If They Didn't Hate Me Before, They Will Now: Vayseth's Official Chaingrab Thread

[o-Serin-o]

His diabetes. =3

 

[AvariceX]

I have the same problem. It just takes practice.
What drew you to King DDD.

He's a penguin with a hammer?

Seriously though, he was the first character I actually mained. It's more of what drew me away from Dedede which was just the fact that I got better with Ness after a while. I feel too limited playing Ness now though so I'm basically playing Dedede and MK now.

 

[CRASHiC]

You know, that's funny, because I picked up Lucas a week ago to make him the broken character I believe he can be.

 

[o-Serin-o]

Lmao? Lucas is broken. Well, lemme rephrase that. His stick is broken, his dsmash is broken, his usmash is broken, his nair tornado is broken, his pk freeze is broken, and his hair is dope. What does that leave him with?

 

[AvariceX]

It leaves him living in Ness' shadow for eternity due to being the far inferior character .

Seriously though, trying to break a character like that while sounding like a really cool idea is pretty much never practical. Low tier (10nessismidtiers) mains have to go through so much work and research to ensure they are abusing any possible advantages their character has available that it's very unlikely there is ever much that hasn't already been found.

That said...the Ness boards found a guaranteed (but really hard to setup) 0-90% combo on MK recently, which shows that while it is rare, there can be things we haven't found yet.

 

[CRASHiC]

Melee Jigglypuff says hi to your argument, and then jumps out of shield and goes zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Lucas has tons of stuff to abuse, and I plan to abuse every inch of it.
I have found ways to gimp with him, and no one will ever beat me on Yoshi's Island where I have far to many gimping options.

My opinion of the final tier list.

Top:
ZSS
Ice Climbers
Pikachu
Snake
Marth
Diddy Kong

High:
Metaknight
King DDD
Falco
Pit
Lucas

Reasoning for changes I think will occur
ZSS- Way to much to abuse currently, way to much room to grow, it is inevitable.

Pikachu- See above

Ice Climbers- See above

Snake- See above


Marth- A drop in Metaknight will help greatly, and that will happen to the all around best fighter eventually. Metaknight may be the best all around option, but that hasn't spelled out in previous games in terms of tier list development. Also, one technique will change everything, pivot walk. Once this is mastered, he becomes untouchable. Marth's pivot walk is faster than most charecter's dash.

Diddy Kong- See above

Metaknight- With the entire metagame focused on him, he will soon fall. his tactics are effective, but eventually people find ways around them. Shiek was dominant for years, but you barely saw any Shiek's at Genesis. Both faced the same situation. Also, people are discovering all kinds of combos. Combos don't agree with light charecters.

King DDD- Most of us agree that he should be high tier anyway. He won't be any less viable, or any less a dominant force, people just move above him.

Falco- Tournament results, they don't have any. Falco is overrated.

Pit- Look at the japense scene.

Lucas- Insane hatboxes, maneuverability, and among other things.

GnW- This boy hates combos. Its why he was low in Melee, that and his shield.

 

[SuSa]

Lucas, meet grab releases.
Lucas, meet gimpable recovery (reflect the pkt or hit it with a move)
Lucas, meet Snake's utilt that clanks with your pk fire and outranges all of your moves save perhaps dsmash.
Lucas, meet more grab releases. :| (<3 Sheik's grab release > DACUS)

Falco is overrated, MK won't drop THAT much... maybe 2-3 spots IF THAT.

Zamus is also hitting something that ROB hit. People are finally figuring out things... more and more of the Pro's are seeing that side-B is super duper over rated and rather useless once people figure it out. She was VERY underrated for a long time, but she is NOT the best character in the game.

Why are IC's so high? Many of the top tiers can seperate them easily or simply out space them...

Pikachu? I think you mean Anther.... Pika isn't really THAT great.. although I can still see him moving up a little more then he is right now... at least, until more people do great with him and show he's better then he is.

Pit? Planking? Meet powershielding. :|

Also this is the wrong topic for that.

 

[T3h Albino]

i think once the marth players stop *****ing and just start trying harder he could potentioally be top 3

 

[AvariceX]

Well this is on-topic XD...So back to my question; Is there a specific way I need to be spacing or buffering the dtilt after dthrow on ROB/Snake? I still don't understand why it comes out slower sometimes.

 

[T3h Albino]

i never got that down either i just kind of gave up lol

 

[Jupz]

Thats an interesting tier list Crashic

The only part I agree with is ice climbers moving up, though not to second.

ZSS is fine where she is currently IMO.

The top 2 characters are just miles above the rest currently IMO, and they will remain the top 2 for at least the next couple of tier lists I think. Maybe this will change over time.

 

[Kitamerby]

Lucas, meet gimpable recovery (reflect the pkt or hit it with a move)

Wait, what the **** is this ****?

Lucas may have some shortcomings, but by god recovery is NOT one of them.


*creeps back into the shadows*

 

[SuSa]

Wait, what the **** is this ****?

Lucas may have some shortcomings, but by god recovery is NOT one of them.


*creeps back into the shadows*

I've killed many Lucas with just a grenade. :|

Most any projectile works.

Zap Jump is cool.
Magnet Pull is punishable and gets predictable.
Zair sorta sucks

 

[CRASHiC]

Lucas, meet grab releases.
Lucas, meet gimpable recovery (reflect the pkt or hit it with a move)
Lucas, meet Snake's utilt that clanks with your pk fire and outranges all of your moves save perhaps dsmash.
Lucas, meet more grab releases. :| (<3 Sheik's grab release > DACUS)

Melee Fox, meet chain grabs.
And I NEVER recover with PK thunder.
I don't think it outranges PK magnate, though I could be wrong.
Also, for the very short time Mango played Brawl, he used Lucas. That man knows unabused power when he sees it.

Zamus is also hitting something that ROB hit. People are finally figuring out things... more and more of the Pro's are seeing that side-B is super duper over rated and rather useless once people figure it out. She was VERY underrated for a long time, but she is NOT the best character in the game.

Old news is old. Zamus has more in her arsenal than that one move, though based on the SBR back room talk, that's the only move they want to think exist. Bair is her main kill move, and if she lands a dash attack on you, you are going to die. Also, 2nd best pivot walk.

Why are IC's so high? Many of the top tiers can separate them easily or simply out space them...

I could have said the same thing about Metaknight not to long ago, but the matchup has shifted towards even now.

Pikachu? I think you mean Anther.... Pika isn't really THAT great.. although I can still see him moving up a little more then he is right now... at least, until more people do great with him and show he's better then he is.

ESAM beat Seibrik, Sensai Chops, Co18, NickRiddle, and Afrothunder in a tournament.

Pit? Planking? Meet powershielding. :|

The Japanese player does a lot more than plank and spam.

Is there a specific way I need to be spacing or buffering the dtilt after dthrow on ROB/Snake? I still don't understand why it comes out slower sometimes.

You can't just mash it, you have to time it on the last 10 frames in order to buffer correctly.

 

[o-Serin-o]

You guys are ****ing off topic...

 

[kown]

if you guys are not perfect, Pit will upb out of D3 cg

 

[o-Serin-o]

Pit is hard to CG anyways. I wouldn't be bothered trying to do it anways.

 

[CRASHiC]

Serin, you wouldn't chaingrab anyone.

 

[SuSa]

**** it CRASHiC, you said it before I did.

He'd just bthrow/fthrow and smile.




Then do his BIG GAY DANCE!

 

[o-Serin-o]

=3 Lololol

 

[Commander_Beef]

Serin, you wouldn't chaingrab anyone.

LOL^^. Pit is only hard for you Serin because you haven't mastered shield grabbing...
It's a totally different story if you shield grab him perfectly every time.

 

[o-Serin-o]

No Beef, what he meant was that I LITERALLY don't CG anyone. And yes, I have mastered shieldgrab. I hug everyone that I can =3

 

[Commander_Beef]

Haha! A funny man, you are. Understood.

 

[maceflow66]

uhhhh im most def gonna read this

 

[o-Serin-o]

Yeah it helpful, but no need to bump the thread.

This is also in the stickied thread as well.

 

[ducky98]

Not that it really matters, but I got four grabs on Luigi side to side on Final Destination.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Lol no offense but this isn't like newsworthy.

 

[Commander_Beef]

Yeah it wasn't worth to necro this shiet. It's already in the Grand United Royal Guide.

 

[Vayseth]

It's always awesome to revive my thread of awesomeness. Thanks!! =D

 

[Dark 3nergy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vidMsubS3DE&feature=player_embedded


also vayseth PLEASE TRANSLATE THIS WHOLE VID

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdKrfegxgMo&feature=player_embedded

OH MY GOD @ THE AMOUNT OF JAPAN REFERENCES I DONT UNDERSTAND IN THIS VIDEO