Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Ze Diglett]

How could I have seen Waluigi if he didn't exist at the time? But also, i dont even see it now ;p

Ah, but that's just what you think, my dear Teeb! You may THINK Waluigi didn't exist until Mario Tennis on the N64, but in reality, he's been hiding in everyone's shelves the whole time! HE'S BEEN HERE THE WHOLE TIME, I TELL YOU!!

Alright, I'll stop.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

See, I find it annoying and suspicious that some regions seem to get obvious favoritism over others. I suppose it's natural to favor one's own country/region over another's, but let's consider Bayonetta for a moment. When she was released, Nintendo claimed that she scorely "highly" on the Japanese and American ballots, but was "top pick in Europe", thus she got in. Well then, I pose the question, who the Hell was top pick in Japan/the States??? Why did Europe somehow act as the deciding factor? It almost feels like Tendo was already leaning towards her and it was just coincidence that Europe happened to line up. Of course, wasn't this around the time that Bayonetta 2 was coming out or being ported or something? Makes me wonder how much (if any) of the character picks are actually brought in by ballot demand or if they simply bring in whoever they're brokering a deal with and just say it was by popular demand to shut everyone up. I mean, I can see how Bayo could be genuinely popular, but I just think it's suspicious.

I mean, Bayonetta probably represents a great balance between listening to fans and incorporating a clear and present fan demand into something else you can work with. I've always considered her the marriage between fan demand and Nintendo pick as she benefits everyone involved. I don't think it really comes down to any "favoritism." I think Sakurai makes a wide range of choices and the choices behind Bayonetta just happened to have her be most popular in Europe it would seem. She certainly had quite a bit of demand around that period.

I think Bayonetta 2 would have been out for around 6 months or so going by when the Zero Suit Samus data in her character slot was found. But I mean, the Wii U era is so short that basically anything is relatively close to one another.

Sakurai outright admitted that every game has a slot dedicated to a new Pokemon. Incineroar is that new Pokemon. That is on top of it being Sakurai bias because he wanted to make a wrestling character or else it would have been Decidueye. So yeah. Not every ultimate pick was made with the fans in mind. Fans wanted Decidueye if a starter had to be picked.

To be fair, none of the Pokemon would have been known as popular when Sakurai started working on Incineroar. They had chosen to include a Gen 7 Pokemon with the project plan and then Incineroar ended up the choice. If we go by how Greninja was picked, Sakurai likely just got the concept art and ideas behind the Gen 7 starters and ended up choosing Incineroar to make as a wrestling character. I think it's incredibly likely that Incineroar was picked before fans even knew of the starters and even if after, before they had enough time to solidify. I don't think Incineroar's a decision we can point to of him prioritizing his interest over fans or whatever you want. It's impossible to tell fan demand before something releases.

I found it kinda sad that we live in an period of time where people think 3rd party are more likely than 1st party for DLC because "hype factor".

Bruh Mewtwo. And Lucas/Roy.
Yeah returning veterans and shtick , but it's still a game exclusive to Nintendo's console. It was also used as a way to introduce people to new Nintendo series , (This is also why I really want the Chorus Kids and Chibi-robo , to some extent) shouldn't DLC be the perfect way to do so?
Not even somethin' like King Boo for Luigi's Mansion 3?
A BiS rep like Fawful , Midbus , Dark Bowser for the remake ?
Heck , Tom Nook for Animal Crossing Switch ?

Honestly , my big problem with third party is that a lot of the more popular one are humans like. You can do unique stuff with them (Bayo , Ryu...) but it seem like they can't do anything without a weapon.
And more cartoonish 3rd party (Why isn't Bomberman playable , I'm not even a fan of his serie , but why) aren't considered as likely for some reason.

They should be groundbreaking announcement , and people are like "Yeah it's okay to expect 5 differents 3rd party from 5 differents companies" , and then they are the one saying "Poor Sakurai should take some vacations ".
I dunno , always found it fascinating how so many people never took the time to step back , and look at the entire picture.

I think the veteran status has to be a bigger deal that that. Especially when those three were requested veterans and among the most lamented cuts of the Smash 4 era. They had a fan base well beyond their actual character because they had appeared in Smash before. The only new character for Smash that they actually included was Corrin, and well, many people in this thread continue to voice their vocal distaste for that character.

But having been over the issue of third parties versus first parties many times at this point, I'll just say this. Sakurai has done an amazing job ensuring that basically every major franchise is well represented in Smash, and many smaller ones as well. There's an extremely short list of missing franchises and about an equally short list of major characters with multiple appearances that are considered the "A or B list" characters. The hype factor comes down to the diminishing returns of increasingly obscure and less notable characters. Getting characters like Ridley and King K. Rool put us one step closer to having the primary first parties that people want. Third parties appeal to much wider demographics and can absolutely be high ranking characters in perpetuity for all intensive purposes. There's such a massive number to pull from that are much, much more well known than a highly specific pick like say, Mach Rider. It's not that the first parties aren't hype, it's just they're less hype in many instances.

My stance on Minecraft is that it's to videogames what Avatar is to movies. A huge success, but one I can't really attribute to quality so much as being in the right place at the right time.

I think Minecraft deserves a better reputation than Avatar given just how much more it has done for games in essentially creating/popularizing an entire genre and being an excellent tool kit for people interested in creating. There's just an overall inherent quality to Minecraft that has generally been very consistent and hasn't relied upon the past (Which Avatar basically does in regards to plot, character, etc.).

 

[Brothanigus]

See, I find it annoying and suspicious that some regions seem to get obvious favoritism over others. I suppose it's natural to favor one's own country/region over another's, but let's consider Bayonetta for a moment. When she was released, Nintendo claimed that she scorely "highly" on the Japanese and American ballots, but was "top pick in Europe", thus she got in. Well then, I pose the question, who the Hell was top pick in Japan/the States??? Why did Europe somehow act as the deciding factor? It almost feels like Tendo was already leaning towards her and it was just coincidence that Europe happened to line up. Of course, wasn't this around the time that Bayonetta 2 was coming out or being ported or something? Makes me wonder how much (if any) of the character picks are actually brought in by ballot demand or if they simply bring in whoever they're brokering a deal with and just say it was by popular demand to shut everyone up. I mean, I can see how Bayo could be genuinely popular, but I just think it's suspicious.

Yep. This is what happens when you keep Sakurai around, he clearly has a bias and doesn't care about showing it.

Look at Shovel Knight/Inceneroar for example - Shovel Knight, a western character that lots of FANS wanted is made inot an assist trophy. All the while we get Inceneroar ALL BECAUSE SAKURAI wanted a wrestling moveset in the game, so that's what we get instead of what the fans wanted or anything western. Look at Joker, another nobody no one wanted but was added in because Sakurai wanted it. Look at the LoZ franchise compared to FE, there's ZERO reason for FE to be more reped more than LoZ, none, except Sakurai likes FE more than LoZ.

Look at Isaac, top 5 most wanted, is an assist trophy AGAIN AND Sakurai states that it's a dead franchise so he won't ever be a playable character, yet this hack adds in ROB, G&W, Lil Mac, countless DEAD franchise characters. <content redacted>

At this point, I wouldn't be suprised if we got Goku over any character people actually want. Wouldn't be surprised if we got Steve concidering how popular it is in Japan and how much Sakurai likes it(he hosted a SSBU promo with two highly popular minecraft streamers in Japan. He's NEVER DONE THIS for anything else. HMMMMMM)

 

[MissingGlitch]

I think Minecraft deserves a better reputation than Avatar given just how much more it has done for games in essentially creating/popularizing an entire genre and being an excellent tool kit for people interested in creating. There's just an overall inherent quality to Minecraft that has generally been very consistent and hasn't relied upon the past (Which Avatar basically does in regards to plot, character, etc.).

Many people can still perfectly recall everything about Minecraft. All people can tell you about Avatar is that it had blue people on an Alien Planet. It's not that good of a comparison.

Minecraft is still going 10 years later. While people are rooting on End Game finally taking Avatar's spot.

 

[GillyGrime]

Like some of you, I too have only noticed attention with Erdrick and Steve from Smash Ultimate onwards (despite following speculation since pre Brawl). But really, so what?

Sure there's those who bandwagon for a sense of wanting the characters with the perceived highest chances (but if it's one thing we've learnt, the Smash fanbase are crap at accurately guessing the roster, see Decidueye and Ashley). But I think most likely, fans of Dragon Quest and Minecraft saw these rumours and realised "you know what? That'd be rad, I'd love Erdrick/Steve in the game". It even happened with me and Geno. If it weren't for the fan support I'm not sure I would've even considered it, and I love Super Mario RPG to bits. That doesn't make me somehow a fake Geno fan. I think people are getting a bit too defensive, and this is coming from someone completely apathetic to both Dragon Quest and Minecraft. Good for Erdrick and Steve fans.

Also, as I've mentioned in other threads, I find the fan poll bittersweet. Amazing to see Banjo, Geno, Shantae, Rayman, Crash and Tails dominate the results but damn, Dixie Kong not even being in the top 10 first party characters is rough as a Dixie fan lol.

 

[Megadoomer]

Yep. This is what happens when you keep Sakurai around, he clearly has a bias and doesn't care about showing it.

Look at Shovel Knight/Inceneroar for example - Shovel Knight, a western character that lots of FANS wanted is made inot an assist trophy. All the while we get Inceneroar ALL BECAUSE SAKURAI wanted a wrestling moveset in the game, so that's what we get instead of what the fans wanted or anything western. Look at Joker, another nobody no one wanted but was added in because Sakurai wanted it. Look at the LoZ franchise compared to FE, there's ZERO reason for FE to be more reped more than LoZ, none, except Sakurai likes FE more than LoZ.

Look at Isaac, top 5 most wanted, is an assist trophy AGAIN AND Sakurai states that it's a dead franchise so he won't ever be a playable character, yet this hack adds in ROB, G&W, Lil Mac, countless DEAD franchise characters.

Punch-Out had gotten a major release in 2009, five years before Smash for 3DS came out. (and even less than that before they started development on it) If that qualifies a franchise as "dead", then so many other franchises would also fit that qualification.

Over half of the Fire Emblem characters are extremely similar clones of each other, so it seems like the sheer amount of FE characters is because of how easy it is to make them. It's frustrating that Zelda hasn't had a proper newcomer since 2001, especially with Hyrule Warriors showing that so many characters could work well in an action game, but the two points don't seem to be connected.

Saying that "nobody" wanted Joker seems like a flawed statement (at least one major Smash Youtuber, Alpharad, supported the character even back when he was a pipe dream, and there are undoubtedly other less vocal supporters), and I have no idea where you're getting claims like Isaac being a "top 5 most wanted" character from. (online polls are rather limited in terms of how many people participate in them)

Every human being is going to have a bias of some kind, and it's impossible to create an objectively unbiased roster.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Just remember, if you think a post is bait, just don't respond. Please just report it. It makes it a lot easier for us to handle. There's some cases where we need to edit out or remove a post entirely. That means every reply to it has to be taken care of in some way.

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

So...any movies you guys want to see this month that aren't Avengers Endgame?

Definitely John Wick 3. I might be seeing Detective Pikachu and Godzilla: King of the Monsters.

It's guaranteed that I'll be seeing Toy Story 4 next month. What I love about Pixar is they love to release movies in June, and it's my favorite month; it was always the month I got out of school for summer. Toy Story has an interesting trend where the sequels get better than their previous movies, so I wonder if Toy Story 4 will top Toy Story 3. I'm hoping we get a Monsters, Inc. 3 (a sequel that continues from the events of the first movie). Pixar movies hold a special place in my heart, especially their movies from the early-mid 2000s. I was and still am just absolutely happy that they were able to give us a sequel to Finding Nemo and The Incredibles, and their sequels were amazing.

https://twitter.com/ssbunews/status/1125204020774285312?s=21

SSBU's new 'ballot' thing came out with the results! I honestly expected Geno would be a lot lower, considering he's a spirit and many people take that as a deconfirmation, but I was happily proven wrong. LOTS of votes for Banjo and Sora, though.

It's good to know Geno's still loved and supported. It's also nice to see Master Chief, 2B, Dante, Crash, and Porky getting some support.

Also, Master Chief beat Doomguy by one place? Hahaha.

Have you ever seen the movie "A Christmas Story"?
"Be sure to drink your Ovaltine? A crumby commercial???....Son of a *****!"

Remembering most scenes, not so much. The cat chair scene and all the lights going out are the most memorable to me. Only other is the turkey dinner splitting open with only hot air.

I love that movie. My favorite has got to be the part where that kid's tongue gets stuck to the pole. I also love the part where Ralphie says THE word... The big one. The queen-mother of dirty words. The F-dash-dash-dash word!

Spoiler

 

[Teeb147]

In case anyone wanted to see the rest of the characters that were voted for in the latest fighter ballot, here's the long list:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12Xwag9HkqpWEgbHxR_C7wcxC_pqjS28XWjtMJtaFQ9M/edit#gid=0

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

In case anyone wanted to see the rest of the characters that were voted for in the latest fighter ballot, here's the long list:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12Xwag9HkqpWEgbHxR_C7wcxC_pqjS28XWjtMJtaFQ9M/edit#gid=0

I wish they listed everyone, not just those who were top 25. I'm aware impossible additions were gone(non-game characters, assist trophies), though I don't know if they considered obscure picks among that list as "unfeasible" anyway. Probably?

I prefer how SourceGaming did it, listing everyone, even 1-voters

 

[Teeb147]

I wish they listed everyone, not just those who were top 25. I'm aware impossible additions were gone(non-game characters, assist trophies), though I don't know if they considered obscure picks among that list as "unfeasible" anyway. Probably?

I prefer how SourceGaming did it, listing everyone, even 1-voters

I dont care too much for 1-votes, but i get it and i'd be curious to see how Ashley, Isaac,, Krystal and the others did myself.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I dont care too much for 1-votes, but i get it and i'd be curious to see how Ashley, Isaac,, Krystal and the others did myself.

That too. Just seeing all votes is still nice. Just put them under the normal list and label it "unfeasible votes".

 

[Ze Diglett]

To be fair, none of the Pokemon would have been known as popular when Sakurai started working on Incineroar. They had chosen to include a Gen 7 Pokemon with the project plan and then Incineroar ended up the choice. If we go by how Greninja was picked, Sakurai likely just gt the concept art and ideas behind the Gen 7 starters and ended up choosing Incineroar to make as a wrestling character. I think it's incredibly likely that Incineroar was picked before fans even knew of the starters and even if after, before they had enough time to solidify. I don't think Incineroar's a decision we can point to of him prioritizing his interest over fans or whatever you want. It's impossible to tell fan demand before something releases.

This is why, in my opinion, they just shouldn't add characters before getting a chance to gauge their popularity (at best, Sak read the tea leaves once with Greninja, but on the other hand, we're more likely to get another Corrin than anything else), but I digress.

In case anyone wanted to see the rest of the characters that were voted for in the latest fighter ballot, here's the long list:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12Xwag9HkqpWEgbHxR_C7wcxC_pqjS28XWjtMJtaFQ9M/edit#gid=0

...hol up. Heavy from TF2 made the top 25? Sweet mama, I hope this is indicative of some actual demand for TF2 content in Smash. It'll have a completely negligible chance of happening regardless, but I can dream.

 

[MissingGlitch]

...hol up. Heavy from TF2 made the top 25? Sweet mama, I hope this is indicative of some actual demand for TF2 content in Smash. It'll have a completely negligible chance of happening regardless, but I can dream.

I'm really hoping that Valve/Nintendo meeting for an exclusive Switch game had some truth to it because....

 

[Ze Diglett]

I'm really hoping that Valve/Nintendo meeting for an exclusive Switch game had some truth to it because....View attachment 217039

Oh, how that image tantalizes me. If I saw that in an actual Nintendo Direct, I would be jumping out of my seat in excitement for the rest of the week.

Not that I see it happening any time soon, considering Valve these days is basically the video game industry's geriatric old cat who refuses to do anything but sleep on their Steam profits all day. Give us that Heavy Update, you lazy cat!

 

[Firox]

I love that movie. My favorite has got to be the part where that kid's tongue gets stuck to the pole. I also love the part where Ralphie says THE word... The big one. The queen-mother of dirty words. The F-dash-dash-dash word!

lol "You'll shoot your eye out, kid. Merry Christmas. HO! HO! HO! (Santa kicks Ralphie down the chute)"

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

lol "You'll shoot your eye out, kid. Merry Christmas. HO! HO! HO! (Santa kicks Ralphie down the chute)"

Forgot to put that as a favorite, too. I love it when Santa just slowly puts his foot on Ralphie's face and pushes him down the chute. LOL

"Ho... ho... HO!" *Kick*

 

[ForsakenM]

Anyone who thinks Incineroar was a bad pick is being super subjective, and anyone who thinks Bayonetta wasn't a hype announcement is clouded with unjustified anger about how she was left in such an unbalanced state.

Also, Decidueye lost out on most of his popularity when it was realized he was a crappy mon.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Anyone who thinks Incineroar was a bad pick is being super subjective, and anyone who thinks Bayonetta wasn't a hype announcement is clouded with unjustified anger about how she was left in such an unbalanced state.

Also, Decidueye lost out on most of his popularity when it was realized he was a crappy mon.

I never cared how OP Bayonetta was and she wasn't a hype pick for me.

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

Anyone who thinks Incineroar was a bad pick is being super subjective, and anyone who thinks Bayonetta wasn't a hype announcement is clouded with unjustified anger about how she was left in such an unbalanced state.

Also, Decidueye lost out on most of his popularity when it was realized he was a crappy mon.

I can't wait to see your big-ass post!

 

[Deleted member]

Anyone who thinks Incineroar was a bad pick is being super subjective, and anyone who thinks Bayonetta wasn't a hype announcement is clouded with unjustified anger about how she was left in such an unbalanced state.

Also, Decidueye lost out on most of his popularity when it was realized he was a crappy mon.

Uh I don't agree with this someone could have problems with her being the final Smash 4 DLC Character but not care about her balancing and vise-versa I really don't like how unbalanced she was but I don't think she was a bad addition at all.

But I can't wait for your big *** post as you title it, When will it be done?

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I never cared how OP Bayonetta was and she wasn't a hype pick for me.

She’s still a massive pick for the Wii U era. Anybody doubting Bayonetta needs to look at the absolute fervor that happened when Bayonetta 2 was announced as a Wii U exclusive. It was a much needed exclusive announcement that got tons of people super excited for the Wii U and fans were surprised that it was finally happening, but a number were also outraged it was appearing on the Wii U only. It was also a clear shift in mentality for Nintendo as they were finding one of the most seemingly unlikely games for their image. It garnered loads of press and headlines back then.

Not to mention, the original Bayonetta had become a gold standard for action games and had been seen as the true successor to Devil May Cry. This perception only ramped up when Bayonetta 2 came out in 2014 and got damn near universal praise from critics. Especially in the wake of the DmC that had released a year earlier and been so divisive, Bayonetta 2 was a game that corrected many of the mistakes of the original and garnered major attention that Nintendo needed. Bayonetta was quite a big deal from a PR standpoint and received almost nothing but major buzz on an industry level prior to her inclusion in Smash.

Now, if we could only get buffs for her in Ultimate so that she’s fun to play again as opposed to exclusively viable in the hands of top players. I know she was OP as hell last game, but she deserves so much better than what she has right now...

 

[Ze Diglett]

Anyone who thinks Incineroar was a bad pick is being super subjective, and anyone who thinks Bayonetta wasn't a hype announcement is clouded with unjustified anger about how she was left in such an unbalanced state.

Also, Decidueye lost out on most of his popularity when it was realized he was a crappy mon.

I mean, it's almost like thinking Incineroar was a bad pick is a matter of opinion or something. Not saying you're wrong, but the way you worded it sounds kinda silly to me.

 

[osby]

Anyone who thinks Incineroar was a bad pick is being super subjective, and anyone who thinks Bayonetta wasn't a hype announcement is clouded with unjustified anger about how she was left in such an unbalanced state.

Also, Decidueye lost out on most of his popularity when it was realized he was a crappy mon.

Anyone who thinks Incineroar is a good pick is also being subjective. Bayonetta was a hype announcement for a lot of people, I'll give you that. Not for everyone, but she was competing with characters with extremely um, passionate fanbases, so backlash is understandable, as unpleasant as it was.

And Decidueye is still popular, though it seems the bulk of his Smash popularity was caused by its type than anything.

 

[GillyGrime]

Anyone who thinks Incineroar was a bad pick is being super subjective, and anyone who thinks Bayonetta wasn't a hype announcement is clouded with unjustified anger about how she was left in such an unbalanced state.

Also, Decidueye lost out on most of his popularity when it was realized he was a crappy mon.

In the recent unofficial fan poll, Decieueye beat Dixie Kong and Crono, with a score of 84 votes, despite being voted on after Incineroar's inclusion. I don't think all his popularity boils down to just "the obligatory Gen 7 mon".

 

[MissingGlitch]

Primarina doesn't get the love she deserves. She should have been the Gen 7 rep. You all know I'm right.

 

[Deleted member]

Hey, someone's hosting another fan poll!

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[kiteinthesky]

In the recent unofficial fan poll, Decieueye beat Dixie Kong and Crono, with a score of 84 votes, despite being voted on after Incineroar's inclusion. I don't think all his popularity boils down to just "the obligatory Gen 7 mon".

I think a lot of it is from the fact that Smash DESPERATELY needs a Grass standalone on the roster. How the HELL do we have Greninja and Incineroar but no Grass standalone? It's unbalanced and it's so incredibly hard to un-see once you notice it.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I think a lot of it is from the fact that Smash DESPERATELY needs a Grass standalone on the roster. How the HELL do we have Greninja and Incineroar but no Grass standalone? It's unbalanced and it's so incredibly hard to un-see once you notice it.

I don’t know if I can agree with that(despite my unabashed love for Sceptile). Filling arbitrary quota of representation doesn’t make a ton of sense to me. By that we’re due an Axe user and a Lance user from Fire Emblem just to complete the weapon triangle. I just don’t see any series as big as Pokemon getting perfect representation and we at least have Ivysaur already to represent a Grass type at all.

I’d also argue that Pokemon’s now 8 generation reliance on the starters always being Water/Grass/Fire is a bit more frustrating than anything else. I’ve been hoping for three generations now that the next one would be different, but it’s one of the areas Game Freak is determined to retain. But that’s another conversation.

 

[ZelDan]

I never really wanted a gen 7 inclusion in Smash Ultimate in the first place, but if we HAD to get one I would have wanted Decidueye.

I'm guessing that's how a good amount of other people felt.

 

[Firox]

Anyone who thinks Incineroar was a bad pick is being super subjective, and anyone who thinks Bayonetta wasn't a hype announcement is clouded with unjustified anger about how she was left in such an unbalanced state.

Also, Decidueye lost out on most of his popularity when it was realized he was a crappy mon.

Three false generalizations in two sentences. Not bad.

 

[Shado-will]

I think a lot of it is from the fact that Smash DESPERATELY needs a Grass standalone on the roster. How the HELL do we have Greninja and Incineroar but no Grass standalone? It's unbalanced and it's so incredibly hard to un-see once you notice it.

This was similar to what I was thinking before Incineroar was announced. My mindset was that we had not had a final-stage/fully evolved grass starter, while we had Charizard and Greninja

 

[Deleted member]

Or it's indicative of issues we don't know or Nintendo's laziness with other games. It's not like they had to choose 21 for the SNES Classic, that's just where they stopped. Maybe Nintendo knew they had to have Square and decided to work with them on the most basic games that don't require additional licensing work from other studios (Chrono Trigger and the DQ games would be cut in this instance). Maybe they do value Super Mario RPG above those since they specifically get to show off Mario as their defining character across many games and genres. We don't really know a lot behind the decision making of the SNES Classic, and all of their stuff surrounding these plug and play consoles doesn't really paint a picture of significant effort put behind those systems since they were designed to stall in Nintendo's transition between consoles.

Sorry I forgot to respond to this, but I have a question. If you think it's possible that the reason Chrono Trigger and the DQ games aren't on the SNES Classic, then wouldn't you think that the licensing could be used as a point against Erdrick/DQ in Smash? In the past, you didn't think so:

Again, we’re speculating on how difficult that is though. On paper it sounds bad, but we don’t know how difficult any of it actually is. Maybe part of the agreement for a Dragon Quest character is Square handling all the excess rights stuff, or maybe they’ve already got papers written up for such situations. Or maybe it is really all that difficult to get everyone on board.

We just don’t know, and I think assuming complex legal matters such as these, that also could have any number of corporate decisions behind them is just going too far.

Is Geno easier? Absolutely. Should he be picked because he is an easy win and Square seems to be more difficult to work with? Probably. Will he? We’ll have to see.

Or even worst case scenario is something like Square agreeing to include Cloud in base for something later on that they get more influence on.

There’s just way too much to take that sort of information as a negative or a positive in my mind.

We've got nothing to substantiate how difficult obtaining Erdrick or any Dragon Quest character for a title actually would be. We know that there are multiple companies involved. That's it. The actual legal ramifications of getting those companies involved to make a DQ character a reality in Smash are completely unknown. Especially when Nintendo of all people are the ones asking.

There is no reason for us to keep leaning on this part of the Dragon Quest question. Is Geno theoretically easier to license? Sure, they've done it before with the Mii costume. But we don't know anything about how the Square/Nintendo deals actually go or how hard any certain act is to achieve in the context of Smash.

I'm just curious.

 

[The Anigriffin]

I don't care if Decidueye isn't the most powerful starter.

He's still my choice because competitive viability isn't the only reason I like Pokemon. He's a ****ing ghost owl with a hoodie. That's awesome.

 

[Deleted member]

Yeah, I definitely preferred (and still prefer) Decidueye over Incineroar

 

[Shado-will]

I don't care if Decidueye isn't the most powerful starter.

He's still my choice because competitive viability isn't the only reason I like Pokemon. He's a ****ing ghost owl with a hoodie. That's awesome.

Definitely, I almost never pick my pokemon because of competitive, or "they're the best/most viable." Decidueye has always been my favorite gen 7 starter purely based on his design.

 

[Firox]

He's still my choice because competitive viability isn't the only reason I like Pokemon. He's a ****ing ghost owl with a hoodie. That's awesome

I know, right? Sure beats a disproportional cat version of Yosemite Sam, huh? I'm sorry, my biggest hang up with Incineroar is that the poor sucker is just downright repugnant. Sorry, he just is. Then add in the fact that he's one of the slowest characters in the game....Yeah, I'll take my fast, ferrari-sleek ninja frog over that any day.

 

[The Anigriffin]

I know, right? Sure beats a disproportional cat version of Yosemite Sam, huh? I'm sorry, my biggest hang up with Incineroar is that the poor sucker is just downright repugnant. Sorry, he just is. Then add in the fact that he's one of the slowest characters in the game....Yeah, I'll take my fast, ferrari-sleek ninja frog over that any day.

It's kinda funny becuase before Smash I really didn't like Greninja that much for some reason, but after he was added in Smash I gained a lot more respect for him. Probably because he was fun to use in Smash Run.

Incineroar just bugs me since it doesn't look like an evolution of Torracat. It looks like someone threw mutagen on one and he sadly ended up as a rejected mutant henchman of Shredder

 

[3BitSaurus]

Three false generalizations in two sentences. Not bad.

Eh, while they are generalizations, they still hold a little bit of truth in them. I mean, Charizard vs. Blastoise is a thing to this day, so favorite starters are very subjective. I like Decidueye more myself, but I'm happy with Incineroar and the playstyle they gave him. Not hyped, just happy.

And yeah, some people started bashing on Bayo's popularity and the hype around her after she was officially launched. These people were a minority, of course, but bandwagoners will always exist and be vocal, I guess.

The last point might be the only one I disagree with, though. I mean, Decidueye was in Pokkén. That has to mean something regarding his popularity post S/M launch. And the competitive community does not necessarily affect a Pokémon's popularity that much. Usage, maybe, but not popularity.

Ah, sidenote regarding Geno movesets: would you guys rather have standalone Geno or do you think he could use some unique items from SMRPG or even assists from other characters (mostly Mallow) in his moveset? Just out of curiosity.

 

[Deleted member]

Ah, sidenote regarding Geno movesets: would you guys rather have standalone Geno or do you think he could use some unique items from SMRPG or even assists from other characters (mostly Mallow) in his moveset? Just out of curiosity.

Y'know, I actually like the idea of Geno getting assists from Mallow and using items from SMRPG. The star egg could be used as part of his moveset, maybe even working as a tilt or something. But I like the idea.