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Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

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Penguinbowler

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Piranha Plant is literally a tumor on a really solid character select screen. If cuts have to be made for Smash 6, that pos is at the front of the line.

If your all time most wanted or favorite character on the list was Plant, then you without a doubt have a single digit iq

I also cannot forget to mention the fact that Plant gave all Sora fanboys ammunition against anyone who wanted Geno.
Saying a character is **** without giving a real solid reason why is kinda just...petty? I don't know the word to describe it, though you have my sympathies if sora fans were harassing you guys over it.
 

StormC

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Piranha Plant is literally a tumor on a really solid character select screen. If cuts have to be made for Smash 6, that pos is at the front of the line.

If your all time most wanted or favorite character on the list was Plant, then you without a doubt have a single digit iq

I also cannot forget to mention the fact that Plant gave all Sora fanboys ammunition against anyone who wanted Geno.
You take a $60 toy where Mario beats up Pikachu way too seriously.
 

SSGuy

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Saying a character is **** without giving a real solid reason why is kinda just...petty? I don't know the word to describe it, though you have my sympathies if sora fans were harassing you guys over it.
Partly true.

My reasoning for despising Plant comes from the fact that I never felt more blue balled in my life from this choice. Like Sakurai decided to tell us to go to hell.

Sora fans are just overall real ****. For some reason they hate Geno the most when it comes to Smash speculation. For literally no reason. I've been dealing with their toxicity since Smash 4 but they often just victimize themselves to save face.

You take a $60 toy where Mario beats up Pikachu way too seriously.
I don't see where I am pushing my feelings for the game over the limit. I normally just say how I feel and then that becomes the end of it. I normally do not go around harassing people irl about Plant. But I do believe my feelings towards him are fair and justified.

To say I take a video game too seriously is ridiculous since I feel like what say about his character choice is valid. It rubbed me the wrong way after months of speculation and waiting.
 
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Fatmanonice

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I said Banjo was a combo of a corporate and fan pick. Like I said, I know it's very nuanced and I'm not trying to be totally reductive in it. Yes, there's no such thing as a 100% fan pick and added solely because of that. Maybe my argument came off as too literal because I'm not really hard disagreeing with any retorts because we're kind of just adding more definition to what we're talking about.
 

EarlTamm

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Partly true.

My reasoning for despising Plant comes from the fact that I never felt more blue balled in my life from this choice. Like Sakurai decided to tell us to go to hell.

Sora fans are just overall real ****. For some reason they hate Geno the most when it comes to Smash speculation. For literally no reason. I've been dealing with their toxicity since Smash 4 but they often just victimize themselves to save face.
I severely doubt Sakrai had any intention of that. And I don't see that as an actual problem with the character. Many characters could have done that to you if it didn't meet what you were expecting.

I have never seen a Sora fans really be toxic here, so I don't know what to say. I doubt it's any sort of majority in that fanbase.
 

CrusherMania1592

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Pretty sure that PP is considered the WTF character of this game but his playstyle is already unique


You know, I've been thinking. Since Geno is considered the fastest of all of the SMRPG characters, where would his speed go in Smash? I don't know if he will be any faster than Fox but faster than at least 80% of the roster
 

Ovaltine

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People have had bad experiences with Geno fans, as well. Let's not forget that every fan base has its bad apples while also bearing good fruit. ****-flinging at Sora's entire fan base over the behavior of one group within it ain't cool. It's what we as Geno fans get all the time, and don't we always talk about how we get fed up with that? If you can't take the heat, don't dish it out.

I also really don't see Plant as 'taking Geno's spot'. The only thing they have in common is the series they're both from. Otherwise, especially in terms of what it'd take to include them, they couldn't be any more different. I understand disliking Plant for other reasons, but that ain't it, chief.
 

MattOnwheels

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Piranha Plant is literally a tumor on a really solid character select screen. If cuts have to be made for Smash 6, that pos is at the front of the line.

If your all time most wanted or favorite character on the list was Plant, then you without a doubt have a single digit iq

I also cannot forget to mention the fact that Plant gave all Sora fanboys ammunition against anyone who wanted Geno.
But that isnt reason to invalidate his inclusion. Your post is more an appeal to emotion. just keeping it 100 here.
 

StormC

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Partly true.

My reasoning for despising Plant comes from the fact that I never felt more blue balled in my life from this choice. Like Sakurai decided to tell us to go to hell.

Sora fans are just overall real ****. For some reason they hate Geno the most when it comes to Smash speculation. For literally no reason. I've been dealing with their toxicity since Smash 4 but they often just victimize themselves to save face.



I don't see where I am pushing my feelings for the game over the limit. I normally just say how I feel and then that becomes the end of it. I normally do not go around harassing people irl about Plant. But I do believe my feelings towards him are fair and justified.

To say I take a video game too seriously is ridiculous since I feel like what say about his character choice is valid. It rubbed me the wrong way after months of speculation and waiting.
The fact that you perceive Sora fans as some sort of enemy because a couple of people on a message board riled you up (which seems to be pretty easy to do) says more about you than anybody else.

I won’t even touch the “single digit IQ” comment.
 

SSGuy

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You know, I've been thinking. Since Geno is considered the fastest of all of the SMRPG characters, where would his speed go in Smash? I don't know if he will be any faster than Fox but faster than at least 80% of the roster
Probably faster just under or just as fast as Sheik/Pikachu.

I always imagined Geno to be a Shiek/Robin hybrid.

I have never seen a Sora fans really be toxic here, so I don't know what to say. I doubt it's any sort of majority in that fanbase.
Most of my experiences with Sora have been outside of Smashboards. Usually with social media/irl

Not even just one or two randos. Every Sora person I have met I have had a dumb experience with whether it's about Geno or not.
 

MattOnwheels

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Probably faster just under or just as fast as Sheik/Pikachu.

I always imagined Geno to be a Shiek/Robin hybrid.



Most of my experiences with Sora have been outside of Smashboards. Usually with social media/irl

Not even just one or two randos. Every Sora person I have met I have had a dumb experience with whether it's about Geno or not.
Well truth be told? Sora fans may say the same about you. It doesn't make them right.

Your experiences don't mean anything. Thats like saying all Steve fans are toxic as a Banjo fan because of what a few pit us through.
 

xpnc

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Probably faster just under or just as fast as Sheik/Pikachu.

I always imagined Geno to be a Shiek/Robin hybrid.



Most of my experiences with Sora have been outside of Smashboards. Usually with social media/irl

Not even just one or two randos. Every Sora person I have met I have had a dumb experience with whether it's about Geno or not.
I know the Sora fans on the Smash facebook groups I'm in are absolutely venomous when Geno is mentioned
 

SSGuy

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couple of people on a message board riled you up (which seems to be pretty easy to do)
You'd be hard pressed to find me normally getting that tilted over video games. Smash is a super rare exception where I think I get annoyed once every few months over this.

Well truth be told? Sora fans may say the same about you. It doesn't make them right.
All I can do is control myself and from what I have seen we definitely do not act super toxic unless provoked. I can only go based off my experience and it is usually nothing but some nerd with an anime pfp or some normie using the typical arguments against us.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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Let's move on from talking about how toxic other fanbases are. If it's going to lead to bashing them, it's not worth it. We don't want people or fanbases bashed, and it's basically just flaming instead. And that's against the rules because we don't tolerate attacking others. It creates an unfriendly atmosphere as is, which can drive people to not actually participate in discussions as is. We want threads to be inviting to users, not the opposite.
 

Adelto

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Let's go back to the main subject shall we ? Do you guy thinks that geno has a chance to be in this game ? I think we'll only have his costume back sadly.
 

MattOnwheels

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You'd be hard pressed to find me normally getting that tilted over video games. Smash is a super rare exception where I think I get annoyed once every few months over this.



All I can do is control myself and from what I have seen we definitely do not act super toxic unless provoked. I can only go based off my experience and it is usually nothing but some nerd with an anime pfp or some normie using the typical arguments against us.
And?

Again, Sora fans will tell you the exact same thing from their point of view. Welcome to being a Character lobbyist. It happens. It always has. You think I as a K. Rool fan didn't appear ****in' insane to the rest of every fanbase except Ridley since 2007? I got news for you: Every single characters fanbase feels like they're the most civil and the most **** on, but guess what? They aren't. Every fanbase is just as ptone to bullying and being toxic as another. You'd do well to understand this now before it hurts you any more.


EDIT: SORRY MODS, I WAS TYPING WHILE IT WAS POSTED. D:

Let's go back to the main subject shall we ? Do you guy thinks that geno has a chance to be in this game ? I think we'll only have his costume back sadly.
I do, if Sakarai was allowed. Im sure he asked.
 
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ShotoStar 2

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Let's go back to the main subject shall we ? Do you guy thinks that geno has a chance to be in this game ? I think we'll only have his costume back sadly.
That mostly depends on the Mii Costume. If we get it he's out. If we don't he has a very good chance. If we don't get the Mii Costume nor him in the Fighters Pass he may be a DLC Character individually.

I think it's possible we don't get the Mii Costume so I think he has a decent chance around 50/50 to be honest.
 

Fatmanonice

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Pretty sure that PP is considered the WTF character of this game but his playstyle is already unique


You know, I've been thinking. Since Geno is considered the fastest of all of the SMRPG characters, where would his speed go in Smash? I don't know if he will be any faster than Fox but faster than at least 80% of the roster
I picture him as something like top 15 when it comes to run speed. I could see him having the speed of someone like Metaknight or Palutena. I also imagine him having something of skid to help with spacing.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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M MattOnwheels Would you rather I removed your post that came up after mine or just merge the two posts? Also, please don't double post and edit your messages instead. :)

And to help clarify for others; everybody makes mistakes when posting. You can request your post deleted either by editing it in to say so, or just report your own post. Likewise, you can report(or say so via an edit) to ask for a merge if you accidentally double post. Nobody's perfect, after all. We don't want users to feel like it's the biggest deal in the world. Trying to follow the rules is important. But so is admitting there's an error too when it comes up. We'll gladly work with you. Even as a Mod, I've made a double posting mistake before(by accidentally quoting two posts back to back). It happens. That's why asking for help is always a good thing~
 

MattOnwheels

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M MattOnwheels Would you rather I removed your post that came up after mine or just merge the two posts? Also, please don't double post and edit your messages instead. :)

And to help clarify for others; everybody makes mistakes when posting. You can request your post deleted either by editing it in to say so, or just report your own post. Likewise, you can report(or say so via an edit) to ask for a merge if you accidentally double post. Nobody's perfect, after all. We don't want users to feel like it's the biggest deal in the world. Trying to follow the rules is important. But so is admitting there's an error too when it comes up. We'll gladly work with you. Even as a Mod, I've made a double posting mistake before(by accidentally quoting two posts back to back). It happens. That's why asking for help is always a good thing~
Maybe merge them? I jinda dont want it deleted as I still had a point i wanted to make ^^: and
, got ya.
 

Adelto

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That mostly depends on the Mii Costume. If we get it he's out. If we don't he has a very good chance. If we don't get the Mii Costume nor him in the Fighters Pass he may be a DLC Character individually.

I think it's possible we don't get the Mii Costume so I think he has a decent chance around 50/50 to be honest.
Yeah after all, there IS a rumor about a character after the fighter pass so maybe it'll be geno that would be cool plus that would be quite funny because:
We start with a mario rep(piranha plant) and we'll eventually end with a mario rep(geno in that case but i would be fine with waluigi too even if it's off topic
 

ShotoStar 2

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Yeah after all, there IS a rumor about a character after the fighter pass so maybe it'll be geno that would be cool plus that would be quite funny because:
We start with a mario rep(piranha plant) and we'll eventually end with a mario rep(geno in that case but i would be fine with waluigi too even if it's off topic
Wait.. What rumor? I didn't hear of any such rumor.
 

Adelto

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I mean that's what blocked content suggest with their title on this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTGaLQEq8ZQ
I didn't watch it yet so i don't want to give you false hope but from what i heard it'll be because it will have one slot for a stage so one more dlc would make sense after all smash 4 have 7 dlcs and with this additional dlc we'll get 7 dlcs in ultimate too so i think that can happen.
 

N3ON

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I mean that's what blocked content suggest with their title on this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTGaLQEq8ZQ
I didn't watch it yet so i don't want to give you false hope but from what i heard it'll be because it will have one slot for a stage so one more dlc would make sense after all smash 4 have 7 dlcs and with this additional dlc we'll get 7 dlcs in ultimate too so i think that can happen.
That guy doesn't make very credible content.

His theory rests on the extra spot on the stage select, but iirc that slot is just for toggling custom stages on random select.
 

Adelto

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Well, not that i think that they are very reliable but for this one i think it'll make sense like these we will have the same number of dlcs than smash 4 except if we got another fighter pass wich i'm not against tbh.And all the option that you mention are already on the top of the screen.
 

N3ON

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Well, not that i think that they are very reliable but for this one i think it'll make sense like these we will have the same number of dlcs than smash 4 except if we got another fighter pass wich i'm not against tbh.And all the option that you mention are already on the top of the screen.
Once you've seen enough theories based on some quantity remaining the same bite the dust, you realize it's best not to put stock in those kinds of patterns. To me that "carry the seven" business just seems like working backwards to justify a theory built on a faulty premise.

Also the normal/custom tab goes away in the random stage select. Custom stages appear as their own slot on the bottom row. The extra spot is for that.
 

N3ON

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I see,my bad then but i think it's too early to lose hope
No worries, honestly while I'm not holding my breath for either, imo I think it's likelier we get a second pass than just some bonus character at the end.
 

Adelto

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Yeah honestly i would prefer since it mean more character and more chance for characters that i like
 

wynn728

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How is Piranha Plant's inclusion worse then say, Wii Fit Trainer, R.O.B, or Game & Watch? Yes he's just a common enemy, but come on, the plant's as iconic as anyone else, and Mario, more then any other game, loves it's mooks. I'm dead serious, mario enemies are more vital to the mario series then a lot of named characters, how else do you explain the remakes of the mario and luigi games gaining an entire mode STARRING the guys. As much as people hate to admit it, the regular old goomba is given more love then some franchises. Mario's enemy line-up is probably as iconic in video games as he is, and smash is about celebrating what makes video games great.
There's a big difference between Piranha Plant and WFT, R.O.B. & Game & Watch. Wii Fit Trainer represents a new series which adds to making Smash Bros a massive crossover, plus it also represents fitness game. R.O.B. represents Nintendo's toy accessory which was important during the NES and SNES era. Game & Watch was one of the first video game characters that help started it all. Meanwhile Piranha Plant is generic enemy #3 and that's it. It's a character no one asked for and is scrapping the bottom of the barrel when you include a mook enemy. If they really wanted to include a common enemy then Bandana Waddle Dee would've been the perfect fit since he's a heavy requested character that would complete the Kirby series in representation. Sakurai says that there's limited amount of resource so there can't be that many new characters, so Piranha Plant is always going to look like "You're character was so insignificant to be consider playable in Smash Bros Ultimate. Piranha Plant is way more important." It's always going to look like a F U to the fans who wanted these characters that got turned into Assist Trophies & Mii Costume. And now that Piranha Plant is in we have the flood gates open for all the generic common enemies to appear in Smash Bros like Swooping Snitch Bug, Space Pirates, and Monoeye. There is a good reason why the Plant Gang is full of people who make fun of Geno, Isaac, Shadow, Rex, and ARMS character, it's a hate group that takes joy that all these character will never be playable while Sakurai believes that Piranha Plant was way more important that it should be the last Nintendo character to be added.

I severely doubt Sakrai had any intention of that. And I don't see that as an actual problem with the character. Many characters could have done that to you if it didn't meet what you were expecting.

I have never seen a Sora fans really be toxic here, so I don't know what to say. I doubt it's any sort of majority in that fanbase.
Completely untrue. You don't see anyone whine about Ridley, King K Rool, Isabelle, Inkling, or Simon getting in over other fan requested characters. You know why? Because we know that all those characters were for the fans. I want Isaac but I understand him getting passed over for the likes of these characters. Had Piranha Plant spot been either a third party character or a fan favorite Nintendo character that people have been requesting we wouldn't be having this mess. As long as a heavy fan requested character gets in it's okay for the others to get sidelined. But no one asked for Piranha Plant and because of that is why most people will complain about it's inclusion. It's inclusion tells you that those other characters weren't worth the time to make playable when compare to this common enemy. It may not be Sakurai's intention to say "screw you" with Piranha Plant's inclusion, but that doesn't matter. Many message have been made without the intention to offend and wined up being hurtful.
 
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Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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There's not really a big difference as is. They're all surprise characters at the end of the day and were not requested yet added because they all could be fun and unique. PP also does represent something, how important your typical enemy is in a game. There's not a lot to do without them.

So yeah, they all fill a pretty key role overall in gaming in their own unique way. They don't need to fit the exact same kind of role of how they're iconic to be interesting. They're different in good ways.
 

EricTheGamerman

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Well, not that i think that they are very reliable but for this one i think it'll make sense like these we will have the same number of dlcs than smash 4 except if we got another fighter pass wich i'm not against tbh.And all the option that you mention are already on the top of the screen.
The stage slot exists for custom stages in the rules set and random, so it already has a function. So that slot means nothing.

As for the same number as Smash 4, that just seems like a super arbitrary number to base your design decisions around and 4 was designed randomly to begin with. I don’t think the past number of DLC characters will have any influence on Ultimate’s number.
 

KCCHIEFS27

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There's not really a big difference as is. They're all surprise characters at the end of the day and were not requested yet added because they all could be fun and unique. PP also does represent something, how important your typical enemy is in a game. There's not a lot to do without them.

So yeah, they all fill a pretty key role overall in gaming in their own unique way. They don't need to fit the exact same kind of role of how they're iconic to be interesting. They're different in good ways.
Easy there Stretch Armstrong. PP is a terrible addition that no one wanted and barely anyone uses. It was a novel idea that wore off within days and the roster is worse off for it. He doesn’t even work as a character, he was very clearly shoehorned in because Sakurai probably thought it was funny and unexpected and then saw how much it backfired.

I would hope the PP reaction was the nail in the coffin to change how Sakurai decides newcomers. He can very clearly see the difference between how we react to K Rool, Ridley and Banjo compared to some of the other nonsense he throws in
 

Adelto

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The stage slot exists for custom stages in the rules set and random, so it already has a function. So that slot means nothing.

As for the same number as Smash 4, that just seems like a super arbitrary number to base your design decisions around and 4 was designed randomly to begin with. I don’t think the past number of DLC characters will have any influence on Ultimate’s number.
I think the opposite , it will influence the number of ultimate's dlcs because smash 4 came out pretty late on wii u they didn't had time for more since they had to work on ,that's one thing, and then ssb ultimate will live longer like sakurai said the next smash will be in a very long time and i don't think that nintendo will leave smash die knowing this is the best selling on the console i think they'll push the most of it
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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The stage slot exists for custom stages in the rules set and random, so it already has a function. So that slot means nothing.

As for the same number as Smash 4, that just seems like a super arbitrary number to base your design decisions around and 4 was designed randomly to begin with. I don’t think the past number of DLC characters will have any influence on Ultimate’s number.
Same. Patterns aren't really worth much at all. Development isn't based upon patterns much. Like, the closest thing we've had to an actual tradition is that Toon Link has a cloned moveset as "per tradition", since he was already using Young Link and Link as overall bases to create.

Some are just "no duh" like the idea we'd get... newcomers. Most look at getting a Pokemon as a pattern, but it wasn't that simple either. Instead of just adding anything that can work like in previous games, 4 and Ultimate went out of their way to choose a Pokemon based on concept art, namely because Sakurai actually thought the addition worked. But it was also a later addition via a slot set aside. If they didn't work, he's not going to just replace it with another random Pokemon for the sake of it. It just means the slot goes unused. Maybe he'll save the slot for a later Pokemon game, like Gen 8, if Incineroar wasn't in. Who knows. But he doesn't really replace slots anyway. He makes a plan, and things change due to the development cycle. Unlike in previous games, though, Ultimate had a very set character plan and he stuck to it the entire time, with zero additions at all. What this means is he had PP ideal from the start. It doesn't mean it couldn't have been base roster either. But it also just as well have been planned as DLC from the start.
 
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Not exactly a stunning revelation but maybe looking at things at face value isn't a bad idea. Persona 5 and Dragon Quest were highly praised by Sakurai and Microsoft's Big Guy™ vouched for Banjo so maybe this DLC cycle isn't as unpredictable as we originally thought. Hindsight is 20/20, blah blah blah, but if you look at the history of Smash its kind of been this way, especially for third parties. Either Sakurai has talked up a series or a Biggie Cheese for some third party has talked about coming to Smash in some capacity. That said, I'm pretty confident that DLC #4 is going to be Doom Slayer because it honestly checks all the boxes.

-Sakurai has praised it? Yarp.
-Respective third party has talked about it in non-vague terms? Yarp.
-Major anniversary is this year? Uh-yup. (25th)

On this note, this is something that Geno has going for him because Sakurai has talked positively about him in the past. Hell, even most of characters that Sakurai has talked about negatively in the past (Ridley, Chrom, Daisy, etc) have wound up playable or assist trophies so it's not a super far reach either way.
The only unpredictable one was Joker because they specifcally went out of their way to keep him hidden. As oppsoed to Banjo & Hero who were pretty much common conversation due to rumor talk.

If im honest, im not expecting Doomguy, due to what i have seen with Smash going downwards in terms of roster hype every single time once the character is revealed.

Then again, Doomguy would be Anti-Hype for japanese gamers (even more so than Hero was for weterners) so maybe that anti hype will balance the western hype out or something.


I don't think i have asked this Fatman, but have has there been any thoughts of any Nintendo DLC character (not Fire Emblem or Pokemon) in your head?
 

Adelto

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Well we'll see about that but i'm mostly sure that we will got more dlc one way or the other that doesn't look like the end for smash and maybe geno will be in it who knows ? I think doomguy has no chance just see how hard it was for banjo fan to have him .
 

Ovaltine

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I think that if the Mii costume comes back, he's out until further notice, especially if the costume is upgraded in some way. Without an upgrade to his costume, I'd say his chances are next to nothing, and with upgrades, it is solidly nothing. Unless we get further DLC, I do not think he's going to be in Ultimate, honestly.
 
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