Ganondorf

[Smash G]

I just want a Ganondorf with a unique moveset. No more of this clone of Captain Falcon crap. There is SO MUCH to draw from since he's been a boss so many times and had so many different attacks.

And I'd hope one would be his classic giant energy ball that is sadly easily reflected . Maybe it's quite powerful, homes into targets a fair amount, charges but normal smash attacks can reflect the thing (then you can just reflect it back).

Idunno there's a million things they can do.

 

[HatsuneMiku]

Ghirahim was in 1 game and somehow takes precedence over the main, recurring villain of the series? He was no even in the better Zelda games and not even a final boss. Honestly, people who want Ghirahim over ANY final bosses would be a slap in the franchise's face.

All the Ghirahim support is just history repeating itself, remember when everyone wanted Zant in Brawl? Yeah look what happened, nobody even remembers Zant anymore. And the same will happen to Ghirahim, just watch.

 

[Man Li Gi]

Hopefully.

 

[RelaxAlax]

I'm kind of scared of Ghirahim because of the trend of popular new gen characters. I feel if he's somehow in the next Zelda (dual E3 reveal?) then he'd be in, but isn't he, like, dead?

As for Ganondorf, honestly with what we've been seen in the direct, a LOT of veterans are getting rehauled, and if he doesn't that'd be blasphemous at this point.

So, what will change? Will Sakurai listen to the pleas of giving him a sword, akin to how he gave DK a roll?

Honestly, given Ganondorfs cunning and pure evil nature, I can see him assorting punches and kicks alongside his sword wielding attacks. I feel if they stylized him with a mix or Oot and WW he'd look insanely badass. Old, but thick and powerful. And perhaps a dual sword could work. I feel like we'll get Link, Zelda and Shiek for the Zelda Category and Link, Tetra and Ganondorf from WW for the Toon category (just a thought, i can see Sakurai doing something like that).

I'm just really excited to see how he is. Hopefully in this game, when I play him I'll feel like a badass haha

 

[Sonicguy726]

I'm kind of scared of Ghirahim because of the trend of popular new gen characters. I feel if he's somehow in the next Zelda (dual E3 reveal?) then he'd be in, but isn't he, like, dead?

As for Ganondorf, honestly with what we've been seen in the direct, a LOT of veterans are getting rehauled, and if he doesn't that'd be blasphemous at this point.

So, what will change? Will Sakurai listen to the pleas of giving him a sword, akin to how he gave DK a roll?

Honestly, given Ganondorfs cunning and pure evil nature, I can see him assorting punches and kicks alongside his sword wielding attacks. I feel if they stylized him with a mix or Oot and WW he'd look insanely badass. Old, but thick and powerful. And perhaps a dual sword could work. I feel like we'll get Link, Zelda and Shiek for the Zelda Category and Link, Tetra and Ganondorf from WW for the Toon category (just a thought, i can see Sakurai doing something like that).

I'm just really excited to see how he is. Hopefully in this game, when I play him I'll feel like a badass haha

You no what I can 100% say ghirahim will never appear in a zelda game again unless they decided to make a SS sequel which they probably never will

 

[RelaxAlax]

You no what I can 100% say ghirahim will never appear in a zelda game again unless they decided to make a SS sequel which they probably never will

I know, I know he shouldn't appear again, but if there's a likeness for the character anything can happen. I seriously hope he's done with though and we get the new Ganondorf in the new Zelda. I think that would be awesome.

 

[Sonicguy726]

I know, I know he shouldn't appear again, but if there's a likeness for the character anything can happen. I seriously hope he's done with though and we get the new Ganondorf in the new Zelda. I think that would be awesome.

It's been 3 years, no one cares about ghirahim anymore

 

[RelaxAlax]

Same could have been said about Rosalina frankly, but I hope you're right. He feels like a one and done like Zant anyways.

 

[Sonicguy726]

Same could have been said about Rosalina frankly, but I hope you're right. He feels like a one and done like Zant anyways.

Although that twilight princess sequel could happen and with rosalina there aren't like 10 other mario characters that could have easily taken her place, change ghirahim to uga and it wouldn't make a difference

 

[Smash G]

Ghirahim is cool and I'd love to see him but since he's (so far) a one off I doubt it greatly. He's IMO the best single off since Majora/Skull Kid but unlike them he's a bit modern.

Saying he won't appear again is premature. He was that dark sword (forget the same of the sword if it had one). I'd say it's very possible he's not dead but he might be just in sword form trapped somewhere like where that last battle with Demise took place. So there's always the potential for a return.

What about Demise? He is basically Ganondorf. Just his earlier incarnation or something (I don't think reincarnation has been confirmed in Zelda so maybe Ganondorf just harbors the dead Demise's hatred and power, like all the Links have the past Link's courage and stuff). If Ghirhim has any chance Demise could too.

 

[Sonicguy726]

Ghirahim is cool and I'd love to see him but since he's (so far) a one off I doubt it greatly. He's IMO the best single off since Majora/Skull Kid but unlike them he's a bit modern.

Saying he won't appear again is premature. He was that dark sword (forget the same of the sword if it had one). I'd say it's very possible he's not dead but he might be just in sword form trapped somewhere like where that last battle with Demise took place. So there's always the potential for a return.

What about Demise? He is basically Ganondorf. Just his earlier incarnation or something (I don't think reincarnation has been confirmed in Zelda so maybe Ganondorf just harbors the dead Demise's hatred and power, like all the Links have the past Link's courage and stuff). If Ghirhim has any chance Demise could too.

He's too modern, In my opinion his time has passed he hasn't been relevant since 2011, three years ago

 

[RelaxAlax]

Basically, if Aonuma wanted to bring Ghirahim back as a reoccurring character, it could happen. The best chance he has is if at E3 the new Zelda is shown and he is in the trailer. That's, imo, the only way he'd have a shot.

It's loosely refered to that Demise is the precursor to Ganon:

"Though this is not the end. My hate... never perishes. It is born anew in a cycle with no end! I will rise again! Those like you... Those who share the blood of the goddess and the spirit of the hero... They are eternally bound to this curse. An incarnation of my hatred shall ever follow your kind, dooming them to wander a blood-soaked sea of darkness for all time!"

Suffice to say, they share similarities in their model. Also, Demises 'residual consciousness' is absorbed into the master sword. Tbh, i never liked Demises model because it's so cliche but i guess it's the epitomy of evil and Ganon is the partial rebirth of it (Like King Piccolo to Piccolo LOL)

 

[Sonicguy726]

Basically, if Aonuma wanted to bring Ghirahim back as a reoccurring character, it could happen. The best chance he has is if at E3 the new Zelda is shown and he is in the trailer. That's, imo, the only way he'd have a shot.

It's loosely refered to that Demise is the precursor to Ganon:

"Though this is not the end. My hate... never perishes. It is born anew in a cycle with no end! I will rise again! Those like you... Those who share the blood of the goddess and the spirit of the hero... They are eternally bound to this curse. An incarnation of my hatred shall ever follow your kind, dooming them to wander a blood-soaked sea of darkness for all time!"

Suffice to say, they share similarities in their model. Also, Demises 'residual consciousness' is absorbed into the master sword. Tbh, i never liked Demises model because it's so cliche but i guess it's the epitomy of evil and Ganon is the partial rebirth of it (Like King Piccolo to Piccolo LOL)

I still think Zelda U is gonna be twilight princess 2

 

[RelaxAlax]

I still think Zelda U is gonna be twilight princess 2

I'm not sure how it'll go. I feel like it'll be like the 1st game on NES in 3D and with more story elements. The theme, I have no clue.

 

[Smash G]

I'll call it. No way in fudgey fudge town is the Wii U Zelda going to be Twilight Princess 2.

 

[Sonicguy726]

I'll call it. No way in fudgey fudge town is the Wii U Zelda going to be Twilight Princess 2.

I think it has a chance it's the only game in the series that doesn't have a sequel and the zelda tech demo looked very similar to TP, also smash 4 is still using TP designs even though they had 2 options to update it to (SS and OoT3D)

 

[praline]

I hope not TP was a terrible game.

 

[Smash G]

I think it has a chance it's the only game in the series that doesn't have a sequel and the zelda tech demo looked very similar to TP, also smash 4 is still using TP designs even though they had 2 options to update it to (SS and OoT3D)

Smash 4 is using the Skyward Sword design. I'd look again.

 

[Sonicguy726]

I hope not TP was a terrible game.

In you're opinion, tons of people liked it

Smash 4 is using the Skyward Sword design. I'd look again.

I think you need to get you're eyes checked
first of all look at links bombs and boomerang, TP
his arm gauntlet things TP
his sword and shield, TP
His tunic, TP
His boots and pants, TP
It's twilight princess link with brighter colours because of smash 4's art style

EDIT: Also TP Zelda and pretty soon ganondorf aswell as TP concept art sheik

 

[TumblrFamous]

Smash 4 is using TP designs for Link and Zelda, just with more primary characters (like what they're doing for every character). They're TP, but brighter.

This might have been to give Ganondorf a consistent design with the rest of his Triforce Gang. But regardless, I 100% see him getting an overhauled moveset. With more character changes, it only makes sense.

 

[Sonicguy726]

Smash 4 is using TP designs for Link and Zelda, just with more primary characters (like what they're doing for every character). They're TP, but brighter.

This might have been to give Ganondorf a consistent design with the rest of his Triforce Gang. But regardless, I 100% see him getting an overhauled moveset. With more character changes, it only makes sense.

Although the most recent game with all 3 is OoT3D, so it would make sense to use those designs, plus it's arguably the most popular game in the series and where most of zelda's moves came from

 

[Kamiko]

Not sure what happened to that argument while I was gone, but it was supposed be about one sword vs two swords. If Ganondorf is to one-hand a single sword, I'd definately want him to fight similarly to Gwyn:

Only with magic added in of course.

 

[Sonicguy726]

Not sure what happened to that argument while I was gone, but it was suposed be about one sword vs two swords. If Ganondorf is to one-hand a single sword, I'd definately want him to fight similarly to Gwyn:

Only with magic added in of course.

Well unless we somehow get WW ganondorf I'd say it'll be 1 sword

 

[Kamiko]

Well unless we somehow get WW ganondorf I'd say it'll be 1 sword

I don't see why the visual design has to affect what the character does.

 

[Sonicguy726]

I don't see why the visual design has to affect what the character does.

Because wind waker ganondorf is the only one that has 2 swords

 

[Kamiko]

Because wind waker ganondorf is the only one that has 2 swords

It's the same person though. Plenty of people would like to see him wield a trident, despite that combination never happening in the games thus far. There's nothing stopping any particular Ganondorf from picking up any particular weapon. The Phantom actually being Zelda's new down B for some reason supports this.

 

[Sonicguy726]

It's the same person though. Plenty of people would like to see him wield a trident, despite that combination never happening in the games thus far. There's nothing stopping any particular Ganondorf from picking up any particular weapon. The Phantom actually being Zelda's new down B for some reason supports this.

But since we are gonna get TP ganondorf and he used that twilight sword and it'd be weird if he had 2

 

[Kamiko]

But since we are gonna get TP ganondorf and he used that twilight sword and it'd be weird if he had 2

If you mean a copy of the sages' sword then yeah, that wouldn't make any sense. But I don't see why he can't just have another sword of an original design like the Spaceworld demo sword. In fact it could BE that sword and I wouldn't have a problem with it as long as it was scaled down.

Keep in mind we probably won't have TP Ganondorf forever. I'm thinking of future games as well, not just this one.

EDIT: Replace the rightmost Ganondorf's tux with something he'd actually wear:

Spoiler

How would that not be awesome?

 

[Knuckles the Knuckles]

I hope Ganondorf has a unique moveset this time around, based around his swords and magic. I mean sure, he did display some basic martial arts knowledge in WW, but his 3D boss fights always involved swords and spells, so having him as a straight-up clone of Cap. Falcon was always hilarious to me for all the wrong reasons. The only melee atack I can image him having would be the OOT ground slam as a Down B, maybe have it emit a short-distance shockwave that stuns enemies. Honestly, I would preffer the design to be the WW one, maybe reworked a little bit to be more ,,realistic'' akin to TP style of Link and Zelda but keeping the basic idea of the design intact. I would be happy with anything realy, as long as hes not a clone.

 

[TeamFlareZakk]

I remember from the start hoping Ghirahim wasn't going to be added unless he was a trophy, assist trophy, boss character, something that includes him, but he's not a playable character, like how we finally got Skull Kid and Midna included as Assist Trophies.

Ganondorf is too important to Nintendo to not include in Super Smash Bros.

I'm really looking forward to doing Isaac vs Ganondorf, so I also hope Isaac makes it, if Isaac thought Agatio was too strong when he pwned him with Rising Dragon, then wait till Isaac faces Ganondorf, this will be a bigger challenge to Isaac than Dullahan.

 

[Diddy Kong]

If Sheik has got some moveset revamps, there's now 0 excuses not to revamp Ganondorf greatly!

 

[Hong]

Where the **** is Ganny.

They hinted that they will be talking about the customizable moves, so I assume that will be another preview/direct. With e3 coming, we're sure to get something, and hopefully that means more veteran profiles.

 

[Morbi]

If Sheik has got some moveset revamps, there's now 0 excuses not to revamp Ganondorf greatly!

That is true to an extent; however, one of her moves had to be changed as they omitted transformation characters. There was also the Greninja reveal; I feel as though he wanted to differentiate her slightly. I expect some changes to Ganondorf, I just don't necessarily agree with that logic.

 

[Xzsmmc]

Where the **** is Ganny.

They hinted that they will be talking about the customizable moves, so I assume that will be another preview/direct. With e3 coming, we're sure to get something, and hopefully that means more veteran profiles.

It's possible he may be a secret character. He has been the past two games. Though showing a revamped Big G at E3 would be an excellent hype builder.

 

[Z1GMA]

If Sheik has got some moveset revamps, there's now 0 excuses not to revamp Ganondorf greatly!

Exciting, isn't it.

 

[praline]

Man I had this argument with someone who thought that hilariously Ganondorf wasn't gonna return because Zelda(and Mario and Pokemon) was only gonna have 4 reps.

 

[Banjodorf]

Man I had this argument with someone who thought that hilariously Ganondorf wasn't gonna return because Zelda(and Mario and Pokemon) was only gonna have 4 reps.

Y'know, with those 4 reps Mario has right now.

Anyway. My hopes for Gdorf this time around are that in addition to stuff that's specific to him, like the sparta kick, choke slam, etc. he actually, finally, legitimately gets access to swords and/or magic taking inspiration from both TP and OoT. In fact, if they decided to use TP Ganon and give him DW swords ala WW, I'd love that too.

They just need to do something, and with all the major revamps this time around, I really want to main my favorite villain again, with a moveset true to his character.

Come on Sakurai. If you can give DK his roll attack, and give Sheik two new moves, and revamp Pit so totally, you can make Ganon his own dude at last! Come on! You can do it!!

 

[Sonicguy726]

Y'know, with those 4 reps Mario has right now.

Anyway. My hopes for Gdorf this time around are that in addition to stuff that's specific to him, like the sparta kick, choke slam, etc. he actually, finally, legitimately gets access to swords and/or magic taking inspiration from both TP and OoT. In fact, if they decided to use TP Ganon and give him DW swords ala WW, I'd love that too.

They just need to do something, and with all the major revamps this time around, I really want to main my favorite villain again, with a moveset true to his character.

Come on Sakurai. If you can give DK his roll attack, and give Sheik two new moves, and revamp Pit so totally, you can make Ganon his own dude at last! Come on! You can do it!!

Yes to all of this

 

[Neo Zero]

Y'know, with those 4 reps Mario has right now.

Anyway. My hopes for Gdorf this time around are that in addition to stuff that's specific to him, like the sparta kick, choke slam, etc. he actually, finally, legitimately gets access to swords and/or magic taking inspiration from both TP and OoT. In fact, if they decided to use TP Ganon and give him DW swords ala WW, I'd love that too.

They just need to do something, and with all the major revamps this time around, I really want to main my favorite villain again, with a moveset true to his character.

Come on Sakurai. If you can give DK his roll attack, and give Sheik two new moves, and revamp Pit so totally, you can make Ganon his own dude at last! Come on! You can do it!!

If I could like a post 10000 times it would be this. He's a powerful Warlock/Sorcerer and a gifted swordsman. Giving him a move named Warlock Punch and having him pull a sword from the nether regions as a taunt does NOT properly represent him. Give him magic orbs, give him his blades and trident, make him immobalize people with darkness, let him teleport, just don't make him Captain Ganon

The only move I'd really keep as is would be Flame Choke, as that's a very Ganondorf like move. Almost everything else could use a tweak or change (though somes ok to keep like Sparta Kick or Jab). I love Ganondorf, fantastic villain, and what happened to him in Brawl was a travesty, so if Bowser can be redone, let alone all the other names you mentioned, I want Ganondorf to be basically a newcomer at this point, shown the same love Greninja, Rosalina, Villager, WFT, Little Mac and Mega Man have been shown. Given Link now backflips and TP Zelda has a move from a Cel Shaded Game, I have high hopes this will be the True King of Evil we all want.

 

[EdgeTheLucas]

Alright, so I'm new to this particular thread, and I just wanna ask the following:

What do you think of the idea of introducing Black Shadow as a character that took over Ganondorf's role as a Capt. Falcon clone and making Ganondorf unique?

I come from the Project M forums, where the idea is, to my absolute complete surprise, controversial.

See, Mewtwo and Roy are in Project M because the PMBR (Project M Backroom) found a way to access the "Forbidden 7" character files to create 7 extra characters. Roy and Mewtwo take up two of the "slots" so there's room for 5 more characters. If you already know this, then sorry for being redundant.

Anyway there's a thread for discussing possible candidates for the slots (any additional characters have to have appeared in Brawl as a trophy or sticker, btw), and one of the first presented ideas was the Black Shadow / Ganondorf idea. Essentially, the new, revamped, not-a-clone Ganondorf would use a slot while the original Ganondorf would be reskinned and slightly reanimated to look like Black Shadow. Apparently, while a lot of people expressed fondness for the idea, there was also a sizeable, very loud group of people who wanted Ganondorf to stay the same. Some provide a few good reasons:

1) why redo a character we already have in Smash but not other clones?

2) maybe the very few slots should go to other characters instead (Isaac, Ridley, Dark Samus, etc.)

3) some people say Black Shadow isn't the ideal F-Zero rep after Capt. Falcon, sahing that Samurai Goroh better deserves it.


These are good reasons to live with Ganondorf sticking as a clone even with the opportunity to change that is present. However, there are a few reasons people give that are extremely base-breaking and borderline mean-spirited:

1) Black Shadow is "really stupid-looking," having to play him to keep playing the Capt. Falcon clone is going to feel "f*cking ********."

2) Ganondorf shouldn't be changed because "surprisingly, this is a game for Smash fans, not Zelda fans, so they should just deal with it."

And, my favorite,

3) Ganondorf as a clone of Capt. Falcon is actually "perfect sense" because he has the Triforce of Power, therefore being a physical fighter is completely fitting and revamping him is wrong.


I could counterargue all 3 of those for days, but the problem that flame wars come up in the Clone Engine Character thread every single time the idea is mentioned persists, so it's no use.


What I came here for, and the purpose of this post, is to ask if Smash 4 forumgoers feel different, or the same way. Thoughts?