Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[SSGuy]

Alright, let's just get back to Geno. No more theorist or leaker talk.

So one thing I have been seeing mentioned a few times would be the event of Geno not having a spirit board. But wouldn't it be possible for it to include other spirits from Super Mario RPG? Something like other characters that aren't Geno or Mallow? They can still be included just for the sake of being included as well but I think SMRPG alone can provide a ton of spirits or even ones from other Square/Mario RPG games.

Not all of Terry's spirits are exclusive to Fatal Fury or King of Fighters I don't think.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Weren’t you pushing the idea of a triple reveal in January just a few weeks ago?

Because being wrong on the internet isn't a death sentence and is simply a fact of life. This is also why I go with wild ass theories because I don't care about "muh e-cred" as long as people don't use it as a excuse to harass me or the Geno fanbase (cue montage with Frolic meme). As pointed out many times, if people can "forgive" Verge for Star Fox Grand Prix and Wario Ware Switch at E3, Papagenos for Grinch Leak and Arle, GameXplain for existing, Brew/Shifty for Ryu in 2019, and Sabi for the VGAs and Viewtiful Joe 3, this should honestly be a non-issue.

 

[Dynamic Worlok]

Bayonetta was a marketing ploy for Bayonetta 2, Corrin for Fire Emblem Fates, Hero for Dragon Quest 11S..
It's not that hard to believe that they added Byleth for marketing purposes too. Heck, they announced Persona 5 Golden and Persona 5 Scramble pretty close to Jokers reveal.


Agreed

I mean, I can believe shill picks. I just didn't think they'd go back to the fire emblem well after the corrin backlash (discounting chrom since his game was already out when they decided on him, and he had leftover fan support from smash 4. Also his status as an echo)

 

[Turtlar]

One thing I would love to see drop with Geno, is have a premium Mii costume of Black Mage with a soundtrack from FF1. Super unlikely, but it would be awesome if it did.

 

[TriggerX]

Maybe it was speculation, but a user said that he was treating it as a pipe dream.

That post certainly implies he wasn’t.

Ness not gonna lie to you, you come into this thread to basically obsess over Fatmanonice. Cant say I understand why.

I appreciate views that are both for and against Geno's chances because I believe it helps us get a realistic grasp on the chances of the character. Although its rare, sometimes you do make some decent points, however more often than not your posts don't further the discussion. Youre too focused on trying to catch Fatman slipping up.

 

[nessdeltarune00]

Ness not gonna lie to you, you come into this thread to basically obsess over Fatmanonice. Cant say I understand why.

I appreciate views that are both for and against Geno's chances because I believe it helps us get a realistic grasp on the chances of the character. Although its rare, sometimes you do make some decent points, however more often than not your posts don't further the discussion. Youre too focused on trying to catch Fatman slipping up.

Read my previous posts.

Someone fact checked my claim and I admitted that I was wrong for it.

 

[pinshadow]

Jesus Christ its only been 2 weeks since Byleth and we've already exhausted pretty much all of the exact same arguments we've been having for months multiple times. The Smash community will tear itself limb from limb if we have to wait until E3, please Nintendo.

 

[Firox]

Ness not gonna lie to you, you come into this thread to basically obsess over Fatmanonice. Cant say I understand why.

I appreciate views that are both for and against Geno's chances because I believe it helps us get a realistic grasp on the chances of the character. Although its rare, sometimes you do make some decent points, however more often than not your posts don't further the discussion. Youre too focused on trying to catch Fatman slipping up.

It really does feel like a personal vendetta against Fatman doesn't it? I just can't decide if they honestly feel like they're saving us from the "Great evil Beguiler" or if they simply have no greater purpose in life but to lock horns with random people on the internet for their own gratification.

 

[KCCHIEFS27]

N NIckynickreviews Posed an interesting question on my profile. He was able to find the evidence I was talking about that Banjo was decided and negotiated around E3 2018 and asked, since Crash was first heard by insiders around E3 2019, what were the odds of Crash being an E3 2020 reveal and then I like... Oh... That actually would make a lot of sense...

Just to recap, my character predictions are Waluigi, Geno, Lloyd, Dante, Crash, and Master Chief but perhaps not in that order. My thoughts were that Geno and Lloyd would be this year's E3 reveals but... What if it's Geno and Crash? Both have been heavily wanted since even before Melee so them appearing in the 2020 E3 Direct would make a ton of sense. No offense to Lloyd but Crash is definitely more worthy of E3. Lloyd could be saved for the fall Direct or even a special 25th anniversary Tales presentation. Dante and Master Chief would both be extremely appropriate for a VGA reveal. In makes sense in my head and I wanted to see what you all thought.

This would make a lot of sense looking at past precedent. Whereas Geno and Lloyd are both well loved and demanded within the smash community, swapping Crash in gives it that patented “Nintendo E3 bonanza” feeling that Banjo gave everyone

 

[Dynamic Worlok]

Read my previous posts.

Someone fact checked my claim and I admitted that I was wrong for it.

I mean, that doesn't really address the issue presented. Kudos to you for admitting fault, but the actual first thing you did in this thread was go right back up trying to pick apart fatman whilst contributing nothing meaningful. Something you appear to have gained a reputation for.

 

[MattX20]

I'm still confident we will get a character before E3. The first general direct of the year isn't far off, and Geno has a decent chance of potentially being the one revealed if there's a big SNES dump

 

[Megadoomer]

No one has ever used this as an argument for Spirits deconfirming. Find me one example of “GENO CANT BE IN BECAUSE THE SPIRIT HAS HIS NAME ALREADY!”. The fact that we have two Roys already playable should pretty much give away that this was never an entry barrier.

This doesn’t change the fact that

1. All Vol 1 characters lacked a base Spirit.
2. All Vol 1 characters were completely MIA in any capacity before their reveal, including Byleth who conveniently didn’t get a Spirit event.
3. Taking this into account, Vol 2 has been confirmed to have the same content as Vol 1 (Spirit board, Music, Stage)
4. All of the newcomer picks spanning to 4 have been either third party or shill picks. Those have been the main options to have been missing Spirits.

This really doesn’t change as much as you think it does.

There's nothing that conclusively proves that spirits do or do not confirm that a character won't be added as DLC. Out of the current DLC characters...

-Piranha Plant has been strongly implied to have been planned as part of the base game, or at least developed around the same time. (only DLC character with a Palutena's Guidance; only DLC character whose amiibo was released with the amiibos of the base game cast) At the very least, those are two rather large coincidences.

-four of the five Fighters Pass characters were third party characters whose franchises had no involvement in the base game - spirits wouldn't be an issue with their inclusion to begin with, since they wouldn't have been able to get spirits in the first place. (and two, maybe three depending on how you count Atlus, of the companies weren't previously involved in Smash)

-Byleth's game hadn't been released anywhere when Smash Ultimate came out - all we had was the game's name and a bit of video footage by December 2018.

Due to that, I'm not sure how meaningful your first two points are when five of the six DLC characters couldn't get spirits in the base game (or appear in the base game) to begin with. (the only one that could is Piranha Plant, and everything seems to point to it being developed alongside the main game)

I can't really see the development team going "well, this character is quite popular... but there's a single PNG image of them in the game, so we can't include them as DLC." Spirits seem like they'd take almost no effort to add - trophies would be more work-intensive (since they'd require 3D models, often new ones, and descriptions as opposed to just pre-made concept art), and we already saw the Smash developers include characters as DLC despite them having trophies in the base game. (Mewtwo and Lucas)

At the very least, there's nothing significant to indicate how spirits impact a character's chances at being DLC at the moment, either for or against. (the fact that spirits can be renamed through updates might help, but it's not a strong point)

 

[JarBear]

I'm still confident we will get a character before E3. The first general direct of the year isn't far off, and Geno has a decent chance of potentially being the one revealed if there's a big SNES dump

I am hoping for a General Direct soon. We still have the Gamestop SKUs, SNES controller pushed to February release, Pokemon Home in February, etc. So even though there are things that have been announced, there is more they can both announced or even show more details about. Then there can be a Smash reveal. Doesn't even have to be gameplay ... heck it could just be a T pose for all I care. But if my suspicions are correct, I think it will be pretty much full fledged.

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

I am hoping for a General Direct soon. We still have the Gamestop SKUs, SNES controller pushed to February release, Pokemon Home in February, etc. So even though there are things that have been announced, there is more they can both announced or even show more details about. Then there can be a Smash reveal. Doesn't even have to be gameplay ... heck it could just be a T pose for all I care. But if my suspicions are correct, I think it will be pretty much full fledged.

The return of the Geno T-Pose

 

[Fatmanonice]

This would make a lot of sense looking at past precedent. Whereas Geno and Lloyd are both well loved and demanded within the smash community, swapping Crash in gives it that patented “Nintendo E3 bonanza” feeling that Banjo gave everyone

And here's the thing too, it makes a lot of sense on multiple fronts:

-All the major rumors that have come for Nintendo's 2020 since August have been insane: Paper Mario reboot, 2D Metroid, the revival of multiple dead franchises, Wii U ports people have been begging for years for, a new Donkey Kong, BoTW 2 possibly having a miraculous 2020 release, Fire Emblem 6/7 Remaster, etc. Holy crap... Less than half of these could be true and Nintendo fans would still lose their minds. Crash and Geno at E3 would just be more rumors of Nintendo pulling out all the stops this year.

-Like I said earlier, Geno and Crash are basically the last "old" never evers.

https://smashboards.com/threads/i-think-this-might-be-interesting-to-look-at-melee-1999-poll.81891/

Again, official documentation from 1999 from Nintendo itself that people have wanted these two for over 20 years. Having them finally coming not only together but at E3 2020 makes a ton of sense.

-No one argues that Crash is an E3 caliber reveal. My original thoughts were that Crash would be 2021 but why would they drag things out this long? Plant through Byleth was almost exactly a year to a T. Mewtwo through Bayo in Smash 4 was technically shorter. There's not much reason to justify Nintendo dragging out another 6 characters for 2 years. Development takes money and paying people for asses in chairs. From a business perspective, you wouldn't want to drag this out. Why? Because it would cost more money. You could cut the team but you'd still be paying for the boring practical things like electricity and water usage. The team could literally be liquidated to Sakurai himself but that's comically inefficient and, again, you'd still have to pay for things like utilities.

Beyond this, E3 2020 being the last "hurrah" for Ultimate makes sense. Smash is a crowd stealer and Nintendo's painfully aware of this. When Smash is on the table, it's hard for people to care about anything else aside from maybe Mario, Pokemon, and Zelda. Smash 4 had 3 E3s and then bowed out so Ultimate having 3 E3s would follow precedent. We all agree that it would be stupidly hard to top Crash, just like Banjo. On my own list, everybody else, including Geno, is popular but kind of controversial. Dante and Master Chief are popular but not everyone is exactly thrilled with the idea (I want Phoenix Wright, personally). Same with Lloyd (aNiMe SwOrDsMaN) and Waluigi (a troll character incarnate). Crash is one of the few big ticket that would overwhelmingly positive response and why he would be ideal for an E3.

So all this together makes for a lot of reasons. Until solid evidence topples, I'm probably going to stick because, like I said, I've never been super invested in the order anyways aside from Geno being 7 and 77. Not to say I'm permanently locked but Waluigi - Geno -Crash - Lloyd - Dante - Master Chief is looking pretty solid to me right now. Waluigi in the next Direct, Geno and Crash at E3, Lloyd the fall Direct, and Dante and Master Chief at the 2020 VGAs feels like a pretty groovy set up.

 

[Icewolff92]

I mean, I can believe shill picks. I just didn't think they'd go back to the fire emblem well after the corrin backlash (discounting chrom since his game was already out when they decided on him, and he had leftover fan support from smash 4. Also his status as an echo)

It¨s one thing to think that they won¨t do another Fire Emblem character (which I can understand) and another thing to not see the writing on the wall which in this cause is that Byleth was simply a marketing tool (and this comes from someone that loves in inclusion of Byleth to the point that I¨m thinking about having him as one of my mains)

 

[nessdeltarune00]

I am hoping for a General Direct soon. We still have the Gamestop SKUs, SNES controller pushed to February release, Pokemon Home in February, etc. So even though there are things that have been announced, there is more they can both announced or even show more details about. Then there can be a Smash reveal. Doesn't even have to be gameplay ... heck it could just be a T pose for all I care. But if my suspicions are correct, I think it will be pretty much full fledged.

Don’t worry, you won’t have to wait much longer.

 

[Sestetz]

If you had your say, pick 12 tracks with 3 to remix from Mario Spinoff games that you think Geno would use! Super Mario RPG, Mario + Luigi, Paper Mario, etc are all fair game. Hopefully this topic hasn't been reuploaded a million times already lol

And here's the thing too, it makes a lot of sense on multiple fronts:

-All the major rumors that have come for Nintendo's 2020 since August have been insane: Paper Mario reboot, 2D Metroid, the revival of multiple dead franchises, Wii U ports people have been begging for years for, a new Donkey Kong, BoTW 2 possibly having a miraculous 2020 release, Fire Emblem 6/7 Remaster, etc. Holy crap... Less than half of these could be true and Nintendo fans would still lose their minds. Crash and Geno at E3 would just be more rumors of Nintendo pulling out all the stops this year.

-Like I said earlier, Geno and Crash are basically the last "old" never evers.

https://smashboards.com/threads/i-think-this-might-be-interesting-to-look-at-melee-1999-poll.81891/

Again, official documentation from 1999 from Nintendo itself that people have wanted these two for over 20 years. Having them finally coming not only together but at E3 2020 makes a ton of sense.

-No one argues that Crash is an E3 caliber reveal. My original thoughts were that Crash would be 2021 but why would they drag things out this long? Plant through Byleth was almost exactly a year to a T. Mewtwo through Bayo in Smash 4 was technically shorter. There's not much reason to justify Nintendo dragging out another 6 characters for 2 years. Development takes money and paying people for asses in chairs. From a business perspective, you wouldn't want to drag this out. Why? Because it would cost more money. You could cut the team but you'd still be paying for the boring practical things like electricity and water usage. The team could literally be liquidated to Sakurai himself but that's comically inefficient and, again, you'd still have to pay for things like utilities.

I think that 2021 was just an example date, because they didn't have the exact plans for each fighter set in stone yet. But I may be wrong, we could get extended til 2021 which is kinda wild to think

 

[nessdeltarune00]

And here's the thing too, it makes a lot of sense on multiple fronts:

-All the major rumors that have come for Nintendo's 2020 since August have been insane: Paper Mario reboot, 2D Metroid, the revival of multiple dead franchises, Wii U ports people have been begging for years for, a new Donkey Kong, BoTW 2 possibly having a miraculous 2020 release, Fire Emblem 6/7 Remaster, etc. Holy crap... Less than half of these could be true and Nintendo fans would still lose their minds. Crash and Geno at E3 would just be more rumors of Nintendo pulling out all the stops this year.

-Like I said earlier, Geno and Crash are basically the last "old" never evers.

https://smashboards.com/threads/i-think-this-might-be-interesting-to-look-at-melee-1999-poll.81891/

Again, official documentation from 1999 from Nintendo itself that people have wanted these two for over 20 years. Having them finally coming not only together but at E3 2020 makes a ton of sense.

-No one argues that Crash is an E3 caliber reveal. My original thoughts were that Crash would be 2021 but why would they drag things out this long? Plant through Byleth was almost exactly a year to a T. Mewtwo through Bayo in Smash 4 was technically shorter. There's not much reason to justify Nintendo dragging out another 6 characters for 2 years. Development takes money and paying people for asses in chairs. From a business perspective, you wouldn't want to drag this out. Why? Because it would cost more money. You could cut the team but you'd still be paying for the boring practical things like electricity and water usage. The team could literally be liquidated to Sakurai himself but that's comically inefficient and, again, you'd still have to pay for things like utilities.

Beyond this, E3 2020 being the last "hurrah" for Ultimate makes sense. Smash is a crowd stealer and Nintendo's painfully aware of this. When Smash is on the table, it's hard for people to care about anything else aside from maybe Mario, Pokemon, and Zelda. Smash 4 had 3 E3s and then bowed out so Ultimate having 3 E3s would follow precedent. We all agree that it would be stupidly hard to top Crash, just like Banjo. On my own list, everybody else, including Geno, is popular but kind of controversial. Dante and Master Chief are popular but not everyone is exactly thrilled with the idea (I want Phoenix Wright, personally). Same with Lloyd (aNiMe SwOrDsMaN) and Waluigi (a troll character incarnate). Crash is one of the few big ticket that would overwhelmingly positive response and why he would be ideal for an E3.

So all this together makes for a lot of reasons. Until solid evidence topples, I'm probably going to stick because, like I said, I've never been super invested in the order anyways aside from Geno being 7 and 77. Not to say I'm permanently locked but Waluigi - Geno -Crash - Lloyd - Dante - Master Chief is looking pretty solid to me right now. Waluigi in the next Direct, Geno and Crash at E3, Lloyd the fall Direct, and Dante and Master Chief at the 2020 VGAs feels like a pretty groovy set up.

I’ve only heard a portion of the rumors that you are claiming.

I am highly doubtful on the rest of these. Especially if its coming from Paragon.

EDIT: Nevermind, some of this has already been made public by insiders already. Its only less than half of these rumors that I’m hearing for the first time.

 

[Dynamic Worlok]

It¨s one thing to think that they won¨t do another Fire Emblem character (which I can understand) and another thing to not see the writing on the wall which in this cause is that Byleth was simply a marketing tool (and this comes from someone that loves in inclusion of Byleth to the point that I¨m thinking about having him as one of my mains)

I dunno, maybe I had too much faith that Nintendo would ****ing stop it

 

[Sestetz]

I dunno, maybe I had too much faith that Nintendo would ****ing stop it

Another Fire Emblem character is pretty much a 1% chance in my mind. I mean, try and even come up with a Fire Emblem character they haven't added this isn't already an assist that they could even add. Byelth is it, or I will delete my account lmao

 

[Funktastic]

Another Fire Emblem character is pretty much a 1% chance in my mind. I mean, try and even come up with a Fire Emblem character they haven't added this isn't already an assist that they could even add. Byelth is it, or I will delete my account lmao

Hector My favorite but there's no way he's ever getting in and frankly doesn't need to be.

I AM expecting a pokemon rep for wave 2 though.

 

[CannonStreak]

Don’t worry, you won’t have to wait much longer.

And how do you know? Zippo, perhaps?

 

[mynameisBlade]

For as much as I want Geno and hate that we got another Fire Emblem character.. I still wouldn't mind Lyn.. She is the ONLY one I wouldn't mind. That's treading into AT upgrade territory though, which I think would go to Waluigi, Isaac, or Skull Kid first. Seeing Isaac bite the dust was a huge hit to Smash morale. You could see it in the reveals.. Felt bad.

 

[pinshadow]

And how do you know? Zippo, perhaps?

I'd trust him on this one. That being said I don't really know where he's getting the whole "I haven't heard these rumors" thing from and I find it a tad annoying that he's coming into the thread to go after Fatman for being wrong but also saying "I actually know stuff guys I swear".

 

[CannonStreak]

I'd trust him on this one. That being said I don't really know where he's getting the whole "I haven't heard these rumors" thing from and I find it a tad annoying that he's coming into the thread to go after Fatman for being wrong but also saying "I actually know stuff guys I swear".

Oh, I am not doubting him. I am just wondering why I should trust him, as in, does he have some sort of source?

 

[nessdeltarune00]

I'd trust him on this one. That being said I don't really know where he's getting the whole "I haven't heard these rumors" thing from and I find it a tad annoying that he's coming into the thread to go after Fatman for being wrong but also saying "I actually know stuff guys I swear".

I already corrected the post.

Only part of it I haven’t heard, much of what he said has been made public already.

And I admitted to being wrong about him treating the triple reveal as more than speculation. The L has been taken, so to speak.

 

[pinshadow]

I already corrected the post.

Only part of it I haven’t heard, much of what he said has been made public already.

And I admitted to being wrong about him treating the triple reveal as more than speculation. The L has been taken, so to speak.

Was more talking generally but fair enough. Not trying to antagonize you anyway, lets just see how the next couple weeks play out.

 

[MisterMike]

I wonder if this means anything for a future fighter
Potential Remote Play on Switch? What is going on?
http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20..._they_want_remote_play_on_the_nintendo_switch

I don't think this means anything for Smash, I think Sony is just seeing if they should do what Microsoft is doing and allow PS4 owners to play Minecraft with Joyconboys, which they should've done to begin with, really.

No one has ever used this as an argument for Spirits deconfirming. Find me one example of “GENO CANT BE IN BECAUSE THE SPIRIT HAS HIS NAME ALREADY!”. The fact that we have two Roys already playable should pretty much give away that this was never an entry barrier.

This doesn’t change the fact that

1. All Vol 1 characters lacked a base Spirit.
2. All Vol 1 characters were completely MIA in any capacity before their reveal, including Byleth who conveniently didn’t get a Spirit event.
3. Taking this into account, Vol 2 has been confirmed to have the same content as Vol 1 (Spirit board, Music, Stage)
4. All of the newcomer picks spanning to 4 have been either third party or shill picks. Those have been the main options to have been missing Spirits.

This really doesn’t change as much as you think it does.

The reason this is so significant is because it means that, if dev team are perfectly willing change something as minor as a Spirit's name, then Spirits aren't as definitive as some people seem to think they are. So if the dev team wants to include Shantae as a fighter, then they'll do it, Spirit be damned. They can rename the old Spirit and add clarification for this new Spirit. Basically, Spirits don't disconfirm characters.

Guys, remember the ignore button~~~

The ignore button is for little babies who are young.

The return of the Geno T-Pose

You joke about that, but...

 

[Polarthief]

SNES controller pushed to February release

I just want to point out that the controller was available for quite a few hours yesterday before being sold out, the thing still saying "January" before finally being changed to February.

 

[Sestetz]

I don't think a fighter already having a spirit matters, it's just if they have enough content to fill up a spirit board, have a stage, bring in enough music, and STILL have enough fan demand or interest from Nintendo to get in. There's a lot of factors, but I don't think previously having a spirit or having a trophy in the prior game matters. But then again this is all assumptions so nothing really matters lol

 

[Spatulo]

Alright, let's just get back to Geno. No more theorist or leaker talk.

So one thing I have been seeing mentioned a few times would be the event of Geno not having a spirit board. But wouldn't it be possible for it to include other spirits from Super Mario RPG? Something like other characters that aren't Geno or Mallow? They can still be included just for the sake of being included as well but I think SMRPG alone can provide a ton of spirits or even ones from other Square/Mario RPG games.

Not all of Terry's spirits are exclusive to Fatal Fury or King of Fighters I don't think.

That’s true Terry has a couple SNK spirits that are of characters who have been in KOF, but the spirits are of their artwork from their original games.

Maybe a Crono Spirit?

 

[Fatmanonice]

People not hearing the same rumors is not at all unusual. After all, we're all getting our info from different sources. This is why cross checking is important. This is why my ears perk up when people are putting a lot of weight to the Paper Mario rumors, for example. I personally never heard them until Markomaro in November but what I had heard in probably October or so from the NoA ambassador is that not only did Nintendo nuke a lot of 3DS projects and was planning on bringing the most notable ones to Switch, but it was also planning on remastering some of the most successful 3DS games for the Switch too. This is why I'm like "wow, this is probably right" because this fits this perfectly. Paper Mario being a nuked 3DS project makes a ton of sense. Same with a 2D Metroid. Same with Fire Emblem 6/7. Again, this is why I try to stress collaboration not competition with this stuff. We definitely get a better picture of things if we work together instead of trying to be "the Best ™" because who ****in' cares when knowing this stuff isn't exactly a skill and a lot of it is honestly just knowing the right people.

 

[Sestetz]

People not hearing the same rumors is not at all unusual. After all, we're all getting our info from different sources. This is why cross checking is important. This is why my ears perk up when people are putting a lot of weight to the Paper Mario rumors, for example. I personally never heard them until Markomaro in November but what I had heard in probably October or so from the NoA ambassador is that not only did Nintendo nuke a lot of 3DS projects and was planning on bringing the most notable ones to Switch, but it was also planning on remastering some of the most successful 3DS games for the Switch too. This is why I'm like "wow, this is probably right" because this fits this perfectly. Paper Mario being a nuked 3DS project makes a ton of sense. Same with a 2D Metroid. Same with Fire Emblem 6/7. Again, this is why I try to stress collaboration not competition with this stuff. We definitely get a better picture of things if we work together instead of trying to be "the Best ™" because who ****in' cares when knowing this stuff isn't exactly a skill and a lot of it is honestly just knowing the right people.

Yeah knowing who you can trust for reliable info is one of the most important things. Leaks are built off of bait, so having your own constitution and looking more into things if definitley better if you don't want to leave yourself disappointed with the results! Maybe you'd be better off just choosing to believe zero leaks and getting surprised by any character reveal

 

[Kremling Kommander]

And here's the thing too, it makes a lot of sense on multiple fronts:

-All the major rumors that have come for Nintendo's 2020 since August have been insane: Paper Mario reboot, 2D Metroid, the revival of multiple dead franchises, Wii U ports people have been begging for years for, a new Donkey Kong, BoTW 2 possibly having a miraculous 2020 release, Fire Emblem 6/7 Remaster, etc. Holy crap... Less than half of these could be true and Nintendo fans would still lose their minds. Crash and Geno at E3 would just be more rumors of Nintendo pulling out all the stops this year.

-Like I said earlier, Geno and Crash are basically the last "old" never evers.

https://smashboards.com/threads/i-think-this-might-be-interesting-to-look-at-melee-1999-poll.81891/

Again, official documentation from 1999 from Nintendo itself that people have wanted these two for over 20 years. Having them finally coming not only together but at E3 2020 makes a ton of sense.

-No one argues that Crash is an E3 caliber reveal. My original thoughts were that Crash would be 2021 but why would they drag things out this long? Plant through Byleth was almost exactly a year to a T. Mewtwo through Bayo in Smash 4 was technically shorter. There's not much reason to justify Nintendo dragging out another 6 characters for 2 years. Development takes money and paying people for asses in chairs. From a business perspective, you wouldn't want to drag this out. Why? Because it would cost more money. You could cut the team but you'd still be paying for the boring practical things like electricity and water usage. The team could literally be liquidated to Sakurai himself but that's comically inefficient and, again, you'd still have to pay for things like utilities.

Beyond this, E3 2020 being the last "hurrah" for Ultimate makes sense. Smash is a crowd stealer and Nintendo's painfully aware of this. When Smash is on the table, it's hard for people to care about anything else aside from maybe Mario, Pokemon, and Zelda. Smash 4 had 3 E3s and then bowed out so Ultimate having 3 E3s would follow precedent. We all agree that it would be stupidly hard to top Crash, just like Banjo. On my own list, everybody else, including Geno, is popular but kind of controversial. Dante and Master Chief are popular but not everyone is exactly thrilled with the idea (I want Phoenix Wright, personally). Same with Lloyd (aNiMe SwOrDsMaN) and Waluigi (a troll character incarnate). Crash is one of the few big ticket that would overwhelmingly positive response and why he would be ideal for an E3.

So all this together makes for a lot of reasons. Until solid evidence topples, I'm probably going to stick because, like I said, I've never been super invested in the order anyways aside from Geno being 7 and 77. Not to say I'm permanently locked but Waluigi - Geno -Crash - Lloyd - Dante - Master Chief is looking pretty solid to me right now. Waluigi in the next Direct, Geno and Crash at E3, Lloyd the fall Direct, and Dante and Master Chief at the 2020 VGAs feels like a pretty groovy set up.

Wait, a new Donkey Kong?! When was this mentioned/heard?

 

[Datboigeno]

I think everyone here should go off I guess...

Go off and play Super Mario RPG on the SNES Classic that is! It’s a good game with interesting characters and funny writing

 

[Fatmanonice]

Oh yeah, totally forgot... Sorry N NIckynickreviews . This is the article they shared with me that confirms what I had heard from some of my insider friends that Banjo was started at E3 2018:

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20..._super_smash_bros_ultimates_banjo-kazooie_dlc

Again, it definitely puts things in perspective. "Mii costume guy's" middle man hearing SMRPG costumes and Crash from two different sources and passing this onto Papagenos last July may have not been a weird coincidence.

 

[NIckynickreviews]

Oh yeah, totally forgot... Sorry N NIckynickreviews . This is the article they shared with me that confirms what I had heard from some of my insider friends that Banjo was started at E3 2018:

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20..._super_smash_bros_ultimates_banjo-kazooie_dlc

Again, it definitely puts things in perspective. "Mii costume guy's" middle man hearing SMRPG costumes and Crash from two different sources and passing this onto Papagenos last July may have not been a weird coincidence.

The article gives some interesting incite on how these negotiations first start up. I wonder how the other companies got into commincation with Nintendo's teams when it comes to these deals

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

I need a leak of the direct date tbh. Need somthing to look forward too, a bright spot in this drought lmao.

 

[Polarthief]

don't think a fighter already having a spirit matters, it's just if they have enough content to fill up a spirit board, have a stage, bring in enough music, and STILL have enough fan demand or interest from Nintendo to get in.

- Definitely has the music. I had a hard time picking out 10-15 tracks because THEY'RE ALL SO GOOD, but I did make a list like a week ago before the thread got temp locked.
- Stage there isn't one immediately obvious, but you can make it sorta like DQ's stage where you look at a bunch of stuff, or they could just make it Bowyer's Stump Arena area in the Forest Maze. Sakurai could easily make something.
- Spirits? Take your pick. Mario, Peach, and Bowser (specifically SMRPG spirits), then a ton of secondary characters like Frogfucius, Jonathan Jones, Gaz, Chancellor Toad, "Grandma" Toad, "Toad" himself. How about some villains? Smithy (2 forms!), Axem Rangers/Blade, Mack, Bowyer, Yaridovich, Croco, Punchinello, Booster, THE CAKE, THE DREADED CAKE! Tons and tons of spirits that could easily be pulled out. Hell you can even use special Samus and Link spirits!
- Finally the demand, which I do think is there. Geno's also a character backed by SAKURAI HIMSELF. The fact that his Mii costume also dodged the entire base game and FP1 is a massive boon to him, too.