Houston Thread - No HOBOs and no WHOBOs. What do we do now??????????????????????????????????????????

[CY]

denial is not just a river in egypt. the scene is dead

 

[knuckles213]

Yea right now they will cooperate and yea maybe we will get a circuit going but the whole point I was trying to make is that NONE OF THIS REALLY MATTERS.

Our scene will never reach what we used to have in terms of hype and attendance. We must face the new norm which is lackluster at BEST. That is why I said we let it burn and restart with smash 4.

screw that, I'm not gonna wait a whole year for a new smash just to play another and having the tx scene stay dead until then, I rather we plan something now. I'm not, but I'm willing to help out If I can

I'll plead not to ban MK out of my own selfishness of not wanting to play ICs and Olimar as much.

I agree

 

[Tesh]

Also since there is no results screen, im gonna ask here about replays. Apparently my wii thought it was random times during 2008 this weekend so im not sure which replays are from the 1st. did someone use the tag "roy" as olimar vs pj?

 

[Mr. game and watch]

We only need the TO's to cooperate.

We should make a Southwest thread now. Who wants to make it and keep up with it?

 

[*Cam*]

You guys need to solidify your plans before you jump the gun and make a thread.

 

[Mr. game and watch]

A thread as in a discussion thread now instead of the Houston social.
Some plae we can keep track of it all

 

[Espy Rose]

I've always been an avid fan of 2 Stock matches, Gea. It needs to happen more often.

 

[Gea]

For the bored nerds: how the Wii U gamepad works.

Interesting but I was hoping he would talk more in depth about the signal Nintendo uses and latency and whatnot.

Speaking of the Wii U, has it not been confirmed that homebrew still works perfectly in wii mode? I was reading about how stacksmash still works.

It still works, but since you can't install something permanently yet, the applications are limited.

I've always been an avid fan of 2 Stock matches, Gea. It needs to happen more often.

Yeah, the problem is overcoming people's sense of "well it was always this way, why change it?"

 

[*Cam*]

A thread as in a discussion thread now instead of the Houston social.
Some plae we can keep track of it all

I mean, I still think you guys need to decide things a little more formally before you start a thread for it.

 

[CY]

look, let's just face the facts. the scene is basically a dirt dead rat. when brawl rolled around, it had a nice healthy mix of melee players + new comers who ended up making the Houston scene one of the strongest in the U.S. since then, a ton of these players quit and majority of these people aren't going to return for Smash 4.

so what we're left with is a few new gens and a few of the "old" brawl gens for smash 4. most of the OG's have moved on. so DEAL WITH IT, the scene is ****ing dirt, has been for like 2 years now. who cares.

 

[Zano]

You know what would also be neat, if grand finals didn't take an hour to finish. Instead of the loser having to win 2 sets, just have the player in winners with a one game advantage, save about 40 minutes or more.

2 stocks doesn't sound too bad either.

 

[Tesh]

or YOLO, 2 sets would still be way less time than 1 3 stock set.

 

[Espy Rose]

So you want to cheat the person in winner's bracket out of a second life, Zano? Because that's essentially what you'd be doing.

 

[Tesh]

you know in japanese tournament, grand finals is bo3, so 2 sets is still 6 games at most, instead of 10

 

[Mr. game and watch]

>.>

I am confident we will not be changing stock counts.

 

[Gea]

I honestly don't care what you do, but I'd like to hear why.

 

[Espy Rose]

Can you explain why not?

 

[*Cam*]

look, let's just face the facts. the scene is basically a dirt dead rat. when brawl rolled around, it had a nice healthy mix of melee players + new comers who ended up making the Houston scene one of the strongest in the U.S. since then, a ton of these players quit and majority of these people aren't going to return for Smash 4.

so what we're left with is a few new gens and a few of the "old" brawl gens for smash 4. most of the OG's have moved on. so DEAL WITH IT, the scene is ****ing dirt, has been for like 2 years now. who cares.

Smash is still to this day an extraordinarily popular game. Most people who play don't know about the competitive scene, and a majority of those people wouldn't be interested anyway. But to suggest there's not a good-sized audience in Texas that would be interested in playing competitively is just silly.

When I started a Smash club at my university in Alabama (not University of Alabama but my university in Alabama), I spent a single day on the concourse getting signatures of people interested in joining. This was a few years after Brawl came out, and 100 people signed up to get more information. If my small state, heck my small university, has that many people that are interested, then Texas does too.

 

[knuckles213]

no stock change. Why?

MK, ICs, Diddy, etc

 

[CY]

>.>

I am confident we will not be changing stock counts.

look man.

we're missing the ****ing GLUE from the popsicle sticks and the kindergarteners.

changing rules doesn't give us glue. do you understand?

 

[Tesh]

no stock change. Why?

MK, ICs, Diddy, etc

yes, those characters exist, what does this even mean? ive heard the (bad) ics argument but what does mk or diddy have to do with that?

 

[Gea]

I love you CY. You've got heart.

 

[CY]

Smash is still to this day an extraordinarily popular game. Most people who play don't know about the competitive scene, and a majority of those people wouldn't be interested anyway. But to suggest there's not a good-sized audience in Texas that would be interested in playing competitively is just silly.

When I started a Smash club at my university in Alabama (not University of Alabama but my university in Alabama), I spent a single day on the concourse getting signatures of people interested in joining. This was a few years after Brawl came out, and 100 people signed up to get more information. If my small state, heck my small university, has that many people that are interested, then Texas doe too.

99% of the people at my university don't even know what Smash Brothers is. that's a statistical fact. nor do they want to play a 4 year old game. and even if they did, they don't want to have to travel to Houston every time for tournaments.

believe me, we (as in Beaumont) already tried this years ago when Brawl was still in it's prime. we got players interested, but they weren't interested in tourneys for the most part. just casual playing at someone's house here and there.

 

[Seagull Joe]

Thanks for the last 10 pages of reading.

Honestly banning produces more casuals then not banning him.

I'm fairly anti-ban, but I want tourneys to be ran optimally. Do what it takes Texas, which means:

1. Hold banned tourneys or just ban him in one of two events (More incentive for casuals).
2. Make many stages legal and do a 9 stage neutral striking system.
3. LGL of 35 for all characters.
4. Advertise at libraries, schools, churches, and other communities.

 

[sheikamaru]

im the best sheik in texas.

 

[Labernash]

im the best kirby in texas.

 

[*Cam*]

99% of the people at my university don't even know what Smash Brothers is. that's a statistical fact. nor do they want to play a 4 year old game. and even if they did, they don't want to have to travel to Houston every time for tournaments.

believe me, we (as in Beaumont) already tried this years ago when Brawl was still in it's prime. we got players interested, but they weren't interested in tourneys for the most part. just casual playing at someone's house here and there.

No, that's wrong. A LOT of people know about Super Smash Brothers. 99% is a number you pulled out of thin air. And yes, a lot of them still want to play it. You'd be amazed how many people wanted to play Smash 64 when we advertised.

The trick isn't to try to get them all to travel, the trick is to encourage/facilitate a smaller group of people that want to travel and get the rest interested in going to the tournament in their own city. The trick is also to hold regular events (not necessarily tournaments) specifically for locals in that city. We meet every week in Auburn and have a consistent 20-25 people show up. About 6-7 regularly travel for tournaments, and an additional 3-5 sometimes travel. About two-thirds of them show up for Alabama Smash League's Auburn tournament every semester.

 

[Mr. game and watch]

I'm the best puff in Texas but I don't see how that helps.




Ok. 3 stocks is plenty. 1 stock is a silly side event, 2 stocks doesn't leave near enough breathing room.
3 is optimal. Has been since release.

 

[Seagull Joe]

Espy is the best in Texas.

 

[Gea]

Except matches are long as **** and if 2 stock doesn't hurt the consistency of placings there is literally no reason not to do it. Brawl has so many resets into the neutral game and lack of gimps/low % kills that the best argument to keep 3 stock is preference.

 

[Tesh]

Except matches are long as **** and if 2 stock doesn't hurt the consistency of placings there is literally no reason not to do it. Brawl has so many resets into the neutral game and lack of gimps/low % kills that the best argument to keep 3 stock is preference.

^ this, when you look at any other competitive game and see how much can be lost from a single mistake GUARANTEED, i see no reason why good players would need 3 or even 2 stocks to consistently win. even in this game with tripping, random bomb pulls, olimars killing you after you gimp them etc.

 

[Mr. game and watch]

That's why we have an 8 minute timer and matches rarely go to time anyway.
If you wanna host a brawl tourney with 2 stocks, got for it.

This is the LSC. 3 stocks. It has to be playable..

 

[knuckles213]

yes, those characters exist, what does this even mean? ive heard the (bad) ics argument but what does mk or diddy have to do with that?

I'm just saying, having 2 stocks (with winner and loser's bracket) with having to deal with characters that can literally **** you (based on who you chose) would not be fun and I would feel like I was cheated out of my money worths, especially at higher levels of play.

before attending ALSM's last tourney, I've have to deal with Denti's olimar almost every 2nd or 3rd round (him kicking my ***) and then heading to losers just to be beaten by an mk or ICs or diddy. I dont want any less stocks have to deal with any of this ****, that just means it will be a much quicker fight and then its over

 

[Xyro77]

Oh i forgot another reason why smash is dying.

so many ****ing new gens, ******** non brawl players and radicals literally think 2 stocks is better than 3.



LMAO yea we are done for.

 

[CY]

No, that's wrong. A LOT of people know about Super Smash Brothers. 99% is a number you pulled out of thin air. And yes, a lot of them still want to play it. You'd be amazed how many people wanted to play Smash 64 when we advertised.

The trick isn't to try to get them all to travel, the trick is to encourage/facilitate a smaller group of people that want to travel and get the rest interested in going to the tournament in their own city. The trick is also to hold regular events (not necessarily tournaments) specifically for locals in that city. We meet every week in Auburn and have a consistent 20-25 people show up. About 6-7 regularly travel for tournaments, and an additional 3-5 sometimes travel. About two-thirds of them show up for Alabama Smash League's Auburn tournament every semester.

that would work if our scene wasn't dead. majority have moved elsewhere, I haven't played since Summer of 2011, Esca is the only one who plays and AFAIK it's not a lot. so sure, maybe we could get 10-20 people interested, but that would be a lot of work for a game I don't play. but this was more hypothetical anyway, I wasn't trying to revive a scene or something.

edit: not to mention we tried this at my university already like I said. we got a few locals interested and had maybe 10 people in our scene. like 4 went to tournaments. game is just donezo man.

 

[Player-4]

I'll plead not to ban MK out of my own selfishness of not wanting to play ICs and Olimar as much.

You play?

Ban MK

 

[Mr. game and watch]

Xyro join me! And Denti!

I'm a new gen but I agree with you. 2 stocks is dumb.

Look. We need the circuit. Texas wants it.

Look at SanAn! They want in! We could not only be helping all of TX stay active, keep Houton Alive, and help Tyler grow, but also revive a whole nother city!
We need this.

There's enough interest. Lets start the official planning.

 

[Gea]

That's why we have an 8 minute timer and matches rarely go to time anyway.
If you wanna host a brawl tourney with 2 stocks, got for it.

This is the LSC. 3 stocks. It has to be playable..

You're the TO, do what you want, but you're in some massive denial if you think Brawl matches length are not a detriment. If the average match is four minutes then even if someone gets 2-0'd that's going to be roughly 10 minutes for a average set with the lowest number of games possible (stage striking and whatever for the final two minutes).

Your worst case long sets are 25ish minutes, which is nearing half an hour just for one 2/3 set. Grand finals sets that take up two 3/5 sets take a LONG time. The last two rounds of bracket being able to take multiple hours is just inane. I really don't understand why the community never addressed this issue. Melee can take a long time by tournament standards, but Brawl takes all day.

If you're worried about people getting their money's worth, do pools/RR/swiss. But you're right. You're the TO, and if I cared enough I could host my own event.

 

[Espy Rose]

Except matches are long as **** and if 2 stock doesn't hurt the consistency of placings there is literally no reason not to do it. Brawl has so many resets into the neutral game and lack of gimps/low % kills that the best argument to keep 3 stock is preference.

What Gea said.

Also, arguing that MK, Diddy, whatever destroys you harder sounds somewhat odd.

I mean, I find the hill to climb from getting gimped in a 3 stock match to be ridiculous if it's an IC, Olimar, or Meta Knight as is. They can just play passively for the rest of the game, and as long as they're consistent, they're going to ravage you just as badly as they would in a 2 stock setting.

Honestly, the only argument that can be made is preference.

@GaW: And what if the community at large actually liked the idea of 2-stock matches? Or heck, what if a majority of TOs disagreed with you and opted for 2 over 3?

All I'll say is don't go about telling people that it'll be three stocks guaranteed, because you've honestly done nothing but carry on one discussion about reviving the scene. Nothing is concrete.

@Xyro: That hurts. I've been a part of Smash since 2005/2006. 3 Stocks just takes far too much time that could be used elsewhere. 2 Stock doesn't really screw around with consistency, AND it's faster paced.

 

[Xyro77]

Ill make a deal with you, GW. Make a FB group and invite Espy/Denti/Xyro/Nike/Sync/ALSM and we can talk about this stuff. Nothing will be set in stone until we all can agree on stuff.