Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[UberMadman]

Thing is, Sakurai didn't say moving on to the next game instead of making DLC is common practice in the gaming industry - one look at any western AAA game will show that. He said it's how he prefers to do things.

Also, in that hypothetical pass, I don't think Geno would come last. Generally the last reveal is the least hype, and a character of Geno's demand isn't that, I'd think. It might be a spot better reserved for the Gen 8 Pokemon unless it's a huge breakout Rex-wise.

Here, check this post again:

https://smashboards.com/threads/newcomer-dlc-speculation-discussion.453424/page-195#post-23349070

The only opinion Sakurai gives on DLC practice is that he doesn’t personally like season passes. The rest of that is mostly focused on his impression as to what the industry standard is.

As for the last character being the more tepid reveal? That’s definitely been true for the main game, but I’m not sure that adds up for Smash DLC. Reminder that Bayonetta, the last inclusion for Smash 4, was justified as Smash 4’s equivalent of the ballot winner. You could argue Cloud and Ryu were hyper choices, but they were relatively late DLC reveals themselves. The first 3 were cut veterans. Similarly, I’m not sure the last character is intended to be the most tepid for the Fighter Pass either. It makes sense to reveal hype characters upfront when the game isn’t out yet to avoid leaks and mainly for marketing reasons, but DLC is a different matter entirely: it’s harder to leak, and marketing is less important.

 

[GoodGrief741]

The only opinion Sakurai gives on DLC practice is that he doesn’t personally like season passes. The rest of that is mostly focused on his impression as to what the industry standard is.

My reading of it is that it's his opinion of what is efficient. It's definitely not the industry standard though, anyone can see that.

Reminder that Bayonetta, the last inclusion for Smash 4, was justified as Smash 4’s equivalent of the ballot winner.

Bayonetta did cause somewhat of a controversy, and was released alongside Corrin, who didn't cause a controversy by sole virtue of being hated by nearly everyone. Cloud and Ryu were definitely bigger reveals. Mewtwo as well.

it’s harder to leak, and marketing is less important.

If DLC is harder to leak then it sure as hell doesn't seem so. Roy and Ryu were leaked, data for Cloud and Bayo was in the game way before their reveals, and Hero and Banjo were leaked by regular run of the mill insiders.

 

[UberMadman]

If DLC is harder to leak then it sure as hell doesn't seem so. Roy and Ryu were leaked, data for Cloud and Bayo was in the game way before their reveals, and Hero and Banjo were leaked by regular run of the mill insiders.

To respond to this point specifically, I should clarify that DLC is harder to leak outside of accidental leftover code. DLC can be leaked pretty easily if programmers mess up and leave files behind (see: DBFZ season 1 and MK11), but is a lot harder to leak via standard means. There’s less people on staff at that point, so there’s less “exit points” for this kind of information. The only leaks for Smash DLC we’ve gotten that were both legitimate and not through datamining were either right before the reveals or were the Dragon Quest characters, who seem to have been in talks as early as for the base roster, even if they never went through.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I'm still not really on board with the idea of us getting a second Fighter's Pass. All of Sakurai's comments on DLC have tended to be more on the disapproving side and how it's not really the most efficient and profitable use of one's time, especially the further out you get from base game. A new Fighter's Pass would presumably have the same length of time to develop another five characters, and we'd be ending in mid 2021, which seems astoundingly far in the future and absolutely more of an issue with regards to the whole "Further out from base game" issue Sakurai brought up in his book. While I don't think he'd start a new Smash game after the end of Ultimate, I do think he'd just start a new project altogether. A second Fighter's Pass is a massive commitment and focusing on first party characters that late in the game seems like the opposite of what you would have wanted to do (at least, if each DLC has diminishing returns the further out you get from base game, then third party DLC would be a way to create buzz and counterattack said diminishing, the Smash X moniker has a hell of a lot of weight these days). I also think Nintendo will be more than happy to sell the lineup of DLC as established alongside base Ultimate for years to come. Why continue to invest in an expensive and lengthy development process for characters when you can just rest upon the natural sales of the game as the Switch continues to sell? You don't have to do a thing but include it in further advertisements, which costs you next to nothing in comparison.

That doesn't mean I think we won't get any additional DLC though. I still think it's likely we might see an Echo pop-up before the DLC cycle comes to a close and I also think it's possible that Sakurai may decide to develop an additional character. Ultimate, more than ever before, feels like his magnum opus of Smash and Sakurai's not getting any younger. It's going to be legitimately difficult for him to even follow-up on Smash in a way that doesn't piss off a ton of the fan base (see the Dexit issue and what likely awaits the Smash community when the cuts come in full force for a new game). With that in mind, a bonus character or two available for purchase beyond the Fighter's Pass could make a lot of sense. I'm not sure it's going to happen still, but I think that's our best shot at additional DLC as of right now.

 

[Ovaltine]

I'm still not really on board with the idea of us getting a second Fighter's Pass. All of Sakurai's comments on DLC have tended to be more on the disapproving side and how it's not really the most efficient and profitable use of one's time, especially the further out you get from base game. A new Fighter's Pass would presumably have the same length of time to develop another five characters, and we'd be ending in mid 2021, which seems astoundingly far in the future and absolutely more of an issue with regards to the whole "Further out from base game" issue Sakurai brought up in his book. While I don't think he'd start a new Smash game after the end of Ultimate, I do think he'd just start a new project altogether. A second Fighter's Pass is a massive commitment and focusing on first party characters that late in the game seems like the opposite of what you would have wanted to do (at least, if each DLC has diminishing returns the further out you get from base game, then third party DLC would be a way to create buzz and counterattack said diminishing, the Smash X moniker has a hell of a lot of weight these days). I also think Nintendo will be more than happy to sell the lineup of DLC as established alongside base Ultimate for years to come. Why continue to invest in an expensive and lengthy development process for characters when you can just rest upon the natural sales of the game as the Switch continues to sell? You don't have to do a thing but include it in further advertisements, which costs you next to nothing in comparison.

That doesn't mean I think we won't get any additional DLC though. I still think it's likely we might see an Echo pop-up before the DLC cycle comes to a close and I also think it's possible that Sakurai may decide to develop an additional character. Ultimate, more than ever before, feels like his magnum opus of Smash and Sakurai's not getting any younger. It's going to be legitimately difficult for him to even follow-up on Smash in a way that doesn't piss off a ton of the fan base (see the Dexit issue and what likely awaits the Smash community when the cuts come in full force for a new game). With that in mind, a bonus character or two available for purchase beyond the Fighter's Pass could make a lot of sense. I'm not sure it's going to happen still, but I think that's our best shot at additional DLC as of right now.

I agree.

Also, I think Dexit is the best descriptor I've ever seen for the National Dex controversy. Bless you.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I agree.

Also, I think Dexit is the best descriptor I've ever seen for the National Dex controversy. Bless you.

Oh, I'm certainly not the one first person to make that joke, but I'm glad I could bring it into your vernacular! That said, Pokemon Sword and Shield just kind of makes me sad at this point. Dexit aside, they just don't seem to be the that sort of big step forward that other AAA Switch games have generally been committed to and they graphically look like they're doing the bare minimum for a HD era. I know Game Freak largely doesn't want to make Pokemon any more and they're likely on an extremely tight schedule... but I always thought the day Pokemon came to HD home consoles would be a better one than the current ****-show we've got going on. I really, really hope these games turn out well even with the pretty much permanent decision of cutting Pokemon... But the last time Game Freak really gave me any confidence and impressed me was 2012, so...

But, yeah, I think the next Smash will undoubtedly have to face the same issues as Pokemon is facing. Unless it just straight builds off of Ultimate, I think we're going to be talking 20-30 characters gone and a number of the third parties people love due to effort required in getting them (and the Nintendo purists will take an annoying victory lap I suspect...), it's just going to be a bloodbath.

 

[kiteinthesky]

I'm still not really on board with the idea of us getting a second Fighter's Pass. All of Sakurai's comments on DLC have tended to be more on the disapproving side and how it's not really the most efficient and profitable use of one's time, especially the further out you get from base game. A new Fighter's Pass would presumably have the same length of time to develop another five characters, and we'd be ending in mid 2021, which seems astoundingly far in the future and absolutely more of an issue with regards to the whole "Further out from base game" issue Sakurai brought up in his book. While I don't think he'd start a new Smash game after the end of Ultimate, I do think he'd just start a new project altogether. A second Fighter's Pass is a massive commitment and focusing on first party characters that late in the game seems like the opposite of what you would have wanted to do (at least, if each DLC has diminishing returns the further out you get from base game, then third party DLC would be a way to create buzz and counterattack said diminishing, the Smash X moniker has a hell of a lot of weight these days). I also think Nintendo will be more than happy to sell the lineup of DLC as established alongside base Ultimate for years to come. Why continue to invest in an expensive and lengthy development process for characters when you can just rest upon the natural sales of the game as the Switch continues to sell? You don't have to do a thing but include it in further advertisements, which costs you next to nothing in comparison.

That doesn't mean I think we won't get any additional DLC though. I still think it's likely we might see an Echo pop-up before the DLC cycle comes to a close and I also think it's possible that Sakurai may decide to develop an additional character. Ultimate, more than ever before, feels like his magnum opus of Smash and Sakurai's not getting any younger. It's going to be legitimately difficult for him to even follow-up on Smash in a way that doesn't piss off a ton of the fan base (see the Dexit issue and what likely awaits the Smash community when the cuts come in full force for a new game). With that in mind, a bonus character or two available for purchase beyond the Fighter's Pass could make a lot of sense. I'm not sure it's going to happen still, but I think that's our best shot at additional DLC as of right now.

I don't understand why they just wouldn't make individual DLC characters instead of driving themselves into the ground making five at a time. It's absurd to me. There's no need for a stupid Fighter's Pass and there never should have been. Just release individual packs.

 

[EarlTamm]

I don't understand why they just wouldn't make individual DLC characters instead of driving themselves into the ground making five at a time. It's absurd to me. There's no need for a stupid Fighter's Pass and there never should have been. Just release individual packs.

The thing is, you plan these things ahead of time. Of you know you are going to make 5(Or any number 3 and above, really), then bundling them is rather easy and simple.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I don't understand why they just wouldn't make individual DLC characters instead of driving themselves into the ground making five at a time. It's absurd to me. There's no need for a stupid Fighter's Pass and there never should have been. Just release individual packs.

Well, the Fighter's Pass exists for a couple of different reasons. The first of which is that it's actually a direct communication of intent for DLC with Smash and what the future will hold and creates a plan of action that will be followed. Smash 4's DLC was sporadic and nerve racking at the best of times, and downright unknown at the worst. We'd get tons of content, then nothing, then something small, then back to nothing, etc. It wasn't the most well planned out content and led to frustrations in the community. The Fighter's Pass communicates the plan for DLC: There will be 5 brand new fighters, with 5 brand new stages, and music to accompany them. They will all be released by February 2020. That's an incredibly insightful look into the DLC future that we never had before and helps us know what to expect as fans. It's good communication from Sakurai and Nintendo. Plus, it creates an overall time table for developers to follow. It's a pretty standard practice in business to plan out what you're going to make, and the Fighter's Pass is just that reality.

It also exists because they decided their "season" of content beforehand, and it's extremely easy to bundle all that material together as EarlTamm said. They know they've committed to this much content within the season, there's no real reason not to provide the public with the information and the option to purchase it altogether. Especially if you offer this bundle at a discount since there will invariably be people interested in buying all the DLC anyway.

And, yes, it's also driven by a profit motive. Season Passes are common in gaming these days, so people will often just buy them as soon as they see them. To those people who are either uninformed or unwilling to educate themselves on the issues, there's money to be gained from them. People will also buy the Season Pass without knowing the characters beforehand for a myriad of reasons whereas they might not buy individual DLC packs depending on the circumstances. Once you buy the season pass, you lose the ability to complain about the DLC offerings because you've already agreed to them, and Nintendo also knows that. And finally, there are people who will buy the Season Pass purely out of hype for the right character being announced (so many Banjo Kazooie fans said this and confused the hell out of me). I don't really get the last logic, but it happens and Nintendo stands to benefit from them as well.

But honestly, there's no reason for it to not exist. All the DLC is still available individually for purchase. The only exclusive thing to the pass is the Rex Mii costume (I think, it might be available separately now for all I know), so you don't miss anything substantial by not opting in to the pass. The pass also clearly communicates the types of content with Sakurai expressly telling fans to only invest if they were convinced of the idea beforehand. It gets thrown around as anti-consumer sometimes, but it's anything but. It gives an additional option for the DLC and is one of the least scummy things I can think of regarding DLC. People are just a tad impatient with the character reveals. And again, it's not even a limited offer or anything of the sort. It's just an option, and options aren't a bad thing.

 

[Fatmanonice]

I also don't think there will be a second fighter pass. I can see maybe one or two extra fighters for next year's E3 or just because but I don't think they'll do the whole character/stage/music package after #5. There's also a side of me that wonders if they'll announce 4 and 5 at the same time or if they'll announce them separately. If they announce them separately, I wouldn't put it past them to announce an extra character to go along with #5, maybe even doing something like offering early access or a discount if you bought the Fighter's Pass or something, I dunno... If separately, they'll probably announce #4 in October but if together they announce them in late November or early December.

 

[UberMadman]

I bought the first season pass frame 1. I love video games, so I like a wide variety of characters, and I like Smash, and having the feeling of having all the characters. On top of this, I have other people who occasionally play with me, and I like having all the options available to them, too. For someone like me who knows that he’s going to be satisfied with the content pretty much no matter what, the option to buy everything at once at a discount is super convenient for me. Am I regretting this so far? HELL no; these have been some amazing DLC picks. And if there’s a second fighter pass, (which I still insist there likely will be, even though I like a lot of your points), I’m going to buy the hell out of that one too. And I probably won’t regret that, either.

 

[GoodGrief741]

The only leaks for Smash DLC we’ve gotten that were both legitimate and not through datamining were either right before the reveals or were the Dragon Quest characters, who seem to have been in talks as early as for the base roster, even if they never went through.

If Opossum is to be trusted, all DLC was decided by base roster time.

I don't understand why they just wouldn't make individual DLC characters instead of driving themselves into the ground making five at a time. It's absurd to me. There's no need for a stupid Fighter's Pass and there never should have been. Just release individual packs.

Because DLC takes planning. They can't just decide 'Oh, you know what? Let's do another character, what the heck!' The team has to know and has to report when they'll disassemble, what manpower they need, etc. So they need to know how much they're going to do in advance.

Plus, if people bought a Fighter Pass for five characters, and then it turns out there were more of them, people are going to feel scammed. Once you commit to the bundle style of DLC you have to stay the course.

 

[Geno Boost]

alright i just came back from millitary again and i finally finished while i was there the last Smithy model left the Wizard head!!!
i gotta say i didnt expect that i would model all of them since i started the first model of Smithy back in 2016 but it has been a great experience!

Spoiler

also one more special thing i did is a Smithy gang wallpaper that would be good for phones wallpapers!

Spoiler

 

[kiteinthesky]

Because DLC takes planning. They can't just decide 'Oh, you know what? Let's do another character, what the heck!' The team has to know and has to report when they'll disassemble, what manpower they need, etc. So they need to know how much they're going to do in advance.

Plus, if people bought a Fighter Pass for five characters, and then it turns out there were more of them, people are going to feel scammed. Once you commit to the bundle style of DLC you have to stay the course.

Wow, that's an awfully and unnecessarily hostile response.

Making the characters one at a time as opposed to five in a pack wouldn't negate the need for planning, research and development. If anything, it'd allow them to do it more efficiently as they're focusing all of their time and resources on one character as opposed to five.

I don't think anyone would feel scammed if they released future individual DLC characters after the fighter's pass.

 

[EarlTamm]

Wow, that's an awfully and unnecessarily hostile response.

Making the characters one at a time as opposed to five in a pack wouldn't negate the need for planning, research and development. If anything, it'd allow them to do it more efficiently as they're focusing all of their time and resources on one character as opposed to five.

I don't think anyone would feel scammed if they released future individual DLC characters after the fighter's pass.

I don't think it's that hostile.

They still focus on one or two at a time, not five. The future ones are just part of the plan.

I think it's rather important for consistency and expectations. There is no major harm to having a pack. The choice for individual payment is always there.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Wow, that's an awfully and unnecessarily hostile response.

Making the characters one at a time as opposed to five in a pack wouldn't negate the need for planning, research and development. If anything, it'd allow them to do it more efficiently as they're focusing all of their time and resources on one character as opposed to five.

I don't think anyone would feel scammed if they released future individual DLC characters after the fighter's pass.

Yeah, there wasn't really much hostile about that. Blunt I guess, but certainly not hostile.

The current method of character delivery seems to clearly be working better than the prior one for Smash 4. With Smash DLC we've had some fair consistency with release already and should generally expect that trend to continue. Piranha Plant released at the end of January, Joker mid April, and Hero will presumably release sometime in July (He could go into August, but everybody generally seems to be predicting July). Banjo Kazooie will likely be October as well, though again, the release dates aren't final on the others right now and could change. It would make for a very consistent every 2-3 months, a new character is released. It's much better than 6 months with nothing, then Mewtwo in April. Lucas, Roy, and Ryu all in June. Nothing until Cloud in December, and then Bayonetta and Corrin in February of the next year. Which really does put into perspective have much nicer the consistency of DLC for Ultimate is. And that really feels like the goal of Ultimate's DLC so far including the new modes and such, is a consistent stream of new content to keep players engaged and playing. One character at a time would probably not make that as viable and lead to worse gaps than even Smash 4 had since it's DLC was worked on concurrently. If we go by Sakurai's comments on the time to take DLC, then 6 months per character means we wouldn't see the end of the five fighters until mid 2021. Which would be wayyyy worse for the game and us as fans haha.

Also, with the season pass, you are told you will have access to the new releases of the season of content. If you as a developer release something independently, but within that same season at cost and the same kind of DLC as promised (I.E. Unique newcomers), then you're fan base will expect to be receiving that DLC as part of the pass and will be very angry when they learn this new DLC isn't included in their season pass despite being a part of the season and the exact type of content you promised them. It has to be free, extra content for that to work, not paid DLC. Hell, I've seen this happen after the Season Pass contents have been finished and new DLC has come out in which people have been angry that the additional DLC wasn't part of the pass despite how little sense that makes.

 

[Fenriraga]

Is there a particular reason Twitch Chat for CEO is full of "Free Geno"?

I absolutely welcome the Geno support, but... Kinda seems to have come out of nowhere. There a rumor or something?

EDIT: OH, it's Wishes' player tag. I'm dumb.

 

[ShotoStar 2]

Is there a particular reason Twitch Chat for CEO is full of "Free Geno"?

I absolutely welcome the Geno support, but... Kinda seems to have come out of nowhere. There a rumor or something?

EDIT: OH, it's Wishes' player tag. I'm dumb.

Yeah it's Wishes' player tag and while it would've been neat for there to be a rumor supporting Geno I still think someone making it into the top 16 with a Geno tag is pretty neat. At the very least it gets Nintendo's attention as they already tweeted about the top 16 so I think it's pretty cool.

I didn't even know Wishes' wanted Geno nor did I really know who he was but he's left a good impression on me so far, I'm personally rooting for him and Nairo. So even if it's not a rumor supporting Geno it's still pretty neat imo.

 

[NessAtc.]

What this actually is is someone named Geno was arrested recently, and much of the public disagrees with the arrest. Nothing to do with your Geno sadly

 

[ShotoStar 2]

What this actually is is someone named Geno was arrested recently, and much of the public disagrees with the arrest. Nothing to do with your Geno sadly

You sure? I can't find much on this the latest thing that was posted on something along these lines was all the way back in March. At the earliest all the way back in 2015. Plus I'm sure someone in the Twitch chat or on twitter would've brought it up sooner.

 

[UberMadman]

If Opossum is to be trusted, all DLC was decided by base roster time.

Wait, you mean like... back in late 2015-early 2016? That would be news to me. Do you have a specific source on the post they said that? I can’t find it, and I’m curious. That would potentially change some of my impressions on things.

EDIT: Nevermind, I found it. Interesting. Could that mean that PapaGenos’ Banjo source was legit all along? Remember, the reason that he speculated the Grinch leak to be true was because he heard a source directly tell him that Banjo was definitely going to be in, and that was back in October, 6 months after negotiations supposedly completed.

However, that’s still not like... 2015-2016 early. I will say that it does change my post a little bit since it seems that both Hero and Banjo got leaked legitimately without datamining and not on the day before. That would only change my argument on when Geno might be revealed in relation to pass 2 though, not whether or not there will be a second pass.

 

[SSGuy]

I didn't know that about Wishes either. That is pretty legit.

I may not have had the results but I also made a Geno tag. I also got this finished up at CEO.

It's spray painted on canvas. The Smash Ball behind him is glow in the dark so you can only see it am when exposed to a blacklight or when it is extremely dark.

Had to find a way to get Geno out on the artist alley

(If the file doesnt upload, I will post it again later)

 

[Ovaltine]

All DLC being decided by base roster time is false, at least developmentally. It was brought to Sakurai in January 2018, after a lot of Ultimate had already been completed. That said, the DLC was decided before we as the public knew about the full base roster, if that's what you guys mean? I'm way out of it, so forgive me if I misinterpreted things.

 

[Fatmanonice]

On the topic of #FreeGeno, I found this video while Googling it:

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

All DLC being decided by base roster time is false, at least developmentally. It was brought to Sakurai in January 2018, after a lot of Ultimate had already been completed. That said, the DLC was decided before we as the public knew about the full base roster, if that's what you guys mean? I'm way out of it, so forgive me if I misinterpreted things.

Yeah, it'd be the second thing. The FP(and possibly Piranha Plant, as he might've been decided upon after the actual base roster was programmed. It's unclear) would've been decided upon well after the base roster is clearly decided upon. That could've been quite early. The only character we know was worked on later on was Incineroar since he wasn't added to the game just yet, but a placeholder slot was decided upon(not a literal programmed slot, but among the development plans).

We don't know if they started negotiating for DLC after the base roster's main programming was finished or before. Something else I wanted to note. I hope he explains the development plans a bit more~

 

[GoodGrief741]

Wow, that's an awfully and unnecessarily hostile response.

Making the characters one at a time as opposed to five in a pack wouldn't negate the need for planning, research and development. If anything, it'd allow them to do it more efficiently as they're focusing all of their time and resources on one character as opposed to five.

I don't think anyone would feel scammed if they released future individual DLC characters after the fighter's pass.

Uh... I don't think that was hostile at all, but sorry if that offended you somehow. (If you could point out what was hostile that would help.)

But the point still stands, there's a reason they have to plan ahead. Budget, resource management, marketing, release strategy, those are all big factors, so Sakurai can't decide to make a new character on a whim.

And people can and will be pissed if there turns out to be piecemeal DLC. They paid for the Pass under the assumption that all planned DLC would be included in that pass. If they were planning to develop further DLC, and they don't announce how much in advance, the lack of transparency does turn people off.

Plus, telling people how much DLC they can expect and when they can expect it keeps people posted. There's a difference between announcing 5 DLC characters on November 1st, 2018, to be released through 2020, and just waking up a random day in April 2020 to find a trailer for a character. Less people are going to be invested by that point because you didn't tell them what to be expecting.

 

[ShotoStar 2]

On the topic of #FreeGeno, I found this video while Googling it:

I wish that video was the case but unfortunately we have no idea what Sakurai and Co. are thinking. The Geno Mii Costume may very well come back and we don't get Geno, The Mii Costume may not come back and we may get Geno, Maybe neither. We unfortunately don't know. That said, I hope that video is accurate and Sakurai will try his best to get Geno as DLC.

 

[Slender]

Things are going to be really, really tense if the Mii Costume doesn't show up in whatever way they plan to show off 4.0, whether it be in a Direct or a YouTube video like Joker.

Having the Mii Costume show up would either rip the bandage off early and/or leave us completely oblivious to Geno showing up as an actual fighter later on.
A lack of a Mii Costume would have us completely on edge until the very end, and we'll either get him as a fighter or nothing.

To be honest, I don't know what option would be better.

 

[Ovaltine]

Things are going to be really, really tense if the Mii Costume doesn't show up in whatever way they plan to show off 4.0, whether it be in a Direct or a YouTube video like Joker.

Having the Mii Costume show up would either rip the bandage off early and/or leave us completely oblivious to Geno showing up as an actual fighter later on.
A lack of a Mii Costume would have us completely on edge until the very end, and we'll either get him as a fighter or nothing.

To be honest, I don't know what option would be better.

I'd rather the first option considering I doubt that he's a fighter this time around, unless we get individual DLC.

Honestly, considering they have the rights for him in Ultimate, it's pretty frustrating that he isn't actually in. He's a major WoL fight, yeah, but that's literally just playing pretend with a PNG. It'd be like if I taped a picture of Geno to my Switch or TV screen. There being very little time to add him in the base roster is understandable, but then you'd think that'd mean he'd be pushed to DLC, right? Nope, apparently not.

I think him being an AT would have been so much better. Yes, it'd mean even more certainly that he isn't in, but 1) we wouldn't be left in limbo, 2) it'd possibly mean better chances for the next Smash as a fighter, and 3) we'd finally have a brand-new 3D model of Geno from Nintendo and company. He'd at least be tangible. He'd be there.

A PNG slapped into the game and a bootleg rip-off 'Geno' via the Mii costume is not Geno being 'there', playing pretend be damned.

 

[ShotoStar 2]

Things are going to be really, really tense if the Mii Costume doesn't show up in whatever way they plan to show off 4.0, whether it be in a Direct or a YouTube video like Joker.

Having the Mii Costume show up would either rip the bandage off early and/or leave us completely oblivious to Geno showing up as an actual fighter later on.
A lack of a Mii Costume would have us completely on edge until the very end, and we'll either get him as a fighter or nothing.

To be honest, I don't know what option would be better.

I'd prefer the second option honestly. If we don't get the Mii Costume that's apparently better for his Chances and that would make for some really interesting speculation. I want to have hope for Geno even if it may be a little bit or it may be false, I want hope and that would give us hope.

It would look better for his chances and it may mean Geno is actually in which I wouldn't put past Sakurai but even if that isn't the case it at least gives us more to talk about and some amount of hope. It at least makes things a whole lot more interesting until we know for sure.

And one last thing is, Quite frankly, If the Geno Mii Costume returns most of us would take that as a disconfirmation so this thread would really phase out and I don't want to see that happen. I really like spending my time here so I don't want to see this place phased out. I want to spend more time here and hang out with you all I don't want to leave this place that soon.

 

[Ovaltine]

And one last thing is, Quite frankly, If the Geno Mii Costume returns most of us would take that as a disconfirmation so this thread would really phase out and I don't want to see that happen. I really like spending my time here so I don't want to see this place phased out. I want to spend more time here and hang out with you all I don't want to leave this place that soon.

Trust me, I doubt this thread will slow down, and it sure won't as long as I keep doodling this boy, haha. If Isaac's thread can still be going after a freaking AT deconfirmation, Geno's can after a ported over Mii costume that took little effort to add for a quick cash grab.

(I don't say this in any bitterness towards Isaac's fans, btw. It's actually quite the opposite. I highly admire their dedication and resilience!)

 

[Deleted member]

Things are going to be really, really tense if the Mii Costume doesn't show up in whatever way they plan to show off 4.0, whether it be in a Direct or a YouTube video like Joker.

Having the Mii Costume show up would either rip the bandage off early and/or leave us completely oblivious to Geno showing up as an actual fighter later on.
A lack of a Mii Costume would have us completely on edge until the very end, and we'll either get him as a fighter or nothing.

To be honest, I don't know what option would be better.

As a former Isaac for Smash 4 DLC supporter, i would rather find out his fate as quick as possible instead of finding out at the last minute.

 

[ShotoStar 2]

Trust me, I doubt this thread will slow down, and it sure won't as long as I keep doodling this boy, haha. If Isaac's thread can still be going after a freaking AT deconfirmation, Geno's can after a ported over Mii costume that took little effort to add for a quick cash grab.

(I don't say this in any bitterness towards Isaac's fans, btw. It's actually quite the opposite. I highly admire their dedication and resilience!)

Well I don't think people would lighten up with the Geno Support but we'd probably shift our focus towards Operation Starfall I just prefer keeping my focus on Smash cause it's my favorite Video game franchise. Though I guess if a Season 2 comes out or individual DLC comes out the Mii Costume wouldn't mean much in the long run.

I just prefer focusing on Smash personally.

 

[Vector Victor]

As a former Isaac for Smash 4 DLC supporter, i would rather find out his fate as quick as possible instead of finding out at the last minute.

Honestly? The Smash team waiting until the November Smash Direct to confirm that Isaac and Shadow were ATs was a completely stupid idea. They should have just got it over and done with by the first Direct.

And how Shadow wasn't an echo at the very least was baffling.

 

[Ovaltine]

Well I don't think people would lighten up with the Geno Support but we'd probably shift our focus towards Operation Starfall I just prefer keeping my focus on Smash cause it's my favorite Video game franchise. Though I guess if a Season 2 comes out or individual DLC comes out the Mii Costume wouldn't mean much in the long run.

I just prefer focusing on Smash personally.

Yeah, the Mii costume and spirit would both be too great a double whammy to even consider Geno for the FP, but if we get more after it, then all bets are off. I wouldn't consider spirits or Mii costumes as deconfirmations for DLC beyond the initial plans we have. For what we have so far, though, and what is likely on the horizon, it's pretty damning.

 

[Vector Victor]

Yeah, the Mii costume and spirit would both be too great a double whammy to even consider Geno for the FP, but if we get more after it, then all bets are off. I wouldn't consider spirits or Mii costumes as deconfirmations for DLC beyond the initial plans we have. For what we have so far, though, and what is likely on the horizon, it's pretty damning.

The fact that no MarioRPG music was added to Smash is such a bizarre and wasted opportunity, especially since the original composer is already helping Ultimate. And they even used Forest mushrooms for the Mii costume in 4, just for the reveal. Like, just go the extra stupid step and add it to the game.

Honestly, everything with Geno's situation feels like everyone is too scared to just cross the finish line, instead just inching towards it hoping that an outside independent force nudges them over it so they can technically claim they didn't cross it and it just happen. Stop being so damn wishy washy concerning his playability with how perfect he would fit in, how fan demand is repeatedly acknowledged, how his costume is the only one with a splash screen and music, how you actually have his license to use for a jpeg.

Just do it.

 

[xpnc]

And people can and will be pissed if there turns out to be piecemeal DLC. They paid for the Pass under the assumption that all planned DLC would be included in that pass.

Every piece of promotional material regarding the fighter pass, including the Smash Bros websites, specifically states that the Fighters Pass comes with 5 characters and stages. No one except the most willfully ignorant people in the world would buy it with the assumption that they'd receive all future DLC for free. Someone buying the game and the fighter pass tomorrow would still have to pay for Piranha Plant individually.

Please note that there is no definite article here. It states that you get five DLC packs. Not all DLC packs, not the DLC packs, you get five.

I've been stupidly buying DLC season passes for games since Gears of War 3 in 2011. Every single game has had DLC outside of the season passes that you have had to purchase individually. They have all also had more than one season pass.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Not that I think we're getting another season's pass either, but I agree that they're really damn clear on the Fighter's Pass itself. There's no confusion here.

It's super easy to advertise something else on its own. They gave us Mii Costume packs as individual purchases too, so it's not tied to the FP either way. Just like PP isn't. PP was pretty much the Mewtwo of 4(bar the popularity factor. Iconicness, yeah). I can certainly hope we'll get some more characters, but I'm not holding my breath either. I would think they're probably closer to something that at most comes with the character and some extra music, like if it was Geno. Various Echo DLC's wouldn't be different in this particular case either, imo.

 

[KCCHIEFS27]

Uh... I don't think that was hostile at all, but sorry if that offended you somehow. (If you could point out what was hostile that would help.)

But the point still stands, there's a reason they have to plan ahead. Budget, resource management, marketing, release strategy, those are all big factors, so Sakurai can't decide to make a new character on a whim.

And people can and will be pissed if there turns out to be piecemeal DLC. They paid for the Pass under the assumption that all planned DLC would be included in that pass. If they were planning to develop further DLC, and they don't announce how much in advance, the lack of transparency does turn people off.

Plus, telling people how much DLC they can expect and when they can expect it keeps people posted. There's a difference between announcing 5 DLC characters on November 1st, 2018, to be released through 2020, and just waking up a random day in April 2020 to find a trailer for a character. Less people are going to be invested by that point because you didn't tell them what to be expecting.

I also get angry when my favorite video game decides to add additional optional content

 

[GoodGrief741]

Every piece of promotional material regarding the fighter pass, including the Smash Bros websites, specifically states that the Fighters Pass comes with 5 characters and stages. No one except the most willfully ignorant people in the world would buy it with the assumption that they'd receive all future DLC for free. Someone buying the game and the fighter pass tomorrow would still have to pay for Piranha Plant individually.

View attachment 229683
Please note that there is no definite article here. It states that you get five DLC packs. Not all DLC packs, not the DLC packs, you get five.

I've been stupidly buying DLC season passes for games since Gears of War 3 in 2011. Every single game has had DLC outside of the season passes that you have had to purchase individually. They have all also had more than one season pass.

I might have been unclear. I don't think there would be any confusion on whether the Pass has or hasn't the extra characters.

I do think that if extra characters started being announced, people would question whether it was always part of the plan to have them separate from the Fighter Pass. Because that would be a questionable practice. Why make six characters but only sell five as part of a bundle?