Q&A How to Wreck *****es with Ganon?- Linguini Q&A Thread

[Divinokage]

Well, that's exactly what I'm doing too, I've been playing a lot of Falco/Fox and Falcon to see what they could do and it's pretty crazy and fun as well. To me, it's very good for learning experience. And then you can just go back to Ganon when he's needed. lol.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

thats usually how i play, and it's a lot of fun to do. but my ganon tries to use a lot of pivot things and a lot of pure ground sh-waveland things, but when i don't play him for a while, i lose a lot of the timings for important techs. i'm understanding other characters better, but at the same time, i lose touch with the things that i feel make my ganon special.

really, i just need to play better people more. they'll make me stay ganon and have him rise up lol.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

what do you mean?

also @ raphael robo there is no best ganon overall imo. good ganons are

tier 1: linguini, kage, rock crock, chaddd (he just started back up again)
tier 2: spider sense, qlex, Bizzarro Flame, g.vice, cho

linguini and kage are in a tier of their own. rock crock and chadddddddd are good but without quite as much success. I haven't played any of the others really so idk the tier then

edit- and i'd name kage the best ganon right now simply because linguini hasnt really played in the last 2 years or so

 

[RaphaelRobo]

linguini and kage are in a tier of their own. rock crock and chadddddddd are good but without quite as much success. I haven't played any of the others really so idk the tier then

edit- and i'd name kage the best ganon right now simply because linguini hasnt really played in the last 2 years or so

I thought he came 4th at yesterday's tournament in Florida.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

did he? good he was always one of my favorite players! I just havent seen him at a national in a while

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

Mooney it just occurred to me that you probably meant a regular ledge dash to a pivot dash attack, which is very fast and throws your opponent off guard. Jabs, grabs, ftilt, and even fast aerials are good mixups out of a ledge dash as well, depending on what the situation calls for.

you got it. no one expects the headbutt lol

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

also, rockcrock just placed over linguini and beat him in tourney the other month, too. don't sleep on rock or chaddd. they're definitely in the same tier.

 

[-ACE-]

LOL sveet, linguini never really quit, he took a small break after like pound 5 that's about it

and nah, rock and chaddd are NOT currently on linguini/kage's tier. Rockcrock is very good vs Ganon with both Ganon and DK, him beating linguini doesn't mean he's better lol. Chaddd might very well 4 stock every Ganon again one day lol but that doesn't mean he's a better overall player than all of them. Kage has seen a decent amount of success in recent years and NO ONE can play vs spacies like linguini... seriously no one, which is huge.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

I was practicing on some stages other than FD (I've limited my practice almost exclusively to that stage, since it was all my laptop could handle), and found I'm decent at some of them, and pretty bad on others. I'm especially bad at Rainbow Cruise (interestingly, it's Rainbow Ride in the PAL version). Do you guys have any advice for this stage, or any of the others that'll be at NCSU? Or should I just practice them a lot more? I'm planning to buy a US version of the game so I can use my TV and not have everything in Black/White. Also, I've edited the settings on my laptop a bit, so it can now run Battlefield at full speed, which'll help me get more practice done at school.

 

[-ACE-]

Yeah I've got some great words of advice on that bull**** stage

1. It shouldn't be legal
2. Ban it if it is
3. Your opponent is a *** if he mains fox and takes you there and will never be your friend irl

 

[-ACE-]

I usually ban FoD but what a wasted ban if RC is legal (and your opponent is gay enough to take you there). both are close to auto lose for Ganon vs the fastest characters.

 

[Geenareeno]

Also remember that you can be camped on Kongo Jungle. Or is it Congo. Mostly just by Puff and Peach a little bit. Yeah this is why i'm excited to see Linguini at Apex because we don't really know how good he is/if he's better than Kage. Mad respect to all the top Ganon's though.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

Alright, I'll cut RC from my practice. I wonder if custom ISOs are allowed at the next NCSU. That way, if someone picked RC, they'd be forced to listen to my Nyan Cat soundtrack.

What is it that causes FoD to be such a bad stage for Ganon? I haven't played on it much, so don't have experience with it.

I guess I'll stage strike FoD, and then counterpick a stage I'm good at for G2.

EDIT: Just to double check, that's just plain Kongo Jungle, right? Not Kongo Jungle 64?

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

am i the only ganondorf player that doesn't care about who the best ganondorf is? lol

 

[Geenareeno]

EDIT: Just to double check, that's just plain Kongo Jungle, right? Not Kongo Jungle 64?

Sorry I should have been more clear. KJ64 is what I meant. The one with the platforms moving in a rectangle. It's actually a really good stage for Ganon outside of those matchups though. It's not really legal anymore though.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

KJ64 is cool.

RC is mad gay.

fountain gets silly cause platforms mess with fancy waveland things. moving platforms just makes things weird.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

That's fine. I figured most people would know whether to assume it was Jungle 64. Why isn't it legal anymore?

It's interesting the platoforms are that much of a problem. I thought them moving would make for a cool twist. Kind of like how I like the concept of RC (a moving stage), but don't like how it turned out. I can see how moving platforms would mess up landdashing and platformdashing, though.

On a side note, today I platformed dashed onto CPU's and daired them. It was fun.

EDIT: Apparently it is KJ64 that'll be used at NCSU, instead of plain KJ. So, another question. Why does everyone assume it's 64 instead of regular KJ?

 

[Bl@ckChris]

moving platforms can definitely change the dynamic of a game. it's a stage worth learning. it can be pretty fun sometimes. but also pretty frustrating sometimes.

the more you play, the more you learn. platform dashing is where ganon's movement takes off.

edit: the other kongo jungle is just...not good for competition. the small rock is way too good for fox and other people to camp on. through time, these things are learned, and thats pretty much how stage lists come about. we just get lazy about notation sometimes.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

I completely forgot that rock existed. I can see how it would be a problem. I remember when I was very young, and could only defeat Lv1 CPUs, I camped on that rock in a free for all game with 3 Lv9s. They beat each other up, and I won, so I decided I was amazing at the game because I could "beat" 3 Lv9s.

It was a lot of work learning the basics of wavedashing, landdashing, etc (and while I can wavedash fairly consistently now, I'm still not that good at the other two). I never imagined how much fun it would be once I got that down though. The extra speed makes the game so much more fun. I'm really looking forward to getting to the point where I can consistently do those three dashes and use them in combat. Ledgedashing will come after that. I'm pretty bad at ledge hopping at the moment - most of the time when I let go of the ledge I Bair or Dair with the C-Stick, then fall and die. I can do an infinite ledge hog decently, so at least that's something. I usually fall after 3-7 seconds, though. And yes, I did time it.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

that is the scary thing about using the cstick to do ledge things. i've always analog'd it all for that purpose.

ganon is sooo fun.

 

[Geenareeno]

Wait a minute, why would you use the c-stick for the ledge? Just for like Ledgehop Uair?

 

[RaphaelRobo]

So that my DI doesn't become down or right when I'm trying to legdehop. I haven't been able to do if I use the Analog Stick.

 

[-ACE-]

Tipman (the first great Ganon player to be a true pioneer in Ganon's metagme) was always a believer in using the c-stick so you don't drop, but once muscle memory takes over you can do it almost any way you want. I always use down, and I think you have like a 2 frame window to get the ledge dash before you've fallen too far, but I never have problems so I've always just kept using down.

 

[G. Vice]

Tipman (the first great Ganon player to be a true pioneer in Ganon's metagme) was always a believer in using the c-stick so you don't drop, but once muscle memory takes over you can do it almost any way you want. I always use down, and I think you have like a 2 frame window to get the ledge dash before you've fallen too far, but I never have problems so I've always just kept using down.

I use straight back on the right side, down on the left side.

It truly is what your fingers get used to. So find what works for you and roll with it. I've never ever used the c-stick for anything but aerials or buffer rolls.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

yeah, i always quarter circle from down to forward on whatever side it is. i actually kind of need to get back to practicing; i'm starting to miss the down portion of my quarter circle i think, and it's causing me to jump from the edge more often than i would like.

 

[Divinokage]

I usually ban FoD but what a wasted ban if RC is legal (and your opponent is gay enough to take you there). both are close to auto lose for Ganon vs the fastest characters.

Well with the new rules, in a best of 3, you can only ban 1 stage with DSR and in a best of 5 you can't ban anything.. so, every Ganon now should learn all 5 starters + stadium. I usually love FoD with Ganon. FD is hard for me though, it depends, sometimes I can do well on it.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

no bans in a bo5? hmm...well i guess that sorta makes some sense...but then someone could win 3 games all on the same stage...as long as they win game 1...hrmmm

 

[Divinokage]

No you can't, DSR is on, you can't choose a stage you won on. That's why in a Bo5 most stages will be played on during a set.

 

[Renth]

Neva Eva Eva Neva

get on my level hoe

I bored.

 

[Legend4ryFlower]

Do people still play this bad character?

Just play marth

 

[Divinokage]

Do people still play this bad character?

Just play marth

Ya ok, it doesn't work like that.

 

[Legend4ryFlower]

Ya ok, it doesn't work like that.

As long as you still have the satisfaction of going in other threads and calling fox "broken."
gg kage

 

[Linguini]

also, rockcrock just placed over linguini and beat him in tourney the other month, too. don't sleep on rock or chaddd. they're definitely in the same tier.

lol that's the first time rock's beat me in like the past 5 sets...

anways i never quit, just take breaks here and there. although i don't travel oos like i used to being in college now/being poor. apex should be hypeeee

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

i know. i guess you've been getting rusty or something since you've been in gville. you going to apex emilio?

also, i keep losing to this link in orlando called zoro. ironically, i really need to learn the link matchup. roustane/emilio/chad/jason/someone please teach me it. i know it's hard without videos to show what i'm doing wrong, but i'm never getting matches recorded lmao

oh, and getting in on falcon is a *****. i'm going to start playing more sf since i main zangief so i can get better footsies. i honestly believe playing sf will help me get better on fd for some reason lol

 

[Divinokage]

As long as you still have the satisfaction of going in other threads and calling fox "broken."
gg kage

That made no sense but whatever you say.

 

[Geenareeno]

oh, and getting in on falcon is a *****.

Shouldn't you be waiting for him to approach? I'm saying some Hax bull**** here but seriously it's falcon, he's going to approach you.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

I do wait for him to approach. Did you read my post? lol

 

[Geenareeno]

From what I can tell that's all that you said about the Falcon mu. Am I incorrect in assuming 'getting in' means approaching?

 

[G. Vice]

Falcon's tough Mooney.

Shield pressure is the key, and good spacing. Of course, that's every matchup for ganon I suppose. Ask Kage how Ganon beats falcon. When he was here we each beat the other's Falcon with Ganon actually lol.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

I don't even care about Falcon right now. I care about LINK. Someone teach me about the Link matchup.

Hey, Kage. You know a lot about that matchup, right?