kigbariom
Smash Lord
Lol, loose, lose!
Ok I'll keep it this way. For now, I should start prepping for a Falco write-up.
Ok I'll keep it this way. For now, I should start prepping for a Falco write-up.
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How to beat ______ (#3 R.O.B [Edit coming soon])
- Thread starter kigbariom
- Start date
elheber
Smash Lord
Don't fret; chic was having the same problem yesterday on the xat chat. He was Johning on how late it was in Texas. That's right, chic! I called you out!
Anyway, SH to Grounded Cyclone is a viable approach against Falco. I stand by this.
EDIT: I'll be honest Kig... I don't like this format. I tried really hard to get into it when I first read it but the first post killed my eyes. Then I tried really hard to avoid this thread, but my desire to mention delayed recoveries just barely won out.
kigbariom
Smash Lord
What about the post killed your eyes, the length, color, stupidness....?
I like hippie's idea of just a situational thread.
I like hippie's idea of just a situational thread.
elheber
Smash Lord
If I had to pin it down to one thing, I'd say the length. I'd call it "pacing" though. Like when you buy a game and it takes hours to get to the fun part; the multiple loading screens are too long, you can't skip the long intro cut-scenes, the first stages only explain the game with little actual gameplay, etc.
I don't remember whos it was, but someone had made a thread about Luigi's "diary" of his own moveset... I couldn't get into that one either. Too much gimick.
Here's what, Kig, don't change anything unless I'm not the only one to complain. Stephen King said that (paraphrased) if 10 people read your draft and each of them complain about different things, you can ignore their comments just fine; but if just 2 of them complain about the same thing, then it means they're right and you have to change that thing. So, in essence, this might just be me, Kig, complaining about something nobody else dislikes. In which case you should change nothing.
I don't remember whos it was, but someone had made a thread about Luigi's "diary" of his own moveset... I couldn't get into that one either. Too much gimick.
Here's what, Kig, don't change anything unless I'm not the only one to complain. Stephen King said that (paraphrased) if 10 people read your draft and each of them complain about different things, you can ignore their comments just fine; but if just 2 of them complain about the same thing, then it means they're right and you have to change that thing. So, in essence, this might just be me, Kig, complaining about something nobody else dislikes. In which case you should change nothing.
kigbariom
Smash Lord
Spoken like a true scholar.
However, I'm willing to change it all just for you. Besides I don't think people will be opposed.
Will they?
BigLøu
Smash Lord
Try this stuff against falco
kigbariom
Smash Lord
I'm super busy, keep talking but don't expect a write-up until after the 26th. Exams 
chic
Smash Ace
that was an amazing post lou
elheber
Smash Lord
If he Lasers the Cyclone recovery, you regain your Rising Cyclone. It's the dAir we should be wary of when recovering.
hippiedude92
Smash Hero
quick question
what stage do u guys fight snakes on? Excluding BF and RC, where do u take him? *Primarily asking BigLou for this matchup since he knows how to fight them alot more then
what stage do u guys fight snakes on? Excluding BF and RC, where do u take him? *Primarily asking BigLou for this matchup since he knows how to fight them alot more then
elheber
Smash Lord
It's a bad idea to take Snakes to Corneria, because you then have Snakes on a Plane!!! O_O!
I take Snake to Jungle Japes. It's easier to avoid the spam there, for me, and he's got a harder time with the rapids than Luigi does. I'm like "Hey Snake, bet you didn't think you'd get KOd by a Dash Attack near the ledge." He still beats me, though.
I take Snake to Jungle Japes. It's easier to avoid the spam there, for me, and he's got a harder time with the rapids than Luigi does. I'm like "Hey Snake, bet you didn't think you'd get KOd by a Dash Attack near the ledge." He still beats me, though.
FRIGATE....ORPHEON...
The flipping of the stage messes up snake's projectiles and hurts his recovery a lot.
kigbariom
Smash Lord
I'll add all that up in a jiffy
hippiedude92
Smash Hero
Corneria is banned, japes is eh eh. He can control the stage quite well on each platform. The ceiling is high so both of us are kinda screwed, the only forceful way is to push off stage, just like any other stage. So annoying ._.
BigLøu
Smash Lord
hmm i like take snakes to yoshis island for some reason, not sure why but i feel safe on that stage.
BF imo is a bad idea vs snake, he controls those platforms to easily.
maybe halberd is good for those quick and easy kills, but at the smae time snake is good at that stage too.
ALiAsVee
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2008
- Messages
- 739
I find halbred easier to get dair spikes off of their UpB recoveries, but I can't really see why that has to do with the stage.
kigbariom
Smash Lord
Halberd doesn't come up a lot when people talk about CP's. I only thought about it now.
hippiedude92
Smash Hero
lol dunno why, but people always tend to go to Yoshi's island, I've never found it really that great imo. The shy guys can actually somewhat screw you because your attacks lag slightly move if you hit them. I played Anti's Snake got 2 stocked on Smashville (lol he was my first match didnt, prepare properly johns hehe
) Yeah that's true. But then again, it's our job to get snake offstage, just like in any other stage. I'm talking about onstage wise, which is better to take him to. His C4 can cover a platform quite well, since it's so small.
ALiAsVee
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2008
- Messages
- 739
If he C4's the platform in halbred, he controls the centre of the map basically, since I think you can get hit from below the platform there. I can see why people might want to take him to Yoshi's Island, but with a recovery that begs spikes, I find the lower right and left of the stage too "busy" to catch him off guard there. You essentially want it to be busier on stage, and clear off stage so once you get him off stage, you can go to town.
I second Frigate for that reason. Not only that, but Luigi can recovery anywhere basically. Whenever or not you get gimped is a separate issue, but if you time your jumps and know how the stage will orient itself, you don't have to worry about getting snagge under the stage. Snake on the other hand, has more issues in that regard, and he is even MORE predictable than Luigi. If your opponent knows the Spike is coming, he'll do his best to avoid it at all costs. Throwing out Dairs even if you don't plan on hitting him might make him slip up, and you can secure the kill.
This is situational, but one instance is that if the snake is close to the edge and is recovering, you can bait Dairs to make him cancel his UpB to "avoid" you. he essentially then has to do the C4 recovery thingie (don't know the name xD) and he'll be within striking range. If he moves away from the stage, you can shoot fireballs and pressure him there. If he's dumb enough to come on the inside you can grab him off stage and secure the kill.
^^^^ Snake is essentially useless if you zone him correctly, which is why I reiterate stages with lots of offstage space, because you don't need it as much as he does. I don't like Smashville for this, since the moving platform can rescue Snake. Battlefield is "eh" I guess, it's a bit more compact and has smexy platforms, but it's not doing Luigi too many favors since Snake's Grenade range essentially covers the length of the field. Same goes with his DACUS. Rainbow Cruise is one of the given counters, but you have to make sure you have a really good understanding in that map. If there is any stage to analyze, it's RC.
Remember that the platforms begin when you reach the end of the rainbow, even if you're offstage. Know which platforms are solid, and which ones you can drop under. Mind the corners and the top edge of the stage, since an Utilt is likely. You only win because he can't set up shop and camp as easily, but RC is a true example of having to know what the hell you are doing to utilize your counterpick. Even if you get counterpicked on RC, if you opponent only did cause that's what the boards say, he likely does not have a full understand of the stage yet. I don't have a full understanding xD.
Frigate is essentially like RC in that regard, and you'll end up choosing between one of the other, unless your tourney is dumb and allows two bans >_>. i still wouldn't drop Halbred out of the picture either.
I don't know what the situation is with Japes anymore (counter, counter/ban, banned, or w.e), but that's a very risky stage for Luigi. You get your horizontal kills, and are guarded by the high ceiling from Utilts, but it doesn't get any easier than designating a portion of the stage as your campy island, and baiting shieldgrabs. Luigi's recoveries are slow to start, and his UpB doesn't have that arch needed to compensate for the rushing water when reaching the platform (like Mario's). When I got Halbred, RC, and Frigate, I don't see why I should go Jungle Japes. In respect to the Risk/Reward system, it's less of a risk for Snake than it is Luigi to reap reward.
Err, we were doing Falco right?
I second Frigate for that reason. Not only that, but Luigi can recovery anywhere basically. Whenever or not you get gimped is a separate issue, but if you time your jumps and know how the stage will orient itself, you don't have to worry about getting snagge under the stage. Snake on the other hand, has more issues in that regard, and he is even MORE predictable than Luigi. If your opponent knows the Spike is coming, he'll do his best to avoid it at all costs. Throwing out Dairs even if you don't plan on hitting him might make him slip up, and you can secure the kill.
This is situational, but one instance is that if the snake is close to the edge and is recovering, you can bait Dairs to make him cancel his UpB to "avoid" you. he essentially then has to do the C4 recovery thingie (don't know the name xD) and he'll be within striking range. If he moves away from the stage, you can shoot fireballs and pressure him there. If he's dumb enough to come on the inside you can grab him off stage and secure the kill.
^^^^ Snake is essentially useless if you zone him correctly, which is why I reiterate stages with lots of offstage space, because you don't need it as much as he does. I don't like Smashville for this, since the moving platform can rescue Snake. Battlefield is "eh" I guess, it's a bit more compact and has smexy platforms, but it's not doing Luigi too many favors since Snake's Grenade range essentially covers the length of the field. Same goes with his DACUS. Rainbow Cruise is one of the given counters, but you have to make sure you have a really good understanding in that map. If there is any stage to analyze, it's RC.
Remember that the platforms begin when you reach the end of the rainbow, even if you're offstage. Know which platforms are solid, and which ones you can drop under. Mind the corners and the top edge of the stage, since an Utilt is likely. You only win because he can't set up shop and camp as easily, but RC is a true example of having to know what the hell you are doing to utilize your counterpick. Even if you get counterpicked on RC, if you opponent only did cause that's what the boards say, he likely does not have a full understand of the stage yet. I don't have a full understanding xD.
Frigate is essentially like RC in that regard, and you'll end up choosing between one of the other, unless your tourney is dumb and allows two bans >_>. i still wouldn't drop Halbred out of the picture either.
I don't know what the situation is with Japes anymore (counter, counter/ban, banned, or w.e), but that's a very risky stage for Luigi. You get your horizontal kills, and are guarded by the high ceiling from Utilts, but it doesn't get any easier than designating a portion of the stage as your campy island, and baiting shieldgrabs. Luigi's recoveries are slow to start, and his UpB doesn't have that arch needed to compensate for the rushing water when reaching the platform (like Mario's). When I got Halbred, RC, and Frigate, I don't see why I should go Jungle Japes. In respect to the Risk/Reward system, it's less of a risk for Snake than it is Luigi to reap reward.
Err, we were doing Falco right?
hippiedude92
Smash Hero
That's alot of wall of words from Alias. Haven't seen that in a while lol.
For the halberd C4 platform control part, maybe it's just me or it could be wifi's input or I just suck at running to a PS (offline/online>.>) usually if you run past the C4 and Snake is opposite side of the stage, he will most of the time activate it, and if you manage to shield it, well you get pushed back resetting the situation lol. But if you PS it, kudos to you and expect a Ftilt/utilt or anything he will throw out because after he explodes the c4, he can do anything he wants quickly (Is it IASA frames?). That's just my problem. Though SH fireball force approachs is nice and all lol.
As for frigate turning upside, I dunno if it's random or not, but i think it is, alot of the times you can end up under the stage or on the stage. Same goes for Snake. So it's abit luck based unless it's time accorded and positions you in the same position as you were in the first phase of the stage.
Like I said, I just want all of your inputs when it comes to Snake's ONSTAGE GAME. Offstage game I clearly have no problem with unless I mess up.
For the halberd C4 platform control part, maybe it's just me or it could be wifi's input or I just suck at running to a PS (offline/online>.>) usually if you run past the C4 and Snake is opposite side of the stage, he will most of the time activate it, and if you manage to shield it, well you get pushed back resetting the situation lol. But if you PS it, kudos to you and expect a Ftilt/utilt or anything he will throw out because after he explodes the c4, he can do anything he wants quickly (Is it IASA frames?). That's just my problem. Though SH fireball force approachs is nice and all lol.
As for frigate turning upside, I dunno if it's random or not, but i think it is, alot of the times you can end up under the stage or on the stage. Same goes for Snake. So it's abit luck based unless it's time accorded and positions you in the same position as you were in the first phase of the stage.
Like I said, I just want all of your inputs when it comes to Snake's ONSTAGE GAME. Offstage game I clearly have no problem with unless I mess up.
ALiAsVee
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2008
- Messages
- 739
Situations like that are examples of my shield bouncing style of gameplay -utilizing momentum from attacks to set up/reset the situation. But it's late now.
hippiedude92
Smash Hero
Make a guide on that stuff already dude lol. Or did u already make a guide on that stuff ? >.>. I need your preaching once again Alias as you did with the buffering guide lol.
Atash
Smash Apprentice
Your local information miner is at your service!
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=193606 <-- general flip mechanics
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=q5Svwxz2vbs <-- catch+KO glitch
hippiedude92
Smash Hero
u just save hippie's children Atash. my children will idolize for saving alot of time and question in his hands tyvm.
kigbariom
Smash Lord
Well, it's the moment you've all been waiting for....?
Anyway, Falco is done, it's ROB time. Might want to browse through Falco's write-up if you aren't busy one day.
School's finished for me BTW so I'll be ready to update these things all the time. And I'll be on at 5 am my time, when most people here are on!
Anyway, Falco is done, it's ROB time. Might want to browse through Falco's write-up if you aren't busy one day.
School's finished for me BTW so I'll be ready to update these things all the time. And I'll be on at 5 am my time, when most people here are on!
A2ZOMG
Smash Legend
- Joined
- Oct 13, 2007
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- A2ZOMG
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ROB...
Tornado has a much higher reward in this matchup than in others. Punish ROB with it for easy air setups, since ROB sucks once he goes in the air, and he sucks at getting back down. Not to mention he's horribly easy to punish if he goes to the edge.
Keep in mind however, he's good at punishing predicted Tornadoes. Watch out for lasers...powershield his lasers and then try to punish.
Up-smash is incredible in this matchup. Predict his DI and you can get one off really easy especially if you're good at outtiming air dodges.
So anyhow, watch out for lasers, and his tilts. Those are probably his hardest attacks to get past if he's smart about using them. And keep in mind, he can be a nasty juggler too. Getting regrabbed after a D-throw is not cool.
Tornado has a much higher reward in this matchup than in others. Punish ROB with it for easy air setups, since ROB sucks once he goes in the air, and he sucks at getting back down. Not to mention he's horribly easy to punish if he goes to the edge.
Keep in mind however, he's good at punishing predicted Tornadoes. Watch out for lasers...powershield his lasers and then try to punish.
Up-smash is incredible in this matchup. Predict his DI and you can get one off really easy especially if you're good at outtiming air dodges.
So anyhow, watch out for lasers, and his tilts. Those are probably his hardest attacks to get past if he's smart about using them. And keep in mind, he can be a nasty juggler too. Getting regrabbed after a D-throw is not cool.
WIGI
Smash Champion
watch out for nair, dsmash, dilt being gimped.... and lazers
KC18
Smash Journeyman
jab cancels, using follow-up options (dmsash, titls, upb etc) i find are easier to use cuz of robs size and weight. also at low percents if you score a dsmash you can chase rob with more dsmashes cuz of his weight.
if you manage to get a hold of the gyro you can glide toss into some deadly results like any smash attack, upb also...but that's more of a side note thing shouldn't always be going for the glide toss, too predictable.
if you manage to get a hold of the gyro you can glide toss into some deadly results like any smash attack, upb also...but that's more of a side note thing shouldn't always be going for the glide toss, too predictable.
kigbariom
Smash Lord
Luigi's tilts would do some good since he's heavy, like u-tilts, and a few f-tilts for spacing, and d-tilts.
chic
Smash Ace
any tips vs a rob who retreats to the ledge and spams projectiles while grabbing the ledge?? i was playing a rob who did this and i couldnt do anything i ended up losing
i ended up losing
hippiedude92
Smash Hero
Hey guys. Back to snake. What do you do to counter snake's ftilt? oos, walking, turnaround for ftilt and damage for it so ****ing huge. -_-. advice please luigis <3
kigbariom
Smash Lord
Kick the player in the face or don't show up for the match. Honestly, I have that problem too. I hate tilts
luke_atyeo
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 10, 2008
- Messages
- 7,215
nice thread guys, after rob can we do diddy kong, apparently luigi is supossed to be diddy's hardest matchup, I'd like to know why.
and for meta knight, didnt polmex or someone make a thread like this about meta with vids and stuff, you could just link it on the OP, but I cant seem to find it anywhere
and for meta knight, didnt polmex or someone make a thread like this about meta with vids and stuff, you could just link it on the OP, but I cant seem to find it anywhere
hippiedude92
Smash Hero
ScAtt77
Smash Journeyman
ok if Rob ledgecamps, I usually wait for him to use his gyro. Once he throws it out, try to catch it to limit him and spam fireballs to put more pressure on him. The laser does have a recharge time so try to get him then. :O
BigLøu
Smash Lord
Hippie for snake i sheild the frist tilt then sidestep the second, then punish with a grab or somethin.
Rob- bait the spotdodge. Luigis jab comes out before rob can do anything out of the spotdodge so its pretty much an instant up b. I like to spam bair in this matchup, a well spaced bair beats robs nair. It also owns his recovery. Robs really easy to combo too. Fireballs can help in this matchup but robs fair can just swat it away, if your smart with it though it can set up for up bs.
and what scat said too.
Rob- bait the spotdodge. Luigis jab comes out before rob can do anything out of the spotdodge so its pretty much an instant up b. I like to spam bair in this matchup, a well spaced bair beats robs nair. It also owns his recovery. Robs really easy to combo too. Fireballs can help in this matchup but robs fair can just swat it away, if your smart with it though it can set up for up bs.
and what scat said too.
LuigiKing
Smash Lord
Rob is super easy to combo... but he camps the crap out of you so easily. =/
PolMex23
Smash Champion
The problem with ROB is that I hate camping players...an robs camp.
cant stand it.
Im working on my patience though
cant stand it.
Im working on my patience though
A2ZOMG
Smash Legend
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- RPV, California
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Shielding near the edge is a good option vs ROB.any tips vs a rob who retreats to the ledge and spams projectiles while grabbing the ledge?? i was playing a rob who did this and i couldnt do anything
ROB sucks a lot at the edge IMO...he's okay at grabbing it, but he's horrible at getting back up from it (his ledgejump and ledgeroll are like the worst in this game...his getup attack is good, but like any other getup attack it's punishable out of shield). One thing I'd do is drop with N-air over him. If he tries a getup, it will nail him. You can also try to go offstage with N-air and see if it will hit him after he loses his invul frames.