God **** It! (pardon the pun)

[Johnny Pteran]

Do it, and do it well, my friend.

 

[DarkAura]

Remember that I'm being forced
Having read the Bible in it's entirety, I exactly understand what you're saying.

i read the entire bible through when i was 10 i think, It took me lilke a full month and from that day on i just started to think religion is a hoax.


i have more insulting things to say but for the sake of staying true to my word im not saying them,

 

[TP]

I know this was covered pages ago, but I'd like to clarify the whole "gravity is a law, evolution is only a theory" thing. Scientific laws can only become laws when they have MATHEMATICAL proof. That's part of the definition. Therefore, concepts that aren't based on math can never become more than a theory. THEORY IS THE HIGHEST LEVEL OF CONFIRMATION FOR SUCH CONCEPTS. Examples include Cell Theory and the Theory of the Atom.

Just wanted to clarify.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Why'd you give in? Why didn't you just tell her you were an atheist and you didn't feel it was right for you to go?

I mean she was already angry that you were saying no.

Who the **** is she to question your beliefs?

 

[ook]

I didn't read the whole thread, so sorry if this was said before, but...


Either way, your parents are going to find out you're an athiest.

If you tell your parents you're an atheist straight-up, they won't let you serve.

If you talk about atheism at VBS, your parents will find out, yell at you, and won't let you serve anymore. And you'll probably get in a ****load more trouble.


Seems better just to tell them...



Also, do you really think kids will care about your "arguments?"
They're kids. They go to VBS to play games, sing songs and eat cookies. That's what VBS is.
They're not going to take what you say with any serious thought, lol.

 

[Teran]

And no, you're point is ****, if it wasn't **** we'd be insulting Teran and Straked and SuSa and me all the time

Dude, I'd appreciate it if you didn't constantly refer to me as a troll, because I'm not.

People just disagree with me a lot, and having a different opinion/belief and stating it to people is basically trolling unwittingly.

I don't troll people, they troll themselves and take me for the ride. -__-

 

[Meru.]

No backup plan save moving out of the state will save you once it gets out that you did it. And it will get out:
"Let's say thanks to God before eating."
"But the kid at the school said God doesn't exist!"
And then you are ****ed.

I agree with this. Dude, I'm sorry, but it seems to be a lose-lose situation for you. If you're going to tell the children about atheism, the chance that they'll tell their parents about it, is huge. Remember, they're children. And then you're indeed fcked. I also agree with ook. After your parents find out, you're going to be in a lot of trouble.

Even if you pick your words very carefully, the chance that a child tells their parents and that they'll come after you etc. is really really big. If you don't want any problems, you should just do what the VBS asks you to, but I can understand that it'd be a torture.

I feel sorry for you, but anyway, good luck.

 

[RyuReiatsu]

Why'd you give in? Why didn't you just tell her you were an atheist and you didn't feel it was right for you to go?

I mean she was already angry that you were saying no.

Who the **** is she to question your beliefs?

His mom? :embarrass

On a serious note.
3mmanuel, you've put yourself in a not-so-good situation.
I'd suggest you tell her the truth and see for yourself. I'm by no means religious, 100% atheist... (Not saying it's a good thing though, as nothing from any parties have been proven.)

I'd say Christianity is total brainwashing. But don't you go brainwashing them yourself either. That doesn't make it any better... Or maybe? Actually, I'm just telling you this so you won't get into any trouble. We're all selfish people, let them be.

They're young folks, they'll listen to their parents.
The moment they'll set foot out of the church and ask their parents if what you've said was true. Their parents will say that you're just a liar or some psycho guy. Resulting in your speeches being meaningless and getting scolded by a number of parents.

Don't do it, and tell the truth to your mom.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

And no, you're point is ****, if it wasn't **** we'd be insulting Teran and Straked and SuSa and me all the time. AND THAT WOULD BE NO GOOD AT ALL.

Wow, way to ****ing forget me.

Ryu, I understand she's his mom, but just because she's his mom does NOT mean she can make him believe something.

And if she doesn't respect his beliefs, then screw her.

 

[REL38]

Either way, your parents are going to find out you're an athiest.

If you tell your parents you're an atheist straight-up, they won't let you serve.

If you talk about atheism at VBS, your parents will find out, yell at you, and won't let you serve anymore. And you'll probably get in a ****load more trouble.


Seems better just to tell them...



Also, do you really think kids will care about your "arguments?"
They're kids. They go to VBS to play games, sing songs and eat cookies. That's what VBS is.
They're not going to take what you say with any serious thought, lol.

Agreed. I'm a christian, but it is better that you don't go. It's goes against what you believe in so serving will make it worse when your parents eventually find out you're atheist. If you tell them you're atheist then two things will most likely happen:

1. You'll get yelled at for straying off the "right path" and the drama will create the short term result of you not going to VBS.

2. Your parents will be on your case constantly about this. It might even spread throughout the church, but that depends.

In any case, don't go. If you have to tell them the truth, then so be it. The cat will come out of the bag eventually so why not now?


If you do end up going, don't take it upon yourself to "educate" the kids. You will be found out and end up in an even bigger mess. The parents will probably hate you for spouting "nonsesne" and "lies" into their children's brains and your parents won't be none too happy. And as Ook said, they're kids. They don't really care about all of the spiritual lessons being given. They only care about the fun stuff.
Personally, I don't agree with the aspect of kids "accepting Jesus as Savior" at such a young age, but that's just me. If anything, it gives them something to think about when they're older.

 

[mountain_tiger]

3mmanuel, I have a suggestion. They say you have to spread the bible, right? Well, rather than saying the stuff like 'unlimited forgiveness' etc. etc., how's about telling them the passages where God orders men, women and children to be killed, thrown against rocks, *****, stolen from etc. and where Jesus says that he's here to spread envy and anger. That should tell them that their so-called God is little more than a fairy tale. Technically, you could say that you're not really meant to stop them believing in God, but then their parents shouldn't be indoctrinating them into beliefs that are false. Think about it. If I told a child that what we call 'squares' were called triangles, you'd think I was being cruel, right? It's the same thing basically.

BTW, as you've probably guessed, I'm a very strong atheist. I used to believe in God, but looking back I don't know why I did. God was like my equivalent of an imaginary friend. Of course, if God is real, then I give permission to all the Christians here to laugh at me when I'm in hell.

 

[thanortinzak]

Agreed. I'm a christian, but it is better that you don't go. It's goes against what you believe in so serving will make it worse when your parents eventually find out you're atheist. If you tell them you're atheist then two things will most likely happen:

1. You'll get yelled at for straying off the "right path" and the drama will create the short term result of you not going to VBS.

2. Your parents will be on your case constantly about this. It might even spread throughout the church, but that depends.

In any case, don't go. If you have to tell them the truth, then so be it. The cat will come out of the bag eventually so why not now?


If you do end up going, don't take it upon yourself to "educate" the kids. You will be found out and end up in an even bigger mess. The parents will probably hate you for spouting "nonsesne" and "lies" into their children's brains and your parents won't be none too happy. And as Ook said, they're kids. They don't really care about all of the spiritual lessons being given. They only care about the fun stuff.
Personally, I don't agree with the aspect of kids "accepting Jesus as Savior" at such a young age, but that's just me. If anything, it gives them something to think about when they're older.

I HAVE to go. There's no way around it, because my mom already signed me up, and I've already attended the volunteer meetings she forced me to attend, etc. I CAN'T tell them the truth, because it won't make a darn difference at all! I'll still be forced to attend church two times a week, you know what I mean. It'll only make matters worse by creating tension.

And uhh...I doubt I'll be found out, because it's not like I'm gonna hold up a sign saying "God doesn't exist". Nope. Heck, I doubt I'd even educate more than 10 kids! I'll also be bribing them to secrecy with candy.

And as an extra security measure, I might not even tell them my name.

My plan is foolproof

 

[ook]

I HAVE to go. There's no way around it, because my mom already signed me up, and I've already attended the volunteer meetings she forced me to attend, etc. I CAN'T tell them the truth, because it won't make a darn difference at all! I'll still be forced to attend church two times a week, you know what I mean. It'll only make matters worse by creating tension.

Believe me, if they know you're an athiest, and if they're actually somewhat decent christians, they WILL NOT want you to have any position of serving in the church. They'll take you out.


I remember back when my brother was in VBS. Someone there told him Santa Claus wasn't real. ohhhh did my mom find out about that.
and that's only Santa....


btw, I think it's kinda funny/ironic that your name is "3mmanuel" and you're an atheist. I can't really think of a more christian name than that

 

[thanortinzak]

Believe me, if they know you're an athiest, and if they're actually somewhat decent christians, they WILL NOT want you to have any position of serving in the church. They'll take you out.


I remember back when my brother was in VBS. Someone there told him Santa Claus wasn't real. ohhhh did my mom find out about that.
and that's only Santa....


btw, I think it's kinda funny/ironic that your name is "3mmanuel" and you're an atheist. I can't really think of a more christian name than that

Hehe, my name is Emmanuel because my parents gave me that name lol.

 

[mountain_tiger]

Hehe, my name is Emmanuel because my parents gave me that name lol.

Ouch. Fancy getting owned by your own name. Then again, my name means 'gift from God', so I'm in the same boat...

 

[thanortinzak]

Ouch. Fancy getting owned by your own name. Then again, my name means 'gift from God', so I'm in the same boat...

lol

That's why I have my friends call me "Manny" or "Emanny".

You guys can all call me Manny from now on, okay?

 

[smash brawl player 99021]

Ok...well I'm sort of the same way. I don't really believe in God, yet my parents make me go to church :/ My stepbrothers call me "atheist *******" all the time. It's very annoying so don't feel alone. And presenting both sides of the story is the best/only thing you could really do.

 

[The_Guide]

Don't do it. For the love of god (lol), don't do it. There is VERY little chance that you will not be found out. And why is this?

Because kids have consciences.

If they have been taught that rejecting god is a blasphemy, they will feel guilty for taking part in your discussion. There's no way around that. They will be tormented by guilt of association, and being children, will not be able to puzzle out an appropriate response without help. They will run straight to their parents for advice, and trust me, you WILL have hell to pay. Do you think you can hide from them when you go to church twice a week, as you have said? Their children will point you out instantly, so you have no hope of trying to hide your identity.

Really, you have no way out of this. One way or another, its going to come out that you're an atheist, so you're going to have to think about damage control. Ultimately, telling you're mom will create a smaller ****storm. You have to ask yourself, "do I want to have trouble with my family, or do I want to have that AND an hostile community in my town?".

(I'm agnostic, btw)

No matter what you do, I respect you, man. You have the character to think for yourself, and, if slightly misguided, tried to help innocents follow that same path. You're a good person, a **** good one; no matter what happens, keep that thought in your head.

 

[RyuReiatsu]

3mmanuel, tell them you're not willing to spread 'god's teachings' or whatever it is.
Tell them that you won't do **** because you're atheist and forcing you to serve under a religion that you don't believe in ain't right at all.
Otherwise... Silently suffer and teach those kids real stuffs .

Wow, way to ****ing forget me.

Ryu, I understand she's his mom, but just because she's his mom does NOT mean she can make him believe something.

And if she doesn't respect his beliefs, then screw her.

Bro, that was a joke LOL. I'm not that dumb to claim that because she's his mom, she can do whatever she likes to him. That ain't true one bit.

 

[thanortinzak]

Don't do it. For the love of god (lol), don't do it. There is VERY little chance that you will not be found out. And why is this?

Because kids have consciences.

If they have been taught that rejecting god is a blasphemy, they will feel guilty for taking part in your discussion. There's no way around that. They will be tormented by guilt of association, and being children, will not be able to puzzle out an appropriate response without help. They will run straight to their parents for advice, and trust me, you WILL have hell to pay. Do you think you can hide from them when you go to church twice a week, as you have said? Their children will point you out instantly, so you have no hope of trying to hide your identity.

Really, you have no way out of this. One way or another, its going to come out that you're an atheist, so you're going to have to think about damage control. Ultimately, telling you're mom will create a smaller ****storm. You have to ask yourself, "do I want to have trouble with my family, or do I want to have that AND an hostile community in my town?".

(I'm agnostic, btw)

No matter what you do, I respect you, man. You have the character to think for yourself, and, if slightly misguided, tried to help innocents follow that same path. You're a good person, a **** good one; no matter what happens, keep that thought in your head.

Hey, thanks!


But the children won't point me out instantly. That's not a problem. Why? Because in my church, children and adults have different worship services. The teens have to join the adult services. This means that no child will point me out, as they are in a different worship service

I'm quite safe, although the risk of random detection is a quite scary one. If a kid points me out, I'd just say that I don't know what he/she is talking about, and they're referring to the wrong person. That excuse would actually work because a lot of people in my church look like me (everyone in my church is azn lol. I don't mean to be racist, but it's true, which means that a lot of people look like me). So the chance of detection is extremely low (although still techincally existant).

3mmanuel, tell them you're not willing to spread 'god's teachings' or whatever it is.
Tell them that you won't do **** because you're atheist and forcing you to serve under a religion that you don't believe in ain't right at all.
Otherwise... Silently suffer and teach those kids real stuffs .

I'm gonna silently suffer, but show those kids my opinion. And I'm gonna teach them that it's not bad to question religion at all.

 

[Falconv1.0]

Wow, way to ****ing forget me.

Ryu, I understand she's his mom, but just because she's his mom does NOT mean she can make him believe something.

And if she doesn't respect his beliefs, then screw her.

1.)You're no where my trawling levels.

2.)Yes, he should **** his mom out of revenge, perfect idea.

 

[RyuReiatsu]

Hey, thanks!


But the children won't point me out instantly. That's not a problem. Why? Because in my church, children and adults have different worship services. The teens have to join the adult services. This means that no child will point me out, as they are in a different worship service

I'm quite safe, although the risk of random detection is a quite scary one. If a kid points me out, I'd just say that I don't know what he/she is talking about, and they're referring to the wrong person. That excuse would actually work because a lot of people in my church look like me (everyone in my church is azn lol. I don't mean to be racist, but it's true, which means that a lot of people look like me). So the chance of detection is extremely low (although still techincally existant).



I'm gonna silently suffer, but show those kids my opinion. And I'm gonna teach them that it's not bad to question religion at all.

HOLY ****. You should've pointed that out earlier! YOU'RE ASIAN.
I feel your pain man. . Luckily, my family's buddhist and my close family ain't religious freaks. The rest of them are though.

Teach those little kids the real thing man !

I would've never guessed that an asian guy could be named Emmanuel.

 

[Falconv1.0]

I'm gonna say one more time that he is almost definitely going to get caught and when he does I'm gonna lol hard.

Unless you take the coward's way out and choose not to tell us.

 

[The_Guide]

Is your Mom likely to think of the fact that you were reluctant to do the school thing, in the case that are accused? If so, you've got instasuspicion on your hands.

Personally, I wouldn't count on the kids not being able to tell who you are. You're going to be telling them something that they don't usually hear, which should leave an imprint of you on their minds. Hell, you're even giving them candy .

Its ultimately up to you, but I don't think that anyone else would argue that you have a high chance of being discovered. Do you really want to feel such apprehension every time you go to church. Sounds pretty dreadful, imo.

At least don't forget the warnings that we gave you.

 

[thanortinzak]

HOLY ****. You should've pointed that out earlier! YOU'RE ASIAN.
I feel your pain man. . Luckily, my family's buddhist and my close family ain't religious freaks. The rest of them are though.

Teach those little kids the real thing man !

I would've never guessed that an asian guy could be named Emmanuel.

Hehe, looks like I have a fellow asian here!

Yeah, I know, it's rare to see a asian guy like menamed Emmanuel lol. You can call me Manny though (if you want. Personally, I prefer being called Manny or Emanny, but you don't have to call me that if you don't want to).

Oh, and my family (extended and immediate) is very religious. Half are buddhist, half are christian. And as you can see, my immediate family is Christian.

Is your family buddhist or Christian, Ryu?

 

[Jiggy]

Instead of teaching those kids that there is a god, I have the opportunity to educate those kids and teach them that there is no God! Something good has come out of the bad after all!

So instead of letting them believe what they want to believe, you're going to impose your beliefs on them.

Sounds great. /endsarcasm

You're 14, man. I can tell you that you haven't gone through life enough to even come to a conclusion over the whole God existing thing. Grow up some more, then come to a conclusion.

 

[TP]

So instead of letting them believe what they want to believe, you're going to impose your beliefs on them.

Sounds great. /endsarcasm

It's nothing the kids haven't had to deal with before from their parents. Remember, they are being sent to Bible School.

 

[RyuReiatsu]

As everybody said, you'll most likely get caught.
I wouldn't mind getting caught, having all the tension everytime I go to church and all that kinda stuffs though... But that's just me.

And my family's buddhist lol.

It's nothing the kids haven't had to deal with before from their parents. Remember, they are being sent to Bible School.

^ This.

 

[StealthyGunnar]

Why don't you believe that God exists in the first place?

 

[TP]

Why don't you believe that God exists in the first place?

Inappropriate. The thread will get locked if an actual religious debate starts up. Please don't go there.

 

[M.K]

Although you are entirely able to believe your own beliefs and exercise your right to make your own decisions, it's very immature of you to try and force your beliefs on other people, especially those who are easily impressionable. Also, if one of those children goes home to tell their parents that some teenager tried to convince them that God doesn't exist, you (and the organization) could get into alot of trouble. (though I'm sure you could care less about it, you should realize the consequences of your actions)
To be honest, I agreed with your post all the way up until you decided to try and impose your ideas on the kids. That's immature and rude to those who paid money for something that they believe in. That's like ordering a Big Mac from McDonalds and having the cashier give you a 20 minute rant on the health effects of said burger, then giving you a cup of water instead and saying "Lose weight, fatass".

I'm not a religious person, I hate going to Church, I find the preacher's raspy voice annoying and the God Wafers a tad tasteless. However, I'd like to believe that there IS a God just in case their is life after death somewhere ^.^

 

[:mad:]

Why don't you believe that God exists in the first place?

Is there any evidence that he does?

Is everyone expected to believe it?

 

[Teran]

Also, for everyone going "OMG TELL UR MOM LOL U HAZ 2 B TRU 2 URSELF OLOLOL"

This is real life. This is not Disneyworld. This is not LaLa Land. This is not Fantasia. Some things are better left unsaid. Maybe the more wise approach, something most silly kids don't realise, is to just do whatever the hell your parents want of you as long as it isn't illegal, and then do the whole independence thing when you're free of the household. While you're still reliant on your parents, and they're still legally your guardians, you should just play they game they want you to play.

Also 3mmanuel, just preach the doctrines anyway, you'll learn to find it amusing. If a kid points out a contradiction just go, "Ah! Excellently observed! One of the many mysteries of religion you see!"

Yeah, I've totally gone there.

 

[thanortinzak]

So instead of letting them believe what they want to believe, you're going to impose your beliefs on them.

Sounds great. /endsarcasm

You're 14, man. I can tell you that you haven't gone through life enough to even come to a conclusion over the whole God existing thing. Grow up some more, then come to a conclusion.

Read the OP, and you'll find out that I'm not imposing my beliefs on anyone

And also, please stay away from religious debates.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Also, for everyone going "OMG TELL UR MOM LOL U HAZ 2 B TRU 2 URSELF OLOLOL"

This is real life. This is not Disneyworld. This is not LaLa Land. This is not Fantasia. Some things are better left unsaid. Maybe the more wise approach, something most silly kids don't realise, is to just do whatever the hell your parents want of you as long as it isn't illegal, and then do the whole independence thing when you're free of the household. While you're still reliant on your parents, and they're still legally your guardians, you should just play they game they want you to play.

You'll most likely **** any point I make, but I don't care.

Yes this is real life. But does this mean that someone should be forced to believe in something by their parents? I mean it's one thing to just go along with what they say, but beliefs are something different.

If his mom doesn't respect his beliefs, than she's not a good mother (not trying to knock your mom, just saying). Parents should give their children the right to think what they want, even if it differs from what the parents themselves believe.

 

[Meru.]

Emanny sounds like... E-mail. I'd drop it. Manny is a good name though. IMO of course.

EDIT: Oh, I didnt see there was an 8th page o.o Sorry for interrupting discussion and stuff.

 

[Teran]

You'll most likely **** any point I make, but I don't care.

Yes this is real life. But does this mean that someone should be forced to believe in something by their parents? I mean it's one thing to just go along with what they say, but beliefs are something different.

If his mom doesn't respect his beliefs, than she's not a good mother (not trying to knock your mom, just saying). Parents should give their children the right to think what they want, even if it differs from what the parents themselves believe.

I don't think you get what I'm saying. First of all, I was never talking from a moral Fairy Godmother let's all hold hands and say grace point of view.
I'm talking from a make life easier for yourself point of view.

Sure it's stupid that a mother should act like that. Sure it's not the best way of bringing up a child, but that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that since the child in question is basically completely at his mother's mercy when it comes to legal stuff, it would be far more wise to just shut up, swallow his pride, and go along with everything. You have your entire adulthood to stick your middle finger up at your mother, but for the meantime, it's better to just do as she says.

Also, rights don't exist. They're a manmade thing, you know, like Communism and Santa Claus.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

I don't think you get what I'm saying. First of all, I was never talking from a moral Fairy Godmother let's all hold hands and say grace point of view.
I'm talking from a make life easier for yourself point of view.

Sure it's stupid that a mother should act like that. Sure it's not the best way of bringing up a child, but that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that since the child in question is basically completely at his mother's mercy when it comes to legal stuff, it would be far more wise to just shut up, swallow his pride, and go along with everything. You have your entire adulthood to stick your middle finger up at your mother, but for the meantime, it's better to just do as she says.

Also, rights don't exist. They're a manmade thing, you know, like Communism and Santa Claus.

Ah, OK, yeah I misunderstood you.

Sidewalks are man-made, but they exist

Also, Ca5h, you're an idiot.

"Why don't you believe in god in the first place"

Uh, maybe because he like to use logic and not accept random "facts" presented to him?

 

[Teran]

Sidewalks are man-made, but they exist

I think you know what I meant, don't be silly.
I meant a made up concept you know?

Sort of how you would describe God as an atheist. I guess you don't like that same sort of mockery towards your rights. Ah, Americans love their rights.

 

[Falconv1.0]

There's a difference between a disbelief in God and a disbelief in religion. Religion is bull****, you cant say God is bull****. There's a certain point where it's just beliefs, rather than just being an idiot, and if you cross the line from insulting religion to insulting a belie, I will bring out my full trawlin' wrath.

Just sayin~