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How to Deal With Specific Enemy Moves! Week 3 Falco's Annoying *** laser! (week?)

Hive

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YES, I stole this from Peach boards. And Pit boards. and possibly other boards who have used the same thing. I even stole the picture from pit boards unashamedly (i am that ninja). ^^ So stop ***** about it. ^^
We are samus boards and we are THAT f------ space piratey! So be afraid character boards, your important/valuable thread may be next! :)

So basically what I want to promote is discussion concerning specific tactics that are used by other characters, and figure out ways to effectively deal with them.
Try to give specific strategies to minimize the risk of the move in a fight rather than just
"get out of the way" lol- is probably not the most detailed response you can offer. ^^

Ok, starting off, Mach tornado! :)


WEEK 1 MACH TORNADO!



Tornado's Hitbox

(the red indicates his **** radius) :p

Info/How to deal with it:
(hmm, i remember there usto be a list that detailed all of samus' options to stop the tornado, does anyone know what happened to it?)

the_carter said:
Mid range- Dtilt is the absolute best option. You can also go for a Zair, but you must hit the top of the tornado, which naturally has less priority.

Close- Run. run away and when you feel you absolutely MUST; shield. Remember to tilt your shield upwards. Most MKs will retreat once theyve uncsuccessfully 'nado. Which is when you should zair/super missile.

Long rage- Super missile. Most Mks will try approaching with a nado, dont fire a fully charged shot, if you have time for a super missile. Save the FC shot for of stage, or when MK nados in killing range.

Below Samus- Nair. Quickest of samus; aerials. Much smarter than dair, because of that. Aim the Nair at the top middle of the nado. Or the top of the sides.
Also, remember that when you are hitting mk with zair it has to be on the upper part of the tornado and cannot be aimed randomly. ^^ it usually takes a little bit of time to set up imo, especially if you are just getting done with a spam.

Bombs stop it as well and I find are pretty useful to throw in every once in awhile if you think he will try it, to help protect a spam. ^^ Even though I usually hate bombs and rarely ever use them like that lol

also...
Ravin said:
Samus can grab mk out of it
My note: The move probably gives destroys samus more than any other. MK mashing nado can stop zairs, super missiles, homing missiles, etc... It entirely defeats her spam game unless she gets the spam to hit on the top corner of the tornado, which takes time to set up. Super missiles can go through occassionally if the mk isn't mashing enough, and fully charged charge shot is good too, but takes time to save up. Grabs, and dtilts, and bombs take time to set up too, and mks won't spam this from a mile away giving you time to react. mk can pull this move out while samus is going for a zair or missile... not only will it eat through her brick wall but it will hit samus and gain damage before she can hit the ground or do anything. Basically, the only short range solution to this imo is to shield it through, and punish if the mk is at a short distance afterwards.



it reminded me of metaknight ^^ don't laugh.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

WEEK 2- DIDDY KONG'S BANANAS!


me: You Share!


Info/How to deal with: My Note: This is Diddy's signature move and it is a *****. ^^ The bananas don't necessarily hurt samus by much by themselves, however, they set up most of Diddy's combos, and can even lock you.
Samus can do a few things to limit diddy to having one banana: she can throw one onto a platform in levels with platforms, she can hold onto a banana and still use many of her moves, and she can also throw a banana off of the level for a quick fix. Diddy with one banana though still rocks hard, do not fall into believing that this will somehow destroy his gameplay. If Samus is holding a banana and is trying to spam, diddy can easily throw a banana in between your spams or before your spams and combo you (it comes out fast). Even without any bananas diddy is still a good match. Shield bananas if he throws them at you, and don't step on them!

When samus takes diddy's bananas
Dryn- If you glide toss, be sure to glide toss away, whether throwing the Banana Peel forward or downward.

DelxDoom-Standard glidetoss combos and stuff. If you play Diddy Kong for a little bit you'll get the hang of bananas, then just adapt to Samus's glidetoss, slow aerial speed, slower dash attack, etc.

Samus is somewhat unique in that her useful portions of her moveset are not totally negated with a banana in hand. To zair, airdodge first. You can missile, you can up b, you can bomb, you can charge shot.

You can charge shot cancel to glide toss.

You can dash attack over a banana to pick it up into up b (lol)

You can fsmash while holding a banana if you're holding a (mostly from dash attacks lol)

Basic Diddy trix adapted to Samus. Don't forget ground grab releases to maneuver the Diddy's into stolen bananas.


Also one note of warning; bananas trip people on the ground when their feet touch them. Beware of using Utilt if the banana is on a platform where your feet will touch them. Dsmash will also trip. etc.



some tech info-
To perform a glide toss start a roll animation and then throw the banana immediately.
(more info on glidetossing and nana trixies in ultimate samus database too! ^^)
xyro said:
F-smash with banana= short hop, drop banana, catch banana with A (registers as nair), while holding A, flick the cstick forward, then immediately let go of A and Samus fsmashes

N-air/f-air/b-air/u-air/d-air while holding a banana= at the apex of your jump tap Z, this will drop the banana, perform an aerial, this will register as you catching the banana.
xiahoudun said:
Alternatively to FSmash with a Bananna without throwing out an attack you could roll or spotdodge then begin holding A during the animation. From there continue to hold A as long as you like and perform the Smash with the C stick as normal.
WEEK 3: FALCO'S LASER!!


pew pew* pew pew*

Info/How to Deal With:
 

∫unk

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If you're close when it starts you can challenge it with a lot of moves otherwise shield. If your shield is low for whatever reason be near an edge so you have an escape option.
 

Crystanium

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The Mach Tornado starts up with poor priority. It can be dealt with a Bomb or Super Missile, or even z-air. You just have to be careful once that start-up is out of the way.
 

Ravin

Smash Lord
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Mach tornado has several hits, but after you shield a few hits, you will see a "pause in it" Think of links Tornado when he hits you once it does nothing untilt the animation is over.

Now think of several link tornados going off, only at different times, i believe around the third - fifth hit there is a delay, you could Up B OOS it. Ive done it like once or twice. :p
 

tha_carter

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Id like everyone to ignore the first few post. 'nado is a situational move... and those dont answer all situations.

Mid range- Dtilt is the absolute best option. You can also go for a Zair, but you must hit the top of the tornado, which naturally has less priority.

Close- Run. run away and when you feel you absolutely MUST; shield. Remember to tilt your shield upwards. Most MKs will retreat once theyve uncsuccessfully 'nado. Which is when you should zair/super missile.

Long rage- Super missile. Most Mks will try approaching with a nado, dont fire a fully charged shot, if you have time for a super missile. Save the FC shot for of stage, or when MK nados in killing range.

Below Samus- Nair. Quickest of samus; aerials. Much smarter than dair, because of that. Aim the Nair at the top middle of the nado. Or the top of the sides.
 

Crystanium

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Or, let's not. Everyones input is valuable here. Some are better than others, but that doesn't mean we should ignore them.
 

Ravin

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YES, I stole this from Peach boards. And Pit boards. and possibly other boards who have used the same thing. I even stole the picture from pit boards unashamedly (i am that ninja). ^^ So stop ***** about it. ^^
We are samus boards and we are THAT f------ space piratey! So be afraid character boards, your important/valuable thread may be next! :)


^^^^^Tencoolpoints
 

Vader

Smash Rookie
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i read somewhere that Metaknight can be grabbed out of the tornado
 

Uffe

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I think just about any character can grab MK out of Mach Tornado. The problem is is that MK won't be grounded the majority of the time. As for Diddy Kong's Bananas, I guess what n00b said about it. By the way, Samus can do some pretty cool stuff with glide tossing Diddy's Bananas.
 

n00b

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xyro didn't say it, i did 8)

dash attack to catch diddy's naners....

or you can keep pressuring diddy so he never has time to set up bananas..
 

Uffe

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Sorry. I saw the name Xyro somewhere in here. Maybe it was a different topic. Either way, thanks, n00b. But seriously, against Diddy Kong, glide tossing the Banana at DDK to a Charge Shot is super sexy for sexy Samus to pull off. Once you've played a lot of DDK's, I think you begin to figure out their methods. Dryn has been playing quite a few lately unintentionally and he's been doing fairly well against them.
 

tha_carter

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Just to add to that 'mk can get grabbed out of nado'; Samus' barrel must be touching the nado, not just the grapple. So if youre trying to grab him out and its not working, thats the reason.


Lmao, let xyro explain how to handle bananas....

EDIT: n00b/xyro didnt say it; i did. 8D
 

DelxDoom

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Standard glidetoss combos and stuff. If you play Diddy Kong for a little bit you'll get the hang of bananas, then just adapt to Samus's glidetoss, slow aerial speed, slower dash attack, etc.

Samus is somewhat unique in that her useful portions of her moveset are not totally negated with a banana in hand. To zair, airdodge first. You can missile, you can up b, you can bomb, you can charge shot.

You can charge shot cancel to glide toss.

You can dash attack over a banana to pick it up into up b (lol)

You can fsmash while holding a banana if you're holding a (mostly from dash attacks lol)

Basic Diddy trix adapted to Samus. Don't forget ground grab releases to maneuver the Diddy's into stolen bananas.


Also one note of warning; bananas trip people on the ground when their feet touch them. Beware of using Utilt if the banana is on a platform where your feet will touch them. Dsmash will also trip. etc.
 

n00b

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Also bomb -> di backwards -> raigoth cancel -> buffer forward glide toss -> charge shot = SWD CHARGE SHOT HYPER COMBO FINISH!!!
 

Crystanium

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Once you got the hang of glide tossing, I believe you will have a lot more fun fighting Diddy Kong players. I have fought with several not long ago. You can throw the Banana Peels away to make the match a bit easier on you, or you can hold one in your hand and perform Homing Missiles and z-air. If Diddy Kong pulls out another one, you can either continue to hold the one that you have, or toss it and take the other one, forcing Diddy Kong to pull out another one. If you glide toss, be sure to glide toss away, whether throwing the Banana Peel forward or downward.
 

Xiahou Dun

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Alternatively to FSmash with a Bananna without throwing out an attack you could roll or spotdodge then begin holding A during the animation. From there continue to hold A as long as you like and perform the Smash with the C stick as normal.

The more you know...
 

DelxDoom

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Throw bananas up if you want them out of your way for a while, hopefully landing on a useless platform.

The strategy is that if the Diddy player wants that banana, they will be put into a disadvantageous spot that you can take advantage of by missiling and zairing and broiling. etc.

Remember that most Diddy's will pick up bananas on the ground most of the time with dash attacks, you can definitely punish those with spaced grabs.
 

Crystanium

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Remember that most Diddy's will pick up bananas on the ground most of the time with dash attacks, you can definitely punish those with spaced grabs.
Or a Charge Shot, since his dash attack won't break through it like he would if it were a Homing or Super Missile. Xyro needs to upload that replay I sent him. It's me fighting a Diddy Kong player.
 

tha_carter

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I would advise that this thread continues; it has potential.

G&W's bair, or Snakes grenades would be good moves to discuss....
 

Ravin

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Sword Dance. Flame Thrower, Rock Smash, Bullet Seed, Flood. Should be sticked, but we already have "Too" Many.
 

Hive

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I'm sorry, i totally forgot about this guys. T.T I'll try to update it soon ok, and then we can move onto other moves. ^^
 

Crystanium

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How to deal with Falco's Blaster. Hang on the edge. Or roll toward him. Or air-dodge while approaching him.

Ugh.
 

IsmaR

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Just to add to that 'mk can get grabbed out of nado'; Samus' barrel must be touching the nado, not just the grapple. So if youre trying to grab him out and its not working, thats the reason.
Barrel. lolololollolololoolololololololololololllololololololololo

On topic: It's best to try air dodgeng(yes eng) and getting in close for Z-airs. Projectiles are usually a bad idea. Staying near the edge also helps. Other than that, standard projectile spam blocking(rolls, shielding/powershielding, side step, punishing wiith D-air/Dash/missiles when off guard, etc.)

My font color hates you too.
 

Cherry64

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perfect
shield
dash
Good Luck, Buddy - Dryn told me to say it, In reality I can only Perfect shield dash maybe half of his stuff but he will generally grab me by SH'ing and DI'ing backwards while firing off 1 laser, then land and Grab me either because I perfect shielded it, or because of laser stun.
 

Hive

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falco's lasers are easier to dodge when he tries to double them in his shorthop. however, if he grounds them they are much* harder to avoid (the first laser in the shorthop lasers usually goes above samus). Perfect shielding here imo is not as useful with the grounded ones (good with the doubled ones though, and also you can shield and charge your shot (i do this sometimes as well) in between)
And also in places like frigate falco can actually double his lasers in shorthop while he is in the dip in the level in one of the phases, and have both hit you. this is by far the most annoying thing i've ever encountered in the history of smash.
 

Cherry64

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I am bumping this. Are we too all continue trying this thing out? or shoudl Drynybeans just lock it up?
Prolly leaning towards the latter of the two sadly :(
But in the end it's Dryns call although Hive should have equal say as it's her thread helping samus out.
I'm going to bed, I smell in an infraction for this post though. Give me Minor spam If ya Do infract Dryn Thanks buddy!
 
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