Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Potatu]

So I'm just curious.... what would be your Square List of Priority when it comes to Smash?

I'd have to go Geno > Chrono > Sora > Sephiroth > Lara Croft >>>>>>>> Slime >>>>>>>>>>> Other DQ rep.

Geno > Tidus/FF4 rep > Crono > basically anyone >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lara Croft

 

[Lime3037]

Mii costumes would be the best case scenario for Dragon Quest representation, imo. The costumes might not make as much as a character, but I think more people would prefer that representation as opposed to a full-fledged character.

Reading that part about Cloud being overpowered makes me laugh. No wonder they didn't put him in the World of Light opening.
"No way is our character getting shown up by a pink puffball! In reality, Cloud just got stuck in traffic! Yes, that's it!"

 

[Oshawott777]

Me, Psycho, KCchief, Xigger, TBone, etc have been on this ride for a long time. We've all been here since the Brawl speculation days with several of us being migrants from Nsider (Nintendo's official online forum that closed October 2017). In every sense of the word, we're the Old Guard of the Geno fanbase.

I know that I'm late to this, look what I found!

I was a lurker on the old forums, but people like you guys are the reason why I wanted Geno and Ridley. Even though I didn't play their games at the time, people would talk about them all the time. I may not expect Geno, but I can still hope for him, right?

 

[PolarPanda]

I'd also like to know, no part of that says "Spirits don't deconfirm fighters" to me. In fact, all it says is "We made spirits for non-fighters"

"Single player experience," "Because we couldn't go through the process of creating 3D renders for all (1,297) of these characters," and by almost explicitly calling them trophy replacements in the direct. All these things imply they don't deconfirm fighters, considering DLC would not be a part of WoL, likely.

 

[Gum-Gum Smash]

"Single player experience," "Because we couldn't go through the process of creating 3D renders for all (1,297) of these characters," and by almost explicitly calling them trophy replacements in the direct. All these things imply they don't deconfirm fighters, considering DLC would not be a part of WoL, likely.

That's fair enough Polar. But again that's just assuming. I could also ask why remove obvious ones though? Sylux is another one that comes to mind. Here's hoping your right

 

[Lime3037]

So I finally stopped being lazy and looked up a list of franchises Square Enix owns.
If we get Bub and Bob or a Space Invaders alien (), I'm game (after Geno, of course).

 

[Potatu]

That's fair enough Polar. But again that's just assuming. I could also ask why remove obvious ones though? Sylux is another one that comes to mind. Here's hoping your right

Adeleine is missing too, but nobody seems to be rooting for her. Instead, they want(ed) Bandana Dee, Magolor and Marx.

 

[HolyKnight]

Adeleine is missing too, but nobody seems to be rooting for her. Instead, they want(ed) Bandana Dee, Magolor and Marx.

well yeah no one cares about a reskinned paint roller. she popped up twice. as a mid boss.

 

[Gum-Gum Smash]

Adeleine is missing too, but nobody seems to be rooting for her. Instead, they want(ed) Bandana Dee, Magolor and Marx.

Yes. In my previous post I said Adeleine, however. If I had to make a theory on her, not to get off topic, I think it's because Sakurai has bias against the character. Wasn't there something where he doesn't like human characters in Kirby? For Sylux, Metroid Prime 4. Porky is 30th Mother Anni. next year. Rhythm Heaven could get an unannounced Switch game next year, as it is huge. Especially in Japan, where people say NOJ picked the reps. For Warriors, maybe Sakurai doesn't care, I don't think Fire Emblem Warriors content is in as well as Hyrule. That's all the missing ones I think

 

[EarlTamm]

well yeah no one cares about a reskinned paint roller. she popped up twice. as a mid boss.

Addeline is nothing like the paint roller. Like, at all.

 

[ForsakenM]

So I was off the grid for a bit with a buddy and then I had work and have been both sick and busy, so I had a lot of pages to catch up with, but I'm going to bring up something that needs to be addressed, and it's something EricTheGamerman has brought up before but I didn't believe it until now: this is an echo chamber and I'm frankly disgusted at what a host of my fellow Geno fans here have done, particularly those here that I respected like Fatmanonice .

Now make no mistake, I get this is the 'Hey, we like Geno and want him in Smash thread' but the discussion I'm about to bring up has nothing to do with that. StormC was just a cool dude who's really active here on SmashBoards, and he responded to PokéfreakofBACON claiming that, and I QUOTE, "Do you remember Cloud's announcement? Most Smash fans were upset we got a character that's never been on a Nintendo console, and Final Fantasy fans were hyped for like a day or two, then ultimately stopped caring, likely because a lot of them don't even have Smash. It'd be the same thing with Master Chief."

His whole discussion brimmed from the fact that this person was actually just wrong to how Cloud was received. Literally a single search on Youtube of 'Cloud Smash Reaction' will prove to you that Cloud's inclusion was one of the most hype things Nintendo, Smash, or Sakurai have ever done or been a part of, and yet this person posts a comment like this that is not only completely incorrect factually but also incredibly personally biased and what do you guys do?

You all jump on StormC's back and push him out of the thread with stupid arguments that have nothing to do with his original claim that what PokeBacon said was literally just false, and now StormC has yet to return to this thread despite still being super active in other threads on SmashBoards.

This is unacceptable of us as a community and frankly is incredibly toxic and proof of an echo chamber of some degree and frankly I think all of you who reacted inappropriately to StormC without being informed of his goal of discussion should step back from this forum for a minute and think about what you've done and how it was wrong. I get that I sound like I'm treating those of you who did that like children, but to be honest most adults today act like children, and that's exactly how I felt when I saw what went down.

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After that spicy bit, I get to do even MORE unpopular stuff and once AGAIN play off my manz EricTheGamerman despite being against him most of this time: I don't think Geno is gonna make it as a playable fighter, not anymore, and I'm going to bring up evidence to explain why.

So many of you swear up and down that Spirits don't deconfirm characters, but even with that rather vague statement from Sakurai, we really don't know for sure do we? I mean, is it likely that over a thousand characters have been deconfirmed to be playable? MY argument is that I doubt ALL of them are, but I would say MOST of them are, and we have to hope and pray that Geno isn't one of those who are deconfirmed by being a Spirit. REMEMBER, the WHOLE point of Spirits is that we can get characters we would love to have in Smash that just simply cannot be a fighter for once reason or another, and Geno is now confirmed as a Spirit. I would also like to briefly bring up the presence of false confidence in the community during the time Geno was merely an icon for the online lobby mode and not revealed as a Spirit yet. I find it funny how everyone was SO sure that he wasn't a Spirit because icons were a separate thing but yet when people kept bringing up things that could point to that meaning he is also a Spirit, no one even countered that point: you all just immediately fell back on the 'Spirits don't deconfirm characters' bit. That shows a weak will to debate and lack of confidence in your own stance.

Now, in PolarPanda 's OWN WORDS, no one knows what the DLC is...NO ONE. I proceed to bring you to a world where no one means just that, and that we throw out Vergeben's words right alongside LeakyPandy and Hitagi. Consider the fact that it's confirmed that Vergeben got most of his info from Stealth and friends and that it has been stated he 'burned his bridges' with his sources, and you can see that it's entirely possible that Vergeben has run out of actual info as of the final Direct for the game. If you also assume that NO ONE KNOWS includes Stealth and Vergeben's other sources, then it's even more likely that Vergeben is entirely wrong on his DLC speculation.

Now I know that he recently said 'MINECRAFT BOSS GUIZ!' but let's be honest with ourselves for a moment: have we seen any MC content in the base game? Do we have dead-set info on the supposed Rare titles found via datamining? How much sense would it make to have a MC boss base game with no Steve as a playable character? Better yet, what sense would it make to have a MC boss AT ALL without Steve as a playable character, considering such a boss would make no sense for any other character to face at the end of a Classic Mode run? You could make the argument that it could be for B&K and be this nuanced thing to represent that battle of B&K vs MC for trying to make it into Smash, but that's just poetic thought patterns.

Now ladies and gentlemen, I proceed to show you two worlds. The first one is where there is some truth, but Square's strange hold on their IPs and unrelenting stingy nature ruin our dreams of grandeur. Imagine us getting a Square rep but it's either Lightning/Noctis and we do get Geno, but only as his Mii Costume again, advertised in a similar manner as last time because that's all Nintendo could get out of Square regardless of positions and corporate pull. That is a world I believe is possible to live in.

The other is worse: Vergeben is completely wrong and we get NO Square rep and Geno's Mii Costume doesn't return at all. All we get from Square is Geno's Spirit and an icon to remember our favorite obscure hero by. Sure, if anything we've heard with character rumors is remotely true, then this one isn't likely at all...but NO ONE KNOWS the DLC, so rumors we hear could be so fake or false that Square might not even be involved in any more Smash content.

Just food for thought, because honestly the positivity around Geno here has become so supercharged that some of us have made stupid decisions and pushed people out of the thread of speculation. I get it: you all want Geno. I do too, but I'd rather stay realistic and gather facts and weigh them against one another and make an opinion, and the one thing keeping me hopeful was that his Spirit hadn't been revealed yet. Now I have little to hold onto other than hearsay and common sense that we all know that Square and Nintendo don't always apply.

Hey everyone just to let you know I'm still on the ship and getting a snack. You all want anything?

I need a Pick-Me-Up after that Geno Spirit reveal, and maybe a Yoshi Cookie to give me a head-start.

-when the grinch leak was still possible, reading japanese reactions from 2ch was mostly "these are gaijin characters" even for Geno

First off, my GOD that comes off as fairly racist. I mean, when you have your own slang-ish term for what people outside your country want AND your culture is known for being rather xenophobic...I'm just pointing it out here.

Secondly, and more importantly, that's a crock of crapola: No on in Japan wants DQ in Smash, not when compared to Sora or Geno, and Geno has placed high in Japan Smash wants since almost over 10 god-blessed years ago. So yeah, that's a bunch of crap, but then again you did get that from 2ch so...what more was there to expect?

Maybe Nintendo saw the backlash against characters like Incineroar and Piranha Plant, or how hated Kencineroar/how beloved Grinch theory was, and decided Sakurai’s lost his touch and somebody new needs to step in.

Spoiler: Reaction in a Nut Shell

My god guys, we really need to stop acting as if Sakurai doesn't know what we want for Smash. Sakurai is the one who chose and insisted on getting Cloud even though Square was hoping for and likely wanted and suggested their more modern characters. Sakurai is the one who sat down in front of this team and said 'Okay, we are bringing every character from Smash back in this game, including those who were cut from previous titles and the DLC from Smash 4' and stood his ground even when his team looked at him in silence like he was actually mentally handicapped. he is the one who ultimately (haha, get it?) the one who approved and helped make Ridley and K. Rool a reality. He hears us and he knows what we want and 9/10 he gives it to us. Sure, he had a struggle versus what fans wanted and his creative identity back in the day, but that was then and this is now. He's MORE than proven himself.

In fact, the only reason I even have a glimmer of hope left out there for Geno's chances is that Sakurai acknowledged us as a fanbase and seems to still want him in. If Sakurai has any say in this, I know we will get Geno, but at this point it depends on two things: was one of the options Nintendo gave him, or does Sakurai have enough pull that he was able to put him on the list regardless?

I don't blame him. After all, when I was a kid I believed Geno's lock of hair was his nose.

Okay, so hear me out: for some reason as a kid/young teen I thought Geno's hair was his nose and the design on his hat was a pair of glasses and that he had kinda squinty eyes like the -.- emoticon, which always gave me the impression that he was kinda silly-looking for how badass he was but it also made sense to me because he was kinda the wise sage of the group who was mostly neutral in emotion and goal-oriented.

...idk man, don't ask me...

 

[TheCJBrine]

"Spirits disconfirm fighters"

Excuse me, I don't think Nintendo gives a crap; if they want a certain character but they're already a Spirit, Sakurai may say yes anyway instead of saying no because of a png image...

I mean, can you imagine:

"Can you make this character?"

"No, because they're already a Spirit."

"Ah yes, we know about the Spirits..." *points out Chrom* "Isn't this character breaking your rules (looks to the crowd) or, technically, the fan's rules?"

*they all laugh*

"Okay, okay, yeah, I'll get right on it."

 

[StormC]

I appreciate the post, ForsakenM . I chose to not post again because I felt my time and energy could be better spent elsewhere, as I've gone too deep down the rabbit hole of Smash arguments before to expend considerable effort on going against the grain of this thread. I've said it many times that SMRPG is one of my all time favorite games so it's not like I hate Geno or anything, but it's clear I have fundamental disagreements with the way discussion has been conducted in this thread (right or wrong). So indeed, I have not posted since.

I don't know if Geno will get or not. He's kind of a question mark right now. I feel it's possible that Geno will get selected, or Nintendo/Sakurai will select a more mainstream character. But after spending so much time in the K. Rool thread and seeing people take out their frustration at his exclusion on characters in the roster, including ones I liked, I didn't care to see a repeat of it. If Geno gets in, I'll be happy for his fans. A few disagreements in a forum thread don't really reflect on the thousands of people on the internet who want Geno. I think some of the hostility stems from bitterness over the Grinch leak being fake (which is understandable). My interaction with this thread is just an anecdote.

It will be interesting to see what happens. I'm personally even starting to doubt a Square DLC character existing.

 

[PolarPanda]

"Spirits disconfirm fighters"

Excuse me, I don't think Nintendo gives a crap; if they want a certain character but they're already a Spirit, Sakurai may say yes anyway instead of saying no because of a png image...

I mean, can you imagine:

"Can you make this character?"

"No, because they're already a Spirit."

"Ah yes, we know about the Spirits..." *points out Chrom* "Isn't this character breaking your rules (looks to the crowd) or, technically, the fan's rules?"

*they all laugh*

"Okay, okay, yeah, I'll get right on it."

Best argument against spirit's deconfirming, IMO, is the whole point that they were decided by different teams. Sakurai has consistently referred to spirits as a thing that "we" (the Smash development team) created. They made the list and they implemented the spirits. Whereas all the DLC, aside from Pirannah most likely, were decided by an entirely different team. Imo I don't think Porky's spirit is missing at all. Next to other antagonists, he has an online icon from Mother 3, it's just the absolute safety capsule (which is also a spirit). I figured this was just a clever joke that Galeem's beam couldn't break that dumb capsule.

Sylux is understandable, so far he was only really in Metroid Prime Hunters, which was nowhere near the most recognized Metroid game.

 

[Gum-Gum Smash]

"Spirits disconfirm fighters"

Excuse me, I don't think Nintendo gives a crap; if they want a certain character but they're already a Spirit, Sakurai may say yes anyway instead of saying no because of a png image...

I mean, can you imagine:

"Can you make this character?"

"No, because they're already a Spirit."

"Ah yes, we know about the Spirits..." *points out Chrom* "Isn't this character breaking your rules (looks to the crowd) or, technically, the fan's rules?"

*they all laugh*

"Okay, okay, yeah, I'll get right on it."

I said this in my first message. I was mostly talking about Chrono Trigger and not Spirits. But my point about Spirits was that everything was planned in the beginning. How do you know Nintendo didn't pick the characters, then Sakurai purposely didn't put them as Spirits. Especially since we know DLC was planned, because missing SSS spots and Rex. If it was Wave 2, you'd probably have a point

 

[GhostYB]

"Spirits disconfirm fighters"

Excuse me, I don't think Nintendo gives a crap; if they want a certain character but they're already a Spirit, Sakurai may say yes anyway instead of saying no because of a png image...

I mean, can you imagine:

"Can you make this character?"

"No, because they're already a Spirit."

"Ah yes, we know about the Spirits..." *points out Chrom* "Isn't this character breaking your rules (looks to the crowd) or, technically, the fan's rules?"

*they all laugh*

"Okay, okay, yeah, I'll get right on it."

i actually can and im pretty sure thats how itll actually go down LUL

 

[Fatmanonice]

I know that I'm late to this, look what I found!

I was a lurker on the old forums, but people like you guys are the reason why I wanted Geno and Ridley. Even though I didn't play their games at the time, people would talk about them all the time. I may not expect Geno, but I can still hope for him, right?

Yep... There's my old sig with Geno, Ridley, Megaman, Vaati, and... Bill Cosby... I know, that hasn't aged well...

Anyways, thanks for the encouragement!

 

[Gum-Gum Smash]

Best argument against spirit's deconfirming, IMO, is the whole point that they were decided by different teams. Sakurai has consistently referred to spirits as a thing that "we" (the Smash development team) created. They made the list and they implemented the spirits. Whereas all the DLC, aside from Pirannah most likely, were decided by an entirely different team. Imo I don't think Porky's spirit is missing at all. Next to other antagonists, he has an online icon from Mother 3, it's just the absolute safety capsule (which is also a spirit). I figured this was just a clever joke that Galeem's beam couldn't break that dumb capsule.

Sylux is understandable, so far he was only really in Metroid Prime Hunters, which was nowhere near the most recognized Metroid game.

Other Spirits have the name of the character with them. I could look them up if you'd like. Like I said before, I'm not sure, as they probably would've put his Brawl model (aren't Spirits suppose to be a way to play as characters, why hinder it?) And even if your right, wouldn't it be something with his name like Absolutely Safe Capsule (Porky) or something like that. They do that for other characters.

And yeah about Sylux. But then they have the other Hunters from that game that are way less popular than Sylux as Spirits. You see what I'm saying?

 

[ForsakenM]

I appreciate the post, ForsakenM . I chose to not post again because I felt my time and energy could be better spent elsewhere, as I've gone too deep down the rabbit whole of Smash arguments before to expend considerable effort on going against the grain of this thread. I've said it many times that SMRPG is one of my all time favorite games so it's not like I hate Geno or anything, but it's clear I have fundamental disagreements with the way discussion has been conducted in this thread (right or wrong). So indeed, I have not posted since.

I don't know if Geno will get or not. He's kind of a question mark right now. I feel it's possible that Geno will get selected, or Nintendo/Sakurai will select a more mainstream character. But after spending so much time in the K. Rool thread and seeing people take out their frustration on his exclusion on characters in the roster, including ones I liked, I didn't care to see a repeat of it. If Geno gets in, I'll be happy for his fans. A few disagreements in a forum thread don't really reflect on the thousands of people on the internet who want Geno. I think some of the hostility stems from bitterness over the Grinch leak being fake (which is understandable). My interaction with this thread is just an anecdote.

It will be interesting to see what happens. I'm personally even starting to doubt a Square DLC character existing.

That's completely fair and I'm not blaming everyone in the thread, only those who responded to you the way the did. They completely ignored your whole point and conversation and acted amazingly defensive over nothing of importance, and if they did it to you they could do it again and I see that has the beginnings of something horrid that we REALLY don't want to start. Waluigi fans get flack because TWO KIDS sent stupid shiz to Sakurai on Twitter, imagine if one of the biggest places for Geno fans was written off as a bunch of obsessive losers who do nothing but attack people who dare threaten the chances of their character getting in? Would be bad times ahead, and I know we are better than that.

Also I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks we may not even get a Square rep at all. For some reason, even if you love SMRPG and Geno and want him in Smash, if you start to hold an opinion that conflicts with 'Hey, Geno's gonna make it guys!' in this thread, you KINDA get the wolf pack released on you and I'm starting to get miffed about it.

 

[Datboigeno]

So I was off the grid for a bit with a buddy and then I had work and have been both sick and busy, so I had a lot of pages to catch up with, but I'm going to bring up something that needs to be addressed, and it's something EricTheGamerman has brought up before but I didn't believe it until now: this is an echo chamber and I'm frankly disgusted at what a host of my fellow Geno fans here have done, particularly those here that I respected like Fatmanonice .

Now make no mistake, I get this is the 'Hey, we like Geno and want him in Smash thread' but the discussion I'm about to bring up has nothing to do with that. StormC was just a cool dude who's really active here on SmashBoards, and he responded to PokéfreakofBACON claiming that, and I QUOTE, "Do you remember Cloud's announcement? Most Smash fans were upset we got a character that's never been on a Nintendo console, and Final Fantasy fans were hyped for like a day or two, then ultimately stopped caring, likely because a lot of them don't even have Smash. It'd be the same thing with Master Chief."

His whole discussion brimmed from the fact that this person was actually just wrong to how Cloud was received. Literally a single search on Youtube of 'Cloud Smash Reaction' will prove to you that Cloud's inclusion was one of the most hype things Nintendo, Smash, or Sakurai have ever done or been a part of, and yet this person posts a comment like this that is not only completely incorrect factually but also incredibly personally biased and what do you guys do?

You all jump on StormC's back and push him out of the thread with stupid arguments that have nothing to do with his original claim that what PokeBacon said was literally just false, and now StormC has yet to return to this thread despite still being super active in other threads on SmashBoards.

This is unacceptable of us as a community and frankly is incredibly toxic and proof of an echo chamber of some degree and frankly I think all of you who reacted inappropriately to StormC without being informed of his goal of discussion should step back from this forum for a minute and think about what you've done and how it was wrong. I get that I sound like I'm treating those of you who did that like children, but to be honest most adults today act like children, and that's exactly how I felt when I saw what went down.

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After that spicy bit, I get to do even MORE unpopular stuff and once AGAIN play off my manz EricTheGamerman despite being against him most of this time: I don't think Geno is gonna make it as a playable fighter, not anymore, and I'm going to bring up evidence to explain why.

So many of you swear up and down that Spirits don't deconfirm characters, but even with that rather vague statement from Sakurai, we really don't know for sure do we? I mean, is it likely that over a thousand characters have been deconfirmed to be playable? MY argument is that I doubt ALL of them are, but I would say MOST of them are, and we have to hope and pray that Geno isn't one of those who are deconfirmed by being a Spirit. REMEMBER, the WHOLE point of Spirits is that we can get characters we would love to have in Smash that just simply cannot be a fighter for once reason or another, and Geno is now confirmed as a Spirit. I would also like to briefly bring up the presence of false confidence in the community during the time Geno was merely an icon for the online lobby mode and not revealed as a Spirit yet. I find it funny how everyone was SO sure that he wasn't a Spirit because icons were a separate thing but yet when people kept bringing up things that could point to that meaning he is also a Spirit, no one even countered that point: you all just immediately fell back on the 'Spirits don't deconfirm characters' bit. That shows a weak will to debate and lack of confidence in your own stance.

Now, in PolarPanda 's OWN WORDS, no one knows what the DLC is...NO ONE. I proceed to bring you to a world where no one means just that, and that we throw out Vergeben's words right alongside LeakyPandy and Hitagi. Consider the fact that it's confirmed that Vergeben got most of his info from Stealth and friends and that it has been stated he 'burned his bridges' with his sources, and you can see that it's entirely possible that Vergeben has run out of actual info as of the final Direct for the game. If you also assume that NO ONE KNOWS includes Stealth and Vergeben's other sources, then it's even more likely that Vergeben is entirely wrong on his DLC speculation.

Now I know that he recently said 'MINECRAFT BOSS GUIZ!' but let's be honest with ourselves for a moment: have we seen any MC content in the base game? Do we have dead-set info on the supposed Rare titles found via datamining? How much sense would it make to have a MC boss base game with no Steve as a playable character? Better yet, what sense would it make to have a MC boss AT ALL without Steve as a playable character, considering such a boss would make no sense for any other character to face at the end of a Classic Mode run? You could make the argument that it could be for B&K and be this nuanced thing to represent that battle of B&K vs MC for trying to make it into Smash, but that's just poetic thought patterns.

Now ladies and gentlemen, I proceed to show you two worlds. The first one is where there is some truth, but Square's strange hold on their IPs and unrelenting stingy nature ruin our dreams of grandeur. Imagine us getting a Square rep but it's either Lightning/Noctis and we do get Geno, but only as his Mii Costume again, advertised in a similar manner as last time because that's all Nintendo could get out of Square regardless of positions and corporate pull. That is a world I believe is possible to live in.

The other is worse: Vergeben is completely wrong and we get NO Square rep and Geno's Mii Costume doesn't return at all. All we get from Square is Geno's Spirit and an icon to remember our favorite obscure hero by. Sure, if anything we've heard with character rumors is remotely true, then this one isn't likely at all...but NO ONE KNOWS the DLC, so rumors we hear could be so fake or false that Square might not even be involved in any more Smash content.

Just food for thought, because honestly the positivity around Geno here has become so supercharged that some of us have made stupid decisions and pushed people out of the thread of speculation. I get it: you all want Geno. I do too, but I'd rather stay realistic and gather facts and weigh them against one another and make an opinion, and the one thing keeping me hopeful was that his Spirit hadn't been revealed yet. Now I have little to hold onto other than hearsay and common sense that we all know that Square and Nintendo don't always apply.




I need a Pick-Me-Up after that Geno Spirit reveal, and maybe a Yoshi Cookie to give me a head-start.




First off, my GOD that comes off as fairly racist. I mean, when you have your own slang-ish term for what people outside your country want AND your culture is known for being rather xenophobic...I'm just pointing it out here.

Secondly, and more importantly, that's a crock of crapola: No on in Japan wants DQ in Smash, not when compared to Sora or Geno, and Geno has placed high in Japan Smash wants since almost over 10 god-blessed years ago. So yeah, that's a bunch of crap, but then again you did get that from 2ch so...what more was there to expect?

Spoiler: Reaction in a Nut Shell

My god guys, we really need to stop acting as if Sakurai doesn't know what we want for Smash. Sakurai is the one who chose and insisted on getting Cloud even though Square was hoping for and likely wanted and suggested their more modern characters. Sakurai is the one who sat down in front of this team and said 'Okay, we are bringing every character from Smash back in this game, including those who were cut from previous titles and the DLC from Smash 4' and stood his ground even when his team looked at him in silence like he was actually mentally handicapped. he is the one who ultimately (haha, get it?) the one who approved and helped make Ridley and K. Rool a reality. He hears us and he knows what we want and 9/10 he gives it to us. Sure, he had a struggle versus what fans wanted and his creative identity back in the day, but that was then and this is now. He's MORE than proven himself.

In fact, the only reason I even have a glimmer of hope left out there for Geno's chances is that Sakurai acknowledged us as a fanbase and seems to still want him in. If Sakurai has any say in this, I know we will get Geno, but at this point it depends on two things: was one of the options Nintendo gave him, or does Sakurai have enough pull that he was able to put him on the list regardless?



Okay, so hear me out: for some reason as a kid/young teen I thought Geno's hair was his nose and the design on his hat was a pair of glasses and that he had kinda squinty eyes like the -.- emoticon, which always gave me the impression that he was kinda silly-looking for how badass he was but it also made sense to me because he was kinda the wise sage of the group who was mostly neutral in emotion and goal-oriented.

...idk man, don't ask me...

Well first off i think you’re really framing what happened in the cloud discussion in a way that is untrue. There were several people who disagreed with the sentiment that Cloud was received negatively. Also plenty of people stated they were jumping ship or were unsure of Geno’s chances after he was revealed to be a spirit. You’re just making generalizations about dozens of people with differences of opinion. Also your next grand conclusion: Vergeben might be wrong. Wew. As if no one here has brought that up in the past. Clearly he might be wrong about things and in the past clearly was wrong about King K. Rool. I think plenty of people have pointed out his flaws as a leaker.

Really man, get off your high horse. This finger wagging does you no favors. If you have problems with certain things that have been said address those specific things/users but don’t make broad generalizations of the thread based on things that were said by a few people a few days ago.

 

[Fatmanonice]

ForsakenM So, what did I do? Apparently something bad enough for someone to lose all respect for me?

 

[FalconFire93]

9 more days until Ultimate releases, we’re in the single digits now, never thought I’d finally see the day.

So I finally stopped being lazy and looked up a list of franchises Square Enix owns.
If we get Bub and Bob or a Space Invaders alien (), I'm game (after Geno, of course).

Yes, Bub and Bub in the game as a 2-in-1 character like Ice Climbers, I wouldn’t even be mad.

 

[StormC]

Also you’re wrong in saying StormC hasn’t come back to the thread because he liked your post within a few minutes of it being up.

I was notified of his post in my alerts because I was tagged.

 

[EarlTamm]

Well first off i think you’re really framing what happened in the cloud discussion in a way that is untrue. There were several people who disagreed with the sentiment that Cloud was received negatively. Also you’re wrong in saying StormC hasn’t come back to the thread because he liked your post within a few minutes of it being up. Also plenty of people stated they were jumping ship or were unsure of Geno’s chances after he was revealed to be a spirit. You’re just making generalizations about dozens of people with differences of opinion. Also your next grand conclusion: Vergeben might be wrong. Wew. As if no one here has brought that up in the past. Clearly he might be wrong about things and in the past clearly was wrong about King K. Rool. I think plenty of people have pointed out his flaws as a leaker.

Really man, get off your high horse. This finger wagging does you no favors. If you have problems with certain things that have been said address those specific things/users but don’t make broad generalizations of the thread based on things that were said by a few people a few days ago.

Actually, he probably came because he was tagged, not because he still frequents. And I will say, despite my positive views on Geno, I agree that we should have more varied opinions to have less of an echo in this thread. Some points have been kinda repeating.

Edit: Got 'd by the man himself.

 

[Rocketjay8]

Really man, get off your high horse. This finger wagging does you no favors. If you have problems with certain things that have been said address those specific things/users but don’t make broad generalizations of the thread based on things that were said by a few people a few days ago.

You probably typed this up before his but...

That's completely fair and I'm not blaming everyone in the thread, only those who responded to you the way the did. They completely ignored your whole point and conversation and acted amazingly defensive over nothing of importance, and if they did it to you they could do it again and I see that has the beginnings of something horrid that we REALLY don't want to start. Waluigi fans get flack because TWO KIDS sent stupid shiz to Sakurai on Twitter, imagine if one of the biggest places for Geno fans was written off as a bunch of obsessive losers who do nothing but attack people who dare threaten the chances of their character getting in? Would be bad times ahead, and I know we are better than that.

Aso I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks we may not even get a Square rep at all. For some reason, even if you love SMRPG and Geno and want him in Smash, if you start to hold an opinion that conflicts with 'Hey, Geno's gonna make it guys!' in this thread, you KINDA get the wolf pack released on you and I'm starting to get miffed about it.

 

[GhostYB]

9 more days until Ultimate releases, we’re in the single digits now, never thought I’d finally see the day.



Yes, Bub and Bub in the game as a 2-in-1 character like Ice Climbers, I wouldn’t even be mad.

View attachment 180423

this is gonna be a loooong 9 days..

 

[Gum-Gum Smash]

Best argument against spirit's deconfirming, IMO, is the whole point that they were decided by different teams. Sakurai has consistently referred to spirits as a thing that "we" (the Smash development team) created. They made the list and they implemented the spirits. Whereas all the DLC, aside from Pirannah most likely, were decided by an entirely different team. Imo I don't think Porky's spirit is missing at all. Next to other antagonists, he has an online icon from Mother 3, it's just the absolute safety capsule (which is also a spirit). I figured this was just a clever joke that Galeem's beam couldn't break that dumb capsule.

Sylux is understandable, so far he was only really in Metroid Prime Hunters, which was nowhere near the most recognized Metroid game.

Didn't mean to double post. I edited the other one about the Sylux thing

 

[Datboigeno]

I was notified of his post in my alerts because I was tagged.

I will edit that part of my post then.

Actually, he probably came because he was tagged, not because he still frequents. And I will say, despite my positive views on Geno, I agree that we should have more varied opinions to have less of an echo in this thread. Some points have been kinda repeating.

Edit: Got 'd by the man himself.

Really? Because I feel like we’re getting a good amount of people that either regularly comment in the thread or jump into it from elsewhere and bring up the same arguments about why Geno might not be in and therefore we present our reasons for why certain things disprove those arguments or at the very least bring up things that are in Geno’s favor. Of course it’s going to sound repetitive because people keep making the same arguments. If people want a more varied discussion from people who are pro-Geno then they should bring up points we haven’t touched on at all rather than the same things people have brought up every day for the past month. People do try to redirect and ask things about when we first began liking Geno or what we want his moveset to look like but then someone comes in and says he’s definitely deconfirmed because he’s a spirit or that he’s irrelevant because SMRPG is old and we have to go over the same old points again.

 

[HMpoweredMan]

I made a bet with my friend that if Geno is in then I will buy a Switch and Smash. Until then I think I'm gonna hold out. If Nintendo wants my money...

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Adeleine is missing too, but nobody seems to be rooting for her. Instead, they want(ed) Bandana Dee, Magolor and Marx.

And Bubbles isn't among the NES retro character spirits, when even the goddamn Urban Champion has a spirit. Although I don't think that one will factor into anything...

this is gonna be a loooong 9 days..

On the bright side, only 2 days until the Star Allies update's out.

 

[EarlTamm]

I will edit that part of my post then.



Really? Because I feel like we’re getting a good amount of people that either regularly comment in the thread or jump into it from elsewhere and bring up the same arguments about why Geno might not be in and therefore we present our reasons for why certain things disprove those arguments or at the very least bring up things that are in Geno’s favor. Of course it’s going to sound repetitive because people keep making the same arguments. If people want a more varied discussion from people who are pro-Geno then they should bring up points we haven’t touched on at all rather than the same things people have brought up every day for the past month. People do try to redirect and ask things about when we first began liking Geno or what we want his moveset to look like but then someone comes in and says he’s definitely deconfirmed because he’s a spirit or that he’s irrelevant because SMRPG is old and we have to go over the same old points again.

That is true, that has certainly been the case several times. Honestly, this is why I brought up the general Square thread idea. At least then everyone from all sides could get a shot at new opinions and views and we could all possibly come to an consensus as a community.

 

[Gum-Gum Smash]

I will edit that part of my post then.



Really? Because I feel like we’re getting a good amount of people that either regularly comment in the thread or jump into it from elsewhere and bring up the same arguments about why Geno might not be in and therefore we present our reasons for why certain things disprove those arguments or at the very least bring up things that are in Geno’s favor. Of course it’s going to sound repetitive because people keep making the same arguments. If people want a more varied discussion from people who are pro-Geno then they should bring up points we haven’t touched on at all rather than the same things people have brought up every day for the past month. People do try to redirect and ask things about when we first began liking Geno or what we want his moveset to look like but then someone comes in and says he’s definitely deconfirmed because he’s a spirit or that he’s irrelevant because SMRPG is old and we have to go over the same old points again.

I brought up some points that nobody really gave a solid answer to yet. Also, I love Geno. I will reiterate that. But as other people have been saying, we need to be open to all ideas and not zone ourselves into a certain way of thinking. That's just going to make people hate the character and not want to play Super Mario RPG, and lead you all to disappointment when the character isn't in

 

[Datboigeno]

You probably typed this up before his but...

Yeah the problem with that statement is that he is making large generalizations in his original post putting in “you all” to describe to treatment of StormC with respect to the Cloud thing and other subjects and making big generalizations about the thread as a whole. If he wants to speak specifically to what certain people said that’s fine. But that’s not what he did.

I brought up some points that nobody really gave a solid answer to yet. Also, I love Geno. I will reiterate that. But as other people have been saying, we need to be open to all ideas and not zone ourselves into a certain way of thinking. That's just going to make people hate the character and not want to play Super Mario RPG, and lead you all to disappointment when the character isn't in

I mean there have been plenty of times where I made a certain point and was basically ignored and another person made the same point a few pages later and it developed into an in-depth discussion on said point. That’s the nature of fast moving threads like this. People are definitely welcome to different points of view but if someone just comes into the thread saying Sora is more likely than Geno for example after we’ve gone over that argument dozens of times do you think we’re really going to invest heavily in what that person is saying? Probably not. We’re just going to restate what has been brought up and move on. If someone is going to decide they hate Geno and never want to play SMRPG over an internet disagreement or not switching the minds of an entire thread on Geno’s chances over some small detail they should reevaluate some things in life.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Sakurai said himself that he doesn't force characters to work. Duck Hunt's encompassing concept is the NES Zapper. Pac-Man's is classic Namco Arcade games. That's pretty straight forward.

Just because Sakurai went back to the drawing board for some characters doesn't make him a hypocrite. Villager and Isabelle use things from the Animal Crossing games. Ridley is big and vicious. The Mii characters are intentionally kind of blank slates because they're literally player avatars. The concepts still stand and he's willing to try again with new games. He couldn't visualize Villager in Brawl as a fighter so they weren't included but he was able to with Snash 4. It's that simple.

From here you basically flat out admit that they'd have to dig deep to make a Dragon Quest hero unique, specifically mentioning a side trait from one game in a franchise that has 11 mainline entries (Erdrick wasn't even in DQV...) . As Sakurai said, third party characters are basically an accumulation of their franchise in concept and design. For a vast majority of the cast, he was able to think of concepts very quickly yet you yourself spin your wheels and simply blow off the character's defining characteristics as if they don't matter. On top of all of this, these designs and whatever creative liberties Sakurai does would have to be approved by a MINIMUM of three studios. Anyone says boo (Toriyama is a giant stickler and control freak for how his characters are depicted), and it all goes to crap. Futhermore, this is also the reason Dragon Quest characters have NEVER appeared outside a game that Square Enix didn't develop in its 32 year history.

You misunderstand. I don’t think that Sakurai would have to dig deep at all to come up with a moveset. Anyone who plays a Dragon Quest game sees there’s enough items and spells to easily come up with a unique moveset.

What I’m saying is, if Sakurai, for some reason, isn’t able to create a unique character out of that (and again, we don’t really have a sword + spellcaster aside from Robin, so there’s a lot of room to make a character unique in that niche), he can still pull from other games in the series (like you say, third party characters are an accumulation of their franchise). The monster catching aspect (which is just an example) is no side trait, as it inspired its own spinoff series and was a precursor to Pokémon.

What I’m saying is, it’s super easy to come up with a unique moveset for a DQ character. If Sakurai wills it (or, more accurately, if Nintendo wants him to), he can and will.

"Spirits disconfirm fighters"

Excuse me, I don't think Nintendo gives a crap; if they want a certain character but they're already a Spirit, Sakurai may say yes anyway instead of saying no because of a png image...

I mean, can you imagine:

"Can you make this character?"

"No, because they're already a Spirit."

"Ah yes, we know about the Spirits..." *points out Chrom* "Isn't this character breaking your rules (looks to the crowd) or, technically, the fan's rules?"

*they all laugh*

"Okay, okay, yeah, I'll get right on it."

Funny, the other day I said the same thing but replacing Spirits with Assist Trophies and I got **** on.

This thread can be a circle jerk sometimes...

 

[EarlTamm]

Yeah the problem with that statement is that he is making large generalizations in his original post putting in “you all” to describe to treatment of StormC with respect to the Cloud thing and other subjects and making big generalizations about the thread as a whole. If he wants to speak specifically to what certain people said that’s fine. But that’s not what he did.

That is fair, though maybe he just did not realize it. Really, I think both sides have done this sort if thing, unintentionally or not. Heck, I probably have as well.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Storm came in here and basically accused all of us of "trying to rewrite history" as if we were menacingly manufacturing propaganda to spread to the rest of the board because of one thing one person said. If there was one person who blew things out of proportion, it was them. I even said the person's statement was wrong but I also clarified that the entire fanbase was not accountable for someone being wrong despite this weird notion that we were supposed to collectively chastise them.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Tbh I'm not so sure we'll get Geno; while I like to believe Spirits don't disconfirm fighters, I find it odd how we have a Goomba Spirit, probably a Koopa one (I'm not really sure, but there may have been one in that datamine; I thought someone mentioned it before but I may be wrong), and yet no Piranha Plant Spirit, although I guess you could say it's because Piranha Plant was being developed earlier than the other DLC characters (I mean, that's obvious, since it's releasing in February like its amiibo I think).

However, I do think that Nintendo won't give a crap; if a character they want is already a Spirit, they won't care, and I'm sure Sakurai doesn't really care either. For Geno's case, if he was only a Spirit and never became playable, it wouldn't be because Sakurai didn't see his potential or whatever (lol those interviews with Sakurai clearly show he'd like, if not love, to add Geno, thinking he'd be perfect for Smash), it would be because Sakurai couldn't get Square's stingy selves to cooperate.

I'm also getting tired of these made-up fan-rules that the community keeps making tbh, and Chrom kinda already broke a few with how he's playable, part of a Final Smash, and also a Mii Costume; even if he was added late, if what people said about Sakurai was true, then he would've denied making Chrom playable even as an echo.

Personally, I think we're getting either Geno or Sora; maybe Crono, but I think it was discussed that he's in a similar position to Dragon Quest?

Funny, the other day I said the same thing but replacing Spirits with Assist Trophies and I got **** on.

This thread can be a circle jerk sometimes...

Tbh I kinda think Assist Trophies can become playable while still being ATs if Sakurai really wanted to, especially if Nintendo wanted a character that's already an AT; I mean, supposedly ATs already don't show up on certain stages (The Moon AT supposedly will never show up on Termina's Great Bay, which sucks because I wanted two Moons (three with a Skull Kid final smash)), so you'd think they could code specific ATs to be disabled when their respective playable-fighter is on stage.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

You misunderstand. I don’t think that Sakurai would have to dig deep at all to come up with a moveset. Anyone who plays a Dragon Quest game sees there’s enough items and spells to easily come up with a unique moveset.

What I’m saying is, if Sakurai, for some reason, isn’t able to create a unique character out of that (and again, we don’t really have a sword + spellcaster aside from Robin, so there’s a lot of room to make a character unique in that niche), he can still pull from other games in the series (like you say, third party characters are an accumulation of their franchise). The monster catching aspect (which is just an example) is no side trait, as it inspired its own spinoff series and was a precursor to Pokémon.

What I’m saying is, it’s super easy to come up with a unique moveset for a DQ character. If Sakurai wills it (or, more accurately, if Nintendo wants him to), he can and will.



Funny, the other day I said the same thing but replacing Spirits with Assist Trophies and I got **** on.

This board can be a circle jerk sometimes...

Yeah, you make a good point, for instance the main likely reason why Bomberman became an AT is because Saukrai wasn't able to come up with anything interesting for him at the time, but he does have him acknowledged in a big way in the meantime. He would need to sit down and sift through the various main entries and spin-offs to find something that compliments him planting bombs. This type of approach could work for Dragon Quest characters, which is helped by the fact that he wouldn't be limited to the equivalent of yet another FE lord, since DQ is a different set of toys, so to speak.

Fixed that for you. Honestly, this kind of problem is everywhere I go on it.

I'm also getting tired of these made-up fan-rules that the community keeps making tbh, and Chrom kinda already broke a few with how he's playable, part of a Final Smash, and also a Mii Costume; even if he was added late, if what people said about Sakurai was true, then he would've denied making Chrom playable even as an echo.

Personally, I think we're getting either Geno or Sora; maybe Crono, but I think it was discussed that he's in a similar position to Dragon Quest?



Tbh I kinda think Assist Trophies can become playable while still being ATs if Sakurai really wanted to, especially if Nintendo wanted a character that's already an AT; I mean, supposedly ATs already don't show up on certain stages (The Moon AT supposedly will never show up on Termina's Great Bay, which sucks because I wanted two Moons (three with a Skull Kid final smash)), so you'd think they could code specific ATs to be disabled when their respective playable-fighter is on stage.

It's a matter of when or if Sakurai will eventually break that rule, probably not this entry, but we do know they're willing to have ATs not show up under certain circumstances. Baby steps.

And I'm also tired of these stupid fan rules too, not even changed that. What's it going to take, Earthworm Jim showing up or something?

 

[TylerBlackRunIt]

No, you're not the only one. The real ending to the roster should be:

- Banjo & Kazooie
- Geno
- Crash Bandicoot
- Dixie Kong
- Bandana Dee

But It's not very likely we are going to get all these characters, especially with the recent announcement. Bandana Dee and Dixie Kong though could have a better shot now.

My prediction would be

- Rayman
- Crash Bandicoot
- Erdrick (The hero from Dragon Quest III)
- Minecrafter (Indie Rep)
- Jibanyan (Yo-Kai Watch)

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Like I said yesterday, I can't even imagine Sephiroth with his "turn on the TV in the living room while standing in the kitchen" sword and "I think I've just engulf the Galaxy in a supernova for funnsies" power

Oh that's simple. Just use the length that sword actually is in the original Final Fantasy VII for starters. His sword ain't too big.