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Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

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SSGuy

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I love Smash Bros and I love Geno, but this place is getting way too toxic lately...
It isn't so much Geno supporter fault. Whether the information is true or not, everyone everywhere is on pins and needles about everything coming out.
 

ForsakenM

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I keep wanting to make this big posts trying to get people to realize how they are both right and wrong but I feel like I'll just take a breather and got eat dinner instead.

We will get an announcement soon enough. I'm sad because I will be likely late to seeing it.
 

GillyGrime

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I’m also eager to see Banjo release (please come with a Conker costume) and the 4th DLC fighter. But this thread has just been a hype killer lately tbh. Which is a shame as previously, this thread has been second to none my favourite on the website.

I get the uncertainty causing doubts and concerns but it’s just been **** throwing and self pity lately.
 

OrpheusTelos

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Year 2068, during Smash 23's hype cycle:

"Okay, now that we got Cloud, Hero, Sora, Lara Croft, Neku, Brave Fencer Musashi, Gex, and the Bouncer, Geno is clearly next in li-"

THE QUIET MAN SILENCES THE COMPETITION

...nevermind
 

JarBear

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I’m also eager to see Banjo release (please come with a Conker costume) and the 4th DLC fighter. But this thread has just been a hype killer lately tbh. Which is a shame as previously, this thread has been second to none my favourite on the website.

I get the uncertainty causing doubts and concerns but it’s just been **** throwing and self pity lately.
Unfortunately we are at this weird moment in between character releases. We've had the Hero release without the Geno Mii costume. Since then there has been so many "leaks" that go all over the place. With no further information from The Source to be given to us. Plus ... that Startling photo is still unknown ...
 

Rie Sonomura

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Year 2068, during Smash 23's hype cycle:

"Okay, now that we got Cloud, Hero, Sora, Lara Croft, Neku, Brave Fencer Musashi, Gex, and the Bouncer, Geno is clearly next in li-"

THE QUIET MAN SILENCES THE COMPETITION

...nevermind
After Quiet Man is added: ok, NOW Geno is next in-

Fayt Leingod: yo

...sobs in corner
 

Ovaltine

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I’m also eager to see Banjo release (please come with a Conker costume) and the 4th DLC fighter. But this thread has just been a hype killer lately tbh. Which is a shame as previously, this thread has been second to none my favourite on the website.

I get the uncertainty causing doubts and concerns but it’s just been **** throwing and self pity lately.
Oh yeah, I agree. It's been dreadful in here. It's honestly been a headache.

Also god, Conker Mii gunner is all I've ever needed in life. pls I need.
 

MisterMike

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Oh boy we are talking about Captain Marvel now. Conversations about that film always go so well.

i liked it
Haven't seen it myself, but I have seen reviews/analysis videos about it, and the general consensus is that it was objectively poorly made, but overall bland and forgettable... except for the scene where Captain Marvel crushes The Don's hand and extorts him for his bike.
 

GillyGrime

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Oh yeah, I agree. It's been dreadful in here. It's honestly been a headache.

Also god, Conker Mii gunner is all I've ever needed in life. pls I need.
That or Conker swordfighting with his chainsaw. Both iconic and both would kickass. I would be more hype for Conker as a Mii costume than most playable fighters thinking about it lmao

Edit: frying pan is also a legitimate choice damn
 
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GillyGrime

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Oh gosh, that'd honestly work, too...

I'll just take a Conker costume in general. I don't care which denomination of Mii it'd be for! :yoshi:
I recently found a custom stage online of the Great Mighty Poo fight, complete with toilet paper platform, animated singing Poo and a terrified living sweetcorn.

Needless to say, my game has never felt so Ultimate...
 

ZelDan

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The result of information droughts unfortunately. It's difficult for everyone
Seriously if we don't get something soon I can only imagine how things will be in the future:

Sakurai: "Hello Smash fans! I finally have some new stuff to annou-"

 

EricTheGamerman

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You do know that Carol Danvers Captain Marvel is widely hated by fans, right? Comics like Civil War 2 are a prime example of why. That, and MCU fans wanted Black Widow to get a movie for years, and were understandably pissed off she didn't get one for years. That, and she wasn't even the first or second female character to take up the mantle of Captain Marvel. The first and best one of the three hands down was Monica Rambeau
I didn't comment upon Captain Marvel's quality or anything else. Just the fact it was the first MCU movie with a female starring in it as the primary character entirely and not billed alongside other male co-stars who played the leader role. I'm very aware that fans wanted a Black Widow movie for years as well, I was one of those fans haha. That all said, I wasn't making a statement on the quality of the Captain Marvel they chose (I don't know the specifics of fans with Captain Marvel in the comics, I enjoyed her movie well enough), just that despite having multiple potential characters in a starring role, the MCU only just recently got to female star.
 

Firox

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So I was totally fine dropping this subject for Eric, but you just HAD to rip this open again, so I'll set the record straight one more time. *cracks neck*

Ok, so first of all, I'm getting the vibe that you misinterpreted my posts to mean that I was advocating for intolerance or anti-representation. For the record, the question was whether media "needed" to have diversity as opposed to being successful with or without it. Now then, let's dig in.

Promoting, encouraging and appreciating diversity is an acknowledgement that specific circumstances or identity aspects of a person does not inherently make them any better or worse than anyone else, and that we all have unique, interesting viewpoints to offer.

Being apathetic/hostile towards the expression/appreciation of diversity is to say "certain perspectives/identities are inherently more important, more meaningful, more valid, and any that fall outside the predominant demographic are worthless."
This assumption is both false and ludicrously black and white. A person can be totally indifferent to another person's identity but that doesn't mean they deem it as worthless. To claim so is being painfully presumptuous towards those that aren't actively "promoting" diversity since you say a person either is or isn't.

A workforce on the verge of collapse, a supremely FAILED education system that creates model students who go on to have crippling mental health issues (impacting their ability to be productive members of society, hence their troubled workforce), all of which have very little to do with perceived cultural homogeny. Also, arguing that diversity isn't so great because it brings more hate crime is like saying a cure for cancer is bad because it leads to more non-cancer deaths.
"A workforce on the verge of collapse"? "Supremely FAILED education system"? Where are you pulling this garbage from? Japan was ranked second in the world for education in 2015 (http://fairreporters.net/world/the-best-education-systems-in-the-world-in-2015/ ) and don't even try to compare their disfunctionalities with the US. We've got them beat every time. You wanna talk mental health issues? Look at the rabid violence in our schools! Look at the drug abuse. The absolutely pitiful funding we put towards education. I could go on but this entire point was a huge tangent from where I was trying to go in the first place. My point was that a homogeneous society doesn't have to worry about overcoming differences because everyone is the same. Granted, there are pros and cons to this since diversity DOES offer an edge when it comes to technological development etc. but I was merely trying to state that uniformity isn't without SOME advantages.

Artistic angle: People make art for self-expression, but they often also wish to impart some kind of emotion or message unto an audience, which requires their work to be effectively realized. If your audience is diverse, it makes more sense to factor that into your work, and have your work more accurately reflect the world your audience is familiar with. A racially/culturally homogenous setting or cast is NOT what most audiences will be familiar with, so it will likely be less inherently engaging for them, and less effective at connecting with them.

Commercial angle: In a global market, with a global audience, why limit the appeal of your product? Why not make a product more reflective of the experiences more people have had?
You're just flat out wrong here. To say that "a racially/culturally homogenous setting or cast is NOT what most audiences will be familiar with" is incredibly tone deaf to the rest of the world. Roughly 20% of the entire world is Chinese. You wanna talk about a racially/culturally homogeneous setting? And take a wild guess which market is the second largest for movies. You wanna know the third? India. Another homogeneous country. It's no wonder everyone stereo-types Americans as considering themselves the nexus of the world. It's really sad, but there's a lot of places in the world that couldn't care less about diversity. Have you ever seen it in Bolly Wood movies? How about a SINGLE non-Japanese actor in a Japanese movie? In fact, if you want to argue from a commercial perspective, limiting your cast to mostly whites and asians has historically proved more lucrative. Heck, did you know that in China, when the Force Awakens was released, the movie poster shrank Finn's picture almost out of existence while blowing up Harrison Ford's? I'm in no way advocating for these kinds of practices or ideologies, and I understand exactly what you mean about trying to connect with your audience, but realize that projecting your world view onto people doesn't make you right.

This assumes that a push for diversity in storytelling and media is some unrealistic, politically-driven agenda. In reality, it's the correct observation that most mainstream media has been DEFINED by an unrealistic, politically-driven agenda, one that aimed to prioritize the experiences of conventionally-attractive, straight, white men over EVERYONE ELSE to an ABSURD degree for over a century.
Ok, since you're at least the second one to bring this up, I'm going to put this to bed once and for all. You wanna know why most American media up until now has been "white-centric"? Let me give you a little history lesson. Recall that back in the 1700's, the United States was founded by Judeo-Christian, WHITE Europeans. As horrifying as it may sound, this demographic has comprised the numerical majority of the US's population ever since (roughly 60% as of 2017 but projected to actually become a minority by 2050). When you made the earlier point that an artist should connect with their audience, there happens to be a statistical reason for why it often leans white. Let's look at the comic book industry since people have been pining for more diverse heroes: The first super hero to ever reach critical acclaim was our good old fashion Superman in 1938. His creators were Joe Shuster and Jerry Siegel. Both white. Jack Kirby and Stan Lee spearheaded over 90% of the known Marvel Universe. Both white. These were inspired people with amazing stories to tell. They didn't make the vast majority of super heroes white because they were part of some evil white patriarchy out to subvert the rest of the world. They simply made characters that they and their target audience could relate to. If Marvel had started in Kenya, don't you think that most the heroes would have been black? Or if Japan had come up with it, Japanese? (Note: Manga characters are almost exclusively Japanese...shocker) People need to stop ******** about why existing heroes aren't diverse enough and start coming up some heroes of their own. Make a hero that connects with YOU'RE identity or expand on those that already do. You want a book with more diversity? Write one! You want to show the beauty of your culture? Paint it! Tell a story through you own eyes and promote diversity in a tangible way!

There aren't some finite list of creators who are being held at gunpoint and told "make more black women characters!".
You've clearly never worked for Disney... lol

INTOLERANCE TOWARDS INTOLERANCE IS NOT A THING. I had a young black foster kid living at my house who thought black people were ugly "because they're barely on TV". I won't abide people arguing against fair representation with completely disingenuous, misleading lines of crap like this.
You're right. "Intolerance towards intolerance" ISN'T a thing...which is why it's a damn good thing that's not what I said. I was referring to FORCED TOLERANCE towards intolerance. I'm all for diversity, but it's something that needs to be WILLFULLY accepted and based equally off merit. Don't think for one second that there aren't people that would sooner bash your face in with a baseball bat than hear you say that Black Panther was overrated. There's people out there that would incite a virtual lynch mob on social media to get you fired from your job because you said something even remotely racist. I live in Southern California and see this happen far more than it should. Heck, I came from a Junior High where the term "white" was considered a vulgar insult. Again, I'm all for diversity, and I'm all for FAIR representation (I never said otherwise) but when it devolves into violence, favoritism, and "hang the straight white patriarchy", now we're talking bigots against bigots. You can't make progress without dialogue from BOTH sides. It can't just be an echo chamber. When you call my posts "completely disingenuous, misleading lines of crap", that's both uncalled for and shows a complete lack of empathy. Again, the entire point of my posts was to argue in favor of creative freedom on the part of creators. Diversity is always admirable to include, but an artist should never be forced to create solely for others. True art can only come from the artist, not someone else's checklist of wish fulfillment. You don't have to like it, but consider the fact that someone else will. Period. I pray that your young foster child realizes that beauty comes in all colors. It sincerely hurts me to hear that they said that.

Yeah, barely Smash related, but if stuff like this is posted, it can't be allowed to fester. No offense to Firox, as I'm sure you meant no ill will, but there are certain things that need to be challenged. I've promoted negative mindsets/arguments in the past inadvertently and I wish someone would have called them out.
"No offense"? An interesting disclaimer to an otherwise hostile post. For the record, I meant no ill will. I never did, but some things SHOULD be challenged, and that is why I had to reply. Again, I agree that diversity is important, but I feel that freedom is even more so. Anyway, I've said my peace and will honor EricTheGamerman's request to drop the subject since we're wildly off topic. If anyone else wishes to continue arguing, I probably won't dignify their post with a response. I'd rather move on to something more Geno-related anyway.
 
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Glitch-EGamer

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Do I want to know what's going on? Firox Firox , he may have ripped it open but you could've let it close by itself by not responding. I didn't even bother to read all of it because it looks pointless based off the sheer text size alone. Please put that away in a dm or something if you want to keep arguing over who knows what at this point. No offense to you but we need to just let it go or settle it somewhere else.

Changing subjects back to Geno, I really want Exor to be in Smash in some shape or form if Geno gets in. Preferably a stage but the forest would be nice too. I really think that having Star Road as the stage with Exor smashing through it and changing it to Bowser's castle would be awesome and I think Ovaltine Ovaltine agreed at one point. That feels like a pipedream though. More so than some of these characters we've gotten.
How would you guys want Exor represented, if at all?
 

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EricTheGamerman

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"A workforce on the verge of collapse"? "Supremely FAILED education system"? Where are you pulling this garbage from? Japan was ranked second in the world for education in 2015 (http://fairreporters.net/world/the-best-education-systems-in-the-world-in-2015/ ) and don't even try to compare their disfunctionalities with the US. We've got them beat every time. You wanna talk mental health issues? Look at the rabid violence in our schools! Look at the drug abuse. The absolutely pitiful funding we put towards education. I could go on but this entire point was a huge tangent from where I was trying to go in the first place. My point was that a homogeneous society doesn't have to worry about overcoming differences because everyone is the same. Granted, there are pros and cons to this since diversity DOES offer an edge when it comes to technological development etc. but I was merely trying to state that uniformity isn't without SOME advantages.
This is the only thing I really want to address (and it's only because I can't bring myself to not on this specific part, I'm really trying not to continue this any further), but I don't see why the hell you keep bringing up specific statistics and ideas with regards that the this unrelated point of homogeneity directly is somehow supposed to be influencing them. Like you can't just pull crime, shootings, drug abuse, education, and workforce statistics out to suddenly make some sort of valid point about a homogeneous culture having positives. You'd be laughed out of the academic community for such a broad and unfounded claim. Like, no. All those statistics have deep causes and different histories that require extreme amount of analysis to really deconstruct and understand, many of which have very little to do with the racial diverse components of the US (many of which are not replicated in similarly diverse Western countries). For example, like what does the amount of funding we put towards education have to do with diversity? Those are unrelated issues, and it's frankly disturbing you keep pushing this specific idea that you can simply distill the various aspects of Japan's current situation and the US down to no diversity and diversity as defining reasoning...

Like, seriously, that's a scarily inaccurate portrayal of all these important, complex, and difficult issues and a pretty disturbing mindset to be honest. Maybe you're not saying what I think you seem to be implying, but uh... Yeah.
 
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ForsakenM

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Do I want to know what's going on? Firox Firox , he may have ripped it open but you could've let it close by itself by not responding. I didn't even bother to read all of it because it looks pointless based off the sheer text size alone. Please put that away in a dm or something if you want to keep arguing over who knows what at this point. No offense to you but we need to just let it go or settle it somewhere else.

Changing subjects back to Geno, I really want Exor to be in Smash in some shape or form if Geno gets in. Preferably a stage but the forest would be nice too. I really think that having Star Road as the stage with Exor smashing through it and changing it to Bowser's castle would be awesome and I think Ovaltine Ovaltine agreed at one point. That feels like a pipedream though. More so than some of these characters we've gotten.
How would you guys want Exor represented, if at all?
I think you need to address everyone, not just Firox Firox Targeting specifically just him in your post when others are part of the conversation is unfair and suggests bias.

I'm not saying you have any or mean anything of the sort, but when a teacher notices an issue between three students and only calls out one...yeah.
 

Glitch-EGamer

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I think you need to address everyone, not just Firox Firox Targeting specifically just him in your post when others are part of the conversation is unfair and suggests bias.

I'm not saying you have any or mean anything of the sort, but when a teacher notices an issue between three students and only calls out one...yeah.
You're right. My apologies. It did sound like I was picking out one person. Sorry Firox Firox

So, EVERYONE, drop it, please. It is uncalled for and if you want to continue to argue, please, take it to your dms. It'll be greatly appreciated by everyone, I assure you.
 
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Firox

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I think you need to address everyone, not just Firox Firox Targeting specifically just him in your post when others are part of the conversation is unfair and suggests bias.

I'm not saying you have any or mean anything of the sort, but when a teacher notices an issue between three students and only calls out one...yeah.
Thank you, ForsakenM. I realize my folly, but it did feel kind of weird getting singled out.
 
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TheHeartbreakKid

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You do know that Carol Danvers Captain Marvel is widely hated by fans, right? Comics like Civil War 2 are a prime example of why. That, and MCU fans wanted Black Widow to get a movie for years, and were understandably pissed off she didn't get one for years. That, and she wasn't even the first or second female character to take up the mantle of Captain Marvel. The first and best one of the three hands down was Monica Rambeau
I'm a huge Monica Rambeau fan, but she's much better as Spectrum than she ever was as Captain Marvel. Danvers, second DEBATABLY only to Mar-Vell, is THE Captain Marvel, case-closed. Even if you disagree with her being the best in the role. I prefer Jon Stewart or Kyle Rayner, but I can't argue that Hal Jordan is THE Green Lantern. I DESPISE Barry Allen but, for better or worse, he is THE Flash.

And 616 Tony Stark was (rightfully) hated MUCH, MUCH more by comic fans before the first Iron Man film than people (rightfully) hated 616 Carol before her first film.

It is. It is naive to think that you're on the good side or that you have the moral highground. There's not a good side and a bad side bro. Who the **** are you to say what's morally wrong or right ? Especially since morality is just a concept to make people do what you want them to do.
"There's not a good side and a bad side" is a fine argument for circlejerking in philosophy class, but in the real world, there are clearly immoral acts, which can be judged based on whether or not they provide utility to anyone. A push against diversity in a culture or society has no evolutionary basis, it benefits humans in no obvious, biological way. Diversity OBJECTIVELY benefits civilization on virtually all fronts, and cultural homogeny only provides benefits as a result of artificial circumstances set in place to reward it. (the supposed "benefits" or "contradictory examples" provided by Firox all fall into the latter category)
 
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link2702

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Guys please stop arguing. We have (usually) been the most chill board around for a reason, we’ve usually gotten along mostly well.
 

OrpheusTelos

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While I think diversity in media is an important topic that needs to be discussed, I don't think the Geno thread is the best place to have this conversation. There's a time and a place for political discourse, but a thread about a Mario character really isn't it, especially when it has nothing to do with the subject
 

xpnc

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You wanna know the third? India. Another homogeneous country.
I really hate this conversation but with a total of 20+ officially recognised languages, half a dozen major religions ranging from 4 million adherents on the low end, and countless ethnic groups, India is one of the least homogeneous countries on the planet

To make this Geno related: what exactly is happening when you get a freebie in SMRPG? Does an extra item just appear from the aether or what?
 
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TheHeartbreakKid

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Well, moving on to more Smash talk:

Pauline being in Smash, to me, would be about as insulting as Piranha Plant was. I have nothing against the character, but she's a literal nothing compared to someone like Waluigi, Birdo or King Boo, who would all be much better Mario inclusions (ignoring the fact that the Mario franchise already has more than enough reps)

I have nothing against Tracer (or any Overwatch heroes) as a character, or Overwatch as a game, but it is a FACT that the game is dying, and that her inclusion in Smash would be an extreme anomaly less than 5 years after her introduction.

I have nothing against Jill Valentine or Leon Kennedy, but I just feel like their movesets would be extremely boring compared to other possible options. Not to say that they wouldn't WORK, just that "human with guns that punches/kicks" is just significantly less interesting moveset-wise than "living wooden puppet mage with gun arm", "limbless dude who uses his hair as a propellor" or even "battle android with a mech, crazy combat maneuvers and different weapons"

That said, I'm open to being proven wrong, as I was about Bandana Dee
 
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xpnc

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Well, moving on to more Smash talk:

Pauline being in Smash, to me, would be about as insulting as Piranha Plant was. I have nothing against the character, but she's a literal nothing compared to someone like Waluigi, Birdo or King Boo, who would all be much better Mario inclusions (ignoring the fact that the Mario franchise already has more than enough reps)

I have nothing against Tracer (or any Overwatch heroes) as a character, or Overwatch as a game, but it is a FACT that the game is dying, and that her inclusion in Smash would be an extreme anomaly less than 5 years after her introduction.

I have nothing against Jill Valentine or Leon Kennedy, but I just feel like their movesets would be extremely boring compared to other possible options. Not to say that they wouldn't WORK, just that "human with guns that punches/kicks" is just significantly less interesting moveset-wise than "living wooden puppet mage with gun arm", "limbless dude who uses his hair as a propellor" or even "battle android with a mech, crazy combat maneuvers and different weapons"
I'm pretty much done with humanform characters as well. Smash works best when most of its cast looks like cereal mascots and anyone who has a problem with that can fight me
 

EricTheGamerman

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I'm pretty much done with humanform characters as well. Smash works best when most of its cast looks like cereal mascots and anyone who has a problem with that can fight me
I mean, why can't both exist? All the human characters work well and so do the cereal mascots. A little from column A, a little from column B.
 

xpnc

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I mean, why can't both exist? All the human characters work well and so do the cereal mascots. A little from column A, a little from column B.
No, it should be a lot from column A and a little from column B. And I would strongly disagree with the notion that all the human characters work well (I'm not counting super-deformed humans like Mario and Ness)
 

Zav22

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At first I was kinda iffy about Pauline being in smash but now I'm OK with it, just as long as shes not an exact clone of Peach and Daisy which judge by how she is in terms of design and character (especially in Odyssey) I don't think she could be. Plus if she were to get in smash now that she sings I could totally see her using her microphone as part of her moveset, kind of like how I saw this one persona girl fight with a microphone.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...BMAB6BAgAEAI&usg=AOvVaw1qf34XayXLyvUJ0Ju1HAO8
 

xpnc

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At first I was kinda iffy about Pauline being in smash but now I'm OK with it, just as long as shes not an exact clone of Peach and Daisy which judge by how she is in terms of design and character (especially in Odyssey) I don't think she could be. Plus if she were to get in smash now that she sings I could totally see her using her microphone as part of her moveset, kind of like how I saw this one persona girl fight with a microphone.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqYeDbbf02c&ved=2ahUKEwjvidXawaTkAhUJS60KHWrwCxAQo7QBMAB6BAgAEAI&usg=AOvVaw1qf34XayXLyvUJ0Ju1HAO8
Well she certainly isn't going to appear in the Fighter's Pass, that's for sure. What stage and music would she have that isn't already in the game?
 

Zav22

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Well she certainly isn't going to appear in the Fighter's Pass, that's for sure. What stage and music would she have that isn't already in the game?
Well Im obviously not expecting her in THIS smash bros game since she not only has Jump up superstar as a song but she also appears in the background on the new donk city stage. Plus you can't deny that that is a completely unique way to fight since we don't have a single fighter that solely uses music and rhythm as a way to fight, and no Jiggly puff does not count because she only has ONE singing move that mainly put you to sleep. The only characters I can think of that would use music and rhythm as their movesets would be a rhythm heaven character or hatsune miku.
 
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Glitch-EGamer

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JammerProHD believes Geno is probably a lock for the Fighter's Pass because of his level of fan demand.

He also believes Tracer is possibly one of the last two fighters, though he's uncertain.
 
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