'How to deal with specific enemy moves' Discussion - Discussion 42: IC Grab

[Canvasofgrey]

Abuse the delay that Bowser has right before this move lands. Thankfully, Peach has quick attacks like Ftilt and Dsmash to grab priority from this move. Even jab will knock Bowser out of this move I think.

Because this move is used up close, and that the enemies has to be pretty much completely horizontal to Bowser to make this move land, I think just Turnip pressure him, and use a lot of aerials to prevent Bowser from getting in the first few critical seconds to pull it off.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Ah, I forgot to mention - Bowser can SH this move, land and go into an immediate F Tilt if he pleases. I got a lot of this all the time. Oh and it's also a grab style move. Things like Toad don't work

 

[Razmakazi]

yea this move can get annoying but it's not as bad as his up b. it sounds like your friend loves to grab release + jab + grab/claw/or surprise bowser bomb/roll behind you and do more jab-grab funsies.

all i can say is work the slap/ftilt during grab releases or roll or sidestep. if they bust out the side b w/o a good set-up then sidestep + usmash has gotten me a lot of bowser kills when they whiff =o

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Not really. He certainly gave me my fair share of grab release to F Tilts. By far his favourite thing to do was to spam it in the air to get me out of my Floating. Doesn't work anymore though xD

Hang on, move off grab releases. This is his Side B - it's a type of grab. It's not his actual grab. The one where he picks you up, jumps/spins in the air and comes crashing down with you

 

[cutter]

Just popping in; I actually think Bowser's Side B is up there with some of the best moves in the game:
- It's deceptively fast
- Does a whopping 18%
- Kills when it's fresh (not the suicide, the slamming part)
- One shot kills with Bowsercides
- GOES THROUGH SHIELDS
- Can be infinite seconded jumped with it

Treat Bowser's side B like a normal grab; the hitbox only lasts a very few amount of frames and obviously does not linger. My intuition would say airdodge/sidestep this beastly move.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Just popping in; I actually think Bowser's Side B is up there with some of the best moves in the game:
- It's deceptively fast
- Does a whopping 18%
- Kills when it's fresh (not the suicide, the slamming part)
- One shot kills with Bowsercides
- GOES THROUGH SHIELDS
- Can be infinite seconded jumped with it

Treat Bowser's side B like a normal grab; the hitbox only lasts a very few amount of frames and obviously does not linger. My intuition would say airdodge/sidestep this beastly move.

He said pretty much what I wanted/was trying to say

So yea cheers cutter

 

[Canvasofgrey]

Then it's kind of like IC where you just play defensively, and stay off the ground and not horizontal to Bowser.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Doesn't look like we are getting anywhere with this move (there aren't many Bowser players out there I guess?). I recommend you at least take a look at the DI section I stuck in

Next up is ZSS' Side B. This is pretty nasty imo. At least if they try to spam it to death it gets stale. Don't forget they can SH backwards and use it to try and force you to approach - kind of like Samus' Zair...just slower and a lot more deadly

Discuss away!

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

They can shorthop it backwards all they like. If they're far away just turnip and glide toss. If they are close enough you can just toad it can't you? It's slow enough. ^_^

Actually Peach is faster this time around 'twould seem. Can't she run forward and toad a reverse shorthop one? Maybe not, but it's not like you HAVE to.

Perfectly spaced ones are annoying but jumps and floats should do well enough against it. Control the spacing and it's useless.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

By far the biggest problem with Toad is that sometimes ZSS' Side B will cut right through it or the spores will miss. Toad does work though but it's a bit dodgy on this move

 

[Canvasofgrey]

I think the key is to not be hit with the second hit since it has incredible knockback. I believe you can shorthop over the first hit since the attack box is a bit smaller than the second hit.

 

[deepseadiva]

I have another request.

Marth's Dancing Blade. I despise it.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

It's clear this isn't going anywhere so the next move I'm doing should hopefully spark some life into these discussions. If anyone wants to discuss/disagree on a move already done, please do so

Discuss away!

Spoiler

And for those of you who think I've gone even more insane/think I'm trying to spam, I'm actually trying to think up more things I could cover, considering I've only got like 2 other moves I could do :/ Besides, it's always nice to know how to deal with this move if you see it coming, right?

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

Falcon Punch

How to counter it: Watch it get initiated, take a nap, maybe grab a bite to eat, taunt, run around for a while, taunt again, throw out some random attack, ????, PROFIT!

 

[Morrigan]

^Best answer ever lol

Against Peach this move only works in doubles or if he breaks your shield

 

[EdreesesPieces]

Be a man and take the hit. The poor guy deserves to hit you with SOMETHING =P

 

[Morrigan]

Or sacrifice our servant:

 

[Razmakazi]

@edrees: Lol when i first saw you, you were 3-stocking this girl's CF. <.<

@Dekuu: LOOL xD

personally I'll let myself get Pawnch stagespiked if some1 had the balls to try. I've come so close so many times to pulling it off but i'd either miss, bounce them off the wrong part of the stage, or knock them over the stage itself. ;[

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Dekuu, those pictures are win

And lol Edreese

 

[EdreesesPieces]

Dude, that wasn't a girl, that was a very femm guy LOL

But seriously, freakin falcon players, are worse than meta players with their b spamming, its an auto win.

 

[Villi]

Switch to Ganon.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

The Warlock Punch lacks the epicness of the Falcawn Pawnch though :/ Is there nothing we can do against this move?

 

[Razmakazi]

LOL, **** i'm blind.

newayz wut is there to rly discuss about the pawnch? just know it's not gonna get thrown out there predictably and that if ur on your final stock we all know CF loves his flashy finishes. If they really wanna pawnch you then don't get mindgame'd I guess.

 

[deepseadiva]

In all seriousness, I think the question is how do you punish it?

I always get hit when trying to Toad it. It's slower than toad's entire animation and so I get hit when trying to do that.

I usually bomber during the wind up. It really is Peach's signature PUNISH move.

Otherwise the safest thing is to simply go pull a turnip.

 

[Villi]

Stand there just out of its range and smash him, or powershield it like a man. It's the only way. If you choose not to Ganon.

 

[TigerWoods]

I jump off and loose a stock. It's too much for me....

 

[Villi]

I jump off and loose a stock. It's too much for me....

That's cuz you're a wet little cooch. You gotta take it head on, man.

 

[Canvasofgrey]

That's cuz you're a wet little cooch. You gotta take it head on, man.

I just make Toad eat it instead.

Your Tyra signature is pure win.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

Seriously though I can't figure out how to beat him if he spams it. Some people turn it around and trick me.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Seriously though I can't figure out how to beat him if he spams it. Some people turn it around and trick me.

I completely understand. The reverse pawnch is completely broken. I was fighting Captain Falcon the other day on Spear Pillar. He reversed his pawnch, purposely missed me, hit the stage and the bit I was standing on shattered and collapsed!

Clearly this is a force to be reckoned with

 

[EdreesesPieces]

PUnish it by floating, waiting for it to finish, then down air comboing him.

 

[SleeplessInKyoto]

I'd say go for something daring and Toad his face

Also can we do Snake's F-Tilt next Rick? xD Thankies.

 

[EdreesesPieces]

I do go for something dairing. That's why I said start dairing him.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

I do go for something dairing. That's why I said start dairing him.

I can tell that pun was completely unintended. Magic

Oh Edreese, how do you do such wondrous things?

I'll move onto something slightly more serious soon. I hope you've all had a bit of laugh. Be sure to contribute on other moves to come as well

 

[PrepareYourself]

And then Snake's Utilt after that, if you don't mind.

 

[Razmakazi]

nvm powershield was suggested already.

lets do marth fair or as kyoto suggested, snake ftilt ;o

 

[Canvasofgrey]

I wish to cover MetaKnight's glide tactic.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

That concludes the epic discussion guys. Thanks for your contribution. I implore you to visit the write up on how to deal with the PAWWWWNCH. Be sure to keep contributing!

I know people have asked I cover Pit's Side B and Marth's Side B - I'll do them after this move. I want to cover at least one of Snake's Tilts first though because believe me, they're a hell of a lot more deadly

Up next is Snake's F Tilt. Perhaps Snake's camoflauge device didn't completely cut off when he entered the battle and he might just have a really, really fat leg. Or his tilts might just be a bit broken. I'm going for the latter. This move has horribly deceptive range, evil KO power and comes out nastily fast

Discuss away!

 

[Niko_K]

You can actually SDI behind him on the first hit if you input enough SDI's. I did it at Percons house yesterday by fluke.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

You can actually SDI behind him on the first hit if you input enough SDI's. I did it at Percons house yesterday by fluke.

So I wasn't going crazy...Thankyou very much for confirming this Niko . I've only ever managed to pull it off once and I thought Wi Fi was glitching up