Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Rohanx17]

I forgot that Sylux had a trophy in Brawl. Really though, all of these characters are represented via series, despite not making an appearance. Not sure I'm following the logic here, are you thinking a Nintendo character is #5? Because obviously, spirit or not, post pass doesn't matter, maybe not even assist trophy.

oh my b, I was just musing again this morning who the totally new 1st party characters on the insider list was because it played into an idea I had for some dlc slots deep into the future. Though on the topic of promotions they may not ultimately matter but I don't think they plan on doing a ton of them before they wrap it up. I'd say 4-5 tops though that would reach far enough into the request list for one game I don't think it will be a problem.

 

[Spatulo]

I'm almost vibrating (probably from it being Manic Monday and drinking a whole lot of coffee) but things are falling into place so damn hard. What I wrote earlier gives backing to a theory that I've been using literally before Ultimate was announced... Useable assets. Inkling, Isabelle, Chrom, Dark Samus, and K. Rool all had usable assets from Smash 4. One piece of the puzzle was in front of me the whole time...

Of course they renegotiated for Geno! He was in the base game and if Season 1 of DLC was planned and finalized before launch, of course Nintendo already had permission to use the assets, especially if the original plan was to bring back all the Smash 4 DLC costumes! It makes so much sense! Of course he was always going to come back either way but we all assumed it was the Mii costume. No! That ship has sailed, mother****ers, and hasn't been to port in four months!

Now, similar situation, DLC was kind of sprung on Sakurai for Smash 4 too. Originally it was JUST going to be Mewtwo as a little bonus gift but around November 2014 they were like "**** it, let's do a whole line up." Now, ladies and gentlemen, who were the first three characters outta da gate? Mewtwo, Lucas, and Roy. Lucas was in Brawl and Mewtwo and Roy were originally planned for Brawl but ultimately cut despite having the most work done by far. Why these three? USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. A lot of the basic work bull**** was already done for these characters. Same could easily be argued for Lloyd and Geno. USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. There's a whole goddamn buffet table spread for ATs and Mii costumes being used as references and models for full playable characters. MMMMMM! That's some GOOOOOOD speculation, right there!

Our time is coming, my brothers and sisters! Our time is near!

View attachment 249438

I am 100% on board with coffee fueled maniac fatman

 

[xpnc]

The reason why Mike Jones isn't in the game at all is probably because StarTropics didn't even release in Japan. Ever. Not on Virtual Console on Wii or Wii U, not on the Japanese Famicom Classic Edition, not on Switch Online--not ever. Smash has never had a Mike Jones trophy, sticker, no StarTropics stages, music, etc. There's pretty much a 0% chance we'll ever see him or anything related to StarTropics ever in Smash Bros.

Adeleine doesn't have a spirit because Sakurai has always hated the idea of humans in Kirby, if I remember correctly. He barely acknowledges anything Kirby if he wasn't involved in it.

Sylux will probably come alongside Metroid Prime 4, which was further along in development when Smash's spirits were decided. Probably.

Porky is probably considered to be inside the Super Safe Capsule as a joke (or we're getting some kind of Mother collection and his spirit will come with it )

Don't have explanations for the others missing but I wouldn't really look too far into it. Poochy and Vaati are not going to be Smash DLC. Sceptile almost certainly isn't either

 

[Deleted member]

I'm almost vibrating (probably from it being Manic Monday and drinking a whole lot of coffee) but things are falling into place so damn hard. What I wrote earlier gives backing to a theory that I've been using literally before Ultimate was announced... Useable assets. Inkling, Isabelle, Chrom, Dark Samus, and K. Rool all had usable assets from Smash 4. One piece of the puzzle was in front of me the whole time...

Of course they renegotiated for Geno! He was in the base game and if Season 1 of DLC was planned and finalized before launch, of course Nintendo already had permission to use the assets, especially if the original plan was to bring back all the Smash 4 DLC costumes! It makes so much sense! Of course he was always going to come back either way but we all assumed it was the Mii costume. No! That ship has sailed, mother****ers, and hasn't been to port in four months!

Now, similar situation, DLC was kind of sprung on Sakurai for Smash 4 too. Originally it was JUST going to be Mewtwo as a little bonus gift but around November 2014 they were like "**** it, let's do a whole line up." Now, ladies and gentlemen, who were the first three characters outta da gate? Mewtwo, Lucas, and Roy. Lucas was in Brawl and Mewtwo and Roy were originally planned for Brawl but ultimately cut despite having the most work done by far. Why these three? USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. A lot of the basic work bull**** was already done for these characters. Same could easily be argued for Lloyd and Geno. USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. There's a whole goddamn buffet table spread for ATs and Mii costumes being used as references and models for full playable characters. MMMMMM! That's some GOOOOOOD speculation, right there!

Our time is coming, my brothers and sisters! Our time is near!

View attachment 249438

I think there's a big difference between the usable assets of Roy, Mewtwo and Lucas and the usable assets of a Mii costume. I mean, Mewtwo and Lucas had fully rendered trophies in Smash 4 before they were turned into fighters - providing the edge loops were there, or a semblance of them were there, the trophies themselves could have become the fighter models, just with higher resolution textures. Literally all it takes is rigging a skeleton for them. Mii costumes, though? Huge stretch. I mean, you can't seriously think that they took that K. Rool costume and turned it into K. Rool, can you?

Adeleine doesn't have a spirit because Sakurai has always hated the idea of humans in Kirby, if I remember correctly. He barely acknowledges anything Kirby if he wasn't involved in it.

Adeleine is design wise, just Ado under a different name, and Ado was in Dreamland 3, which iirc was Sakurai's last work on Kirby. He can't possibly hate the character that much.

 

[TooManyToastahs]

I think there's a big difference between the usable assets of Roy, Mewtwo and Lucas and the usable assets of a Mii costume. I mean, Mewtwo and Lucas had fully rendered trophies in Smash 4 before they were turned into fighters - providing the edge loops were there, or a semblance of them were there, the trophies themselves could have become the fighter models, just with higher resolution textures. Literally all it takes is rigging a skeleton for them. Mii costumes, though? Huge stretch. I mean, you can't seriously think that they took that K. Rool costume and turned it into K. Rool, can you?

Yeah but mii costumes contain assets, kind of like pieces to a diorama. They wouldn’t rig a mii costume, no, but they would use parts from these mii costumes in creating these characters.

For example, they could update the cape and hat used in Geno’s mii costume and utilize it in Geno’s new character model. A lot of the work was done on these parts to his character, they would just have update it to Ultimate and playable character standards.

 

[Qeomash]

I just want to say that I really doubt that Nintendo is able to "reuse" assets from any Mii costumes.

Models themselves are not that difficult to create. For a professional, it's just about like sculpting something with clay. Models are easy to create in a vacuum.

The hard part is animations. Rigging an animation skeleton in that easily created model is not difficult, but super tedious and time consuming. This is where reuse happens, and why humanoid characters are easy. We joke that all fire emblem characters are Marth, but I'm willing to bet they all started with him as their skeleton. Another example of this is that Plant is based off Bowser Jr.'s model/skeleton.

The devs will take an existing model and skeleton and squish them, in very broad terms, into the next character they are making.

Where I'm going with this is that Nintendo most likely didn't reuse anything from Mii costumes into any future characters. The inkling hats are very different in size and shape to the actual inklings that they were more likely based on Young Link than their Smash 4 mii costumes. Same for the potential Lloyd inclusion, and of course Geno.

All they might reuse are design notes, and even those would go through heavy revision.

 

[Spatulo]

I think there's a big difference between the usable assets of Roy, Mewtwo and Lucas and the usable assets of a Mii costume. I mean, Mewtwo and Lucas had fully rendered trophies in Smash 4 before they were turned into fighters - providing the edge loops were there, or a semblance of them were there, the trophies themselves could have become the fighter models, just with higher resolution textures. Literally all it takes is rigging a skeleton for them. Mii costumes, though? Huge stretch. I mean, you can't seriously think that they took that K. Rool costume and turned it into K. Rool, can you?


Adeleine is design wise, just Ado under a different name, and Ado was in Dreamland 3, which iirc was Sakurai's last work on Kirby. He can't possibly hate the character that much.

I’m no expert, but I think that turning a Mii costume into a character would actually be easier than a trophy. A trophy doesn’t necessarily have a skeleton at all, they might not even have separate “parts” because they’re never designed to move. Mii costumes on the other hand are already on skeletons and have some physics and shading attached to them. K Rool is actually a good example, the costume clearly used similar shading and textures to the character model and had cape physics.

 

[Nicnac]

Fatmanonice leaving insider speculation to fully embrace being a regular speculator reminds me so much of this

Definitely one of my top 10 favourite films ever.

 

[Deleted member]

I’m no expert, but I think that turning a Mii costume into a character would actually be easier than a trophy. A trophy doesn’t necessarily have a skeleton at all, they might not even have separate “parts” because they’re never designed to move. Mii costumes on the other hand are already on skeletons and have some physics and shading attached to them. I Rool is actually a good example, the costume clearly used similar shading and textures to the character model and had cape physics.

No, that's backwards. Qeomash basically covered it in his post. The Mii costumes are all rigged to be a Mii fighter, and the hats are all just floating on a "bone", an attachment point for the object. The game engine moves the skeleton and the skeleton moves the model. For the record, things that are designed to move in games anymore are typically all modeled as one solid piece to avoid clipping issues - you don't easily make out the polygons on the moving parts like you could in say, Mario 64 because it's basically a hollow shell instead of multiple geometries. Because a trophy isn't intended to move, it's actually more likely that they're the ones made of multiple parts.

 

[Qeomash]

I’m no expert, but I think that turning a Mii costume into a character would actually be easier than a trophy. A trophy doesn’t necessarily have a skeleton at all, they might not even have separate “parts” because they’re never designed to move. Mii costumes on the other hand are already on skeletons and have some physics and shading attached to them. I Rool is actually a good example, the costume clearly used similar shading and textures to the character model and had cape physics.

I haven't looked, but I'm willing to bet that even trophies have skeletons, even if they are super simple ones. Would make posing them a lot easier.

 

[Spatulo]

No, that's backwards. Qeomash basically covered it in his post. The Mii costumes are all rigged to be a Mii fighter, and the hats are all just floating on a "bone", an attachment point for the object. The game engine moves the skeleton and the skeleton moves the model. For the record, things that are designed to move in games anymore are typically all modeled as one solid piece to avoid clipping issues - you don't easily make out the polygons on the moving parts like you could in say, Mario 64 because it's basically a hollow shell instead of multiple geometries. Because a trophy isn't intended to move, it's actually more likely that they're the ones made of multiple parts.

Ohhh okay, yeah that makes sense. Qeomash sounds like they know what they’re talking about haha. I’d still argue that having Mii Fighter assets still means they’re starting with more than nothing though, even if not much of it gets literally “reused”

 

[pinshadow]

I'm almost vibrating (probably from it being Manic Monday and drinking a whole lot of coffee) but things are falling into place so damn hard. What I wrote earlier gives backing to a theory that I've been using literally before Ultimate was announced... Useable assets. Inkling, Isabelle, Chrom, Dark Samus, and K. Rool all had usable assets from Smash 4. One piece of the puzzle was in front of me the whole time...

Of course they renegotiated for Geno! He was in the base game and if Season 1 of DLC was planned and finalized before launch, of course Nintendo already had permission to use the assets, especially if the original plan was to bring back all the Smash 4 DLC costumes! It makes so much sense! Of course he was always going to come back either way but we all assumed it was the Mii costume. No! That ship has sailed, mother****ers, and hasn't been to port in four months!

Now, similar situation, DLC was kind of sprung on Sakurai for Smash 4 too. Originally it was JUST going to be Mewtwo as a little bonus gift but around November 2014 they were like "**** it, let's do a whole line up." Now, ladies and gentlemen, who were the first three characters outta da gate? Mewtwo, Lucas, and Roy. Lucas was in Brawl and Mewtwo and Roy were originally planned for Brawl but ultimately cut despite having the most work done by far. Why these three? USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. A lot of the basic work bull**** was already done for these characters. Same could easily be argued for Lloyd and Geno. USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. There's a whole goddamn buffet table spread for ATs and Mii costumes being used as references and models for full playable characters. MMMMMM! That's some GOOOOOOD speculation, right there!

Our time is coming, my brothers and sisters! Our time is near!

View attachment 249438

you just realized this now? I feel like people have been saying this stuff for months. Still great to note and easily the biggest point in Geno's favor.

 

[Deleted member]

Ohhh okay, yeah that makes sense. Qeomash sounds like they know what they’re talking about haha. I’d still argue that having Mii Fighter assets still means they’re starting with more than nothing though, even if not much of it gets literally “reused”

I think in Geno's case, there's an argument only because his costume is a full body that seems pretty faithful, but at the same time, it's just halfassed enough to feel like a Mii costume. They'd have to completely remove that weird tommy gun arm they gave him to be another fist, and work in a transformation gimmick, and update the textures, and remake the skeleton...

...and at that point they might as well just make all new geometry. Geno's gonna have to bend and break in ways that Mii Gunner just isn't going to. I mean, there's a realistic argument to be had for the fact that this man transforms into a ****ing cannon, for Christ's sake. Mii Gunner body was never prepared for that.

 

[Rohanx17]

The thing about porky is interesting because If I remember there are two different capsule sprites in mother 3, one for before and after porky gets in. Guess which one they used for the spirit?

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I get it, I'm sticking it out though

I feel like we're a matter of days before someone like Shinobi drops a bombshell

I feel like Shinobi will only come out and say something if it's someone really big like Sora, Master Chief, or Crash. The last two he leaked were Ridley and Banjo & Kazooie and they were big iconic requested characters.

 

[Deleted member]

The thing about porky is interesting because If I remember there are two different capsule sprites in mother 3, one for before and after porky gets in. Guess which one they used for the spirit?

I mean, the difference is unbelievably subtle. They didn't even use the one piece of official non-sprite artwork for Buzz Buzz, I think it's fair to say that Sakurai doesn't give much of a damn for Mother.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

The thing about porky is interesting because If I remember there are two different capsule sprites in mother 3, one for before and after porky gets in. Guess which one they used for the spirit?

The empty version:

I mean, the difference is unbelievably subtle. They didn't even use the one piece of official non-sprite artwork for Buzz Buzz, I think it's fair to say that Sakurai doesn't give much of a damn for Mother.

You don't know that.

 

[Qeomash]

I mean, there's a realistic argument to be had for the fact that this man transforms into a ****ing cannon, for Christ's sake. Mii Gunner body was never prepared for that.

The canon transform would likely be a different model altogether. The Geno fighter model likely will flip and shrink (but not change fundamentally) and be placed invisibly into a rapidly growing canon model.

 

[Spatulo]

I mean, the difference is unbelievably subtle. They didn't even use the one piece of official non-sprite artwork for Buzz Buzz, I think it's fair to say that Sakurai doesn't give much of a damn for Mother.

*the staff for the original Smash was made up partially of people who worked on Earthbound and they gave a canon explanation for his moveset*

*Lucas was planned for Melee but cut because Mother 3 got delayed*

*Lucas and Porky in Brawl*

*Magicent is the design from Mother 1 with tons of references to 1 and 2 including actual screens of gameplay*


“Sakurai doesn’t care about Mother because he used the wrong pngs”

 

[Deleted member]

You don't know that.

No attempt was made to make Ness faithful to his game. Ness was planned to be replaced with Lucas simply because Lucas was a more recent protagonist, and then Lucas was just completely cut for no reason, and is also a semi-clone despite being added when characters were becoming more faithful to their home game.

Nowhere near the level of care has been taken with Mother's representation in Smash as other series, it's probably tied with Metroid for least ****s given.

 

[Firox]

Boys. Fatman is finally back to his roots.

I was thinking the exact same thing. He sounds a LOT more open and excited. Me likey.

 

[Midget Master]

I think Mother got pretty damn excellent treatment this game. It would have been nice to see Porky's boss return, but beyond that I cannot imagine what there could be to complain about as a Mother fan.

 

[Firox]

The empty version:

Wait, why did you post a picture of a Saiyan space ship?

 

[MisterMike]

I'm almost vibrating (probably from it being Manic Monday and drinking a whole lot of coffee) but things are falling into place so damn hard. What I wrote earlier gives backing to a theory that I've been using literally before Ultimate was announced... Useable assets. Inkling, Isabelle, Chrom, Dark Samus, and K. Rool all had usable assets from Smash 4. One piece of the puzzle was in front of me the whole time...

Of course they renegotiated for Geno! He was in the base game and if Season 1 of DLC was planned and finalized before launch, of course Nintendo already had permission to use the assets, especially if the original plan was to bring back all the Smash 4 DLC costumes! It makes so much sense! Of course he was always going to come back either way but we all assumed it was the Mii costume. No! That ship has sailed, mother****ers, and hasn't been to port in four months!

Now, similar situation, DLC was kind of sprung on Sakurai for Smash 4 too. Originally it was JUST going to be Mewtwo as a little bonus gift but around November 2014 they were like "**** it, let's do a whole line up." Now, ladies and gentlemen, who were the first three characters outta da gate? Mewtwo, Lucas, and Roy. Lucas was in Brawl and Mewtwo and Roy were originally planned for Brawl but ultimately cut despite having the most work done by far. Why these three? USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. A lot of the basic work bull**** was already done for these characters. Same could easily be argued for Lloyd and Geno. USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. There's a whole goddamn buffet table spread for ATs and Mii costumes being used as references and models for full playable characters. MMMMMM! That's some GOOOOOOD speculation, right there!

Our time is coming, my brothers and sisters! Our time is near!

View attachment 249438

I think it also helped in the case of that they all had similar fighters to base them off of for Smash 4 . Hell, Roy even uses the same idle animation as Marth when he holds an item.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

No attempt was made to make Ness faithful to his game. Ness was planned to be replaced with Lucas simply because Lucas was a more recent protagonist, and then Lucas was just completely cut for no reason, and is also a semi-clone despite being added when characters were becoming more faithful to their home game.

Nowhere near the level of care has been taken with Mother's representation in Smash as other series, it's probably tied with Metroid for least ****s given.

But hey, at least Mother got all of it's stages back in Ultimate. You can't say that about a lot of other franchises in the game. In my opinion DKC has had it worse than both Metroid and Mother in terms of representation in Smash over the years. For God's sake we just got K. Rool and we should have gotten him years ago back in Brawl honestly. And DK didn't get any character in Smash 4 at all. Classic DKC content has been ignored in Smash for so long.

 

[egaddmario]

I also had an idea going off of Fatman's Thank You theory- what if the final character was Balloon Fighter as a thank you to Iwata?

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I also had an idea going off of Fatman's Thank You theory- what if the final character was Balloon Fighter as a thank you to Iwata?

It would make sense since Ultimate was Sakurai's last mission from Iwata.

 

[Deleted member]

But hey, at least Mother got all of it's stages back in Ultimate. You can't say that about a lot of other franchises in the game. In my opinion DKC has had it worse than both Metroid and Mother in terms of representation in Smash over the years. For God's sake we just got K. Rool and we should have gotten him years ago back in Brawl honestly. And DK didn't get any character in Smash 4 at all. Classic DKC content has been ignored in Smash for so long.

I guess I'm not as big of a fan of Donkey Kong Country as I am... most franchises in Smash, actually, so it's something of a blind spot for me. I love Magicant and think it's the most faithful Mother stage in the game, so I'm grateful for it being around, and the (one) remix it got.

Don't even get me started on how Mother has gotten the short end of the music stick, as well. I mean, just put the original gamerips in.

 

[Zeb Nasaki]

I'm almost vibrating (probably from it being Manic Monday and drinking a whole lot of coffee) but things are falling into place so damn hard. What I wrote earlier gives backing to a theory that I've been using literally before Ultimate was announced... Useable assets. Inkling, Isabelle, Chrom, Dark Samus, and K. Rool all had usable assets from Smash 4. One piece of the puzzle was in front of me the whole time...

Of course they renegotiated for Geno! He was in the base game and if Season 1 of DLC was planned and finalized before launch, of course Nintendo already had permission to use the assets, especially if the original plan was to bring back all the Smash 4 DLC costumes! It makes so much sense! Of course he was always going to come back either way but we all assumed it was the Mii costume. No! That ship has sailed, mother****ers, and hasn't been to port in four months!

Now, similar situation, DLC was kind of sprung on Sakurai for Smash 4 too. Originally it was JUST going to be Mewtwo as a little bonus gift but around November 2014 they were like "**** it, let's do a whole line up." Now, ladies and gentlemen, who were the first three characters outta da gate? Mewtwo, Lucas, and Roy. Lucas was in Brawl and Mewtwo and Roy were originally planned for Brawl but ultimately cut despite having the most work done by far. Why these three? USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. A lot of the basic work bull**** was already done for these characters. Same could easily be argued for Lloyd and Geno. USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. There's a whole goddamn buffet table spread for ATs and Mii costumes being used as references and models for full playable characters. MMMMMM! That's some GOOOOOOD speculation, right there!

Our time is coming, my brothers and sisters! Our time is near!

View attachment 249438

I agree with everything you said and that this could mean great things for geno in the future, I personally think he is 7 at least with lloy being 6.

Howewver I still have one doubt. If your theory is correct and sword users will be a theme for the mii costumes of number 5 and in the case that vergeben is right and is not a bandai namco character. There are pthrr sword users that has not been decofirmed taht could also fit the criteria. Also if Lloyd is number 6 it would be weird to have two namco characters back to back, also that nightmare and also sol are fighting game characters so they will be the same genre as terry. So i personally think that number 5 is not bandai namco, it is a company totally unexpected, no heard about but is a non rpg sword user.

That could give some light in the darkness of the number 5 mistery.

 

[Franco Geno]

I'm almost vibrating (probably from it being Manic Monday and drinking a whole lot of coffee) but things are falling into place so damn hard. What I wrote earlier gives backing to a theory that I've been using literally before Ultimate was announced... Useable assets. Inkling, Isabelle, Chrom, Dark Samus, and K. Rool all had usable assets from Smash 4. One piece of the puzzle was in front of me the whole time...

Of course they renegotiated for Geno! He was in the base game and if Season 1 of DLC was planned and finalized before launch, of course Nintendo already had permission to use the assets, especially if the original plan was to bring back all the Smash 4 DLC costumes! It makes so much sense! Of course he was always going to come back either way but we all assumed it was the Mii costume. No! That ship has sailed, mother****ers, and hasn't been to port in four months!

Now, similar situation, DLC was kind of sprung on Sakurai for Smash 4 too. Originally it was JUST going to be Mewtwo as a little bonus gift but around November 2014 they were like "**** it, let's do a whole line up." Now, ladies and gentlemen, who were the first three characters outta da gate? Mewtwo, Lucas, and Roy. Lucas was in Brawl and Mewtwo and Roy were originally planned for Brawl but ultimately cut despite having the most work done by far. Why these three? USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. A lot of the basic work bull**** was already done for these characters. Same could easily be argued for Lloyd and Geno. USABLE. ****ING. ASSETS. There's a whole goddamn buffet table spread for ATs and Mii costumes being used as references and models for full playable characters. MMMMMM! That's some GOOOOOOD speculation, right there!

Our time is coming, my brothers and sisters! Our time is near!

View attachment 249438

LET'S F#CKING GO!!!

 

[MisterMike]

I also had an idea going off of Fatman's Thank You theory- what if the final character was Balloon Fighter as a thank you to Iwata?

I don't think a Villager Echo Fighter would go down so well with fans...

 

[Spatulo]

But hey, at least Mother got all of it's stages back in Ultimate. You can't say that about a lot of other franchises in the game. In my opinion DKC has had it worse than both Metroid and Mother in terms of representation in Smash over the years. For God's sake we just got K. Rool and we should have gotten him years ago back in Brawl honestly. And DK didn't get any character in Smash 4 at all. Classic DKC content has been ignored in Smash for so long.

It’s really weird to me how well represented Donkey Kong Barrel Blast has been in Smash compared to the rest of the DKC franchise. Ultimate is definitely a step up in classic representation (Thanks K Rool and Klaptrap) but it’s still iffy, and the lack of Tropical Freeze music is a crime

 

[RetrogamerMax]

It’s really weird to me how well represented Donkey Kong Barrel Blast has been in Smash compared to the rest of the DKC franchise. Ultimate is definitely a step up in classic representation (Thanks K Rool and Klaptrap) but it’s still iffy, and the lack of Tropical Freeze music is a crime

Ultimate is definitely a step up from the past games when it comes to classic DKC content. But it's still missing a lot things we should have gotten years ago like:

- A playable Dixie Kong

- DKC3 music

- DK64 music

- Tropical Freeze music

- A minecart stage

- Kong Assist Trophy

 

[Rohanx17]

I mean, the difference is unbelievably subtle. They didn't even use the one piece of official non-sprite artwork for Buzz Buzz, I think it's fair to say that Sakurai doesn't give much of a damn for Mother.

Maybe but I have a hard time believing that the guy who thought Ness was a priority to get in before peach, Bowser, wario, Zelda, gannondorf, dedede and meta knight doesn't give a damn about mother.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Maybe but I have a hard time believing that the guy who thought Ness was a priority to get in before peach, Bowser, wario, Zelda, gannondorf, dedede and meta knight, doesn't give a damn about mother.

This. If that was the case, Bowser and Peach both would have gotten in back in 64 over Ness and Captain Falcon.

 

[Deleted member]

Maybe but I have a hard time believing that the guy who thought Ness was a priority to get in before peach, Bowser, wario, Zelda, gannondorf, dedede and meta knight doesn't give a damn about mother.

iirc, Peach, Dedede, and Meta Knight were all considered for 64 and technical difficulties kept them out. No source, sorry, so take it as hearsay. That aside, Ness was the first "Wtf" character and was probably only added for the shock factor.

 

[I.D.]

Mother is a trilogy that finished 13 years ago and its three games combined don't even break a million sales, the only franchise with playable characters in smash that fails to accomplish this. Despite this it still gets two fighters, four stages, two assist trophies, three items, and over a dozen arranged music tracks. Plenty of people on this forum would kill for Sakurai to give "as much of a damn" for their favorite series as he gives for Mother.

 

[Franco Geno]

Our lord and savior Fatmanonice has spoken, y'all better listen to him

 

[Fatmanonice]

you just realized this now? I feel like people have been saying this stuff for months. Still great to note and easily the biggest point in Geno's favor.

More so getting a full grasp of the significance than just realizing it.

 

[OffBi]

Our lord and savior Fatmanonice has spoken, y'all better listen to him
View attachment 249445

kek