Ice Climbers Matchup Thread*Closed*

[BlueTerrorist]

Rotation #1 Mario

Ah the mascot of Nintendo. With many basic moves, you can say he was designed to be the standard for all fighters in this game. How does he stack up to the Ice Climbers?


Behaviour: Mario players are going to focus more on spacing to keep ICs away. They can do this with Fireballs, FLUDD and well spaced aerials. They will also try to gimp you offstage with the Cape or FLUDD

Moves to watch out for: Definitely you need to watch out for the Cape since it can lead to an early death (Especially on Nana). It can also reflect projectiles, but that's a bit minor against ICs. It can also reverse your attacks and leave you wide open for anything.
- FLUDD can mess up Desynch strings and can help him gimp you. It can also be used to keep you away and keep the spacing on his own terms.
- Dair can easily separate Nana from you and you know that's never good.
- Fsmash, well it's his popular kill move. Always gotta watch out for kill moves right?
- Uair, it's really a good tool for him to pressure you from below.

How To Win: You have more range than him,abuse it. Even though Mario has the tools to put up a fight and control the space, ICs can do it much better. The danger here is getting separated and having Nana gimped early. Mario is extremely good at gimping which will always be a constant threat when you get knocked offstage. You're better off recovering from below than above the stage. Other than that, not much to say. ICs outrange the majority of Mario's attacks so getting him on the defensive is really easy, especially with desynch strings. He's also easy to shieldgrab, so you know what that means if you get a grab in . Some Post to take note of:

Quit spreading false information on a match-up you know nothing of, please.

First of all I'll say the Ice Climbers is a huge pain if they know what they're doing, but really the only advantage they really have is that killer grab game. Otherwise, Mario can deal with the rest of what the Ice Climbers got.

Bobson laid it out nicely. We Mario's first reaction always is to separate the ice climbers. D-air does this the easiest, but a U-tilt lock to D-air or U-air does the job just fine too.

Keeping the ice climbers away from each other is a tedious but worthwhile task for Mario. His aerials are quick enough to switch back and forth between the two, and Nana is super-easy to gimp off-stage.

And our grabs are not useless even if Nana is around. It's not hard to grab and then U-throw or D-throw. The motion only takes about a half-second, and it's enough to get you separated as well. All it really takes is to land a grab when Nana is stuck trying to keep up with the action.

Someone said that Mario's B-throw is powerful. That's completely false. It's the best throw we got, but it takes 140% to kill at FD, that's without good DI.

FLUDD onstage will be used to kill approaches, mindgames, and FIHL (FLUDD-Induced-Hit-Lag). FIHL causes lag whenever you contest it with an attack that out-prioritize it (which is pretty much everything), and it allows Mario to counterattack with an aerial, D-Smash, or F-smash. Most of all it'll be used to mess up your tech-skill with the Ice climbers.

Fireballs will be used to approach and to help out with spacing, but mainly to approach. It's a bit harder to do since there is -two- characters helping each other out, but it's still worthwhile since the input of Nana takes about a half-second longer. However, you can use your blizzard (I think) or neutral b to stop fireballs.

The main problem Mario will have here is the grab. It's plenty easy to grab a Mario that is not good with spacing. His low range definitely hurts him this match and ICs has some killer grab options, even without the chaingrab in mind. However, this does not break the deal here as pretty much, it's easy to break Nana and Popo away from each other.

The ICs' main objective here is to keep Nana alive and keep the momentum in your favor. Do not let Mario pressure you to the point where he's able to easily kill Nana, because with her gone the advantage automatically shifts to Mario.

Make good use of shieldgrabbing, avoid the D-air, and most of all, don't get gimped. Mario shuts out alot of ICs' options in terms of dsync due to FIHL and is an excellent multitasker compared to other characters, and if Nana is gone and Popo is knocked off, he's probably the easiest character for Mario to gimp in all of his match-ups.

Popo by himself can chaingrab Mario to 60% though, and he can take Mario one-on-one, but he's not much without Nana by his side.

We haven't evaluated the Ice climbers in a long time on the Mario boards, so stuff like FIHL, Up-B Out of Shield, or even using FLUDD on-stage wasn't applied to the discussion. This used to be thought up as a hard match-up for Mario, but now it's pretty much just one that requires plenty of adapation and multi-tasking.

60:40 Ice Climbers.

Behaviour:

I've played some Mario mainers, they usually use utilt to juggle, Fsmash on me to get pass my hammer. Also when I get predictable, they start using the yellow cape, Mario mainers also usually use his fireballs to approach to me as well as a Mario Tornado to seperate me.

Moves to watch out for:

Dair: Can seperate the ICs
Utilt: This move can juggle the ICs well
Fsmash: It's range hurts, as well as the knockback
Dsmash: A good kill move to finish them off when Mario's Fsmash is constantly used
Bair: A good move for Mario in the air

How To Win:

Play, wait for an opening and attack. The IC's Squall hammer goes over the fireballs, don't get caught in the Tornado and since Mario has 'average' weight, he should be easy to chaingrab. Don't try and fight Mario in the air since his Bair can stop you. You have more range than him but his Fsmash move. Space properly and go for a chaingrab when you have a chance.

Recommended stages:

Final Destionation
Smashville

Match Score:

55-45 or 60-40 ICs

Recommended stages:

Final Destination: Very easy to force him to approach. Control the spacing and you'll do fine.

Smashville: Really helps alot, especially for recovery.

NOT Battlefield: He can use the platforms to camp you and you run the risk of getting harassed by Uair.

Match Score: 60:40 Ice Climbers

 

[FrozenHobo]

Behaviour:
haven tplayed too many so i'm not too sure.

Moves to watch out for:
Fully charged FLuDD when recovering from above the ledge.

How To Win:
space, smash and tilts.

Recommended stages:any

Match Score:Advantage. 55:45 - 60:40 Ice Climbers

 

[BlueTerrorist]

Behaviour:
haven tplayed too many so i'm not too sure.

Moves to watch out for:
Fully charged FLuDD when recovering from above the ledge.

How To Win:
space, smash and tilts.

Recommended stages:any

Match Score:Advantage. uh... what numeric thingy should it be in?

We'll see what the numbers are when the discussion ends. It might be quick, never really had too much trouble against Mario. But, we'll see what the Mario boards say.

 

[Bnzaaa]

In order for Mario to defeat the Ice Climbers, spacing is most important. He can keep them at bay with fireballs and approach through the air. The Mario's I've seen like to use short hopped fireballs to approach and get in close to attack again.

Mario's grab game is hurt by the second climber's presence. This is his eaisest setup for juggling with up air. His powerful back throw is also limited because the swing doesn't hurt the second climber anymore.

Mario can appraoch the Climbers from the air. Down air has good priority, is multi-hit, can split the Climbers, and when autocanceled, allows him to do a second jump or another aerial. Back air is his spacing tool. It's fast and has enough range to keep him from being grabbed.

Mario's strongest strength probably is his gimping ability. The cape can destroy squall hammer recovery, and the FLUDD messes the Climbers up due to their slow aerial speed.

I'll have more later.

 

[choknater]

how to beat mario: obliterate him.

we should do hard matchups lol

iono mario just seems like one of the easiest matchups ever

he has no range or advantages over ics

 

[bobson]

I don't have much experience against good Ice Climbers, so I'll just drop some hints on Mario's playstyle.

Mario's a well-rounded character who's decent everywhere, so expect a fight wherever you approach him. Uair and bair are nigh-lagless and chain together well, so keep on (or off) your toes in the air. His up-B OoS wrecks Squall Hammer approaches, but I've never managed to pull it off against Blizzard. Ice blocks can be caped, but they're still annoying when spaced well. Shorthopped fireballs are a favorite for approaching.

Mario's dair can split the Climbers, his uair/bair can keep them split, and once off the stage, Nana's inferior robot brain makes her easy pickings for a gimp. Speaking of gimping, don't try to recover with Squall Hammer unless you're high above Mario's range; it's easy enough to cape that it'll almost always mean you'll get sent right back out. The FLUDD is another gimping tool and is merciless to a single Climber trying to recover.

On his ground game, his up-angled fsmash kills at 91% from the center of FD, and it has killer range if he stutter-steps it. His other smashes are both fast and decently powerful, so expect to see them a lot if he isn't trying to save them for kills. Utilt chains at low percents will get about 20% and separate Nana. His grabs are rendered nigh-useless with Nana around, but if she's gone, dthrow and uthrow can potentially set up some aerial chains and bthrow has the power to kill at high enough percents. On land, FLUDDing will induce hitlag if you're attacking the stream and can easily ruin desyncs.

Oh, and watch out for his dtilt, it has a sweetspot that kills at 40% and makes your underwear disintegrate.

 

[B0mbe1c]

All I really know is that Mario is a pretty easy char. to Alt throw, so use it to your advantage, Also, UpB the ledge when hes off stage so he cant recover, and watch out for Uair/Bair combos.

 

[HeroMystic]

how to beat mario: obliterate him.

we should do hard matchups lol

iono mario just seems like one of the easiest matchups ever

he has no range or advantages over ics

Quit spreading false information on a match-up you know nothing of, please.

First of all I'll say the Ice Climbers is a huge pain if they know what they're doing, but really the only advantage they really have is that killer grab game. Otherwise, Mario can deal with the rest of what the Ice Climbers got.

Bobson laid it out nicely. We Mario's first reaction always is to separate the ice climbers. D-air does this the easiest, but a U-tilt lock to D-air or U-air does the job just fine too.

Keeping the ice climbers away from each other is a tedious but worthwhile task for Mario. His aerials are quick enough to switch back and forth between the two, and Nana is super-easy to gimp off-stage.

And our grabs are not useless even if Nana is around. It's not hard to grab and then U-throw or D-throw. The motion only takes about a half-second, and it's enough to get you separated as well. All it really takes is to land a grab when Nana is stuck trying to keep up with the action.

Someone said that Mario's B-throw is powerful. That's completely false. It's the best throw we got, but it takes 140% to kill at FD, that's without good DI.

FLUDD onstage will be used to kill approaches, mindgames, and FIHL (FLUDD-Induced-Hit-Lag). FIHL causes lag whenever you contest it with an attack that out-prioritize it (which is pretty much everything), and it allows Mario to counterattack with an aerial, D-Smash, or F-smash. Most of all it'll be used to mess up your tech-skill with the Ice climbers.

Fireballs will be used to approach and to help out with spacing, but mainly to approach. It's a bit harder to do since there is -two- characters helping each other out, but it's still worthwhile since the input of Nana takes about a half-second longer. However, you can use your blizzard (I think) or neutral b to stop fireballs.

The main problem Mario will have here is the grab. It's plenty easy to grab a Mario that is not good with spacing. His low range definitely hurts him this match and ICs has some killer grab options, even without the chaingrab in mind. However, this does not break the deal here as pretty much, it's easy to break Nana and Popo away from each other.

The ICs' main objective here is to keep Nana alive and keep the momentum in your favor. Do not let Mario pressure you to the point where he's able to easily kill Nana, because with her gone the advantage automatically shifts to Mario.

Make good use of shieldgrabbing, avoid the D-air, and most of all, don't get gimped. Mario shuts out alot of ICs' options in terms of dsync due to FIHL and is an excellent multitasker compared to other characters, and if Nana is gone and Popo is knocked off, he's probably the easiest character for Mario to gimp in all of his match-ups.

Popo by himself can chaingrab Mario to 60% though, and he can take Mario one-on-one, but he's not much without Nana by his side.

We haven't evaluated the Ice climbers in a long time on the Mario boards, so stuff like FIHL, Up-B Out of Shield, or even using FLUDD on-stage wasn't applied to the discussion. This used to be thought up as a hard match-up for Mario, but now it's pretty much just one that requires plenty of adapation and multi-tasking.

60:40 Ice Climbers.

 

[Bnzaaa]

I believe the Forward smashes are about equal in range. Any character can stutterstep a Forward Smash, and the Ice Climber's Forward smash is quicker. This is probably Mario's best kill move, and it's range can be deceptive.

Mario's Up- Smash is pretty strong too, especially towards the back of his head. It beats out any attack from above. It has limited range is situational. Down smash is fast and can knock the Ice Climbers away.

The Ice Climbers out range Mario due to the hammers and blizzard. Mario also can't do much when being juggled. The Climber's Up-Air beats out everything Mario does except for airdodge

Mario isn't difficult to chaingrab. He also won't come back easily if he's spiked off the edge.

Mario's Up-B out of shield destroys close range combat.

Mario can't compete with blizzard. It outranges everything he has (cape can work to protect him but won't deal much damage.)

The fireballs can be powershielded. If he tries to follow up a short hopped fireball, powershield and punish.

Someone said that Mario's B-throw is powerful. That's completely false. It's the best throw we got, but it takes 140% to kill at FD, that's without good DI.

Yeah, that's about right. I meant that it launches farther than most throw (guess compared to Ness' it's pretty insignificant) but it will most likely get them off stage. And I agree with the ratio.

 

[choknater]

Quit spreading false information on a match-up you know nothing of, please.

Just because I didn't provide any matchup information doesn't mean I don't know anything about the matchup. And just because you wanted to defend Mario doesn't mean the matchup isn't FREAKING EASY for IC's.

Get realz yo!

Consider this:

What can Mario do to desynch blizz/uair defense??? Nothing. It's barely even possible for Dedede to get past that, what can Mario do with much less range/priority?

95:5 IC's because I can be a man about matchups.

 

[bobson]

What can Mario do to desynch blizz/uair defense??? Nothing. It's barely even possible for Dedede to get past that, what can Mario do with much less range/priority?

FLUDD.
Nana gets pushed away from Popo or vice versa, your wall goes away.

Edit: I just tested, and fireballs go through Blizzard and clank with uair. Cape also works, although Mario'd probably just end up getting hit with a Blizzard from the other Climber if he tried to cape it.

 

[FrozenHobo]

FLUDD.
Nana gets pushed away from Popo or vice versa, your wall goes away.

to a point. don't forget that mario gets lag from that too and that he gets pushed just as far away from the ICs as they are from him. now FLUDD when IC try to recover can be a *****, but otherwise its not that big of a setback. plus the ice blocks can cancel out fireballs if they hit.
mario can still be a good matchup, but the odds are in the favor of the IC player (assuming they don't just mindlessly spam throws)

and since we're going out of 100 then: 55:45 - 60:40 ICs

 

[Bnzaaa]

The Climber's horrible traction makes it hard for them to start up the foward momentum again. And taking to the air will push them back pretty far.

Mario can't do much to a blizzard wall even with FLUDD I think. I know it doesn't have to be fully charged, but once Mario (or any character) is caught in one blizzard, they are usually caught in another.

As for Up-Air, he can't attack it or he'll get hit.

 

[HeroMystic]

Just because I didn't provide any matchup information doesn't mean I don't know anything about the matchup. And just because you wanted to defend Mario doesn't mean the matchup isn't FREAKING EASY for IC's.

Please tell me you're not serious and just being a troll.

This match-up is rough but not a difficult match for Mario. I already agreed the Ice Climbers has a decent advantage, but nothing more.

You're treating Mario just like how everyone talks about how Sonic has 'lol-priority'. That mindset is going to get you wrecked in tournaments. Everyone knows Mario has low range on his attacks. That doesn't mean he can't get around it.

Now, if you're not going to -at least- pull out some good data on the match-up. I'd like to politely ask to stop degrading this match-up discussion.

to a point. don't forget that mario gets lag from that too and that he gets pushed just as far away from the ICs as they are from him. now FLUDD when IC try to recover can be a *****, but otherwise its not that big of a setback. plus the ice blocks can cancel out fireballs if they hit.

Mario doesn't lag from FLUDD, but you have a good point. It doesn't stop them from setting it up again and there's still that chance where you do it in front of Mario's face, but point still stands that the wall doesn't decimate him.

 

[FrozenHobo]

by 'lag' i mean he just has to go through the entire movement is all. but yeah, the wall isn't THAT big of a threat to mario. approaching is where the most trouble is for both characters: mario generally is forced to use the short hop -> fireball approach, which can be punished, but the ICs aren't exactly the heaviest charcters and a wel placed/lucky smash from mario can get them in the air pretty easily.

 

[PKNintendo]

Chocknater has the most posts'

It's over 9000. Seriously, thats alot.
95-5 is a bit much don't you think? I mean there's no matchup in the game like that.

 

[momochuu]

Mario isn't that hard.

Unless that Mario knows the matchup extremely well, and has fantastic spacing. Other than that...95:5, ICs favor. =3

Or maybe 60:40 ICs?

 

[PKNintendo]

Mario isn't that hard.

Unless that Mario knows the matchup extremely well, and has fantastic spacing. Other than that...95:5, ICs favor. =3

Or maybe 60:40 ICs?

I suppose. Isn't that what Hero Mystic wanted in the first place?

 

[JustNoOne]

Behaviour:

I've played some Mario mainers, they usually use utilt to juggle, Fsmash on me to get pass my hammer. Also when I get predictable, they start using the yellow cape, Mario mainers also usually use his fireballs to approach to me as well as a Mario Tornado to seperate me.

Moves to watch out for:

Dair: Can seperate the ICs
Utilt: This move can juggle the ICs well
Fsmash: It's range hurts, as well as the knockback
Dsmash: A good kill move to finish them off when Mario's Fsmash is constantly used
Bair: A good move for Mario in the air

How To Win:

Play, wait for an opening and attack. The IC's Squall hammer goes over the fireballs, don't get caught in the Tornado and since Mario has 'average' weight, he should be easy to chaingrab. Don't try and fight Mario in the air since his Bair can stop you. You have more range than him but his Fsmash move. Space properly and go for a chaingrab when you have a chance.

Recommended stages:

Final Destionation
Smashville

Match Score:

55-45 or 60-40 ICs

 

[hippiedude92]

I'm leaning on 55:45 on ICs favor. Both will have a gayastic time approaching each other. I think Popo/Nana, should be able to throw Ice blocks at him (because it's 2 and its kinda faster duh lol). Mario will love to get ICs in the air. I dunno much of ICs air game, but most of the time I've always camped/played defensively against ICs :/

But ICS has nice ground game (duh glares at grabs T.T)

As for counterpicks, I suggest jungle japes against Mario, because mario doesnt have much vertical kos, and spiking MArio to the water is majority of the time a stock down I believe.

 

[HeroMystic]

Btw, I recommend not taking Mario to Norfair, Brinstar, or Lylat Cruise. Your best advantage is heavily minimized there.

As far as counterpick stages go, pick neutral stages. They're literally your best bet here. The only counterpick stage I recommend is Frigate Orphean due to that one part of the stage where you can't grab the ledge.

EDIT: I thought about Jungle Japes as a counterpick for ICs, but I dunno. Nana can die too easily there and the stage is aerial based, which is where Mario shines at.

 

[hippiedude92]

I don't think so. Majority of the time myself I find hard trying to kill anyone on jungle japes -_-. I just go to battlefield and camp on platforms like a beast. But yeah, justnoone, hit the point on wait and punish, both will be doing that alot :/

 

[BlueTerrorist]

It seems alot of you are leaning towards a 60:40 huh? I played a few Mario players and IC players should NOT underestimate Mario. Nana can easily get gimped and FLUDD does screw with whatever ICs were planning. Although it isn't too big of an issue because ICs can easily control the spacing in this match. Many Mario's played alot of keep away during my matches, they spaced for their lives just to not get grabbed. They approached at times, but usually that was their behavior with me. Never be predictable, or eat a cape and get gimped.
I'm kinda leaning towards the 60:40 ICs myself.

I don't recommend places like Battlefield for this battle. It makes it easier for Mario to pressure you with Uair.

 

[Rykard]

Mario isn't that hard.

Unless that Mario knows the matchup extremely well, and has fantastic spacing

this can just be copied and pasted into every matchup thread in existance by replacing the name of the character...

maybe im jsut in a bad mood today but honestly, these things everyone does against ice climbers. they will always camp and aviod grabs at all cost

as for mario, you just need to learn to ice block before blizzard since blizzard does nothing against fireballs and be very smart when approching him yourself cause he has a very good close range game with good piority on his moves

 

[HeroMystic]

maybe im jsut in a bad mood today but honestly, these things everyone does against ice climbers. they will always camp and aviod grabs at all cost

Until IC isn't over-centralized over their grabs (which as stated before, are quite awesome), this is pretty much what every character will do, but I don't see that happening sadly.

 

[BC AL]

err i ll try and help with the ice climbers vs zelda part
if you re caught up in the air, NEVER try to hit zelda back when you re landing, because all of her moves outprioritize and have more range than the ice climbers, land somewhere far from her
When she is fireballing and the beginning, i dont recommend ice blocking back, because her fireballs deal 10% for each one while our poor little ice blocks deal a measly 4% APPROACH IMMEDIATELY and close in with a good spaced blizzard or bair and follow it up from there
approachin is VERY difficult as mentioned up there, Squall hammers can be destroyed from her fsmash, ...but a well timed squall hammer can do some good which can pop her up for some old school uair combos... your only hope is bair or blizzard...
u cannot shieldgrab most of her attacks
be careful of FAIRS, FSMASH, USMASH, and DSMASH
if nana is gone, YOU RE DEAD, try and rack up percent before u die
Edgeguarding is fairly easy, edgehog, mostly and finish her with a running usmash
finish her with a grab combo ASAP or you might never get a chance to grab her again

correct me if im wrong anyone, because i myself need help in this matchup and these are some random pointers i can give...hope its useful

 

[FrozenHobo]

err i ll try and help with the ice climbers vs zelda part
if you re caught up in the air, NEVER try to hit zelda back when you re landing, because all of her moves outprioritize and have more range than the ice climbers, land somewhere far from her
When she is fireballing and the beginning, i dont recommend ice blocking back, because her fireballs deal 10% for each one while our poor little ice blocks deal a measly 4% APPROACH IMMEDIATELY and close in with a good spaced blizzard or bair and follow it up from there
approachin is VERY difficult as mentioned up there, Squall hammers can be destroyed from her fsmash, ...but a well timed squall hammer can do some good which can pop her up for some old school uair combos... your only hope is bair or blizzard...
u cannot shieldgrab most of her attacks
be careful of FAIRS, FSMASH, USMASH, and DSMASH
if nana is gone, YOU RE DEAD, try and rack up percent before u die
Edgeguarding is fairly easy, edgehog, mostly and finish her with a running usmash
finish her with a grab combo ASAP or you might never get a chance to grab her again

correct me if im wrong anyone, because i myself need help in this matchup and these are some random pointers i can give...hope its useful

this. i've been playing zelda more and more and she is **** hard to approach (shiek is still pretty easy). especially if they just spam dins. GOD! no matter what character i use for that it never stops being a pain...

 

[FrozenHobo]

....should we see about getting this unstickied?

v_v

 

[NinjaFoxX]

....should we see about getting this unstickied?

v_v

no wai its stickied?

and on zelda, approach is limited, she outranges and outprioritizes you,its a very limited match.etc...

 

[Diddyknight]

i find camping much easier against zelda and just punish the Side B lag from it. I tend to space with the Nair and fair

 

[choknater]

Yeah, HeroMystic I'm just being a troll . I agree with what people are saying about 60-40.

You guys don't know me very well yet. I run around the forums saying Sheik vs Ganon is 130:-30. Yes I always use that big a font.

 

[Blackbelt]

Yeah, 60-40 ICs.


I always use a different character when facing the ICs.

 

[SuSa]

60:40 IC

Dair seperates you as stated... which can really mess with you because Mario has an easy time gimping Nana (cape/spike/fireball) and then your all by your lonesome, getting camped to death....

If your able to get a grab in your good (like always), and so long as you don't let his dair seperate you, you're good as well.

(barely beat my friends Mario today ^^.... living hell but still beatable, my problem is I kept falling for dair.....)


Basically:
He has Fsmash and Dair
You have Desynching (not grabs.... but just in general), chaingrabs (always), so long as you SPACE WELL you outreach him in the air. On the ground, he has Fsmash, and just space so you don't get hit by dsmash/usmash.

 

[BlueTerrorist]

Weekly Character Discussion #2 Sonic

Rotation #2 Sonic
Pic Soon

"You're Too Slow!!!" Our favorite hedgehog finally joins the Brawl. With speed that make any speed characters **** their pants, What does this mean for our ****** friends?

Behaviour:

Moves to watch out for:

How To Win:

Recommended stages:

Match Score:

 

[FrozenHobo]

Behaviour:
sonics have one of 2 behavior patters: blitzkrieg or patient.

Moves to watch out for:
neutral b (trajectory is tricky sometimes), fair, dsmash (surprisingly large area)

How To Win:
CGs, smashes, tilts.

Recommended stages:
BF, Lyat Cruise, Frigate Orpheon, etc.

Match Score:
55:45 Sonic

 

[Jim Morrison]

Behaviour: Spam side-taunt.

Moves to watch out for: Side-taunt.

How To Win: Do NOT let him side-taunt. Also take his steak, it's his power source.

Recommended stages: Hanenbow.

Match Score: 61-39 IC's

but srsly
DO NOT OPEN THIS, MAJOR SPOILER!!!

Spoiler

Behaviour: Sonic has speed over IC's (durr). However that's not much of a factor. Sonic will stay out of grab range, spacing with d-tilt/f-tilt. Hyphen Smash comes out of nowhere. His aerial game is pretty all-round. His U-air has lots of priority, D-air auto cancels after a full Spring Jump (meaning he can D-air, and immedeatly put up a shield on the ground or grab). F-air is just annoying, B-air is gonna kill you and N-air is meant to get IC's off Sonics ***. Sonic has many approaches, Spin Dash Shield Cancel (Running>Side-B>Shield) immedeatly puts up a shield. His Dash Attack is fast, he can Spin roll, he can ASC (Aerial Spin Charge, go to sticky in Sonic thread SideB explained)

Moves to watch out for: ASC, it's down B in the air. You can use it do nice damage/knockback. It can do 49% from 0 when executed perfectly. Also you can shield it when you land. B-air is a good killer, together with F-smash, D-smash. Sonic's recovery is also too good. He can basicly recover from the far down-corner of FD as long as he has a double jump. The Spring is used to get out of the d-throw, F-air grab.

How To Win: CG him to high %, then kill him. Sonic will have trouble killing you, his best bet is gimping (he's too good at it). Also do not approach, he'll have even more options than if he'd approach. Just spam your B to force approach.

Recommended stages: Battlefield, Yoshi's Island. Battlefield cause most Sonic players are worse with platforms. Yoshi's Island cause I suck on it. Avoid Smashville, it's just too good for Sonic.

Match Score: 50:50, I can't say, I don't fight many IC's

BTW, if you wanna brawl my amateur Sonic, PM me

 

[Tenki]

u guyz shud lern 2 blizzard @ Sonic.


Definitely don't focus on chaingrabbing on this matchup, but more on outprioritizing with aerials/spacing with blizzard. Desynchlimbers to win. If you get a grab, then go happy with it, but if you focus your game on grabbing, you'll leave yourself to so many openings and traps.

Ohya, watch out for F-airs/jabs off-stage. Nana doesn't always seem to be able to SDI correctly, and it probably sucks to be like, falling below the stage and unable to Belay back while Nana is still getting hit/knocked away.

 

[FrozenHobo]

u guyz shud lern 2 blizzard @ Sonic.


Definitely don't focus on chaingrabbing on this matchup, but more on outprioritizing with aerials/spacing with blizzard. Desynchlimbers to win. If you get a grab, then go happy with it, but if you focus your game on grabbing, you'll leave yourself to so many openings and traps.

Ohya, watch out for F-airs/jabs off-stage. Nana doesn't always seem to be able to SDI correctly, and it probably sucks to be like, falling below the stage and unable to Belay back while Nana is still getting hit/knocked away.

nah, ya think?

 

[Blackbelt]

I would either put this at 50-50, or 55-45 Sonic advantage.


I mean, ICs camp Sonic very well, between the Ice Blocks, Blizzards, and your hammers.


But once Sonic gets past all of that, he can (and will) seperate the ICs very easily, and thanks to his godly run speed, he can (and will) kill Nana very quickly. And once Nana is dead, it becomes a much easier fight for Sonic.



And yeah, Tenki is right, make the Chaingrab your second priority in this matchup.

 

[Bnzaaa]

Sonic's strongest asset is dealing out punishment. That much I know.

Sonic has speed and can use it to his advantage once the Ice Climbers whiff an attack. It makes it much easier for Sonic to split the Climbers, and Sonic moves too fast for Popo to catch up to Nana.

Sonic has range on his tilts and I believe they can link into another attack pretty well. Multi-hit moves really mess with the Ice Climbers, and Sonic's F-air is no exception. There is a small window of availability to DI that attack.

Spin Dashes and Spin Charges work well to punish a missed attack, or if the Ice Climbers happen to be synched and are charging an attack. It also can punish a dodge attempt due to it's sheer speed.

Sonic will have trouble approaching the Ice Climbers from the ground. The Climber's game in the air is weaker but their ground game is solid. Their strong ground game plus Sonic's supposed lack of priority gives the Climbers an advantage there.

Sonic's Forward Smash has good range and power. Down Smash also has range and punishes dodges. Hyphen Up-Smash or running Up Smash cover a good amount of distance as well. B-air has nice killing potential as well.

Sonic also has one of the best recoveries. Meteor smashes won't work well because his Up-B plus B-air/F-air give him really good height. He can also perform a footstool if you are trying to edgehog him.

Homing attack is another move that can be used for punishment, but can be punished in return if it completely misses . It hits in the air and can split the Climbers (most of the time only one will get hit.)

Sonic can't afford to blindly blitz the Climbers. Blizzard is an awesome attack, and will beat out anything Sonic has on the ground. Sonic can be grabbed out of his spin attacks but don't expect it to work on competent Sonic.

The Ice Climbers can use their disjointed hammers to their advantage. They have enough range to out space Sonic, and enough power to kill him early.

Dysynches work wonders in this matchup. Ice blocks to blizzard wall is too good. If he approaches from above you can cover in front and above with a Forward/Down Tilt or Smash to Up-Tilt/Smash or short hopped N-air/ Up-air. Getting Sonic caught in an Up-tilt can lead to a grab at low percents if they fail to DI out.

Grabbing Sonic won't be your main priority in this match. If you manage to land a grab, make sure to get him to killing percent and finish him. He will most likely come back if he's spiked. Random grabs will leave you open.

To me it's pretty even. The Ice Climber's form of ultimate punishment is nullified by Sonic's speed. Sonic can still punish but has to be patient. Counterpicks are very important in this matchup. Sonic runs all over the Climbers on flat stages, so stages like Battlefield or Delfino (I heard Sonic hates water) work well here. Just remember that Sonic is as good or better than us on our good stages.