Inferno's Decarde, The Bowser Video & Critique Thread

[Vex Kasrani]

My avatar shows how FEARSOME he is!

 

[KingKong_ad]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkA-hFJ27iQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8ugFC2YZYo

Its my set against stroumbert, the winner was sure to get 4th at least

 

[Zigsta]

I'll be done moving into my apartment today, so I'll be updating this thread this week. Thanks for your patience, everyone.

 

[B!squick]

I honestly think Ganondorf is better than Captain Falcon. All the Captain has going for him is his quick Jab follow ups and mobility. Ganon has a super fast roll and FoG when he wants to get around, the most broken UAir in the game of all the characters not named Meta Knight, a Special Grab, and a lagless DAir of doom.

And as I pointed out long ago in the match-up thread, the hit boxes on almost all of Bowser's attacks come out before the ones on Captain Falcon's. I don't think even Ally could beat MrEh at his sandbaggiest.

Good games none the less, KK.

 

[Zigsta]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgXX9VYi7Nc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c47ySkbKfJw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMnwsI6hWzc

Friendly set with Mike3, a Marth main from Austin. It was the first time we'd played since last semester, so we had been talking MAD trash talk beforehand. It's just friendlies, and I love trolling him, so you'll see me throw out silly fsmashes ('cuz he used to run right into them, so I still do it and rib him for it IRL).

I'm still getting off to first KO game 1.


Also, I haven't updated this/critiqued anyone else's videos because my Internet and cable still isn't hooked up. I'm on my phone's wireless hotspot right now, but it's not high quality enough to watch videos, and I use it primarily for school stuff since I'm on a data plan. I'll have Internet Friday and will get to things next week since I'll be at HOBO this weekend.

 

[Vex Kasrani]

I can see Ally destroying MrEh with Falcon regardless if he sandbagged or not. MrEh doesn't know the matchup, and Ally knows how to destroy heavies with Falcon. I think Falcon vs Bowser is evenish. Plus Chad has awful reaction time, he'd died to a ton of charged downsmashes(like me, except more!).

Falcon is a better character then Ganondorf, me and Verm had this discussion and we both agree that Falcon is definitely better.

 

[Pachinkosam]

l cancel bowser ***

 

[B!squick]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgXX9VYi7Nc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c47ySkbKfJw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMnwsI6hWzc

Friendly set with Mike3, a Marth main from Austin. It was the first time we'd played since last semester, so we had been talking MAD trash talk beforehand. It's just friendlies, and I love trolling him, so you'll see me throw out silly fsmashes ('cuz he used to run right into them, so I still do it and rib him for it IRL).

I'm still getting off to first KO game 1.


Also, I haven't updated this/critiqued anyone else's videos because my Internet and cable still isn't hooked up. I'm on my phone's wireless hotspot right now, but it's not high quality enough to watch videos, and I use it primarily for school stuff since I'm on a data plan. I'll have Internet Friday and will get to things next week since I'll be at HOBO this weekend.

I loved game 3. The last kill I was like, oh ****, is he gonna shield the UpB and UAir for the win---oh **** he did! :O

Also, if Verm says the Captain is better I can't really disagree, lol.

 

[Zigsta]

Yeah, I ribbed him pretty hard for falling for the same thing twice in a row, haha. The shield > upair is something KingKong posted back here a while back--I just stole it from him.

Dodging fairs with dsmash > jab > grab > fsmash is a Zigsta original, though.

 

[KingKong_ad]

Yeah, I ribbed him pretty hard for falling for the same thing twice in a row, haha. The shield > upair is something KingKong posted back here a while back--I just stole it from him.

Marth players always fall for that XD

 

[Pachinkosam]

Marth players always fall for that XD

i know man i hate that ween that happens XD

 

[Zigsta]

More vids vs HeroChima. Still trying to grasp a better hold of staying grounded. I think I did slightly better this time (being grounded) than I did before. Also at the ZSS matchup. I couldn't figure out a thing vs her.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QiMANUCOw1s

Finally getting around to this!

In addition to what Limit said:

-Overall, great job staying more grounded! You jumped way too much early on but seemed to settle down midway through and then got a bit antsy in your play towards the end.

-Be wary of using your double jump against characters with tether grabs like ZSS. If you've been airdodging to avoid attacks right before you hit the ground, you're likely to get pivot grabbed, and ZSS/Samus/Link (and to a lesser extent, TL) have a wide margin of error thanks to their grab range. Xyro does this to me often and I HATE it. (Samus, not Zamus, but you get the picture.)

-If the Zamus is good, I try to AD and catch his armor pieces and then throw them offstage. I never risk throwing a piece back at ZSS unless she's offstage. She just wrecks us way too hard offstage. It's not worth her getting a piece back. This MU is a LOT harder with her pieces than without.

If I don't think the Zamus is very good, I'll just run for the ledge and up B a lot. Good Zamuses don't know how to time their armor pieces against that, I find, and they waste precious pieces. If I'm pretty sure the Zamus is good, though, I'll very, very rarely do this because we can get dsmashed>spiked here.

-I realize this is a friendly, but NEVER get off that uppermost ledge on the rock transformation of PS1. That's a HUGE dropdown from the ledge with plenty of platforms for the enemy to play around with. It's one of the worst spots to put Bowser in the game, period.

HOWEVER, Bowser is really good on that ledge, provided no one is pressuring him from underneath. His massive size makes it so that whenever he does his getup attack, he's instantly pushed off the ledge. This makes it really hard for the opponent to punish the ending lag of the getup attack, and Bowser can immediately perform any aerial/special/AD after the getup attack gets canceled and he gets pushed off the ledge.

This is fairly common knowledge, and I'm sure you're already aware of it, but I just wanna point that out since it goes hand-in-hand with the strategy of keeping Bowser as grounded as possible so as to protect his blind spot.

-While I looooove seeing people jab>fsmash, I must ask: Do you think he would have spotdodged? He hadn't at all in the entire match. If you notice your opponent is shielding after the first jab, go for a Klaw or regrab. Landing multiple regrabs makes most people spotdodge ASAP, and THAT'S where you fsmash.

-Again, like Limit said, you'll improve in this MU just by playing it a lot and figuring out the timing to powershield her side B, down B, and B. This is a MU where you wanna be PSing>jab instead of PSing>Fortress. ZSS has NO answer to jabs in the face.


Vs. Zelda:

-Normally I watch an entire match through before commenting, but I just had to stop to say GOOD FREAKING FSMASH. You read the spotdodge like a BOSS. That's how you do it!!

-Good read with uptilt>pivot grab. You just need to get used to Bowser's lack of range on his PG.

-Upair is a frame trap. If your opponent ADs it, follow with another aerial ASAP. You could've faired Zelda.

-You're getting a lot better at feeling out Klawhop>Klawhop>bair. It's VERY useful.

-Hero shielded your second jab a LOT. Go for more Klaws/regrabs! Again, he'll probably start spotdodging following jab 1 if you condition him, and then you can FSMASH him.

-Dig the Bowser Bomb edgehog. Hell yeah.

-Don't rush Zelda so hard when you have a large lead like you did in match 3. All she's gonna do is Din's Fire you--that's literally her ONLY safe option if you don't approach. After you whiffed an attack, you kept trying to get in her face, and you catered to her game (kicking you in the face/upsmashing your airdodges). Chillax and punish as needed.

-When you're above Zelda, don't airdodge into her. That's just asking to get upsmashed.

-Great use of hopping over Zelda's shield and then Klawing in the opposite direction just before the 12:00 mark. Smart.

-You died a lot to dair. Personally I don't even give Zelda the chance to use that move--if she's above you offstage, don't go for an aerial. Not worth the risk.

If you'd like more Zelda help, ask MrEh. He's played the MU waaaaaaaay more than any Bowser could ever possibly hope to in a THOUSAND lifetimes.

 

[Zigsta]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkA-hFJ27iQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8ugFC2YZYo

Its my set against stroumbert, the winner was sure to get 4th at least

Finally getting around to yours, too!

-At 3:22 in match 1, you Firebreath CF as he's coming from offstage. He SDI'd into you, and you canceled the attack, doing 8 damage, and Stroum uptilted you for 13. I'd personally keep the Firebreath going in this case: You're nowhere near KO percentages, and you're not in danger of being knocked offstage. If you kept it going, CF would probably just upair you, which is definitely gonna be more stale than uptilt.

-Why no GR at 4:44? Did you just want to get him offstage?

-Is your regrab timing off? I've seen you do it in previous videos. SB shielded after all your grab releases--you probably could've gotten some regrabs/Klaws off even if your timing was off.

-What stage did you ban? I'm REALLY surprised SB took you to FD. I was expecting some janky platform stage where CF can juggle us with upair.


Overall it's really obvious you're used to playing this MU. Good stuff.

-Good job playing patient overall.

 

[Zigsta]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JOpdA9yDGo

Friendly against SkyPirate's Sonic. I'm trying different stuff in the MU.

 

[Cassius.]

so far so good.

I see two problems:

You use UpB, or have used UpB predicting that he'd hit your shield lots of times. Don't do that, because you left yourself open a lot, and Sonic isn't the kind of character you should be whiffing UpBs against like that.

Also, around the time you died on your first stock, why didn't you just Klaw? He was stuck on the platform with no options, and he was shielding/was going to shield anyway. BAir has heinous lag..that's why I only use it offstage or if the enemy is suffering from heavy lag--so I'm sure I'll kill.

2nd stock was beautiful...aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand then you ****ed up.

That's a cool take on the MU..I personally would have just shield camped/jabbed more, especially when you were in the lead, but you had a handle on it anyway.

 

[Zigsta]

Yeah, I'm whiffing Fortress a TON in this MU. I've been playing more reactionary since summer, and it shows in a LOT of MUs...except for Sonic. XD I'm having a hard time with a more reactionary style against him because I'm not used to his speed/options, so I'm trying to play completely differently against him now.

I baired because I had been upsmashing/Klawing all night, and thought a random bair might surprise him...but it didn't at all. XD

OMG, I TOTALLY forgot about my second stock. I input up B, but it didn't come out for some reason.

I used to shield camp a lot more in this MU, but it got to where Sonics would Spin Dash>grab my shield, so I've been doing it less lately just to see if I do better.

Anyways, thanks for your input, Limit.

 

[B!squick]

Sonic is really annoying when they know what they're doing. I remember playing a decent Sonic player years back when I was somewhat decent myself and I kept losing my **** because he'd either poke through my shield and hit Bowser's big head or be so far past me when he'd whiff attacks that I couldn't respond fast enough.

I had moderate success with Firebreath, but after the first time I hit with it, it was almost impossible to do it a second time without being punished for the attempt. Took him all day to pick off my stocks though, one of the few bright spots in the match up.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Yeah, I'm whiffing Fortress a TON in this MU. I've been playing more reactionary since summer, and it shows in a LOT of MUs...except for Sonic. XD I'm having a hard time with a more reactionary style against him because I'm not used to his speed/options, so I'm trying to play completely differently against him now.

My playstyle is almost 100% reactionary, so I know exactly what you mean, Sonic is a pain. Lemme play against a Spacey and I'll juggle that mofo all day just by reading his crap, but Sonic... >.>

 

[Zigsta]

Yo guys, Limit's helping me upload my MMs from Genesis 2. Here they are so far:

vs. T-block
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5-kTw6UXh4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwlAUTkp9GE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFRoi6ZIhEY

vs. Arty
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2oCRYR2Buo0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xyGVbhKypiU

vs. Asa
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7MAZ-kzCF0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9R06CYswL4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icCvzjtnGnI

vs. Kuraudo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ct0-F_NyF9I
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gyg3xBEK4us
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeWtBoa8brQ

That's all of them. Thanks, Limit!

 

[Zigsta]

More videos!

Zigsta vs. Nike MM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4nnj7i6qNXs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ynWIKYph7k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei1YvaNSm5E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKgyuhr3xxA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3HWuixzmuY

Friendlies:

vs. SkyPirate
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgEcX1EybHA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iR_Kb3RYQGQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4R9lK2oy0V0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MH5ublb_KA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhohmw9Hc0c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvWWWHXAguk

vs. SkyPirate
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3Qdq1yOaak
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCA13aZeM5E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WO_azgLoSwA

vs. SkyPirate
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlNDJ1AG7k8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYk_X8hKAgg

vs. AeroLink
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1n_yf_g678
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiXojXpxpzs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqgznxGXAB8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFOVs_qcJ10
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYQTqYgFJT4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NIjaME4iBs

 

[Ripple]

you have got to learn how to b-reverse zig. watching you try to land is painful

 

[Zigsta]

I know how to B-reverse. Whatchu talkin' bout, Willis?

 

[Ripple]

I know how to B-reverse. Whatchu talkin' bout, Willis?

I watched your games against nike and didn't see a single b reverse.

 

[Cassius.]

b-reverse what? i'm assuming youre talking about firebreath, but why would you b reverse firebreath though..that would literally only work one time

the cool down is heinous, and against most characters it won't help and will probably be even worse if you catch them, with marth for example.

 

[Ripple]

if wouldn't be worse if you were falling

 

[Flayl]

In theory b-reversing firebreath like a ROB b-reverses a gyro would be neat, but in practice the duration of the move is so huge that you will get hit anyway

Still, if it means you will get hit by a weaker attack it might be worth it... I prefer to try and airdodge into fortress/roll/whatever

 

[Ripple]

Why notjust wavebounce it? It'd be much safer

 

[Zigsta]

Yeah, Firebreath's way too laggy. It leaves Bowser's blindspot exposed, which is really bad in general but especially against Marth. He's at his best below Bowser or edgelocking him.

 

[Ripple]

phhhhhhtt....someone doesn't know how to play bowser

 

[Zigsta]

Yeah, his name's Ripple.

OHHHHH

 

[Cassius.]

got heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeem

 

[Z'zgashi]

LOL, Zig goin in.

And Ripple, coming from someone who wavebounces like he invented it (cuz I main Yoshi and his wavebounce is GROSS), Bowser's wavebounce is bad and isnt worth it most of the time.

 

[Ripple]

LOL, Zig goin in.

And Ripple, coming from someone who wavebounces like he invented it (cuz I main Yoshi and his wavebounce is GROSS), Bowser's wavebounce is bad and isnt worth it most of the time.

I'm going to make you eat those words

 

[KingKong_ad]

I have a few replays who I did some fun ''comboes'' I should send it to someone since I dont want to do a combo vid >.>

 

[Z'zgashi]

I'm going to make you eat those words

And they will taste like sweet, sweet victory.

 

[Zigsta]

Friendlies from LSC. I played more aerial game 2 to see how I'd do. You'll see me get gimped game 3 first stock cuz I didn't time the speedhug right--I typically need to play a lot of games the day of a tournament to get my timing down, and I didn't get too many games in since I was TOing.

Zigsta vs. Swaka
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0IuDD4Pubcg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8zLDs4MfY0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PxVzOCo8yE

 

[Cassius.]

just do a quarter circle motion in the opposite direction..

 

[Flayl]

Your SDI really needs work, but other than that well played

 

[Zigsta]

Yeah, I always forget to SDI Fox's moves. XD

 

[Zigsta]

MM with dabuz plus a friendly on Delfino to show the Olimar boards it's not a Bowser CP.

I know I SD'd at some point in the MM cuz this was the first singles match I played in a while. XD

Zigsta vs. dabuz
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WsBMEajx6s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmSdq4f8TI4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5tK4JsCSCY