General ICs Q&A Thread

[EverAlert]

I'd say it hovers around 60:40 Snake, it's certainly not 70:30 anymore but it's quite clearly not even. Regardless of that, though, I really love playing the mu, it's quite fun.

 

[swordgard]

I'd say it hovers around 60:40 Snake, it's certainly not 70:30 anymore but it's quite clearly not even. Regardless of that, though, I really love playing the mu, it's quite fun.

It is even : ).

 

[EverAlert]

Hmm, I don't really see how, want to elaborate?

All I know is I beat all but a couple of aussie snakes, I always attributed that to just liking the matchup enough to intuitively be able to play it or something like that though. :S

 

[I SEE YOU]

Ok guys. I know i don't post often, but i've been maining ICs since January and i haven't had this problem until now.. On back throw to down throw characters~ the lightweights (Falco & MK for the most part) After doing back throw to down throw, once popo grabs the opponent nana is attempting to grab? it's like a wierd buffer thing. Sure i can wait until Nana is done being stupid, but it has been throwing off my timing and if i want to be able to infinite ppl that don't suck, i need to be able to grab fairly quickly. Has anyone ever had this problem? I don't think i'm doing the grab any different that i usually do and it's not a controller error (i've tried with another controller and had the same problem). Any help would be appreciated D:

 

[GimR]

Hold Z down when you grab to make her shield

 

[I SEE YOU]

It is even : ).

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^This

Hold Z down when you grab to make her shield

Thank you! It seems so basic, but i was starting you get really frustrated XD

 

[J00sh]

Ok guys. I know i don't post often, but i've been maining ICs since January and i haven't had this problem until now.. On back throw to down throw characters~ the lightweights (Falco & MK for the most part) After doing back throw to down throw, once popo grabs the opponent nana is attempting to grab? it's like a wierd buffer thing. Sure i can wait until Nana is done being stupid, but it has been throwing off my timing and if i want to be able to infinite ppl that don't suck, i need to be able to grab fairly quickly. Has anyone ever had this problem? I don't think i'm doing the grab any different that i usually do and it's not a controller error (i've tried with another controller and had the same problem). Any help would be appreciated D:

Noob here but I had the same problem before. I fixed it with one of two ways;

The first was as suggested to input down when the grab button was pressed to force a shield.

The other was to slightly delay the regrab so that nana doesn't buffer a grab but uses shield unstead (or nothing).

Either way works

 

[Altres]

• I have 2 questions
• Whats the easiest way to grab with Nana?
  
• Is this new? I grabbed with Popo,grab attacked, and before grab release I shielded and c-stick forward,with Nana I pressed z and chaingrab 'til 999%

 

[J00sh]

• I have 2 questions
• Whats the easiest way to grab with Nana?
  
• Is this new? I grabbed with Popo,grab attacked, and before grab release I shielded and c-stick forward,with Nana I pressed z and chaingrab 'til 999%

For your first question I find the grab+back desynch an easy way. The SND supergrab is also nice and easy n_n.

As to your second, I'm not quite sure what you're talking about... could you explain it better?

 

[EverAlert]

Hey guys I think I found something amazing. I discovered that if you press Z, then you grab your opponent, which makes them unable to do anything. Broken! Is this new? n_n

 

[DeLux]

Hey guys I think I found something amazing. I discovered that if you press Z, then you grab your opponent, which makes them unable to do anything. Broken! Is this new? n_n

Censored to prevent troll quoting.

 

[BadKarma]

So idk why but I'm having trouble with wolf. Idk if it's a mental block or what but I was wondering is there anything that you guys have figured out that works well when fighting wolf?
I saw the earlier threads in here talking about wolf but they wernt very helpful lol.
Thanks in advance.

 

[Altres]

Maybe these will help

• He is slower than you
• Don't focus on Chaingrabs
• When you see a shot coming, most likely they'll shoot 3 to 4 times, roll past all of them, and fsmash as soon as you can, remember the gun is kinda laggy.

I hope I helped!

 

[BadKarma]

Maybe these will help

• He is slower than you
• Don't focus on Chaingrabs
• When you see a shot coming, most likely they'll shoot 3 to 4 times, roll past all of them, and fsmash as soon as you can, remember the gun is kinda laggy.

I hope I helped!

When your talking about the laser part are you saying to roll past all of his shots to get in closer to him? I'm not trying to sound rude but wouldn't it be faster to run and perfect shield them then punish?

 

[Altres]

No, better mindgames, also ,you can roll dodge back to confuse your opponent and probably IB if he stops
And also, the perfect shield thing is kinda predictable(I used to main Wolf AND IC'S
EDIT:Ice Climbers are harder to PS due to their 6 frame difference.

 

[BadKarma]

I see what your saying now.
And yes ps is hard but it's the same with projectiles like lasers and arrows and stuff.
Is there anything else you know of?

 

[Altres]

Well, a Wolf will ALWAYS do this:

• Dash
• Shield
• Laser Spam

Most decent/advanced Wolf choose this way of aproaching, especially on SV/FD/ :D

EDIT: Some may go for a grab(mostly noobs), and noobish pros :3

 

[Smoom77]

SDI out of fsmash. please

 

[Altres]

SDI out of fsmash. please

Yeah you could do that, but remember that lag from the gun still is TERRIBLE

 

[DeLux]

EDIT:Ice Climbers are harder to PS due to their 6 frame difference.

This is a misconception. If you are walking forward into a shield, you don't need to powershield with nana.

I disagree with most of the advice as well, but most if it is just my opinion on the matter so I won't bother posting it.

Also, contrary to what you say, Laser spam is a form of camping, not approaching.

 

[BadKarma]

This is a misconception. If you are walking forward into a shield, you don't need to powershield with nana.

I disagree with most of the advice as well, but most if it is just my opinion on the matter so I won't bother posting it.

Also, contrary to what you say, Laser spam is a form of camping, not approaching.

I would like to hear your opinion on the match up :D

 

[DeLux]

You really don't have to approach laser camping. You can IB camp at a positive trade so there really isn't any reason to approach. Wolf's solo dthrow is relatively high and his lack of recovery options makes separation not that huge of an issue (ie a wolf needs to dair spike nana for the gimp, but that leaves him vulnerable to all the latch guarding in the world. At the same time, if you are separated and get a grab, you can solo dthrow him until the cows and nana come home and then cg to death).

Shield grab is your friend. If you condition the wolf correctly, they will either never laser camp or if they do, you can IB chase the laser/IB cancelling into a grab. If you condition them to never laser, DSG is your friend if you HAVE to approach. However, given that Wolf has very limited approaching options in the match up and you CLEARLY outcamp on most levels, you ought to just sit and wait. Pivot/shield grab and punish. Oh, and uair string all day baby.

Watch out for BDACUS and Dsmash which have surprising knockback. Also, Shine really makes blizzard a bad option imo. Learn to bungie jump for gimping. All pretty basic stuff I guess. If someone disagrees help me out because I've only friendlied random wolf's and haven't played a good one in a tournament set.

 

[Teh Future]

too much theorycraft

wolf is dumb, no idea what to do and pretty sure only cat that does is lain but he doesnt post.

wolfs air speed is ******** and he can basically teleport around anything you do and bair xD

 

[toobusytocare]

yeah like when people theory craft wolf they neglact his rediculous airspeed (comparable to warios)

same goes for wario too, especially here
most of you think ICs beat out wario because "LOL pivots grabs" and "ROFL uair and nairs"
but in reality its just not true

 

[DeLux]

Cool thanks for the help guys. I am ONLY theory crafting and not drawing on previous experience I've had from playing.

We really should just give up on all of these match ups because these character's clearly out class ours.

 

[GimR]

There is nothing wrong with theory craft as long as your putting your idea out there so it can be tested and seen if it's actually true. theory craft, however, should never be the basis of an argument.

 

[toobusytocare]

what wolf players do you get this experience from?
just wondering

 

[Teh Future]

Cool thanks for the help guys. I am ONLY theory crafting and not drawing on previous experience I've had from playing.

We really should just give up on all of these match ups because these character's clearly out class ours.

im not sure what the point of this post is. you said yourself you have only played against random wolfs.

i dont think "random wolf mains" should pose a problem to any good ic player because they will get grabbed.

 

[swordgard]

im not sure what the point of this post is. you said yourself you have only played against random wolfs.

i dont think "random wolf mains" should pose a problem to any good ic player because they will get grabbed.

What good wolf main is there really? I don't know of any tbh.

 

[Rubberbandman]

what wolf players do you get this experience from?
just wondering

SeagullMan in MD/VA, also possibly Xzax.

yeah like when people theory craft wolf they neglact his rediculous airspeed (comparable to warios)

same goes for wario too, especially here
most of you think ICs beat out wario because "LOL pivots grabs" and "ROFL uair and nairs"
but in reality its just not true

Bro, why do you keep bringing up Wario? No one said **** about him. =/

 

[swordgard]

SeagullMan in MD/VA, also possibly Xzax.


Bro, why do you keep bringing up Wario? No one said **** about him. =/

Meep losing to bluerogue or something.

 

[DeLux]

what wolf players do you get this experience from?
just wondering

I say "random wolf mains" in the context that I don't remember who I played. I probably would have been more inclined to remember who they were had I been anywhere near losing.

im not sure what the point of this post is. you said yourself you have only played against random wolfs.

i dont think "random wolf mains" should pose a problem to any good ic player because they will get grabbed.

The point is that rather than making any sort of substantial assessments to help advance the level of play, you guys are just falling back on "it's theorycraft and he's too fast so we're screwed". Obviously you guys have input on the match up. Why don't you post something constructive to help rather than tearing down and attempting to leave people with nothing.

This kind of response is exactly why I try to limit my input to technical responses only and not relative value discussions ( aka why I was hesitant to discuss the matchup in the first place).

 

[Teh Future]

i put xD at the end of my post for a reason. It was a joke...

Lux you just need to understand that theorycraft can only take you so far in this game.

i can look at a character and guess what might work against them but that doesnt mean in reality it will. a lot of the times yes, but wolf is a character that not many people really understand fully (me included) so theorycraft isnt just no this doesnt work its no doing this ****s you over and you'll get *****. not to mention that wasnt directed completely at you.

I can either go to midwest-east or midwest-west region where i live. BOTH places have wolf mains that consistently place top 3 in singles. Kain is he best player from IL atm and holms is from kansas. he recently went to texas and split for 1st with UTD zac after beating dphat and other texas players.

so yeah here are definitely good wolf mains. Not that common but at tournaments I go to i do need to worry about this matchup and thats why i keep bringing it up because I dont know what to do. if i could give any input i would

 

[DeLux]

Haha, fair enough man. I'm seriously debating on skipping work and heading out to StL this weekend just to hit your tournament. Would really love to sit down and talk some IC's with you and Hylian. But that's if I can get off work =\

 

[J00sh]

I have two three questions;

How does one bungee jump? (a vid would be helpful)

When is bungee jumping useful? (How should I use it?)

And finally, how does one ensure that they don't sweet spot the ledge when recovering using belay? (so that popo doesn't get ***** by metaknight in the lag before the pull up animation)


Thanks guys, I appreciate any help you can give me.

 

[Rubberbandman]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-RHxha0VX4

 

[J00sh]

Thanks heaps n_n. Just the last question now;

How do I avoid auto-sweet spotting when recovering using belay (so metaknight doesn't **** popo)

 

[Rubberbandman]

Don't belay stupidly.

 

[Smoom77]

If you have to belay to recover, don't do it after a jump. A falling belay could get you out of the reach of him. Jumped belay gets you closer to the stage so he can attack you more easily.

 

[Hylian]

Haha, fair enough man. I'm seriously debating on skipping work and heading out to StL this weekend just to hit your tournament. Would really love to sit down and talk some IC's with you and Hylian. But that's if I can get off work =\

Do it!!!! Lain and Atomsk are going as well, and Rauleen is making lots of cookies/baked goods .