Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

????? No?
Im sorry but by your logic Corrin was more requested than K.Rool or Ridley back in Sm4sh.

Yeah, I mean I don't remember anyone ever asking for Flies & Hand.

This may simply be a case of Yacht Club asking for anything that can promote their game.

 

[Polan]

????? No?
Im sorry but by your logic Corrin was more requested than K.Rool or Ridley back in Sm4sh.

corrin was a explicit promo pick. he has literally no bearing on discussion about popularity.

i’m sure, but do show me the amount of ballots, whether it be official or not, that he scored highly on. further, i’m not trying to imply anything, i’m genuinely letting you know that the amount of people who want Shovel Knight above everyone else is considerably smaller than you might think.

most of the fanpolls i saw had him consistenly on the top ten. but i don't trust fanpolls considering they missed bayo and simon.

I really don't wanna be that girl. But, isn't there a Shovel Knight for DLC thread this conversation would best be suited for. Lol

then tell people to stop responding to me then. i'm trying to keep it in topic lol but it's hard.

 

[Ovaltine]

most of the fanpolls i saw had him consistenly on the top ten. but i don't trust fanpolls considering they missed bayo and simon.

I agree that Shovel Knight is very popular, but using a fan poll as a counterargument, then going on record to say that you don't trust fan polls, is a little contradictory, don't you think?

 

[Tetrin]

most of the fanpolls i saw had him consistenly on the top ten. but i don't trust fanpolls considering they missed bayo and simon.

would you mind linking one? most of the ones i’ve seen have either shown him to be lower or not even on there at all.

some of the ones i’ve seen (and these are the first things you find on google, too):

https://mobile.twitter.com/ssbunews/status/1037437559343865856

https://i.imgtc.com/COf52oG.jpg

https://amp.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/9egrty/unofficial_smash_ballot_2018_results/ (this one’s out of 50)

the only one i’ve looked at so far with Shovel Knight in the top 5 was this one: https://www.sourcegaming.info/2018/06/10/mega-smash-poll-switch-results/

Feel free to look into the origins of the polls, too; all had a considerable sample size and aren’t entirely questionable.

 

[DaxMasterix]

I agree that Shovel Knight is very popular, but using a fan poll as a counterargument, then going on record to say that you don't trust fan polls, is a little contradictory, don't you think?

Yah, he entered a thread full of things he doesnt like.
I think Polan here is a big oof, just ignore him.

 

[Klimax]

I already think that Spirits is the ****tiest idea ever, so if Geno doesn't have anything more, it will be a downgrade compared to what he had in Smash 4.

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

On the topic of old rivalries:

That actually looks legit. I'd love to have Bomberman in Smash, and I can see Bomberman being in the next Smash game as a newcomer.

would you mind linking one? most of the ones i’ve seen have either shown him to be lower or not even on there at all.

Until I see the official results, I'll believe Shovel Knight is in the top 10. For now, King K. Rool definitely won the Smash 4 ballot; he had support from YouTube, the Smash community, fan art, Deviantart, Twitter, Tumblr, Gamefaqs, Eventhubs, Smashboards, and many others.

 

[-Coco-]

"Polygon: Was that when you split off onto your own company, Armor Project? YH: Actually, I had Armor Project from the very beginning. Back in the day, Enix didn’t have an internal development team so I started Armor Project. It’s like the relationship between an editor and an artist; that’s how it was back then. For a while after the merger, that didn’t really change much since Dragon Quest had this pre-established system of “outsourcing its development.” And Final Fantasy was developed internally [with its own staff], so there wasn’t much of a change for quite some time." From the Creator's mouth saying that DQ was always owned by Enix"

https://www.polygon.com/features/2018/9/20/17876714/yuji-horii-dragon-quest-11-interview(edited)

People are using this to say that there is no '4 companies issue' and that it's just Square and the composer. What say you all to this?

Also, Dai form the DQ mange Adventures of Dai was revealed for Jump Force, but no one seems to care. I for one want to see if SE decides to double-dip and get that double DQ rep. I know that apparently SE has nothing to do with this manga, but it is DQ-related.

This doesn't say anything about Enix owning the IP, armor Project was there from the beginning and Enix had exclusive publishing rights. That's always been the case.

 

[ZelDan]

emphasis on "was". and shovel knight is probably going to get a mii costume.

As someone who really wanted Shovel Knight playable in Smash, I think a mii costume for him would actually be kinda cool. I think Shovel Knight's proportions might come close to those of the Miis, and like Skull kid, you wouldn't even have to worry about the Mii face, since he wears a helmet. If a shovel could replace the sword that'd be even better (do any costumes do stuff like that in Ultimate so far?)

 

[Deleted member]

I'm sorry, but whoever made that "poll" where it showed Shovel Knight as #1 was total bias. Compared to the top 10 I listed, he was not even highly requested as them.

shovel knight was definitely highly requested since he has an assist trophy, which is far more substantial than anything geno got.

Shovel Knight being an assist trophy doesn’t mean he got in because so many people wanted him playable. We don’t know why he’s an assist trophy. If you rebut this in saying it was the most likely cause, try and gauge the actual support for Shovel Knight in Smash; you’ll find it’s not nearly as great as one might think (even i was surprised). If anything, I’d assume his inclusion as an assist was because he’s practically the face of indies.

If there were an indie rep it would be her

Why?

-the original indie darling
-face of indies ( Tetrin )
-debuted on a Nintendo console
-has a great history with Nintendo
-moveset potential
-more popular in Japan than SK
-highly requested female character for smash
-Nintendo game creators liked/tried her out (tloz,WarioWare,Pokémon)
-she’s cuter than jigglypuff
-more expressive than SK

She is the best character I have ever seen and supported

 

[MissingGlitch]

Brave is still Geno though. You can trust me. I am able to write a forum post on the internet.

 

[Ovaltine]

Brave is still Geno though. You can trust me. I am able to write a forum post on the internet.

You and Luigi on a Game Boy from the Game Boy Camera program saying that Geno is in are our only hopes.

 

[ZelDan]

Brave is still Geno though. You can trust me. I am able to write a forum post on the internet.

My dad's friend's uncle's wife works at Nintendo and can confirm this.

 

[MissingGlitch]

My dad's friend's uncle's wife works at Nintendo and can confirm this.

You just can't give away my source like that wtf

 

[Tetrin]

If there were an indie rep it would be her
View attachment 187488
Why?

-the original indie darling
-face of indies ( Tetrin )
-debuted on a Nintendo console
-has a great history with Nintendo
-moveset potential
-more popular in Japan than SK
-highly requested female character for smash
-Nintendo game creators liked/tried her out (tloz,WarioWare,Pokémon)
-she’s cuter than jigglypuff
-more expressive than SK

She is the best character I have ever seen and supported

I’d definitely say that title goes to Shovel Knight, but I guess we’ll just agree to disagree.

Personally The Knight from Hollow Knight is my character of worship, and I respect Shantae’s populrity, but I think Shovel Knight is just universal.

 

[Musubi]

So I ordered the SMRPG shirt from Yetee that was part of AGDQ this year. Does anyone have any experience with getting shirts for AGDQ and could tell me about when I could expect to receive my shirt?

 

[Deleted member]

As someone who really wanted Shovel Knight playable in Smash, I think a mii costume for him would actually be kinda cool. I think Shovel Knight's proportions might come close to those of the Miis, and like Skull kid, you wouldn't even have to worry about the Mii face, since he wears a helmet. If a shovel could replace the sword that'd be even better (do any costumes do stuff like that in Ultimate so far?)

Well, there's the Ashley and Vince ones, replacing the swords with a staff and paintbrush respectively

Also, @Connorb0t2 this is the Geno thread not the Shantae thread. If you're going to bring up why she deserves to be in, please do it over there

 

[Deleted member]

Well, there's the Ashley and Vince ones, replacing the swords with a staff and paintbrush respectively

Lip's replaces the sword with a flower as well

 

[Deleted member]

Lip's replaces the sword with a flower as well

Tbh I keep forgetting Lip's mii costume exists

 

[MattX20]

Good lord, this thread has so many mood swings. We shouldn't be so down in the dumps regarding Geno's chances as DLC right now. It's pointlessly pesimistic, when we know that "Brave" has stats equivalent to Geno and others like Duck Hunt, the Mii Gunner, and more importantly many insiders are swearing it's adult Erdrick (kid Erdrick doesn't exist, that's just a chibi version of the same character from DQ 3). And even if "Brave" isn't the second character, there are still 3 others beyond that.

 

[MissingGlitch]

And even if "Brave" isn't the second character, there are still 3 others beyond that.

The main issue with this point is that it is highly unlikely that Square Enix gets two DLC characters. So if its any other SE character then the last characters won't be Geno.

It's the exact reason people are so concerned about Steve. Steve means Banjo has no chance for this game. So Erdrick being announced means Geno isn't happening.

 

[MattX20]

The main issue with this point is that it is highly unlikely that Square Enix gets two DLC characters. So if its any other SE character then the last characters won't be Geno.

Geno is considered a Mario character by the game's Spirit for him, and given that both Konami and Capcom got 3 characters each in the base game, the idea of Square getting two more characters as DLC isn't really that absurd. Right now, that logic of Square getting only one DLC character is just a fan rule at best. Until all 5 are shown off, we can't really say that's the case.

 

[Ze Diglett]

It's the exact reason people are so concerned about Steve. Steve means Banjo has no chance for this game. So Erdrick being announced means Geno isn't happening.

I wouldn't go that far, but I do agree that two SE characters as DLC isn't likely. Hell, two DLC reps from the same company at all is an unlikely scenario.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Geno is considered a Mario character by the game's Spirit for him, and given that both Konami and Capcom got 3 characters each in the base game, the idea of Square getting two more characters as DLC isn't really that absurd. Right now, that logic of Square getting only one DLC character is just a fan rule at best. Until all 5 are shown off, we can't really say that's the case.

I will give you the fan rules part. Most of us assume based off little hints that Square Enix was the hardest people to work with for Smash. So we all assume its unlikely that Nintendo would want to work with them enough to want to pay for 2 characters to be DLC. Especially when there are other companies who are on much friendlier terms with Nintendo and would be more then happy to negotiate for a character.

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

Well, there's the Ashley and Vince ones, replacing the swords with a staff and paintbrush respectively

Also, @Connorb0t2 this is the Geno thread not the Shantae thread. If you're going to bring up why she deserves to be in, please do it over there

They're fine to discuss their most wanted character in the Geno thread, I don't mind. We're all friends here.
I discuss reasons why I want Banjo, Crono, and the Arbiter in Smash on this thread, so why should they be yelled at?

 

[TooManyToastahs]

Also, @Connorb0t2 this is the Geno thread not the Shantae thread. If you're going to bring up why she deserves to be in, please do it over there

No need to be so hostile about that, we’re just here to talk about video game characters. It’s not like there’s anything that’s going on for that to interrupt the conversation.

 

[Teeb147]

It's better to stay on topic of the thread but it's fine to stray from it,.. but If it goes on for too long or someone only talks off-topic then that can be something to look at.

While I don't think Nintendo would have a problem making two dlc characters from the same company, depending on who it is, I do think it's more likely to be different ones. But who knows maybe nintendo would surprise us with a bonus character that comes along the SE one (I know, that's wishful thinking, but we never know with sakurai)

 

[MissingGlitch]

It would just suck to have a Smash game called Ultimate and not have those last few remaining heavily requested characters like Geno. It just doesn't feel right for them to essentially be pushed aside for yet another game so Nintendo can promote a few upcoming releases.

 

[ForsakenM]

This doesn't say anything about Enix owning the IP, armor Project was there from the beginning and Enix had exclusive publishing rights. That's always been the case.

Right, I read some of the article, what I'm saying is people are using the statement I selected from that article to say that the whole 'Erdrick has Square, Armor Project, Bird Studios, the defunct company, and Sugiyama' is no longer true and that it's just Square and Sugiyama because Toriyama isn't an issue and the defunct company doesn't matter apparently.

I could probably easily research a way to counter this, but since PapaGenos's leak speculation section of Discord is a dumpster fire and I got banned for doing nothing but pointing out why in all honesty Erdrick has no more going for him than any other character on the grand scheme of things, I lack the motivation.

Also yes, I didn't tag Papa because I'm tired of tagging him here complaining about his Discord. It's not his fault and I don't want him to constantly feel bad. Also also, if anyone was starting to wonder if I might be the problem there, just keep in mind that while I've decided that Datboigeno has the best idea of how to deal with these idiots who think Erdrick is actually already in the game and ignore counterpoints while spamming emotes of him, I've also peacefully debated people who think it's Erdrick but admit they have no idea for sure.

God, I'm just so f***ing sick of these goddamn Erdrick-d***-riding, mouth-breathing, weak-debating, self-absorbed, c**-guzzling wastes of flesh.

Phew...that feels better.

 

[MissingGlitch]

who think Erdrick is actually already in the game and ignore counterpoints while spamming emotes of him

Take this from someone who got really into the Grinch leak. Tone back your expectations while you still can. This is the exact sort of thing the Grinch believers went through when we outright expected the Grinch leak to be real. And we all remember what happened? We ended up having our hearts destroyed the very second the wrestling ring appeared on screen. I wanted nothing to do with Smash for at least a week afterwards. Don't let the same thing happen to you because you expect it to be Erdrick.

I know someone is gonna say "But all the insiders said the Grinch Leak was fake!" In hindsight it was super obvious how the leak was fake because of the time frame it would take to reveal them all and the stuff Sakurai said about slowed down reveals. It would have been super easy for them to just say it was fake and to continue pushing their story.

 

[ForsakenM]

Take this from someone who got really into the Grinch leak. Tone back your expectations while you still can. This is the exact sort of thing the Grinch believers went through when we outright expected the Grinch leak to be real. And we all remember what happened? We ended up having our hearts destroyed the very second the wrestling ring appeared on screen. I wanted nothing to do with Smash for at least a week afterwards. Don't let the same thing happen to you because you expect it to be Erdrick.

I know someone is gonna say "But all the insiders said the Grinch Leak was fake!" In hindsight it was super obvious how the leak was fake because of the time frame it would take to reveal them all and the stuff Sakurai said about slowed down reveals. It would have been super easy for them to just say it was fake and to continue pushing their story.

Don't worry bro, I don't believe it's Erdrick: I think he's leakbait, and that's why these leakers have heard him so much and why he's the ONLY THING YOU CAN TALK ABOUT!

I was merely expressing how frustrating it is trying to even mention the option of Erdrick not being Brave in certain circles, namely Papa's Discord.

Damn, and speaking of the beautiful man himself, he hops in right after that mod flexed on me? So unfair.

I hope Grapevine chokes on his own vine.

EDIT: To relate more to your post, I personally never believed the Grinch Ruse, just slightly hoped so as it was the Dream Team. It was just too unreasonable for the time, and this was from someone who refuted box theory for many different reasons. I enjoyed the ride of the memes and tried to remind people to remember it's not official until Nintendo announces it, just like I am now with Erdrick...and just like with the Grinch Ruse, no one is listening now and partying way too early.

 

[MissingGlitch]

The lesson is that to much blind faith is a bad thing. Because there is a huge chance you will be let down. Hard. When all we have is a 5chan post and a bunch of anonymous people saying "Yup its totally X character" you really need to take a step back and question it a little bit.

 

[Deleted member]

No need to be so hostile about that, we’re just here to talk about video game characters. It’s not like there’s anything that’s going on for that to interrupt the conversation.

I wasn't even trying to be hostile about it

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I think Verge will get screwed over by his SE character claim, because I don't even know anymore.

I trust Verge because of him getting so much right so far. But I will be delighted if he's dead wrong about any claims that he has made that hasn't come true yet because I'm tired of him spoiling almost everything.

It would just suck to have a Smash game called Ultimate and not have those last few remaining heavily requested characters like Geno. It just doesn't feel right for them to essentially be pushed aside for yet another game so Nintendo can promote a few upcoming releases.

For us fans it doesn't make sense, but for Nintendo it does. To them, bringing back every veteran and completing the villains lineup to the original 8 was good enough to them or Sakurai to call this game Ultimate. Of course, we wouldn't have gotten , , and without fan demand and the Smash Ballot. But they were more obvious missing puzzles to the roster.

Edit: Oops, I double posted my bad. Can the mods came and fix this please?

 

[kiteinthesky]

For us fans it doesn't make sense, but for Nintendo it does. To them, bringing back every veteran and completing the villains lineup to the original 8 was good enough to them or Sakurai to call this game Ultimate. Of course, we wouldn't have gotten , , and without fan demand and the Smash Ballot. But they were more obvious missing puzzles to the roster.

The fans' opinions are more important because we're their customer base, though, and those franchises affected our lives in deeply profound ways, not theirs. To them these characters are just cash cows. The higher-ups at Nintendo treat the Mario cast like they're an acting troupe putting on plays for ****'s sake.

And sure, because of current copyright law they have a monopoly on those characters right now meaning they control what's in the game or not, but we're the ones who control whether they stay in business or not by choosing to give them money, and that's a power we have to learn to wield if we want any results or meaningful progress. Not just for video games, but for ANYTHING. We live in an exceedingly cruel capitalist society where the only vote that matters is your dollar and instead of fighting it or passively accepting it we need to take advantage of it.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

To be fair, it is called Special in Japan (aka not much different than Fatal Fury Special). It's NOA's poor decision to use a word that made them write themselves into a corner. What will the subtitles for the next localised sequels be? Ultimate Deluxe? Ultra? Showdown? Scuffle? War? Magnificent?

Also, this is getting a little too political, can we leave society issues out of this, please?

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I agree with KirbyWorshipper2465, we should leave politics out of gaming discussions.

 

[Deleted member]

The fans' opinions are more important because we're their customer base, though, and those franchises affected our lives in deeply profound ways, not theirs. To them these characters are just cash cows. The higher-ups at Nintendo treat the Mario cast like they're an acting troupe putting on plays for ****'s sake.

And sure, because of current copyright law they have a monopoly on those characters right now meaning they control what's in the game or not, but we're the ones who control whether they stay in business or not by choosing to give them money, and that's a power we have to learn to wield if we want any results or meaningful progress. Not just for video games, but for ANYTHING. We live in an exceedingly cruel capitalist society where the only vote that matters is your dollar and instead of fighting it or passively accepting it we need to take advantage of it.

I mean, Nintendo's been doing a decent job at appealing to both longtime and modern fans of Smash. Just with the newcomers:

Ridley, K.Rool, and Simon were added to appeal longtime hardcore fans. Chrom and Dark Samus were also very easy clones to make that were spawned off of fan demand since the previous game. Ken had a bit of a following too after the echo fighter reveal.

Modern fans who are just now getting into Smash (since nobody bought a Wii U) got Isabelle, Incineroar, and Inkling. You could argue Daisy was a good echo fighter for casuals but she was also in a bit of demand as well. You might be able to argue Joker as well since he's a newer character, but I would say that's disingenuous since the rest of the DLC hasn't even been revealed yet.

Then there are characters that could easily go both ways, like Richter and P L A N T.

Honestly none of these characters are bad picks at all and they all have their place here. It just seems pretty obvious that Nintendo was trying to balance the newcomers for both sides. And, I mean, can you blame them? Both hardcore fans and casuals supply them with a ton of money, so it makes sense to appeal to both rather then just the one. And anyways, there are only like 2 or 3 "longtime popular" picks left, like Isaac, Geno, and Banjo. And Geno and Banjo are both third parties. Isaac is really the only one that I'm surprised hasn't been included yet.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

And anyways, there are only like 2 or 3 "longtime popular" picks left, like Isaac, Geno, and Banjo. And Geno and Banjo are both third parties. Isaac is really the only one that I'm surprised hasn't been included yet.

Dead/dormant franchises from third-parties seem to have more leeway than first in terms of being considered, apparently (e.g. Castlevania basically had nothing recently new until Simon got confirmed). The main thing in this case is that he'd need a new GS so that Camelot can get out of their Mario sports rut.

One thing for sure is though, it may be the end of an era of speculation by the time DLC support for this game stops.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I mean, Nintendo's been doing a decent job at appealing to both longtime and modern fans of Smash. Just with the newcomers:

Ridley, K.Rool, and Simon were added to appeal longtime hardcore fans. Chrom and Dark Samus were also very easy clones to make that were spawned off of fan demand since the previous game. Ken had a bit of a following too after the echo fighter reveal.

Modern fans who are just now getting into Smash (since nobody bought a Wii U) got Isabelle, Incineroar, and Inkling. You could argue Daisy was a good echo fighter for casuals but she was also in a bit of demand as well. You might be able to argue Joker as well since he's a newer character, but I would say that's disingenuous since the rest of the DLC hasn't even been revealed yet.

Then there are characters that could easily go both ways, like Richter and P L A N T.

Honestly none of these characters are bad picks at all and they all have their place here. It just seems pretty obvious that Nintendo was trying to balance the newcomers for both sides. And, I mean, can you blame them? Both hardcore fans and casuals supply them with a ton of money, so it makes sense to appeal to both rather then just the one. And anyways, there are only like 2 or 3 "longtime popular" picks left, like Isaac, Geno, and Banjo. And Geno and Banjo are both third parties. Isaac is really the only one that I'm surprised hasn't been included yet.

Don't forget about Bomberman, Krystal, and Waluigi who like , , Geno, Isaac, and Banjo have been highly requested since the pre-Brawl days.