, so far, my response has almost always been "no." (K. Rool Avenue is the only notable exception.) I've been waiting an awfully long time for the chance to finally say "I HAVE GOOD NEWS," so if they ever announce K. Rool's return, the very first thing I'm doing (before the announcement video is even finished) is calling my grandma.

 

[ChronoBound]

I must be in the minority that liked DK64 and who thinks that DKC3 is terribly underrated.

DKC3 is incredibly underrated. I personally see it as the second best in the trilogy. I think it gets a lot of flak due to two things:
1. People being burnt out on DKC after the first two titles.
2. Kiddy Kong

I will say though DKC3 was less atmospheric and had a weaker soundtrack than DKC1 though. However, the gameplay and stage design was certainly a lot more polished than the first game.

DKC3 also released after the N64 so a lot of people saw it as "old news", especially so when it did not seem to be doing anything a lot different compared to the first two. It improved the graphics and animations over previous titles due to advancements in compression technology due to coming out so late.

There were a lot of great games that came out very late in the SNES's life that do not get the praise they deserve aside from DKC3. Kirby's Dream Land 3 and the game featured in my avatar are two other examples. Those two games are among the strongest installments of their respective series even.

 

[Jurae818]

spoilerowl Perhaps bias was the wrong word to use. Perhaps subdued is more appropriate if the Retro games are anything to go by. There seemed to be only elements from the first world of DKC as a mainstay, DK/Diddy/Rambi/Cranky/Squaks. Tropical Freeze added Dixie and Funky and...that's it. It's like they only played the beginning of DKC and then stuck with those elements entirely. And on DLC, I stand by my stance on it. As someone who was waiting for Breath of the Wild to release and finally played it, I have zero interest in purchasing it, and I'm constantly saying to myself that Zelda needs a post-game for once. That pack did nothing nor added anything of value in my opinion. If Rool gets in as DLC, it means that he wasn't even on the radar or a priority and I'd rather not wait for another scrap thrown at me. Hyrule Warriors' needed DLC for its roster to be good and that took two years. I'm not holding out for that long. If bias is the wrong word to use, I'd say Donkey Kong is not of the highest priority with Nintendo, and it shows.

On another note, DK64 in spite of its flaws reminded me of Rare's old charm when I first played it in 2012. King Kut Out and Krusha K. Rool especially are some of the best boss fights I've ever played in a game.

Marcello691 Yeah, that's what I'm referring to. World 4 literally wrote itself in what could have been an Enguarde-friendly environment. How do you NOT utilize that? Yes, the Kongs can attack underwater now but I still feel that was a missed opportunity and I then remember that Nintendo prioritizes gameplay over characters and I finally realize what the DKVine meant long ago and it came to pass: Characters aren't important, only the mechanics. Relating to Smash, Duck Hunt isn't really the dog/duck, but a compilation of light gun games. That's why I didn't like the newcomers in For: Too many mechanic/gimmick-based characters and not enough characters in general. Not everyone needs a meter or gauge that can hinder them if you don't learn its mechanics to a T. With K. Rool, I see him having a mechanic with his armor where he takes enough damage and it breaks apart, increasing his speed but lowering his defense. That seems simple enough without being too niche. Ryu in general is also like this. I can't get down with the roster picks if they were chosen for a 'unique' gameplay purpose and not because they're popular or notable among the core Nintendo base.

Ramble, ramble.

 

[Nap_]

DK64 got a lot of problems, bad choices if you prefer, switching characters is not even the biggest issue: absurd moveset with very circumstantial moves required not even 10 times, lame new characters outside the Kongs, excess of collectibles with a lot of unnecessary stock like bananas, a broken multiplayer, lots of puzzles resolved only with switchs, K. Lumsy... It not aged well, Tooie solved the gameplay better. But still is a enjoyable game, with top graphics in these years, humour, music, new concepts wich sadly not worked very well... And the DK Rap. Also one of the most WTF bosses I've ever seen.

DK64 its very different for what you could expect coming from Country. Its a great game but with design problems. One of my favourites but have to recognize its problems.

 

[Sirfishe]

we all should do one giant kutthroat reaction for the next nintendo direct. If K Rool gets announced then we all can experience it together. many tears will fall lol

 

[Jeck]

Are you proposing some kind of shot-heard-round-the-world celebration if he gets in?

I think an official watch party stream for this thread would be good enough.

 

[Sirfishe]

Are you proposing some kind of shot-heard-round-the-world celebration if he gets in?

I think an official watch party stream for this thread would be good enough.

something like that

 

[cybersai]

DK64 also felt like a "grand finale" for King K. Rool at the time, especially the ending cutscene with the way he's defeated. It was a perfect build-up of everything from DKC 1-3 into DK64. Even though this is before Rare was being sold, it is kinda ironic how it paved the way for new villains with Jungle Beat's evil Kongs, then Returns Tiki's and Tropical Freeze Snowmad's.

King of Swing and Jungle Climber felt like fun side adventures where K. Rool returned, but it still feels like he's been "defeated" in canon since DK64.

 

[TCRhade]

IF there's ever a new direct at this rate. I'm getting a little impatient lmao.

 

[Handy Man]

That's one of the reasons why I love King K. Rool as a character so much. His plans in each main series Rareware game got progressively more insane.

• In DKC1, he took the banana hoard in order to gain the Kong's attention, as the Kremlings attempted to take over their island. My headcannon of their goal was to starve the Kongs enough in order to get rid of them, meaning they could take over the island easily. The Kremlings easily underestimated Donkey Kong and Diddy Kong though.

• In DKC2, King K. Rool now saw Donkey Kong as a threat, so he successfully kidnapped and tortured him throughout the game as the Kremlings invaded the island once again. He also used Donkey Kong's kidnapping to blackmail Diddy for the banana hoard, knowing how much the bananas meant to Donkey Kong in the first game.

• In DKC3, King K. Rool sees both Donkey Kong and Diddy Kong as threats, kidnapping them and utilizing them both as living batteries. On top of that, Dixie Kong and Kiddy Kong didn't even know they were kidnapped; they thought they just went missing, and went to look for them without yet learning King K. Rool's involvement. They seemed to be aware of KAOS however.

• By the time DK64 happened, King K. Rool was losing it. He felt that this could have been his last chance of taking over DK Isle for himself. After his attempts of learning from his mistakes didn't work out, he realizes that he needed to go all out with nothing held back. King K. Rool's main plan was to fire a laser at DK Isle and completely obliterate it. Once it didn't work out and he needed his laser repaired, he kidnapped four of the Kongs and stole Donkey Kong's banana hoard once again. This would ensure that Donkey Kong would starve, not have anyone to help him, and let him realize the reality where his island would be nuked soon. Of course, Donkey Kong is persistent and stopped King K. Rool anyway.

After DK64, I personally felt like no matter what King K. Rool did, he felt like he couldn't win. This could be due to various factors, like the resilience of the Kongs, the incompetence of his minions, or just the general feeling of hopelessness. I think the way Rare portrayed King K. Rool's descent into madness throughout the Country trilogy and DK64 is really great, as it's hard to find villains that recognize where they went wrong, how they could improve, and when to know to quit.

I definitely agree that DK64 was King K. Rool's last big hurrah, as his plots in the DK Jungle Climber games felt much more Bowser-esque, in the sense that he just wanted to take Donkey Kong's bananas because he's an evil guy and does evil things. Rareware's portrayal of King K. Rool felt like so much more than that to me, a great villain who always strives for greater things, and had to eventually realize that everything was working against him at all costs. King K. Rool will always be my favorite Nintendo villain because of that; he's comical and insane, yet is self-aware and flawed. King K. Rool always did the absolute best he could, yet he left when he was still bested by his competition regardless of what he did. I have a lot of respect for that.

 

[StormC]

I mean, K. Rool in Jungle Climber tried to take over the universe. That was a thing that happened.

 

[cothero]

Source Gaming said K. Rool is the most requested character in Japan as well. If his popularity and uniqueness are not a problem, let's just hope that his recent absence hasn't been a problem in Sakurai's decision.

 

[GalacticPetey]

Sort of related to K. Rool, but I was thinking back to Smash 4 and before the DLC period, there was only one 64 stage included, and it was Kongo Jungle. I always thought it was kind of weird that only 64 stage came back, and it was Kongo Jungle of all stages. Of course we got three more via DLC, but I don't know what to make of it being in the base game. Maybe Sakurai felt DK could use an additional stage and decided to play into nostalgia.

 

[IMainKingKRool]

It's true that K. Rool's plots escalated through each subsequent Rare DK game, which was cool because it was as if he was constantly learning from his mistakes rather than just doing the same old thing over and over, but there's only so much escalation you can have before you're stuck with "destroy the planet because Donkey Kong lives on it" or something outrageous like that.
I really do hope that whenever they do bring back the Kremlings they have at least a vague story point explaining K. Rool's absence as being because he had genuinely given up, but then something motivated him to return. Maybe he's been Cranky-ing it up in the background, giving the newer villains grief over how horribly their plans go. "Well, well, well, if it isn't my good-for-nothing 'replacement'. Did you really think just launching the Kongs across the ocean would stop them? You've got to keep those darn dirty apes under lock and key, make sure you KNOW they're not going anywhere! Why, if I had been playing, I'd have already tossed all four of those has-beens into a dungeon somewhere before the game even started! See how they save their island when the only other Kong 'heroes' weren't even good enough to get a second adventure!"

 

[Nap_]

Best K. Rool plot is the DK Land one. Donkey and Diddy are arguing with Cranky about who is the best heroe, the old gorilla or them. Then Cranky phones K. Rool for steal the bananas and test Donkey and Diddy in a new adventure. Talk about how evil K. Rool is.

Cranky: -Hey K. Rool, steal the bananas, I'm tired of this idiots!
K. Rool: - Okay...

 

[Mariomaniac45213]

That's one of the reasons why I love King K. Rool as a character so much. His plans in each main series Rareware game got progressively more insane.

• In DKC1, he took the banana hoard in order to gain the Kong's attention, as the Kremlings attempted to take over their island. My headcannon of their goal was to starve the Kongs enough in order to get rid of them, meaning they could take over the island easily. The Kremlings easily underestimated Donkey Kong and Diddy Kong though.

• In DKC2, King K. Rool now saw Donkey Kong as a threat, so he successfully kidnapped and tortured him throughout the game as the Kremlings invaded the island once again. He also used Donkey Kong's kidnapping to blackmail Diddy for the banana hoard, knowing how much the bananas meant to Donkey Kong in the first game.

• In DKC3, King K. Rool sees both Donkey Kong and Diddy Kong as threats, kidnapping them and utilizing them both as living batteries. On top of that, Dixie Kong and Kiddy Kong didn't even know they were kidnapped; they thought they just went missing, and went to look for them without yet learning King K. Rool's involvement. They seemed to be aware of KAOS however.

• By the time DK64 happened, King K. Rool was losing it. He felt that this could have been his last chance of taking over DK Isle for himself. After his attempts of learning from his mistakes didn't work out, he realizes that he needed to go all out with nothing held back. King K. Rool's main plan was to fire a laser at DK Isle and completely obliterate it. Once it didn't work out and he needed his laser repaired, he kidnapped four of the Kongs and stole Donkey Kong's banana hoard once again. This would ensure that Donkey Kong would starve, not have anyone to help him, and let him realize the reality where his island would be nuked soon. Of course, Donkey Kong is persistent and stopped King K. Rool anyway.

After DK64, I personally felt like no matter what King K. Rool did, he felt like he couldn't win. This could be due to various factors, like the resilience of the Kongs, the incompetence of his minions, or just the general feeling of hopelessness. I think the way Rare portrayed King K. Rool's descent into madness throughout the Country trilogy and DK64 is really great, as it's hard to find villains that recognize where they went wrong, how they could improve, and when to know to quit.

I definitely agree that DK64 was King K. Rool's last big hurrah, as his plots in the DK Jungle Climber games felt much more Bowser-esque, in the sense that he just wanted to take Donkey Kong's bananas because he's an evil guy and does evil things. Rareware's portrayal of King K. Rool felt like so much more than that to me, a great villain who always strives for greater things, and had to eventually realize that everything was working against him at all costs. King K. Rool will always be my favorite Nintendo villain because of that; he's comical and insane, yet is self-aware and flawed. King K. Rool always did the absolute best he could, yet he left when he was still bested by his competition regardless of what he did. I have a lot of respect for that.

This was absolutely well written/said. THIS is the reason why K.Rool is my favorite villain and what I try to tell detractors that go "Why do people want this fat ugly crocodile anyway? All he does is jump and drop cannonballs he's a Bowser knockoff" but if they actually PAID attention to the games and saw this MAYBE they would change their minds/opinions. It's sad that Paon K.Rool kinda made him generic when Rare was creating a fantastic villain. K.Rool got what I like to call the "Anti-Bowser syndrome" where Bowser started off with no character/personality from SMB to SM64. It wasn't until Sunshine IMO where Bowser started growing personality/character then it really shined in games like Galaxy and Odyssey (and of course the RPG spin-offs). Where as K.Rool kinda started off generic in the original DKC then got a BUNCH of personality and character in DKC2-DK64 then kinda got generic again with Paon.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

It's true that K. Rool's plots escalated through each subsequent Rare DK game, which was cool because it was as if he was constantly learning from his mistakes rather than just doing the same old thing over and over, but there's only so much escalation you can have before you're stuck with "destroy the planet because Donkey Kong lives on it" or something outrageous like that.
I really do hope that whenever they do bring back the Kremlings they have at least a vague story point explaining K. Rool's absence as being because he had genuinely given up, but then something motivated him to return. Maybe he's been Cranky-ing it up in the background, giving the newer villains grief over how horribly their plans go. "Well, well, well, if it isn't my good-for-nothing 'replacement'. Did you really think just launching the Kongs across the ocean would stop them? You've got to keep those darn dirty apes under lock and key, make sure you KNOW they're not going anywhere! Why, if I had been playing, I'd have already tossed all four of those has-beens into a dungeon somewhere before the game even started! See how they save their island when the only other Kong 'heroes' weren't even good enough to get a second adventure!"

Either that, or simply revealing that he's been amassing a huge army, which proceeds to take over DK Island while the family is sleeping at nighttime , with only DK managing to escape somehow. The other Kongs have been imprisoned and/or forced to fight for K.Rool's amusement.

Otherwise, I'm not sure how Retro would provide further escalation, given that Returns had you save DK Island's hypnotized animals, and TF followed up on that by having you go through several islands to even reach DK Island and save it.

 

[cybersai]

If you look at K. Rool's defeat in the ending for Jungle Climber, he pretty much goes from being really big to really small again and knocked out, as seen if you skip towards the end of the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9girlHaXgU

I don't know how much people consider the importance of "canon" for these games, but this is the last we've seen of him to date.

 

[Mariomaniac45213]

If you look at K. Rool's defeat in the ending for Jungle Climber, he pretty much goes from being really big to really small again and knocked out, as seen if you skip towards the end of the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9girlHaXgU

I don't know how much people consider the importance of "canon" for these games, but this is the last we've seen of him to date.

Apparently he died in space due to lack of oxygen and then Master Hand skinned his dead corpse and put it on a Mii.

 

[cothero]

Just a reminder to anyone who's losing hope:

 

[StormC]

If you look at K. Rool's defeat in the ending for Jungle Climber, he pretty much goes from being really big to really small again and knocked out, as seen if you skip towards the end of the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9girlHaXgU

I don't know how much people consider the importance of "canon" for these games, but this is the last we've seen of him to date.

Well, next year he went out to play baseball.

 

[GAINAX]

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/76855937

Something to worry about if Mr. G&W gets posted tomorrow on the Smash Blog.
"- Assist trophies are also shown off. Isaac, Magalor, Blue*, Celica, Chibi Robo, Lottie, DK Jr., The Helmasaur King, and King K Rool are all shown off in a compilation."

 

[Draugen]

Just a reminder to anyone who's losing hope:

View attachment 154958

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/76855937

Something to worry about if Mr. G&W gets posted tomorrow on the Smash Blog.
"- Assist trophies are also shown off. Isaac, Magalor, Blue*, Celica, Chibi Robo, Lottie, DK Jr., The Helmasaur King, and King K Rool are all shown off in a compilation."

How is it possible that I have so many mixed feelings at the same time??

 

[Nap_]

Even if tomorrow shows Mr. Game & Watch it means nothing, could be a coincidence, but we will doomed for sure till new info.

 

[Eldrake]

I hope to Video Game Villain Gods that it's fake.

 

[AngrySun88]

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/76855937

Something to worry about if Mr. G&W gets posted tomorrow on the Smash Blog.
"- Assist trophies are also shown off. Isaac, Magalor, Blue*, Celica, Chibi Robo, Lottie, DK Jr., The Helmasaur King, and King K Rool are all shown off in a compilation."

Not buying it. I doubt even Sakurai would piss off half the fanbase like that.

And the person who posted that "leak" only has one post, making it quite suspicious.

 

[GAINAX]

Well he managed to piss off a lot of people with the Kyrstal and Waluigi ATs.

The one reason I think it's fake, Sakurai has never made any DK assist trophies previously, and now all of a sudden we're getting DK Jr. and K. Rool?
Hmmm...

 

[cothero]

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/76855937

Something to worry about if Mr. G&W gets posted tomorrow on the Smash Blog.
"- Assist trophies are also shown off. Isaac, Magalor, Blue*, Celica, Chibi Robo, Lottie, DK Jr., The Helmasaur King, and King K Rool are all shown off in a compilation."

Blue as an AT sounds pretty unrealistic, but would Sakurai be so disrespectful to the all people who want such a requested character as K. Rool?

 

[SeasideKingDumb]

Why on earth would the Helmasaur King be an assist trophy. Like it would be cool, but why? I think I'm just gonna start ignoring every leak that doesn't involve Vergeben at this point, keeping up with of the fakes is a nightmare.

 

[Travix Man]

I'm not buying this at all.

According to Sneasel on the same page
IMPORTANT: READ THIS

Regardless of the veracity of this leak (it's fake btw), there is a significant chance Mr. Game & Watch will be revealed tonight. July 31 was the Japanese release date of Fire, and several blog updates have been timed to coincide with release anniversaries. Bowser Jr. was on Sunshine's anniversary, ROB was on his own anniversary, the F-Zero medley was on GX's anniversary. TC obviously knew this, and that's why he's banking on his reveal tonight. Don't buy into this one, even if Mr. Game & Watch is revealed tonight.