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Social General Ice Climber Chat

Darkshooter

Darkshooter

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 8, 2010
Messages
505
Location
Guess.
^Im gonna sound like a really big noob, but how do you bait with the Ice Climbers?

Ive found that when I play with them against Fox, I found that it can be epically close.
 
Binx

Binx

Smash Master
Joined
Jul 19, 2006
Messages
4,038
Location
Portland, Oregon
GrimFandango said:
Wave-dash in and out with ftilt or utilt depending on the match-up and de-synch blizzards/blocks.
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No.

How you bait with ice climbers is by doing autocanceled uairs bairs and feigning movement when you are close enough that they think they can punish but cant, you can wavedash in place also that can sometimes get people to move or shield when they wouldnt. Also shielding can be a good bait, if you *know* they will try and grab you can spot dodge it, or if you know it will make them change positions you can wavedash out of shield roll or short hop attack or just let it drop and run whichever way your want, all of these are situationally fine and situationally dangerous so as long as you dont overuse any one movement trick you shouldnt get predicted. I guess sometimes desyced blocks could work too even though I said no, same with blizzards, its just you usually have to be so far away when they happen that they aren't typically useful.

If you watch wobbles he will waveland on the platform above him and just drop back through trying to bait an overextension from his opponent. Speaking of wobbles, did he die immediately after becoming a mod?
 
Binx

Binx

Smash Master
Joined
Jul 19, 2006
Messages
4,038
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Portland, Oregon
GrimFandango said:
Sorry, I read his post as "How do you approach as ICs"
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np, imo ics shouldnt be making blind approaches, really no character should but ICs have a lot more difficult time of it than say Fox Falcon or the master of aggression, Falco. ICs dont have the control and speed needed to do those aggressive rush downs that the higher tier characters are capable of or the range to zone off the stage, ice climbers rely a lot on creating pressure with their presence but not necessarily attacking which we do really well because if we did attack and they didn't react they would die in a single grab or die to something that leads into a grab like a wavedash forward tilt that knocks them over and then they get techchased into a grab by us and die.

This is how i think ice climbers are played most effectively, you zone in to a place where you can pressure by just being there, even in your shield people think twice cause if they miss that l cancel they die, if they jump and we predict it they die, if they roll they get grabbed and they die, if they stand still too long and we get a grab they die, if they jab and we shield grab they die. After this you just pay attention to their movement and catch them offguard with something and make it really count, follow up, know when you cant follow up and what they can do in the middle that could end the combo but if you predict that you can keep it going.

This is how i play my Ice Climbers, its not that I never blindly attack, because I do, but i make my best effort to really wait for it to try and make it unexpected when it does happen. I believe this is how Wobbles plays his iceclimbers, and I believe in a very extreme way its how plur plays ics. Chu did something similar to this except he didn't really rely on the hard punishment that wobbles does, he just continually predicted people. I believe wobble's method is way sexier because you get bonus fear at all times protecting you from the types of aggression ICs aren't always capable of handling.
 
S

Smasher89

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 4, 2005
Messages
1,936
Location
Sweden
IC probably has one of the most fearsome aggression styles though. Space some kind of desynch to make Nana charge a smash close to your opponent while Popo for example are shielding. They gets forced to act, and shield means grab, hit means hit> grab, roll/spotdodge should get punished so yea, they can be played with "safe and very threatening aggression".
Double teaming the opponents options.
 
PB&J

PB&J

Smash Hero
Joined
Apr 25, 2007
Messages
5,758
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lawrenceville, GA
Smasher89 said:
IC probably has one of the most fearsome aggression styles though. Space some kind of desynch to make Nana charge a smash close to your opponent while Popo for example are shielding. They gets forced to act, and shield means grab, hit means hit> grab, roll/spotdodge should get punished so yea, they can be played with "safe and very threatening aggression".
Double teaming the opponents options.
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^^^^..this..i always thought icy's approach was pretty good if u mix it up
 
choknater

choknater

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Modesto, CA
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choknater
yeah its pretty good haha, its just hard to know when to approach. if i wanna play aggressively i just rely on instinct
 
Wobbles

Wobbles

Desert ******
BRoomer
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
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2,881
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Not dead, just busy with work and other random stuff. Haven't really touched smash related anything except for TO6 where I did.... not good. Sorry for the absence ;D

That tournament made me start training like a maniac though. My technical consistency has always been my biggest weakness, so I decided I'm going to turn it into my biggest strength instead, even if I have to dig my own basement just so I can practice in it.
 
voorhese

voorhese

Smash Master
Joined
Dec 22, 2007
Messages
3,389
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Decatur, IN
2 things, if u desynch ( i use roll for this) and use nana's iceblock, and right as soon as he animation starts, but b4 she shoots it, you walk behind her, the ice block shoots behind her to....

2nd thing: if fox i find it easier to chain grab him with a dthrow(popo) -> jab (nana) -> regrab (popo (while fox is falling))
this also seems to work vs puff, im not sure about the timing yet, i can do it sometimes...what happens is when puff gets hit by the jab, he doesnt go into the air that high, and he has hit stun, so u can regrab him as if u where using dair on like fox or falcon etc.


edit: to lazy to see if these have been found yet or not.

double edit: i havent tried this with other moves yet, (1st thing) but if it works with say nana's blizzard it may be a nice little free grab.
 
Grim Tuesday

Grim Tuesday

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Nov 4, 2007
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I'm sure other IC players have seen this before and know how to pull it off, but I was just wondering what the deal is with Nana doing a retreating dash attack? It sometimes happens to me when I grab with Popo and Nana is off doing her own thing, I try to get her to come in with a dash attack or smash or whatever and she does the dash attack animation, but leaps away from me.
 
Vts

Vts

Smash Champion
Joined
Sep 10, 2007
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Loser's Semis vs ihavespaceballs
CA5H said:
how do i beat link? his nair wrecks me and u cant cg him w/ dthrow.
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Speed write up for this.

_things to use_
- desync ice blocks and nana pults keep a campy link from using to many projectiles and allows u to get closer and grab
- u-airs links approuches are either from above or sides get under him and **** him for his bad hit boxes
-grabs at good %, link can die really easily, once he is off the stage edge guarding him is simple with iceblocks desyncs and bair.

_things to avoid/not do_
-Spamming d-smash is good but against link he is in the air a lot and if he is on the ground his sword/jabs give u some problems with getting in.
-link is going to throw/use a lot of projectiles, punish his really laggy movs (boomerang if it misses, bombs if he is pulling it out).
-don't challenge link in the air if you are above or beside him , his hit boxes are bigger than your and broken (he can do another nair before his first nair's hitbox is over), u can challenge it only if you can space bairs (its what i do against links and works amazing).
-watch out for his up-b, a smart link will bait you and get you with it more often than you think, which brings me to the second part, don't save nana unless your 100% sure u can't be punished links up-b stops u from living from from own up-b if nana misses him.(stupid spike)

can't think of much more right now.

my link experience is fighting germ a little bit at gensis, NES's link (before he died), and chad's link
 
Fly_Amanita

Fly_Amanita

Master of Caribou
Joined
Aug 24, 2007
Messages
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Claremont, CA
Also, light-shield projectiles so they don't shield-poke you.

Link doesn't have a great approach, so you can afford to play pretty passively. Try not to rush him down too much, because Link is also pretty good at dealing with the ICs' approaches.
 
ChivalRuse

ChivalRuse

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 13, 2007
Messages
8,413
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College Park, MD
A lot of Links randomly forward smash or up-b when they think you'll wavedash at them. It's important that you recognize these situations and bait his laggy attacks rather than rush in impatiently.
 
StealthyGunnar

StealthyGunnar

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
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West St. Paul, MN
ya my friend plays link. he spams up b on the ground a lot, so ive noticed that i can bait, wait for up b, then wavedash in and grab. then headbutt blizzard dsmash crap.
 
Binx

Binx

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Joined
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Messages
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Plur i think your too aggressive, if those are friendlies thats fine but especially when in the lead as sopo you should try and work hard to find openings rather than just attack at people. I like your continuous desynchs i've never seen that sort of playstyle before so its really interesting to watch, at the same time I think you over do it, its more important to have consistently good spacing for most of the match and throw out those desynchs when your already pressuring from good position.
 
Grim Tuesday

Grim Tuesday

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Nov 4, 2007
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Adelaide, South Australia, AUS
Binx said:
Plur i think your too aggressive, if those are friendlies thats fine but especially when in the lead as sopo you should try and work hard to find openings rather than just attack at people. I like your continuous desynchs i've never seen that sort of playstyle before so its really interesting to watch, at the same time I think you over do it, its more important to have consistently good spacing for most of the match and throw out those desynchs when your already pressuring from good position.
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I agree with the continuous de-synchs being awesome. I learn so much from watching you guys playing :3

P*L*U*R: De-Synch Skillz
Wobbles: Grab Skillz
Fly Amanita: Spacing Skillz
ChuDat: Nostalgia xD
Choknater: Combo Skillz
 
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