Got a question! Sheik Q&A & FAQ

[#HBC | Scary]

Castle Siege is so awesome for Sheik. I think it needs to be used more by us.

Most of me hates PS1 with an unadulterated passion. Like, complete, perfect hate levels. I see no redeeming qualities to that stage.

 

[C.J.]

Everyone just needs to sit down w/ me at Apex for 20 minutes and they'll learn the amazing that is CS.

And PS1 actually has one really good quality for Sheik (although Ed, you don't use it at all).

If you camp really hard before the first transformation and just get a decent percent lead going into a transformation, when you get to a part that stalls out (fire, for example) opponents frequently feel like they can't waste time sitting over there and will come to you. Free everything you want on them. Alternatively, if they wait out the transformation, once it is over they go "well, I just wasted 30 seconds... I need to approach to do something about that % lead" and will approach more carelessly than they would have otherwise.

The advantage is less so about character traits and the stage but psychologically.

 

[Youngster Joey]

No I don't mind the tilting on lylat. I just feel like the platforms are in bad spots but the real reason I don't like it is because of the music.. Haha it doesn't really catch my attention. That's what determines if I like a stage or not really. I'm not all out competitive at this game. I just love competitive friendlies

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

Sheik actually does super well on PS1. Upsmash/tilt pokes through the neutral platforms, we are insane when next to a wall, lower ceiling makes our guaranteed kill setups kill earlier. Free transforms during stage changes to refresh moves.

 

[sheikamaru]

ps1 is a good place to take icies imo.. just go in when stage is about to change.

 

[Ultimate kaos]

I always love battlefield. I guess it's just because my friends constantly spam projectiles, and battlefield is easy to get to hem fast lol

 

[tru0067]

I like BF too

I have no idea why though

 

[Ultimate kaos]

Yes I like PS1 as well. I just seem to do well on that stage for some reason. I feel like it fits my playing style. I love playing smash ville too. The moving platform has saved me many times lol.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Is there a list of the characters that are always air-released if Sheik doesn't pummel them?

 

[tru0067]

Not sure, but I think every character gets air released if you don't pummel them

 

[dettadeus]

I don't think there's a list, but last i checked it's anyone whose feet don't touch the ground while they're in their grabbed animation.
Some examples are MK, Pikachu, Squirtle, Kirby, Olimar, Wario, etc. Short/small characters.

 

[Darky-Sama]

Pummeling doesn't effect the grab release unless they would break from the grab during the pummel animation or during the ending frames of the pummel. Once a character reaches it's neutral holding stance, the character is forced to break from the grab in whatever method they normally do. If their feet touch the ground, they break on the ground (unless they jump or hold up). If their feet are off the ground, they air release.

I know sliding with pivot grabs on uneven ground can cause characters to break differently though -- whether their feet are touching the ground or not. I'm not entirely sure what the deal is with that, though.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Pummeling doesn't effect the grab release unless they would break from the grab during the pummel animation or during the ending frames of the pummel. Once a character reaches it's neutral holding stance, the character is forced to break from the grab in whatever method they normally do. If their feet touch the ground, they break on the ground (unless they jump or hold up). If their feet are off the ground, they air release.

I'm aware of that--I just didn't want people to say, "Well, if they break out during your pummel..." That said, my wording was basically asking for this, anyway.

 

[sheikamaru]

Reflex. Mm rematch at apex.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I'm not going to Apex, somewhat because car troubles piled up after Retribution and I had to spend about $800 to get things right again.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaah!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Ultimate kaos]

So, when should the DACUS be used? Is it more of a surprise thing, or should be a legit part of your playstyle?

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I think it can be both. I've been interested in the potential of sort-of running away with DACUS. Otherwise, Sheik has many grab-release follow-ups in general, and it can be used to punish people far away in a manner similar to Dash Attack.

 

[Tesh]

I love DACUS in the marth matchup. I feel like he just LIVES at the perfect angle to get hit by "random" DACUS.

While we are on the subject, I feel like I'm really good at doing DACUS (probably because I use wiichuck) and I want to learn alot of combos and kill setups for it. I know alot of the basic ones like fair/bair to DACUS and Fthrow-DACUS at 0% on heavies. Bthrow to DACUS of they DI down.

How else can I get these upsmashes in as follow ups for big damage and early kills?

 

[Youngster Joey]

does f throw dacus really work on heavies? i never thought to do that.. i gotta try it now o_0 i wonder what else im missing...

also when is it good to use the chain?

 

[Tesh]

^ I think it depends on DI, but the damage is only like 23 total and you slide way past them so no real follow ups cept needles.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

You really should not be getting anything from throws except attacks that require a read. She definitely has no sure thing out of a throw.

Either that or I've done it wrong for a very long time.

 

[Tesh]

Well, I'm not talking about guaranteed combos. I'm talking about set ups that allow you to, at the very least, safely whiff DACUS while trying.

Bthrow to DACUS works for me vs real people, I rarely get grabs at 0 to see if I can fthrow to DACUS a heavy with DI though. Its funny because bthrow to upsmash is a sonic "combo" too.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Is it really?!?!?! That works?

As far as Sheik throws to DACUS.....that makes more sense. Essentially what I mentioned with having to make reads on their DI.

Still overusing Dthrow. Love that move, still nets me all my kills lol. Dthrow to Wait (eat a sandwich) and read, to Usmash. Just gotta put some fear in them and make them airdodge.

 

[Tesh]

I hate dthrow. I really feel like this character has such ****ty throws. Its like the same weak follow up potential as sonic but the throws do like half the damage i think...

i dont use upthrow and dthrow really, they both send them up, which is where they would go anyway if they DIed away from follow ups on the side throws.

 

[Ultimate kaos]

Still overusing Dthrow. Love that move, still nets me all my kills lol. Dthrow to Wait (eat a sandwich) and read, to Usmash. Just gotta put some fear in them and make them airdodge.

I LOVE her Dthrow!

Anyways thanks guys I never knew all the things a DACUS can follow up from... Guess that's why I found it hard to use in a normal game

 

[Youngster Joey]

Guys the chain! When is it good to use the chain? I feel it can be very useful. And I don't mean tether recovery. That's obvious.. As an attack how and when should it be used?

 

[Zankoku]

You're overthinking it.

 

[Gadiel_VaStar]

I hate dthrow. I really feel like this character has such ****ty throws. Its like the same weak follow up potential as sonic but the throws do like half the damage i think...

i dont use upthrow and dthrow really, they both send them up, which is where they would go anyway if they DIed away from follow ups on the side throws.

I disagree, d-throw is her best throw IMO. Billy is so good at trapping, punishing your landing, and covering your options. He's the best player in GA/AL at it, IMO. You guys should take more notes on him. But w/ Sheiks's d-throw, you can probably frame trap easier/have an easier time following up on stage than f-throw/b-throw.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

D-throw is her second worst throw. It allows people to choose which way they pop up, and at low percents all the throws pop them into a relatively similar airspace.

Like take sheik vs pit, if she dthrows pit, he should always DI infront of her to stuff out any followup with his fair, but if you back throw him, you give yourself a guaranteed punish since his only means to contest you is the super slow bair.

And vs characters like Kirby who have giant brick aerials like his bair, it's so counter productive to not f throw. While characters like Marth who are broken and have a BS brain dead spacing tool like fair, f-throw and d-throw put him in a perfect fairings position.

Obv there are some characters that just suck so your choice of throw is irrelevant but yeah, you generally want to throw them in the way that reduces their options.

 

[Tesh]

^ thats why i just use the 7 damage throws and ignore the 5 damage throws. pretty much the same with less damage.

 

[Zankoku]

dthrow is 6 damage. It's one that pops up and lets them drift down, but keeps them relatively low to the stage which allows for interesting threats.

Both side throws deal 7 damage and only follow up during early percents on DI toward, but you can force a lose-lose situation for them by throwing off-stage, where they need to make a decision to DI away from the stage or inward and risk a follow-up as they pop straight up.

uthrow is 5% and leaves Sheik in the longest recovery time, but also gives the opponent the least amount of directional control. I don't really like it, but some do.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

As you probably know, immediate short-hop U-Air autocancels. Given Sheik's ground coverage and great speed on most moves, I was wondering if any thought been given to attempting landing frame traps with short-hop U-Air. I imagine this could be pretty useful against certain characters based on their horizontal aerial speed and falling speed. Have any of you had success or lack thereof with it?

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Between empty SHs and Uair, I've had good success.

 

[Zankoku]

I usually use SH AC uair to frame trap and poke at shields from under a platform.

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

The Japanese Sheiks do it a lot, and it works most of the time.

 

[Ultimate kaos]

Ok, so I can DACUS(not reliably but can still do it), I know how to jab cancel, ftilt lock, edge guarding, shield grabbing. I still find myself struggling to get to competitive level of play. Anything I can do/practice to get better? Anything else I should know about competitive sheik?

 

[C.J.]

Mobility, control, spacing. Those three things are important than everything you listed. And yes, you still need to get better at them since there's not a player in the world that had all of that down perfectly.

 

[Ultimate kaos]

Can somebody explain mobility, control and spacing? Or is there another thread this should go in?

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

mobility is moving, like know how far away you can punish stuff.

spacing is knowing the range of your options against your opponents options.

Control is limiting the opponents options to the ones that your options are superior too.