Improve your MK: Tactics, Theory-crafting, & More!

[!!!RM!!!]

O_O It is? Then what's with all the matchup stuffs saying "DO NOT GLIDE ATTACK (so-and-so's) SHIELD" I've seen here? I'm guessing its common knowledge already then. Q.Q

 

[Kaffei]

because of all the different angles and speeds you can glide from it's just not safe

 

[Player-4]

Lol it is safe, you guys just aren't doing it right. Just look at the frame data, when spaced perfectly it's unpunishable. Go watch Nairo.

 

[Kaffei]

Nairo*

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27JdAZczWgE 1:02
There I watched him.
Obviously that wasn't spaced perfectly but trust me that kind of theory craft is booty, especially if your opponent knows how to shield SDI

you would need to glide extremely low so you land right as you hit their shield + glide slowly so the momentum doesnt push you forward now how often do you get to do that just pick a safer option

 

[!!!RM!!!]

You have to glide really close to the ground sure, but everyone shield-grabs it from experience, so its not like they're gonna do anything besides wait anyways. The momentum isn't a problem unless you're going fast enough and you land horizontally so that your momentum carries on. You could be going as fast as gliding will let you and still be in grab range (just so long as you angle it down) .

 

[Player-4]

I do it to Gnes all the time but whatever >.>

And Kaffei I just watched the glide attack you just said to watch, that was a horrible GA. I didn't say Nairo always does perfect GA's but if you watch him enough you'll see what I'm talking about.

Here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWKYpkxzBtA

2:41 GGs

 

[Kaffei]

Don't be ridiculous.

 

[Player-4]

Smh................

 

[Kaffei]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBMNY9TaNxk
2:54
this is a good one and what i am talking about

 

[Player-4]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBMNY9TaNxk
2:54
this is a good one and what i am talking about

Lmaooo me, that one was alright, but the GA I'm talking about is one where you tilt it down sorta at a slant. If you do it you can Dsmash or whatever after it and it's safe.

 

[Kaffei]

neve r

 

[!!!RM!!!]

Too many 1 line posts. >_>

Based on frame data it's safe. And based on videos it's proven to work in tournament and at least friendlies. I don't see whats wrong with it.

 

[Player-4]

Just remember to space it

Trial and error

 

[Kaffei]

just remember to space everything

trial and error

 

[Seagull Joe]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBMNY9TaNxk
2:54
this is a good one and what i am talking about

If that was powershielded then it probably could've been punished with a grab?

 

[Player-4]

just remember to space everything

trial and error

Go away ***got

 

[Kaffei]

Go away ***got

p4 loves me

@Joe: ya
gnes one too

also joe let's MM. i wanna play a wolf

 

[Dojo]

The glide attack thing is kinda dependent on matchup and who you're playing. It's not very hard to do especially at lower levels of play.

It kind of depends on how your opponent is spacing himself as well. If he just stands and shields as you come at him then it's pretty easy to do. If he walks into it and then shields as you come in that's a pretty easy grab.

At lower levels and a lot of people at the top level generally just stand there in shield and wait for you to come in so you can do it.

 

[Gnes]

Perfectly spaced glide attack on shield is unpunishable

This. I played the booty warrior, mk has time to UP B again before even diddy can punish(with OoS naner throw)

 

[Exdeath]

Glide attack is one of the best mix-up moves in the game, up there with Falco's Neutral B. It's safe once it's out, but you still need to glide before you can use it, so it isn't like you can suddenly glide attack (if glide attack replaced Fair or Bair...), so the opponent has time to react to it and they can affect your spacing by moving closer/away. Likewise, in order to choose how they are going to interrupt it, they have to know what you're planning to do with it, so this is somewhat of a double-edged sword. Glide attack can be safe, but it depends on the situation/spacing/opponent's habits and predictions/etc. Understanding glide attack mainly comes through experience.

 

[Kaffei]

mk has time to UP B again before even diddy can punish(with OoS naner throw)

i laughed really really hard when i read this

 

[!!!RM!!!]

>____> What is this I don't even...

 

[Kaffei]

im gonna try it LOLZ

 

[KassandraNova]

So has anyone found any cool ways to use bair at all?

 

[ぱみゅ]

Mixups when juggling Olimar, platform pressure and some shield pokes against platformed opponents if you attack them low enough.
Bair is pretty situational...

 

[!!!RM!!!]

And Fair outshines it as a move in every way besides range. There's no real point to Bair unless you need that little extra range that badly. Which MK doesn't ever need lol.

 

[Player-4]

So has anyone found any cool ways to use bair at all?

Falling Bair into Dsmash, turn around Fair, or turn around grab (cancel the third hit).

 

[Dojo]

Or turn around tilt.

Usually I try it from early percent juggling if they end up behind me. Like if I get them in the air hit an uair into a nair and they SDI behind me, I'll jump fast fall a fully spaced bair to autocancel it. If they manage to shield it then I can just froll away. If they don't I can turn around first hit of ftilt into dtilt then dash grab.

I usually manage to get that last string so fast most people are pressured to sit in their shield and it's a free grab.

It's pretty damn situational, but I've caught myself using it here and there.

 

[Player-4]

Whoops I meant turn around Ftilt not Fair lmao

 

[Orion*]

Bair can last longer than their airdodge so depending on the characters mobility its pretty useful in random situations when juggling//following up offstage.

Also RAR dair spaced first hit bair on shield as a mixup to potentially f/dtilt or grab is pretty good

edit: also you can run behind people and bair if you predict a spotdodge, imo spaced pivot is bair but this is a much less technical option.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

And Fair outshines it as a move in every way besides range. There's no real point to Bair unless you need that little extra range that badly. Which MK doesn't ever need lol.

Falling Bair into Dsmash, turn around Fair, or turn around grab (cancel the third hit).

This, plus bair is usually fresh and can kill around what, 150? Pretty decent for MK. :V

 

[Dojo]

Bair is also great for popping balloons on Smashville.

Unstales your other moves by 1.

 

[Jem.]

I hate the balloon on smashville. In a tournament matche I was going for an aggressive up b that maybe would have killed, but I hit the balloon in mid air which messed everything up.

 

[Dojo]

Lol I used it this last weekend to extend my upb longer than the guys airdodge and it killed.

 

[!!!RM!!!]

Hmmm... if your shuttle loop and other kill moves are staled and your opponent is offstage on like brinstar, maybe it's better to refresh your kill moves rather than going for the edgeguard. Or maybe unstale them first and then go for the kill instead of just going out with stale moves. Use their position offstage to your advantage. Know what I mean?

 

[Player-4]

No, always go for the edge guard. You can gimp with Dair or whatever, there's no reason to let your opponent back or give up free damage just to refresh your moves. But besides all that you'll always have something that can kill, so you really shouldn't have all your kill moves stale. Don't be dumb, save your Dsmash for when you know it'll kill, but keep in mind your Uair, Nair, Fair, Bair, Dair, Fsmash, Dsmash, GSL, SL, Utilt, and even Usmash, Side-B, Down-B, and B can kill.

 

[!!!RM!!!]

Right, I forgot that MK has like 10+ kill options offstage. Guess its not really important to refresh your moves then. I didn't mean give up your edgeguard though. :S

 

[Player-4]

Also keep this in mind, if you're hitting your opponent a bunch while edge guarding, then you're also refreshing your kill moves

 

[-LzR-]

So is it any good to avoid dsmash and use other punishers? I really would like to have a semiguaranteed killmove whenever I want if I keep it fresh.
Why not just upB or dtilt OoS or nair or dair. Why Dsmash?

 

[ぱみゅ]

If you save it until kill percentages, you not just keep it fresh, but also condition your opponent into thinking you won't do it (at least for the first stock).
When you do it right, it works incredibly great.