Into The New World :: Generation V Competitive Metagame Discussion

[xxmoosexx]

How often do you guys see Gyarados?

He is an alternative to Burungeru and can't be pursuited.

He covers the Fighting and Fire weakness Natt has and obtains the ever wonderful Intimidate.
He also covers the threat of Earthquake that Nattorei doesn't like to take. Nattorei's Leech Seed can definitely help Gyarados void using Rest for his recovery.
Gyarados can also rack up some damage abusing his roar and Nattorei's access to Spikes.
You can also use a bulky Gyarados to setup on Heatran and Shandera. ScarfShandera is basically a free Dragon Dance. Infernape running Grass Knot or Thunderpunch may be a problem.

Those are just my thoughts on running Gyarados over Buru to check Natt's counter.

 

[Gates]

I used to use my old Resttalk Gyarados before I stopped playing stall (and by extension OU). It's pretty good, but with Doryuzuu Rock Slide running around it can be risky. There's also the fact that Burungeru is the best defensive ghost this gen, which makes him pretty much the only viable spinblocker.

 

[xxmoosexx]

Yeah thats what i was thinking. Buru also gets the spin blocking abilities and if you didn't want to play stall you could go with Balanced or Offensive with a Bulky Gyarados set.

I wouldn't switch Gyara into Dory unless you knew it was going to EQ and get Intimidate's effect off and switch in a wall that can handle Dory like Hippowdon or Gliscor.

What tier do you play now?

 

[Gates]

The problem with Intimidating Doryuzu is that Swords Dance lets him shrug off any stat reductions. +1 Doryuzu is still really threatening, especially with Life Orb.

There's no question that Gyarados is a more versatile pokemon overall than Burungeru (because it actually has the capability to sweep), but Burungeru is still a better pokemon in stall teams for a lot of reasons.

I play Ubers almost exclusively now.

 

[Pluvia]

Holy **** I just found out that paralysis is 25%, not 50%

I had this exact same revelation about a week ago.

Seriously, has paralysis always been a 25% cut and not 50%? Or was this only a Generation V mechanic change?

It's a Generation 1 mechanic change.

 

[mood4food77]

Nattorei's Minimum speed stat is 40.

-6 Spe is 1/4 of that. 10.
Para 1/4ths your speed. 2.5, Pokemon rounds down to 2.
You now have a speed stat of 2. Most LC Pokemon can't even get that slow. At level 5.

no i meant that PO wouldn't let his speed drop past 17

i was paralyzed and at +4 with 17 speed, even when i kept cursing, his speed stayed at 17

 

[xxmoosexx]

The problem with Intimidating Doryuzu is that Swords Dance lets him shrug off any stat reductions. +1 Doryuzu is still really threatening, especially with Life Orb.

There's no question that Gyarados is a more versatile pokemon overall than Burungeru (because it actually has the capability to sweep), but Burungeru is still a better pokemon in stall teams for a lot of reasons.

I play Ubers almost exclusively now.

Yeah, Buru is better for stall teams but I was just pointing out Gyara's niche role pairing with Nattorei along with his pro's and con's.

What is Ubers like?

 

[Hobobloke]

It's good. After reading one of PR's posts I've decided to learn how to play Ubers, so far I'm rather enjoying it.

 

[Gates]

Ubers is way better than OU ever was and ever will be.

That's right, I said it.

 

[UltiMario]

Nattorei is going to be forced out by anything with a fire move, even if it's in rain and it's some weak-*** thing running HP Fire (like Starmie).

Bull****. Running balanced defenses (252HP/88Def/168SpD Sassy) makes it so **** like Life Orb Latios' HP Fire has issues KOing the *****, and even without too much investment in SpD, Mixtars still have issues one-shotting Natt.

Being 4x weak isn't fun, but Natt is bulky as **** and can take literally everything up to STAB Fire attacks.

 

[UltiMario]

no i meant that PO wouldn't let his speed drop past 17

i was paralyzed and at +4 with 17 speed, even when i kept cursing, his speed stayed at 17

Then you aren't running a -Spe Nature and 0 Spe IVs.

 

[mood4food77]

i don't remember about the speed IV but i definitely was a -speed nature

also, shandera must carry a fire move at least as strong as Fire Blast to OHKO nattorei when scarfed

 

[UltiMario]

...You factoring in Rain here?

TTar can almost OHKO Nattorei with his Flamethrower, so....

 

[Luxor]

I started playing Gen 5 today.

What exactly is going on????

 

[Gates]

Just play Ubers. You can use the same team you had in Gen IV and do fine. Hell, that's what I started out doing.

 

[Wave⁂]

I started playing Gen 5 today.

What exactly is going on????

To summarize, everything is better. Nattorei, Burungeru, Evo Stone Porygon2, Poison Heal Gliscor, Improved Wish Blissey make stall better. Sazandora, Doryuuzu, Shadow Tag Shaderaa, Eccentric Ditto, Drizzle Politoed make offense better.

 

[Luxor]

I used to play some Ubers and enjoyed it, but I want to at least get a feel for the OU metagame first.

The problem is I keep running into random things I've never seen before. Nothing for that but experience, I guess. Got some reading to do.

 

[Pluvia]

Just highlight the Pokemon to check what type it is. And if it's a Swampert or something and it suddenly uses Flamethrower, it's Zoroark being an arse with his Illusion ability.

Also weather is everywhere. And that mole is broken as **** in a Sandstorm, and Breloom somehow got even better.

 

[Gates]

Zoroarks who lead off with Night Burst are by far some of the most poorly designed pokemon of all time.

You have a pokemon whose entire appeal is based around pretending to be another pokemon and you use its signature move that only his evolutionary chain gets? Nice deception there.

 

[Pluvia]

Zoroark's dreadful movepool for a Pokemon with his ability really lets him down I say.

 

[Zook]

Zoroark's dreadful movepool for a Pokemon with his ability really lets him down I say.

Eh, it isn't that bad. Focus Blast, Flamethrower, and Dark Pulse put a nice dent in most things.

 

[kirbyraeg]

I think I'm gonna make a Trick Room team for funsies

he really needed a better physical movepool. bluffing kojondo/nape/blaziken/roob/breloom would be fun to lure ghosts at least...

Actually this set doesn't sound like a half bad idea at all:

Zoroark @ Life Orb
252 SpAtk/252 Spe/4 Atk
Hasty/Naive / Illusion

Shadow Ball
Focus Blast
Hidden Power Fire/Substitute
Sucker Punch

3 guesses what this is supposed to imitate (and lure). The icing on the cake is that Sucker Punch is strong enough to ko Shandera with no boosting item, so any moveset with sucker punch would be great to lure Shandera. Hell, even copying a special attacking fighting-type would work as long as you weren't choiced.

 

[UltiMario]

Gengar + Zoroark has been beaten to death by now.

Old news buddy lol

 

[Wave⁂]

Pretty sure that Zoroark is mean to imitate an Infernape. Why would Shanderaa switch into Gengar?

 

[dskank]

what do u guys think about wargle as a sp. def tank
encourage
roost
bulk-up
brave-bird
superpower

and a question, does the ability encourage remove negative secondary effects too? like the stat lowering on superpower? i dont have this game yet

 

[kirbyraeg]

Pretty sure that Zoroark is mean to imitate an Infernape. Why would Shanderaa switch into Gengar?

If it's scarfed it might ty to revenge kill it? XD

 

[Gates]

what do u guys think about wargle as a sp. def tank

It's weak to Ice and Electric, which are two of the most common special attacking types. That kind of hurts its ability to take hits.

and a question, does the ability encourage remove negative secondary effects too? like the stat lowering on superpower?

Nope. As far as I know it doesn't remove recoil either.

 

[mood4food77]

...You factoring in Rain here?

TTar can almost OHKO Nattorei with his Flamethrower, so....

it still comes off a base 145 special attack and has STAB

flamethrower doesn't OHKO in the rain and it's really important to know that since it's not a free kill

if he doesn't, no one else will

 

[Wave⁂]

[3:25:51 PM] Linkshot: Theorymon is currently testing Inconsistent Dive Bibarel in Ubers
[3:25:51 PM] Linkshot: And it's working
[3:25:53 PM] Linkshot: Lol
[3:26:18 PM] Linkshot: Inconsistent is really really overpowered.
[3:26:22 PM] Linkshot: Sub/Protect/Dive
[3:26:23 PM] Linkshot: gg

Anyone else tried Inconsistent anything? I've seen Smeargles try to use it, but with no real success.

 

[mood4food77]

if only bibarel was actually a good poke, he's got 3 awesome abilities (okay, 3 pretty friggen awesome abilities) but he has crap stats and an iffy typing (idk if it's good or not)

inconsistent's problem is exactly in its name, it's inconsistent, it can lower a stat you need like attack or speed and then boost something like special attack (on bibarel, it's not something you really want but you can counter-act that by carrying surf or something)

 

[Terywj [태리]]

[3:25:51 PM] Linkshot: Theorymon is currently testing Inconsistent Dive Bibarel in Ubers
[3:25:51 PM] Linkshot: And it's working
[3:25:53 PM] Linkshot: Lol
[3:26:18 PM] Linkshot: Inconsistent is really really overpowered.
[3:26:22 PM] Linkshot: Sub/Protect/Dive
[3:26:23 PM] Linkshot: gg

Anyone else tried Inconsistent anything? I've seen Smeargles try to use it, but with no real success.

My friend has used Substitute / Protect Glalie with Inconsistent and it's definitely luck based, but if they pull off the right +2 boosts it can get really out of hand.

 

[Gates]

People may have to start running Feint.

 

[Pluvia]

Nope. As far as I know it doesn't remove recoil either.

It does removed LO recoil and powers up moves such as Flamethrower, Ice Beam, Earth Power and anything that can cause a secondary effect.

It coupled with LO gives moves a 1.7 boost in power.

 

[kirbyraeg]

He meant move-caused recoil, from stuff like Flare Blitz.

 

[UltiMario]

Whenever my opponent uses inconsistent my moves always miss when they protect.
And hit when they don't.

 

[Pluvia]

He meant move-caused recoil, from stuff like Flare Blitz.

Yeah I was just like popping in that LO thing whilst we were on the subject of it, but I'm surprised you managed to understand me, I just re-read my post:

It does removed LO recoil and powers up moves such as Flamethrower, Ice Beam, Earth Power and anything that can cause a secondary effect.

It coupled with LO gives moves a 1.7 boost in power.

It does removed LO recoil? Wtf?

 

[Circa]

if only bibarel was actually a good poke, he's got 3 awesome abilities (okay, 3 pretty friggen awesome abilities) but he has crap stats and an iffy typing (idk if it's good or not)

Water/Normal is an AMAZING typing. So long as it's a physical sweeper, that is. You get near-perfect coverage in both STABs, with the only thing being left over is a way to hit Nattorei and Emploleon. So that's probably Brick Break or Superpower. Last slot goes to whatever boosting move it's (probably) given.

Yup yup.

 

[kirbyraeg]

It does removed LO recoil? Wtf?

Yeah, it does actually remove LO recoil.

Which is crazy, but also tested and proven.

 

[Pluvia]

No I was meaning my grammar makes that sentence not make sense, so I was surprised you understood what I was saying.

 

[UltiMario]

Water/Normal is an AMAZING typing. So long as it's a physical sweeper, that is. You get near-perfect coverage in both STABs, with the only thing being left over is a way to hit Nattorei and Emploleon. So that's probably Brick Break or Superpower. Last slot goes to whatever boosting move it's (probably) given.

Yup yup.

Don't forget Burungeru takes a whopping 0 damage from Water/Normal/Fighting!