Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[AugustusB]

If there are any glitches or issues in any modes concerning Mii Gunner, all hell will break loose. The last 2 characters who had some glitches were Mii Sword and Duck Hunt. Then look who we got at E3.

I kind of hope that doesn't happen again. It would be nice to be surprised, but I agree...All hell will break loose if that happens.

EDIT: Though if it happens, it would be great to see a character glitch that no one could point it to. Example, to me, would be that Yoshi starts glitching.
Everyone: Uhhhh...Boshi!?!?

Although, it would be really interesting if more than 2 characters started glitching....then it would be a real s***show!

 

[Ovaltine]

I kind of hope that doesn't happen again. It would be nice to be surprised, but I agree...All hell will break loose if that happens.

I still only think those glitches were an odd coincidence, but of all characters in a 70+ character roster...

That said, I really don't think that, from a programming perspective, it makes much sense for that to be connected to Banjo and Hero's inclusions, especially the Duck Hunt bit. His maneuvers fit a more quadruped move set, and Banjo is not that.

 

[AugustusB]

I still only think those glitches were an odd coincidence, but of all characters in a 70+ character roster...

That said, I really don't think that, from a programming perspective, it makes much sense for that to be connected to Banjo and Hero's inclusions, especially the Duck Hunt bit. His maneuvers fit a more quadruped move set, and Banjo is not that.

Now correct me if I am wrong, but did a similar situation happen with Zamus in Sm4sh being used as Bayonetta's base model?

It is a coincidence, but like you said..out of ALL the fighters it happens to be Mii Swordfighter and Duck Hunt.

 

[MattX20]

Spoiler: Huge post

Alright, so, on today's episode of Overthinking Everything, I'm going to fenagle a new theory for everyone's amusement that I will call "Continuation" theory to possibly predict the last two newcomers.

In Smash Ultimate, the trailers have been very heavily thematic in comparison to Smash 4. The Banjo trailer that we got recently is a prime example. DK, Diddy, and K. Rool were all previous RARE characters and, of course, so was Banjo. Duck Hunt was there because of the very obvious animal duo pairing. When it comes to the character choices in the trailers, it seems to be very deliberate and with purpose. Simon/Richter's had Luigi as Nintendo's go-to character with spooky games. K. Rool obviously had DK and Diddy but King Dedede, the only other major Nintendo character with King inherently in his name, was there too. Ken/Inceniroar's was "fighting" characters with Little Mac from the get-go and then all the characters in the game with boxing gloves (Villager, K. Rool, and Bowser Jr.) as comic relief. Hero had Link, Metaknight, and Marth in prominent roles because, well, swords while Isabelle and Joker's trailers basically focused on the individual characters themselves. This then leads to an interesting observation about the first full character trailer we got, Ridley's...

The main characters in Ridley's trailers are Mario, Megaman, and Samus. The connection between Samus and Ridley is obvious but what about Megaman and Mario? It doesn't help that Mario and Megaman are "killed off" very early in the trailer and the connection between Samus and Ridley is extremely highlighted. This is where the Continuation Theory comes in. We don't exactly know what happens to either of them. Megaman makes the classic death noise but he doesn't explode so he's probably seriously hurt but not necessarily dead. Same could easily be said about Mario. Chances are, they're simply somewhere else in the environment. Why is this significant? It's because we never really get a proper conclusion to Samus and Ridley's fight. Samus is about to dive kick Ridley in the face and then it just sort of fades out. This makes me believe that this story will continue but why? Because it's already happened once before.

The ending to K. Rool's trailer is very vague as well. A big clash of fists, a shock wave, and then we don't really see what happens after that aside from a goofy little skit at the end. At the start of Banjo's trailer, their story continues. I noticed that the endings of Simon/Richter's trailer and Ken/Inceniroar's trailer are kind of vague too. Luigi is about to go into his body when Carmilla appears and we don't see what happens next. Inceniroar gets a line of challengers, utters a sigh of annoyance, but we don't see the end result. There's a decent chance that the story of at least one of these trailers will continue, with my money being on the Ridley trailer being the most likely. Before I go into that, let's imagine the other two.

With Inceniroar's, the end result is that he probably effortlessly beat his three challengers and is looking for someone to give him a real challenge. Who could do this? Keeping with the theme, it would probably be a character from a fighting game. For example, thematically speaking, someone like Heihachi from Tekken would work really well here although that is just one possibility.

With Simon/Richter's, we have Luigi as a ghost/spirit and we're still in the spooky locale of Dracula's castle. This makes me believe that, if this story continues, they would try to have a character that fits this theme. Off the top of my head, two characters fit this theme pretty well: someone from Resident Evil (probably Leon or Jill) or someone from Yokai Watch like "Nate" with Yokai like Pokemon Trailer or someone stand alone like Jibanyan coming to save Luigi.

Now let's go back to Ridley. Like I asked earlier, what's the connection between Mario, Megaman, and Samus? I looked into Smash's past and looked at past presentations:

Bowser Jr's trailer is the only character trailer in Smash 4 where all three characters were together in the cinematic. It's kind of the same premise too, they're fighting a villain but this time they're fighting a Mario villain. Coincidentally, Mario and Megaman get hurt in this trailer too. Beyond that, there's one other time: the Final Smash 4 presentation.

At 15:37, you see "Geno" fighting Zero Suit Samus. At 15:40, you see Samus, "Geno" and Megaman together. At 17:00, you see "Geno" fighting on Ridley's stage, the location that most people agree is most similar to the one in Ridley's trailer. Tin foil hatty but there's a proven historical connection between these characters under this train of thought. Again, the characters for trailers seem to be very deliberate if the characters are given significant screen time. Based on this, these characters were probably put together for a reason but the full reason may not be obvious because we don't have the full story yet. Following this theory, the connection between the characters will be better established when the story continues and a lynch pin that connects these three characters is Geno. Still, this is kind of out there but I wanted to see what people thought of it.

Interesting theory, that might be something to make a mental note of

 

[T2by4]

I still only think those glitches were an odd coincidence, but of all characters in a 70+ character roster...

That said, I really don't think that, from a programming perspective, it makes much sense for that to be connected to Banjo and Hero's inclusions, especially the Duck Hunt bit. His maneuvers fit a more quadruped move set, and Banjo is not that.

Isn't Banjo's Bair the same as duckhunts? I thought it was obvious that they used duckhunts assets for banjo.

 

[Ovaltine]

Isn't Banjo's Bair the same as duckhunts? I thought it was obvious that they used duckhunts assets for banjo.

Now correct me if I am wrong, but did a similar situation happen with Zamus in Sm4sh being used as Bayonetta's base model?

It is a coincidence, but like you said..out of ALL the fighters it happens to be Mii Swordfighter and Duck Hunt.

Huh. Okay, maybe I don't know as much about the situation as I thought, haha.

Very interdasting...

 

[GoodGrief741]

I kind of hope that doesn't happen again. It would be nice to be surprised, but I agree...All hell will break loose if that happens.

EDIT: Though if it happens, it would be great to see a character glitch that no one could point it to. Example, to me, would be that Yoshi starts glitching.
Everyone: Uhhhh...Boshi!?!?

Although, it would be really interesting if more than 2 characters started glitching....then it would be a real s***show!

Well, that's obvious. It would have to be a fighter with abilities similar to Yoshi's signatures. And what's Yoshi's signature ability?

That's right tax evasion Joker confirmed for Smash

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Well, that's obvious. It would have to be a fighter with abilities similar to Yoshi's signatures. And what's Yoshi's signature ability?

That's right tax evasion Joker confirmed for Smash

I think you just like egging people on.

Speaking of base stuff, I'd imagine Yoshi would be used to help make someone like Agumon. At least for the base form. They're fairly similar shapes. The other ones, not so much.

 

[UberMadman]

Isn't Banjo's Bair the same as duckhunts? I thought it was obvious that they used duckhunts assets for banjo.

No; Banjo’s bair is a multi-hit, and Duck Hunt’s is only a single hit. However, most characters in the game are built using some other character as a base, and I think you’re right that it's likely they started with Duck Hunt for Banjo & Kazooie.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I was trying to think of a single other character I'd want as DLC other than Geno now that Banjo is in, and unless they suddenly decide to add Blastoise, I can't think of anything. Geno (Blastoise) or whatever now.

I think if they add Papyrus though I'd flip. Not specifically rooting for him though

 

[GrungeMan]

Spoiler: Huge post

Alright, so, on today's episode of Overthinking Everything, I'm going to fenagle a new theory for everyone's amusement that I will call "Continuation" theory to possibly predict the last two newcomers.

In Smash Ultimate, the trailers have been very heavily thematic in comparison to Smash 4. The Banjo trailer that we got recently is a prime example. DK, Diddy, and K. Rool were all previous RARE characters and, of course, so was Banjo. Duck Hunt was there because of the very obvious animal duo pairing. When it comes to the character choices in the trailers, it seems to be very deliberate and with purpose. Simon/Richter's had Luigi as Nintendo's go-to character with spooky games. K. Rool obviously had DK and Diddy but King Dedede, the only other major Nintendo character with King inherently in his name, was there too. Ken/Inceniroar's was "fighting" characters with Little Mac from the get-go and then all the characters in the game with boxing gloves (Villager, K. Rool, and Bowser Jr.) as comic relief. Hero had Link, Metaknight, and Marth in prominent roles because, well, swords while Isabelle and Joker's trailers basically focused on the individual characters themselves. This then leads to an interesting observation about the first full character trailer we got, Ridley's...

The main characters in Ridley's trailers are Mario, Megaman, and Samus. The connection between Samus and Ridley is obvious but what about Megaman and Mario? It doesn't help that Mario and Megaman are "killed off" very early in the trailer and the connection between Samus and Ridley is extremely highlighted. This is where the Continuation Theory comes in. We don't exactly know what happens to either of them. Megaman makes the classic death noise but he doesn't explode so he's probably seriously hurt but not necessarily dead. Same could easily be said about Mario. Chances are, they're simply somewhere else in the environment. Why is this significant? It's because we never really get a proper conclusion to Samus and Ridley's fight. Samus is about to dive kick Ridley in the face and then it just sort of fades out. This makes me believe that this story will continue but why? Because it's already happened once before.

The ending to K. Rool's trailer is very vague as well. A big clash of fists, a shock wave, and then we don't really see what happens after that aside from a goofy little skit at the end. At the start of Banjo's trailer, their story continues. I noticed that the endings of Simon/Richter's trailer and Ken/Inceniroar's trailer are kind of vague too. Luigi is about to go into his body when Carmilla appears and we don't see what happens next. Inceniroar gets a line of challengers, utters a sigh of annoyance, but we don't see the end result. There's a decent chance that the story of at least one of these trailers will continue, with my money being on the Ridley trailer being the most likely. Before I go into that, let's imagine the other two.

With Inceniroar's, the end result is that he probably effortlessly beat his three challengers and is looking for someone to give him a real challenge. Who could do this? Keeping with the theme, it would probably be a character from a fighting game. For example, thematically speaking, someone like Heihachi from Tekken would work really well here although that is just one possibility.

With Simon/Richter's, we have Luigi as a ghost/spirit and we're still in the spooky locale of Dracula's castle. This makes me believe that, if this story continues, they would try to have a character that fits this theme. Off the top of my head, two characters fit this theme pretty well: someone from Resident Evil (probably Leon or Jill) or someone from Yokai Watch like "Nate" with Yokai like Pokemon Trailer or someone stand alone like Jibanyan coming to save Luigi.

Now let's go back to Ridley. Like I asked earlier, what's the connection between Mario, Megaman, and Samus? I looked into Smash's past and looked at past presentations:

Bowser Jr's trailer is the only character trailer in Smash 4 where all three characters were together in the cinematic. It's kind of the same premise too, they're fighting a villain but this time they're fighting a Mario villain. Coincidentally, Mario and Megaman get hurt in this trailer too. Beyond that, there's one other time: the Final Smash 4 presentation.

At 15:37, you see "Geno" fighting Zero Suit Samus. At 15:40, you see Samus, "Geno" and Megaman together. At 17:00, you see "Geno" fighting on Ridley's stage, the location that most people agree is most similar to the one in Ridley's trailer. Tin foil hatty but there's a proven historical connection between these characters under this train of thought. Again, the characters for trailers seem to be very deliberate if the characters are given significant screen time. Based on this, these characters were probably put together for a reason but the full reason may not be obvious because we don't have the full story yet. Following this theory, the connection between the characters will be better established when the story continues and a lynch pin that connects these three characters is Geno. Still, this is kind of out there but I wanted to see what people thought of it.

From one overthinker to another, I really appreciated this perspective and find it really creative.

- I would love to see a trailer with Luigi (alive and successfully escaped out of Dracula's mansion) running down a street and past a sign reading "Welcome to Raccoon City." He begins to hear ominous grunts and groans and scurries in yet another house only to meet Jill who succesfully navigates Luigi out of harms way throughout the trailer.

- Heihachi vs. Incineroar sounds great and a nice touch since I believe Heihachi's voice actor voiced Incineroar in Ultimate as one of his last roles before passing away.

- Question though: Is there a precedent to feature a guest character from one company in a reveal trailer for another guest character from a different company? Not that Capcom would care, but Megaman in Geno's reveal trailer would be odd assuming Geno will continue Ridley's trailer. However, it would now make sense why Mario was originally there in Ridley's trailer considering Geno probably lives in space somewhere and will just casually drop by to save his old friend... alongside Megaman and Samus... because blasters (same as Hero with the swordsmen cameos).

 

[NintendoKnight]

Spoiler: Huge post

Alright, so, on today's episode of Overthinking Everything, I'm going to fenagle a new theory for everyone's amusement that I will call "Continuation" theory to possibly predict the last two newcomers.

In Smash Ultimate, the trailers have been very heavily thematic in comparison to Smash 4. The Banjo trailer that we got recently is a prime example. DK, Diddy, and K. Rool were all previous RARE characters and, of course, so was Banjo. Duck Hunt was there because of the very obvious animal duo pairing. When it comes to the character choices in the trailers, it seems to be very deliberate and with purpose. Simon/Richter's had Luigi as Nintendo's go-to character with spooky games. K. Rool obviously had DK and Diddy but King Dedede, the only other major Nintendo character with King inherently in his name, was there too. Ken/Inceniroar's was "fighting" characters with Little Mac from the get-go and then all the characters in the game with boxing gloves (Villager, K. Rool, and Bowser Jr.) as comic relief. Hero had Link, Metaknight, and Marth in prominent roles because, well, swords while Isabelle and Joker's trailers basically focused on the individual characters themselves. This then leads to an interesting observation about the first full character trailer we got, Ridley's...

The main characters in Ridley's trailers are Mario, Megaman, and Samus. The connection between Samus and Ridley is obvious but what about Megaman and Mario? It doesn't help that Mario and Megaman are "killed off" very early in the trailer and the connection between Samus and Ridley is extremely highlighted. This is where the Continuation Theory comes in. We don't exactly know what happens to either of them. Megaman makes the classic death noise but he doesn't explode so he's probably seriously hurt but not necessarily dead. Same could easily be said about Mario. Chances are, they're simply somewhere else in the environment. Why is this significant? It's because we never really get a proper conclusion to Samus and Ridley's fight. Samus is about to dive kick Ridley in the face and then it just sort of fades out. This makes me believe that this story will continue but why? Because it's already happened once before.

The ending to K. Rool's trailer is very vague as well. A big clash of fists, a shock wave, and then we don't really see what happens after that aside from a goofy little skit at the end. At the start of Banjo's trailer, their story continues. I noticed that the endings of Simon/Richter's trailer and Ken/Inceniroar's trailer are kind of vague too. Luigi is about to go into his body when Carmilla appears and we don't see what happens next. Inceniroar gets a line of challengers, utters a sigh of annoyance, but we don't see the end result. There's a decent chance that the story of at least one of these trailers will continue, with my money being on the Ridley trailer being the most likely. Before I go into that, let's imagine the other two.

With Inceniroar's, the end result is that he probably effortlessly beat his three challengers and is looking for someone to give him a real challenge. Who could do this? Keeping with the theme, it would probably be a character from a fighting game. For example, thematically speaking, someone like Heihachi from Tekken would work really well here although that is just one possibility.

With Simon/Richter's, we have Luigi as a ghost/spirit and we're still in the spooky locale of Dracula's castle. This makes me believe that, if this story continues, they would try to have a character that fits this theme. Off the top of my head, two characters fit this theme pretty well: someone from Resident Evil (probably Leon or Jill) or someone from Yokai Watch like "Nate" with Yokai like Pokemon Trailer or someone stand alone like Jibanyan coming to save Luigi.

Now let's go back to Ridley. Like I asked earlier, what's the connection between Mario, Megaman, and Samus? I looked into Smash's past and looked at past presentations:

Bowser Jr's trailer is the only character trailer in Smash 4 where all three characters were together in the cinematic. It's kind of the same premise too, they're fighting a villain but this time they're fighting a Mario villain. Coincidentally, Mario and Megaman get hurt in this trailer too. Beyond that, there's one other time: the Final Smash 4 presentation.

At 15:37, you see "Geno" fighting Zero Suit Samus. At 15:40, you see Samus, "Geno" and Megaman together. At 17:00, you see "Geno" fighting on Ridley's stage, the location that most people agree is most similar to the one in Ridley's trailer. Tin foil hatty but there's a proven historical connection between these characters under this train of thought. Again, the characters for trailers seem to be very deliberate if the characters are given significant screen time. Based on this, these characters were probably put together for a reason but the full reason may not be obvious because we don't have the full story yet. Following this theory, the connection between the characters will be better established when the story continues and a lynch pin that connects these three characters is Geno. Still, this is kind of out there but I wanted to see what people thought of it.

I love this concept of these thematic continuation trailers, honestly. Not saying Geno has to do this, but it'd be a neat concept to try.

Which trailer would fit best for Geno to re-use and pop in with?

Personally, watching Geno go in to save Samus, Mario and Mega Man would be very interesting.

Also, in regards to the character reveal taglines, I distinctly remember that someone on Smashboards predicted B-K's "Raring to go" tagline. So I was trying to think of something that would utterly fit Geno... and then I figured it out!

Geno Shoots for the Stars!

It's pretty much beyond perfect, IMO.

 

[GrungeMan]

Another question for the thread in general:

All 11 guest characters never had smash representation before their reveal (which gives some perpective, imo, to Reggie's TGA comments), so do you think we'll get a DLC fighter that breaks this fan-rule?

If not, and if you prescribe to Mii Costume theory (which I kinda do at this point since it's practical), then Namco wouldn't pick Heihachi or Lloyd.

Which gives me reason to believe we may get KOS-MOS as a Namco rep, and who has alreasy crossed over in Xenoblade 2, so the potential to also rep all of Xeno (and thus indirectly a Nintendo franchise) is there.

I don't think Geno counts (even though he technically does) because he's not a guest. Geno is a Mario character through and through. So if Geno is a bonus fighter he'll be a unique case for 3rd parties and their patterns of non-representation.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

I don't think Geno counts (even though he technically does) because he's not a guest. Geno is a Mario character through and through. So if Geno is a bonus fighter he'll be a unique case for 3rd parties and their patterns of non-representation.

Geno's a weird case in that he's a Mario character though was made by Square so they technically own him.

You could pretty much argue one way or another, but personally I would mark him up as a Mario character. Don't think Super Mario RPG should get its own icon honestly (though I wouldn't mind down the line if it, Paper Mario, and Mario & Luigi were grouped together as one "Mario RPG" series, that would be fun).

 

[Wazygoose]

NintendoKnight I’m thinking surely there’s been a section somewhere in these thousand pages where everyone came up with a Geno reveal tagline. Good luck finding it though. I like yours a lot, there’ve been others I’ve heard too:

Geno Shoots for the Stars
Geno Grants Your Wish
Geno Blasts In
Geno Serves a Higher Authority
Geno Comes to Life

The authority one is a joke, but for the last one I do think it’d be cool for the last fighter pass character to throw way back to Smash64: Master Hans pulls a Geno Doll out of the toy chest, drops him into some cutscene, snaps his fingers, and the doll comes to life.

 

[3DSNinja]

I got one
Geno Stars in Smash!
Get it, he is a star
*leaves*

 

[Nicnac]

Geno gives it a whirl?

 

[_Sheik]

Hello, please add me to the support list! I just got Geno in SMRPG. I was convinced he wouldn't interest me too much but I admit I got hyped when I witnessed his 'awakening'. Bowyer being a moron really undermined his later entrance but it was still a lot of fun

 

[osby]

I think Sakurai's giving waaay too much value to the surprise element of Smash. Stuff like Greninja's Mewtwo fakeout, the entire existence of Piranha Plant and not having another Subspace Emissary because people spoiled it for themselves online are just... Dumb. Subverting expectations can be fresh and good, but it can also backfire hard when the decision made is not as good as the expectation.

There's no such thing as Mewtwo fakeout, people were just dumb and jumped at what they want, like how they gone "WOLF?!" at Cloud's reveal trailer.

Also, why people still act like the only reason we didn't get another SSE is Sakurai being petty? WoL did have cutscenes, people need to read between the lines and accept making 50+ minutes of cutscenes with 70+ characters wasn't realizable with development time they had.

 

[Deleted member]

I got one
Geno Stars in Smash!
Get it, he is a star
*leaves*

Hey, I came up with that one

 

[Deleted member]

Last night I had a dream about CTR NF.

For some reason, Geno and Pitfall Harry were part of the roster.

 

[Vector Victor]

Last night I had a dream about CTR NF.

For some reason, Geno and Pitfall Harry were part of the roster.

The weirdest thing: I actually had a Geno dream last night. The site was showcasing Hero's stage and they accidentally leaked Geno in one of the clips very briefly with a player icon and moving like a playable character (so not an AT).

 

[AugustusB]

Another question for the thread in general:

All 11 guest characters never had smash representation before their reveal (which gives some perpective, imo, to Reggie's TGA comments), so do you think we'll get a DLC fighter that breaks this fan-rule?

If not, and if you prescribe to Mii Costume theory (which I kinda do at this point since it's practical), then Namco wouldn't pick Heihachi or Lloyd.

Which gives me reason to believe we may get KOS-MOS as a Namco rep, and who has alreasy crossed over in Xenoblade 2, so the potential to also rep all of Xeno (and thus indirectly a Nintendo franchise) is there.

I don't think Geno counts (even though he technically does) because he's not a guest. Geno is a Mario character through and through. So if Geno is a bonus fighter he'll be a unique case for 3rd parties and their patterns of non-representation.

My dude (or dudette), if KOS-MOS gets in, this fighters pass would be catered to me BIG time. Also I agree that IF Namco gets another fighter, it would be someone different than what is expected. Plus, KOS-MOS would be a technical double whammy. Namco AND Monolith Soft rep rolled up in one.

You have good taste btw lol

 

[EricTheGamerman]

My dude (or dudette), if KOS-MOS gets in, this fighters pass would be catered to me BIG time. Also I agree that IF Namco gets another fighter, it would be someone different than what is expected. Plus, KOS-MOS would be a technical double whammy. Namco AND Monolith Soft rep rolled up in one.

You have good taste btw lol

What's your pitch for KOS-MOS? I've seen her pop up a lot over the past year, seemingly out of nowhere, and never really understood why haha.

 

[AugustusB]

What's your pitch for KOS-MOS? I've seen her pop up a lot over the past year, seemingly out of nowhere, and never really understood why haha.

My time is now! KOS-MOS is an all in one army android who brings something new to the table. She is from Xenosaga, who's series had a pretty decent following back in the 2000's. She is a Namco character and is produced by Monolith Soft.

I would suggest going to the support thread: https://smashboards.com/threads/kos...battle-kos-mos-for-smash-ultimate-dlc.451936/ As I could go on, but currently at work.

EDIT: I guess the appeal is she would represent not only Namco, but Monolith as well. She has been on a Nintendo platform with Xenosaga 1 and 2 being on the DS and she was in Project X Zone as well as being a Rare Blade in Xenoblade Chronicles 2. With the rule of no guns in Smash, the gate opens a bit for her.

 

[Geno Boost]

people dreaming of Geno huh!? here is my story i one dreamed that made appearence in one of future square-enix game i am not sure how to describe it, it could be a new IP but a successor to SMRPG there wasnt any SMRPG characters in that game but the design and style of it is too similar SMRPG its also 3D appearently when Geno made an appearence his design looked different a little his cape and hat were and shoes were metal and his wooden body is cosmic and the joints are suns also his mouth and eyes werent visible you could say it looked similar to cosmic rosalina, Geno was like a secret boss but at the end he bodies everyone and tell that he was testing their power you could say he had a similar rule to Culex. i also remember that his name was "The Star Spirit".

 

[Datboigeno]

10 months? Try the past four years since Phil Spencer made his statement. Banjo Kazooie just usurped any one in their way for most highly requested newcomer. Spencer made his comment almost immediately after the ballot started too, so there's no way to discredit Banjo Kazooie on the basis of that either.

I am looking at the big picture, and that's everything in the post Smash 4 era. And honestly, Geno was not doing well during that era. Only when we saw his Mii fighter costume and heard from Sakurai did he actually start gaining proper traction again, which would have been after Banjo Kazooie was on the table. Geno didn't drop off as hard as Krystal for example... but there was a pretty substantial drop off in his popularity from Brawl to 4. A thing that hurts us a lot more than it helps us since he wouldn't have actually had that resurgence while the ballot was ongoing. I think that's one of the biggest marks against Geno and his chances for inclusion in Ultimate. His best moment to shine in polls was during his probably lowest point popularity wise in the past decade.

I hate that some try to claim Geno has "such a consistent legacy" when he's like a lot of other characters, he's had a lot of ups and downs in popularity (Most of the desire for him in Melee seems so horribly unsubstantiated and those numbers of things are absolutely tiny, so I don't consider him having popularity until the Brawl era). He was quite popular in the Brawl era, fell off during Smash 4, and came back during Ultimate, particularly with a huge boom after King K. Rool was confirmed and people thought he was happening next. His popularity has been parabolic in a sense. He's been popular and has done well with online polls throughout Smash history, but there is unarguably a massive drop during the Smash 4 era. Similarly, Banjo Kazooie also didn't have a consistent popularity. He was warming up in the Melee era, disappeared until Smash 4 DLC. Pretty much no character has a super consistent legacy of popularity like that.

But it's just also, when Banjo Kazooie became an option, he absolutely dominated everything. Like multiple polls have him at first and the margin between him and second isn't even close even in our fan polls. Geno has hovered for a while in the top five, top ten. He's never been the clear cut winner in any era like that.

Geno has definitely topped polls and gotten in the top 3 before though therein beating out Banjo at times. Off of the top of my head he was first in the big Reddit DLC poll with Banjo getting third and I think got second or third behind Sora and Rex in a Japanese poll.

Spoiler: Huge post

Alright, so, on today's episode of Overthinking Everything, I'm going to fenagle a new theory for everyone's amusement that I will call "Continuation" theory to possibly predict the last two newcomers.

In Smash Ultimate, the trailers have been very heavily thematic in comparison to Smash 4. The Banjo trailer that we got recently is a prime example. DK, Diddy, and K. Rool were all previous RARE characters and, of course, so was Banjo. Duck Hunt was there because of the very obvious animal duo pairing. When it comes to the character choices in the trailers, it seems to be very deliberate and with purpose. Simon/Richter's had Luigi as Nintendo's go-to character with spooky games. K. Rool obviously had DK and Diddy but King Dedede, the only other major Nintendo character with King inherently in his name, was there too. Ken/Inceniroar's was "fighting" characters with Little Mac from the get-go and then all the characters in the game with boxing gloves (Villager, K. Rool, and Bowser Jr.) as comic relief. Hero had Link, Metaknight, and Marth in prominent roles because, well, swords while Isabelle and Joker's trailers basically focused on the individual characters themselves. This then leads to an interesting observation about the first full character trailer we got, Ridley's...

The main characters in Ridley's trailers are Mario, Megaman, and Samus. The connection between Samus and Ridley is obvious but what about Megaman and Mario? It doesn't help that Mario and Megaman are "killed off" very early in the trailer and the connection between Samus and Ridley is extremely highlighted. This is where the Continuation Theory comes in. We don't exactly know what happens to either of them. Megaman makes the classic death noise but he doesn't explode so he's probably seriously hurt but not necessarily dead. Same could easily be said about Mario. Chances are, they're simply somewhere else in the environment. Why is this significant? It's because we never really get a proper conclusion to Samus and Ridley's fight. Samus is about to dive kick Ridley in the face and then it just sort of fades out. This makes me believe that this story will continue but why? Because it's already happened once before.

The ending to K. Rool's trailer is very vague as well. A big clash of fists, a shock wave, and then we don't really see what happens after that aside from a goofy little skit at the end. At the start of Banjo's trailer, their story continues. I noticed that the endings of Simon/Richter's trailer and Ken/Inceniroar's trailer are kind of vague too. Luigi is about to go into his body when Carmilla appears and we don't see what happens next. Inceniroar gets a line of challengers, utters a sigh of annoyance, but we don't see the end result. There's a decent chance that the story of at least one of these trailers will continue, with my money being on the Ridley trailer being the most likely. Before I go into that, let's imagine the other two.

With Inceniroar's, the end result is that he probably effortlessly beat his three challengers and is looking for someone to give him a real challenge. Who could do this? Keeping with the theme, it would probably be a character from a fighting game. For example, thematically speaking, someone like Heihachi from Tekken would work really well here although that is just one possibility.

With Simon/Richter's, we have Luigi as a ghost/spirit and we're still in the spooky locale of Dracula's castle. This makes me believe that, if this story continues, they would try to have a character that fits this theme. Off the top of my head, two characters fit this theme pretty well: someone from Resident Evil (probably Leon or Jill) or someone from Yokai Watch like "Nate" with Yokai like Pokemon Trailer or someone stand alone like Jibanyan coming to save Luigi.

Now let's go back to Ridley. Like I asked earlier, what's the connection between Mario, Megaman, and Samus? I looked into Smash's past and looked at past presentations:

Bowser Jr's trailer is the only character trailer in Smash 4 where all three characters were together in the cinematic. It's kind of the same premise too, they're fighting a villain but this time they're fighting a Mario villain. Coincidentally, Mario and Megaman get hurt in this trailer too. Beyond that, there's one other time: the Final Smash 4 presentation.

At 15:37, you see "Geno" fighting Zero Suit Samus. At 15:40, you see Samus, "Geno" and Megaman together. At 17:00, you see "Geno" fighting on Ridley's stage, the location that most people agree is most similar to the one in Ridley's trailer. Tin foil hatty but there's a proven historical connection between these characters under this train of thought. Again, the characters for trailers seem to be very deliberate if the characters are given significant screen time. Based on this, these characters were probably put together for a reason but the full reason may not be obvious because we don't have the full story yet. Following this theory, the connection between the characters will be better established when the story continues and a lynch pin that connects these three characters is Geno. Still, this is kind of out there but I wanted to see what people thought of it.

Hey nice this is very similar to what I brought up a while ago in terms of some trailers being continuations of previous ones.

https://smashboards.com/threads/geno-♪-return-of-the-starsend-savior-come-on-lets-get-this-show-on-the-road-geno-dlc.446378/page-988#post-23390664

This would actually fit better than what I was thinking for Geno than just him fitting into the WoL spirit stuff. I do think it's super conspicuous that Mario of all characters hasn't really shown up in any of the trailers outside of Ridley's, and neither has Megaman even though both showed up several times during the Smash 4 cinematics. It also really did seem at the time like the Samus vs Ridley face off would get some sort of continuation with the fade to white ending of it and we haven't gotten that yet. It would make total sense for the continuation of that to be the final reveal of the FP if they did in fact plan all these cinematics well in advance which they obviously needed to. Also if any characters were going to be chosen to connect to Geno other than Rosalina those three would make the most sense. Mario for obvious reason, Megaman for their weapon-type/fighting similarities, and Samus loosely because she's from space and Geno's star connection.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Another question for the thread in general:

All 11 guest characters never had smash representation before their reveal (which gives some perpective, imo, to Reggie's TGA comments), so do you think we'll get a DLC fighter that breaks this fan-rule?

If not, and if you prescribe to Mii Costume theory (which I kinda do at this point since it's practical), then Namco wouldn't pick Heihachi or Lloyd.

Which gives me reason to believe we may get KOS-MOS as a Namco rep, and who has alreasy crossed over in Xenoblade 2, so the potential to also rep all of Xeno (and thus indirectly a Nintendo franchise) is there.

I don't think Geno counts (even though he technically does) because he's not a guest. Geno is a Mario character through and through. So if Geno is a bonus fighter he'll be a unique case for 3rd parties and their patterns of non-representation.

For this pass? I don't think we will. Reggie's 'new to Smash' seems kind of final in that aspect. Maybe we could get a character like Lloyd who has been in Smash before but not in Ultimate, but otherwise nah.

 

[kiteinthesky]

Geno has definitely topped polls and gotten in the top 3 before though therein beating out Banjo at times. Off of the top of my head he was first in the big Reddit DLC poll with Banjo getting third and I think got second or third behind Sora and Rex in a Japanese poll.

Yeah, he's really the last major popular pick left for the DLC slot. He'll either make one of the last two slots, or we'll have to wait until next game I suppose.

I really don't see how, given almost every major fan favorite has made either the main roster or DLC so far, that Geno wouldn't barring something horrible happening.

I suppose we'll see by the end of the year. I believe he'll make it in, though. We've made it this far.

 

[GrungeMan]

My dude (or dudette), if KOS-MOS gets in, this fighters pass would be catered to me BIG time. Also I agree that IF Namco gets another fighter, it would be someone different than what is expected. Plus, KOS-MOS would be a technical double whammy. Namco AND Monolith Soft rep rolled up in one.

You have good taste btw lol

Thank you!

Also, I agree with your post above. While Tekken surely is an inevitability it seems as though guest characters truly are "brand new." Xeno as a series in smash isn't just a smart, strategic move for generating interest in Xenoblade Chronicles, but it's also a chance for Namco to utilize it's cross-over queen once more.

The appeal may not be immediately obvious among fans, but I believe the appeal is there strongly between Namco and Nintendo as companies.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Geno has definitely topped polls and gotten in the top 3 before though therein beating out Banjo at times. Off of the top of my head he was first in the big Reddit DLC poll with Banjo getting third and I think got second or third behind Sora and Rex in a Japanese poll.



Hey nice this is very similar to what I brought up a while ago in terms of some trailers being continuations of previous ones.

https://smashboards.com/threads/geno-♪-return-of-the-starsend-savior-come-on-lets-get-this-show-on-the-road-geno-dlc.446378/page-988#post-23390664

This would actually fit better than what I was thinking for Geno than just him fitting into the WoL spirit stuff. I do think it's super conspicuous that Mario of all characters hasn't really shown up in any of the trailers outside of Ridley's, and neither has Megaman even though both showed up several times during the Smash 4 cinematics. It also really did seem at the time like the Samus vs Ridley face off would get some sort of continuation with the fade to white ending of it and we haven't gotten that yet. It would make total sense for the continuation of that to be the final reveal of the FP if they did in fact plan all these cinematics well in advance which they obviously needed to. Also if any characters were going to be chosen to connect to Geno other than Rosalina those three would make the most sense. Mario for obvious reason, Megaman for their weapon-type/fighting similarities, and Samus loosely because she's from space and Geno's star connection.

I genuinely don't know of any poll in which both Geno and Banjo Kazooie are featured, but Geno has actually won out over Banjo Kazooie. You'll have to show me the ones you're talking about. I've seen Banjo Kazooie not show up on some older polls because he wasn't considered viable as a candidate, or even downright thrown out as impossible in the same way I've seen polls throw out characters like Goku for being a "troll pick" or "impossible."

Also, we've been through the whole trying to make the cinematic trailers mean something too many times already when we didn't know what Spirits meant and when people were determined to find some deeper story that never actually existed with them in relation to Ultimate's campaign. Those trailers have always been designed around the specific aesthetics of the character coming in. The Samus vs Ridley face off wasn't supposed to go anywhere, it was just a neat demonstration of Samus and Ridley as absolute rivals and that Samus would fight even when her power suit was destroyed and then flow into a release date drop. Most of the trailers have little teases at the end and in references. Banjo Kazooie stealing the pancakes was a reference to Tooie. Incineroar was just fighting with other characters that were known to have boxing gloves since he's a wrestler. I find it incredibly unlikely that these minor little details are going to add to anything.

The singular connection any trailer has to another is the Banjo Kazooie to King K. Rool trailer, and that's genuinely just because they're both heavily requested Rare icons that you can have some fun with and it makes sense for them to all be there.

Also, Mario appeared at the end of Banjo's trailer and was also among the silhouettes in Joker's trailer from The Game Awards, so he has actually shown up multiple times beyond the Ridley reveal trailer. Mario doesn't fit super well into any other newcomer trailer either (I guess he didn't for Ridley either, but a good way to show off Ridley's brutality is just to have him straight up kill Mario since he's such a big icon). There's just not been a lot of places to naturally put him this DLC and these trailers have generally focused less on the all-star cast aspect of the Smash 4 trailers overall.

 

[Wish7s]

Hey guys! I'm streaming Mario RPG right now, just started a new play through if anyone wants to come hang out https://twitch.tv/wish7s

 

[Datboigeno]

I genuinely don't know of any poll in which both Geno and Banjo Kazooie are featured, but Geno has actually won out over Banjo Kazooie. You'll have to show me the ones you're talking about. I've seen Banjo Kazooie not show up on some older polls because he wasn't considered viable as a candidate, or even downright thrown out as impossible in the same way I've seen polls throw out characters like Goku for being a "troll pick" or "impossible."

Also, we've been through the whole trying to make the cinematic trailers mean something too many times already when we didn't know what Spirits meant and when people were determined to find some deeper story that never actually existed with them in relation to Ultimate's campaign. Those trailers have always been designed around the specific aesthetics of the character coming in. The Samus vs Ridley face off wasn't supposed to go anywhere, it was just a neat demonstration of Samus and Ridley as absolute rivals and that Samus would fight even when her power suit was destroyed and then flow into a release date drop. Most of the trailers have little teases at the end and in references. Banjo Kazooie stealing the pancakes was a reference to Tooie. Incineroar was just fighting with other characters that were known to have boxing gloves since he's a wrestler. I find it incredibly unlikely that these minor little details are going to add to anything.

The singular connection any trailer has to another is the Banjo Kazooie to King K. Rool trailer, and that's genuinely just because they're both heavily requested Rare icons that you can have some fun with and it makes sense for them to all be there.

Also, Mario appeared at the end of Banjo's trailer and was also among the silhouettes in Joker's trailer from The Game Awards, so he has actually shown up multiple times beyond the Ridley reveal trailer. Mario doesn't fit super well into any other newcomer trailer either (I guess he didn't for Ridley either, but a good way to show off Ridley's brutality is just to have him straight up kill Mario since he's such a big icon). There's just not been a lot of places to naturally put him this DLC and these trailers have generally focused less on the all-star cast aspect of the Smash 4 trailers overall.

I was mistaken about the Reddit poll because as Banjo got 1st and Geno got 2nd. The Japanese poll I'm referring to is this one:

https://twitter.com/bandanadeessbu/status/1066302033207136257

Your view on the cinematics is really a lot of your own assumptions. You don't actually know that the Ridley cinematic isn't going anywhere further. We at least have two more trailers to go. The Hero trailer most definitely is a continuation of the story trailer of WoL and the circumstances depicted there plus with the Banjo one there is a precedent. That's different than trying to figure out what Spirits mean or whatever. The little in-game pancake scene for the end of Banjo's trailer is a totally different situation than the actual CGI cinematics at the end of Ridley's.

Also it's disingenuous to say that Mario being present at the end of Banjo's trailer in his in-game model with everyone else and showing up in the animated Joker trailer is the same as something like K. Rool being back in DK's treehouse in the Banjo trailer. The first was more of a meta-everyone being happy Banjo is back. They weren't physically there in that scene/story playing out. The Joker trailer was on the level of the Isabelle trailer as being separate from the CGI cinematics.

 

[ForsakenM]

Hey guys! I will be streaming Banjo-Kazooie tomorrow!

The question is, what time would work for you guys? I'm aiming for the AM, but you guys are the ones interested so I'd liek to see what times are best for you and then see what I can managed to do to fit around that.

 

[GrungeMan]

Honestly, between color, mii costume, trailer continuation, and my silly 7 star dlc theory I feel like just throwing my blind support behind the idea Geno is bonus dlc just for fun.

Banjo-Kazooie getting in is a huge buffer for setting my expecations too high and for failure, so I'm perfectly fine with believing Sakurai has something special planned for our star boy and I'm perfectly fine with that ending up not being the case.

You heard it here first folks, I'm 100% in on Geno being bonus DLC.

Keep the Geno dream alive!

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I was mistaken about the Reddit poll because as Banjo got 1st and Geno got 2nd. The Japanese poll I'm referring to is this one:

https://twitter.com/bandanadeessbu/status/1066302033207136257

Your view on the cinematics is really a lot of your own assumptions. You don't actually know that the Ridley cinematic isn't going anywhere further. We at least have two more trailers to go. The Hero trailer most definitely is a continuation of the story trailer of WoL and the circumstances depicted there plus with the Banjo one there is a precedent. That's different than trying to figure out what Spirits mean or whatever. The little in-game pancake scene for the end of Banjo's trailer is a totally different situation than the actual CGI cinematics at the end of Ridley's.

Also it's disingenuous to say that Mario being present at the end of Banjo's trailer in his in-game model with everyone else and showing up in the animated Joker trailer is the same as something like K. Rool being back in DK's treehouse in the Banjo trailer. The first was more of a meta-everyone being happy Banjo is back. They weren't physically there in that scene/story playing out. The Joker trailer was on the level of the Isabelle trailer as being separate from the CGI cinematics.

The poll you're referencing has 986 votes total. That's extremely low to do work with and also I find it strange in the original article the Tweet links to that Banjo Kazooie's name doesn't come up at all in the extra section (the Hero from Dragon Quest also funnily enough does show up). I do know the Reddit poll you're referring to and at least that one certainly has a much higher sample size to work with. My point stands though that Banjo Kazooie has generally dominated every poll he's been a part of. I'm not trying to disprove Geno's popularity in polls, I'm just stating his general trends showed him outperforming Geno with a lot of consistency.

As for the trailers. There's zero indication that Ridley's trailer will continue on to anything else. It functions as a complete trailer on its own. All the Zero Suit Samus attack was supposed to reveal was as the followup to Ridley using the Final Smash on Samus in the trailer, which makes sense given that Zero Suit is a character is also playable. Sure, I don't know that there isn't a followup, I can't inherently prove that something doesn't exist. But Occam's Razor will absolutely dictate that a simpler explanation of it acting like a small followup of fan service makes more sense than conspiracy theories on what these reveal trailers mean.

Hero wasn't a continuation of anything in specific either. World of Light is a aesthetic of the game, and Dragon Quest revolves entirely around a very traditional light vs dark motif and how you bring light to the world. Thus, it makes perfect sense to use the Dharkon themes in the trailer where the versions of Hero fight the darkness to achieve victory. There's no real place for connective tissue there either, as it would have to serve as a followup to World of Light completely, and both Dharkon and Galeem are canonically destroyed at the end of the mode. That fits Dragon Quest specifically well to just use that.

Banjo's trailer following up on King K. Rool's also exists for the specific reasons I've laid out and the similarities they share as inclusions. The one followup trailer does not allow us to say there is precedent on the issue. We would need to see others that legitimately follow up past trailers to determine if a pattern exists, or if this is entirely a one off. And again, with the specifics of King K. Rool and Banjo Kazooie in mind, the decision to connect their trailers makes a great deal more sense than any other situation.

Mario still appeared outside of pure in game footage in Banjo's trailer, and Joker's absolutely counts and likely constitutes more effort than Isabelle's trailer overall. It's as legitimate of a trailer as the rest of them, it's just done in a different style than the CGI of many. Much like Little Mac and Palutena had unique trailers in animation style, Joker had a unique animation style that directly paralleled elements of Persona 5 for his official announcement at the TGAs. I don't think it's disingenuous to bring up either of those examples. I'm not saying it's the same thing as the connection of King K. Rool and DK to Banjo, but I was disputing your statement about Mario not showing up in other trailers.

I just don't see any compelling evidence to do a thing with the trailers we've seen from Ultimate.

 

[valkiriforce]

I don't think it's set in stone that anything is going to continue from those trailers or not with the last two DLC fighters, it's just a possibility and a fun theory to consider. I do think it's interesting to see Mega Man, Samus and that Geno Mii outfit together in that Smash 4 presentation; it'd be great to see that become a reality this time around. After all, Sakurai wanted to at least give us something then, I really hope he can pull through this time around.

 

[AugustusB]

I don't think it's set in stone that anything is going to continue from those trailers or not with the last two DLC fighters, it's just a possibility and a fun theory to consider. I do think it's interesting to see Mega Man, Samus and that Geno Mii outfit together in that Smash 4 presentation; it'd be great to see that become a reality this time around. After all, Sakurai wanted to at least give us something then, I really hope he can pull through this time around.

Yeah, with nothing to tie us over now that the Square Rep (The Hero) and an actual Microsoft Rep (Banjo) were announced, we have nothing but time.

Until the next hint, credible leaker or datamine gives us something to go off on, all we have is our imaginations and time. Sometimes, it could come to fruition. Always thought/hoped if Banjo and Kazooie were announced, they would have Diddy in the reveal trailer in some fashion.

Also, did Sakurai state that not all the reveals would be to the caliber of Joker? I might have mis-remembered, but I am certain he said that. So what did he mean? Was it because it was an animation? I honestly took his wording as "Do not expect a big budget like trailer for all the DLC fighters. This is a one time deal. Enjoy the in game trailers from here on". That is just me, but I am curious what others thought.

 

[REZERO]

Yeah, with nothing to tie us over now that the Square Rep (The Hero) and an actual Microsoft Rep (Banjo) were announced, we have nothing but time.

Until the next hint, credible leaker or datamine gives us something to go off on, all we have is our imaginations and time. Sometimes, it could come to fruition. Always thought/hoped if Banjo and Kazooie were announced, they would have Diddy in the reveal trailer in some fashion.

Also, did Sakurai state that not all the reveals would be to the caliber of Joker? I might have mis-remembered, but I am certain he said that. So what did he mean? Was it because it was an animation? I honestly took his wording as "Do not expect a big budget like trailer for all the DLC fighters. This is a one time deal. Enjoy the in game trailers from here on". That is just me, but I am curious what others thought.

I felt that a lot more work was put into joker compared to the hero and banjo kazooie, those two characters have a lot of moves from other characters but revamped.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I don't think it's set in stone that anything is going to continue from those trailers or not with the last two DLC fighters, it's just a possibility and a fun theory to consider. I do think it's interesting to see Mega Man, Samus and that Geno Mii outfit together in that Smash 4 presentation; it'd be great to see that become a reality this time around. After all, Sakurai wanted to at least give us something then, I really hope he can pull through this time around.

I don't really think there's enough to even call what people are saying a theory. Geno appears next to Samus and Mega Man because they both specifically have blaster arms in that trailer. Then, we have Ridley's trailer and of course you're going to have Samus play a major role in that trailer, so there's no points there. As far as I can tell, this "theory" entirely hinges on the presence of Mega Man as some clue in the Ridley trailer after a throwaway reference to the fact that these three characters all share projectile based weapons on one of their arms.

So, let's entertain the notion of all the pieces of this supposed "theory"

Spoiler: The Steps for This to Work

December 2015 - Sakurai unveils the Geno Mii costume and has him feature alongside Samus and Mega Man.

Early 2018 - Sakurai enters negotiations for Square Enix and walks away with the rights to Dragon Quest and Geno in Smash as two of his proposed five fighters for the Fighter's Pass. He instructs the animators of the Ridley reveal trailer that he has a grand plan and they need to follow his directions for the trailer very carefully.

June 2018 - Sakurai unveils Ridley as the final part of the E3 reveal of Ultimate. He has specifically chosen Mega Man, Samus, and Mario for this trailer in what will be over a year and a half long tease that Geno is coming to Smash. He chose Mega Man specifically because he remembered that he had Samus and Mega Man show up alongside that Mii costume two and a half years prior for a couple of seconds. Because they both showed up alongside the costume, they indicate Geno and Mario seals the deal because he's from Super Mario RPG. He ends the trailer with Zero Suit Samus attacking and leaves it supposedly open ended so that he can eventually do his Geno reveal.

December 2018 - Sakurai makes sure to include Geno and Mallow spirits in the game so nobody gets too suspicious of his master plan to have Geno be one of the final newcomers in Ultimate through DLC. An absent Geno would have revealed this master plan.

Late 2019/Early 2020 - Sakurai finally reveals Geno as the 4th or 5th fighter in a trailer in which he teams up with Zero Suit Samus to defeat Ridley and avenge his fallen Mega Man comrade from the two seconds of screen time they had together in one 2015 presentation and Mario. This has been a plan that has been in the works for what is likely almost two full years at this point to carefully lay down a specific pattern for the reveal of Geno to make complete and logical sense for anyone paying attention to every little detail. All because he's determined to make these character reveal trailers link to one another.

It's one of the greatest long cons pulled off if this is the case. Not only did Sakurai secure the rights to Geno, but he knew immediately how he needed to be revealed and what he needed to connect to so as to tease Geno in Ultimate, all thanks to a throwaway reference in the December 2015 Smash presentation.

OR

Mega Man is the single third party character that Nintendo and Sakurai seem to have the most free reign to do with as they please in trailers for Super Smash Bros. Ultimate seeing as he showed up with one of the lengthier reveals in Smash 4, appeared in the Bowser Jr. trailer, appeared in the reveal for Ridley, and got a literal front row seat to the primary cinematic of World of Light next to Mario. He's the only third party we've seen with this many appearances, and it works out very well for the sake of the Ridley trailer. Having him kill two of gaming's biggest icons in his reveal trailer immediately establishes him as a violent and real threat, concepts that served as the basis for Ridley's entire creation. Not to mention, Mega Man 2 has an infamous fight against a dragon and Mega Man also has one of the most distinct death sounds in the game that can be used in Ridley's trailer. Plus he's a robot so conceivably being stabbed through the chest is less problematic than Mario. He was just a good and convenient pick for the circumstances and the ending with Ridley vs Zero Suit Samus was never meant to lead to anything specific with future trailers. And the reveals for a character two years off at the time of the trailer's conception aren't already inherently decided and built around this first Smash trailer.

I can only suspend my disbelief so far for the sake of Smash theories, and this one seriously pushes any reasonable boundaries of mine in that regard. This is the 4D chess people keep trying to say that Sakurai plays so distinctly all the time and never actually does.