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[Gates]

It depends partially on how you move after the throw, but yes it's possible. I don't think it's garunteed like Marth's fthrow->fthrow->tipper fsmash though.

 

[Jupz]

Oh ok, thanks Gates.

 

[Countcocofang]

This is still a critique thread right? I have some vids of myself playing two sets in a tourny here in NorCal. Please give me any advice you feel I need. Match up tips for ROB would be appreciated since there's practically nothing written about him in our matchup thread, and the only practice I get against ROB is playing ridiculously good ones (Do I outspace him on the ground, throw lots of bairs, go for lots of grabs? anything would be nice)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sA0EDxVRhkE&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxy9CDGr4tQ&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ajsj6zRtG8k&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRhoEQkWUM0&feature=related

 

[Commander_Beef]

This is still a critique thread right? I have some vids of myself playing two sets in a tourny here in NorCal. Please give me any advice you feel I need. Match up tips for ROB would be appreciated since there's practically nothing written about him in our matchup thread, and the only practice I get against ROB is playing ridiculously good ones (Do I outspace him on the ground, throw lots of bairs, go for lots of grabs? anything would be nice)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sA0EDxVRhkE&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxy9CDGr4tQ&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ajsj6zRtG8k&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRhoEQkWUM0&feature=related

Sorry it took so long Count...But I've been busy with my life stuff, and it's not really that active in this thread because everybody else doesn't care, or it's not active in the King Dedede boards for that matter.

For the first video...never throw a waddle dee that close to somebody. It's too laggy and especially against Marth, you should know that he'll get you with the chaingrab to a forward smash. You have to keep that in mind whenever your percent is from 0-4 (Yes that's the exact percent range. Anything higher won't get the chaingrab). The waddle dee throw might have been a habit thing, so work on that.
You didn't use forward tilt once against Marth...It outranges everything he has and it's even better if you spaced it and hit him with it at the same time. Marth is the hardest character to chaingrab consistently, even if you think you got it down, you don't. I saw you chaingrab him successfully a couple times so keep that up. It'll make the matchup that much easier the more you know when the frame windows are perfectly open.
I saw you Inhale Marth and spit him back onstage...always turn around and spit him offstage, it's guarenteed if you turn around. And just try to watch yourself when you're approaching with a Reverse Aerial Rush back air, please. That seems to be a habit that you have to break, and rather watch for when the correct time to do it when Marth messes up his spacing or when he starts going down to ground.

Against Snake on Castle Siege...you should've figured out already that he was going to do all that camping with grenades on the second transformation. So instead of staying under him the whole time, start puffing up to the side platforms (flags) and go aerial on him then with a keen watch of his grenades. And that will heat it up for him. You were dealing with the grenades everywhere else almost perfectly...keep up the air camping and waiting for the appropriate time to grab, good stuff there.

R.O.B. is such a predictable matchup for us...but I think you need a slight bit more experience for this to happen with you also. You must know that whenever you're close to ROB, or in range of his down smash, he will do it. Another indication that he will down smash is if he spotdodges first, that's what almost all ROBs do when they're not smart to do anything else. So immediately shield when you see the spotdodge, but don't attempt a grab beforehand. You should watch him for a second instead of always trying to grab him because of his spotdodge. Yes I know this becomes like a guessing game when I say this but, they will grab you after a spotdodge sometimes too, but forget the guessing game and shield anyways.
And never do your down smash too early in percentages because it's lag is not worth the 15% that it will deal when that early in your opponent's stock.
For this matchup, you cannot always expect a chaingrab, you have to mix up your options unless if the ROB is really stupid. I'd say for his airgame...you should back air out of your shield more. Or at least do back airs the whole time if that's what it takes to shut down his fast aerial game. It seems that you're having the most trouble with R.O.B...so ask me anything in particular that you're iffy with in this matchup. R.O.B. is my secondary, so I should know.

 

[Countcocofang]

Thanks a lot Beef <3

And just try to watch yourself when you're approaching with a Reverse Aerial Rush back air, please. That seems to be a habit that you have to break, and rather watch for when the correct time to do it when Marth messes up his spacing or when he starts going down to ground.

Is Reverse Aerial Rush back air referring to be bairing like crazy? Yah, somewhere I heard that that was a good idea, I didn't know I had to do it on reaction, thanks. As for the lack of ftilts, I had some bad experience playing RedJ since he likes too perfect shield my ftilts, I think I just need to be less predictable!

Against Snake on Castle Siege...you should've figured out already that he was going to do all that camping with grenades on the second transformation.

I actually did not see this coming at all, I thought he was crazy when he went snake after I picked Siege. Now I know *sigh*

R.O.B. is such a predictable matchup for us...but I think you need a slight bit more experience for this to happen with you also.

Hit the nail on the head. Only other ROB I've played was t0mmy like one time, next time I'll be ready. Thanks for responding Beefy!

 

[Jupz]

Sorry I couldn't help critique beef, I wasn't here for the past few days.

Reverse aerial rush is when you input the pivot animation and immediately jump out of it so you are facing backwards.

Also I would like to say, as beef said robs are predictable and they like to spotdodge a lot up close so don't be afraid to charge a dsmash and release it to punish their spotdodge.

 

[CRASHiC]

Beef, I don't do critiques because you do them so amazingly well.

 

[Commander_Beef]

Is Reverse Aerial Rush back air referring to be bairing like crazy? Yah, somewhere I heard that that was a good idea, I didn't know I had to do it on reaction, thanks. As for the lack of ftilts, I had some bad experience playing RedJ since he likes too perfect shield my ftilts, I think I just need to be less predictable!

Hit the nail on the head. Only other ROB I've played was t0mmy like one time, next time I'll be ready. Thanks for responding Beefy!

Yes it's exactly as Jupz said, it's very easy to master. And no you don't do this on reaction...this is one of your best approach options. You'll know when to jump back air when you see King Dedede's pivot where he swings around his hammer on the ground.
And no don't let people discourage you on your metagame, you should never stop the frequency of your use of a move unless if it's Jet Hammer. Mix things up.
And I understand about T0mmy though, he's one of the best R.O.B.'s I think.
Your welcome Count. I just hope that you didn't thank me for my response just to thank me, but rather you apply into your game what I said, that's the important part. Please let me know of any specific problems with the characters that you are facing, if you have any.

Alrught I understand Crashic, that's a pretty good excuse. And thank you for your input Juppies, your definiton of Reverse Aerial Rush will be added..

 

[o-Serin-o]

A wonder question:

If I hit my own waddle with a jab, would that refresh my moves?

 

[Commander_Beef]

A wonder question:

If I hit my own waddle with a jab, would that refresh my moves?

Ah yes...a brilliant question that should've been known to all King Dedede players since near the beginning of his metagame. It's so logical.
To answer it more specifically, yes the move used to hit a Waddle Dee or Waddle Doo will be put into the imaginary "9 attack queue". This will gradually lead to the refreshment of moves.

 

[o-Serin-o]

Thanks.

Also, just be blunt. I'm not as stupid as people lead others to believe I am.

 

[Commander_Beef]

Thanks.

Also, just be blunt. I'm not as stupid as people lead others to believe I am.

Yes I'm aware of that, I'm just saying that it's logical referring to everybody that should know that, when most people didn't, so shame on them, not you Serin. They didn't bother jabbing a servant. I'm glad that you asked this question.

 

[Jupz]

I need help with the G&W matchup

 

[Gates]

Anything specific? Did you look in the export thread?

 

[H4XGD]

After maining G&W for about a year, I feel that I've gone nowhere. My main experience is against a friend of mine who mains Snake, so, basically, none.

But I want to turn that around, and since I'm so sick of G&W, I wanted to pick up a new character, and after playing a few games with MK, Olimar and D3, I decided on D3.

Now I ask you all a few questions:

1.) Best controller layout?
2.) How to practice? Should I try just mastering some techniques alone in training, or should I play online? I've heard that it's significantly laggier and it may hurt my playing if I use it for too long.
3.) Best way to start D3? Just read the stickied threads, I'd assume. Is there anything else special that I have to do?

 

[CRASHiC]

1.) Best controller layout?- Some will go with C-stick set to grab to help with the chain grab.


2.) How to practice? Should I try just mastering some techniques alone in training, or should I play online? I've heard that it's significantly laggier and it may hurt my playing if I use it for too long.- You should start out practicing the basics such as the chain grab in training. Then from there, this is what takes practice with D3, you should focus on playing people. You'll want to read up about all the matchups (the hardest part about D3) and learn all there is to no. From there, you want to try to apply each of these in a match against a player. Playing on Wifi won't hurt you too much, as long as you also get a great deal of in real life play against people as well. Just a friendly reminder, DO NOT PLAY AGAINST COMPUTERS
3.) Best way to start D3? Just read the stickied threads, I'd assume. Is there anything else special that I have to do?- Reading the stickies is great, but some info may be out of date. Look for matches by Co18, Seibrik, Atomsk, Lain, Fogo, and Hungrybox and watch the matches. From here you'll learn a lot about how to apply things in a matchup.

 

[Commander_Beef]

1.) Best controller layout?
2.) How to practice? Should I try just mastering some techniques alone in training, or should I play online? I've heard that it's significantly laggier and it may hurt my playing if I use it for too long.
3.) Best way to start D3? Just read the stickied threads, I'd assume. Is there anything else special that I have to do?

Take into account what both Crashic and I say, not just one of us, except for his number #1.
1.) Keep everything the way it is except put Tap Jump off. It's easiest and better to keep C-stick at smashes. I don't know how the C-stick grab thing does better though, I don't think it does.
2.) The only techniques to perfect in Training is your chaingrab on all characters. Don't worry about the time consumption on this because it's easy to get used to except for Toon Link, Marth, Peach, Diddy Kong, and Pit. They all require Shield Chaingrabbing and some others. The other is to Pivot Grab.
Playing online is a little bit laggier but it won't affect your offline play at all. Just switch off between the two. Using online for your matchups and learning your character's moveset is the main part to using online.
3.) Yes just the stickied threads, including the first post of this one don't forget. There's much information about Pivot Grab and tons of other stuff in the questions and answers. And as Crashic said look at the players to see how they play and what you can replicate to your game.

This will take some time, but if you're determined enough to read, study, and train your king, you'll have a better character than your Mr. Game & Watch.

[Still no time to update original post, I will do so by adding other posts etc. when I have the time.]

 

[H4XGD]

OK. Thanks a lot for all your help. I'll get right to it.

 

[Jakebudden]

Ch-ch-ch-check it out!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=duBqP4OirhI&feature=channel_page

 

[o-Serin-o]

There's a social thread for that.

 

[Jupz]

Anything specific? Did you look in the export thread?

Yeah I guess I'll check it out.

 

[JJROCKETS]

Hey guys, you probably don't know me because I don't think I have ever posted on the Dedede boards, and I don't post much at all, but whatever. Anyways, I am an Ice Climbers main from the Chicago area, and I secondary Dedede. I am here looking for your guys help on how to improve my Dedede. I have never been to a "real" tournament, but people from my high school occasionaly get together and we have tournaments, but only about four people that play are any decent at all, lol.

Anyways, here are some videos that I would like critiqued:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YTeBFMU82OI&feature=channel_page

I mainly play Dedede for the Snake matchup, and this was the only time I played Skid's Snake all day, so I want to see what you guys have to say about it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIdOhy7Mrz4&feature=channel_page

This is Skid's Metaknight, which was really giving my Dedede a hard time, so any advice here would be appriciated.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jk3aclFk24&feature=channel_page

A different Metaknight... I beat him in Norfair but not on Lylatt, I suck on that stage lol.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NqWnFNT0grM&feature=channel_page

Skid's Metaknight from grand finals. I can't seem to beat that thing...

Please, don't say something generic such as "lrn2DI foo!" or anything like that, it won't help me at all. Instead, try to give me something constructive that I can learn from. Thanks guys, I hope you enjoy watching my videos.

 

[T3h Albino]

Alright, I'll critique your videos ;D.

For the first video vs snake
0:30-Cipher grab, don't go for fsmash. Grab him and do not input any throw directions or pummel. Let him release and he is forced to use his c4 to recover.
1:04-If snake is pressuring you on the ledge just don't get up. Wait for an opportunity to get up without being punished. Also don't make unnecessary movement around grenades. Pick them up and throw them back, or move out of the way. Shielding them is probably what the snake wants you to do.
1:21-Learn the timing for dthrow > dtilt.
1:54-During shield pressure RAR inhale is always a great idea. This is especially true when they are shielding.
2:45-If you see him waiting for you on the ground, come down with inhale. It has the priority of a grab !
2:50-If you ever see a snake edgeguarding like this and you're a stock ahead go for the dededecide. They almost never see it coming.
2:51-Good DI
3:20-Just turn around and grab, don't roll.
3:29-Always dthrow
3:34-Always dthrow
Overall good match. Roll less, and learn the different methods to gimp all of snakes recovery options.

Second Game
0:00-This stage ****ing sucks, especially in this matchup.
0:15-Don't dash grab. Shield cancel grab has more range, and is less punishable.
0:21-Try to avoid dairing straight into the ground. If you're going to dair make sure it's lagless. Inahle would've been the better option.
0:27-Upthrow would've been a good option had your bthrow been staled, but it was not.
0:30-Turn around and grab > dsmash
0:32-See how you got punished for dairing into the ground?
0:48-STOPPP lol, also try to sweetspot the ledge so you get your jumps back.
0:54-Don't roll into mk. Ftilt or grab when he's at that length away.
1:15-OH OH SHIIII OH...
1:17-**** that's unfortunate lol.
1:21-Turn around and grab.
1:33-Never throw waddles dee's if you're that close to mk. He'll run up and...do what he did.
2:09-Recover low and go for the edge. If you recover high shuttle loop will **** you over.
2:33-<__<
2:55-That was really risky. Don't roll into him when he's doing stuff like that. Ftilt or short hop inhale.
3:06-If he's pressuring you like that wait it out. Another option I love is ledgehop dair.
3:16-Bthrow. I saw you had a lot of oppurtunities to tech chase, but you reacted too late. Work on reacting on time to tech chases, and learn your options out of tech chases.
3:29-Don't throw waddles that close.
3:34- DO NOT, AND I REPEAT DO NOT go off the stage to edge guard mk. If he's coming close to the edge you can throw a few bairs out, but the best way to edgeguard him is to just throw waddles. Pressure him while he's on the ledge with inhale,ftilt,grabs, and bairs.
Overall solid play. I believe your inexperience in the matchup, and the rush down style of metaknight got to you. With experience I'm sure you could **** this matchup.

 

[Mr.Fakeman]

How do I get past Lucas' ShortHop>PKfire spam?

 

[Jupz]

Powershield them and punish the lag with Ftilt when you get close.

 

[JJROCKETS]

T3h Albino: Thanks alot for the critique, I think it will really help me, I was clueless against Metaknight lol.

 

[Commander_Beef]

T3h Albino: Thanks alot for the critique, I think it will really help me, I was clueless against Metaknight lol.

I would help you also with my thoughts, but this computer makes the videos I watch skippy, so I'll trust Albino's contribution.

 

[T3h Albino]

You're very welcome JJrockets.

Thanks beef . ;3

 

[theAPExp]

has anyone ever noticed
you could standing infinite characters
like rob and snake on rainbow cruise
on the top part
everywhere
as long as you're facing to the left
i haven't read, heard, or seen anybody do this
it's not in matchup guides
not in stage guides
or anything
but i also don't really keep up with the ddd forums
not since the metagame turned into grab better

edit: i'll elaborate if it turns out i'm not just full of it

 

[stingers]

you're a liar

 

[theAPExp]

no seriously
since you banned castle siege yesterday
i was pissin around on rainbow cruise

congratz stingers, i discovered more hate on you

 

[stingers]

whatever

i'll just ditto you if i have to

 

[Mr.Fakeman]

Powershield them and punish the lag with Ftilt when you get close.

What if he keeps DIi'ng away after the PKfire? I won't be able to reach.

 

[Jupz]

Just keep running then until he reaches the end of the stage

 

[stealth3654]

How many frames of vulnerability does DDD have when he spot dodges?

 

[T3h Albino]

Go away billy, you'll never beat me OR raf !
;3

 

[CRASHiC]

We have no data on the spot dodge as you are asking.

 

[Jupz]

Pretty sure someone made a thread in tactical with all characters spot dodges, search is broken for me though

 

[Commander_Beef]

How many frames of vulnerability does DDD have when he spot dodges?

Frame data is the only thing in which we don't have stealth...sorry.

What if he keeps DIi'ng away after the PKfire? I won't be able to reach.

I think you meant..."What if he is wavebouncing it to where he spaced it too far away from you".
In that case, it's as logical is just shielding it and watch for another one, and shield again. Take a small walk in between each PK Fire if you have to.
Or if you see the fire coming just jump and puff your way there (aircamp it). Or you can spotdodge one if you have the correct timing.
These are just logical ways in which a smasher should develop when they come across spamming. Develop that mindset for these situations and learn what's the most logical way to eliminate the spam every time.

 

[Admiral Pit]

I hope this is the right place to ask this but, on behalf of trying to support some fellow Pits, I would like to ask many D3 players about the Pit v D3 matchup.

This has been a request that some Pits have given me, to pick up some Data on Top tiers/High tiers, and so I can finish up some Data that will be placed in my document which will hold every matchup, which I can preview via AIM.

My request is that I want the Dedede's Point-of-view, generally from Intermediate/Expert D3s that have a lot of Pit experience. I would like to know their names, so I can contact them, or they can contact me. That way, I can get a great summary on the Pit v D3 matchup, hopefully as less biased as possible, with Character CPs/Bans included, priorities, capabilities, and such.
So can u tell me the names of some good Pit-experienced D3 players, so I can complete my task? U can contact me Via PM or AIM if you desire. If you have AIM, I am capable of showing you my document's progress, and... yea, you get the idea.
Seriously, I would really appreciate your support.