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Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

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JoscarGamma

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Does anyone here have a list of who dodged the spirit list? With new releases and echoes out of the running seems like the best place to start.
That I know of:
Mike Jones (Star Tropics)
Porky (Earthbound/Mother)

And maybe

Linkle (Hyrule Warriors)

I’ve been going through the spirit list and any other game representation already included/not included in smash... still looking
 

Fatmanonice

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I think that theory is solid. The missing costumes are clear exceptions that raise some huge red flags. I said for the entire first half of the year that if the Geno costume didn’t return with Erdrick (Hero) then I’m all in.

I’m all in.
This also lines up with the rumor that "Season 2" was decided around E3 and explains why Hero and Terry simply had costumes cut and not full on replacements (presumably Chocobo and Geno for Hero and Heihachi for Terry).
 

Icewolff92

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Like I said, I think it's a matter of "fairness" because Sakurai has already apologized for Rex and Spring Man and they came out in 2017. Despite that, I keep saying the names I've heard aren't absolutely definite, it's super unlikely that all of them will make it, and there's a decent chance of a "surprise" or two at some point. As for me, and you all can drag me for this later if I'm wrong, I'm currently not expecting anyone from Three Thrones, Sword and Shield, Astral Chain, etc.

Add in: there's been zero talks of Echoes.
That's fair and a good point. But I can¨t deny that if they are out of the question, the lack of spirits from 3H and AC, while there are DXM and LoZ:A spirits makes me scratch my head if you know what I mean
 
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ivanlerma

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That I know of:
Mike Jones (Star Tropics)
Porky (Earthbound/Mother)

And maybe

Linkle (Hyrule Warriors)

I’ve been going through the spirit list and any other game representation already included/not included in smash... still looking
Adeleine from Kirby
 

StarLight42

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Could someone summarize Fatman's full thoughts on postpass DLC for me? This thread kind of moves miles a minute so it's hard to keep up sometimes. From what I gather, the character names he has been hearing are "the equivelant of drunk online shopping" but do NOT consist of spirit promotions, AT promotions, or Mii Costume promotions and also won't be shill characters (Byleth, Akira) nor are any echoes being talked about. That's just from what i'm gathering, please let me know if i'm off the mark on any of this.
 

ivanlerma

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Wouldn't she be controversial considering that she isn't Bandanna Dee?
Why should she be Controversial she's a character that has fans who would happily accept her with open arms.
Why would fans be upset for her?
 
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Grumbo

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Sylux is another missing character. I cant see any of these characters actually becoming playable, theyre all such odd choices. Porky being the exception but idk how he’d be implemented or if theyd even want to give mother another rep
 

Rohanx17

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Every notable character I found that wouldn't make more sense as an echo would be

Poochy
Adeline
Sylux
Porky
Vaati
Mike Jones

Poochy and sylux don't really fit and startopics doesnt exist as far as noj is concerned I might be able to see the others though

Edit: noticed grovile/sceptile are missing too, very interesting, I think Pokemon might be a good place to start looking.
 
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owjies

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Does anyone here have a list of who dodged the spirit list? With new releases and echoes out of the running seems like the best place to start.
Sylux from Metroid is missing as well. That said, this past January, Nintendo decided to completely restart development of Metroid Prime 4 and re-partner with Retro Studios. Sylux may be in hiatus or could be used to reinvigorate excitement for Metroid Prime 4 if Nintendo can turn it around.

Edit: :ultgreninja:'d
 
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7NATOR

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Why should she be Controversial she's a character that has fans who would happily accept her with open arms.
Why would fans be upset for her?
Just because ican see a good amount of people that want Bandanna Dee hating on the fact we get a new Kirby Character and it's not him
 

Fatmanonice

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Could someone summarize Fatman's full thoughts on postpass DLC for me? This thread kind of moves miles a minute so it's hard to keep up sometimes. From what I gather, the character names he has been hearing are "the equivelant of drunk online shopping" but do NOT consist of spirit promotions, AT promotions, or Mii Costume promotions and also won't be shill characters (Byleth, Akira) nor are any echoes being talked about. That's just from what i'm gathering, please let me know if i'm off the mark on any of this.
-A vast majority of the hypothetical list is decent sized fan picks, on par or bigger than Geno and Crash.

-Don't expect a lot of NPC promotions. This includes spirits and ATs. I will say that ATs and Mii costumes already in the game are a lot less likely and, if the jump happens, it'd be literally one and I have a hard time seeing Sakurai do that for the sake of fairness.

-Most have not appeared in Smash in any form.

-Most are third party but not all.
 
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ivanlerma

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Just because ican see a good amount of people that want Bandanna Dee hating on the fact we get a new Kirby Character and it's not him
i could understand why but getting mad over a character not representated getting in over a highly suggested one is rather dumb.
 

Midget Master

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When saying it's narrowed down to two, my mind pretty much jumps right away to Lloyd vs. Heihachi. Or potentially Lloyd vs. Yuri, should Heihachi's addition to Pac-Man's taunts be one of those "disconfirm" things.
 

Plank08

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When it comes to a Bamco Rep, not enough people are talking about a dark souls Rep, the series has a humongous influence and could very well blindside all of us
 

MisterMike

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Like I said, I think it's a matter of "fairness" because Sakurai has already apologized for Rex and Spring Man and they came out in 2017. Despite that, I keep saying the names I've heard aren't absolutely definite, it's super unlikely that all of them will make it, and there's a decent chance of a "surprise" or two at some point. As for me, and you all can drag me for this later if I'm wrong, I'm currently not expecting anyone from Three Thrones, Sword and Shield, Astral Chain, etc.

Add in: there's been zero talks of Echoes.
So The Stretchers guys won't be DLC?! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!! :ultpacman:
This also lines up with the rumor that "Season 2" was decided around E3 and explains why Hero and Terry simply had costumes cut and not full on replacements (presumably Chocobo and Geno for Hero and Heihachi for Terry).
I haven't heard of this before, that's pretty interesting!
Big if true, but most likely means nothing since I also act a bit suspicious when people accume me of stuff even if it's obvious I didn't do it.
 

Rie Sonomura

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-A vast majority of the hypothetical list is decent sized fan picks, on par or bigger than Geno and Crash.

-Don't expect a lot of NPC promotions. This includes spirits and ATs. I will say that ATs and Mii costumes already in the game are a lot less likely and, if the jump happens, it'd be literally one and I have a hard time seeing Sakurai do that for the sake of fairness.

-Most have not appeared in Smash in any form.

-Most are third party but not all.
so in other words, we'd sooner see Spirit promotions that aren't also Mii Costumes or Assist Trophies, and even then not that much?
 

ForsakenM

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If the goal is to celebrate Gaming Culture and Lloyd is fighter #5, then it has failed in that regard. There’s more to gaming than just JRPGs.
I've never seen something more wrong.

You do realize that most games kinda don't care about characters and focus on gameplay, right? RPGs are very much story-focused, and you can't have a story without characters, and the characters have to be worth investing in. FPS games care more about gameplay, usually multiplayer, rather than characters. Battle Royale game care about gameplay, not characters. Sports games care about making money, not characters.

This is why it makes sense to have more JRPG/RPG characters being requested and put into Smash, because more people will be fans of those characters since they fell in love with them, which is what RPGs are supposed to do. How do you think all us Geno fans got here in the first place? The majority of us are fans from when we were kids, and most of the rest are people who liked him for smaller other reasons and then played the game and fell in love with him there as well.

Congrats on the 1700 pages guys. Shame Geno isn't FP5(if sabi's source is right), but I still think Geno is a garuntee at this popint. the question is when.

as for FP5, I am still leaning towards Shantae or Reimu(if that doujin leak is still legit, nothing has killed it yet). Sakurai said that reconition is not important to him, but fun gameplay, and this FP is a celebration of games. Why not end the pass with a Indie fighter? These 2 seem the most likely, as Shantae has a very long history with nintendo and is the longest currently ongoing indie in the west(and who cares if she is a spirit, her getting in helps geno's chances a bunch),and Reimu is the biggest Indie/Doujin character in japan and is mega popular in Japan and China.
No offense to Touhou and stuff, but for the same reasons that I don't believe we will get Heihachi is the same reason I don't think we will get any other fighting game characters in the FP. Terry got a lot of nerds upset at having three reps from other fighting games and I doubt picking another one is in the plans. Could happen I suppose, but I don't see it as likely. As for an indie rep, that seems like post-pass to me at best. You already got two huge indie reps in the game as an AT and Mii costume as well as a Spirit so I think that will still come later down the line once bigger requests have been filled. I could see an indie rep of some sort near the end of Season 2, like #9 or #10.

^^^^ this this this

So far Sakurai has been introducing fighters that bring new things to the table in the pass. Joker has Arsene and the Revolution (?) Meter, Hero has the Command Menu and a small chance for critical hits, Banjo and Kazooie have their side special which they can only use five times per stock and renders them (mostly) invincible, and Terry can use Power Geyser and Buster Wolf using certain inputs at 100% damage or more.

When it comes to Tales, even though Lloyd is super popular due to Symphonia originating on GC, and Yuri has ToV Definitive on Switch in his favor, Velvet would be the most unique from a gameplay perspective. Yes I know there’s her outfit, but it’s nowhere near comparable to Mai Shiranui’s situation and Velvet’s idle animations don’t focus on sexuality; her design is more “edgy” than sexy. Just cover the cleavage a bit and make her shorts longer and you’re good
Uhh...not to burst your bubble, but Mai didn't get in because she shows off cleavage and legs and some hips and booty with her design, and Mai has an earlier design for the first and third (I think?) Fatal Fury games that covers up her boobage. She's still got the hips and legs, but she doesn't even remotely have as much cleavage.



So to me, this means that it wasn't that they COULDN'T censor her, but it was more that they couldn't represent her fully and truly to her well-known design that is iconic, and they decided to not have her at all rather than not properly represent her.

So, if a character that is well known for being sexy and revealing HAS an art style that is canon that makes them less revealing and can't even be a Spirit or background character in a stage, I'm not sure what makes you think THIS would be acceptable as a fighter,

 

7NATOR

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Fatmanonice Fatmanonice is it possible some of the characters on the "LIST" are leakbait Characters perhaps, kind of like with the Minecraft content thing, and the 7 Square name list
 

Door Key Pig

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These are names that have honest to god been floating around as early as last September and they can be prime candidates for #5 and post pass. Also, there are first/second party names but not a lot. Most of the characters would be new to Smash too so, like I told the thread yesterday, if you're crossing your fingers for a ton of NPC promotions, you're going to be super disappointed.
So you're saying there's at least a few character names floating around that are already repped in Ultimate in some way? I can be down for that.
 

Fatmanonice

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Fatmanonice Fatmanonice is it possible some of the characters on the "LIST" are leakbait Characters perhaps, kind of like with the Minecraft content thing, and the 7 Square name list
Yes which is another reason I'm not saying that ones that haven't been revealed by other people. Some people suspect Ryu might be, for instance.
 

Midget Master

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It really doesn't sound good for Isaac, I flip between him and Geno being my #1 most wanted like every couple days. Alas for the poor boy... Though if they were to promote exactly one AT, I think he has a legit shot. That's probably the character I feel most conflicted over, lots of fan demand but he's kinda stuck in limbo, and could just lose out to Waluigi. We'll have to see how it goes.
 

OffBi

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Let's be real, assists that are being promoted are definitely waluigi and Isaac
 

ivanlerma

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I've never seen something more wrong.

You do realize that most games kinda don't care about characters and focus on gameplay, right? RPGs are very much story-focused, and you can't have a story without characters, and the characters have to be worth investing in. FPS games care more about gameplay, usually multiplayer, rather than characters. Battle Royale game care about gameplay, not characters. Sports games care about making money, not characters.

This is why it makes sense to have more JRPG/RPG characters being requested and put into Smash, because more people will be fans of those characters since they fell in love with them, which is what RPGs are supposed to do. How do you think all us Geno fans got here in the first place? The majority of us are fans from when we were kids, and most of the rest are people who liked him for smaller other reasons and then played the game and fell in love with him there as well.



No offense to Touhou and stuff, but for the same reasons that I don't believe we will get Heihachi is the same reason I don't think we will get any other fighting game characters in the FP. Terry got a lot of nerds upset at having three reps from other fighting games and I doubt picking another one is in the plans. Could happen I suppose, but I don't see it as likely. As for an indie rep, that seems like post-pass to me at best. You already got two huge indie reps in the game as an AT and Mii costume as well as a Spirit so I think that will still come later down the line once bigger requests have been filled. I could see an indie rep of some sort near the end of Season 2, like #9 or #10.



Uhh...not to burst your bubble, but Mai didn't get in because she shows off cleavage and legs and some hips and booty with her design, and Mai has an earlier design for the first and third (I think?) Fatal Fury games that covers up her boobage. She's still got the hips and legs, but she doesn't even remotely have as much cleavage.



So to me, this means that it wasn't that they COULDN'T censor her, but it was more that they couldn't represent her fully and truly to her well-known design that is iconic, and they decided to not have her at all rather than not properly represent her.

So, if a character that is well known for being sexy and revealing HAS an art style that is canon that makes them less revealing and can't even be a Spirit or background character in a stage, I'm not sure what makes you think THIS would be acceptable as a fighter,

Camilla and Mythra got Censored, But Shantae, Risky Boots, and Pyra got in uncensored.
 

xpnc

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Let's be real, assists that are being promoted are definitely waluigi and Isaac
Let's say there's 5 post-pass. 40% of them being AT promotions and 20% of them (Geno) bring spirit promotions definitely counts as "many" in my book. We'll get Geno and that's probably it.
 

Rohanx17

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So our hypothetical list is

Geno
Ryu
Crash
1-2 1st party spirits
1-2 1st party newcomers
2-3 other 3rd party newcomers

The spirit candidate could literally be anyone but in the context of fanservice I think dee and paper Mario are the only ones that come to mind. If doom makes it then i think shantae and rayman also become very likely but time will tell

For entirely new 1st parties we have even less of an idea. Looking at all spiritless fighters then we have poochy, sylux, Adeline, porky, vaati, grovile/sceptile, Mike Jones,Dixie Kong, ext. And I'll add to that as we continue to find new possible candidates.

3rd parties are largely unknown but we do know it isn't doomguy Steve and reimu, sora and I think fortnite. Not that they are impossible but they certainly aren't on the list. Also we know they are on par or bigger than geno and crash. It could be hyperbole and contain other choices like Lloyd, Dante, Phoenix, valve, ext.

Hopefully we have a leaker enter the game to take up verges mantle but for now it looks like we're going to have to work this out ourselves until the release happens. Major props to brew and the crash guy for coming out though so we have a little more to contextualize with.
 
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TheBeastHimself

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I understand that a lot of people find AT promotions to be extremely unlikely, but like, nothing is entirely impossible in Smash. I don't think adding Isaac would completely turn Smash Ultimate on its head and ruin the game. Yeah it's probably not the most likely thing to happen, but the same could be said for Ridley joining the game. It just depends on whether or not Sakurai and his team is fine with doing it. I mean, if Waluigi gets promoted and summons a Waluigi AT, is the game going to suddenly crash and CTRL + ALT + DEL itself?
 

StrawHatX

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Let's be real, Assist Trophy promotions are a long shot.
Definitely. But not impossible. I like to think that the most requested first party character in the Smash community for the past 15 years that’s not Ridley or K. Rool still has a chance to get in to the Smash game that’s been dedicated to fan favorites. The series has no playable characters. Come on Sakurai!
 

Ovaltine

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This. Not sure why everyone is getting so upset. Yall are softies good lord.
lol? Definitely not about being a softie. I used to frequent 4chan for years, starting back when it was first a thing. It's more about cultural divide and how poking and prodding at 4chan outside of 4chan just makes you look silly and hardly invites anything productive. I've seen enough on the 'net as an edgy old fogey to know.

Anyway, I'm done with that subject. Promotions...

I easily see spirits being promoted. Base game Mii costumes, I could see being promoted, as well. DLC Mii costumes and assist trophies, however... nah. I think their chances are long dead.
 
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Plank08

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I’m thinking spirit promotions will be like maybe Geno, Shantae and Rayman (Paper Mario in my dreams) hopefully there will be more
The only Assist Trophy promotion will be Isaac in my eyes
 

Midget Master

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From the sounds of things, AT promotions are not looking that likely, but as time goes on it certainly could change, especially should they expand their plans again. I do think for what it's worth that Isaac and Waluigi are the first and foremost candidates. I'd hesitate to expect it at the moment, but I would also hesitate to say that you'll never see an AT promotion before this game's DLC is completely finished.
 

JoscarGamma

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So our hypothetical list is

Geno
Ryu
Crash
1-2 1st party spirits
1-2 1st party newcomers
2-3 other 3rd party newcomers

The spirit candidate could literally be anyone but in the context of fanservice I think dee and paper Mario are the only ones that come to mind. If doom makes it then i think shantae and rayman also become very likely but time will tell

For entirely new 1st parties we have even less of an idea. Looking at all spiritless fighters then we have poochy, sylux, Adeline, porky, vaati, grovile/sceptile, Mike Jones, ext. And I'll add to that as we continue to find new possible candidates.

3rd parties are largely unknown but we do know it isn't doomguy Steve and reimu and I think fortnite. Not that they are impossible but they certainly aren't on the list. Also we know they are on par or bigger than geno and crash. The only thing that comes to mind is sora but it could be hyperbole and contain other choices like Lloyd, Dante, Phoenix, valve, ext.

Hopefully we have a leaker enter the game to take up verges mantle but for now it looks like we're going to have to work this out ourselves until the release happens. Major props to brew and the crash guy for coming out though so we have a little more to contextualize with.
Another one to add to the first party with a spirit already in the game is Dixie Kong... just a thought...
 
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