Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Griselda]

Who else but Mii Gunner? The ultimate revenge!

I think if any Mii Fighters are getting involved, there needs to be an Axem Rangers costume with color variations to simulate their fight. Taking place on the Halberd, of course.

 

[OffBi]

Who else

But Donald Duck!

 

[Zac's Realm]

Can't believe I, of all people, missed Monokuma talk by going to sleep.

Danganronpa's so special to me, that would make me actually scream if it ever happened.

At any rate, I think people overrate how bad he is maturity-wise. Bayonetta is similar to him i'd say in maturity, the difference being it's way easier to tone Monokuma down since he's also very wacky despite being an evil little bear.

Don't get me wrong, obviously the games themselves are super mature, but it wouldn't be hard to tone Monokuma down for Smash I think.

 

[Franco Geno]

So the most likely character as of right now for fighter 5 is Lloyd right? (until Sabi or other leaker kills him too)

 

[RingJ5]

So the most likely character as of right now for fighter 5 is Lloyd right? (until Sabi or other leaker kills him too)

Not significantly. The only things going for him could very well end up completely unrelated, nothing specifically has come out that ties him to Smash.

Despite how things might have seemed over the last few days, it’s still very much an “anything can happen” situation... well, not counting anyone that has been outright deconfirmed.

 

[Latyon]

I still very much have doubts about Lloyd, or any Tales character honestly. I mean, sure, Lloyd is cool (not as cool as Repede but hey) and his moveset could pretty much be directly lifted from Symphonia...but he just feels a little...off? Compared to the others in the Fighter's Pass. Banjo was heavily requested, Terry has a huge legacy, Hero has a huge legacy, Joker...was a weeb vote.

I dunno. I like Lloyd but to me he seems unlikely for FP5. I feel like FP5 is gonna blow our ***** off and Lloyd just ain't it.

 

[Deleted member]

Yeah seems like it. But consindering the great Thanos snap of November with a bunch of characters getting disconfirmed even Lloyd's chances are up in the air.

He still could get in but Sabi could disconfirm him at any moment.

So for now yeah he has a chance. Which I hope stays but we'll see.

 

[ivanlerma]

Happy Thanksgiving Everyone, i hope you all enjoy spending time with your families for a wild feast. here's a fun song that could give you a happy feel for the holiday. https://youtu.be/Y4ilrgYoCcg?list=PLVlceJCtUuObc3Fv5wuWVyEGG1pe02qW3

 

[Deleted member]

It’s both sad and hilarious to me that Cloud is the go-to comparison for ****ty representation in Smash

Think a series doesn’t have enough music? Look at Cloud. Not enough spirits? Cloud. Dumb logo? Cloud.

It almost undermines him being basically the craziest Smash inclusion of all time. Almost.

When it comes to missing music or spirits, I point to Wario Land instead of Cloud.


Because Wario Land desperately needs it.

 

[Fire Scyther]

When it comes to missing music or spirits, I point to Wario Land instead of Cloud.


Because Wario Land desperately needs it.

Shokora and Captain Syrup, along with a few Shake It! characters appear as spirits though, and Wario's shoulder bash is back as a dash attack.

 

[Deleted member]

Shokora and Captain Syrup, along with a few Shake It! characters appear as spirits though, and Wario's shoulder bash is back as a dash attack.

4 spirits and a dash attack won't cut it.

The Shake King is the only spirit from Shake It! there.

WarioWare is still the dominant one with its representation, and I want to see Wario Land get the same amount of love. It doesn't have remixes, a stage, or an assist trophy.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad the shoulder is back, because down tilt into dash attack is the greatest, but there just isn't enough Wario Land in Smash.

 

[Sigran101]

Even if you think it's trivial, it really isn't. Sakurai stated Lloyd was a good pick for a Mii Costume and nothing more, don't try to read into it. On top of that, Tales was literally mentioned in two sentences in this entire interview, and other then this Sakurai has literally never talked about the series (that I could find). EVEN on top of that, when have Sakurai's interviews ever been indicative of anything getting into Smash 100%? (Ridley too big for Smash).

On top of this all my other arguments still stand beyond that:
-Sakurai stated the Lloyd stuff before Yuri had any games (outside Project X Zone) on a Nintendo Console.
-Outside of Smash, Yuri is still the most popular Tales character (usually the most popular 3rd party characters of a series get represented in Smash as a character), he earns Bamco a lot more money then Lloyd. Fujoshi's would literally buy out all the Yuri merchandise created from Smash.
-Tales of Vesperia: DE released on the Switch in 2019, making Yuri more relevant compared to any other Tales protagonist at this time.
-Nintendo is actually picking the DLC and not Sakurai, and Vesperia makes more sense to advertise from a money-making perspective compared to Symphonia for both Bandai-Namco and Nintendo (Unless Symphonia HD gets ported to all modern consoles again.)
-So far the only DLC character that got in due to fan-demand is Banjo.
-The book icon (assuming it's for Smash) is linked to Yuri not Lloyd. You don't see Joker come with Persona 4 TVs as his icon, and you see Cloud come with the FF7 icon.

So when people are only able to defend Lloyd 100% getting in over Yuri through two sentences Sakurai said 3.5 years ago, you could say I'm a bit skeptical about that.

Also lol at me trying to really grasp at straws to come up with an argument for Yuri getting in. I always say Lloyd/Yuri because I'm 50/50 on their chances and they both have good reason to get in. I just get annoyed at people who let their biases ruin speculation.

Try coming up with an argument for why Lloyd is DEFINITIVELY getting in over Yuri, and don't use the interview as anything definitive please. Because outside of the interview (2 sentences), all I can use to defend Lloyd's position is that a small group of Smash fans want Lloyd in more vocally then Yuri.

I agree on the other points you made. But the interview is significant. You haven't explained why it would be different for a character. Sakurai said Lloyd should represent Tales. He didn't say only for a mii costume. This just screams fan rule. Literally what's the difference?

 

[RetrogamerMax]

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/78203375?jumpto=27#27

Rofl, this is an absolute bloodbath.

Insiders: While we ain't able to tell you who FP5 is, we will at least tell you who isn't. Have fun guessing who it is bye.

 

[I_DON'T_KNOW_YOU!]

This should be Lloyd's logo-

 

[nessdeltarune00]

Insiders: While we ain't able to tell you who FP5 is, we will at least tell you who isn't. Have fun guessing who it is bye.

To be fair, if any of us had that power, who wouldn’t use it to create chaos in the community?

 

[Droodle]

I agree on the other points you made. But the interview is significant. You haven't explained why it would be different for a character. Sakurai said Lloyd should represent Tales. He didn't say only for a mii costume. This just screams fan rule. Literally what's the difference?

I'm not gonna bother arguing about Lloyd VS Yuri anymore; we'll know who's in, when they get in (There's even a possibility neither make it in).

That said I'll leave an image summarizing my thoughts.

 

[RingJ5]

I still very much have doubts about Lloyd, or any Tales character honestly. I mean, sure, Lloyd is cool (not as cool as Repede but hey) and his moveset could pretty much be directly lifted from Symphonia...but he just feels a little...off? Compared to the others in the Fighter's Pass. Banjo was heavily requested, Terry has a huge legacy, Hero has a huge legacy, Joker...was a weeb vote.

I dunno. I like Lloyd but to me he seems unlikely for FP5. I feel like FP5 is gonna blow our ***** off and Lloyd just ain't it.

For Joker, Megaten itself has a pretty huge legacy, especially on Nintendo platforms. It’s a bit of a Cloud situation, with the chosen character being more associated with Playstation, but also generally being the most currently recognizable character from the franchise as a whole.

However, I’d be entirely remiss not to mention that, well... Persona 5 is also one of Sakurai’s favorite games, which absolutely played a factor. My personal theory is that Nintendo wanted anything from “an Atlus rep” to specifically “a Megaten rep” expecting Jack Frost or something, but Sakurai specifically asked if he could go straight for Joker, and the rest was history.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

He did not call Erdrick, that was Tansut.

He did not call Banjo, that was shinobi.

He did not call Terry, that was Nintendo themselves.

He was right about stuff over a year ago and since then has been coasting on that reputation and proven himself a completely worthless source of info.

Yep, exactly. Vergeben was the first one to say stuff up until the February Direct where he wrong about Star Fox GP and Erdrick in Smash showning up. Since then, he has been piggybacking off of other insiders like Sabi.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Yep, exactly. Vergeben was the first one to say stuff up until the February Direct where he wrong about Star Fox GP and Erdrick in Smash showning up. Since then, he has been piggybacking off of other insiders like Sabi.

Sabi trusts him, and he still got stuff right. I think he’s just trying to be more careful instead of piggybacking.

 

[AdamBel731]

For Joker, Megaten itself has a pretty huge legacy, especially on Nintendo platforms. It’s a bit of a Cloud situation, with the chosen character being more associated with Playstation, but also generally being the most currently recognizable character from the franchise as a whole.

However, I’d be entirely remiss not to mention that, well... Persona 5 is also one of Sakurai’s favorite games, which absolutely played a factor. My personal theory is that Nintendo wanted anything from “an Atlus rep” to specifically “a Megaten rep” expecting Jack Frost or something, but Sakurai specifically asked if he could go straight for Joker, and the rest was history.

I think that's a reasonable way to look at it. I'm tired of some people saying that Sakurai lied or something, and that HE was the one who chose everything for DLC.

I think the more likely scenario is probably what you must outlined. Nintendo either told Sakurai the franchise and/or company that should get a character, and then Sakurai picked a character he thought would be cool/would have a cool moveset. At the end of the day, no matter the semantics, I think it is pretty silly to just assume Sakurai outright lied to us.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Sabi trusts him, and he still got stuff right. I think he’s just trying to be more careful instead of piggybacking.

Perhaps so. But I trust Sabi more now than him.

So the most likely character as of right now for fighter 5 is Lloyd right? (until Sabi or other leaker kills him too)

Yep.

 

[ForsakenM]

Lost my big Geno post again but it shouldn't be hard to recreate. Until then, let me lay down the smack down for some of our newer memebrs in this thread. Glad to see this post is still relevant despite passing out for way too many hours.

>Leaks Ridley, Simon, Isabelle, Kencineroar, Erdrick, Banjo, Terry, Isaac assist trophy, no cuts
>”Vergeben knows nothing!”

You sure about that?

You are giving Vergeben too much credit here, so let me help you be more informed.

First off, when it comes to Ridley and Simon and the return of the Ice Climbers as well as no cuts, all that information was already available to other insiders for months but they didn't want to leak it to protect jobs. But Vergeben said '**** that, it's not MY job on the line' and leaked all that information. The Ken Debug Leak was also a thing, so we all had proof of Ken well before Vergeben knew which Pokemon was in. Lots of people knew about Hero months and months ago but nobody knew how Hero would be approached and technically Vergeben was WRONG saying it was Erdrick (oh, and btw, the List of Seven Square Reps cost people jobs if I remember correctly, and that came directly from Vergeben), Sabi's NoA source told us about Isaac returning as an AT before Verge did (even though it was in an offhanded way as to protect people) and Vergeben piggybacked off of nearly every other leaker for Banjo and Terry.

Vergeben is nothing but a coattail-riding wannabe now, and the facts show he always has been. Him saying 'X company ain't it chief' when other leakers already know who the character IS and just haven't said anything for obvious reasons is proof enough that he is irrelevant. Also, don't forget his Minecraft screw up, his original Dragon Ball FighterZ screw up, and his Star Fox major mishap as well as saying the new LoZ game WASN'T a Link's Awakening remake...when it actually was, then trying to take credit that he meant something else and being wrong about that as well.

If y'all don't believe Vergeben is legit despite getting most of his Smash info right, getting some stuff right for other games, and Sabi trusting him, I don't know what to tell y'all.

Just because a leaker gets something wrong doesn't mean they're a liar, else we'd have forgotten about Sabi already with that whole Jonesy thing.

Actually Sabi and I have made fun of Vergeben on multiple accounts now for coattail-riding things other leakers have said, including Sabi. Sabi never said Jonesy was in nor were they involved in that stupid 4chan leak, they just entertained the idea as they genuinely love Fortnite...one of the few things I hold against them but I let it slide since they are the only insider that I get to chat with. Also, read my previous paragraphs that show that Vergeben's info was nothing new in the insider circle for pretty much his entire career for Smash Ultimate minus maybe Isabelle and Incineroar.

I praised him back in the day myself, especially when everyone **** all over him and believed the Grinch Ruse, but the fact is 90% of the information he ever shared was already known by other insiders who just decided overall it wasn't a good idea to share it.

On top of this all my other arguments still stand beyond that:
-Sakurai stated the Lloyd stuff before Yuri had any games (outside Project X Zone) on a Nintendo Console.
-Outside of Smash, Yuri is still the most popular Tales character (usually the most popular 3rd party characters of a series get represented in Smash as a character), he earns Bamco a lot more money then Lloyd. Fujoshi's would literally buy out all the Yuri merchandise created from Smash.
-Tales of Vesperia: DE released on the Switch in 2019, making Yuri more relevant compared to any other Tales protagonist at this time.
-Nintendo is actually picking the DLC and not Sakurai, and Vesperia makes more sense to advertise from a money-making perspective compared to Symphonia for both Bandai-Namco and Nintendo (Unless Symphonia HD gets ported to all modern consoles again.)
-So far the only DLC character that got in due to fan-demand is Banjo.
-The book icon (assuming it's for Smash) is linked to Yuri not Lloyd. You don't see Joker come with Persona 4 TVs as his icon, and you see Cloud come with the FF7 icon.

1. Your Yuri bias is showing. I don't care how many facts you spit out about Yuri, it's all charged by your bias. Due to my lack of personal bias, I dug up an article that was about this big Tales Of celebration (it was really late and I passed out, so I think it was a con maybe? I know there were official poles but that's all I remember) and Lloyd was still very high in those polls. People still love him more than you give credit, so try again.
2. Being on a Nintendo console =/= not a possibility until they are on a Nintendo console. That rule has been broken already along with so many others, so please stop bringing that up. That goes for anyone else.
3. Sales doesn't mean anything towards a character's chances. Never has, never will.
4. 'bUt NiNtEnDo PiCkEd ThE dLC!' is also a dead argument because this entire list is proof that, at best, they gave Sakurai a list of characters that was pretty huge and Sakurai picked out which ones he thought would be best for what would be, at the time, the last 5 characters getting into the game. So far from what we have seen, Sakurai saw 3 characters he loves very much personally and one that the fans have been asking for since Melee. So he made them all happen. Frankly, if Nintendo DID pick the DLC, it would all have been marketing picks...and not a single one of these have been marketing picks outside of arguably Hero, but that doesn't advertise a Nintendo 1st Party as much as Nintendo's favorite 3rd Party. The rest do nothing major for Nintendo, so this argument can stop now, thank you.
5. So...if the Tales Of community still loves Lloyd so much both inside and outside of Smash, and YOUR GAME IS SMASH, which do you pick: the character with overall more popularity outside of Smash, or the character that Smash fans have been clamoring for since Brawl who is still popular outside of Smash? The choice is clear here.
6. Actually, you are incorrect about Cloud: his logo in Smash is just "FF" which is for Final Fantasy as a whole. See, Cloud doesn't represent JUST FF7: represents ALL of Final Fantasy, since there are so many games and his story is just the most popular. Lloyd could EASILY be the same thing, which just "Tales Of" or the journal that is generic and spread across all Tales Of games as he would represent the entire franchise as a single character.
7. Saying that Banjo is the only one that got in due to fan demand not only discredits that demand for the other 3 characters, but also means nothing for future speculation. In fact, it gives more in Lloyd's favor because you would think it would be more likely to balance itself out, and thus the next character would have an increased chance to be a fan pick.
8. To the rest of your arguments: Oh look, someone else who forgot Sakurai's own words. Hold on, I got you.
   

Yuri being more popular to a general audience or to the general Tales Of audience or being more relevant is no longer a talking point because Sakurai himself stated that it doesn't matter: what matters is if he can make the character fun. Welp, what would be more fun for the Smash community: a character that has little pull from a series that isn't super big outside the East? Or a character that was super popular generally everywhere from a game that did well globally and has a fan-following from your own game series requesting him for a very long time AND is a part of that same series that is mostly popular in the East?

 

[DanganZilla5]

meanwhile, luigi and daisy are happy,
Also Sakurai stated that Alucard was nearly the choice for Castlevania, but he felt that Simon was more iconic.

That and whips are a staple of the series.

I think Monokuma is just fine because Sakurai can always tone him down. Otherwise we would have disregarded Doom Slayer a long time ago.

And I'm looking forward to seeing if Lloyd gets to live through the deconfirmation storm. He seems to be picking up steam from within the community and whenever a character gets traction, they always get deconfirmed by Sabi's source. And right now Lloyd is arguably the number one choice, besides maybe Nightmare. And I don't see a Guilty Gear character coming to Smash. His fans have been loud and clear for years, putting Lloyd high up in fan polls. The Tales of series has quite a bit of Nintendo history and is relatively popular in Japan and has a decent fanbase in the West. His dual wield style could make for an interesting moveset. Let me ask, does he have some kind of magic or special abilities? I looked at his page on numerous wikis and couldn't find a Powers section for him.

Edit: And of course the trademark thing that COULD be related to Smash and the fact that he is a Bandai Namco character and god do they deserve another character.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Today is Thanksgiving. How about we take a break from arguing and just go eat till we hate ourselves the next day when a good half of the day is spent on the toilet.

and we all gained like 20 pounds.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Is that it?

No offense, but the generic Tales icon fits Yuri more then Lloyd because Vesperia is actually when that icon started to be used as a save icon.

Unless you have other reasons to believe Lloyd has a better shot then Yuri, I'm back on 50/50 Lloyd:Yuri. But either or is a win for me, and it is nice to know that they have a pretty good shot.

I feel like the bigger takeaway is that there's a lot in favor of Tales being the front runner for a Namco rep and there has been for over a year. The icon thing is just serendipitous because it came out and supposedly Nintendo itself started to hardcore tease its employees that big Tales news was coming soon on the same day. I can't say specific names of who was doing the teasing but it definitely illicited an "oh ****" reaction from us when the NoA source shared this.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Fatmanonice I have two questions to ask you: What are the chances that we will get a Indie rep and that rep being Shantae? I'm curious if we are getting a Indie rep or not.

 

[MissingGlitch]

I feel like the bigger takeaway is that there's a lot in favor of Tales being the front runner for a Namco rep and there has been for over a year. The icon thing is just serendipitous because it came out and supposedly Nintendo itself started to hardcore tease its employees that big Tales news was coming soon on the same day. I can't say specific names of who was doing the teasing but it definitely illicited an "oh ****" reaction from us when the NoA source shared this.

You're making it sound like Nintendo is really wanting to push JRPGs in the west. Especially when every JRPG character (if Lloyd) this pass was announced at some major western event followed by a heavy marketing campaign for said character and their game. (Well except for Persona, GIVE ME THAT SWITCH PORT ALREADY ATLUS)

 

[Plank08]

Rip I tried to use the geno hat but it always has the white background on it

 

[link2702]

happy stuff your face full of food and regret it later day everyone.

 

[ForsakenM]

Today is Thanksgiving. How about we take a break from arguing and just go eat till we hate ourselves the next day when a good half of the day is spent on the toilet.

and we all gained like 20 pounds.

I normally would but I'm all alone for Thanksgiving and I'm broke, so there is that.

Merhaps I'll finally unite us under that post though...

 

[Droodle]

Lost my big Geno post again but it shouldn't be hard to recreate. Until then, let me lay down the smack down for some of our newer memebrs in this thread. Glad to see this post is still relevant despite passing out for way too many hours.



You are giving Vergeben too much credit here, so let me help you be more informed.

First off, when it comes to Ridley and Simon and the return of the Ice Climbers as well as no cuts, all that information was already available to other insiders for months but they didn't want to leak it to protect jobs. But Vergeben said '**** that, it's not MY job on the line' and leaked all that information. The Ken Debug Leak was also a thing, so we all had proof of Ken well before Vergeben knew which Pokemon was in. Lots of people knew about Hero months and months ago but nobody knew how Hero would be approached and technically Vergeben was WRONG saying it was Erdrick (oh, and btw, the List of Seven Square Reps cost people jobs if I remember correctly, and that came directly from Vergeben), Sabi's NoA source told us about Isaac returning as an AT before Verge did (even though it was in an offhanded way as to protect people) and Vergeben piggybacked off of nearly every other leaker for Banjo and Terry.

Vergeben is nothing but a coattail-riding wannabe now, and the facts show he always has been. Him saying 'X company ain't it chief' when other leakers already know who the character IS and just haven't said anything for obvious reasons is proof enough that he is irrelevant. Also, don't forget his Minecraft screw up, his original Dragon Ball FighterZ screw up, and his Star Fox major mishap as well as saying the new LoZ game WASN'T a Link's Awakening remake...when it actually was, then trying to take credit that he meant something else and being wrong about that as well.



Actually Sabi and I have made fun of Vergeben on multiple accounts now for coattail-riding things other leakers have said, including Sabi. Sabi never said Jonesy was in nor were they involved in that stupid 4chan leak, they just entertained the idea as they genuinely love Fortnite...one of the few things I hold against them but I let it slide since they are the only insider that I get to chat with. Also, read my previous paragraphs that show that Vergeben's info was nothing new in the insider circle for pretty much his entire career for Smash Ultimate minus maybe Isabelle and Incineroar.

I praised him back in the day myself, especially when everyone **** all over him and believed the Grinch Ruse, but the fact is 90% of the information he ever shared was already known by other insiders who just decided overall it wasn't a good idea to share it.

1. Your Yuri bias is showing. I don't care how many facts you spit out about Yuri, it's all charged by your bias. Due to my lack of personal bias, I dug up an article that was about this big Tales Of celebration (it was really late and I passed out, so I think it was a con maybe? I know there were official poles but that's all I remember) and Lloyd was still very high in those polls. People still love him more than you give credit, so try again.
2. Being on a Nintendo console =/= not a possibility until they are on a Nintendo console. That rule has been broken already along with so many others, so please stop bringing that up. That goes for anyone else.
3. Sales doesn't mean anything towards a character's chances. Never has, never will.
4. 'bUt NiNtEnDo PiCkEd ThE dLC!' is also a dead argument because this entire list is proof that, at best, they gave Sakurai a list of characters that was pretty huge and Sakurai picked out which ones he thought would be best for what would be, at the time, the last 5 characters getting into the game. So far from what we have seen, Sakurai saw 3 characters he loves very much personally and one that the fans have been asking for since Melee. So he made them all happen. Frankly, if Nintendo DID pick the DLC, it would all have been marketing picks...and not a single one of these have been marketing picks outside of arguably Hero, but that doesn't advertise a Nintendo 1st Party as much as Nintendo's favorite 3rd Party. The rest do nothing major for Nintendo, so this argument can stop now, thank you.
5. So...if the Tales Of community still loves Lloyd so much both inside and outside of Smash, and YOUR GAME IS SMASH, which do you pick: the character with overall more popularity outside of Smash, or the character that Smash fans have been clamoring for since Brawl who is still popular outside of Smash? The choice is clear here.
6. Actually, you are incorrect about Cloud: his logo in Smash is just "FF" which is for Final Fantasy as a whole. See, Cloud doesn't represent JUST FF7: represents ALL of Final Fantasy, since there are so many games and his story is just the most popular. Lloyd could EASILY be the same thing, which just "Tales Of" or the journal that is generic and spread across all Tales Of games as he would represent the entire franchise as a single character.
7. Saying that Banjo is the only one that got in due to fan demand not only discredits that demand for the other 3 characters, but also means nothing for future speculation. In fact, it gives more in Lloyd's favor because you would think it would be more likely to balance itself out, and thus the next character would have an increased chance to be a fan pick.
8. To the rest of your arguments: Oh look, someone else who forgot Sakurai's own words. Hold on, I got you.View attachment 248540

Yuri being more popular to a general audience or to the general Tales Of audience or being more relevant is no longer a talking point because Sakurai himself stated that it doesn't matter: what matters is if he can make the character fun. Welp, what would be more fun for the Smash community: a character that has little pull from a series that isn't super big outside the East? Or a character that was super popular generally everywhere from a game that did well globally and has a fan-following from your own game series requesting him for a very long time AND is a part of that same series that is mostly popular in the East?

I thought I'd said that I wouldn't bother with talking about Lloyd vs Yuri anymore but:

-https://www.siliconera.com/tales-festival-2017-character-popularity-poll-results/ : This was the last tales popularity poll, Lloyd placed outside the top 10 (at number 11); Zelos who is a side character from Symphonia placed at 9. Yuri was banned.

-Being on a Nintendo console DOES boost a character's chances, as I bought it up with Hideaki Itsuno saying Dante isn't possible due to him not being on a Nintendo console in a significant way. The only exception to this so far is CLOUD, who is THE FF Character; which already is one of the most popular video game series in the world.

-I was just stating Yuri merch sells a lot more then Lloyd merch; Symphonia has sold more then Vesperia so wouldn't your point technically favor Yuri?

-As I said, Lloyd isn't amazingly popular within the Tales of community (especially in Japan, it's homebase); when the goal of DLC as mentioned by Nintendo is to bring in more audiences to Smash, would you pick Lloyd who's primary fanbase already has Smash; or would you bring in Yuri, who's primary fanbase is much bigger then Lloyd (even if it doesn't necessarily cross with the Smash fanbase). If you want a bigger newer audience, you would pick Yuri over Lloyd; if you want to appeal to your existing audience you would pick Lloyd over Yuri.

-Yes, you're right about Cloud. That was my bad. That said, they wouldn't use the book to represent Tales of Symphonia when the Astrolobe is a much better choice. The journal wasn't used as a save point in Symphonia.

-Banjo was the only one that had SIGNIFICANT amounts of fan demand. Joker and Terry weren't commonly discussed before their actual reveal, but turned out to be popular anyways. Hero didn't pick up momentum until Vergeben leaked Erdrick.

- I don't know what you're trying to say with the picture and the rest of your arguments? Lloyd is more requested then Yuri so he would be more fun to play then Yuri? Sakurai used the recognizability argument to say that even though Terry wasn't hugely requested and recognizable he was still fun to play; so that's why he got in. That picture neither hints at Lloyd or Yuri, it just states that sometimes fun characters get in over more recognizable characters.

-On top of this, your bias shows when you say Lloyd would be more fun for the community just due to being more popular inside the Smash community.

- Also if people are going to use Sakurai's interview 2 years ago (where Tales is barely mentioned) as evidence supporting Lloyd; I can use Reggie's statement from the game awards and state that only new characters not previously in Smash will get in. Is it dumb, yes, but so is Sakurai's statement from 3.5 years ago.

So I don't get how my personal bias is showing when I say Yuri and Lloyd have a 50/50 shot of getting in over each other. In fact, you could just as easily say that Smash speculation bias is showing in for people who think Lloyd is the only possible Tales rep.

 

[MissingGlitch]

I normally would but I'm all alone for Thanksgiving and I'm broke, so there is that.

Merhaps I'll finally unite us under that post though...

Oh...I'm Sorry

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I normally would but I'm all alone for Thanksgiving and I'm broke, so there is that.

Merhaps I'll finally unite us under that post though...

Sorry to hear that.

 

[Ura]

Fatmanonice I meant to ask you this the other day but are you still confident in post-pass characters not being from after 2017? I would find that a bit odd since this new wave of DLC was decided on most likely around mid 2019-ish.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Fatmanonice I have two questions to ask you: What are the chances that we will get a Indie rep and that rep being Shantae? I'm curious if we are getting a Indie rep or not.

Not great... I know you're a big Shantae fan (I am too) but Shantae kind of gets steamrolled. Not only haven't we heard her but we haven't heard any Indie characters, we've heard very few Western characters, and we've technically only have heard one female character and it's less of a name and more of people agree that Nintendo's probably going to try to have a least one before DLC is over.

 

[Droodle]

I feel like the bigger takeaway is that there's a lot in favor of Tales being the front runner for a Namco rep and there has been for over a year. The icon thing is just serendipitous because it came out and supposedly Nintendo itself started to hardcore tease its employees that big Tales news was coming soon on the same day. I can't say specific names of who was doing the teasing but it definitely illicited an "oh ****" reaction from us when the NoA source shared this.

Yeah, I'm just happy if a Tales rep gets in.

I still don't feel like Lloyd/Yuri are 100% in; but it's nice to know that their chances are looking good even by insiders.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Not great... I know you're a big Shantae fan (I am too) but Shantae kind of gets steamrolled. Not only haven't we heard her but we haven't heard any Indie characters, we've heard very few Western characters, and we've technically only have heard one female character and it's less of a name and more of people agree that Nintendo's probably going to try to have a least one before DLC is over.

Well that sucks to hear. But as for who might be the next female character if there is one, I'm leaning on Elma more than any other female character. I think out of the first party characters, she probably has the best shot just mainly due to there being no Xenoblade X music in the game and Elma's voice actress voicing a secret role since last November. Which, she still hasn't announced.

 

[SpiritOfRuin]

His playstyle would probably be "sadistic Looney Tune character". He's also got robots, and a little gavel.

That...actually sounds like the exact thing I would want in Smash.

 

[Deleted member]

Not great... I know you're a big Shantae fan (I am too) but Shantae kind of gets steamrolled. Not only haven't we heard her but we haven't heard any Indie characters, we've heard very few Western characters, and we've technically only have heard one female character and it's less of a name and more of people agree that Nintendo's probably going to try to have a least one before DLC is over.

So no Reimu? Damn... If true that's kinda disappointing. I haven't been rooting for Reimu as long as I have for Geno but she would've been cool.

Maybe in Smash 6.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Fatmanonice I meant to ask you this the other day but are you still confident in post-pass characters not being from after 2017? I would find that a bit odd since this new wave of DLC was decided on most likely around mid 2019-ish.

I still stand by this because look at the names that we've made public: Ryu, Crash, Geno, Sephiroth, Nightmare, Sol, Lloyd/Yuri, and Dante. The remaining names are more of the same: very fanservicey and with most being requested for over a decade. The fact that a lot of these characters are similar to Ridley, K. Rool, and Banjo in terms of history with the fandom is no coincidence in my eyes.