Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[skydogc]

Scrooge McDuck is the one and only Disney character that belongs in Smash Bros.

Implying anyone else from Disney belongs. GIMME THAT MOON THEME!

 

[SSGuy]

Lol I guess you right. He did beat Shovel Knight in a death battle after all lmao

A literal God amongst Disney mortals

 

[domriver]

Are you seriously arguing that Nintendo should try to appease people who won't be buying the game?

Look at any poll of the audience at large and Geno is top 3 and Sora is not. Stop pretending there's some large majority of people in hiding who want Sora but aren't participating in the hype season right now. The main people who really want Sora won't be paying $400 for a switch and Smash just to play as him in smash.

As others have mentioned, you're just becoming a nuisance in this thread because people are taking the time to respond to you and you literally ignore what they say and once again promote your side

LOL.

On another note - anything news regarding our Geno? :D Nothing new from Verge etc...

 

[Deleted member]

Since I went into the main things going against his competitors, I might as well list the main things going for Geno right now:

-SMRPG has been rereleased 3 times in 10 years with the SNES Classic selling more than 6 million consoles. Although SMRPG wasn't originally released in Europe, it has been included in all virtual consoles platforms since 2008.

-Sakurai's glowing review of Geno in Nintendo Dream in early 2016, noting that: the character is popular, the character has been popular for a long time, there was an attempt to get him in Brawl and Smash 4, the Mii costume was a consolation to his fans, and that he likes his overall concept as a character.

-Geno's already in Ultimate, meaning the rights to use him were renewed and already in Nintendo's hands.

-Yoko Shimomura, SMRPG's composer, is once again back for her third Smash game in a row.

-Thanks to the Mii costume, Nintendo already has usable assets for the character, just like Isabelle, Inkling, K. Rool, and Chrom.

-Geno's Mii costume being the only one with a splash screen in a Direct.

-Sakurai noting that Geno would be a gun oriented character, something that Smash doesn't really have yet aside from Mii Gunner. Compare this to swords to understand why this is significant.

-Vergeben, the most reliable insiders this cycle, noting a new Square Enix character in early August. He also mentioned that Geno is one of a number of names that he had heard thrown.

-Multiple insiders saying they have heard Geno's name too, including Polar Panda's.

-Aside from Ken, Geno being the only character from the Grinch Leak that insiders didn't have strong negative comments about.

-Geno's Smash fanbase having notable visibility globally since 2005 with evidence that people have been directly requesting him in Smash Bros as early as 2000.

-Aside from Dixie, Geno being the last major popular character from the Brawl days that isn't playable or an assist trophy.

-Geno consistently making top 15 in large scale Smash polls since 2005 in North America and Japan.

-Geno being tied to Nintendo's biggest and most popular IP, Mario.

-Geno's biggest competitors from Mario already been disconfirmed: Toad and Waluigi. Because stages are a big part of this DLC cycle, this casts doubts on Paper Mario, which already has a composite stage.

I think that covers everything.

Another thing, in December 2015 (the month Ultimate began development), a senior artist for Nintendo posted on social media (can't remember which specifically) "Super Mario RPG has been quite the topic lately here at the studio, so Geno felt right to draw" and posted a picture of Geno along with the post. This was taken down three years later! Nintendo of America made that tweet earlier this year "Are you team Mallow or team Geno?" And yes, one of the three most requested Smash characters in Smash history, and the only one who is not playable yet (which will most likely change soon)

Nothing new yet, just going over everything in Geno's favor

 

[SSGuy]

So at this point, we are wanting Monster Hunter Worlds to win RPG of the Year at TGA

I find the whole award show to be a dumb idea. They literally have an award for best on going games just to give a dying game like Overwatch a shed of relevancy. It's a joke. (Team Fortress 2 for life)

I'm just hoping we survive past the whole DQ rumor.

 

[Loliko YnT]

The SMRPG tweet earlier this year to celebrate It's 22th birthday release date is still sooooooooo weird to me.

When was the SNES Mini announced ? Maybe they wanted to know how much people liked SMRPG ( and damn , people show how much they like it , It's the most liked Nintendo tweet ! )to see if it was worth putting in the SNES classic ? Seem weird to me , especially because they re-released it twice before...

If anything , I'm sure it was a quick way to check if Geno's popularity is still a thing ( they might think the 2015 ballot was outdated ) and well , it still is.
And also , they could have done it during december of 2015 , when Cloud and the Geno costume were released !

But no , they choosed to do it after the teaser for Ultimate... I think everyone is underestimating this , and It's not an Isaac situation , they clearly ask us : " Team Geno or Team Mallow ?" It's not a little SMRPG reference hidden in a , let's say , M&L tweet.

And before saying " to celebrate It's 22th anniversary "
Well... They skipped the 20th and 21th anniversary , and out of the blue , they do it for the 22th? Like , doesn't it seem suspicious to skip the 20th anniversary even tho it represent 2 decades of existance for SMRPG ?

 

[domriver]

I hope Reggie announces the DLC at the video game awards.
Host: Welcome Reggie President of NOA
Reggie: Thanks! I got SMASHING news!
Host: Tell us!
Reggie: Now we love working with Square Enix, as you know we released the SNES mini with favorites like Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars.
xD! lol

 

[RetrogamerMax]

The SMRPG tweet earlier this year to celebrate It's 22th birthday release date is still sooooooooo weird to me.

When was the SNES Mini announced ? Maybe they wanted to know how much people liked SMRPG ( and damn , people show how much they like it , It's the most liked Nintendo tweet ! )to see if it was worth putting in the SNES classic ? Seem weird to me , especially because they re-released it twice before...

If anything , I'm sure it was a quick way to check if Geno's popularity is still a thing ( they might think the 2015 ballot was outdated ) and well , it still is.
And also , they could have done it during december of 2015 , when Cloud and the Geno costume were released !

But no , they choosed to do it after the teaser for Ultimate... I think everyone is underestimating this , and It's not an Isaac situation , they clearly ask us : " Team Geno or Team Mallow ?" It's not a little SMRPG reference hidden in a , let's say , M&L tweet.

And before saying " to celebrate It's 22th anniversary "
Well... They skipped the 20th and 21th anniversary , and out of the blue , they do it for the 22th? Like , doesn't it seem suspicious to skip the 20th anniversary even tho it represent 2 decades of existance for SMRPG ?

Yeah, somethings up. NOA knows something that we don't obviously.

 

[skydogc]

So at this point, we are wanting Monster Hunter Worlds to win RPG of the Year at TGA

I find the whole award show to be a dumb idea. They literally have an award for best on going games just to give a dying game like Overwatch a shed of relevancy. It's a joke. (Team Fortress 2 for life)

I'm just hoping we survive past the whole DQ rumor.

I guess Octopath isn't even in the running, and Pokemon Let's Go isn't gonna have a chance?

But then again, hot damn MHW is a beast of a game. I love it. It'll probably win unless we get Skyrim, Now With Spears Edition.

I'm still not entirely sure what I think about the show. I mean...yeah I get that the Oscar's for video games sounds cool, but...eh...I don't hate it, I'm just indifferent for the most part. I'm not convinced everything gets looked at evenly across the board, especially when end of the year "Oh shiny" syndrome kicks in vs an amazing game that released in February.

TF24Life.

 

[Shado-will]

I think that the point about Geno already being in the game as an online token can be both good and bad because, yeah, he's already in the game so Nintendo's got the rights to use him. That's good, but he's already in the game. If I recall correctly, no other Square character is (besides Cloud, correct me if I'm wrong), so they might be saving the SE spot for someone who hasn't been shown in Ultimate in some shape or form. Just something that's been on my mind for awhile; there's still a lot going for Geno imo.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I think that the point about Geno already being in the game as an online token can be both good and bad because, yeah, he's already in the game so Nintendo's got the rights to use him. That's good, but he's already in the game. If I recall correctly, no other Square character is (besides Cloud, correct me if I'm wrong), so they might be saving the SE spot for someone who hasn't been shown in Ultimate in some shape or form. Just something that's been on my mind for awhile; there's still a lot going for Geno imo.

For right now, I'm just going to take the theory about a character being a spirit or a online token means them being deconfirmed with a huge grain of salt. Remember, Mewtwo and Lucas were trophies in Smash 4 before they were DLC characters.

 

[TBone06]

For right now, I'm just going to take the theory about a character being a spirit or a online token means them being deconfirmed with a huge grain of salt. Remember, Mewtwo and Lucas were trophies in Smash 4 before they were DLC characters.

Honestly, in regards to the token, it almost looks like it was a mistake. Realistically if you weren't scanning for everything in the video, you never would have noticed it. There was no attention brought to it. If it's something online, I have a feeling you may be able to pick your own tokens, maybe even download them yourself. But I don't know, something always felt weird about it. The only place he was seen was there, meanwhile most of the other icons were seen as Spirits. Something is off about it.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Are you seriously arguing that Nintendo should try to appease people who won't be buying the game?

Look at any poll of the audience at large and Geno is top 3 and Sora is not. Stop pretending there's some large majority of people in hiding who want Sora but aren't participating in the hype season right now. The main people who really want Sora won't be paying $400 for a switch and Smash just to play as him in smash.

As others have mentioned, you're just becoming a nuisance in this thread because people are taking the time to respond to you and you literally ignore what they say and once again promote your side

How many people do you think voted for Geno in the ballot? I mean, let’s spitball. We can assume that Ridley wasn’t voted as much because he was a boss in 4, but K. Rool definitely won. Let’s assume Geno got in second place, beating out veterans and other candidates like Isaac and Banjo. The pool for the ballot was 1.8 million. If we maximize Geno’s results, we get 0.9 million votes. So that’s almost a million people voted for Geno.

For reference, the Wii U version of Smash sold over 5 million copies, and the 3DS version sold over 9 million. Nintendo’s definitely hoping to sell 3DS numbers for Ultimate. No matter how you cut it, we are still a minority. 1.8 million people participated in the ballot. That’s not even half the people that bought the Wii U version of the game.

I’m not saying there’s a hidden contingent of Sora fans, I’m saying there’s a silent majority of casual fans, who will always find more appeal in the most well-known characters. Geno is absolutely in the top 3 most demanded Smash characters in the hardcore community, but the hardcore community is and has always been a bubble, an echo chamber.

Please leave out personal attacks mate, I’m responding as well as I can to circumstantial arguments and baseless claims. I’m not ‘promoting my side’, I’m a Geno supporter and have been since Brawl came out. I just feel like you guys are getting overconfident and was trying to refute the more flimsy arguments being said.

 

[Datboigeno]

Scrooge McDuck is the one and only Disney character that belongs in Smash Bros.

Well ackshually, Mickey Mouse has been in more Nintendo games than Scrooge McDuck and therefore is more relevant and therefore should be in Smash before him /s

 

[FCZHornet]

No hate to you goodgreif. I know we are all here to literally be cheerleaders for Geno but it’s important to look at this thing from all sides, which I think you are. I think people see arguments against Geno’s possibility as “YOU DON’T LIKE GENO” which is wrong. We gotta keep the conversation moving forward somehow, so thank you for that.

 

[KCCHIEFS27]

How many people do you think voted for Geno in the ballot? I mean, let’s spitball. We can assume that Ridley wasn’t voted as much because he was a boss in 4, but K. Rool definitely won. Let’s assume Geno got in second place, beating out veterans and other candidates like Isaac and Banjo. The pool for the ballot was 1.8 million. If we maximize Geno’s results, we get 0.9 million votes. So that’s almost a million people voted for Geno.

For reference, the Wii U version of Smash sold over 5 million copies, and the 3DS version sold over 9 million. Nintendo’s definitely hoping to sell 3DS numbers for Ultimate. No matter how you cut it, we are still a minority. 1.8 million people participated in the ballot. That’s not even half the people that bought the Wii U version of the game.

I’m not saying there’s a hidden contingent of Sora fans, I’m saying there’s a silent majority of casual fans, who will always find more appeal in the most well-known characters. Geno is absolutely in the top 3 most demanded Smash characters in the hardcore community, but the hardcore community is and has always been a bubble, an echo chamber.

Please leave out personal attacks mate, I’m responding as well as I can to circumstantial arguments and baseless claims. I’m not ‘promoting my side’, I’m a Geno supporter and have been since Brawl came out. I just feel like you guys are getting overconfident and was trying to refute the more flimsy arguments being said.

See this is where you're wrong. Casual fans are not out there asking enough for Sora to make any real difference. You know who casual fans ask for? Characters like Goku. Sora isn't happening for reasons stated on 50% of the last 100 pages. DQ is a different beast where it actually has a shot, but has a whole lot going against it.

I don't think you know anything about the Geno fans in this thread if you think we're "overconfident". I doubt if push came to shove many of us would bet on Geno making it in as DLC even with everything going in his favor. What we're doing and what we have been doing for the last decade is stating all the reasons that make sense as to why he should be in and should've been for a long time now. Every single game we get **** on.

This is where the Geno fanbase is special. Because even though individually we are probably all sick to our stomach about his chances, we still post here and build each other up and rally together. We post positive things to keep each other going. That's why this fanbase has lasted for so long and has only grown.

Geno is far from a lock, but he certainly has the best chance of any SE character to get in. But as we've seen before, best chance and makes the most sense =/= happening

 

[GoodGrief741]

See this is where you're wrong. Casual fans are not out there voting enough for Sora to make any real difference. You know who casual fans ask for? Characters like Goku. Sora isn't happening for reasons stated on 50% of the last 100 pages. DQ is a different beast where it actually has a shot, but has a whole lot going against it.

I don't think you know anything about the Geno fans in this thread if you think we're "overconfident". I doubt if push came to shove many of us would bet on Geno making it in as DLC even with everything going in his favor. What we're doing and what we have been doing for the last decade is stating all the reasons that make sense as to why he should be in and should've been for a long time now. Every single game we get **** on.

This is where the Geno fanbase is special. Because even though individually we are probably all sick to our stomach about his chances, we still post here and build each other up and rally together. We post positive things to keep each other going. That's why this fanbase has lasted for so long and has only grown.

Geno is far from a lock, but he certainly has the best chance of any SE character to get in. But as we've seen before, best chance and makes the most sense =/= happening

Again, not saying casual fans voted for anybody in the ballot, just that if I was an executive and had to pick a character to sell to 9 million people I’d go for the least obscure.

I agree that, at least to me, personally, Geno makes the most sense to add as DLC right now, and has made a lot of sense to add for a while. But (as my experience with Ultimate has proven) what makes the most sense isn’t exactly what ends up happening, sadly.

I understand being twitchy and reacting negatively towards criticism, as someone who’s been in this for a while I understand. Positivity is great, but also a clear mind.

No hate to you goodgreif. I know we are all here to literally be cheerleaders for Geno but it’s important to look at this thing from all sides, which I think you are. I think people see arguments against Geno’s possibility as “YOU DON’T LIKE GENO” which is wrong. We gotta keep the conversation moving forward somehow, so thank you for that.

Thanks, that’s what I was going for.

Hell, if this thread was more pessimistic and negative I’d probably be going around telling people to cheer up and the pros for Geno’s inclusion. Discussion should be balanced, I think.

 

[Loliko YnT]

Is starting of with a DQ character or Sora a Good idea ?

I mean , Iv'e said it a lot , but the first DLC of the pass must be big to convince people to buy the fighter pass.

A DQ DLC will lack music variety , and except for slime , the majority of people don't know the main character and this would be worse because they would think " generic anime swordman ".

Sora is interesting.
There is definitely a Big chunk of people who would love the idea , and buy the pass , probably more than Geno , BUT!

Without any KH main entry on the Switch/3DS , there wouldn't be a way for people to encourage them to... Well , play a KH game on a Nintendo system.
He doesn't promote ANYTHING RECENT that can benefit Nintendo. And this time , Nintendo choosed the DLCs , or at least propose candidates.

And yeah , he would sell a lot of DLC , but , will this be enough to compensate for how much he cost ? Because DLCs sales is the only thing they'll get from Sora , and the KH developpement Team show no interest to port KH3 to Switch , and except if they got a top secret KH game for the Switch in the work ready for the first Half of 2019... This will be risky for Nintendo.

Geno may make less sales than theses characters... But do you think that's the only thing that matter ? Not everyone is buying DLC , everyone criticize the prices of Sm4sh DLC and now it's the exact SAME PRICE.

If they just port SMRPG to the eshop for 8-10 dollars, people will be interested , It's a Mario game , It's retro , it doesn't cost a lot of money , so most people could buy it... While a full priced DQ or KH game... Not everyone could buy that just because " Erdrick/Sora is in Smash so let's see where he came from ".

And that's not mentioning the fact that , despise myself not beeing a Square or Nintendo employe , It's logical to think that Geno will cost way less money and is WAY LESS RISKY.

Only one third party to deal with , Square. No Armor project or Disney.
Square is willing to let Sakurai use him to some extend.
Yoko is working on the soundtrack of Ultimate, and could do some SMRPG remix.
Mario stages are simple , recognizable , and fun. Easy to promote.

Nintendo as a lot of money , they could lose money for 10 years straight and still be in the running , but they still want to make money and promote their products for obvious reasons.

Geno , in the long run , could give them more money Because :
-Could sell well as DLC , requested , unique , Mario rep , third party...
-Promote the SNES classic ( they just have to mention that his original game is in the SNES classic and they are selling 80 dollars X people who are interested , way more safe than betting on a POSSIBLE future release of a third party game on their consoles. )
-Geno has potential to be a loved character and could be the protagonist of a Nintendo X Square game / franchise.

Others candidates will just promote their franchise and nothing else. And their franchises aren't Nintendo exclusive.

However , this is all assuming the SE rep is the first DLC.

 

[FCZHornet]

The fact that Geno has been shown as an icon in the direct, and since then people have found over 500 spirits and he’s not yet one of them is telling. We also haven’t seen a mii costume. The further we move away from the direct with no explanation for that icon increases how suspect it is.

Also is anyone else super excited to use Geno as an online icon at the very least? I sure am

 

[TBone06]

Is starting of with a DQ character or Sora a Good idea ?

I mean , Iv'e said it a lot , but the first DLC of the pass must be big to convince people to buy the fighter pass.

A DQ DLC will lack music variety , and except for smile , the majority of people don't know the main character and this would be worse because they would think " generic anime swordman ".

Sora is interesting.
There is definitely a Big chunk of people who would love the idea , and buy the pass , probably more than Geno , BUT!

Without any KH main entry on the Switch/3DS , there wouldn't be a way for people to encourage them to... Well , play a KH game on a Nintendo system.
He doesn't promote ANYTHING RECENT that can benefit Nintendo. And this time , Nintendo choosed the DLCs , or at least propose candidates.

And yeah , he would sell a lot of DLC , but , will this be enough to compensate for how much he cost ? Because DLCs sales is the only thing they'll get from Sora , and the KH developpement Team show no interest to port KH3 to Switch , and except if they got a top secret KH game for the Switch in the work ready for the first Half of 2019... This will be risky for Nintendo.

Geno may make less sales than theses characters... But do you think that's the only thing that matter ? Not everyone is buying DLC , everyone criticize the prices of Sm4sh DLC and now it's the exact SAME PRICE.

If they just port SMRPG to the eshop for 8-10 dollars, people will be interested , It's a Mario game , It's retro , it doesn't cost a lot of money , so most people could buy it... While a full priced DQ or KH game... Not everyone could buy that just because " Erdrick/Sora is in Smash so let's see where he came from ".

And that's not mentioning the fact that , despise myself not beeing a Square or Nintendo employe , It's logical to think that Geno will cost way less money and is WAY LESS RISKY.

Only one third party to deal with , Square. No Armor project or Disney.
Square is willing to let Sakurai use him to some extend.
Yoko is working on the soundtrack of Ultimate, and could do some SMRPG remix.
Mario stages are simple , recognizable , and fun. Easy to promote.

Nintendo as a lot of money , they could lose money for 10 years straight and still be in the running , but they still want to make money and promote their products for obvious reasons.

Geno , in the long run , could give them more money Because :
-Could sell well as DLC , requested , unique , Mario rep , third party...
-Promote the SNES classic ( they just have to mention that his original game is in the SNES classic and they are selling 80 dollars X people who are interested , way more safe than betting on a POSSIBLE future release of a third party game on their consoles. )
-Geno has potential to be a loved character and could be the protagonist of a Nintendo X Square game / franchise.

Others candidates will just promote their franchise and nothing else. And their franchises aren't Nintendo exclusive.

However , this is all assuming the SE rep is the first DLC.

It also shows promise for the remaining DLC reps. If a DQ rep is the first DLC character, I wouldn't have a lot of faith in the fighters pass. If it's Geno, I think that shows they have the interests of the fans. I'd be a lot more confident buying the fighters pass in that sense.

 

[DaxMasterix]

How many people do you think voted for Geno in the ballot? I mean, let’s spitball. We can assume that Ridley wasn’t voted as much because he was a boss in 4, but K. Rool definitely won. Let’s assume Geno got in second place, beating out veterans and other candidates like Isaac and Banjo. The pool for the ballot was 1.8 million. If we maximize Geno’s results, we get 0.9 million votes. So that’s almost a million people voted for Geno.

For reference, the Wii U version of Smash sold over 5 million copies, and the 3DS version sold over 9 million. Nintendo’s definitely hoping to sell 3DS numbers for Ultimate. No matter how you cut it, we are still a minority. 1.8 million people participated in the ballot. That’s not even half the people that bought the Wii U version of the game.

I’m not saying there’s a hidden contingent of Sora fans, I’m saying there’s a silent majority of casual fans, who will always find more appeal in the most well-known characters. Geno is absolutely in the top 3 most demanded Smash characters in the hardcore community, but the hardcore community is and has always been a bubble, an echo chamber.

Please leave out personal attacks mate, I’m responding as well as I can to circumstantial arguments and baseless claims. I’m not ‘promoting my side’, I’m a Geno supporter and have been since Brawl came out. I just feel like you guys are getting overconfident and was trying to refute the more flimsy arguments being said.

So, in your eyes here are plenty of people who are "overconfident" about Geno but you show yourself overconfident enough to say that Geno have low chances in comparison with any other SE rep (or at least it won't sell well in comparison with Sora). I really think your position is a little bit hypocrite. Even if you're trying to be objective showing some facts.
At least, and In my opinion, Geno supporters owns a Switch. When you think on Sora the last company that goes into your mind is Nintendo. I'm not saying that because of this, there's nobody who owns a Switch and want Sora, but I'm trying to capitalize that, People want Geno vs People would be okay with Sora.
I want Geno as the DLC and I would be okay with Sora being the DLC, and I'm feeling pretty confident that the pools demostrate it enough.

Hope you understand that this is my opinion, but so is yours. Let's wait until the time smack our faces.

 

[domriver]

Well at least supposedly we will wait till the week of the release of Ultimate to figure out if some sort of DLC announcement will be made. (Presuming) .
Aside from the DLC any think Sakurai will pop out with Echos every now and then? Or shall we expect no more? Just a thought i had.

 

[PolarPanda]

Yeah, but there wasn’t huge demand in Japan for Richter either, nor was there huge demand for Simon around here.

I hate to say it, but I don’t think Nintendo’s listening to us hardcore fans.

Are you.... are you sure? lol. Ridley and K Rool were pure fan demand, and don't argue they weren't.

I'd honestly be very confused. Sakurai just came out with a statement that non videogame characters will never be in smash under any circumstances.

No he did not. There WAS an article going around.... but it was fake news. It only reposted his quote from over 10 year ago on a brawl blog, LOL.
Though if there is some other source to that, I'd probably be pretty happy.

 

[Loliko YnT]

It also shows promise for the remaining DLC reps. If a DQ rep is the first DLC character, I wouldn't have a lot of faith in the fighters pass. If it's Geno, I think that shows they have the interests of the fans. I'd be a lot more confident buying the fighters pass in that sense.

This. The first DLC fighter pack is big because of that. They can't afford to take a random risk and put Sora/Erdrick/Slime.

 

[Datboigeno]

How many people do you think voted for Geno in the ballot? I mean, let’s spitball. We can assume that Ridley wasn’t voted as much because he was a boss in 4, but K. Rool definitely won. Let’s assume Geno got in second place, beating out veterans and other candidates like Isaac and Banjo. The pool for the ballot was 1.8 million. If we maximize Geno’s results, we get 0.9 million votes. So that’s almost a million people voted for Geno.

For reference, the Wii U version of Smash sold over 5 million copies, and the 3DS version sold over 9 million. Nintendo’s definitely hoping to sell 3DS numbers for Ultimate. No matter how you cut it, we are still a minority. 1.8 million people participated in the ballot. That’s not even half the people that bought the Wii U version of the game.

I’m not saying there’s a hidden contingent of Sora fans, I’m saying there’s a silent majority of casual fans, who will always find more appeal in the most well-known characters. Geno is absolutely in the top 3 most demanded Smash characters in the hardcore community, but the hardcore community is and has always been a bubble, an echo chamber.

Please leave out personal attacks mate, I’m responding as well as I can to circumstantial arguments and baseless claims. I’m not ‘promoting my side’, I’m a Geno supporter and have been since Brawl came out. I just feel like you guys are getting overconfident and was trying to refute the more flimsy arguments being said.

I mean, the point of a ballot/survey is never to say exactly "This is 1:1 with what every single customer who buys our game thinks." Nintendo realizes not everyone who plays Smash filled out the ballot. The purpose of it was to see what a large sample size of the entire customer base wanted for Smash. It's literal market research. It's why focus groups are a thing. Companies don't ask literally every potential customer what they want. They take a select few from various demographic groups. Or things like the Nielsen ratings for US television. They don't track what literally every person on TV is watching. They send out boxes to a big assortment of different people from different demographics and use that data extrapolate how many millions of people are watching X show. And sometimes it's not very accurate as to what all of people are watching or want. But it is something companies use all the time when making decisions, and like you said we already have evidence they used the ballot when making decisions for Ultimate. If Geno hypothetically actually got second or close to there on the ballot that would be a big deal period. It doesn't matter if it's only a sample size of the entire userbase that is purchasing Super Smash Bros. titles.

 

[RingJ5]

See this is where you're wrong. Casual fans are not out there voting enough for Sora to make any real difference. You know who casual fans ask for? Characters like Goku. Sora isn't happening for reasons stated on 50% of the last 100 pages. DQ is a different beast where it actually has a shot, but has a whole lot going against it.

I don't think you know anything about the Geno fans in this thread if you think we're "overconfident". I doubt if push came to shove many of us would bet on Geno making it in as DLC even with everything going in his favor. What we're doing and what we have been doing for the last decade is stating all the reasons that make sense as to why he should be in and should've been for a long time now. Every single game we get **** on.

This is where the Geno fanbase is special. Because even though individually we are probably all sick to our stomach about his chances, we still post here and build each other up and rally together. We post positive things to keep each other going. That's why this fanbase has lasted for so long and has only grown.

Geno is far from a lock, but he certainly has the best chance of any SE character to get in. But as we've seen before, best chance and makes the most sense =/= happening

I think that Geno is relatively a lock on one particular condition: If the first DLC(for the pass, not counting the plant) is a Square character. If the first DLC is Banjo or BWD or Rayman or something, his chances drop significantly.

With KH3’s immediate launch on other platforms, Sora makes little sense as the first reveal, and a DQ character wouldn’t exactly get like 70% of the Smash audience all that excited.

But if the Square character was... say, third or fourth? That’d be a good few months after the release of KH3, and right around the time of DQXI’s Japan-only Switch release. Both would fit far better in that sort of situation, not starting off the pass.

No, the pass needs someone who’ll go over real well with the core fanbase and get them confident enough to throw in that extra $25 for the full thing. There are many characters that can do this, for example the three I mentioned earlier, but Geno is the only viable Square choice that would.

 

[Sigran101]

Are you.... are you sure? lol. Ridley and K Rool were pure fan demand, and don't argue they weren't.


No he did not. There WAS an article going around.... but it was fake news. It only reposted his quote from over 10 year ago on a brawl blog, LOL.
Though if there is some other source to that, I'd probably be pretty happy.

Wow, you really have to be careful these days. I didn't see any reason to doubt that article. Thanks for pointing that out!

 

[Deleted member]

I think that Geno is relatively a lock on one particular condition: If the first DLC(for the pass, not counting the plant) is a Square character. If the first DLC is Banjo or BWD or Rayman or something, his chances drop significantly.

With KH3’s immediate launch on other platforms, Sora makes little sense as the first reveal, and a DQ character wouldn’t exactly get like 70% of the Smash audience all that excited.

But if the Square character was... say, third or fourth? That’d be a good few months after the release of KH3, and right around the time of DQXI’s Japan-only Switch release. Both would fit far better in that sort of situation, not starting off the pass.

No, the pass needs someone who’ll go over real well with the core fanbase and get them confident enough to throw in that extra $25 for the full thing. There are many characters that can do this, for example the three I mentioned earlier, but Geno is the only viable Square choice that would.

Alright, well we are in luck, since Vergeben said that the Square Enix character will be the first DLC character

 

[Fatmanonice]

So at this point, we are wanting Monster Hunter Worlds to win RPG of the Year at TGA.

I'm just hoping we survive past the whole DQ rumor.

Monster Hunter: World has sold more than 10 million copies worldwide and at 10 months old is the best selling game in Capcom's entire company history. Dragon Quest XI has sold about 4 million overall in almost two years with 3.2 being in Japan. It would have to be hardcore rigged for DQXI to win.

 

[RingJ5]

Alright, well we are in luck, since Vergeben said that the Square Enix character will be the first DLC character

Yeah, I’m aware that a good few leakers are saying that.

If it’s true, I’m about 85% sure that it’d be Geno. If it isn’t and we get, say, Banjo as the first reveal, I’d certainly lose a lot of hope for Geno’s chances.

Monster Hunter: World has sold more than 10 million copies worldwide and at 10 months old is the best selling game in Capcom's entire company history. Dragon Quest XI has sold about 4 million overall in almost two years with 3.2 being in Japan. It would have to be hardcore rigged for DQXI to win.

It is worth noting that the Game Awards winners are decided 90% by committee, 10% by viewers. Still, MHW is certainly going to be the favorite even among said committee, it’s just that gigantic worldwide. DQXI winning anyway and then getting an associated Smash announcement would cause an absolute ****storm of bad press relating to whether the results were rigged or not that would taint a DQ character announcement at the VGAs way, way worse than originally expected.

 

[GoodGrief741]

So, in your eyes here are plenty of people who are "overconfident" about Geno but you show yourself overconfident enough to say that Geno have low chances in comparison with any other SE rep (or at least it won't sell well in comparison with Sora). I really think your position is a little bit hypocrite. Even if you're trying to be objective showing some facts.
At least, and In my opinion, Geno supporters owns a Switch. When you think on Sora the last company that goes into your mind is Nintendo. I'm not saying that because of this, there's nobody who owns a Switch and want Sora, but I'm trying to capitalize that, People want Geno vs People would be okay with Sora.
I want Geno as the DLC and I would be okay with Sora being the DLC, and I'm feeling pretty confident that the pools demostrate it enough.

Hope you understand that this is my opinion, but so is yours. Let's wait until the time smack our faces.

Oh, I am not claiming that what I’m saying is the verified truth, I never meant for that to be what people got and I’m sorry if that’s the case.

For clarity’s sake: I’m not saying Sora would definitely sell better than Geno, and I am not saying Geno definitely has lower chances than other Square candidates. I was just playing Devil’s Advocate and bringing forward points against Geno’s inclusion that are equally plausible.

For all we know Geno would sell huge. Or maybe only his fans would buy him.

For all we know Sora would sell huge. Or maybe the Kingdom Hearts fanbase is primarily PlayStation based.

Both are equally possible scenarios from what we’ve seen.

(And just a final comment, but when you say Sora the last company I think about is Microsoft, not Nintendo. Nintendo’s gotten some big games)

 

[Xigger]

Honestly, in regards to the token, it almost looks like it was a mistake. Realistically if you weren't scanning for everything in the video, you never would have noticed it. There was no attention brought to it. If it's something online, I have a feeling you may be able to pick your own tokens, maybe even download them yourself. But I don't know, something always felt weird about it. The only place he was seen was there, meanwhile most of the other icons were seen as Spirits. Something is off about it.

This. It really reminds me of old leaks. If memory serves, Brawl leaked character icons for Ness, Jigglypuff, and Lucario in a SSE blog post picture for stickers, and SSB4 leaked Ganondorf in an off-screen bubble during a trailer.

 

[Deleted member]

This. It really reminds me of old leaks. If memory serves, Brawl leaked character icons for Ness, Jigglypuff, and Lucario in a SSE blog post picture for stickers, and SSB4 leaked Ganondorf in an off-screen bubble during a trailer.

Well, Brawl actually leaked Pokemon Trainer's icon

 

[FCZHornet]

Smash might not be an easy metric to determine which characters would or wouldn’t sell well from a dlc perspective for two reasons: game is absurdly popular casually and has a hardcore competitive following. It’s casual popularity could indicate people are gonna snap up the DLC no matter what, and competitive players need to have every single character on their setups anyway so they’re gonna buy it regardless. I don’t have data to work with here, but ask yourselves how many setups you saw that had Corrin unlocked... do those people really want Corrin or was it just another character you gotta have?

 

[RingJ5]

This. It really reminds me of old leaks. If memory serves, Brawl leaked character icons for Ness, Jigglypuff, and Lucario in a SSE blog post picture for stickers, and SSB4 leaked Ganondorf in an off-screen bubble during a trailer.

Tinfoil: That icon is in the base game, but as part of a feature that the larger audience was never intended to see until December 7th. The Game Awards was going to premiere the night before launch and give context to the icon by announcing Geno proper, thus making the appearance of his SMRPG render(but not actually as a Spirit) less confusing. Instead, it got slipped into the November direct by accident, and people have been debating over it ever since.

 

[Loliko YnT]

Smash might not be an easy metric to determine which characters would or wouldn’t sell well from a dlc perspective for two reasons: game is absurdly popular casually and has a hardcore competitive following. It’s casual popularity could indicate people are gonna snap up the DLC no matter what, and competitive players need to have every single character on their setups anyway so they’re gonna buy it regardless. I don’t have data to work with here, but ask yourselves how many setups you saw that had Corrin unlocked... do those people really want Corrin or was it just another character you gotta have?

That's a good point.

All serious offline tourneys have set-up with every characters , DLCs included.

People can buy DLCs just to get every character.

 

[ForsakenM]

Let’s not start with revisionist history. Simon is and always was a beloved character in gaming, but the demand for him was negligible before Vergeben leaked him (I know because I was there). Bomberman was much more in demand with Smash fans, and definitely performed better in the ballot.

In fact, this whole situation is eerily similar. You have the fan favorite, the character people vote for in ballots and polls and campaign for for years (Bomberman/Geno), and the one that has the most mass appeal, from a legendary franchise with big pedigree (Simon/Sora or DQ rep). At least for the former case, it was the mass appeal one that got in.

As for who I’d buy, I’m really spoiled for choice. I love Geno, I love Sora, and I love Dragon Quest. And I don’t really have a bias against swordfighters that most people do.

If I were to put myself in the shoes of somebody who didn’t know Geno, I think they’d love him for his uniqueness, but they’d probably be more hype for a guy like Sora because he’s simply more well known. He’s a ‘break the internet’ addition.

You think an announcement for Sora would break the internet MORE than Geno (and thereby SMRPG) being acknowledged by Nintendo in video game form? Geno's announcement would be on that Ridley/K. Rool level of hype and internet explosion, maybe even more so due to the recent traction of casual players/non-Geno supports rooting for us Geno fans. We would also have our Isaac brothers at our side, because if Geno can make it, then Golden Sun still has a chance for greatness. The majority of Smash Bros/Nintendo reaction channels would be getting crazy views because of the reaction to his reveal. Seriously, I can promise you that just a goddamn motherf***ing jpg of Geno at the VGA after Reggie being on screen would make the internet ripple with insanity. It happened with just a model for Mewtwo, it would CERTAINLY happen for Geno.

Also, the comparison to Simon getting over Bomberman isn't comparable: Simon had requests for years but it died with the hate of Konami and the franchise falling off, but Bomberman kept getting games that seem to have been doing well. I could make arguments over the fact that Simon had more support even though it may not have shown up in the Ballot, or that we don't know the Ballot results so we can only assume, but honestly it comes down to what Sakurai thinks he can make work as a playable fighter. Bomberman was an AT because Sakurai and Team decided that there wasn't enough to make something out of him, but people love Bomberman, so they made him an AT while Simon and Richter had more to go off of for a moveset.

EDIT: You also never responded to my list of reasons why Geno is a better pick for Nintendo than Sora or a DQ rep. Sorry if you did and I missed it, but I was never quoted by you and I've skimmed through the comments here and there and I found you talking to other but not my claims. You gonna just ignore all that and move to another argument?

 

[Deleted member]

You think an announcement for Sora would break the internet MORE than Geno (and thereby SMRPG) being acknowledged by Nintendo in video game form? Geno's announcement would be on that Ridley/K. Rool level of hype and internet explosion, maybe even more so due to the recent traction of casual players/non-Geno supports rooting for us Geno fans. We would also have our Isaac brothers at our side, because if Geno can make it, then Golden Sun still has a chance for greatness. The majority of Smash Bros/Nintendo reaction channels would be getting crazy views because of the reaction to his reveal. Seriously, I can promise you that just a goddamn motherf***ing jpg of Geno at the VGA after Reggie being on screen would make the internet ripple with insanity. It happened with just a model for Mewtwo, it would CERTAINLY happen for Geno.

Also, the comparison to Simon getting over Bomberman isn't comparable: Simon had requests for years but it died with the hate of Konami and the franchise falling off, but Bomberman kept getting games that seem to have been doing well. I could make arguments over the fact that Simon had more support even though it may not have shown up in the Ballot, or that we don't know the Ballot results so we can only assume, but honestly it comes down to what Sakurai thinks he can make work as a playable fighter. Bomberman was an AT because Sakurai and Team decided that there wasn't enough to make something out of him, but people love Bomberman, so they made him an AT while Simon and Richter had more to go off of for a moveset.

EDIT: You also never responded to my list of reasons why Geno is a better pick for Nintendo than Sora or a DQ rep. Sorry if you did and I missed it, but I was never quoted by you and I've skimmed through the comments here and there and I found you talking to other but not my claims. You gonna just ignore all that and move to another argument?

I would faint from hype if Geno comes. Just imagine the CGI for his reveal trailer!

 

[FCZHornet]

Sora would definitely “break the internet” more then Geno. We gotta keep in mind having “Isaac bros” support, comparisons to K. Rool etc are pretty confined to the smash speculation community, which is large, but nowhere near having the main character of Kingdom Hearts in the game. I’m sorry but that game is huge.

 

[Deleted member]

Sora would definitely “break the internet” more then Geno. We gotta keep in mind having “Isaac bros” support, comparisons to K. Rool etc are pretty confined to the smash speculation community, which is large, but nowhere near having the main character of Kingdom Hearts in the game. I’m sorry but that game is huge.

Geno has a larger fan following for Smash than Sora does, so I believe that Geno would "break the internet" more than Sora. He has also been requested for longer than Sora, so Geno needs this first